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Inferi - The Promethean Kings

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Lefafel
223 posts
Joined January 2013
Lefafel

Natsu wrote:

so you failed to read that I'm worry about the difference of difficulty with the rest of the map and also the playability ? I'm not complaining about his interpretation, I'm complaining about the sudden spike and that the map don't have any target audience, did someone passed it without no fail?, reducing the difficulty at that part may open the map for someone to play it properly (maybe).
Yeah there's a stark spike in the map's star rating, not so stark in the actual difficulty play-wise. It has been explained several times in the thread already.

The map has been extensively playested by a number of experienced players, and has recieved praise from them, so there clearly is an audience for it as well. It might be true that the players that can pass the map without difficulty-decreasing mods can be counted with one hand right now, but how does that devalue the map in any way? For many of us, enjoying a map doesn't require a final score that the game labels as a "pass". Are players not allowed to enjoy and compete on maps just because they can't perform well enough to meet the game's somewhat arbitary standards of what counts as a "passable score" (Or, as you put it, can't "play it properly")? Who even are you to tell what is or isn't "playing properly"?
If the map was HP1, would it suddenly be more worthy of ranking because people could now pass it without no-fail or half time?

Only nerfing the star rating spike would just compromise the map's consistency, since the current map represents the music just about as well as can be expected. (This is subjective, of course, but plenty of people agree with this, including many very experienced mappers and players and of course Mazzerin himself)

All of these issues are so fundamentally subjective, that even bringing them up after them being discussed so many times already just seems very disruptive rather than constructive.
Natsu
8,100 posts
Joined September 2012
Natsu

LefafeI wrote:

Yeah there's a stark spike in the map's star rating, not so stark in the actual difficulty play-wise. It has been explained several times in the thread already.

The map has been extensively playested by a number of experienced players, and has recieved praise from them, so there clearly is an audience for it as well. It might be true that the players that can pass the map without difficulty-decreasing mods can be counted with one hand right now, but how does that devalue the map in any way? For many of us, enjoying a map doesn't require a final score that the game labels as a "pass". Are players not allowed to enjoy and compete on maps just because they can't perform well enough to meet the game's somewhat arbitary standards of what counts as a "passable score" (Or, as you put it, can't "play it properly")? Who even are you to tell what is or isn't "playing properly"?
If the map was HP1, would it suddenly be more worthy of ranking because people could now pass it without no-fail or half time?

Only nerfing the star rating spike would just compromise the map's consistency, since the current map represents the music just about as well as can be expected. (This is subjective, of course, but plenty of people agree with this, including many very experienced mappers and players and of course Mazzerin himself)

All of these issues are so fundamentally subjective, that even bringing them up after them being discussed so many times already just seems very disruptive rather than constructive.
Why you keep talking about star rating?

The spike is there, no I'm not complaining about it being 9 stars, I'm complaining about the lvl of difficulty.

Who I'm to complain about a map in the qualify map section, just a member of the community that is concerned about the direction that mapping is going nowadays, if you didn't read that's the purpose of the qualify section, anyone can post their concern, I'm wonder until when people will notice this.



Yes I read all the map thread, there are alot of complains about that diff spike, isn't only me.

Nerfing that part would not compromise anything, let's don't talk about that, i have enough mapping experience to know that nerfing things don't compromise your map in any way, if playability wins then there should not be an excuse for don't do it, anyways I want to know what the QAT think about this.

Edit:

Btw who can pass this map? tbh atm as Doyak said is the same as a new player trying to pass a hard diff, there is no one, if I'm not wrong.
Lefafel
223 posts
Joined January 2013
Lefafel
ohhhh now I understand, you think that the opinnions of the nominators that qualified the map are wrong, since they considered the difficulty spike a non-issue and you don't. That would indeed mean that QAT, being the higher administrative party, is the only souce of any relevancy at this point and further discussion before their input about this is pointless.
Natsu
8,100 posts
Joined September 2012
Natsu

LefafeI wrote:

ohhhh now I understand, you think that the opinnions of the nominators that qualified the map are wrong, since they considered the difficulty spike a non-issue and you don't. That would indeed mean that QAT, being the higher administrative party, is the only souce of any relevancy at this point and further discussion before their input about this is pointless.
That apply to any map where a discussion is going on, don't take it wrong, just because a map is qualified doesn't mean is ranked, qualified section is to discuss things related to the map, ranked section is the final product of it, don't merge them, and yes, that's why we used this thread: p/5518455 the QAT check if the issues worth a DQ or not.
Mazzerin
493 posts
Joined July 2013
Topic Starter
Mazzerin
Xexxar

Xexxar wrote:

Xendogenesis wrote:

i ducking love this map


i like watching centipede too :^)

In all seriousness, I like the map but i feel like it's just excessive how much the solo increases the difficulty of this map.

I would like for people to seriously atleast consider the transition between 03:00:073 (1) - and 03:15:830 (1) - .

It's obvious that the later has a bit more uniqueness and intensity to it, but is this unbelievably impossible mapping really necessary? It's not enjoyable for anyone to play this map and then be hit with arguably a wall of unplayability. (sure its possible to play this but I'm just being realistic).

It honestly just feels like its trying to be AS HARD AS PHYSICALLY possible for the sake of being it. Almost no one can play it, no one can enjoy it, so why do it?



Instances of overmapping
03:23:271 (2) -
03:23:387 (4) -
03:23:503 (2) -
03:25:579 (2) -
03:25:926 (4) -
03:26:387 (3) -

ETC.

feels like forced difficulty to me :(
In the thread I've talked about the transition, and all I said about it is that I want it to consist out of clicks for every guitar 1/2 at 03:14:907 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - and that's nowhere close to 'unplayable', please leave judging playability to players and me. I asked some people about the transition like Azerite and he said it's really nothing special especially if you know it's there after playing it once or just looking at the map.

The guitar - this is what we came up with goldenwolf/ukod and me, pishi also icon'd this - 1/6 are changed to 1/4 - https://misery.s-ul.eu/KHJ3l7o1
every single object you linked is actually there, leave timiming judging to more experienced timers please.

What's wrong with mapping so it's hard to pass? Don't you remember what happened with Airman or any other of the challenge maps? Or when Everything Will Freeze was 'hard' and then C just comes in and fc's it?

Shian-aaa

Shian-aaa wrote:

This is the first Mazzerin map that is pointless enough to be in qualify state as of now.

Overall maps from first time mappers appeal more then what has been shown here.


Couple of obvious wrong things:

-Map up to 1200 combo is outragously boring (till 2 min 20 gametime) basicly 30 % of the begin on the map.
Not even the short part at 800 combo was sufficent enough to call it mapped

-Most mapped parts are a copy pasta fest he must have googled symetry or something but didnt take a test in it yet the result is clearly visible.

