I really like how the system is right now, and I can't wait until patterns get weighted more. I really feel rewarded for being fcing a hard song. Very good job.
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Performance Points feedback and suggestions (Standard)
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Topic Starter
The easy map won't give you anything because it's... easy? pp is completely based on map difficulty.asior wrote:
Wow..
So play on easy, get better acc (but worst score) and gain more pp than play without mods but with fc and tragic acc. seems legit...
Go try it.asior wrote:
Wow..
So play on easy, get better acc (but worst score) and gain more pp than play without mods but with fc and tragic acc. seems legit...
"Wow, I just wasted my time" in 3... 2...
asior_old
Tom94 wrote:
The easy map won't give you anything because it's... easy? pp is completely based on map difficulty.asior wrote:
Wow..
So play on easy, get better acc (but worst score) and gain more pp than play without mods but with fc and tragic acc. seems legit...
Ekaru wrote:
Go try it.asior wrote:
Wow..
So play on easy, get better acc (but worst score) and gain more pp than play without mods but with fc and tragic acc. seems legit...
"Wow, I just wasted my time" in 3... 2...
I mean mod, not map type.
the scarlet rose being the hardest map is a joke on the forums lol, it's not really that hard (only hard to fc, not to get high acc)dennischan wrote:
People said that Scarlet Rose was the hardest map in existence (according to forums)
Why is it ranked so low in tp?
Is this map underrated?
Adult's toy is also seriously underrated. You can ask almost everyone and find that the consider Adult's Toy harder than say, some random high tp diff such as recommended spell (Spell)
I suggest maybe high bpm songs should rated higher.
That mod makes most Insanes a lot harder to FC while killing your score modifier. >_>asior wrote:
I mean mod, not map type.
EZ mod gives you huge circles, which makes aim trivial and lowers the score you get from aim. It halves the OD, which makes accuracy trivial and lowers the score you get from accuracy. If you have a short stream, the lower OD will significantly reduce the speed required and lower the score you get from speed.asior wrote:
I mean mod, not map type.
You'll get a small bonus for the low AR, but overall, EZ mod counts for very little, even with a FC.
If reading difficulty is ever implemented, EZ mod might be worth playing for points on some maps.
Honestly i like the new system. In the past i could only get pp for doing new song, now i can play any map. Also its made me want to improve old scores. Although some songs do give out more pp even though they are not that hard.
I found a mistake in the calculations in osutp and I'm wondering if it's the same for the current pp system. When adding the Half Time mod the speed gets multiplied by 0.75, so AR and OD times need to be multiplied by 4/3. The beatmap difficulty on osutp shows different values, though. E.g. ar10 with Half Time becomes ar8.5 instead of ar9 (for correct values check GhostFrog's post in p/2858736). Same issue with OD. I don't know if even the aim and speed values are affected by this, but it might be a good idea to check it out.
Topic Starter
Thanks for pointing that out. I'm pretty damn sure, that I already fixed this at some point - the website even shows the correct multiplier on the info page. Well, gotta fix it again.Ziggo wrote:
I found a mistake in the calculations in osutp and I'm wondering if it's the same for the current pp system. When adding the Half Time mod the speed gets multiplied by 0.75, so AR and OD times need to be multiplied by 4/3. The beatmap difficulty on osutp shows different values, though. E.g. ar10 with Half Time becomes ar8.5 instead of ar9 (for correct values check GhostFrog's post in https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/2858736). Same issue with OD. I don't know if even the aim and speed values are affected by this, but it might be a good idea to check it out.
EDIT: Done.
That mistake is my fault, sorry ._. Tear already pointed it out for me and I forgot to update the table on the wiki and eventually the wrong HT multipliers got passed on to other things... gotta remember to do it aaaa
wait what i just gained 190pp what happened
what does the recent change to pp actually mean?
" Performance: [Tom94] Increase pp-value of scores which excel in one category."
what does the recent change to pp actually mean?
" Performance: [Tom94] Increase pp-value of scores which excel in one category."
It means if the song is difficult to aim or accuracy or requires a great deal of speed but not difficult in the other categories, then it'll give more pp.tastystew wrote:
wait what i just gained 190pp what happened
what does the recent change to pp actually mean?
" Performance: [Tom94] Increase pp-value of scores which excel in one category."
Just a few quick Yes/No questions (I didn't read the whole thread, so they may have been answered already) 
1. Do you gain a different amount of PP depending on where you hit your 100s/50s (i.e. near the end/beginning)?
1.a. If yes, is it simply based on the combo count, or is it something else?
