yeah i realize.winber1 wrote:
You realize I'm just being an ass about grammatical English, right? I know what he means; I'm just explaining his attempt to translate the sentence did not logically make sense.MxG PhiLL wrote:
I think what he was trying to say is that there is seemingly no way that he could have good aim, but he inexplicably does. He just phrased it wrong, but you just gotta think for 2 seconds to figure out what he meant.
forum
Which is more important? Cursor movement or Streaming
posted
Total Posts
201
Cursor movement or Streaming?
Total votes: 522
PhiLL A
u gui so smart!@
well, English isn't my native language, so let's assume, subconsciously i think that i am pro and i wanted show off.
/how to speak English
/how to speak English
mouse movement = hand-eye coordination
accuracy = sense of rythm
speed = physical ability
comparing apples with oranges
accuracy = sense of rythm
speed = physical ability
comparing apples with oranges
What's wrong with that?silmarilen wrote:
comparing apples with oranges
I have 5 apples and 6 oranges. I have more oranges.
streaming since you can buy movement with a tablet
Bullshit.Hanyuu wrote:
streaming since you can buy movement with a tablet
The only problem I had with going back to my mouse was that it was a piece of shit.Hanyuu wrote:
streaming since you can buy movement with a tablet
why is this still going even nowHanyuu wrote:
you can buy movement with a tablet
Buy tablet get good at jumps yeah right more like buy tablet get bad at small circles and lines and squares. mouse > tablet at snapping.
and flow/stream movement is exactly the same with both when you get used to it
if anything tablet makes you better at streaming. tapx race too stronk
I wish tablet made me better at streaming.
start tapping
obviously moving cursor if ur my rank and ur gd at it or experienced streams are easy but moving the cursor to 20 different circles at the same time is not try itAqo wrote:
start tapping
tablet makes you better at aiming and jumps, especially on small circles and squares where mouse is inferior for most people. only because it's different for you it doesn't mean it's like that for everyone, and in fact most of the people who bought a tablet got better at jumps and movement overall almost instantly.Aqo wrote:
why is this still going even nowHanyuu wrote:
you can buy movement with a tablet
Buy tablet get good at jumps yeah right more like buy tablet get bad at small circles and lines and squares. mouse > tablet at snapping.
and flow/stream movement is exactly the same with both when you get used to it
if anything tablet makes you better at streaming. tapx race too stronk
so in 99% of the cases, yes, a tablet is like buying movement and jumpskills.
and tapx is a lot harder to learn than keyboardstreaming, and your acc won't be as good as the acc of a keyboardstreamer unless you are really good with tapx.
PhiLL A
I think Aqo meant that mouse is better than tablet for jumps because snapping is a lot better and easier with mouse.Tanzklaue wrote:
tablet makes you better at aiming and jumps, especially on small circles and squares where mouse is inferior for most people. only because it's different for you it doesn't mean it's like that for everyone, and in fact most of the people who bought a tablet got better at jumps and movement overall almost instantly.Aqo wrote:
why is this still going even now
Buy tablet get good at jumps yeah right more like buy tablet get bad at small circles and lines and squares. mouse > tablet at snapping.
and flow/stream movement is exactly the same with both when you get used to it
if anything tablet makes you better at streaming. tapx race too stronk
so in 99% of the cases, yes, a tablet is like buying movement and jumpskills.
and tapx is a lot harder to learn than keyboardstreaming, and your acc won't be as good as the acc of a keyboardstreamer unless you are really good with tapx.
The only reason people "get better when they buy tablet" is because those people tried playing with high dpi and acceleration and suddenly the full tablet area with absolute positioning made them more accurate "like magic". Low DPI mouse does everything tablet does and better unless your mouse is abysmally terrible.
