Guest
home
beatmaps
rankings
community
store
help
forum
  1. Forums
  2. osu!
  3. Development
  4. Feature Requests
  5. Completed Requests

[added] Make CS/HP/AR/OD toggle-able in Mods

posted
Total Posts
164
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +4,129
Maiz94
1,376 posts
Joined June 2010
Topic Starter
Maiz94

Blaze it


I got this idea when I play this beatmap, http://osu.ppy.sh/s/35375.

So, what I mean is, make CS/HP/AR/OD selected in numbers in mod selection, eg. :

Since the beatmap that I played is Insane diff which is ;
CS : 2/3/4/5/6/7
HP : 1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10
AR : 1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10
OD : 1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10

So, I would like to pass it by following my suit style in ;
Since AR makes me always failed on trying to pass the beatmap.
CS : 2/3/4/5/6/7
HP : 1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10
AR : 1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10
OD : 1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10

It's just like when clicking the Special Mod in osu!mania game mode which is 4K, 5K, 6K, 7K, 8K. So, it's the same way as the Special Mod in standard mode if it's implemented.

Of course, the other players can choose other numbers besides than mine to follow their suit style to pass on a certain beatmaps.

Also, about the Score Multiplier, if more numbers are picked in CS/HP/AR/OD respectively than the original CS/HP/AR/OD, Score Multiplier > 1.00x and if less numbers are picked in CS/HP/AR/OD respectively than the original CS/HP/AR/OD, Score Multiplier < 1.00x.
Last edited by Maiz94 , edited 3 times in total.
Luvdic
2,113 posts
Joined July 2009
Luvdic
I believe that I have read somewhere that they had plans on making the easy mod that way.

That was very long ago though, not sure if they still intent to do so.
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Oinari-sama

Xanandra wrote:

I believe that I have read somewhere that they had plans on making the easy mod that way.

That was very long ago though, not sure if they still intent to do so.
t/56606
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1
o!m can't be compared to this as 4K, 5K, 6K, 7K, 8K all change the gameplay (using different fingers and different patterns etc.), while changing osu standard settings doesn't change gameplay, but rather just making it harder or easier. All patterns and shapes and stuff are the exact same. Furthermore, sometimes increasing AR will help he player read the map better, thus you cannot firmly say that if you increase the numbers, you should get a difficulty increase multiplier. This will make the score multiplier very hard to be used accurately for all maps.

Having a toggle like this where increasing the number increase the multiplier and decreasing the number decreases the multiplier also runs into the problem where if you put HP drain and AR really high and lower the OD a ton (and maybe CS as well), and then you put on hard rock, it completely screws around with the mod because HP drain and AR are already maxed, and the OD increase is insubstantial because OD is already so low and thus if done correctly, you can get the 1.06x multiplier while making Hardrock easier.

Secondly, the mapper has decided the map is to be played like that. Mods are a different story and they are a set difficulty increase or decrease multiplier, and are made for diffculty increase or decrease, while your toggle is basically just for your personal desires.

Third, use editor, it's not hard to change map settings. If you don't like the current settings because they make it hard, change the settings in editor to practice. It's not hard to do.

This has also been requested in a similar fashion iirc somewhere else and got denied.
-Sapphire_old
-Sapphire_old
winber1 : That was harsh, but true. Have seen similar requests elsewhere which got denied as winber1 said.
Jawing
56 posts
Joined September 2010
Jawing
You are talking about my idea (which is very similar)... t/139647
Star it!
Kaeru
302 posts
Joined February 2013
Kaeru
Extra points for higher numbers doesn't always make sense (some maps are way easier with higher AR). Also, everyone would have to go set new highscores with everything set to 10.

I don't mind being able to reduce these settings from the mods menu, though I firmly believe that these plays should be unranked.
DJKero
231 posts
Here since the beginning
DJKero
Making AR Custom by user should be REALLY USEFUL... CS HP and OD don't need to be touched to don't bullshit the difficulty of the game though...
Mithos
636 posts
Joined February 2011
Mithos
As long as it is unranked, I'll support this.
Bauxe
1,624 posts
Joined August 2012
Bauxe

Mithost wrote:

As long as it is unranked, I'll support this.
I too would love this only if it was unranked. Would make practicing a whole lot easier.
Maiz94
1,376 posts
Joined June 2010
Topic Starter
Maiz94
Bump! >w<
deadbeat
osu! Alumni
9,218 posts
Joined June 2009
deadbeat
t/52873 just gonna leave this here
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman
I first came to the forums today to request something like the OP, then I found this thread and the linked-to threads within, and learned about all the issues involved, lots of discussion has taken place already.