1.b. If no, are you still rewarded by highly weighted maps even if you perform poorly on the actual "highly weighted part", but play perfectly for the easier sections?
2. Does a sliderbreak count as a miss? (i.e. would a 99% S with a sliderbreak be worth significantly more than a 99% A with a miss?)
3. Are spinners included in the PP formula? Also, would Spun Out affect your PP gain?
4. On the osu!tp info page it mentioned that the speed value is affected by map length. Does this mean (in general) longer maps such as marathons will reward more PP than a shorter map?
Suggestions:
1. Could readability also count towards map difficulty?
Maps like http://osu.ppy.sh/s/7671 are known to be hard for being incredibly confusing (although I suppose people can just memorize everything, so the added value should be somewhere between hidden and flashlight).
2. Although the vast majority would agree that a map with a higher AR is much harder and hence HR should be rewarded as such (also due to the increased values in OD, CS and Drain), most people I have spoken to would also agree that an AR lower than the recommended map AR is also much harder. Hence the order of difficulty would somewhere be along the lines of HR >>> EZ > No Mod.
My suggestion would be to keep the PP reduction for the lowered OD and Drain, but re-evaluate how AR and CS contribute to map difficulty.
3. Another suggestion is to make sliders contribute to accuracy to... some extent. Although I agree it's a free 300 most of the time, getting a 300 should still reward something, and not getting a 300 should give some form of penalty. This map (http://osutp.net/scores?bid=66941) probably isn't the best example, but as of now the PP rewarded for HDDTHR is worth less than a No Mod SS on most 4~5 star maps.
4. One more suggestion is (if possible) to calculate the PP gained from a map based on the score which gives the most PP, and not simply the highest score. For most maps, a No Mod SS is worth significantly more PP than a 97% HD score, despite the latter having a higher score. In such cases, the No Mod SS should be considered as the player's "best play" rather than the HD score (only in terms of PP calculation). A score should only be overwritten if the new score rewards more PP.
Thanks for reading!
1. Do you gain a different amount of PP depending on where you hit your 100s/50s (i.e. near the end/beginning)?
1.a. If yes, is it simply based on the combo count, or is it something else?
1.b. If no, are you still rewarded by highly weighted maps even if you perform poorly on the actual "highly weighted part", but play perfectly for the easier sections?
2. Does a sliderbreak count as a miss? (i.e. would a 99% S with a sliderbreak be worth significantly more than a 99% A with a miss?)
3. Are spinners included in the PP formula? Also, would Spun Out affect your PP gain?
4. On the osu!tp info page it mentioned that the speed value is affected by map length. Does this mean (in general) longer maps such as marathons will reward more PP than a shorter map?
Suggestions:
1. Could readability also count towards map difficulty?
Maps like http://osu.ppy.sh/s/7671 are known to be hard for being incredibly confusing (although I suppose people can just memorize everything, so the added value should be somewhere between hidden and flashlight).2. Although the vast majority would agree that a map with a higher AR is much harder and hence HR should be rewarded as such (also due to the increased values in OD, CS and Drain), most people I have spoken to would also agree that an AR lower than the recommended map AR is also much harder. Hence the order of difficulty would somewhere be along the lines of HR >>> EZ > No Mod.
My suggestion would be to keep the PP reduction for the lowered OD and Drain, but re-evaluate how AR and CS contribute to map difficulty.
3. Another suggestion is to make sliders contribute to accuracy to... some extent. Although I agree it's a free 300 most of the time, getting a 300 should still reward something, and not getting a 300 should give some form of penalty. This map (http://osutp.net/scores?bid=66941) probably isn't the best example, but as of now the PP rewarded for HDDTHR is worth less than a No Mod SS on most 4~5 star maps.
4. One more suggestion is (if possible) to calculate the PP gained from a map based on the score which gives the most PP, and not simply the highest score. For most maps, a No Mod SS is worth significantly more PP than a 97% HD score, despite the latter having a higher score. In such cases, the No Mod SS should be considered as the player's "best play" rather than the HD score (only in terms of PP calculation). A score should only be overwritten if the new score rewards more PP.
Thanks for reading!
Topic Starter
No-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
Just a few quick Yes/No questions (I didn't read the whole thread, so they may have been answered already)
1. Do you gain a different amount of PP depending on where you hit your 100s/50s (i.e. near the end/beginning)?
Sadly no. In the case that per-HitObject data is available this will change, but it's currently not possible.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
1.b. If no, are you still rewarded by highly weighted maps even if you perform poorly on the actual "highly weighted part", but play perfectly for the easier sections?