I played with a mouse at low DPI (800) before switching to tablet, but I didn't get better at all 
PhiLL A
More practice? please... look at my play count, when i joined and what i achieved(started playing with tablet sep 11)... You can achieve same things with any play style, what matters is how determined you are and talent. If all you do is whine(im not saying that you do that) how easy it is to play with tablet by not even trying it(and when most people try it they understand that it's completely not easy) then you gonna end up buying it \:D/.MxG PhiLL wrote:
The thing is, mouse play takes more skill and more practice than tablet from what I've seen. At least for me, tablet learning curve was much steeper than mouse learning curve
Look at Kakusi(now Shizuru-) he joined this year and already owns 99% people here... or other mouse players Silvia,Beatrice even Niko- is now playing with mouse...
Practicing stream is harder than getting good tablet settings 
I dont know what you guys problem is. Streaming is harder, if you got a tablet and cant aim there is your problem and its not about flow or jumps or whatever words you make up its only pointing the cursor in the right place and its super easy with tablet?
Learning to aim harder than pressing so many clicks in little time.. you got to be kidding me
I dont know what you guys problem is. Streaming is harder, if you got a tablet and cant aim there is your problem and its not about flow or jumps or whatever words you make up its only pointing the cursor in the right place and its super easy with tablet?
Learning to aim harder than pressing so many clicks in little time.. you got to be kidding me
Hanyuu wrote:
Practicing stream is harder than getting good tablet settings
I dont know what you guys problem is. Streaming is harder, if you got a tablet and cant aim there is your problem and its not about flow or jumps or whatever words you make up its only pointing the cursor in the right place and its super easy with tablet?
Learning to aim harder than pressing so many clicks in little time.. you got to be kidding me
thelewa's story
oh yeah? I've played for 2,5 years and I still can't stream =/
Oh yeah? I've played for 2,5 years and I still can't accuracy =/kriers wrote:
oh yeah? I've played for 2,5 years and I still can't stream =/
Emaal
Emaal best
#1 osu
#1 osu
Streaming is easiest thing in this game, what can be hard is high bpm streams(220+) or accuracy on slow ones(but with time you kinda feel each tap so it's not that hard)Hanyuu wrote:
Practicing stream is harder than getting good tablet settings
I dont know what you guys problem is. Streaming is harder, if you got a tablet and cant aim there is your problem and its not about flow or jumps or whatever words you make up its only pointing the cursor in the right place and its super easy with tablet?
Learning to aim harder than pressing so many clicks in little time.. you got to be kidding me
Answer me, what is so hard in pressing button which stays on place all the time???
From your words i can clearly see that you never used tablet, playing with tablet brings a lot of things which can't be fixed in short period... For example grip if you are comfortable with grip which allows you move 1x1cm big area you are pretty much screwed. One more thing, corners i think that's the "best" place for all tablet players.
Wrong, tablet is objectively better for aiming and jumping (coming from someone who switched from 400 DPI mouse to tablet). Absolute tracking with tablet means that there is a point on the tablet area for every hitcircle (hence defined jump paths) whereas with a mouse, you only learn to jump through practice and muscle memory.Aqo wrote:
The only reason people "get better when they buy tablet" is because those people tried playing with high dpi and acceleration and suddenly the full tablet area with absolute positioning made them more accurate "like magic". Low DPI mouse does everything tablet does and better unless your mouse is abysmally terrible.
I was already equal to my mouse jumping ability within 24 hours of tablet play and am now miles better with tablet.
tl;dr - buy tablet, become cookiezi
I'd play tablet too if I didn’t have this much muscle memory and my hand didn't feel like dying from a few hours of tablet usage.
also puraido.
also puraido.
The only reason why some people think mouse is worse is because they suck and don't know how to get their setting properly configured. Tablet is easier to just "jump into", whereas mouse requires more knowledge.Kanye West wrote:
Wrong, tablet is objectively better for aiming and jumping (coming from someone who switched from 400 DPI mouse to tablet). Absolute tracking with tablet means that there is a point on the tablet area for every hitcircle (hence defined jump paths) whereas with a mouse, you only learn to jump through practice and muscle memory.Aqo wrote:
The only reason people "get better when they buy tablet" is because those people tried playing with high dpi and acceleration and suddenly the full tablet area with absolute positioning made them more accurate "like magic". Low DPI mouse does everything tablet does and better unless your mouse is abysmally terrible.
