Guest
home
beatmaps
rankings
community
store
help
forum
  1. Forums
  2. Beatmaps
  3. Ranked Beatmaps (Archived)

TAKA respect for J.S.B - Ubertreffen

posted
Total Posts
345
show more
ztrot
osu! Alumni
4,378 posts
Joined February 2008
ztrot
Okay, 1st off this map seems to be under a lot of attack for reasons imo explain themselves I would like some detailed reasons as to why patterns like the ones in insane were allowed I'd point out some but there are just so many but this kinda stuff is not fun or intuitive and hardly rankable imo just based on the harsh spacing that is involved. I think this needs to be talked about more spread as well we are trying to avoid things like this from occuring are we not? modders remember if something is really bad remapping is always a choice the same goes for the mapper.

okay so after discussing this with a few more staff members....
I strongly suggest you try to even out this spread a bit more and most feel that you should either remap or drop the insane or hardest diff
things like
00:23:059 (1) - are not even sight readable
00:10:301 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13) - death streams with sudden spacing changes here as well.

01:12:542 (3,4,1,2,3,4) - things like this are almost impossible to read with the default hit bursts

as for spread I may be wrong but it will be talked about more for right now unranked.
Mismagius
9,242 posts
Joined July 2008
Mismagius
okay, unlocked but please don't troll.
NatsumeRin
osu! Alumni
4,032 posts
Joined August 2009
NatsumeRin
Diff spread: Fine as it is, Bronze may be a bit hard, but you really can't expect something more to add between a Easy and a Normal (though both are hard ones)

Highest diff: I probably won't bubble mapsets contains such a diff because it's just like mad, but those things are not unrankable, i doubt if they're fun to play but at least it fits the music.
val0108
1,430 posts
Joined January 2010
val0108
omg
SapphireGhost
osu! Alumni
2,618 posts
Joined June 2010
SapphireGhost
- I don't agree that this is a great map, but some people enjoy it. For that reason, I don't agree with unranking this because there are no strictly "unrankable" aspects.
- The spread plays like NHIIII. We allow NHI spreads, so there's no reason to not allow this one. A) Changing the difficulties to make the star rating different doesn't accomplish anything. B) Removing difficulties will not improve a spread.
- Scores on [Platinum] are here for sentimental value.

ztrot
osu! Alumni
4,378 posts
Joined February 2008
ztrot
so you leave it in a horrible state and just let it go like that? we should try to improve where there is room to improve or our standards will drop to nothing.
Katsuri
1,075 posts
Joined February 2011
Katsuri
Well, sudden speed ups may not be good, considering the player will not really be able to play it easily. The rest of the difficulty is not really difficult to full combo, but the speed-ups are just kind of mad. Well, considering reducing the speed-up rate should work out as fine as needed for this mapset. As ztrot said, the deathstreams are not really welcome here, it doesn't really fit the song at all and neither is fun to play, as Natsume said. Just don't give up! You can improve your mapset, it's cool to play, I just disliked some weird hidden patterns, but they are readable.

Good luck! :D

Just keep working! :D
Last edited by Katsuri , edited 1 time in total.
Cyclohexane
osu! Alumni
4,568 posts
Joined May 2009
Cyclohexane
In a purely informative aspect, I have collected the comments on the beatmap on the highest difficulty. It should also be noted that the map had an user rating of 6.3 before it got unranked.
SPOILER
-MAP SUCKS MAP SUCKS MAP SUCKS
-What happens if a CtB user makes a standard mode map
-this map sucks.
-sooooooooooo baaaaaaaaaad D:
-ITS NOT BAD!!!
-Can't pass the map = This map sucks
-Make shitty hard map and say that everyone who hates the map cant play it? Sure.
-first
-LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLL WHAT THE FUCK
-I really loved the accerelations
-Don't make a map like this again, It's worthless

I think this speaks for itself. "Some people" might enjoy it, but it's clearly not ready for ranking.
Plus I'm not sure about the rankability of the fast sliders at the beginning of Platinum.
Last edited by Cyclohexane , edited 1 time in total.
SapphireGhost
osu! Alumni
2,618 posts
Joined June 2010
SapphireGhost
ztrot: It is your opinion that this map is in a "horrible state". It wasn't worth unranking the map for the entire community.