It doesn't count as a miss, but as a 100. However it indirectly reduces your gained pp by breaking your combo.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
2. Does a sliderbreak count as a miss? (i.e. would a 99% S with a sliderbreak be worth significantly more than a 99% A with a miss?)
Spinners are included as having to aim to the center and move a big. They are pretty much negligible. SpunOut multiplies the pp you gain from that particular score by 0.95.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
3. Are spinners included in the PP formula? Also, would Spun Out affect your PP gain?
If they have the same difficulty, then yes.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
4. On the osu!tp info page it mentioned that the speed value is affected by map length. Does this mean (in general) longer maps such as marathons will reward more PP than a shorter map?
It's planned, but for now all the "readability" that pp considers is ApproachRate.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
Suggestions:
1. Could readability also count towards map difficulty?
AR below 8 and above 10 already give bonuses. The bonus below 8 is further amplified by Hidden.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
2. Although the vast majority would agree that a map with a higher AR is much harder and hence HR should be rewarded as such (also due to the increased values in OD, CS and Drain), most people I have spoken to would also agree that an AR lower than the recommended map AR is also much harder. Hence the order of difficulty would somewhere be along the lines of HR >>> EZ > No Mod.
My suggestion would be to keep the PP reduction for the lowered OD and Drain, but re-evaluate how AR and CS contribute to map difficulty.
Not getting a 300 on a slider is heavily penalized by the way sliders are "excluded" when speaking about accuracy. You're right, that it would make sense to give them some small value still, I'll think about how to properly add that into the equation.-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
3. Another suggestion is to make sliders contribute to accuracy to... some extent. Although I agree it's a free 300 most of the time, getting a 300 should still reward something, and not getting a 300 should give some form of penalty. This map (http://osutp.net/scores?bid=66941) probably isn't the best example, but as of now the PP rewarded for HDDTHR is worth less than a No Mod SS on most 4~5 star maps.
Currently this is not possible due to technical limitations, but who knows what the future brings...-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
4. One more suggestion is (if possible) to calculate the PP gained from a map based on the score which gives the most PP, and not simply the highest score. For most maps, a No Mod SS is worth significantly more PP than a 97% HD score, despite the latter having a higher score. In such cases, the No Mod SS should be considered as the player's "best play" rather than the HD score (only in terms of PP calculation). A score should only be overwritten if the new score rewards more PP.
I personally would love to see this.You're welcome!-ArmoredTitan- wrote:
Thanks for reading!
Topic Starter
Some additional info for everyone. The pp formula has been slightly changed and your pp and rank will be fluctuating a bit in the next ~48 hours. Please be patient until the re-calculation is done and be easy on me with your complaints. 
I'm going to wait till that disgusting B rank in my top ranks will disappear.
Suddenly we see the Tom94 in top50 ranks.Tom94 wrote:
Some additional info for everyone. The pp formula has been slightly changed and your pp and rank will be fluctuating a bit in the next ~48 hours. Please be patient until the re-calculation is done and be easy on me with your complaints.
Ohh, interesting.
I'm really interested to see the algorithm since I've been moved down ranks (even though im a DT player) and other DT players have gone up in ranks xD so confused!
EDIT: Nevermind, It updated and I went up ranks
no confuserino
EDIT: Nevermind, It updated and I went up ranks
no confuserino
Topic Starter
I'll drop out again, when everyone has been updated, don't worry. Somehow I knew someone would end up pointing stuff like that out... <-<Plaatinum wrote:
Suddenly we see the Tom94 in top50 ranks.Tom94 wrote:
Some additional info for everyone. The pp formula has been slightly changed and your pp and rank will be fluctuating a bit in the next ~48 hours. Please be patient until the re-calculation is done and be easy on me with your complaints.
FL has been buffed... will see if it is enough.CXu wrote:
@Tom94 Just thought I'd link back to my post since you might've missed it or something (orsuperignoremakingmesad.) Since you've changed the algorithm though, maybe stuff have changed already.
p/2854921
Recalculate points pls.
After update i had 4800pp (4351-->4800)
Then i pass one map and i lost 639 pp (4800-->4361)
as if I have gained points to the old pps(4351+10)
Something is wrong :/
After update i had 4800pp (4351-->4800)
Then i pass one map and i lost 639 pp (4800-->4361)
as if I have gained points to the old pps(4351+10)
Something is wrong :/
Topic Starter
Don't worry, things will stabilize soon enough. The initial gigantic rise in ranks was not intended and has been fixed.K_N wrote:
Recalculate points pls.