I was already equal to my mouse jumping ability within 24 hours of tablet play and am now miles better with tablet.
tl;dr - buy tablet, become cookiezi
That absolute tracking also fucks up everything when you need small movement or hard patterns(its hard to explain but you end up pressing in wrong places or smth). And what you mean by whereas with a mouse, you only learn to jump through practice and muscle memory to move pen you also need muscles besides if you are hovering then you need even higher precision because you can't feel anything in the air whereas with a mouse, you move on actual surface.Kanye West wrote:
Wrong, tablet is objectively better for aiming and jumping (coming from someone who switched from 400 DPI mouse to tablet). Absolute tracking with tablet means that there is a point on the tablet area for every hitcircle (hence defined jump paths) whereas with a mouse, you only learn to jump through practice and muscle memory.Aqo wrote:
The only reason people "get better when they buy tablet" is because those people tried playing with high dpi and acceleration and suddenly the full tablet area with absolute positioning made them more accurate "like magic". Low DPI mouse does everything tablet does and better unless your mouse is abysmally terrible.
I was already equal to my mouse jumping ability within 24 hours of tablet play and am now miles better with tablet.
tl;dr - buy tablet, become cookiezi
Also from my experience even after ~5 months with tablet, 1 day was enough to fc easy hard with mouse but i always was making random miss with tablet.
lol logo trying to say tablet is hard wwwwwww
He's just saying that a mouse is better for small movements such as in this map: http://osu.ppy.sh/s/19691
That's a map that really is a thousand times easier for mouse players to DT fc.
That's a map that really is a thousand times easier for mouse players to DT fc.
It's true tho, not only for weird line patterns and stuff
doing fullscreen 1/2 jumps on 200bpm or higher on CS5 with tablet is hard as hell because of hovering, you end up missing between the jumps. you need to practice being super steady with the hand that holds the pen
meanwhile with mouse it's easy to land exactly on the the circles as long as you moved in the right direction and you have enough speed. stuff like those diamonds on atama is a nightmare with tablet and with mouse it's like a free +combo
http://osu.ppy.sh/b/150406&m=0
the first few seconds on this map
with mouse it's really easy
with tablet it's like buuuuuutttfuuuuuck
doing fullscreen 1/2 jumps on 200bpm or higher on CS5 with tablet is hard as hell because of hovering, you end up missing between the jumps. you need to practice being super steady with the hand that holds the pen
meanwhile with mouse it's easy to land exactly on the the circles as long as you moved in the right direction and you have enough speed. stuff like those diamonds on atama is a nightmare with tablet and with mouse it's like a free +combo
http://osu.ppy.sh/b/150406&m=0
the first few seconds on this map
with mouse it's really easy
with tablet it's like buuuuuutttfuuuuuck
Whats so hard pressing a button that stays in place well.. its pretty damn fast and you need to train your fingers so ridiculously that you can press this fast and keep this endurance for the long streams . Also i played tablet by tapping for half a year and then afterwards i switched to kb pressing. it is not hard at all and if you cant move in a 1x1cm big area (well thats a joke i think but anyways) you can adjust with resolution or gameplay area. <-- thats why i said about tablet settings in my earlier post. also those "feared" corner things squares whatever. it does not really matter. the game is just about aim and hit in time. however the pattern may look or where notes are placed it doesnt matter really. anyways my opinion still stands and the topic title is: Which is more important? Cursor movement or Streaming... for me definitely streaming since yeah,you can get a good movement alot easierLoGo wrote:
Streaming is easiest thing in this game, what can be hard is high bpm streams(220+) or accuracy on slow ones(but with time you kinda feel each tap so it's not that hard)Hanyuu wrote:
Practicing stream is harder than getting good tablet settings
I dont know what you guys problem is. Streaming is harder, if you got a tablet and cant aim there is your problem and its not about flow or jumps or whatever words you make up its only pointing the cursor in the right place and its super easy with tablet?
