Newbie Mafia 2! [Mafia Win!]

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T00:20:11+00:00

nardi11011 wrote:
I'm not sure what to think of the current situation.

Think anyway.

Yuukari-Banteki

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Yuukari-Banteki 2009-06-14T00:32:49+00:00

strager wrote:
Eek!

I meant I didn't mean to spill the beans! I thought that's what you were asking. I didn't mean I wasn't "unclaiming" myself as Doctor.

so you confirm that you are a Doctor then? ugh i dont know which direction to go now. despite all my logic my gut instinct is still to trust Echo on these things.....but one of the things Echo said is that you should never lynch someone who claims Doctor on day 1. im pretty sure 0_o is a civvy and for above reason i cant vote for either strager or Echo.

unvote~~i will edit with my vote later once i reread all posts not belonging to the three aforementioned people.~~

vote adam because of the 25% of posts that dont belong to me, kuu, Subi, or the three people im disregarding, he is the most annoying and suspicious, although i hardly feel comfortable voting against him i feel its safer than lynching Echo or strager and most likely otherwise to be mafia

A new name for a new start

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T01:23:40+00:00

Page 13 get.
Post 181 get.

BagelBob_old

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BagelBob_old 2009-06-14T01:56:57+00:00

strager wrote:
strager wrote:
I don't know where you got the idea that I think having the doktor role-claim on the first day is a good idea. I distinctly remember saying "I dislike role claims", and you first quoting me about it, then doing an analysis earlier.
I was responding to this:
BagelBob wrote:
Oh, and I have to disagree with you on that matter. A fake-claim by a town could work out nicely. I certainly don't think that's what's happening here, but I could see it working.
I was working off that the 'could' is 'would' in the hypothetical situation.

This, along with

strager wrote:
Saturos-fangirl wrote:
also since strager no longer has the appearance of claiming doctor, which was what was stopping me from voting against him before. this is also making me begin to doubt Echo's skill at this game, but meh.

unvote
vote strager
Eek!

I meant I didn't mean to spill the beans! I thought that's what you were asking. I didn't mean I wasn't "unclaiming" myself as Doctor.

this, makes it sound like you're trying to back out of your doctor claim now. You didn't mean to spill the beans about not being the doctor? Double negative meaning that you are trying to un-claim yourself as the doctor? You've been being very vague from the beginning.

Also, I've failed to see your case on Echo. So far, the only reason I can come up with for your vote is that he was making a case on you. Could you give anything more than that?

WIFOM

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T02:12:49+00:00

BagelBob wrote:
strager wrote:
strager wrote:
I don't know where you got the idea that I think having the doktor role-claim on the first day is a good idea. I distinctly remember saying "I dislike role claims", and you first quoting me about it, then doing an analysis earlier.
I was responding to this:
BagelBob wrote:
Oh, and I have to disagree with you on that matter. A fake-claim by a town could work out nicely. I certainly don't think that's what's happening here, but I could see it working.
I was working off that the 'could' is 'would' in the hypothetical situation.

I don't know how to explain this better. =S

BagelBob wrote:
strager wrote:
Saturos-fangirl wrote:
also since strager no longer has the appearance of claiming doctor, which was what was stopping me from voting against him before. this is also making me begin to doubt Echo's skill at this game, but meh.

unvote
vote strager
Eek!

I meant I didn't mean to spill the beans! I thought that's what you were asking. I didn't mean I wasn't "unclaiming" myself as Doctor.
this, makes it sound like you're trying to back out of your doctor claim now. You didn't mean to spill the beans about not being the doctor? Double negative meaning that you are trying to un-claim yourself as the doctor? You've been being very vague from the beginning.

Okay, let me (try to) clarify.

Claiming Doctor was a slip. I didn't intend for it to happen, and I didn't intend to claim Doctor. But it happened and that's what I meant. I wasn't trying to bring about a double negative by "spilling the beans" about me "unclaiming" myself as Doctor (unless I misunderstand where you're getting the double negative from?).