After update i had 4800pp (4351-->4800)
Then i pass one map and i lost 639 pp (4800-->4361)
as if I have gained points to the old pps(4351+10)
Something is wrong :/
How long will the full re-calculation take? and how different is the new formula from the previous one?
Got a pleasant boost in ranks so I don't mind if the rankings stay as they are lol
Same thing happened to me, but remember thatK_N wrote:
Recalculate points pls.
After update i had 4800pp (4351-->4800)
Then i pass one map and i lost 639 pp (4800-->4361)
as if I have gained points to the old pps(4351+10)
Something is wrong :/
Tom94 wrote:
...your pp and rank will be fluctuating a bit in the next ~48 hours. Please be patient until the re-calculation is done and be easy on me with your complaints.
Are the updates mostly done now? And do you have a changelog of what you've been doing with pp (Nvm checked official changelog). Or are you waiting to make stuff like that public until the algorithm goes public?
pp got recalculated, your post = qq.
lol
I was top 500 for a few hours :> then I went back to my old pp value - 3 :<
[qq]i'm lower than the initial pp i started with[/qq]
Increase pp-value of scores which excel in one categoryWas it already said what that one category was, and if not, can you tell us what it is Tom?
If you actually read before...Myke B wrote:
Was it already said what that one category was, and if not, can you tell us what it is Tom?
It's the same categories as in tp.Almost wrote:
It means if the song is difficult to aim or accuracy or requires a great deal of speed but not difficult in the other categories, then it'll give more pp.tastystew wrote:
wait what i just gained 190pp what happened
what does the recent change to pp actually mean?
" Performance: [Tom94] Increase pp-value of scores which excel in one category."
I think it means that if a score has 2 low value tiers and 1 really high tier that it will be weighted more than it was before. e.g. a map with 200 aim, 20 speed, 20 accuracy was weighted 240 before, now its worth 280, but its just a guess.Myke B wrote:
Increase pp-value of scores which excel in one categoryWas it already said what that one category was, and if not, can you tell us what it is Tom?
Is this still half fixed?
Because Yesterday I went from 560ish>615 and my friend went from 660ish>804, And now I'm back at 551 and my friend is still at 804?
Because Yesterday I went from 560ish>615 and my friend went from 660ish>804, And now I'm back at 551 and my friend is still at 804?
buny wrote:
[qq]i'm lower than the initial pp i started with[/qq]
Topic Starter
Get your friend to make some new high-scores on any map. That should trigger an immediate re-calculation of his pp. If his rank doesn't go back up a while after that, then he will most likely stay at 804.Takuji wrote:
Is this still half fixed?
Because Yesterday I went from 560ish>615 and my friend went from 660ish>804, And now I'm back at 551 and my friend is still at 804?
Ah okay, thanks for the fast responser :3Tom94 wrote:
Get your friend to make some new high-scores on any map. That should trigger an immediate re-calculation of his pp. If his rank doesn't go back up a while after that, then he will most likely stay at 804.Takuji wrote:
Is this still half fixed?
Because Yesterday I went from 560ish>615 and my friend went from 660ish>804, And now I'm back at 551 and my friend is still at 804?
I was just curious (sorry if this has already been answered) how is BPM factored into the PP calculation?
I've just noticed a very easy, high BPM song (in comparison to my other scores) has risen to my top performance (DT + Hard, A rank) rather than some of the more difficult insanes I've FCed. Maybe it's just an outlier, but I haven't seen this happen before.
I've just noticed a very easy, high BPM song (in comparison to my other scores) has risen to my top performance (DT + Hard, A rank) rather than some of the more difficult insanes I've FCed. Maybe it's just an outlier, but I haven't seen this happen before.
umm.. what?
-46pp for getting #60 in a hard song? what.
can someone please explain to me how this shit even happens
p.s. that was my first play on the map
-46pp for getting #60 in a hard song? what.
can someone please explain to me how this shit even happens
p.s. that was my first play on the map
Pls read the last few pages of this thread! Everything is explained there.
No I didn't hence the "not sure if it was already said" because who the fuck would want to read that deep into a giant QQ fest. her derAlmost wrote:
If you actually read before...
Are you not able to get PP for qualified maps? I know that you were able in the old system and weren't in TP. I seem to not be getting PP from maps that are qualified and not "ranked" yet. If the PP isn't going through the qualified maps will I get the PP for the score once the map becomes ranked?
With this kind of skill measurement, I'm afraid something needs to be done with the score multiplier as well.
Score multipliers (mods) became pointless ever since ppv2 started - this is because HR weighs bigger than FL and HD now. The thing is, will score ranking even matter now? Why not based the scoreboard with the highest pp earned instead? Or why not tweak the score multiplier of every mod to it's fitting value?
