Not sure if Kevin's in love with ppv2 or he didn't mention how "fair" HT and mods multiplayers are on purpose.
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Performance Points feedback and suggestions (Catch the Beat)
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im cutting into my own flesh if im talking bad about HT-PP Farming *kappa*...Scorpionek wrote:
Not sure if Kevin's in love with ppv2 or he didn't mention how "fair" HT and mods multiplayers are on purpose.
just kiddin, i think we all know that HT is too overpowered right now,but it also shouldn't loose too much of it's potential since HT is still "kinda hard" to exicute on hard High AR Patterns
is the new star rating/pp system for ctb on test build final?????
new star rating algorithm is still work in progress on cuttingedge.
pp system will be work in progress after the star rating algorithm on cuttingedge is final.
pp system will be work in progress after the star rating algorithm on cuttingedge is final.
Topic Starter
The Catch the Beat performance points are currently undergoing a re-calculation after an algorithm update. Please visit the changelog for further information.
I'm aware that things are still far from perfect. Most notably: Clutch timings including pixel jumps are still underrated while certain other patterns get weighted too much. I hope to address those issues in further updates. Please wait until the re-calculations finished for everybody until giving feedback. Even if you pp changes drastically your best performance list might not have been updated accordingly yet.
I'm aware that things are still far from perfect. Most notably: Clutch timings including pixel jumps are still underrated while certain other patterns get weighted too much. I hope to address those issues in further updates. Please wait until the re-calculations finished for everybody until giving feedback. Even if you pp changes drastically your best performance list might not have been updated accordingly yet.
A lot of love for this update.
yeah, i really appreciate your hard work on this Tom ^^Stefan wrote:
A lot of love for this update.
im hoping the recalculations and the tweaking of some values will be finished soon
but right now it seems pretty balanced between various "difficult" playing styles
like the Low AR HD stuff, some FL Bonuses, and the "above AR9" boosts
Dunno if I'm actually that bad or not but i lost 11 thousand places with the algorithm change >___< so welp and 99% of my maps got reclassified in 1 star or 2 stars even if the title is difficult and would more likely need 4 stars or so how but thats just my opinion.
the recalculations aren't finished yet. People aswell as the pp-outputs of most maps probabbly have to be updated before assumptions on the calculations would be viableGirgias wrote:
Dunno if I'm actually that bad or not but i lost 11 thousand places with the algorithm change >___< so welp and 99% of my maps got reclassified in 1 star or 2 stars even if the title is difficult and would more likely need 4 stars or so how but thats just my opinion.
Don't complain that your pp farm maps don't count anymore and use this chance to learn how to play better.thijner14 wrote:
Pls just change it back
Just trying to undertand why increase pp bonus on low AR in CTB, higher AR really makes this mode more difficulty and low AR also isn't that hard to read (actually, is easier to read).
So are these PP scores going to be adjusted appropriately on my profile? It would really suck if they remained as they were before the update.
So...I love the sounds of this update. However...as above With Girgias, I went from 3.9k to 11.2 and lost almost half my pp...will it be staying like that or is this only due to the recalculation phase and I can expect it to change again?
It seems people don't understand raw pp doesn't mean anything
ZiRoX wrote:
It seems people don't understand raw pp doesn't mean anything
aPPocalypse
Gotta love how Right Round got destroyed from 180ish to 51 (SS Nomod). I found it was much harder than https://osu.ppy.sh/b/25990?m=2 :c (due to the nature of jumps in RR that isn't in Shopkeeper)
Dunno. I'm not that into CtB so maybe I'm wrong but it may be worth pointing it out uwu
Dunno. I'm not that into CtB so maybe I'm wrong but it may be worth pointing it out uwu
Im not panicking, nope...i am panicking dammit il just close my eyes and everything will be guud right?
Personally i think its good they changed ctb ranking, coz really.. some songs are just too easy and give too much pp. Tho changing the stars is kinda umm not necessary.. now playing a 3 star map feels like meh (before it would be bout 6, and would feel like woah 6 stars im getting better), but it's just my opinion ^^
Personally i think its good they changed ctb ranking, coz really.. some songs are just too easy and give too much pp. Tho changing the stars is kinda umm not necessary.. now playing a 3 star map feels like meh (before it would be bout 6, and would feel like woah 6 stars im getting better), but it's just my opinion ^^
Topic Starter
They will adjust.minhtam1638 wrote:
So are these PP scores going to be adjusted appropriately on my profile? It would really suck if they remained as they were before the update.
To all the others: Calm down. Wait until the recalculations are done before panicking about your rank changing. Other people will lose similar amounts of pp so your rank will normalize again.