-At some point in the map he decided he wants it to be Mazzerin TV size pp jumps adding sliders wich are pointless to begin with, your not going to miss at that level from it being a slider , and the sliders itself dont add anything to begin with

-The ending was a combination of Sentimental Scyscrapper jumps and a potato version of the 2010 mapped Basara , heres a link for people not knowing it https://osu.ppy.sh/s/13019


In its current state the map is not worth peoples time to even consinder them modding , as over 85 % of the map is needing to be restructured.
thanks for your opinion! our opinions clash, it seems.

Natsu

Natsu wrote:

03:28:753 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - just to up it to 9 stars I suppose, on a serious note, I don't think this huge difficulty spikes should be allowed, you can argue that you feel the music is stronger than other parts, but I don't that justify 12,0 10,0 jumps.

also can you explain me what's the point of making maps that no one can play? I mean, anyone can take songs like this and make 9 stars maps, but I think people don't because no one can enjoy them (without NF or HT), there is a point when maps become physically impossible and they shouldn't be ranked IMO.

About the big difficulty spike what's the point of have it? make your map 9 stars? make it super hard?, if they fit the music or not is subjective, since alot of people would argue they do (personally I don't think they do), but we should take in consideration the playability of the map, having them make the map less enjoyable, I believe you are a decent mapper who can represent the song without the need of those jumps.

There are alot of linear movements 03:25:060 (1,2,3,1) - that don't play good at normal bpms and I guess they are worst at this high bpm, alot of overmapped objects as Xexxar pointed.

Anyways if this get ranked with that difficulty spike, we shouldn't complain at any other as well, since this one is beyond to any other difficulty spike.
1. What do you mean 'no one can play'? Who do you think tested them then? What do you consider playable and unplayable? Does playable always equal to fcable in your mind? And lastly: what's wrong with having something unplayable if it's not too out of reach of what people can do now? What wrong will it do? (not even speaking of this map)
2. The point of having a difficulty spike is to follow the song. And since the target audience are top players, it is a top difficulty, which means the whole map is scaled around being challenging as well.
3. I am against overmapping. There are no overmapped objects in my maps except for slider ends. I tried stopping RIDICULOUSLY overmapped maps from being ranked, but it never worked. Even if it was overmapped, I could argue it fits the guitar sweeps, but enough of that.
4. 03:25:060 (1,2,3,1) - which part of this is linear? I just checked the entire 260 bpm part and there isn't a single linear pattern, lol. I can actually link you every linear pattern in the map:
02:35:298 (1,2,3) - felt like it fits guitar + good lead in to 02:35:803 (1) -
05:23:057 (1) - all of these, also because of how the guitar goes
both are in 178 bpm parts, and there are only 2 instances of them. Not a valid point.
5. What's wrong with extreme difficulty spikes being ranked? As long as it would be justified and made sense in comparison to the rest of the song/map like here, it would be fine.

TL;DR:
1. There are no overmapped objects.
2. There are no linear movements in the 260 part.
3. It's made with me following the song while having the skill of top players in mind as a reference point to what is playable and what is unplayable.
Yauxo
1,622 posts
Joined June 2011
Yauxo
People react as if it's bad that there's discussion about the first qualified 9* map.
Ofcourse there will be opinions that are different to mazzerin's explanation and ofcourse people will try to make their point clear. Just because there's an "because the song is stronger lel" doesnt mean that noones allowed to post anything about it.
Bearizm
1,213 posts
Joined October 2013
Bearizm
I know i sound like a jackass for saying this (because well, I'm me) but I believe that as long as difficulty spikes are justified by the song, it's fine. In this case, it really is justified simply by the guitar. It may seem like the DS is way too high, but it really isn't when you compare it with all those high bpm spaced streams and stream jumps. The intensity and the lack of density in the 1/2 jumps are compensated with very high DS. Also, consider that the base DS of the jumps are fairly high. There has to be a way to make the most intense part of the song noticeably much more difficult.

This qualified section is made to improve maps that lacks quality, not rant about how a 9* map gets qualified and "nobody" can play it.

o3o
kkk
233 posts
Joined August 2014
kkk

Bearizm wrote:

This qualified section is made to improve maps that lacks quality, not rant about how a 9* map gets qualified and "nobody" can play it.
Well, after all "improvements" this map will be moved to ranked section. Exactly for three and a half people, who can play it and other 300-500 people, who will give it one try with NoFail and forget about it. What do you think, does this map deserves to be ranked? Does the whole community need maps like this? Is there any other reason, despite mapper's will, to move it to ranked section? The answer is no.

This map will be forgotten in a month anyway, no matter ranked it or graveyarded. Enjoy your hype, kids.
Darth_Mula
130 posts
Joined September 2014
Darth_Mula
god bless u mazzerin
m1ts
398 posts
Joined April 2013
m1ts

Bearizm wrote:

This qualified section is made to improve maps that lacks quality, not rant about how a 9* map gets qualified and "nobody" can play it.
funny thing is that, its totally playable.. the stream before the kickslider jumps is the hardest part about the map, and thats only because the meta focuses on anything but streams, so of course very few people are able to play it. in any way that doesnt mean its impossible though, it just doesnt fit the skill set of all these anime map players
Froslass
Beatmap Nominator
9,344 posts
Joined July 2008
Froslass
"i don't like it therefore it shouldn't be ranked"
"i can't play it and almost no one can so it shouldn't be ranked"

there's something called technical quality which is required for getting a map ranked... which this map happens to have
maps like galaxy collapse and red like roses may be "fun" to play (smash your keys through random jumps, sure) but don't have technical quality, therefore that's why they aren't ranked while this map is
people just need to deal with the fact that we should be ranking quality maps regardless if they're hard or not
and if you have absolutely no idea about mapping quality then you should probably stay away from the thread
discussing about "forced difficulty" and actual issues in the map is fine, but saying that the map shouldn't be ranked because it's "too hard" is completely stupid
Stefan
Global Moderator
10,425 posts
Joined January 2011
Stefan
Locked for cleaning
Okoayu
Nomination Assessment Team
5,057 posts
Joined May 2012
Okoayu
okay, shitpost warning #2, some things on this thread that weren't contributing to anything, really, died.

Please behave
Xexxar
915 posts
Joined June 2013
Xexxar

Bearizm wrote:

I know i sound like a jackass for saying this (because well, I'm me) but I believe that as long as difficulty spikes are justified by the song, it's fine. In this case, it really is justified simply by the guitar. It may seem like the DS is way too high, but it really isn't when you compare it with all those high bpm spaced streams and stream jumps. The intensity and the lack of density in the 1/2 jumps are compensated with very high DS. Also, consider that the base DS of the jumps are fairly high. There has to be a way to make the most intense part of the song noticeably much more difficult.