Score multipliers (mods) became pointless ever since ppv2 started - this is because HR weighs bigger than FL and HD now. The thing is, will score ranking even matter now? Why not based the scoreboard with the highest pp earned instead? Or why not tweak the score multiplier of every mod to it's fitting value?
I saw this question some days ago, but don't remember it being answered.
Does the no-fail do anything to the pp you can gain? say you do 98% or something with nf, would there be any difference between the pp gained from that and a score without mod?
Does the no-fail do anything to the pp you can gain? say you do 98% or something with nf, would there be any difference between the pp gained from that and a score without mod?
Topic Starter
NoFail gives 10% less pp than without.ntaig wrote:
I saw this question some days ago, but don't remember it being answered.
Does the no-fail do anything to the pp you can gain? say you do 98% or something with nf, would there be any difference between the pp gained from that and a score without mod?
When these most recent pp changes (the one that weights scores that excel in one category higher) kicked in and many people went up like 500pp, my top ranks changed and seemed to reflect these changes. Two of my scores in particular that are really high in one category moved way up. The pp reverted, as well as my top ranks, and I've gained pp since then through scores so I can't tell if I gained any after the revert due to the change.
So, Tom, did you accidentally weigh these scores that excel in one category much higher than you had intended at first and then fixed the number? Or are calculations still going on behind the scene? I'm confused.
So, Tom, did you accidentally weigh these scores that excel in one category much higher than you had intended at first and then fixed the number? Or are calculations still going on behind the scene? I'm confused.
Before that change got reverted my best performances list looked way more accurate than how it was before/now. .-.pooptartsonas wrote:
When these most recent pp changes (the one that weights scores that excel in one category higher) kicked in and many people went up like 500pp, my top ranks changed and seemed to reflect these changes. Two of my scores in particular that are really high in one category moved way up. The pp reverted, as well as my top ranks, and I've gained pp since then through scores so I can't tell if I gained any after the revert due to the change.
So, Tom, did you accidentally weigh these scores that excel in one category much higher than you had intended at first and then fixed the number? Or are calculations still going on behind the scene? I'm confused.
Yeah, I kinda felt like that too. It seemed like a nice balance between the tp system of 3 separate categories and the pp system of all-around scores.
JappyBabes wrote:
Before that change got reverted my best performances list looked way more accurate than how it was before/now. .-.
I took a break for about 4-5 days and today I came back to play and updated my rank. My pp dropped from 1950 to 1859. Does anyone know why my pp dropped? I didn't know that was possible for pp to decay especially since I've only been inactive for a few days. If it was a re-weighting of the maps then I would understand but it seems that none of my friend's pp were affected. Does anyone know what's going on? Usually it's just my ranking that fluctuates but my pp remains untouched.
Why doesn't it make ppv2 into the same calculation method as tp?
Because pp of 3 section (aim, speed, acc) sum total of other musical scores is high although Legendre has the skill to take Acc99.76% of accuracy by HDHR of RedGoose [Another], the capability to take accuracy is not correctly reflected in ppv2ranking.
This is being able to say not only to him but to all the players.
I wish, ppv2 becomes the same calculation method as tp.
Because ppv2 of now cannot say it as the ranking which expresses the skill of a player correctly.
Because pp of 3 section (aim, speed, acc) sum total of other musical scores is high although Legendre has the skill to take Acc99.76% of accuracy by HDHR of RedGoose [Another], the capability to take accuracy is not correctly reflected in ppv2ranking.
This is being able to say not only to him but to all the players.
I wish, ppv2 becomes the same calculation method as tp.
Because ppv2 of now cannot say it as the ranking which expresses the skill of a player correctly.
ppv2 is pretty much tp...Gray Pigeon wrote:
Why doesn't it make ppv2 into the same calculation method as tp?
Because pp of 3 section (aim, speed, acc) sum total of other musical scores is high although Legendre has the skill to take Acc99.76% of accuracy by HDHR of RedGoose [Another], the capability to take accuracy is not correctly reflected in ppv2ranking.
This is being able to say not only to him but to all the players.
I wish, ppv2 becomes the same calculation method as tp.
Because ppv2 of now cannot say it as the ranking which expresses the skill of a player correctly.
ppv2 is tp without the Rank 50 Limitation... and also Tom94 made itGray Pigeon wrote:
Why doesn't it make ppv2 into the same calculation method as tp?