It seems people don't understand what "waiting for the changes to be all done" means, can't you understand the rank you have now is not your final result/Final rank, wait some more days and stop complaining about you dropping 10k places or whatever and just wait and play the game.
some suggestion : 1st rank should be weighted more than other ranks (at least a bit) ,so pp can decrease too
sorry bad english because i'm so sleepy
sorry bad english because i'm so sleepy
Topic Starter
Luckily waiting a few more hours is enough. :p-Ryuujii- wrote:
It seems people don't understand what "waiting for the changes to be all done" means, can't you understand the rank you have now is not your final result/Final rank, wait some more days and stop complaining about you dropping 10k places or whatever and just wait and play the game.
Since CtB has less scores than standard it's a lot quicker.
Decided to wait out untill the recalc is done... Hory sheit, i boosted from #2500 to #1000, and here i thought i was a overrated player. O_o
I suggest you play a game to refresh it. I rank 2k6ish with more pp.Granger wrote:
Decided to wait out untill the recalc is done... Hory sheit, i boosted from #2500 to #1000, and here i thought i was a overrated player. O_o
Well, my PP on my profile decreased, so i think my rank/pp was already updated. Ill play a map regardless, cant hurt.
...
Hmm, okaay. #3k6 now.
...
Hmm, okaay. #3k6 now.
Topic Starter
Aaaaand calculations are done. Get the feedback going! 
Yights, well in the end stilll lost 2K places :c well never mind gonna try to crowl back into the best 10K people.
So actually is it worth to redo easy maps with a SS then a normal S ? or will it just degrade my placement like before the changes ?
Edit: I just said nothin =° redone a beatmap in "normal" what i didn't even have full combo and won 4K places. :hap: So maybe my comments are completly useless ^-^
So actually is it worth to redo easy maps with a SS then a normal S ? or will it just degrade my placement like before the changes ?
Edit: I just said nothin =° redone a beatmap in "normal" what i didn't even have full combo and won 4K places. :hap: So maybe my comments are completly useless ^-^
ok im just gonna give you some of my thoughts ^^, right now it seems that the pp-output relys way to much on the star rating of a DiffTom94 wrote:
Aaaaand calculations are done. Get the feedback going!
because most "difficult" rated non-FC's are giving pp values that shouldn't as high as they are now.the best example would probabbly be the TAG4 diffs and especially this one.
The next thing would be how CS is accounted in the difficulty calculations, before the update there were many older maps with higher CS, that combined with mod combinations like HR+HD+DT or HD+DT gave you pretty solid pp-values and now it seems their difficulty rating was significantly lowered compared to most "easier" AR9 Insane diffs which have gotten a huge boost in pp if they only incorparated "one hard part" in them.
Then there is also the Problem with EZ/HT because they are still valued a bit to high for my taste
But what i really appreciated in this formula are the bonuses for long Maps and Doubletime.
to sum it up for me, it seems that the Top-Tier values for hard stuff are pretty solid (with some exeptions like the TAG4 Stuff)
but the mid-ground has to get a bit more balanced to be accurate
DeletedUser_500696
I definitely appreciate how difficult non-fcs are higher up there in pp, and this system is somewhat more difficult to exploit. I personally really like it more than the last, I don't think pp will ever be perfect in ctb but this is a step in the right direction. DT has some bigger bonuses which is nice, but HR for non FC's or on difficult short maps could use a slight boost as there are some really great HR players like S a o r i that are still kind of high in rank imo. Will add more as I notice more stuff
[Superstar]_old
Yes this is better than the last but there are still hard maps which are really underrated.
And finally stream maps take into account and give reasonable pp, this is a good job!
SPOILER
Last two are really difficult and first 3 are 1 try FC maps
DT seems to have solid pp giving, thats quite nice.Last two are really difficult and first 3 are 1 try FC maps
And finally stream maps take into account and give reasonable pp, this is a good job!
I like it that the pp system is not that exploitable anymore.
But i really hate the changes effecting the pp from long or short maps first in my opinion its to mush pp for long and to less for short maps and even more imported for me is that these changes don't show in the star rating that i used to see if a beatmap will bring me pp or not.
sry for my bad English^^
But i really hate the changes effecting the pp from long or short maps first in my opinion its to mush pp for long and to less for short maps and even more imported for me is that these changes don't show in the star rating that i used to see if a beatmap will bring me pp or not.
sry for my bad English^^
i dont understand how tsurupettan is worth so much more than kanjou chemistry
tsurupettan is basically move>one note>move>one note>move and so on, with no complex patterns and barely any dashes needed. while, for someone of my skill, kanjou chemistry is really hard and complex.
tsurupettan is basically move>one note>move>one note>move and so on, with no complex patterns and barely any dashes needed. while, for someone of my skill, kanjou chemistry is really hard and complex.