This qualified section is made to improve maps that lacks quality, not rant about how a 9* map gets qualified and "nobody" can play it.

o3o
If you had a slow song that had a 1/8th stream out of nowhere is it okay to map it because the song warrants it? A map should cater consistency in its design and not be excessive for what its trying to be.



Mazzerin you point out maps like timefreeze and airman as examples of controversial high difficulty maps that are "ok now because C has fc'd them." Do you even think bringing those maps up is relevant? They are consistently difficulty and only have slight to moderate noticeable increases in difficulty in them. The problem is not the difficulty, the problem is how the difficulty is unnatural in the presence of the rest of the map. It's excessive and doesn't fit what else you've mapped.

as for overmapping, I'll ask pishifat to listen to those since you seem to believe he is almighty. (which he is)
Neto
Beatmap Nominator
1,327 posts
Joined October 2014
Neto
A map should cater consistency in its design and not be excessive for what its trying to be.
Hmm... If that's the case I must warn you that pretty much all recent mapping should be DQ then, since most of what we see in recent mapping is maps consistently made as 4* hitting 5* by the abuse of jumps on kiais (this also happened a lot in the past maps by abusing streams).

Saying that the map is mainly mapped according to one star rating(or one difficulty range) and say that the kiai abuses difficulty to increase that should be enough reason to never actually got to rank Road of Resistance, but i didn't see you applying the same logic there.

Not a personal attack, just pointing that this line of argument is pretty empty considering the actual meta of mapping :/
bulli
22 posts
Joined August 2011
bulli

Xexxar wrote:

Mazzerin you point out maps like timefreeze and airman as examples of controversial high difficulty maps that are "ok now because C has fc'd them." Do you even think bringing those maps up is relevant? They are consistently difficulty and only have slight to moderate noticeable increases in difficulty in them. The problem is not the difficulty, the problem is how the difficulty is unnatural in the presence of the rest of the map. It's excessive and doesn't fit what else you've mapped.


Xexxar wrote:

It honestly just feels like its trying to be AS HARD AS PHYSICALLY possible for the sake of being it. Almost no one can play it, no one can enjoy it, so why do it?

?
Mazzerin
493 posts
Joined July 2013
Topic Starter
Mazzerin

kkk wrote:

Bearizm wrote:

This qualified section is made to improve maps that lacks quality, not rant about how a 9* map gets qualified and "nobody" can play it.
Well, after all "improvements" this map will be moved to ranked section. Exactly for three and a half people, who can play it and other 300-500 people, who will give it one try with NoFail and forget about it. What do you think, does this map deserves to be ranked? Does the whole community need maps like this? Is there any other reason, despite mapper's will, to move it to ranked section? The answer is no.

This map will be forgotten in a month anyway, no matter ranked it or graveyarded. Enjoy your hype, kids.
Impeccable logic! Bravo! It's been over a year of how your miserable comment on Apparition's thread rots, while the map doesn't, yet to this day you remain completely oblivious to what such behavior will lead to. This kind of input doesn't provide anything to me nor the community, it will change nothing, it affects the quality of the map in no way. Neither the map or you will ever be forgotten though - I can assure you of that - it is already inevitable.

Xexxar wrote:

If you had a slow song that had a 1/8th stream out of nowhere is it okay to map it because the song warrants it?
holy shit 1/8 streams on slow maps aren't even close to how different these jumps are in difficulty, by the way they are used sometimes and they don't come out of nowhere, but rather on intense parts of the song. This comparison would imply that putting 1/16 streams (since the song is 'fast' (I think you were implying it's mostly 1/2 by 'slow'?)) in this map would be just as intense as the 1/2 jumps.. which isn't even close, frankly.

Xexxar wrote:

A map should cater consistency in its design and not be excessive for what its trying to be.
what the... what are you talking about? That part literally never repeats again, the song is extremely unrepetitive and every part has unique spacing that is directly related to each part to make it properly emphasize the hard parts. Don't you see that there are other parts even in the 260 bpm part that are just as spaced as the very spike? 03:37:753 (1,2,1) - 03:44:445 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - 03:52:522 (1,2) - 03:48:830 (1,2) -
well, you probably don't see them because they don't pop up in your aim strain graph app... If you try to argue that 'it's not the same because there's only 2 or 4 notes this spaced' there, I will disagree again, because that's how the song is. The spike simply has a larger amount of 1/2 high pitch notes so it turns out this way, and everything before the sliders builds up gradually.

Xexxar wrote:

Mazzerin you point out maps like timefreeze and airman as examples of controversial high difficulty maps that are "ok now because C has fc'd them." Do you even think bringing those maps up is relevant? They are consistently difficulty and only have slight to moderate noticeable increases in difficulty in them. The problem is not the difficulty, the problem is how the difficulty is unnatural in the presence of the rest of the map. It's excessive and doesn't fit what else you've mapped.
Man do you actually think airman/everything will freeze are consistently difficult? Maybe airman is consistently spaced, but let's face it, the non-spaced parts with back and forths 2 times are the only hard parts in the map. Time freeze difficulty spikes up at the end, which is why people who can play it get 1k+ combo very consistently, while failing to pass most of the time. It's not about those maps, though, so I'll say it again - blame the song for becoming 260 bpm if you want, because I have even larger jumps in the 178 bpm sections, not to mention the technical stream patterns which actually ARE difficult, talala even said he might fail just because of the second solo after passing the first one because the second one isn't exactly THAT easy and the first one isn't THAT difficult.

Xexxar wrote:

as for overmapping, I'll ask pishifat to listen to those since you seem to believe he is almighty. (which he is)
Fine, but just for fun - keep these in mind: https://osu.ppy.sh/s/336414 https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1049018
Mordred
532 posts
Joined October 2015
Mordred
03:30:022 (2) - is that offscreen or still ok? https://puu.sh/rwRfp/094608aaa4.png
_koinuri
451 posts
Joined June 2012
_koinuri

Xexxar wrote:

If you had a slow song that had a 1/8th stream out of nowhere is it okay to map it because the song warrants it? A map should cater consistency in its design and not be excessive for what its trying to be.
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1012279
I think it's perfectly fine to map a 1/8 stream on a slow song if it called for it. I also don't think ignoring a certain aspect of a song for the sake of being consistent is a good idea either. If a song suddenly became intense on a single part, you should map it.
Xexxar
915 posts
Joined June 2013
Xexxar

-[Koinuri] wrote:

Xexxar wrote:

If you had a slow song that had a 1/8th stream out of nowhere is it okay to map it because the song warrants it? A map should cater consistency in its design and not be excessive for what its trying to be.
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1012279
I think it's perfectly fine to map a 1/8 stream on a slow song if it called for it. I also don't think ignoring a certain aspect of a song for the sake of being consistent is a good idea either. If a song suddenly became intense on a single part, you should map it.
why not just use a 1/8th slider to avoid an unnecessary spike in difficulty when it might not warrant it, or any other form of sliders to make it reasonable.

as for mazzerin.

aight fine do whatever, no one cares about maps quality anymore anyway so idk why I even make an effort. (i forgot quaver got ranked, this map is fine)
stryver12
231 posts
Joined August 2012
stryver12

N00dle wrote:

03:30:022 (2) - is that offscreen or still ok? https://puu.sh/rwRfp/094608aaa4.png
Took a look at Autoplay yesterday, looks fine IIRC.
_koinuri
451 posts
Joined June 2012
_koinuri

Xexxar wrote:

why not just use a 1/8th slider to avoid an unnecessary spike in difficulty when it might not warrant it, or any other form of sliders to make it reasonable.
Having bunch of 1/8 repeat sliders (essentially making it a long 1/1 or 1/2 section) is just as inconsistent because it'd make the section way too easy, considering it's one of the peak in the song, but oh well, offtopic. My point is having a spike isn't necessarily a bad thing if the song calls for it.
Bearizm
1,213 posts
Joined October 2013
Bearizm

Xexxar wrote:

If you had a slow song that had a 1/8th stream out of nowhere is it okay to map it because the song warrants it? A map should cater consistency in its design and not be excessive for what its trying to be.
If a song calls for it (like really), why not? It's not always good to sacrifice emphasis for consistency. Actually, I don't think there is ever a case where consistency is prioritized over emphasis. If you think of consistency as the higher prior than emphasis then you're playing a target practice. If vice versa; you're playing a circle clicking rhythm game; which is what this game is. xd
Flower
1,740 posts
Joined August 2011
Flower
I just feel some 260 bpm large space 1/4 jump is funny. But it's just my opinion and this is unrelated to the map quality. No need to reply to this post. The map is good overall, and in my opinion it's good everywhere. And this is not some sarcasm, I mean, man, this map is good.
riktoi
711 posts
Joined September 2014
riktoi

N00dle wrote:

03:30:022 (2) - is that offscreen or still ok? https://puu.sh/rwRfp/094608aaa4.png
looked through the map with auto at 800x600, nothing should be offscreen (some stuff goes pretty close but it's not close enough for it to be a problem)

for anyone complaining about sharp stream transitions (like this 04:56:597 (1,1,1) - ) you need to understand that mapping is not simply about smooth transitions and flow. I don't really know the name but you can hear the foot pedal (?) kick in here 04:56:765 - which justifies this kind of patterning.

also mazzerin can you tell me about this 05:02:158 (1,2,1,2) - 05:02:833 (1,2,3,4) -
Mazzerin
493 posts
Joined July 2013
Topic Starter
Mazzerin

riktoi wrote:

N00dle wrote:

03:30:022 (2) - is that offscreen or still ok? https://puu.sh/rwRfp/094608aaa4.png
looked through the map with auto at 800x600, nothing should be offscreen (some stuff goes pretty close but it's not close enough for it to be a problem)

for anyone complaining about sharp stream transitions (like this 04:56:597 (1,1,1) - ) you need to understand that mapping is not simply about smooth transitions and flow. I don't really know the name but you can hear the foot pedal (?) kick in here 04:56:765 - which justifies this kind of patterning.

also mazzerin can you tell me about this 05:02:158 (1,2,1,2) - 05:02:833 (1,2,3,4) -
tell what it's similar to 04:55:754 (1) - but of less magnitude, those notes increase in pitch while the 2nd group decrease and it isn't as noticeable when it decreases, so nothing really happens
riktoi
711 posts
Joined September 2014
riktoi
I see thanks
Henri
113 posts
Joined February 2012
Henri
People are complaining about the hugely exaggerated back and forth jumps that are ill fitting to the rest of the map,
when the whole map is ugly and looks unpolished in general.

This map has too low AR/OD and there is nothing the mapper can do about it.
Played in half time, (which many people in this case WILL ACTUALLY DO, (unlike in other maps)) the map becomes 7.22* and AR9.

I can't imagine anyone choosing to map for example:
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1028733
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/851255
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/724015
:with AR9, taking into consideration that most of the people in around top 5 000 can read ar9DT with ease, and this maps target audience being the top3+ a couple of fast players.

Obviously people are going to say that it isnt the mappers fault, as he cannot rise the AR above 10.
There still is SOMETHING he can do: not overmap like crazy, or consider NOT mapping something that CANNOT be mapped with the current editor.
Sadly that is mostly what he is known for and for what his fanboys will follow him for.

Also, gotta love these comments about this map automatically being better because its not anime music.
I feel like these people do not look at the map at all, but just the music, and mainly want a contrast for the anime heavy scene.
I love this kind of music but I disagree with a choice of mp3 making the MAP any better..

EDIT: cant wait for the learn to read replies
Akali
639 posts
Joined November 2012
Akali

huono_tuuri wrote:

People are complaining about the hugely exaggerated back and forth jumps that are ill fitting to the rest of the map,
when the whole map is ugly and looks unpolished in general.

This map has too low AR/OD and there is nothing the mapper can do about it.
Played in half time, (which many people in this case WILL ACTUALLY DO, (unlike in other maps)) the map becomes 7.22* and AR9.

I can't imagine anyone choosing to map for example:
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1028733
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/851255
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/724015
:with AR9, taking into consideration that most of the people in around top 5 000 can read ar9DT with ease, and this maps target audience being the top3+ a couple of fast players.

Obviously people are going to say that it isnt the mappers fault, as he cannot rise the AR above 10.
There still is SOMETHING he can do: not overmap like crazy, or consider NOT mapping something that CANNOT be mapped with the current editor.
Sadly that is mostly what he is known for and for what his fanboys will follow him for.

Also, gotta love these comments about this map automatically being better because its not anime music.
I feel like these people do not look at the map at all, but just the music, and mainly want a contrast for the anime heavy scene.
I love this kind of music but I disagree with a choice of mp3 making the MAP any better..

