I can always count on Ymir for shitposting.Ymir wrote:
you two are perfect for each other
maybe I should take lessons...
I can always count on Ymir for shitposting.Ymir wrote:
you two are perfect for each other
ColdTooth wrote:
I disagree with Patatitta's takes sometimes but holy fuck give them some goddamn space. They're actually making this a reality. Saying someone has a terrible taste in any form of media is completely disingenous. What if I came up to you and told you that everything you ever liked, from Grand Theft Auto, catch the beat, and NFS games, were completely hot fucking garbage. It would feel terrible, wouldn't it? You wouldn't like that if I personally walked up to you and smacked you upside the head on whatever you enjoyed in your life. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion whether you disagree with them or not.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
GTA 4, girls und panzer, And i frustrated cuz u Dropped far cry 2
and oh yeah,
If u pirate Sleeping dogs even At discounts, then u broke AF
and u can play NFS MW On PS2 Emulator and Dolphin
This thread is a goddamn blessing to have because not only do we, as the audience, get to participate in providing the OP stuff to review in his own time, he gets to provide his own opinion on what he thinks about them. Any other thread could not compete with this level of activity, this level of trust, and this level of honesty. Not only do I believe that this thread is marvelous in its own right because of this generosity, he's doing it for fucking free! And I even managed to pick up a damn game out of it cause it interested me. So this thread is not only helpful and informational, but a very strong piece of writing when it comes to the real world. Patatitta is providing their own feedback on what they find fun and enjoyable, or agonizing and downright terrible to him. If I love a game to death, but he hates it to the very core, that's just opinions! That's how they work! It's a healthy communication, even if it isn't positively received.
Yeah, sure pirating isn't really good in many people's eyes (unless you're pirating adobe products which honestly that's perfectly fine cause adobe fucking sucks nowadays (I'm not saying you should do it, but you have the option)), but when you actively preach about something or lots of things either positively or negatively, you're going to attract the attention of those around you in both influences. Saying something is really good might lead to people buying a product, even if you pirated it. And who knows maybe the person preaching about it might buy a legitimate copy in the future. That's just how sales works, or atleast an indirect way of doing it.
So while Patatitta might have some spicy takes, everything should still be accounted for as an opinion. Just because you like something, doesn't mean it's universally loved. Someone else might hate it, someone might absolutely despise it. And some people don't even want to have it imprinted in their brains. You can't just be selfish and think about yourself when it comes to having thoughts about if one thing is good or bad, you have to understand why someone else would think opposite. Maybe there's a feature that ruins it for someone? Maybe someone really enjoys playing the game in that way? You have to think logically, and connect the dots on the table, because everyone has their own unique flavors and tastes they are trying to accomadate for in their life. Do they like shooters? Open world? Puzzles? Stealth? Adventure even?
Desperately needed to get that off my chest because I can't believe that people can't even have their own opinion, whether it be good or bad. It's almost 2025 and the internet is becoming more of a cesspool because of clashing idealogies, and the mentality of "well if you don't like it you clearly are stupid". Like what the fuck? I can't even tell if you're trolling because your reputation in this sub-forum just makes it look like you popped up out of nowhere and decided to be hostile. Like the reason I'm hostile at times is because I'm just a grumpy old fuck in this "dying" subforum and everyone somehow tolerates me. But I don't overdo it at times because I understand that there are moments that people are actually cool and entertaining and sometimes I just like to goof off. Infact I haven't even been that grumpy in a while. And now it's back. Thanks for that.
Winnyace wrote:
Just noticed this. Please play the PC version. Thanks.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
and u can play NFS MW On PS2 Emulator and Dolphin
Still dont really get it but fair enough, not really a huge CGDCT fan myselfPatatitta wrote:
really quickly since i'm going to sleep now, bocchi is a very happy anime, it's a really good time, makes the chemicals in my brain go , I think the characters and the relationship between them are very good, the comedy is spot on, the music is unironically good for a music anime, animation is good, really, it's a anime on one of my favourite genres (slice of life CGDCT) that is done really well and there is nothing to hate, I've read the manga and while the manga is pretty good I feel most (good) music manga really gets exalted with the anime, tho, if you thought the manga was mid, I don't think your opinion on the anime is going to be all that differentDM FOR MUTUAL wrote:
I think the strangest one for me is bocchi in S. I don't really get it. Maybe because I haven't watched the anime, but is it that much better than the manga? I read your analysis, but you don't really say much about why you like it. Maybe me not liking Bocchi that much is the real hot take, I'd put it in B probably.
