hurr durr silly large post I shouldn't have wasted my time on inc
xsrsbsns wrote:
Naturally it also looks desperate and of course no one likes that.
SPOILER
I look around for maps that give points, and if I think I can get a good rank on it, I go for it. Why is that desperate, just because the map so happens to be labeled "hard"?
silmarilen wrote:
ok so by using logic you showed why the one map would give more pp than the other. then lets look at another example: me.
my whole top10 performance is hd fl on incredibly easy maps yet im almost top500 pp (i used to be top500). how is that fair?
and dont tell me i used a lot of plays so its dedication, because some of them were done in less than 20 plays
SPOILER
You're getting hung up on the wrong data. A few things you should know:
Your current PP amount currently gives you a very low amount of diminishing returns (comparing to someone just 200 ranks higher)
You have a lot of plays and 200~ish submitted top 50 scores (not on easy/normal diffs) - this is a lot more than the majority of the osu community, so these scores are building on top of each other to get to your current PP amount
Rank is the largest determining factor in how much PP you get for a map. Most of those maps are not worth a particularly large amount of pp, but because you are highly ranked on them (#1-#6) and getting SS, they are giving you the most amount of PP you can get out of them.
And again, due to diminishing returns on PP gains not hitting you particularly hard yet, you are getting a lot for most of these scores.
You can disagree with the system all you want, but this is how it works (based on my own experiences)
Your current PP amount currently gives you a very low amount of diminishing returns (comparing to someone just 200 ranks higher)
You have a lot of plays and 200~ish submitted top 50 scores (not on easy/normal diffs) - this is a lot more than the majority of the osu community, so these scores are building on top of each other to get to your current PP amount
Rank is the largest determining factor in how much PP you get for a map. Most of those maps are not worth a particularly large amount of pp, but because you are highly ranked on them (#1-#6) and getting SS, they are giving you the most amount of PP you can get out of them.
And again, due to diminishing returns on PP gains not hitting you particularly hard yet, you are getting a lot for most of these scores.
You can disagree with the system all you want, but this is how it works (based on my own experiences)
Blue Dragon wrote:
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/134551&m=0 barely gave me pp while HD+HR people get 242443932498 pp from it
I hate how this system is fully based on accuracy lol
SPOILER
That map is not worth a particularly high amount of pp, so I don't know where you're getting this from. Also, unless accuracy is really bad, usually higher rank is more meaningful to the system.
Satonaka wrote:
imo It's because [Hard]s in beatmaps are labeled as Insane for osu! thus making them give similar (if not the same) pp.
Like silmarilen's examples. Both [Hard]s and [Insane]s display the I star for Insane. http://puu.sh/2qaAo and http://puu.sh/2qaAO
SPOILER
As far as I know, star rating isn't counted into PP calculations, but don't quote me on this (I don't know any of peppy's algorithms, so I can't say for sure)
It would be nice if we could get a quote for that from him, though, because star rating is absolutely worthless
It would be nice if we could get a quote for that from him, though, because star rating is absolutely worthless
fartownik wrote:
If you farm PP on the main Insanes of the sets and do it with the hardest mod combination possible to achieve #1 then it's fine (aka Cookiezi farming). You can say it's not actually farming but just spamming #1s. Farming on Hards is simply wrong because you don't have enough of top tier players playing them to challenge with, which means getting the first place on them is easier than the main Insane, no matter the level of the difficulty itself. It can be as hard as the toughest Insanes, but still there's not enough competition and you just can't know how good the best players would do on them. It doesn't make the score any less impressive, but gives you additional PP that you don't deserve.
SPOILER
You can say this for any insane with few scores by pros as well. While what you're saying is technically correct, it doesn't mean that you don't deserve the PP you're getting -- you are receiving points within the boundaries the system sets for you, and if someone else wanted those points, they could come take them, as long as they can beat your score. Also, hard diffs recently are getting more and more contested by really good players (not cookiezi/white wolf/rrtyui etc tier, but very strong players nonetheless), and many of them are pretty difficult maps in their own right.
AmaiHachimitsu wrote:
Nothing I can do about it, but I dislike when 70% of top 100 are FLwhores. Every damn map with some exceptions is gonna be FLed sooner or later T.T
SPOILER
I agree, FL breaks the PP system in a few ways, but I don't feel like turning this thread into a memory vs skill discussion
AmaiHachimitsu wrote:
96% hdhr is like SS hd, please....
SPOILER
Maybe 98-99% (in terms of accuracy, this doesn't take into account the increase in map difficulty due to CS/AR)
AmaiHachimitsu wrote:
Why the most played maps do give MUCH more pp? Instead of encouraging people to play miscellaneous maps they play only a bunch when they want to rank up. Who cares if a map is super-popular - top #30 will give you more pp than a #1 on a map that may be even harder, but happened to not be noticed. That's why some FLwhore can waste few days and gain outrageous amount of pp and in most cases a score with HDFL is the limit since one additional mod would make the map impossibru. This way FLers can even drop the game and remain top 50 for the next years.
SPOILER
More competition = harder to get a high rank, is the logic behind it. Yes, FL causes a few flaws here
Thatgooey wrote:
All of these factors lead to hard maps being worth a lot of performance points. Should you care? Probably not.
SPOILER
Your post was long so I just picked out one thing I thought was rather silly. While I am ok with most of what you said (to each their own, pretty much) I just wanted to point this out because people play the game for different reasons, and you kind of contradict this statement later on your post ("play the game for the reasons YOU want") etc. Some people want to be high in the rankings to feel like they accomplished something, and that's a valid way to have fun in the game ;>
Winshley wrote:
Additionally, some old maps still tends to be a "pp gold mine". I believe this might be because of lacking dedication from pro players towards those maps.
SPOILER
Actually, from what I've gathered, it's mostly from these maps being badly timed leading to very few good accuracy scores