i'm just newly fc-ing (bout 2 weeks ago) go berzerk with hd... i mean who wasn't happy to get much pp of this map since this map is hard because of jumping (more harder when adding hd)... i was very lazy back then when play that map but who knows dat was my lucky day...
but when pp system changes and knowing dat go berzerk is underrated.. i felt a deep silent and thought "what the heck this can be happen",, all difficult map became more and more low pp.. when people start comfortable with current pp system and this happen... im sure not only me unsatisfied with new system...
but when pp system changes and knowing dat go berzerk is underrated.. i felt a deep silent and thought "what the heck this can be happen",, all difficult map became more and more low pp.. when people start comfortable with current pp system and this happen... im sure not only me unsatisfied with new system...
and I am going Down Down Down Down...
and then feel like...
again...
streamy map is more give much pp
whats good is the new maps are not pp maps aka the high tier ones, the maps i can argue about is ---
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/456933?m=2 over 34 people did it, so its not quite hard and its free 477 pp which is way to high
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/371595?m=2 needs a nerf or everyone will HR it, or attempt to, by the time of this month it should have 8-10 HR scores
EDIT: ^ I think you should reduce the value on nomod to 270 and increase HR to 340-330
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/465454?m=2 it's long but it has no real hard parts at all
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/329800?m=2 this is hard but not as hard as the maps i posted above, it's very long and some places for error but no where near 533 pp
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/297463?m=2 yoiyami hanabi is harder than airman 2k14
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/264090?m=2 leaf FC should be way higher like 430 its pretty challenging
these maps should be weighed WAY higher for overall difficulty
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/118068?m=2
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/319661?m=2 ExtRa and Lan Extra 300 ish maybe 290
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/179070?m=2 neu plat should be atleast 330-340 FC
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/122693?m=2 should be 320-330
I feel as if DT also needs a lot of love because DT is VERY hard so maybe boost the value by ateast 8-10%
there is many maps i havent listed or i have listed, but overall way better than the old pp system because the farmers have been destoryed aka, you actually have to do HARD MAPS to get into top 20 I.E instead of TAG4 HR/HT, theres still maps like snow goose which is worth way to much but this is overall beta. Nice job tom94 keep it up
if anyone has any maps related to this post, please post your thoughts lets get this system working.
PS: I love how SS's matter now, 10% for SS's is a very nice tough for accuracy players, nice job
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/456933?m=2 over 34 people did it, so its not quite hard and its free 477 pp which is way to high
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/371595?m=2 needs a nerf or everyone will HR it, or attempt to, by the time of this month it should have 8-10 HR scores
EDIT: ^ I think you should reduce the value on nomod to 270 and increase HR to 340-330
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/465454?m=2 it's long but it has no real hard parts at all
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/329800?m=2 this is hard but not as hard as the maps i posted above, it's very long and some places for error but no where near 533 pp
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/297463?m=2 yoiyami hanabi is harder than airman 2k14
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/264090?m=2 leaf FC should be way higher like 430 its pretty challenging
these maps should be weighed WAY higher for overall difficulty
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/118068?m=2
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/319661?m=2 ExtRa and Lan Extra 300 ish maybe 290
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/179070?m=2 neu plat should be atleast 330-340 FC
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/122693?m=2 should be 320-330
I feel as if DT also needs a lot of love because DT is VERY hard so maybe boost the value by ateast 8-10%
there is many maps i havent listed or i have listed, but overall way better than the old pp system because the farmers have been destoryed aka, you actually have to do HARD MAPS to get into top 20 I.E instead of TAG4 HR/HT, theres still maps like snow goose which is worth way to much but this is overall beta. Nice job tom94 keep it up
if anyone has any maps related to this post, please post your thoughts lets get this system working.
PS: I love how SS's matter now, 10% for SS's is a very nice tough for accuracy players, nice job
I think everyone has too much pp right now, maybe cut it down by 10-15%
I don't even understand, I lost like almost 1.5k pp, before i had best performance with a map at 5.92 stars (w/HR) but now its gone... Now I don't understand what kind of map gives pp
hard mapsRookie_FR wrote:
I don't even understand, I lost like almost 1.5k pp, before i had best performance with a map at 5.92 stars (w/HR) but now its gone... Now I don't understand what kind of map gives pp
I feel like the new ratings over value maps with a harsh difficulty spike but are otherwise easy.
My new top rank is one of these maps - the first few seconds are brutal but after that its easymode. Im certain i've FCed overall harder maps. I didnt expect that one to become my top rank, at all.
Also interresting: A large part of my new top ranks are 1x miss plays now, while i generally think it is good that FC doesnt matter as much anymore this gets me curious.