Because pp of 3 section (aim, speed, acc) sum total of other musical scores is high although Legendre has the skill to take Acc99.76% of accuracy by HDHR of RedGoose [Another], the capability to take accuracy is not correctly reflected in ppv2ranking.
This is being able to say not only to him but to all the players.
I wish, ppv2 becomes the same calculation method as tp.
Because ppv2 of now cannot say it as the ranking which expresses the skill of a player correctly.
ppv2 calculates PP which 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of musical scores totaled in high order.
tp calculates PP after making 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of a musical score into separately high order.
Therefore, although tp and ppv2 are alike, it is not completely the same.
Even if tp carries out rank in to the 10000th place and it will be reflected, a result differs from ppv2.
tp calculates PP after making 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of a musical score into separately high order.
Therefore, although tp and ppv2 are alike, it is not completely the same.
Even if tp carries out rank in to the 10000th place and it will be reflected, a result differs from ppv2.
Today i beat my score on SENTIVE - Saigo ni Kimi ga Ita with HD. My rank increased from rank around 220 to 88. But at the same time I lost pp and therefore ranks.
Does anyone has an explanation for this?
Does anyone has an explanation for this?
your acc was probably worst in the HD play there for you get a new score but takes off your pp because its HDThisabel wrote:
Today i beat my score on SENTIVE - Saigo ni Kimi ga Ita with HD. My rank increased from rank around 220 to 88. But at the same time I lost pp and therefore ranks.
Does anyone has an explanation for this?
Translation: Your second play, the one that was "better", was actually worse performance wise, so you lost points because you overwrote your other score.snosey wrote:
your acc was probably worst in the HD play there for you get a new score but takes off your pp because its HDThisabel wrote:
Today i beat my score on SENTIVE - Saigo ni Kimi ga Ita with HD. My rank increased from rank around 220 to 88. But at the same time I lost pp and therefore ranks.
Does anyone has an explanation for this?
If you'd take 5 minutes to look through this thread you'd figure it out yourself, this question shows up every 2 or 3 pages.
I don't think many people realise this. But if this isn't true, then the system/my top ranks/other people's top ranks won't make sense. So I'll just agree with this.Gray Pigeon wrote:
ppv2 calculates PP which 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of musical scores totaled in high order.
tp calculates PP after making 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of a musical score into separately high order.
Therefore, although tp and ppv2 are alike, it is not completely the same.
Even if tp carries out rank in to the 10000th place and it will be reflected, a result differs from ppv2.
sorry, i'm just going to be out with this - your english is terrible and I can't understand what you're trying to point out.Gray Pigeon wrote:
ppv2 calculates PP which 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of musical scores totaled in high order.
tp calculates PP after making 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of a musical score into separately high order.
Therefore, although tp and ppv2 are alike, it is not completely the same.
Even if tp carries out rank in to the 10000th place and it will be reflected, a result differs from ppv2.
Topic Starter
Apart from the fact, that in pp the 3 sections are not just totaled, this is true. The reason why it's not exactly like tp is, because I feel it's just as wrong to only look at single aspects of scores in isolation as it is to look at a totaled value only. Scores which demand skill in all 3 categories should also be rewarded.Gray Pigeon wrote:
ppv2 calculates PP which 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of musical scores totaled in high order.
tp calculates PP after making 3 sections (aim,speed,acc) of a musical score into separately high order.
Therefore, although tp and ppv2 are alike, it is not completely the same.
Even if tp carries out rank in to the 10000th place and it will be reflected, a result differs from ppv2.
Currently the pp a score is worth is computed by the following formula: (aim^X + speed^X + acc^X)^(1/X)
Where X at the moment is 1.1 and will likely rise a bit in the future.
Thank you for the answer, and I am sorry that I am poor at English.Tom94 wrote:
Apart from the fact, that in pp the 3 sections are not just totaled, this is true. The reason why it's not exactly like tp is, because I feel it's just as wrong to only look at single aspects of scores in isolation as it is to look at a totaled value only. Scores which demand skill in all 3 categories should also be rewarded.
Currently the pp a score is worth is computed by the following formula: (aim^X + speed^X + acc^X)^(1/X)
Where X at the moment is 1.1 and will likely rise a bit in the future.
I wanted to know why the calculation method was changed by ppv2 and tp.
If Tom thinks that player skill is exact by the calculation method, I will say nothing.
but, I think that the player which specialized in one skill is pitiful.
I wish, Increase more pp-value of scores which excel in one category.
What's happening about rank sorting? Rank for perfomance toplist and rank for user's page have very strange relation.
Topic Starter
Profile / ingame rank always have been behind by some time. Don't worry, they will eventually catch up.MosaicII wrote:
What's happening about rank sorting? Rank for perfomance toplist and rank for user's page have very strange relation.