Learning to aim harder than pressing so many clicks in little time.. you got to be kidding me
Answer me, what is so hard in pressing button which stays on place all the time???
From your words i can clearly see that you never used tablet, playing with tablet brings a lot of things which can't be fixed in short period... For example grip if you are comfortable with grip which allows you move 1x1cm big area you are pretty much screwed. One more thing, corners i think that's the "best" place for all tablet players.
If we could get good at movements alot easier, we should see a tons of new cookiezi everywhere.
Streaming is definitively easier.
Streaming is definitively easier.
how is that any easier for mouse.Aqo wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/b/150406&m=0
the first few seconds on this map
with mouse it's really easy
with tablet it's like buuuuuutttfuuuuuck
it's pretty damn easy on tablet anyways. trollololol
inb4 peppy now sells osu!-mice instead of tablets.
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/4548
339 combo with mouse /pro
339 combo with mouse /pro
QFT lolwinber1 wrote:
how is that any easier for mouse.Aqo wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/b/150406&m=0
the first few seconds on this map
with mouse it's really easy
with tablet it's like buuuuuutttfuuuuuck
it's pretty damn easy on tablet anyways. trollololol
And if you're having a hard time with small cursor movements, use a bigger tablet area. 'nuff said. Like I said before, if you miss notes with a tablet, you objectively suck.
i think movement is more important because with bad aim you cant get the movement in the streams right
and you can improve faster in streaming
and you can improve faster in streaming
ITT: preferences
I couldn't click on any of those beats.winber1 wrote:
how is that any easier for mouse.Aqo wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/b/150406&m=0
the first few seconds on this map
with mouse it's really easy
with tablet it's like buuuuuutttfuuuuuck
it's pretty damn easy on tablet anyways. trollololol
and I'm a mouse user lol.
wasnt that the whole purpose of this topic? looking at the titlebuny wrote:
ITT: preferences
I just wanted to remind everyone that people have different views on certain things.silmarilen wrote:
wasnt that the whole purpose of this topic? looking at the titlebuny wrote:
ITT: preferences
Mesita.silmarilen wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/4548
339 combo with mouse /pro
Kalle_old_1
For me, getting good at moving the mouse smoothly at all speeds is more important, as keeping up with streams tends to be much harder than being able to click alone. The amount of dexterity that's required when rapid clicking is compounded by constant movement is pretty fierce.
It depends on the player. It's important to be good at both, but some players are better at one and worse at the other.
If you're looking to just pass a song, then I would say cursor movement, since you can mess up a little with timing. But with position, if you're a little off the circle, it still counts as a miss.
i can stream ascension to heaven or say mad machine pretty decent, but when it comes to a part in a song where it's like, stream note note stream stream note, then i have trouble, so it's more about control in streaming and aim, not just how fast you can spam your fingers
Azumi Shizuko wrote:
it's more about control in streaming and aim, not just how fast you can spam your fingers
you can just spam through it though with perfect accuracy still lolAzumi Shizuko wrote:
i can stream ascension to heaven or say mad machine pretty decent, but when it comes to a part in a song where it's like, stream note note stream stream note, then i have trouble, so it's more about control in streaming and aim, not just how fast you can spam your fingers
Spam through it with perfect accuracy? Maybe mad machine yeah, but then again that map has almost 0 importance.
You cannot mindlessly spam your keys on OD8 and get perfect accuracy. (Ascension)
You cannot mindlessly spam your keys on OD8 and get perfect accuracy. (Ascension)
just because you can't doesn't mean others can't also.Zook wrote:
Spam through it with perfect accuracy? Maybe mad machine yeah, but then again that map has almost 0 importance.