EDIT: cant wait for the learn to read replies
Ye it's like, not mappers fault because he can't rise the AR above 10
UndeadCapulet
1,100 posts
Joined April 2013
UndeadCapulet
mods arent considered for map rankability, except in weird cases like hr drain making the map unpassable

its the player's fault if they cant read the mod they put on
Sanze
18 posts
Joined August 2013
Sanze
delet this
Henri
113 posts
Joined February 2012
Henri

UndeadCapulet wrote:

mods arent considered for map rankability, except in weird cases like hr drain making the map unpassable

its the player's fault if they cant read the mod they put on
My point is that even with nomod the diff paremetres do not fit, i just used HT for the example.
There just isnt any players that this map is meant for.
ALSO : https://osu.ppy.sh/s/484689

@akali
its not like the mapper is out of options, as i wrote he can remove the map or change the overmapped parts =)
edit: also graveyard is a good option
Akali
639 posts
Joined November 2012
Akali

huono_tuuri wrote:

@akali
its not like the mapper is out of options, as i wrote he can remove the map or change the overmapped parts =)
It's not overmapped or doesn't spike more than kpop or pool party ballads that breeze through qualification system, it just has higher (justified) base difficulty from which it goes up.

More people map more maps, more and more get ranked, if a weird technical cancer that doesn't give any pp or 9*star deathmetal song get through from time to time nothing bad will happen as long as they maintain theoretical quality standards.
Bursthammy
1,254 posts
Joined May 2015
Bursthammy

huono_tuuri wrote:

There just isnt any players that this map is meant for.
cool opinion you have there
Stefan
Global Moderator
10,425 posts
Joined January 2011
Stefan
Could you please stop repeating the same quote over and over again about "it can also be played while graveyarded" and "graveyard is an option"?

In the end, the map won't bite off your face when you decide to avoid it. Obviously, you should make sure there is nothing which is in this point that overdone that it needs to be disqualified but you could just leave it if you can't really argue what's wrong with the map. Saying "remove overmapped parts" is pointless.
Reddit
36 posts
Joined January 2016
Reddit
So apparently a big rise in difficulty isnt okay when the song gets crazy itself.



but this is okay when the song itself is consistent but the map gets crazy for no reason?
C00L
1,078 posts
Joined September 2014
C00L

Stefan wrote:

In the end, the map won't bite off your face when you decide to avoid it.
could we just quote this from now on?

I mean just give up for god sake just since you cant play it doesnt mean that other cant, it's not just what you can or cannot play, its mostly about map quality isn't it? Think this through maps don't get qualified if they look bad. You can do the math yourself... (not refering to you stefan just in general)

Congratz Mazzerin btw i never said it before, really great map quality
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn

Reddit wrote:

apoplectic, ignorant crap
if you'd have actually looked at the threads and did more than post insinuative bullshit, you'd have realized people did not think quaver's difficulty spike was "okay". Maybe it'd be better for everyone involved if you cut your sarcastic commentary career short.

Stefan wrote:

In the end, the map won't bite off your face when you decide to avoid it.
"If you don't like it leave" stopped being an effective argument in most people's lives once testicles started to drop and periods started to occur. Maps will, and should, be judged by community perspective. Of course, most people have no idea what they're talking about, but that's normal, and you don't figure shit out without making a fool of yourself once or twice, so it's a natural process. Ironic you're calling it the "same quote over and over again" when you responded with the obligatory response to that quote... but I digress.


This map is some bullshit, but it's pretty consistently bullshit and sticks to its theme. I don't like it for personal reasons, but that's normal for Shiirn. I can't really comment one way or the other on the rankability of this map as I'm sure anything I say will be taken with a grain of salt, but if my penny is worth anything I think the map should just be left alone. Shitty deathmetal gonna be shitty.
Battle
2,875 posts
Joined February 2014
Battle
that normal-hitfinish6 is still triggering tho
Remyria
366 posts
Joined June 2012
Remyria
wtf... ... ... ... m'k, that's a retardedly difficult spike (and the rest is ridiculously hard as well)...but it's not bad. You really look like you know what you are doing with these impossible maps. if the other nice 7-8* maps that aren't impossibly hard streams could be ranked as well ;w; <.<

EDIT: it seems that was my 250th message
Last edited by Remyria , edited 1 time in total.
Reddit
36 posts
Joined January 2016
Reddit

Shiirn wrote:

Reddit wrote:

apoplectic, ignorant crap
Yeah ok whatever floats your boat.

Shiirn wrote:

if you'd have actually looked at the threads and did more than post insinuative bullshit, you'd have realized people did not think quaver's difficulty spike was "okay". Maybe it'd be better for everyone involved if you cut your sarcastic commentary career short.
Im aware at how upset people were at Quaver having a retarded difficulty spike that had no justification even being there. Im saying how is this a issue for getting the map ranked when this maps difficulty spike actually fits the music however overmapped you may feel it is. Im not saying "Hey everyone look the entire map is perfect just because i can justify the main thing people are complaining about". I just think it would be better to focus on other parts of the map and try to find real issues instead of "please dq muh overmapping uwu". But whatever, when this map gets inevitably DQed for something unreasonable because he isnt Monstrata or Fycho and doesnt have his special license for using huge jumps in his maps yet. I guess on the bright side i get to make some memes on how Quaver and HAI-TAI is ok but this isnt. 8-)
m1ts
398 posts
Joined April 2013
m1ts

Battle wrote:

that normal-hitfinish6 is still triggering tho
i don't think it doesn't fit the song but its definitely overused (honestly everyone overuses this)
Bearizm
1,213 posts
Joined October 2013
Bearizm

mithew wrote:

Battle wrote:

that normal-hitfinish6 is still triggering tho
i don't think it doesn't fit the song but its definitely overused (honestly everyone overuses this)
It's used in most if not all Mazzerin's maps. That sound is like his map's identity now despite being used by others before he ranked anything lol
Battle
2,875 posts
Joined February 2014
Battle
well if that's the case then I think it's cool lmao
Okoayu
Nomination Assessment Team
5,057 posts
Joined May 2012
Okoayu
Just an update from our side:

We are aware that this map is reported, but we lack technical reasoning to open up a debate about. The stuff that's currently here seems to be widely based on "i think this is too much", while not really providing a) something that would solve the problem people see b) any technical reason why current patterning is broken
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
90% of modders who think they can conceptually understand this map are going to be modding it at 25 or 50% anyway
Ekoro
3,522 posts
Joined March 2010
Ekoro
this isn't disqualified yet come on /s

to me, a map shouldn't be disqualified because of raw difficulty ; even if everyone knows that a 15* would barely make it to ranking no matter how good the map is

the harder the map is, the less you should use technical patterns and use mostly flow-friendly patterns, so the map is still playable while retaining the challenge.