I realize I'm in the minority, but on an objective level there was no reason to unrank this.
Cristian
1,945 posts
Joined November 2009
Cristian
Oh geez, another serious talk.
Sallad4ever
2,917 posts
Joined October 2009
Sallad4ever
I agree with NatsumeRin on the Bronze might be quite a big jump in difficulty from Rust. It could use a little change here and there but it doesn't warrant an unrank. But I wholeheartedly agree on the unrank because of the Platinum diff, the quality of the Platinum diff is not up to the standard of ranking map nowadays. The diff is just too much why can't the mapper just keep Gold as the hardest diff?
Cygnus
1,517 posts
Joined December 2011
Topic Starter
Cygnus
:|, lemme do a little working. :O
Katsuri
1,075 posts
Joined February 2011
Katsuri

Philippines wrote:

:|, lemme do a little working. :O
Lovely! :D
Cygnus
1,517 posts
Joined December 2011
Topic Starter
Cygnus
I don't seem to know what to fix though, I'm a bit confused about some suggestions.
Katsuri
1,075 posts
Joined February 2011
Katsuri
Firstly, it would be lovely if you follow Sallad4ever's suggestion and remove your last difficulty. It's to improve your map.. Or you can study a bit more streamy maps to improve yours, you should just try to make it better, always better!

If you want a mod, just let me know and I will try to help you, but I'm not the better person to help ya since I only mapped streams twice in my life.

Good luck, though :D
SapphireGhost
osu! Alumni
2,618 posts
Joined June 2010
SapphireGhost
Might as well give subjective input now that it's being changed...

[Platinum]
00:22:714 (1,2,1,2) - I found these sightreadable, but it seems most people disagree. Try to make the speedup/spacing less extreme.
00:25:473 (1,2,1,2) - ^
00:37:887 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,1) - Please don't do this. Oftentimes while attempting to hit the fast-paced (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13), it is very easy to hit too many times and end up missing (1). Just change the position of the next stream slightly so it doesn't begin under the previous one.
01:05:473 (1,2,3,4,5,6) etc. - The spacing is really too high in this section. I could hit it decently after a few tries, but it wasn't fun to play because of the difficulty.
01:12:370 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - The overlapping is too extreme here. The player has to move their cursor back and forth very quickly in an awkward manner and it's not fun to play. Just try making the spacing a bit more linear.
01:15:128 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - ^
01:30:301 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - ^

A lot of others have shared these concerns, so I believe your map will be getting a little less hate if you fix these up.
Cygnus
1,517 posts
Joined December 2011
Topic Starter
Cygnus
I'm not gonna delete anything when I know it is rankable. I hope everything goes right after the BAT talk thing, I'm not gonna do any move for now.

EDIT: Hi SG, lemme see..
dkun
osu! Alumni
4,486 posts
Joined August 2009
dkun
dkun's modding key

this is unrankable.
this should be highly considered.
this is just a normal suggestion/praise.

General
  1. Where is your SPREAD? EIIIII IS H O R R I B L E.
  2. Why was this map ranked even with a spread such as this, or even as a map like this? Will you actually respond to what you guys did, Derek and Mafiamaster?
Gold
  1. Consider everything below this as an italics tag, or even a bold tag.
  2. This diff has an identity crisis between a Hard and an Insane.
  3. 00:11:680 (1) - This slider can be composed better.
  4. 00:13:059 (1,3) - These two sliders can look better.
  5. 00:19:956 (1,2,3,4,5) - Is this a hard, or an insane?
  6. 00:23:404 (5,6,1) - This anti-jump doesn't make any sense flow wise.
  7. 00:28:577 (2) - Stack on 1
  8. 00:28:749 (3,4,5,6) - There's your hard vs insane clause again.
  9. 00:29:611 (2) - Stack on 1
  10. 00:30:128 (3,4,5,6) - Same as ^
  11. ^ nice copy paste
  12. 00:31:335 (2) - Stack on 1, you get the point
  13. 00:32:370 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - ???? is this platinum???
  14. 00:35:128 (1,2,3,4,5) - This stream of 5, and the ALL THE ONES ahead of it are bad in terms of flow and the difficulty.
Platinum
  1. Consider everything below this as an italics tag, or even a bold tag.
  2. The overall difficulty of this difficulty is RIDICULOUS. These JUMPS are HORRID. H O R R I D.
  3. 00:12:714 (13,1) - 136miliseconds for a 2.36x jump? Are you a robot? These streams NEED to be reworked.
  4. 00:14:094 (13,1) - ^
  5. 00:15:473 (13,1) - ^
  6. 00:18:232 (13,14) - This jump is utterly ridiculous. Fix it.
  7. 00:19:611 (13,14) - ^
  8. 00:20:990 (13,14) - ^
  9. 00:22:370 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1) - I don't know how this was even ranked to begin with?
  10. 00:30:128 (6,7,8,9) - ???? ^
  11. 00:31:508 (6,7,8,9,10) - ^
  12. 00:34:266 (6,7,8,9) - ^
  13. 00:35:646 (6,7,8,9,10) - ^
  14. 00:37:025 (6,7,8,9,10) - ^
  15. 00:38:921 (13,1) - What is this anti-jump? Breaks the flow of the map.
  16. 01:02:370 (13,1) - Spacing in this as well.
  17. 01:05:473 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12) - ^
  18. 01:06:852 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12) - ^
  19. 01:12:456 (2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - (AND ALL OTHER COMBOS LIKE THIS) just NO
  20. 01:16:852 (4,1,6,6,6,6,6,6) - Everything with the beat on the top here with the random streams is utterly ridiculous and do not even correspond to flow.
136miliseconds for a 2.36X jump?
Low
2,006 posts
Joined July 2011
Low
Here's what I think could be/needs to be improved/changed on your Platinum difficulty (some things are reiterated from ztrot's post) -