My new top rank is one of these maps - the first few seconds are brutal but after that its easymode. Im certain i've FCed overall harder maps. I didnt expect that one to become my top rank, at all.
Also interresting: A large part of my new top ranks are 1x miss plays now, while i generally think it is good that FC doesnt matter as much anymore this gets me curious.
go berzerk hard map? get outtaaa hereeee lol ezFuture_miku95 wrote:
i'm just newly fc-ing (bout 2 weeks ago) go berzerk with hd... i mean who wasn't happy to get much pp of this map since this map is hard because of jumping (more harder when adding hd)... i was very lazy back then when play that map but who knows dat was my lucky day...
but when pp system changes and knowing dat go berzerk is underrated.. i felt a deep silent and thought "what the heck this can be happen",, all difficult map became more and more low pp.. when people start comfortable with current pp system and this happen... im sure not only me unsatisfied with new system...
At least this new star system (and pp) have better balance than before, gj osu! dev team.
Really taking away pp is looking more and more dumb.. (atleast taking away much pp.. like 2k.. thanks)
I can live with that.. but what angers me the most is that i have to play maps like a 3k pp player (being now a 1k one) and get the same or even less amount of pp, which now discourages me completely :/
I can live with that.. but what angers me the most is that i have to play maps like a 3k pp player (being now a 1k one) and get the same or even less amount of pp, which now discourages me completely :/
Topic Starter
FC is generally a bit less important now, even though having a higher combo is still greatly rewarded.Granger wrote:
I feel like the new ratings over value maps with a harsh difficulty spike but are otherwise easy.
My new top rank is one of these maps - the first few seconds are brutal but after that its easymode. Im certain i've FCed overall harder maps. I didnt expect that one to become my top rank, at all.
Also interresting: A large part of my new top ranks are 1x miss plays now, while i generally think it is good that FC doesnt matter as much anymore this gets me curious.
Maps having single difficulty spikes and being overrated as a cause of these is something I also wanna look into since it seems to be something brought up quite frequently. This shouldn't be hard to adjust if some tests confirm it being problematic.
You don't understand how pp works if you think like that. I recommend reading the wiki article about pp:Ryou ark wrote:
Really taking away pp is looking more and more dumb.. (atleast taking away much pp.. like 2k.. thanks)
I can live with that.. but what angers me the most is that i have to play maps like a 3k pp player (being now a 1k one) and get the same or even less amount of pp, which now discourages me completely :/
http://osu.ppy.sh/wiki/Performance_Points
Storm-: Thank you very much for compiling that list of maps and explanations about their difficulty. This is very much appreciated!
Everyone: I can't tell you when the next big ctb update in terms of stars / pp will come. Right now I am on vacation and only pushed out the new ctb pp as fast as possible to get a christmas "gift/update" out. Please don't expect much of me during the next 1-2 months due to various other occupations. ^^'
thanks tom94 we lost faith in you but you got it back with a iron hand, we all love u now
All my filthy pp gone... Ruined. XD
Tom94, this makes (I believe) the pp calc in CtB on par with Std, it makes me annoyed when a "Easy" map (with mod) gets (a lot of) more pp than "Hard" map when the difficulty on both maps didn't say the same (the hard being harder).
Sorry for my bad english.
Have a Merry Christmas, everyone.
Sorry for my bad english.
Have a Merry Christmas, everyone.
What a titanic overhaul, comparable to the way rankings shifted when standard went from ppv1 to ppv2... Well, alright, not nearly as much as that, but still it's surprising that the old algorithm could have been THAT screwed in a fundamental level.
Tom, with the old algorithm , you could get much pp from easy 5-6 stars.
And someone said that you cant get pp when you are playing same difficulty maps.Then with the new algorithm ,that means that those who played easy 5-6 stars then must play 5-6 star maps(impossible maps) even with the new star ranking?
And someone said that you cant get pp when you are playing same difficulty maps.Then with the new algorithm ,that means that those who played easy 5-6 stars then must play 5-6 star maps(impossible maps) even with the new star ranking?
Na, it's just the fact that the average star count on maps has been reduced quite a bit. But you can still get lot's of pp with the good maps. Exemple: http://osu.ppy.sh/b/371595?m=2 (Overdose) was in the past past over 6 stars, I got 240 for that in the past. Now it's 5.62 or so but the same score gave me 329 pp. Maps 6 stars rated now are way harder then 6 stars in the past. So you don't need to play 6 stars maps now to get pp, you can get pp with a way lower star rating. Hope you understand what I rote.Simple27 wrote:
Tom, with the old algorithm , you could get much pp from easy 5-6 stars.
And someone said that you cant get pp when you are playing same difficulty maps.Then with the new algorithm ,that means that those who played easy 5-6 stars then must play 5-6 star maps(impossible maps) even with the new star ranking?