But I still have a relevant question:

Is there any harm in giving incremental multiplier increase for a user selected increase in OD and CS?
AR increase can make a map easier, is a thing that was said. I don't think OD increase can make a map easier in any way, and CS increase might make a deliberately clustered map easier to read, but maps aren't supposed to be deliberately hard to read, so it won't make any correctly made map easier.

I ask because the case of myself specifically, I'd love to be playing everything set to CS7 and OD9 for ranked play without playing harder maps, I like to aim and I like to time accurately, but HR sets any map harder than normal to AR10, which is unplayable at my skill level. There aren't a lot of HR scores compared to the other mods - and my guess is because once someone can do AR10 they just go to higher level maps(which usually still don't have a high CS). And when I save as new diff just to have a thing that's undeniably the same but a little harder, I can't help but wonder why my scores are landing in the realm of "Doesn't count".

My question is if this "customization" is only allowed on CS and OD and they're only allowed to be increased and no option for anything to be decreased, would that be an acceptable feature?
jesse1412
1,457 posts
Joined January 2010
jesse1412

vantheman wrote:

I first came to the forums today to request something like the OP, then I found this thread and the linked-to threads within, and learned about all the issues involved, lots of discussion has taken place already.

But I still have a relevant question:

Is there any harm in giving incremental multiplier increase for a user selected increase in OD and CS?
AR increase can make a map easier, is a thing that was said. I don't think OD increase can make a map easier in any way, and CS increase might make a deliberately clustered map easier to read, but maps aren't supposed to be deliberately hard to read, so it won't make any correctly made map easier.

I ask because the case of myself specifically, I'd love to be playing everything set to CS7 and OD9 for ranked play without playing harder maps, I like to aim and I like to time accurately, but HR sets any map harder than normal to AR10, which is unplayable at my skill level. There aren't a lot of HR scores compared to the other mods - and my guess is because once someone can do AR10 they just go to higher level maps(which usually still don't have a high CS). And when I save as new diff just to have a thing that's undeniably the same but a little harder, I can't help but wonder why my scores are landing in the realm of "Doesn't count".

My question is if this "customization" is only allowed on CS and OD and they're only allowed to be increased and no option for anything to be decreased, would that be an acceptable feature?
Big issue here is that a map with say od6 being upped to od8 changes pretty much nothing for a lot of good players and they would simply be getting free points. CS again suffers from the exact same issue, on some maps it simply won't make a difference at all.
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman
Sorry, but I don't believe "free points" to be true at all.
It's the same thing to a better player because the better player is better. So yes they should be able to earn a little more, because they can do something a little tougher. With ease or not doesn't matter. DT is worthlessly easy to me on an easy map, a completely negligible increase in challenge, but it's still given credit for being DT.
MMzz
Elite Mapper
3,979 posts
Joined June 2009
MMzz
I support this as an unranked mod. To use for practicing different AR/OD/HP etc.
Moway
1,143 posts
Joined January 2012
Moway
This would be nice as unranked. It would be convenient for people who want to practice certain settings. Definitely don't want this as a score multiplier though.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
This is one of those things that should have been here for ages, you can already do it by editing the map yet people can't spectate you/you got to update the map later/can't use it on multiplayer/etc.
Poligen
7 posts
Joined October 2012
Poligen
I feel the need to bump this, guys. I hate having to change beatmaps with the editor. I wouldn't mind if this was unranked or ranked either.
Friggles
37 posts
Joined December 2012
Friggles
This would be amazing as an unranked mod.
Bites
185 posts
Joined June 2012
Bites

vantheman wrote:

Sorry, but I don't believe "free points" to be true at all.
It's the same thing to a better player because the better player is better. So yes they should be able to earn a little more, because they can do something a little tougher. With ease or not doesn't matter. DT is worthlessly easy to me on an easy map, a completely negligible increase in challenge, but it's still given credit for being DT.
This is a good point that was made, please notice this!
jesse1412
1,457 posts
Joined January 2010
jesse1412

Bites wrote:

vantheman wrote:

Sorry, but I don't believe "free points" to be true at all.
It's the same thing to a better player because the better player is better. So yes they should be able to earn a little more, because they can do something a little tougher. With ease or not doesn't matter. DT is worthlessly easy to me on an easy map, a completely negligible increase in challenge, but it's still given credit for being DT.
This is a good point that was made, please notice this!
Please don't, the player gives the same performance they always would have no mod and gets more points? Absurd. If they want more points use HR.
shiori_old2
43 posts
Joined November 2013
shiori_old2
Bump and 2 stars and here is my addition:

Akai Kyoko wrote:

For example, AR9 is a very important level for all CtB players. When I need to practise AR9, I have to search AR9 maps, but the easier maps, even AR8-insanes are not enough. So I should edit them, change to AR9, flip the notes and play them.
Also, AR10s are too hard to play ><

Otherwise, 'osu!' top players like change hard maps to AR10 but keep other property, such as CS and HP. Some map were uploaded to server but can never be ranked.

I wish there can be a custom unranked mod.
it can change the map difficulties, flip notes (horizentally or vertically) freely.
Also, in MP, it can be used like DT and HT to control global difficulty.
I believe it can make the game more fun.
sheela
2,651 posts
Joined October 2011
sheela
I guess it could work. You can edit the CS/HP/AR/OD in the edit mode, but I'm too lazy to go to edit mode.
It'll be cool if it was an unranked mod.
vape
69 posts
Joined April 2013
vape
I don't see why this would be in any way harmful as long as it's in an unranked mode, unless Tom wants to weight it somehow in ppv2.

Honestly reworking DT and HR to allow for smaller increments doesn't seem like a bad idea (think stepmania). This would be a good first step, though.
jesse1412
1,457 posts
Joined January 2010
jesse1412
My opinion is still supreme. Unranked or go home and we all know how much peppy loves unranked mods.
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman
Since you repeated yourself last time I figured I'd play for a while and think about it rather than repeat myself back at you. Seemed like decent etiquette. I realized I can't really speak about high level play since I can't do it, so I'll infer you're right about what you said before, so to restart my argument,

I think us casual players need something to make [hard] maps more interesting besides hard rock(as it exists right now), since AR10 is way beyond me even when I can do AR9. I'll play the whole way down my sort-by-difficulty on nofail, but the maps I can actually clear bore me so much that I've dropped the idea of playing for rank at all, let alone make anything like "meaningful progress" on the pp system. If "ranked small circle play" is the thing that interests me, I shouldn't have to push the difficulty off a 200 foot cliff via an unrelated setting to get it.
Maybe there's a better solution to the dilemma I describe then the one proposed in this thread. If you could point me there, it'd be helpful.

If you feel that people who aren't after the top margin of ranks don't matter at all in this community, or rather, shouldn't take any concern with the player ranking system, then I've got no further argument with you about this particular issue, since we disagree at the root of it.
_koinuri
451 posts
Joined June 2012
_koinuri

vantheman wrote:

Since you repeated yourself last time I figured I'd play for a while and think about it rather than repeat myself back at you. Seemed like decent etiquette. I realized I can't really speak about high level play since I can't do it, so I'll infer you're right about what you said before, so to restart my argument,

I think us casual players need something to make [hard] maps more interesting besides hard rock(as it exists right now), since AR10 is way beyond me even when I can do AR9. I'll play the whole way down my sort-by-difficulty on nofail, but the maps I can actually clear bore me so much that I've dropped the idea of playing for rank at all, let alone make anything like "meaningful progress" on the pp system. If "ranked small circle play" is the thing that interests me, I shouldn't have to push the difficulty off a 200 foot cliff via an unrelated setting to get it.
Maybe there's a better solution to the dilemma I describe then the one proposed in this thread. If you could point me there, it'd be helpful.