00:13:385 (4) - This and all of the patterns in the map like this are extremely difficulty to sightread! Nobody would expect you to do this. It seems really frustrating to play on top of that. A simple, fun to play solution to this would be this.
SPOILER
In the above screenshot, the notes are 1/2 beats apart. Note that (6) is hidden under (4). This is much more intuitive than what you currently have.

00:39:266 (1) - The deathstream starting at this note seems extremely long and tiring. You might want to throw in a short repeat slider or two in there. Also, please don't stack a stream under another stream when they're 1/1 beats apart. The player might accidentally hit the start of the stream too early. A solution to this would be this.

01:03:921 (15,1) - The jump between these two notes, especially considering that they're streams, is very large. The player is extremely vulnerable to missing here.

01:12:370 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - The way that this stream overlaps itself is not fun to play. This occurs multiple times in the map. It looks like a cluttered mess. Perhaps you could try something like this.

Good luck!
Last edited by Low , edited 1 time in total.
val0108
1,430 posts
Joined January 2010
val0108
[Platinum]
OD7
01:15:128 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - plz change this pattern.you can it!!
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1

SapphireGhost wrote:

00:37:887 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,1) - Please don't do this. Oftentimes while attempting to hit the fast-paced (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13), it is very easy to hit too many times and end up missing (1).

Jacob wrote:

Also, please don't stack a stream under another stream when they're 1/1 beats apart. The player might accidentally hit the start of the stream too early. A solution to this would be this.
I find this reasoning to be extremely flawed to be honest. In my opinion the player should be perfectly able to play this. If not, it's the player's fault not the mapper. Changing a difficulty in order to allow a player to play a map better just seems to defeat a certain purpose of mapping.

As for me, I find this map is perfectly rankable and quite playable without much problem. I understood the rhythm of every pattern after my first try, yet on many other songs that aren't nearly as hard it takes me little longer to understand all the patterns.

I know I'm kinda arguing pointless things and what's done is done, but really, this unrank really does feel like a stretch (though I don't really know about the difficulty spread or how the other difficulties play, since I have never seen them yet. I only speak of Platinum)

The only things I felt were a little annoying was 01:05:473 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12) - , but it's mostly due to the fact I suck at triplet streams anyways., and 01:12:370 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - . However, I don't dislike them just because I can't play them well.

Just felt like I really needed to say something, but I do see why many people would dislike this map.

Edit: Oh yeah... also

dkun wrote:

136miliseconds for a 2.36X jump?
SPOILER

lululul my random recognized guest diff. 88ms for 6.93x jump
Derekku
COOL DUDE
7,270 posts
Joined March 2009
Derekku
dkun: Star rating cannot be used to judge difficulty spread. I feel that this spread is proper and nice; easy/normal/hard/hard+/insane/expert.

As for Platinum itself: I stand behind my decision that this map is rankable, intuitive, and readable.
dkun
osu! Alumni
4,486 posts
Joined August 2009
dkun
Then you do not know what difficulty spread is.

There is NO way in hell this is an E/N/H/H+/I/EX. Your decision? Look AROUND you. Everyone else clearly doesn't!
Last edited by Sakura , edited 2 times in total.
Cyclohexane
osu! Alumni
4,568 posts
Joined May 2009
Cyclohexane
So Derekku
have you played it?
Yuukari-Banteki
1,534 posts
Joined June 2008
Yuukari-Banteki
Phillip, your attitude towards mods and BATs is unreasonable and unfortunate. I wish that you would be able to see past desiring to just achieve ranked status and actually care about the quality of your own map.

Please fix this, I only looked at about 15 seconds of your map and if I read any more I will probably gain a career as a serial killer.
ztrot
osu! Alumni
4,378 posts
Joined February 2008
ztrot
and I stand by my call that it was not. thus it was unranked.
Charles445
Elite Mapper II: Aspirant / osu! Paragon
2,881 posts
Joined March 2009
Charles445

Derekku wrote:

dkun: Star rating cannot be used to judge difficulty spread. I feel that this spread is proper and nice; easy/normal/hard/hard+/insane/expert.