Well, I sort of like that whenever you play a hard enough map, even if you fail, if at the start you did a reeeeallly good move it gives you a bit of rank up.
And yeah, it's really balanced right now. Not passed anymore because of farmers for a while!
And yeah, it's really balanced right now. Not passed anymore because of farmers for a while!
http://puu.sh/6Vkes.png
I'm a bit confused about how ranking works with single beatmaps; Generally, when I beat an old score of mine with a worse accuracy, I lose a little bit of pp. Okay, no big deal. But just now, I beat a map with better accuracy and a higher score and lost pp regardless.
Does it take more away if you miss more notes?
I'm a bit confused about how ranking works with single beatmaps; Generally, when I beat an old score of mine with a worse accuracy, I lose a little bit of pp. Okay, no big deal. But just now, I beat a map with better accuracy and a higher score and lost pp regardless.
Does it take more away if you miss more notes?
Yes, they heavily reduce the amount of aim points you'd getTMoI wrote:
Does it take more away if you miss more notes?
No, It will not become, if all categories are not high maps.Defacer wrote:
So finally, if you have generally bad aim but pretty good speed&acc and you finally achieve a score that excels mostly in aim without much speed&acc , will the system treat that score's aim value separately and boost you even though the score overall in all categories isn't that high(maybe not even reaching top performance field)?
If you want to raise pp, The map only with one high category does not have a meaning.
too big QAQSpyrunite wrote:
WOO we finally got the PP graphs again
Hey, I've been reading this thread to figure out why my rank keeps dropping when I beat old scores and songs, and I found the answer to that, but I've also been having another problem. Recently when I play new songs on hard or normal, and I fc it(without ever playing this map before) I'll lose a lot of ranks. Is it because I've been playing a lot of insane maps lately? I have no idea.
Also, I'm sorry if this question has been answered, I haven't been able to find the answer anywhere.
Also, I'm sorry if this question has been answered, I haven't been able to find the answer anywhere.
It's likely because more people gain ranks faster than you, thus you drop in ranks (to prove that your pp shouldn't change much, if at all)Kukuthemoogle wrote:
Hey, I've been reading this thread to figure out why my rank keeps dropping when I beat old scores and songs, and I found the answer to that, but I've also been having another problem. Recently when I play new songs on hard or normal, and I fc it(without ever playing this map before) I'll lose a lot of ranks. Is it because I've been playing a lot of insane maps lately? I have no idea.
Also, I'm sorry if this question has been answered, I haven't been able to find the answer anywhere.
You don't earn too many points from hards or normals so others probably were overtaking your scores. The ranks are generally unstable due to some people being far more active then others.Kukuthemoogle wrote:
Recently when I play new songs on hard or normal, and I fc it(without ever playing this map before) I'll lose a lot of ranks. Is it because I've been playing a lot of insane maps lately? I have no idea.
This is kinda funny but there is a weird bug with the graph (my cursor is at the lower arrow):
yeah, are the graphs upsidedown or something? or am I reading it wrong. o-o
Coffee Hero
others probably were overtaking your scoresNo, score doesn't even matter for ppv2.When you achieve a score on a map other players scores have no effect on your PP.
Recently when I play new songs on hard or normal, and I fc it(without ever playing this map before) I'll lose a lot of ranks. Is it because I've been playing a lot of insane maps lately? I have no idea.PPv2 updates everytime you set a score. What you are seeing is just other players passing you in pp during the time between scores.
This explains the 50% difference in my tp and pp rank then. Although tbh, I reckon maps which have a decent value in all sections is a lot easier than maps which excel in one area.Tom94 wrote:
Apart from the fact, that in pp the 3 sections are not just totaled, this is true. The reason why it's not exactly like tp is, because I feel it's just as wrong to only look at single aspects of scores in isolation as it is to look at a totaled value only. Scores which demand skill in all 3 categories should also be rewarded.
Currently the pp a score is worth is computed by the following formula: (aim^X + speed^X + acc^X)^(1/X)
Where X at the moment is 1.1 and will likely rise a bit in the future.
when will we get the wiki article?
I am quite looking foward to reading it.
Thanks for your hard work Tom94!
I am quite looking foward to reading it.