You cannot mindlessly spam your keys on OD8 and get perfect accuracy. (Ascension)
Pretty much all of my scores are just mindless spammingbuny wrote:
just because you can't doesn't mean others can't also.Zook wrote:
Spam through it with perfect accuracy? Maybe mad machine yeah, but then again that map has almost 0 importance.
You cannot mindlessly spam your keys on OD8 and get perfect accuracy. (Ascension)
accuracy is a subconscious thing anyway
stop trolling thelewa (:
buny, I'd much rather stream properly than be a keyboard berserker and hope for the best.
buny, I'd much rather stream properly than be a keyboard berserker and hope for the best.
only on low bpm i actually have to pay attention to get acc in streamers, between 170-190 bpm i mindlessly spam aswell
It's funny because best players ever are actually movement gods.
/thread?
/thread?
Movement doesn't matter if you have the streaming ability of a 2 year old.Wishy wrote:
It's funny because best players ever are actually movement gods.
/thread?
they arent just movement gods, they also have incredible stream speed.Wishy wrote:
It's funny because best players ever are actually movement gods.
/thread?
its just that they also have movement on top of that, which most people dont.
It's funny because I'm top 100 and I stream really badly. So I'll never be a "best player" unless I can fix that.silmarilen wrote:
they arent just movement gods, they also have incredible stream speed.Wishy wrote:
It's funny because best players ever are actually movement gods.
/thread?
its just that they also have movement on top of that, which most people dont.
I'll never be good unless I suddenly get speedy fingers
my cursor movement sucks atm while my tapping skills are off the charts. I gotta do something about that..
Uncle Buly
relax mod makes the map 50x easier and autopilot makes the map 50x harder
The only thing that takes skill is clicking. Aim takes no skill, every child can do it.
she_old
both take no skill when you look at them individually
Not really
how many people can stream 222bpm for 70 notes individually. http://www.all8.com/tools/mpm.htm people try and fail. it's still hard on its own
how many people can stream 222bpm for 70 notes individually. http://www.all8.com/tools/mpm.htm people try and fail. it's still hard on its own
apparently most of the people that use this forum stream over 240bpm
anyways, more on topic, that's like saying how many people can follow the streams in fd?
anyways, more on topic, that's like saying how many people can follow the streams in fd?
*claim tobuny wrote:
apparently most of the people that use this forum stream over 240bpm
I'm proud to claim to be able to stream up to 180bpm, and not a single beat per minute faster.
Soarezi
The thing about FD is that you have to have insane stamina to actually keep up your fingers to stream constant 222bpm, while you're getting tired your nerves are going to stop working so your right hand will also ( or left hand whichever youre using for movement ) will also slow down and you can't keep up anymore.
People that can stream that fast and for a long time, such as cookiezi or keigoclear have my respect.
People that can stream that fast and for a long time, such as cookiezi or keigoclear have my respect.
Yeah Freedom Dive on relax is nothing compared to actually playing it. When your mind has to process 222 bpm deathstreams while still following insane stream patterns you end up missing more than you would with relax.
You have too high expectations of other players.Defacer wrote:
so I guess a lot of players can easily go 222 constantly.
ErmDefacer wrote:
a lot of players can easily go 222 constantly
There are less than 10 players I know of that can do 222 bpm for as long as freedom dive is while getting acceptable accuracy. Not exactly a lot imo. I will say though a lot of people could complete the streams, but only if you are actually able to keep up with the BPM from a rhythmic standpoint would you be able to complete the map. As in, if the streams were shorter and not spaced as hell you would be able to all-300 it for a while. From my perspective, I miss the streams so badly because I have to put 99% of my concentration on just keeping up with the sheer speed of it. That's why it seems like easy stuff on relax.
yeah movement is more important once you have mastered key presses so really as key presses come 1st that is most important.