If you feel that people who aren't after the top margin of ranks don't matter at all in this community, or rather, shouldn't take any concern with the player ranking system, then I've got no further argument with you about this particular issue, since we disagree at the root of it.
Problem with this mod is that you can pick which stats to increase. So people that can aim well but have terrible accuracy can just raise CS but not OD, the accuracy players who have very small error can just raise OD up until it becomes a problem, etc. It doesn't affect how they play at all but still gives them bonus.

And casual players don't even need any score boosts; competitive players do. I don't understand why the score boosts should be considered just for casual players and break the top 50 scoreboards where the scores actually matter.
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman
certainly the math the OP mentioned breaks things, but you just need to apply some non-linear scaling as things get further away from the map settings so that there's no making things stupidly easy for huge bonuses. I think the OPs math is too simplistic but also pretty irrelevant, it's the concept of adjust-ability that's important. Bumped this thread specifically because he seemed to word the concept best. For the numbers, just work things so that the current best multipliers are the best that the settings can reach anyway, and only through settings that match the current ones, and the top 50s won't break or come to represent anything false.

-[Koinuri] wrote:

And casual players don't even need any score boosts; competitive players do.
What? I don't understand why you said that. When I play a map with 40k scores on it, and a tiny difference throws me ahead several thousand ranks, the more variety there can be in the scores(such as through the incremental changes proposed) the better. Do you think scores below the top 50 don't matter? If so then the game shouldn't even give any rank at the end unless you get one of those. There's your 50 rungs on a ladder, but I play for the altitude on a mountain.
It's also about, aside from adding more texture to the landscape, mixing things up day-to-day without having the records ignore the play. Ranked play has benefit over unranked even if you aren't in it for the ranks, that being the statistical tracking for a stronger competition with self.
secretly asian
15 posts
Joined January 2014
secretly asian
It would be nice to play some insanes and hards in ar 11 without dt required :p
_koinuri
451 posts
Joined June 2012
_koinuri
I meant casual players don't need boosts as much as competitive players. Bad wording >.>
Someone going from 1000th place to 900th on a map means significantly less than someone going from 50th to 49th, so it's natural to favor competitive players over casual players for score boosts.

The non-linear scaling would still break scoreboards. You have to realize that people going for score aren't looking for ways to make map difficult, but just ways to increase their score. HP, for example, means almost nothing when fcing with high accuracy (unless the spinner is too long), so people going for high score would favor HP 10 with this mod over HR despite the fact that the difficulty didn't increase from no mod in terms of fcing with high accuracy. Eventually the scoreboard becomes how much difficulty they can raise without making maps difficult, and people playing no mod will be forced to use this mod to do absolutely nothing in order to get more points to be on scoreboards. It'll be treated like HD, they just put it on because they give more points even though it doesn't necessarily make the map difficult.
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman
ugh, HP drain as it relates to score
don't even get me started

why does nofail give less points when if you're using it you're probably getting less points anyway? why does it give less points when sudden death doesn't give more? why does the game have hp drain at all?

But anyway, the issue you stated, my opinion would be, no increase for increased HP drain, but decrease for decreasing it, seems to be consistent with the game's current scoring treatment of hp drain changes.

I acknowledge it'd be a really nuanced thing to make it fit in the game, but I think allowing players to tweak things to their preferences without losing benefits of ranked play, even if the only fair way to do it is give flat 1.0 for most changes making it harder and big multiplier decreases for changes making it easier, would be a really great addition.
Dumii
61 posts
Joined August 2013
Dumii

-[Koinuri] wrote:

I meant casual players don't need boosts as much as competitive players. Bad wording >.>
Someone going from 1000th place to 900th on a map means significantly less than someone going from 50th to 49th, so it's natural to favor competitive players over casual players for score boosts.