BagelBob wrote:
Also, I've failed to see your case on Echo. So far, the only reason I can come up with for your vote is that he was making a case on you. Could you give anything more than that?

Obviously, because almost all of what Echo has been doing is "making a case on me." There's nothing else to go on from him, really.

Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T02:38:12+00:00

S: Indeed, which makes adam somewhat suspect because he is voting for me. Then again, if he were the Mafia, he'd kill me anyway. So I think it's safe to say ... he is not. That is, I am clearing adam's name as a suspect Mafia for me.
E: adam's done absolutely nothing to convince anyone that he's not mafia.
S: I never said I was convinced he wasn't Mafia. I'm just saying for today I won't consider him a possible target.
E: [quoting first line] Read that and tell me you never said you weren't convinced.
S: I meant to say I wasn't convinced by someone else. Sorry.
E: So you admit that you convinced yourself adam is townie?
S: You're attacking. Am I supposed to just take that? Okay, I will.

That is basically the exchange that went on. Every line is a direct quote from chronological posts in this thread.

btw - strager, can you claim doctor in bold without using a negative sentence construct? Something like "claim: doctor"

strager wrote:
D= I didn't mean to.

strager wrote:
I did not intend to claim myself as Doctor.

I'll stop hammering strager.

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T02:52:31+00:00

Echo wrote:
btw - strager, can you claim doctor in bold without using a negative sentence construct? Something like "claim: doctor"
strager wrote:
D= I didn't mean to.
strager wrote:
I did not intend to claim myself as Doctor.

Claim: Doctor.

Hopefully that clears things up.

Derekku

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Derekku 2009-06-14T02:54:24+00:00

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Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T03:01:01+00:00

edit: thanks strager
Onto SFG's post...

SFG wrote:
If i assume he's mafia, he would be trying to kill strager because strager "claimed" doctor.

Wrong - if I was mafia, then, as you noted, I was the only person who suggested he accidentally leaked the fact that he was doctor. In which case, I would not bring it up, kill him at night, and leave the whole town wondering why the mafia killed him the next day.

SFG wrote:
Echo: explain why you spent so much time pointing out strager's claim if the claim appears to have been invisible to nearly everyone else and you specifically did not want it to have happened.

Obviously, I don't want the identity of the doctor leaked. I actually did expect strager to deny doctor but instead he said he didn't mean to leak his role. However, theoretically speaking the real doctor has nothing to gain by repeated affirming the fact that he was doctor since he can't protect himself, making revealing his role a really stupid thing to do, which is what makes me extremely suspicious of him.

The main reason for hammering strager, however, is because of the exchange which I've condensed into the first quote in my last post.

edit2: NOTE: this is not exactly an attack against strager, but I'm just explaining to SFG my thought processes. I don't expect you (strager) to reply to this, although you're completely free to.

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T03:34:43+00:00

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Yuukari-Banteki

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Yuukari-Banteki 2009-06-14T03:41:33+00:00

Echo wrote:
SFG wrote:
If i assume he's mafia, he would be trying to kill strager because strager "claimed" doctor.
Wrong - if I was mafia, then, as you noted, I was the only person who suggested he accidentally leaked the fact that he was doctor. In which case, I would not bring it up, kill him at night, and leave the whole town wondering why the mafia killed him the next day.

and once again Echo can come up with more devious strategies than i could in my normal mind imagine. Echo is way too pro for this.

._. hopefully he won't die on Day 1 this time cus last time i tried leading the town against the mafia in his stead we all died lol. Although i still hold my vote b/c don't want to risk lynching the doctor if he is real. I'm also really hoping im right to trust Echo here...