As for Platinum itself: I stand behind my decision that this map is rankable, intuitive, and readable.
Yeah, super fast sliders are totally readable! (no they're not.)

As for difficulty spread, Bronze has a fitting star rating. It's not a Normal. The spacing is huge (1.1x with a fast slider velocity = holy cow)
Strings of objects like this 00:39:266 (1,2,3,4) - are what make the star rating rise, and that's because they are not easy for beginners to execute, especially with this high BPM. This is no doubt a Hard.

There is huge opportunity for a difficulty between Rust and Bronze.
Cygnus
1,517 posts
Joined December 2011
Topic Starter
Cygnus
Please don't start anything aweful guys, i'm trying not to rage here. AND I'M ALREADY FIXING. Can someone lock this thread please? The mods are enough i believe to cure this unrank.
Mara
4,906 posts
Joined November 2009
Mara
Too late.

The war has begun.

The war... of..... whatever, back to code C#.

Good luck with the mapset, though.
SapphireGhost
osu! Alumni
2,618 posts
Joined June 2010
SapphireGhost
I'm sorry, the attitude of these posts really is declining and Philippines is requesting a lock.
He's making fixes now, so let's give him some time to do that and give the community some time to calm down.
Let's leave this locked for a while.
Yuukari-Banteki
1,534 posts
Joined June 2008
Yuukari-Banteki
I don't think that locking this thread is productive right now. I'd prefer it to remain unlocked, if you want to discuss it please do so in PM with me.
Katsuri
1,075 posts
Joined February 2011
Katsuri

dkun wrote:

Then you do not know what difficulty spread is.

There is NO way in hell this is an E/N/H/H+/I/EX. Your decision? Look AROUND you. Everyone else clearly doesn't!
Not needed to be as rude as you are being now, but I can agree with you here dkun, there is not way to call it an E/N/H/H+/I/EX. Derekku probably played the map, at least I'm sure he can play it easily. I don't think the map is as messy as you are saying dkun, but it's not even decent to rank a map as it is.
It would be better if somebody lock the thread and let the mapper work on it a while, patiently.

Good luck again Philippines!
SapphireGhost
osu! Alumni
2,618 posts
Joined June 2010
SapphireGhost
There's a lot of negative energy in this thread right now and the mapper would prefer it to be locked. We'll see how it goes.
dkun
osu! Alumni
4,486 posts
Joined August 2009
dkun
big difference between being rude and being blunt
learn the difference



I don't think the mapper has the resolve to fix anything if he keeps this. His words ingame and on here are contradictory, as I pointed out most of the *unrankable* things.
Mismagius
9,242 posts
Joined July 2008
Mismagius
Keep it unlocked as long as people don't troll. There's discussion, but it's actually somewhat productive. So keep it unlocked for now.
Cygnus
1,517 posts
Joined December 2011
Topic Starter
Cygnus
I AM ALREADY FIXING!
Okay, I will try to keep this thing unlock, I'm pretty sure all you guys will be contented on the next update so you guys don't have to rage about it. Just give me a few more hours to fix these 'errors'.
LKs
3,119 posts
Joined August 2009
LKs
I never think think this is a bad map, but this does not really fit the current ranking situation Imo(the average difficulty of ranked maps are not high enough to let your map get in to their list) Good luck anyway

Edit: seems you fixed something. I'll have a look later :p
Last edited by LKs , edited 1 time in total.
Katsuri
1,075 posts
Joined February 2011
Katsuri
You WERE rude, it's not good for the mapper, he is going to ignore your modpost because you were rude and showed you are in rage with this map. That's not helpful to say the mapper: or . You just should consider being less rude with the mapper and then he will work on applying your mod as well.

Still think the thread should be unlocked and then the mapper will have the oppotunity to think about what should be fixed, without getting it's map's thread spammed with: "this map is terrible" or stuff like that.

ok. good luck on working on it philippines, any doubt feel free to bother some people in-game including me if you want to.
Last edited by Katsuri , edited 1 time in total.
SapphireGhost
osu! Alumni
2,618 posts
Joined June 2010
SapphireGhost
I don't know if "too hard" is a good reason to deny rankability on this map.
TJ.Hangneil - Kamui [SHD] and celas - Azul (Remix) are at least as difficult and also ranked.
Gaba
900 posts
Joined May 2011
Gaba

SapphireGhost wrote:

I don't know if "too hard" is a good reason to deny rankability on this map.
TJ.Hangneil - Kamui [SHD] and celas - Azul (Remix) are at least as difficult and also ranked.
Yes, but they are actually good maps.

No offense to the mapper, but this map is...meh.
show more
Please sign in to reply.

New reply

0
106 / 345