The non-linear scaling would still break scoreboards. You have to realize that people going for score aren't looking for ways to make map difficult, but just ways to increase their score. HP, for example, means almost nothing when fcing with high accuracy (unless the spinner is too long), so people going for high score would favor HP 10 with this mod over HR despite the fact that the difficulty didn't increase from no mod in terms of fcing with high accuracy. Eventually the scoreboard becomes how much difficulty they can raise without making maps difficult, and people playing no mod will be forced to use this mod to do absolutely nothing in order to get more points to be on scoreboards. It'll be treated like HD, they just put it on because they give more points even though it doesn't necessarily make the map difficult.
I believe CS, AR and OD should be the only factors affecting score. Ideally to me, this feature request should be viewed in the angle of splitting the HR and EZ mod up into smaller segments. As HP provides no hindrance to players who are going for high accuracy FCs, however can make the map much easier than intended to be, HP should instead be an unranked change. OD, AR and CS make the map more difficult; OD making it much harder to have a high accuracy, AR reducing the amount of time provided to react to the circles and CS making it harder to aim the circles.

Although I do not have specific values for the score multipliers, using HR, where the score multiplier is 1.06x for an increase of HP, CS, AR and OD, the OD increase would theoretically be worth 1.03x, CS worth 1.02x and AR worth 1.01x.

When using the "EZ" mod as an example, where the score multiplier is 0.5x, the multiplier ratio would be in the proportions stated above.

TL;DR: Should be worth OD > CS > AR. HP should be unranked.
_koinuri
451 posts
Joined June 2012
_koinuri
Well now that we have some idea about how to balance the mod from competitive perspective, we can now look at things from casual player's point of view, since the point of this mod getting ranked score was more to benefit the casual players (for vantheman at least) than competitive players getting more mod to get free points.

First, the HP getting unranked will upset many casual players because no matter how difficult the map is, raising its HP and passing it will give no boost at all. Then the value of OD also becomes a problem. Accuracy only starts to matter when you can fc the map since the multiplier from combo gives way more points than getting high accuracy, so in casual player's point of view, assuming they're only passing and not comboing much, OD is more of a free point. Balancing this mod for both group of players require more work than it's worth imo.

Another thing to note is that AR is more of a preference thing and the difficulty can vary depending on the BPM of the map. Higher BPM means more notes per second, which makes higher AR easier to play since the amount of notes on screen decrease and you don't have to read as much notes. It's a preference because people have different idea about the ideal amount of notes on screen. So putting static multiplier on AR isn't a good idea, and I'm sure peppy would agree since he implemented adjustable scroll speed on osu!mania which is equivalent to AR on standard.

If the setting is adjustable with practically zero benefit/disadvantage, then we might as well remove the difficulty setting on editor and put it in this mod so people can do whatever they want with it, which doesn't really make much sense.

Someone made a program that create new difficulty with adjust difficulty of your entire library (though it'll be unranked obviously) so if you're just looking for quick way to make map a bit more difficult you can use this: t/201768
GhostFrog
416 posts
Joined March 2013
GhostFrog
Would love this as an unranked mod. Would be terrible as a ranked mod (and even worse now that we have decimal map settings, but it was terrible before that).
jesse1412
1,457 posts
Joined January 2010
jesse1412
This can never work as a ranked mod.
buny
3,435 posts
Joined March 2012
buny

jesus1412 wrote:

This can never work as a ranked mod.
yep. too many variables to consider unlike mania where it simply changes the amount of buttons you can press

I'd love a mod like this rather than having to go to editor or pollute my song library with remakes of a map in different settings, and having spectators that can't even spectate because it becomes a different map.
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman

-[Koinuri] wrote:

First, the HP getting unranked will upset many casual players because no matter how difficult the map is, raising its HP and passing it will give no boost at all. Then the value of OD also becomes a problem.
Increasing HP drain without point increase is already in the game. Sudden Death, Perfect.
HP Drain is an extremely meaningless aspect of the game, imo, could we not talk about it? The concept of "passing" a song is just an arbitrary performance milestone, separate from either total accuracy or combo length, I think the change would be negligible if passing/failing songs was removed tomorrow.
A performance meter and a graph on the score screen showing your weak spots does make sense, but I feel that "dying" in a game is something a majority of games implement but whole genres of them don't need it to function.