agreebuny wrote:
apparently most of the people that use this forum stream over 240bpm
anyways, more on topic, that's like saying how many people can follow the streams in fd?
speed for very short periods everyone can spam, but to keep consistent high-speed on long run stream is just hell ;_;
A lot of players can go 222 for short bursts, yes. Even I can do that. But only a very very few players can keep up the streams in 4D.Defacer wrote:
And I think that a lot of players can go 222, yeah.
and only about 3 or 4 can follow the streams.GoldenWolf wrote:
A lot of players can go 222 for short bursts, yes. Even I can do that. But only a very very few players can keep up the streams in 4D.Defacer wrote:
And I think that a lot of players can go 222, yeah.
People like Keigo are more like "exceptions" than "examples".Defacer wrote:
KeigoClear is a perfect example of a insane speed and accuracy not to mention stamina
I bet when a number of people say "I can stream 240+ bpm no problem!" they're talking about triples or some shit. I don't think that counts as streaming.
At what point should someone be able to say they can stream a certain bpm?
At what point should someone be able to say they can stream a certain bpm?
Pettanko wrote:
At what point should someone be able to say they can stream a certain bpm?
I'd say more than 17 circles full 300 consistently is a good start
I don't even consider 17 circles a stream anymore :v
if you can't hit at least 200 circles in a row for a certain bpm you can't stream it.
if you can't hit at least 200 circles in a row for a certain bpm you can't stream it.
then i cant stream a single bpm
gg
gg
Just checked top scores on chipscape out of curiosity. Found tons of halftimers, many tap+x, one cheater and less than 10 people who actually cleared that deathstream, not to mention accuracy. Imagine how many of them can follow spaced curved fd streams that last x20 longer.
Oh btw check out the Sprosive guy replay, that's how you deal with deathstream haha.
Oh btw check out the Sprosive guy replay, that's how you deal with deathstream haha.
if you can stream chipscape's deathstream successfully by fingers consider yourself pro, there are much less than a hundred of people who can actually do thatDefacer wrote:
screw all those ''i can stream 260'', ''calculator says i go 320 woo'', they will learn(hopefully) that what they say is not true and is shit.I've encountered many people doing really good results on high bpm streams, I don't know how to explain exactly why in FD 222 isnt hard at all but the damn overall placement of the stream.Chipscape is 220 and so many people can stream the deathstream succesfully but probably can't stream fd, I am one of those for instance and I am not even pro, hundreds of players like me over there.
Also quoting goldenwolf, i can even stream short burst 270bpm without any problem (http://osu.ppy.sh/s/45335) but i can't even pass chipscape, lol
it's hard enough getting to the deathstream without breaking combo
Imagine 100 series of 17 circles streams spaced by 1/1, if you can do more than 90 series full 300, then you can stream that bpm.Aqo wrote:
I don't even consider 17 circles a stream anymore :v
if you can't hit at least 200 circles in a row for a certain bpm you can't stream it.
That said, almost nobody can stream any bpm lol
But that's only my opinion
1/1 is more than enough time to recover from a burst.
17 circles is a bit long for a burst
and I forgot to mention it should be at od9 at least, anything below would be too easy
and I forgot to mention it should be at od9 at least, anything below would be too easy
Whether you can stream or not in stream speed discussions and not stream accuracy discussions should not depend on OD at all. This topic boils down to how fast you can move your fingers up and down subsequently.
(since people in the last few posts were talking about speed)
If you want to mention accuracy it's a whole different thing.
(since people in the last few posts were talking about speed)
If you want to mention accuracy it's a whole different thing.
But what's the point to be able to stream fast if you can't do it well ? (spamming the keyboard and hope for the best)
The exact question I answered was :
So,
The exact question I answered was :
Being able to stream a certain bpm means : 1) Keep up the speed and 2) Having a good accPettanko wrote:
At what point should someone be able to say they can stream a certain bpm?
So,
GoldenWolf wrote:
That said, almost nobody can stream any bpm lol