03:23:214 - 03:26:445 - this part is really a pain to play, especially 03:24:945 (3,1,2,3,1) which is really awkward to play because of the very high BPM
03:52:522 (1,2) - this may be too much, i don't really see why the spacing is so high and sudden here.

that's all here, the map is technically ok (even if i admit that there are some overdone jumps, but eh, can we justify it through the song?)

i feel like i already posted on this topic, giving exactly the same opinion
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
mmm, to clarify Ekoro's comment a bit about technical patterns vs flow-friendly;


It's not necessarily when the map is harder, but when the map is faster. The main difficulty with maps like this is the raw density of notes, not their rhythm or predictability. Like I mentioned in Fetish's Empress, high velocity should be relying on simpler pattern-based structure and flow on a more over-arching scale: individual beats blend together at these speeds, so emphasizing them is useless, if not directly detrimental to a map's playability and feasibility. Thus, it becomes more important to have entire combos and measures taken in context, rather than looking specifically at drums or guitar riffs. This is what causes my disdain for the "25% or 50%" modding - you can hear the differences at that speed, but they're irrelevant at full speed. It ruins the map.

What does this have to do with The Promethean Kings? You tell me. I'm just trying to explain what should be considered for this map's rankability, which I feel is a different metric than most people are used to.
Mazzerin
493 posts
Joined July 2013
Topic Starter
Mazzerin

Ekoro wrote:

this isn't disqualified yet come on /s

to me, a map shouldn't be disqualified because of raw difficulty ; even if everyone knows that a 15* would barely make it to ranking no matter how good the map is

the harder the map is, the less you should use technical patterns and use mostly flow-friendly patterns, so the map is still playable while retaining the challenge.

03:23:214 - 03:26:445 - this part is really a pain to play, especially 03:24:945 (3,1,2,3,1) which is really awkward to play because of the very high BPM
03:52:522 (1,2) - this may be too much, i don't really see why the spacing is so high and sudden here.

that's all here, the map is technically ok (even if i admit that there are some overdone jumps, but eh, can we justify it through the song?)

i feel like i already posted on this topic, giving exactly the same opinion
hmm this actually used to be a triangle triple 03:25:176 (2,3,1) - but gayz and talala both disliked it, after I changed it to this talala could pass it and said it's much better, well the movement isn't awkward at least, the spacing goes up on the strong guitar notes in this section and the triple is part of it (it's the whole white tick after the strongest guitar note, ex: 03:23:676 (1,2,3,4) - 03:24:137 (1,2,3) - 03:24:599 (1,2,3,4,1) - 03:25:060 (1,2,3,1) - and so on)
I think the difficulty comes from it simply being 260 bpm to be honest, I tried making it as non-overlappy as possible (people were having problems with overlaps at first) while having the spacing changes quite clear, but the difficulty of tapping still remains

03:52:522 (1,2) - these aren't much different from 03:48:830 (1,2) - this for example in intensity, and they're spaced similarly, I think that's fine? 03:37:753 (1,2) - could also compare this, these got strong lead guitar notes instead of rhythmic one tho, and the main spotlight of this pattern is 03:37:983 (1) - which is the furthest away, while the other 2 have their final notes closer instead of further away 03:49:060 (1) - 03:52:753 (1) -

I didn't use any "super advanced technical" patterns in the 260 bpm part except maybe 03:47:330 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1) - but even that one plays very simply, it's easier than it would be if the stream was spaced every 1 note, the part is 99% based around mechanical skill as I said somewhere else (well reading is obviously involved because when things are this fast at such a bpm it gets more intense to read as well)
Torchic
96 posts
Joined August 2012
Torchic
Let's go boiiiis
marshallracer
1,608 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer
It is incredible how you're still allowed to use the "rsi" tag although it doesn't have to do ANYTHING with this map
Yeah, it's hard and stuff but why should it have relevance in this map (or any other map you've used it in for that matter)?

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
If it's about helping people to find "difficult" maps, that's not how tags are supposed to be used. They're predominantely meant for additional sources or relevant people/media/events (if any) it has relevance to.
DeletedUser_6709840
DeletedUser_6709840

marshallracer wrote:

It is incredible how you're still allowed to use the "rsi" tag although it doesn't have to do ANYTHING with this map
Yeah, it's hard and stuff but why should it have relevance in this map (or any other map you've used it in for that matter)?

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
If it's about helping people to find "difficult" maps, that's not how tags are supposed to be used. They're predominantely meant for additional sources or relevant people/media/events (if any) it has relevance to.
The RSI tag is a medical warning for people who plan to retry this map a ton of time because streams like these really mess up your hands without proper breaks
Froslass
Beatmap Nominator
9,344 posts
Joined July 2008
Froslass
just a quick reminder that tags can be changed without a DQ so finding wrong things there will not take the map down
marshallracer
1,608 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer

RoseusJaeger wrote:

The RSI tag is a medical warning for people who plan to retry this map a ton of time because streams like these really mess up your hands without proper breaks
This can be done in the description aswell without abusing the tags for this

Blue Dragon wrote:

just a quick reminder that tags can be changed without a DQ so finding wrong things there will not take the map down
This is perfectly fine as long as this issue can and will be discussed
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
also memes can be put in tags fairly easily without anyone really giving a shit, missing or misleading tags are far more disruptive than superfluous tags
Lunicia
328 posts
Joined May 2014
Lunicia
mazzerin, get a 10 star map ranked next

edit: fuck i forgot i cant delete this post. fml ;(

accidental double post plz no silence me pls
Last edited by Lunicia , edited 2 times in total.
Lunicia
328 posts
Joined May 2014
Lunicia

marshallracer wrote:

It is incredible how you're still allowed to use the "rsi" tag although it doesn't have to do ANYTHING with this map
Yeah, it's hard and stuff but why should it have relevance in this map (or any other map you've used it in for that matter)?

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
If it's about helping people to find "difficult" maps, that's not how tags are supposed to be used. They're predominantely meant for additional sources or relevant people/media/events (if any) it has relevance to.
https://osu.ppy.sh/s/368060 this map has rsi in the tags, and rightfully so. there isnt a reason why rsi SHOULDNT be in the tags of this map

after all its a 9 star map
Luel Roseline
1,035 posts
Joined February 2014
Luel Roseline
Never mind...
Somebody lock this thread...
Bursthammy
1,254 posts
Joined May 2015
Bursthammy

S A V E R Y wrote:

Never mind...
Somebody lock this thread...
>locking forum for a map in qualified, killing any discussion

?
marshallracer
1,608 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer

Xendogenesis wrote:

marshallracer wrote:

It is incredible how you're still allowed to use the "rsi" tag although it doesn't have to do ANYTHING with this map
Yeah, it's hard and stuff but why should it have relevance in this map (or any other map you've used it in for that matter)?