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anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T03:43:28+00:00

Saturos-fangirl wrote:
Echo wrote:
SFG wrote:
If i assume he's mafia, he would be trying to kill strager because strager "claimed" doctor.
Wrong - if I was mafia, then, as you noted, I was the only person who suggested he accidentally leaked the fact that he was doctor. In which case, I would not bring it up, kill him at night, and leave the whole town wondering why the mafia killed him the next day.

and once again Echo can come up with more devious strategies than i could in my normal mind imagine. Echo is way too pro for this.

You're right. You may have been deceived right there.

Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T03:56:52+00:00

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anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T04:10:15+00:00

Echo wrote:
I asked the same question again in this post to which you requoted the same thing. I don't see how it's out of context.

Oops; when I read that I thought you were quoting your entire post, not part of it.

Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T04:24:03+00:00

I was quoting the whole post, which you admit applying your reply to. You refused to answer/comment on my statements/questions, one of which was the conversation in the quoted text. Since it applied to all my questions/statements, I don't think it's out of context?

adam2046

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adam2046 2009-06-14T05:29:42+00:00

So uh...Why am I being voted if you want to lynch Echo or strager?
Can I have some follow up points on how I'm suspicious?

Derekku

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Derekku 2009-06-14T05:34:27+00:00

Ugh. I kept getting distracted by other things. >_<

But for now, I at least want to do this. (forgot to yesterday)

Unvote Echo.

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T17:22:57+00:00

Echo wrote:
I was quoting the whole post, which you admit applying your reply to. You refused to answer/comment on my statements/questions, one of which was the conversation in the quoted text. Since it applied to all my questions/statements, I don't think it's out of context?

Okay, I made a mistake in my last post.

When you wrote this post (link) I thought you had quoted this post (link), which what I originally refused to answer in this post (link). I don't think I even saw this post (link), so I gues I'll reply here:

Echo wrote:
strager wrote:
Echo wrote:
dammit WHY do the doctors always need to expose themselves on the first day?
D= I didn't mean to.
Firstly, strager never claimed doctor. He just went with what I said. The real doctor would have tried to cover it up. strager, on the other hand, admitted it straight away.

I would only try to cover it up to prevent myself from being killed by the Mafia during the Night. If I do that I may be suspect of being a Mafia by the town, because I am trying to cover up things I have said. Then again, keeping open about me being a Doctor also makes me a Mafia suspect because I'd be using it as a way to point votes away from me.

Again, claiming was a mistake, but the damage has been done.

Echo wrote:
Echo wrote:
strager wrote:
I meant to say I wasn't convinced by someone else. Sorry.
So you admit that you convinced yourself adam is townie? My point still stands - you can't convince yourself someone is townie when they haven't made a single proper post unless you already know they're townie.
Secondly, he admitted to convincing himself adam is townie without adam making any real posts. Plus, he completely ignored this accusation in his last post.

I think we've already gone over this. (If not I am mistaken.)

Echo wrote:
0_o wrote:
And how exactly does mentioning the cop imply that he's claiming cop??
The cop role shouldn't be on your mind, since he's useless until after the first night. Therefore, mentioning it is a tad suspicious. Why would strager be thinking about the cop, then?

I can't find my post but I'm pretty fucking sure I wrote a post answering this question.

Oh here it is, I think (link).

Yuukari-Banteki

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Yuukari-Banteki 2009-06-14T17:32:34+00:00

adam2046 wrote:
So uh...Why am I being voted if you want to lynch Echo or strager?
Can I have some follow up points on how I'm suspicious?

youre not, youre being voted on because i DON'T want to lynch Echo or strager. tbh its as close to a random vote as it gets, but a couple of people pointed fingers at you and that was the closest to a lead i got so yeah.

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Olinad

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Olinad 2009-06-14T17:51:08+00:00

OMG I think I lost track of the voting situation -.-' May anyone post the list of the votes made up to now? I read the discussion but I don't want to make a vote without knowing the situation

LadySuburu

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Topic Starter

LadySuburu 2009-06-14T17:57:08+00:00

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My thought process is like a Train on a train track shaped like a spider web. With portals.