Thanks for your hard work Tom94!
pp graphs could be a little more interactive... you could toggle other stats like playcount history or maybe replays watched. that would be fun
i think acc affects pp way too much, right now my top2 pp scores are heavy acc based scores and other than that they are pretty easy to fc. if i now were to SS something like eyes of devileliet nomod it wouldnt even be my topscore despite being many times more difficult to fc purely because it is only od7. (at least this would be the case in tp, and since pp is so similar to tp im assuming it would be the case in pp aswell)
I kinda agree. Right now, noisestorm - pulse is one of my top performances just because I got a 99.39% acc. It wasn't very hard to fc, when Mystic Oriental Love Consultation was considerably harder to fc, but I only got 98% so it's lower.
to some extent i don't think accuracy is weighted as much as you say, but I might be bias because my best performance is a C. what seems to give me pp is if I get a high combo or not.
I kinda suck at getting near 100% so maybe that's normal though.
I kinda suck at getting near 100% so maybe that's normal though.
I wouldn't agree, my top 5 is full of shitty acc scores for example
The maps you are talking about aren't really hard aim or speed-wise (although devileliet requires some stamina) so it makes sense if the accuracy value outweight the other ones
The maps you are talking about aren't really hard aim or speed-wise (although devileliet requires some stamina) so it makes sense if the accuracy value outweight the other ones
I often find myself not wanting to try and beat my score on a high acc score. For example: if I have 100% on a song that I know I can beat with HD - I often won't do it, in fear that that I will lose PP :/
I personally think a nomod SS is often better than a HD 99%
(Depends on the map, but unless it gets really hard to even FC nomod, I don't personally value HD much)
(Depends on the map, but unless it gets really hard to even FC nomod, I don't personally value HD much)
Don't fear, just keep improving. If you keep playing it safe, you take longer to improve. I still can't play HD properly either, but I just retry a few more times to make up for it, and eventually beat my non-HD accuracies after another 5 FC's or so with HD on.Myke B wrote:
I often find myself not wanting to try and beat my score on a high acc score. For example: if I have 100% on a song that I know I can beat with HD - I often won't do it, in fear that that I will lose PP :/
That said I do feel there is too much pp to be gained expontentially for getting closer to 100%. Unless the map is really difficult in aim and speed, accuracy should not be weighted as heavily because retrying is a relatively easy thing to do if those are not a problem, which then just tests patience. Maybe that's just me, but DT'ing maps which are relatively easy to FC, because they're short, gives way too much pp for getting better accuracy from retrying.
well tbh.. 100% no mod is more valuable to me than getting that 90 w/e % with HD anyways :/
If Acc of map which you played is high, Aim and Acc are increased somewhat. (If Acc is low, they will decrease. ）
As for HD, Aim is increased. and Acc is increased very slightly.
As for HD, Aim is increased. and Acc is increased very slightly.
Skriggniichan
I am extremely happy with the new pp system, it puts those pp farmers that don't play anything but normal or hard in their place while giving those of us that actually take time to be good at the game a chance to earn appropriate rank. Thank you to Tom and peppy for making this new system that is all shiny and wonderful.
My problem with hidden is that it doesn't match the scores. I understand why it happens, but the way the system is now I need to decide if I want to have better PP or better map score every time I get decent at a map. Since I am not good at accuracy I know that by playing hidden I will not get the same accuracy I do without it.
To those who said that their highest scores were C's; check how many misses you got in them, percentage does not matter nearly as much as how many misses or 50s you got.
Also, I just want to make sure; does pp directly correlate with ranking? I feel like it doesn't, and I want to know what else factors into ranking.
Also, I just want to make sure; does pp directly correlate with ranking? I feel like it doesn't, and I want to know what else factors into ranking.
Ranking has nothing to do with pp gained.TMoI wrote:
To those who said that their highest scores were C's; check how many misses you got in them, percentage does not matter nearly as much as how many misses or 50s you got.
Also, I just want to make sure; does pp directly correlate with ranking? I feel like it doesn't, and I want to know what else factors into ranking.
pp is just a quantity rewarded for completing maps depending on their difficultyTMoI wrote:
To those who said that their highest scores were C's; check how many misses you got in them, percentage does not matter nearly as much as how many misses or 50s you got.
Also, I just want to make sure; does pp directly correlate with ranking? I feel like it doesn't, and I want to know what else factors into ranking.
other peoples ranking doesn't affect you at all, so your pp should NEVER go down unless you replace a score with a lower valued pp score
So Tom said it takes into account all scores, not just top 50 - so does that mean if I get a 99% with HDDT and another score on the same map with 100% DT, does it count them both or just the HDDT one? if they don't, would it be a good idea to? Like what if you can beat a map with DT and you can also beat it with FL but not together, should that person get PP for both or would that be a bad idea.
obviously when he said all scores, he meant all your online scores, regardless of rank...