Givralii wrote:
Na, it's just the fact that the average star count on maps has been reduced quite a bit. But you can still get lot's of pp with the good maps. Exemple: http://osu.ppy.sh/b/371595?m=2 (Overdose) was in the past past over 6 stars, I got 240 for that in the past. Now it's 5.62 or so but the same score gave me 329 pp. Maps 6 stars rated now are way harder then 6 stars in the past. So you don't need to play 6 stars maps now to get pp, you can get pp with a way lower star rating. Hope you understand what I rote.Simple27 wrote:
Tom, with the old algorithm , you could get much pp from easy 5-6 stars.
And someone said that you cant get pp when you are playing same difficulty maps.Then with the new algorithm ,that means that those who played easy 5-6 stars then must play 5-6 star maps(impossible maps) even with the new star ranking?
I understand,but i want to get some pp and i want some ctb maps not for pros but chalenging ,can you help me?
I'd say maps are getting challenging at around 4.5 stars now, maybe a bit lower even.
Though to be honest, if you're playing them just for pp, you won't improve much, but if you play to improve your skill in general your rank will rise with it eventually.
Though to be honest, if you're playing them just for pp, you won't improve much, but if you play to improve your skill in general your rank will rise with it eventually.
- Zik -
DT seems pretty weird, maps seem to give either too much or not enough pp.
If you want pp, look at other people's profiles who are around your rank and play their top ranks.Simple27 wrote:
I understand,but i want to get some pp and i want some ctb maps not for pros but chalenging ,can you help me?
6 stars should be really freaking hard to FC so i think its fine
I dont play for pp,but its sad that i play some quite hard things and i dont even get 3 pp!Zak wrote:
I'd say maps are getting challenging at around 4.5 stars now, maybe a bit lower even.
Though to be honest, if you're playing them just for pp, you won't improve much, but if you play to improve your skill in general your rank will rise with it eventually.
Simple27 wrote:
I dont play for pp,but its sad that i play some quite hard things and i dont even get 3 pp!
You're still fairly "new", so I know you'll get better and you will start seeing pp gain. Just be patient, that's how I've been playing for the past year.
Scorpionek
Maybe they're not giving pp because they're not actually hard?Scorpionek wrote:
Tom, why did you abandon old maps?
I dont know... id consider tiny hitcircles at low AR with HD pretty hard. Of course, only a part of the old maps is like that.
It is not really that hard when you got the pace :<Granger wrote:
I dont know... id consider tiny hitcircles at low AR with HD pretty hard. Of course, only a part of the old maps is like that.
Instead, the modern (2012-2014) maps are much considered as hard maps due to the high AR with high density of jumps, they are more appealing to the public appetites.
High CS is underrated
CTB maps are overrated (with a few exceptions)
HD gives a little too much pp, tho i'd say high CS shoud get a pp bonus not just low AR
Stars seem way off when it comes to DT/NC
Everyone seems to have too much pp, maybe cut everyone's pp down by 10%-15%
Patterns like these are overrated, especially when they are repetitive (i lowered the AR from 9 to 4 for visibility)
Similar: (again, AR lowered from 9 to 4 for visibility)
Comparing this map with HR: https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=57699&m=2 and this map nomod https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=49101&m=2:
Astrosexy is way harder than SOSO HR, i'd say astrosexy is underrated and SOSO overrated
Comparing these 2 (both with DT): https://osu.ppy.sh/b/104944?m=2 (3.81 stars) https://osu.ppy.sh/b/163639?m=2 (3.66 stars):
The "NO NAME" map is harder than the Miku song, actually i can't think of a single thing that makes the Miku song hard, i played harder 3 star maps.
Some underrated maps:
CTB maps are overrated (with a few exceptions)
HD gives a little too much pp, tho i'd say high CS shoud get a pp bonus not just low AR
Stars seem way off when it comes to DT/NC
Everyone seems to have too much pp, maybe cut everyone's pp down by 10%-15%
Patterns like these are overrated, especially when they are repetitive (i lowered the AR from 9 to 4 for visibility)
SPOILER
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/228919?m=2
Similar: (again, AR lowered from 9 to 4 for visibility)
SPOILER
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=117580&m=2
Comparing this map with HR: https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=57699&m=2 and this map nomod https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=49101&m=2:
Astrosexy is way harder than SOSO HR, i'd say astrosexy is underrated and SOSO overrated
Comparing these 2 (both with DT): https://osu.ppy.sh/b/104944?m=2 (3.81 stars) https://osu.ppy.sh/b/163639?m=2 (3.66 stars):
The "NO NAME" map is harder than the Miku song, actually i can't think of a single thing that makes the Miku song hard, i played harder 3 star maps.