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
If it's about helping people to find "difficult" maps, that's not how tags are supposed to be used. They're predominantely meant for additional sources or relevant people/media/events (if any) it has relevance to.
https://osu.ppy.sh/s/368060 this map has rsi in the tags, and rightfully so. there isnt a reason why rsi SHOULDNT be in the tags of this map

after all its a 9 star map
It's just about the correct usage of tags really
I realize it's a 9* diff, fine, but if you want to make clear to the players that they can hurt themselves while playing this map (which in itself sounds absurd, though it's not impossible), you can more than clearly state this in the creators words or even a sb (even if this may impair the maps appearence in the beginning)

I gave you a reason why you shouldn't use "rsi" as a tag, you even qouted it
AncuL
1,114 posts
Joined March 2013
AncuL

marshallracer wrote:

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
but like, there's a connection between rsi and the map
Mazzerin
493 posts
Joined July 2013
Topic Starter
Mazzerin
why are you so salty Bakari once suggested and 'allowed' me to use it, ever since then I've been using it on any of my high bpm maps with lots of 1/2 and 1/4 in a row successfully
marshallracer
1,608 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer

AncuL wrote:

marshallracer wrote:

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
but like, there's a connection between rsi and the map
If you could elaborate that further I'd be glad to read how these two are connected

Mazzerin wrote:

why are you so salty Bakari once suggested and 'allowed' me to use it, ever since then I've been using it on any of my high bpm maps with lots of 1/2 and 1/4 in a row successfully
I listed my reasons why I am so salty about it
Even if Bakari "allowed" you to use it and you've used it several times already, it's still an incorrect usage of a tag
If "lots of 1/2 and 1/4" are the only requirement for a map to have rsi as a tag, then maybe I'd suggest to everyone who makes a map with streams, no matter the BPM or speed of those as long as they are 1/2 or 1/4, to put rsi in their tags

If you're going for warning purposes :

marshallracer wrote:

RoseusJaeger wrote:

The RSI tag is a medical warning for people who plan to retry this map a ton of time because streams like these really mess up your hands without proper breaks
This can be done in the description aswell without abusing the tags for this

marshallracer wrote:

Xendogenesis wrote:

https://osu.ppy.sh/s/368060 this map has rsi in the tags, and rightfully so. there isnt a reason why rsi SHOULDNT be in the tags of this map

after all its a 9 star map
It's just about the correct usage of tags really
I realize it's a 9* diff, fine, but if you want to make clear to the players that they can hurt themselves while playing this map (which in itself sounds absurd, though it's not impossible), you can more than clearly state this in the creators words or even a sb (even if this may impair the maps appearence in the beginning)

I gave you a reason why you shouldn't use "rsi" as a tag, you even qouted it
If we're going after Shiirn's thoughts though :

Shiirn wrote:

also memes can be put in tags fairly easily without anyone really giving a shit, missing or misleading tags are far more disruptive than superfluous tags
We'd have to decide as to how we classify a tag such as "rsi", or why even bother using it

As far as I can remember, "having rsi" has been a running gag in the community for not doing well on a map or generally after having played an overly difficult map. Surely, I haven't seen people "complain" about that in a while but then again, I'm not that often reading channels like #osu anymore where this has happened predominantly. But this wasn't always related to extremely hard maps more so than just for maps one struggles a lot on.
So is a running gag, a joke or what we'd today call a "meme" an appropriate tag?
Apparently it is.

But can we take a look at the definition of what "RSI" actually is?

Wikipedia wrote:

Repetitive strain injury (RSI) and associative trauma orders are umbrella terms used to refer to several discrete conditions that can be associated with repetitive tasks, forceful exertions, vibrations, mechanical compression, or sustained/awkward positions.
[...]
Some examples of symptoms experienced by patients with RSI are aching, pulsing pain, tingling and extremity weakness, initially presenting with intermittent discomfort and then, with a higher degree of frequency.
I know I didn't include a lot of the article but this are the key sentences. RSI is a medical condition. How is a medical condition as such related to any of the previously mentioned points, including the map itself? Did the drummer or guitarist suffer from RSI after playing this song repeatedly? Even so it wouldn't be relevant to the tags at all.
Also, if people pay attention to how they play hard stuff and how to treat their body as a temple, they'll actually never encounter rsi, even when playing difficult maps like this one.
In this case I would assume this tag can be - to some degree - considered as misleading.
Even something as deathstreams or anything similar would be more appropriate.
Last edited by marshallracer , edited 1 time in total.
The Emperor
291 posts
Joined September 2014
The Emperor
i would very much like it if rsi keep being a tag used for stream heavy maps and tecnical stream maps as i find half my maps true this tag.
EDIT: irrelevant cuz all maps with rsi tag has "deathstream" or "stream" as tags to.
JMC
osu!artist
1,899 posts
Joined April 2011
JMC
personal opinion, I prefer deathstream rather than rsi, I remember when I multiplayer with 200k rank player play Hommarju feat. R.Cena - Chousai Kenbo Sengen [Insane] they said "omg my hand hurt, I get rsi after play this map, I can't feel my hand.. omg omg omg etc."

rsi seems too general and ambiguous, 200k rank player or lower can get "rsi" instantly after play 5 stars/6 stars map continuously without stopping
so, I think deathstream is the best to describe how BEAST this beatmap, no need rsi tag
bulli
22 posts
Joined August 2011
bulli

AncuL wrote:

marshallracer wrote:

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
but like, there's a connection between rsi and the map
As marshallracer said, there definitely isn't. If you look at how you get rsi, it just makes no sense.
The thing is, you don't even really get it just out of overstressing your fingers. You have to do the same things over months or rather years very often.
And no it's not "Tenosynovitis" (wikipedia, if you don't know the meaning). I just noticed, that this gets often confused with rsi.