Olinad

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Olinad 2009-06-14T18:00:51+00:00

LadySuburu wrote:
Votecount 3:

strager - 2 (adam, nardi)
adam - 2 (0_o, SFG)
Echo - 1 (strager)
SFG - 1 (BagelBob)

Not voting: 3 - (Olinad, Echo, Derekku)

thx, brb

Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T20:42:18+00:00

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anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T20:48:00+00:00

Echo wrote:
tbh if strager had said something like "I'm just curious to know about the rules around the doctor and how protection works" I wouldn't have had anything to go on, since that would only lead to WIFOM thinking.

Well, I don't ask questions like that, really. I try to be a little more specific in my questions than "how does the Doctor work exactly?" If I had asked the question you suggest I would probably get an answer similar to what the PM states and not what I wanted to know. But you're right, the "claim" wouldn't be discovered and maybe I would have been better protected (because I don't have to worry about the Mafia trying to kill me because they don't know I am the doctor).

Olinard, are you back yet? It's been more than two hours since you said "brb." ;P

EDIT: Echo, what is WIFOM thinking? xD Sounds like "superhypothetical" thinking.

Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T20:53:42+00:00

http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php ... ront_Of_Me

I thought I'd linked that before :/

Basically it's what you do in your early posts.

"if adam was mafia then [something] BUT if adam is townie then [something] which means he must be mafia if he did it but then that makes him townie because he's smart enough to know it makes him look townie, which means he's actualy mafia, which makes him townie, which makes him mafia etc."

Olinad

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Olinad 2009-06-14T20:55:59+00:00

strager wrote:
Echo wrote:
tbh if strager had said something like "I'm just curious to know about the rules around the doctor and how protection works" I wouldn't have had anything to go on, since that would only lead to WIFOM thinking.
Well, I don't ask questions like that, really. I try to be a little more specific in my questions than "how does the Doctor work exactly?" If I had asked the question you suggest I would probably get an answer similar to what the PM states and not what I wanted to know. But you're right, the "claim" wouldn't be discovered and maybe I would have been better protected (because I don't have to worry about the Mafia trying to kill me because they don't know I am the doctor).

Olinard, are you back yet? It's been more than two hours since you said "brb." ;P

EDIT: Echo, what is WIFOM thinking? xD Sounds like "superhypothetical" thinking.

lol UR right, but I was busy XD

I really dunno who to vote... mmh...

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T21:33:46+00:00

Echo wrote:
http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Wine_In_Front_Of_Me

I thought I'd linked that before :/

Basically it's what you do in your early posts.

"if adam was mafia then [something] BUT if adam is townie then [something] which means he must be mafia if he did it but then that makes him townie because he's smart enough to know it makes him look townie, which means he's actualy mafia, which makes him townie, which makes him mafia etc."

By "you" you mean the not me "you"?

And thanks.

/me stabs Olinad into voting.

Echo

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Echo 2009-06-14T21:39:15+00:00

By "you" I mean the second person pronoun (ie. you, strager), and not the generic "you"

Olinad

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Olinad 2009-06-14T21:47:35+00:00

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anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T22:18:23+00:00

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anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T22:23:17+00:00

Echo wrote:
By "you" I mean the second person pronoun (ie. you, strager), and not the generic "you"

Article says:

Article wrote:
In Mafia, WIFOM arguments are often a Scum tactic used to distract the Town.

No wonder you were super-suspicious of me. =S However that paragraph talks about after a Night kill so I'm not sure if that really is your reason or if you just don't like my choices about adam.

Then again I pointed out some circular reasoning in your own argument and you didn't comment on it.

adam2046

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adam2046 2009-06-14T22:23:33+00:00

...Why aren't you voting yourself then SFG?

anonymous_old

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anonymous_old 2009-06-14T22:25:42+00:00