There's a bunch of stuff in D that I disagree with personally but at least I can understand why you don't like them, but I'm kinda confused with bocchi.
For me, it was your GTA IV review. I simply didn't have any of the issues you've encountered with the story and gameplay. The only annoying things about the game was the friendship system and the messages/calls you had to wait for to get new missions. Besides that, I personally enjoyed the game a lot. For me, I think an A would have been good, but its your thread, not mine.Patatitta wrote:
i'm not trying to create beef or anything but i'm genuinly interested to hear this stuff, often when I write something people don't really acknowledge it and just request their own stuff, I'm actually curious to hear what have been my most unpopular takes, so if you could list the takes I have you really disagree with and where you would put it, please do!, also not just winnyace, everyoneWinnyace wrote:
Also, I do agree that Patatitta has some really bad takes, but he is entitled to his opinion.
ColdTooth wrote:
I disagree with Patatitta's takes sometimes but holy fuck give them some goddamn space. They're actually making this a reality. Saying someone has a terrible taste in any form of media is completely disingenous. What if I came up to you and told you that everything you ever liked, from Grand Theft Auto, catch the beat, and NFS games, were completely hot fucking garbage. It would feel terrible, wouldn't it? You wouldn't like that if I personally walked up to you and smacked you upside the head on whatever you enjoyed in your life. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion whether you disagree with them or not.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
GTA 4, girls und panzer, And i frustrated cuz u Dropped far cry 2
and oh yeah,
If u pirate Sleeping dogs even At discounts, then u broke AF
and u can play NFS MW On PS2 Emulator and Dolphin
This thread is a goddamn blessing to have because not only do we, as the audience, get to participate in providing the OP stuff to review in his own time, he gets to provide his own opinion on what he thinks about them. Any other thread could not compete with this level of activity, this level of trust, and this level of honesty. Not only do I believe that this thread is marvelous in its own right because of this generosity, he's doing it for fucking free! And I even managed to pick up a damn game out of it cause it interested me. So this thread is not only helpful and informational, but a very strong piece of writing when it comes to the real world. Patatitta is providing their own feedback on what they find fun and enjoyable, or agonizing and downright terrible to him. If I love a game to death, but he hates it to the very core, that's just opinions! That's how they work! It's a healthy communication, even if it isn't positively received.
Yeah, sure pirating isn't really good in many people's eyes (unless you're pirating adobe products which honestly that's perfectly fine cause adobe fucking sucks nowadays (I'm not saying you should do it, but you have the option)), but when you actively preach about something or lots of things either positively or negatively, you're going to attract the attention of those around you in both influences. Saying something is really good might lead to people buying a product, even if you pirated it. And who knows maybe the person preaching about it might buy a legitimate copy in the future. That's just how sales works, or atleast an indirect way of doing it.
So while Patatitta might have some spicy takes, everything should still be accounted for as an opinion. Just because you like something, doesn't mean it's universally loved. Someone else might hate it, someone might absolutely despise it. And some people don't even want to have it imprinted in their brains. You can't just be selfish and think about yourself when it comes to having thoughts about if one thing is good or bad, you have to understand why someone else would think opposite. Maybe there's a feature that ruins it for someone? Maybe someone really enjoys playing the game in that way? You have to think logically, and connect the dots on the table, because everyone has their own unique flavors and tastes they are trying to accomadate for in their life. Do they like shooters? Open world? Puzzles? Stealth? Adventure even?