Nevertheless I think that the players know, what they will encounter in the map when reading this tag, so it's not really misleading in this sense
(but definitely, if people assume they could get rsi by playing one map again and again).
Enon
Beatmap Nominator
2,719 posts
Joined November 2012
Enon
don't find reason to make a map that you hate going to disqualify
bulli
22 posts
Joined August 2011
bulli

Enon wrote:

don't find reason to make a map that you hate going to disqualify

Blue Dragon wrote:

just a quick reminder that tags can be changed without a DQ so finding wrong things there will not take the map down
Mazzerin
493 posts
Joined July 2013
Topic Starter
Mazzerin

marshallracer wrote:

Mazzerin wrote:

why are you so salty Bakari once suggested and 'allowed' me to use it, ever since then I've been using it on any of my high bpm maps with lots of 1/2 and 1/4 in a row successfully
I listed my reasons why I am so salty about it
Even if Bakari "allowed" you to use it and you've used it several times already, it's still an incorrect usage of a tag
If "lots of 1/2 and 1/4" are the only requirement for a map to have rsi as a tag, then maybe I'd suggest to everyone who makes a map with streams, no matter the BPM or speed of those as long as they are 1/2 or 1/4, to put rsi in their tags
why do you exclude the high bpm part from your if
marshallracer
1,608 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer

Mazzerin wrote:

why do you exclude the high bpm part from your if
I'll have to admit I overread that and I'm sorry about it
Regardless of that, it would come down to what you and what others define as high BPM (playwise)
It could even go as low as roughly 200BPM which may be quite a lot for a few people to play - add lots of 1/2 and 1/4 and inexperienced players could still meme (or rather joke about) "oh hell this is so tough I just got RSI"
It would really allow - regarding everyones own interpretation - a lot of people to add RSI to the tags of their maps, even if you wouldn't agree with it.
So why bother discussing about when a tag is acceptable or not when you could just leave it out alltogether as - for many previously mentioned reasons - it wouldn't fit to the map at all
Stefan
Global Moderator
10,425 posts
Joined January 2011
Stefan
t/480335

If you think this is necessary to be a guideline or even as rule, please follow the thread I've linked. Talking about a general issue - because this is not a map-related issue - won't really help here.

To summarize: It's more than bullshit to add these sort of tags but current phrase applies in this case:

"It's not against the rule, it's not misleading. So it's no problem."

Therefore, the tag can stay until a rule/guideline is added to prevent this.
marshallracer
1,608 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer
Well then, I rest my case.

Congratulations on getting this approved :D
Reddit
36 posts
Joined January 2016
Reddit
8-)

blahpy
297 posts
Joined November 2013
blahpy
To be honest the map is structurally okay mostly but it has some readability issues in transitions from streams to jumps in the hard solo part. Especially this one: 03:25:926 (4,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,1,2) - there are just so many overlaps and spacing changes...
Lunicia
328 posts
Joined May 2014
Lunicia

AncuL wrote:

marshallracer wrote:

I see no connection between rsi and artist, song, album and/or mapper.
well people in the song select can search up "rsi" to find songs that might give them rsi, signifying the intense mapping. so, yoou could easily define this map as an rsi map, giving it purpose in the tags :^)

I just realized that this problem had already been solved, maybe i should read the posts before making a post. fml
Reddit
36 posts
Joined January 2016
Reddit

blahpy wrote:

readability issues
Do you mean by issues that you just personally cant read that part? Its not an issue If its just something you personally have trouble with. Have you thought of the chance of it not being meant to be easy to read?
blahpy
297 posts
Joined November 2013
blahpy

Reddit wrote:

blahpy wrote:

readability issues
Do you mean by issues that you just personally cant read that part? Its not an issue If its just something you personally have trouble with. Have you thought of the chance of it not being meant to be easy to read?
No, I mean that it's objectively hard to read. In the same way that, say, an old skystar map is hard to read. Being able to read it because you've watched that specific pattern in the editor 50 times on 25% doesn't count.
Abyssal
40 posts
Joined January 2015
Abyssal

blahpy wrote:

No, I mean that it's objectively hard to read. In the same way that, say, an old skystar map is hard to read. Being able to read it because you've watched that specific pattern in the editor 50 times on 25% doesn't count.
On my sightread play, I read that properly and had no issues with it?
blahpy
297 posts
Joined November 2013
blahpy
well if you say so then i can't argue i guess
Swiftrax
242 posts
Joined November 2013
Swiftrax
here comes that approval
o shit waddup
The Emperor
291 posts
Joined September 2014
The Emperor
oh man cant wait!!! refreshing the side like to times every minute while spectating hvick
[ Eon Fox ]
302 posts
Joined September 2014
[ Eon Fox ]
I realize these won't be changed, but I still found them odd enough to address:

1. Why use six different SV values?
2. 04:00:137 (1) - How come you didn't put a spinner here instead. Musically, it actually makes more sense.
3. Isn't the HP a little too high? I mean, no one appears to have passed nomod, and at the very least, that should be able to be done.
7ambda
2,599 posts
Joined January 2015
7ambda

[ Eon Fox ] wrote:

I realize these won't be changed, but I still found them odd enough to address:

1. Why use six different SV values?
2. 04:00:137 (1) - How come you didn't put a spinner here instead. Musically, it actually makes more sense.
1. Probably hitsound changes to emphasize different instruments.
2. A spinner wouldn't emphasize the sharp bpm change. 260 -> 178 is a big difference; the slider works better because you have to snap to it quickly, which emphasizes that suddenness.
Froslass
Beatmap Nominator
9,344 posts
Joined July 2008
Froslass

[ Eon Fox ] wrote:

I realize these won't be changed, but I still found them odd enough to address:

1. Why use six different SV values?
2. 04:00:137 (1) - How come you didn't put a spinner here instead. Musically, it actually makes more sense.
3. Isn't the HP a little too high? I mean, no one appears to have passed nomod, and at the very least, that should be able to be done.

5.5HP is, if anything, too low
The Emperor
291 posts
Joined September 2014
The Emperor
Gratz on rank!
Bursthammy
1,254 posts
Joined May 2015
Bursthammy
WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEW LAD
Reillia
1,164 posts
Joined August 2014
Reillia
holy....
uee
36 posts
Joined December 2013
uee
ayylmao
Ideal
Nomination Assessment Team
636 posts
Joined January 2014
Ideal
it happened
pack up bois this will be one hell of a trip
Luel Roseline
1,035 posts
Joined February 2014
Luel Roseline
Okay, it's time to lock.
Chaos
osu! Alumni
244 posts
Joined May 2013
Chaos
wew lads
Abyssal
40 posts
Joined January 2015
Abyssal
gg, Mazzerin! :D
Meteo L-Drago
795 posts
Joined October 2014
Meteo L-Drago
Next Mission: 10 stars
Rilene
2,105 posts
Joined April 2014
Rilene

Mapper wrote:

Next Mission: 10 stars
someone gotta map 300bpm jumps and streams
Antalar
131 posts
Joined October 2014
Antalar

Mapper wrote:

Next Mission: 10 stars
im hoping "The Deceit/Violation" goes ranked 1st 8-)
Reddit
36 posts
Joined January 2016
Reddit
@everyone trying to shit on this map

Akali
639 posts
Joined November 2012
Akali
G O A T
vanucik
484 posts
Joined December 2014
vanucik
нюхаю что хочу, законом запрещено
Enon
Beatmap Nominator
2,719 posts
Joined November 2012
Enon
it worth to be ranked, greatz!
Aikyuu-Chan
227 posts
Joined January 2014
Aikyuu-Chan
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