Accuracy only starts to matter when you can fc the map since the multiplier from combo gives way more points than getting high accuracy, so in casual player's point of view, assuming they're only passing and not comboing much, OD is more of a free point.
I don't think I understand this sentence, the way you've phrased it. A casual player sees getting a higher multiplier for making the hit timing stricter as free? That doesn't make sense. Since that's what OD does, it makes FC harder, it makes passing harder, it makes any score at all harder.
Bara-
11,978 posts
Joined April 2013
Bara-
I used to like this
But now I strongly disagree
Just go to editor, save as new diff and modify stats
The closest thing I think might be okay, is a extra menu, where you can set all stats, but, unless it's the normal values, it will NOT be ranked
_koinuri
451 posts
Joined June 2012
_koinuri

vantheman wrote:

Increasing HP drain without point increase is already in the game. Sudden Death, Perfect.
HP Drain is an extremely meaningless aspect of the game, imo, could we not talk about it? The concept of "passing" a song is just an arbitrary performance milestone, separate from either total accuracy or combo length, I think the change would be negligible if passing/failing songs was removed tomorrow.
A performance meter and a graph on the score screen showing your weak spots does make sense, but I feel that "dying" in a game is something a majority of games implement but whole genres of them don't need it to function.
Those are used mostly to make restart process easier for people that want to fc/ss the map, completely different purpose from HP increase which is to make the map more difficult.
But majority of players actually prefer passing difficult maps over scoring on maps they know they can do, and it wouldn't be fair to those people to not experience some bonus for their achievement. Have to consider players from every aspect if you want to add this to the public build.

vantheman wrote:

I don't think I understand this sentence, the way you've phrased it. A casual player sees getting a higher multiplier for making the hit timing stricter as free? That doesn't make sense. Since that's what OD does, it makes FC harder, it makes passing harder, it makes any score at all harder.
stuff

Aqo wrote:

You do realize that in other rhythm games you literally get nothing for non-perfect hits.

For instance the beatmania standard is

Glowing Great (called PGreat in short)
Great
Good
Bad
Poor (a miss)

You get 2 points for PGreat, which is OD11, 1 point for Great, which is OD10, and zero points for Good, which is OD8, anything below is also zero points.

Osu is lenient as hell in accuracy.

Raising OD will make getting accuracy more difficult, but not fc. You literally have to try to miss notes by pressing too early/late because of how lenient osu is compared to other rhythm games around. It doesn't affect passing of maps that much because HP is usually set very low in most maps (6-7 for most insane), getting couple more 100s is not enough to fail you.
In osu!, combo is worth a lot more than accuracy. It basically multiplies combo and the points you received, + a bit more complicated stuff. A person getting all 100s on 400x combos get more point than people getting all 300s on 100x combos for example. So this just boosts points without affecting the scoring difficulty as much as it would on the competitive level. This creates some balancing problem, if the bonus is too low, then competitive players will get upset, if the bonus is too high, then casual players get more points than they should.
vantheman
43 posts
Joined June 2013
vantheman
First thanks for taking the time to explain all that to me, it's more complicated than it initially seems, and it becomes sort of obvious that while not impossible, it'd be asking the developer for a lot of their time trying to make it happen. While it'd be nice, "more" points isn't the exact thing that I want or care about or even the reason I come to this thread, it's being able to play things at higher OD and CS(separate from AR, it's why I can't use hardrock) to challenge myself on those specific points on the maps I enjoy, without losing the benefits of ranked play

So new idea, if all we want to do is incrementally move up OD and CS (or HP for the people who are into that) to custom values, is there a reason to unrank the play? Deliberately leaving AR away from the idea because higher AR is easier for some and that's a good reason to unrank it.
But I don't know why anybody would say a higher OD and/or a higher CS was an easier score so there'd be no reason to unrank it for increasing those in any amount,

so is there a problem with such a mod that only allows increase, doesn't unrank and doesn't affect the multiplier?
Only thing I can imagine is that maybe there's some finer technical point of mapping I'm not getting

Since this is now a different thing, a new thread might be in order, to re-align discussion and let this part of the debate sink, since I consider the "more points" part of it resolved and that's a big part of this thread
Gumpy
2,418 posts
Joined June 2014
Gumpy
Then I would change everything to AR10.
[Kanzaki Ranko]
327 posts
Joined June 2009
[Kanzaki Ranko]
*throws my 24 stars*
Sadolution
73 posts
Joined December 2011
Sadolution
Yes as unranked mod please.
makes it faster then creating a whole new map diff.
Also, would love to use this in multi.

ranked? not an option.
Ash Marley
96 posts
Joined September 2014
Ash Marley
What I would really love is the ability to raise approach rate on any map, but not lower it (not talking about ones you create yourself).