Some underrated maps:
SPOILER
Some overrated maps:https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=136553&m=2 - Can't tell if it's because i'm comparing it to CTB diffs
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=51308&m=2 - The timing required for those jumps is unreal
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=37710&m=2 - Again, the timing required for the part in the middle is insane and the 2nd half by itself is way harder than 2.67 stars
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/42792?m=2 +HR - I guess the fact that high CS being underrated is mostly the cause of this
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=45433&m=2 - You're looking at a 3.2 star map that has EZ scores in top50 and Exgon has 882 plays on it ( i don't know if he tried to FL or HR it or somethign)
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=73561&m=2 - Some realy hard patterns, shold be way more than 3 stars
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=59327&m=2 - The second half reminds me of neu
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=51308&m=2 - The timing required for those jumps is unreal
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=37710&m=2 - Again, the timing required for the part in the middle is insane and the 2nd half by itself is way harder than 2.67 stars
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/42792?m=2 +HR - I guess the fact that high CS being underrated is mostly the cause of this
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=45433&m=2 - You're looking at a 3.2 star map that has EZ scores in top50 and Exgon has 882 plays on it ( i don't know if he tried to FL or HR it or somethign)
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=73561&m=2 - Some realy hard patterns, shold be way more than 3 stars
https://osu.ppy.sh/p/beatmap?b=59327&m=2 - The second half reminds me of neu
SPOILER
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/58064?m=2 - The jumps are hard but not hard enough to make this a 4.7 star map
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/506395?m=2 - Nothing realy hard in this map
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/165519?m=2 - Again, some jumps but not hard
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/506395?m=2 - Nothing realy hard in this map
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/165519?m=2 - Again, some jumps but not hard
Going to say that CtB maps are worth too much.
Hard coverts like a lot of 0108 maps seem to be worth very little without a FC and even then it's quite poor compared to what you can get from a ctb map.
Hard coverts like a lot of 0108 maps seem to be worth very little without a FC and even then it's quite poor compared to what you can get from a ctb map.
ctb is fine,
HD gives a fine ammount anywhere between 20-50
stars are off cuz CTB is hard to calculate overall difficulty
everyone doesn't have to much pp that's the issue is there is not enough pp maps or so to speak there is very few 500 pp maps and once the top 10 or 5 do those maps you will have what i call a pp cap, which means you must either A: hardrock or B: DT.
older maps are abandoned because this is the new generation of ctb not switched on lotus style, switched on lotus and system of a down is not really all that tough compared to high apm maps like daze also it's ironic that you say old maps are abandoned by new pp @Scorpionek when your top rank is a tag4 map from 2010
the only thing i can agree with this thread thus far is that DT should be weighed a little more prob 10-15% that is all
if you people are wondering why 0108 maps are worth a lot, because of the big droplet change tag4 style maps and droplet maps are weighed a lot heavily more, that's why most 0108 maps are weighed pretty high
the only issue i can see with this pp change is FL and DT FL is very confusing to calculate and DT should be weighed a lot heavily more.
also idk why you guys are complaining about this, create feedback not opinions at least maps like aspire and shuffle heaven and freedom dive hdhr and velper's DT are being calculated instead of being worth 100 or less.
HD gives a fine ammount anywhere between 20-50
stars are off cuz CTB is hard to calculate overall difficulty
everyone doesn't have to much pp that's the issue is there is not enough pp maps or so to speak there is very few 500 pp maps and once the top 10 or 5 do those maps you will have what i call a pp cap, which means you must either A: hardrock or B: DT.
older maps are abandoned because this is the new generation of ctb not switched on lotus style, switched on lotus and system of a down is not really all that tough compared to high apm maps like daze also it's ironic that you say old maps are abandoned by new pp @Scorpionek when your top rank is a tag4 map from 2010
the only thing i can agree with this thread thus far is that DT should be weighed a little more prob 10-15% that is all
if you people are wondering why 0108 maps are worth a lot, because of the big droplet change tag4 style maps and droplet maps are weighed a lot heavily more, that's why most 0108 maps are weighed pretty high
the only issue i can see with this pp change is FL and DT FL is very confusing to calculate and DT should be weighed a lot heavily more.
also idk why you guys are complaining about this, create feedback not opinions at least maps like aspire and shuffle heaven and freedom dive hdhr and velper's DT are being calculated instead of being worth 100 or less.