Example:
- A beatmap at AR6:
- Ability to raise it to AR7, AR8, AR9, AR10
- NO ability to lower the AR.
- NO change in points by changing AR.
GhostFrog
416 posts
Joined March 2013
GhostFrog

Ash Marley wrote:

What I would really love is the ability to raise approach rate on any map, but not lower it (not talking about ones you create yourself).

Example:
- A beatmap at AR6:
- Ability to raise it to AR7, AR8, AR9, AR10
- NO ability to lower the AR.
- NO change in points by changing AR.
So what you're saying is that you want the ability to make maps easier with no penalty.
Bobbias
1,447 posts
Joined March 2011
Bobbias
As far as I'm concerned, any changes to these outside the HR/EZ mods should be unranked. It would make no sense to do something like trying to adjust a multiplier based on the specific changes you make (or anything similar). You can argue that we can already do this by saving a new difficulty with altered settings, but nobody wants to have to do that for every difficulty they feel like playing with modified settings. It breaks the flow since you have to enter the editor, make changes, save it, and then go back into play mode. Adding them to the mod menu does nothing more than make this process easier and mean you don't need to add unranked difficulties directly to the beatmap.

Assuming that adjusting these settings makes your score unranked, this shouldn't even be seen as having anything to do with gameplay in the first place. It's really more of a user experience issue. It's already entirely possible within the game, it's just more time consuming and annoying than it needs to be.
Factorial
691 posts
Joined August 2013
Factorial
This will make the game more complicated...
Unsafeman121
60 posts
Joined December 2012
Unsafeman121
Though I can't really see myself using this personally, I can understand that a lot of players may like the implementation of this feature.

However, if something like this is implemented, I would have to agree with Bobbias:

Bobbias wrote:

As far as I'm concerned, any changes to these outside the HR/EZ mods should be unranked.
In my opinion, this would create too many variables in the ranked statistics and the scores could become skewed because of it. If you want to make the map easier or harder in a ranked fashion then the mods available already provide that.

So long as everything remains unranked I wouldn't have an issue and I believe that it could (and would) be a useful feature for many players to have, both for recreational and learning purposes.
haha5957
1,433 posts
Joined July 2010
haha5957
Bumping?

Just mentioning that now the pp system takes AR (although, needs to be 10.3 or higher) to grant extra pp but not for most of common ARs.

CS and OD directly effects map's pp reward but AR doesn't effect PP in pretty much every case other than DTing 9AR maps, and for HP, adding a nofail mod will grant you 10% less pp (which isn't too much to be honest imo).

So here's the question : while pp being the primary ranking system (and the pp system pretty much disregards every AR between 0~10.2), why don't we make AR customizable?

Just give it a same amount of penalty when the AR goes below 10.3 because of this feature.

I honestly think ARs are now more like preferences. While I do have to agree that AR10 somehow requires "reading" ability, I don't think AR7.5~AR9.7 requires actual "skill".

setting a ironed AR value for a "Extra" difficulty map makes it harder for players to fully enjoy the map. Especially between AR 8.5~9.7, it's more like preference (some like higher, some likes lower.)

For some old extremely hard maps with AR9, they feel too slow. However AR10 on some maps(talking about the material, big black, fd, etc) seems to be too much, while they still fit better than AR9, but I'm pretty sure that maps would had AR9.1~AR9.9 if the option was available at the moment.

This will not only help players to enjoy the game more by using AR of their preference, but it will also increase the value of old maps with AR7(which most of people do not like these days) and maps that didn't have decimal AR values as option(like i mentioned above).

although I called it "preference" there definitely are lots of maps that doesnt not have their best AR due to various reason(like AR7 being mainstream, AR 8 being mainstream, mapper choosing AR of his/her own preference, decimal ARs not being available).
show more
Please sign in to reply.

New reply

0
1 / 164