CTB is worth too much to be honest - in specific ways. Lots of the maps seem to be weighted nicely, specifically a lot of Rains that are below 200 and such, but then maps like this appear. This map is horrible over-weighted in my opinion and it really shows by the leaderboards. In general maps seem to be nicely weighted but the higher you go it seems the more ridiculous the pp amount gets.Storm- wrote:
ctb is fine,
HD gives a fine ammount anywhere between 20-50
stars are off cuz CTB is hard to calculate overall difficulty
everyone doesn't have to much pp that's the issue is there is not enough pp maps or so to speak there is very few 500 pp maps and once the top 10 or 5 do those maps you will have what i call a pp cap, which means you must either A: hardrock or B: DT.
older maps are abandoned because this is the new generation of ctb not switched on lotus style, switched on lotus and system of a down is not really all that tough compared to high apm maps like daze also it's ironic that you say old maps are abandoned by new pp @Scorpionek when your top rank is a tag4 map from 2010
the only thing i can agree with this thread thus far is that DT should be weighed a little more prob 10-15% that is all
if you people are wondering why 0108 maps are worth a lot, because of the big droplet change tag4 style maps and droplet maps are weighed a lot heavily more, that's why most 0108 maps are weighed pretty high
the only issue i can see with this pp change is FL and DT FL is very confusing to calculate and DT should be weighed a lot heavily more.
also idk why you guys are complaining about this, create feedback not opinions at least maps like aspire and shuffle heaven and freedom dive hdhr and velper's DT are being calculated instead of being worth 100 or less.
Then we go onto coverts, maps are worth barely anything compared to ctb-specifics unless you go to the stupidly overweighted or to the downright ridiculous. You might say that ctb maps should be worth more, but with such a small pool of maps and no large diversity within the maps, this only caters to specific players.
In terms of the accuracy weighting, it's a bit upsetting. 99% of the time, SS isn't something that is hard to get, but if you look towards the pp differences you'll see some large differences at times that seem a bit too big in my opinion.
Mods. Supporting a DT increase and maybe something to work out the kinks as it is worth a lot or very little, with the large amount being much harder to find without going into plays done by 2-3 players tops. Not keen on FL but I stay clear of that so I'm not gonna throw anything at that.
tl;dr PP spread sucks, ctb is fine or over-weighted, coverts are worth nothing or too much.
There shouldn't be ANY 500pp map other than maybe some exgon score, 500pp plays should be hard to get. There's 4 500+ pp plays in standard. In ctb: I could count more than 15 just looking at a few profiles. The game with like 3k active players has 15 500pp plays and the game with like 80k active players has 4 500pp plays. People have way too much pp.Storm- wrote:
everyone doesn't have to much pp that's the issue is there is not enough pp maps or so to speak there is very few 500 pp maps and once the top 10 or 5 do those maps you will have what i call a pp cap, which means you must either A: hardrock or B: DT.
Storm- wrote:
stars are off cuz CTB is hard to calculate overall difficulty
Seems a lot easier than in standard from my pov. The pp system is better i'll agree, but it's far from perfect. I don't see anyone complaining, people are giving whatever feedback they can.Storm- wrote:
also idk why you guys are complaining about this, create feedback not opinions at least maps like aspire and shuffle heaven and freedom dive hdhr and velper's DT are being calculated instead of being worth 100 or less.
DT right now is completly broken. If i sort maps by stars and play them one by one, the difficulty is very inconsistent. You could barely pass one map and then FC the next one in 2 tries. DT needs a complete rework.Storm- wrote:
the only thing i can agree with this thread thus far is that DT should be weighed a little more prob 10-15% that is all
Stop saying "people have too much pp" because you're comparing it to standard, you DO NOT compare a system to a system for another mode, they're not supposed to be just about the same, while I do agree the maps giving 500pp are weighted too much, I wouldn't agree with updating the system unless it can still weigh the actual hard maps high enough without the really easy shit like Go Berzerk getting an explosion of pp.
Everyone has already seen those few maps that give too much, but aside from that (not counting DT since it does need some rework) the system seems to be decently balanced. Everyone is just going to have to wait for Tom to have a chance to tweak things again in a couple more months. Just don't convince him to completely change everything again since we're definitely heading in the right direction currently.
Everyone has already seen those few maps that give too much, but aside from that (not counting DT since it does need some rework) the system seems to be decently balanced. Everyone is just going to have to wait for Tom to have a chance to tweak things again in a couple more months. Just don't convince him to completely change everything again since we're definitely heading in the right direction currently.
But the amount of pp doesn't matter, in overall, it is just a number. The problem is how the points are calculated, isn't?Zak wrote:
Stop saying "people have too much pp" because you're comparing it to standard, you DO NOT compare a system to a system for another mode, they're not supposed to be just about the same, while I do agree the maps giving 500pp are weighted too much, I wouldn't agree with updating the system unless it can still weigh the actual hard maps high enough without the really easy shit like Go Berzerk getting an explosion of pp.
Everyone has already seen those few maps that give too much, but aside from that (not counting DT since it does need some rework) the system seems to be decently balanced. Everyone is just going to have to wait for Tom to have a chance to tweak things again in a couple more months. Just don't convince him to completely change everything again since we're definitely heading in the right direction currently.
play for fun, i think we all learned that while playing without rankings for quite some time.eldnl wrote:
But the amount of pp doesn't matter, in overall, it is just a number. The problem is how the points are calculated, isn't?
allrightStorm- wrote:
play for fun, i think we all learned that while playing without rankings for quite some time.eldnl wrote:
But the amount of pp doesn't matter, in overall, it is just a number. The problem is how the points are calculated, isn't?
that's ironic coming from you.Storm- wrote:
play for fun, i think we all learned that while playing without rankings for quite some time.eldnl wrote:
But the amount of pp doesn't matter, in overall, it is just a number. The problem is how the points are calculated, isn't?
ohhhhh buuuurrrrns..but for real though, no disputes pls qwq-Ryuujii- wrote:
that's ironic coming from you.
I have something to point out, under my experience as a ctb player, a jump without an hyperdash when it's close to it can be way harder than an hyperdash jump, hard jumps without hyperdash are not giving enough pp. I will use this map as an example: https://osu.ppy.sh/b/456933?m=2 - It is a hard map overall, but not enough to give 480 pp, it is just because of the huge hyperdash jumps, while maps like this: https://osu.ppy.sh/b/108021?m=2 - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/157861?m=2 - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/226605?m=2 - is not even worth to fc them for pp, and of course, they are harder than the previous map.
I can't be sure if this is just me, someone support?
I can't be sure if this is just me, someone support?
Seph
I was wondering how the two diffs on my approval map The Pretender when clearly Fruitender is way harder than Crystal (jumps vs stream) both having 4.85 star rating.
Guess what, they don't because pp's the ultimate pleasure.
the pleaseure of achieving something :*Laharl wrote:
Guess what, they don't because pp's the ultimate pleasure.
I actually like gaining pp ever now and then to let myself know I'm getting better. May never be on top but when you never see anything to signify improvement you tend to quickly lose interest and abandon it.
It's also really easy to track your improvement when you simply improve old scores.
Don't get pp depending of the difficulty.
For exemple :
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/234923 (difficulty Extreme)
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/51945 (difficulty Uran's CTB)
These two map have the same stars difficulty : 3.28.
But, the second map (Dare so Ka no Gekka) is very hard compared to the first. Only 29 players have no miss on this map.
And, here's the pps for these map when we SS :
The hardest map give less pp than the easiest.
So if hard map gave less pp than "easy" map, it's not very normal. :/
For exemple :
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/234923 (difficulty Extreme)
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/51945 (difficulty Uran's CTB)
These two map have the same stars difficulty : 3.28.
But, the second map (Dare so Ka no Gekka) is very hard compared to the first. Only 29 players have no miss on this map.
And, here's the pps for these map when we SS :
The hardest map give less pp than the easiest.
So if hard map gave less pp than "easy" map, it's not very normal. :/
It doesn't happen often, but there's no such thing as a perfect system so you can always expect to find flaws somewhere.
Index » osu! » Gameplay & Rankings » Catch the Beat » Performance Points feedback and suggestions (Catch the Beat)Zak wrote:
It doesn't happen often, but there's no such thing as a perfect system so you can always expect to find flaws somewhere.
I get that TAG4 is extremely hard but why is so much of what we're seeing giving high (400+) pp a convert? shouldn't ctb specific maps be favored a little bit more because they were made to be hard specifically for this mode, and not a convert that got lucky and turned out to be really hard
TAG4 isn't even rankable, does that mean they should get unranked? in my mind it does...
CtB maps are not exactly "made to be hard for CtB" even though lately some mappers have gone down that road of making maps just to be hard, but I don't think they should be favored more as that already happened and that system was horribly flawed as there just simply aren't enough specifics, I think if TAG4's were removed from pp that would be understandable as it isn't considered playable on CtB in all honesty even if they're all theoretically possible to FC.
TAG4 deserves the amount of pp it is giving, just look at how many FC's they have, Catch the Beat specific difficulties shouldn't give any extra pp just for being specific difficulties, that makes no sense.
How do you have the number of PP in the scoreboard ? o_O
It's a bug, I hope for you.
It's a bug, I hope for you.
Is the FL-Buff really supposed to be that strong in comparison to a FC?
and i think RAMPAGE HDDT score worth more pp than AlZer0 HD score ( less pp because of number of misses ) not fair And yerti because of 6 more misses his pp dropped by 70 pp ... ?Kingkevin30 wrote:
Is the FL-Buff really supposed to be that strong in comparison to a FC?