Desperately needed to get that off my chest because I can't believe that people can't even have their own opinion, whether it be good or bad. It's almost 2025 and the internet is becoming more of a cesspool because of clashing idealogies, and the mentality of "well if you don't like it you clearly are stupid". Like what the fuck? I can't even tell if you're trolling because your reputation in this sub-forum just makes it look like you popped up out of nowhere and decided to be hostile. Like the reason I'm hostile at times is because I'm just a grumpy old fuck in this "dying" subforum and everyone somehow tolerates me. But I don't overdo it at times because I understand that there are moments that people are actually cool and entertaining and sometimes I just like to goof off. Infact I haven't even been that grumpy in a while. And now it's back. Thanks for that.
shoutout to games made to be played in school but we all know going to itch.io and looking at free browser games is bettersametdze wrote:
play the game ice dodo, its free and its a chrome extension
I don't generally do horror but given as it's so short idk may give it a shot later today. i'm still playing guardian's crusade and that stuff but I can probably fit in 20 minutesemajakolic wrote:
https://2oo2.itch.io/bad-parenting-1
its short as fuck and I wanna hear your opinion on this
sureNyzhenets wrote:
Vivy: Fluorite Eye’s Song (anime)
deniedDuck o-o wrote:
Play style boutique for the ds
Wtf actually whyPatatitta wrote:
deniedDuck o-o wrote:
Play style boutique for the ds
not exactly the type of game I cover in this thread, also, can you even beat that game?, is there a end?Duck o-o wrote:
Wtf actually whyPatatitta wrote:
deniedDuck o-o wrote:
Play style boutique for the ds
Yea, the story bit and unlocking of things endsPatatitta wrote:
not exactly the type of game I cover in this thread, also, can you even beat that game?, is there a end?Duck o-o wrote:
Wtf actually whyPatatitta wrote:
deniedDuck o-o wrote:
Play style boutique for the ds
yeah not doing thatDuck o-o wrote:
Yea, the story bit and unlocking of things endsPatatitta wrote:
not exactly the type of game I cover in this thread, also, can you even beat that game?, is there a end?Duck o-o wrote:
Wtf actually whyPatatitta wrote:
deniedDuck o-o wrote:
Play style boutique for the ds
Then u are free to run the thing and make new fashion or whatever in like sandbox mode
so trueDuck o-o wrote:
Actual fake gamer
Never plays real video games smh
it was already requested and done, please check these things before requestingreffty_gag wrote:
wanna req "Samurai Champloo" (anime, 2004)
I guess I could but that seems like a really weird premiseBehrauder wrote:
https://myanimelist.net/anime.php?id=52193
I just thought that post was way too funnysametdze wrote:
banner of shame, this isn't a request, axis is literally the banner
doing it now since it's like 10 minutes longNuuskamuikkunen wrote:
Rejected (2000 short)
this game?mizu_chuu wrote:
Little Misfortune !!
yup yup !Patatitta wrote:
this game?
will add to the queuemizu_chuu wrote:
yup yup !Patatitta wrote:
this game?
given it's so short I may do it early, added to the queuemizu_chuu wrote:
Also, another request would be the game Cold Front !!
AKIBABehrauder wrote:
https://myanimelist.net/anime.php?id=52193
Akiba Maid Waremajakolic wrote:
AKIBABehrauder wrote:
https://myanimelist.net/anime.php?id=52193
I rated it a 10, but I would actually rate it a 9. Because it's an anime that mixes maids with mafia or something like that, I decided to give it 10, since if it weren't for it, there wouldn't be another anime like it.Patatitta wrote:
emajakolic wrote:
AKIBABehrauder wrote:
https://myanimelist.net/anime.php?id=52193Akiba Maid War
I see you behrauder have given it a 10, it seems like you, emajakolic also enjoys this, and for me personally, it's probably on my bottom 5 anime, excluding the ones i've dropped.
I don't get what you see on this anime, it just feels awful. It's a mafia/yakuza anime except that the yakuza are maid cafes, and it's just complete and utter nosense for the rest of the anime. I get this is also a comedy anime, that it's supposed to feel absurd, but it's not entirerily comedy, the tone of the anime really gets serious past a certain point, and it's those segments I hate the most
One thing is having absurd comedy, another is making the anime up as you goe, and given that this is a anime original, it's no exaggeration. Like really, nothing has more than 1 episode of developement in this anime, if something happens it's either set up on the asme chapter or it's just handled really badly. There really isn't any real plot to this anime either, there isn't any goal they're working for, any real big bad, the anime kinda just ends at a certain point and it's not satisfactory at all.
the characters are also really poorly written. In episode 1 the protagonist signs up for being a maid at a maid cafe, then later sees her coworker literally murder someone in front of her eyes and then has to run out of an armed conflict, this literally causes her PTSD as we have scenes on episode 2 of her seeing like food being cooked and she being reminded of what she saw, and then, when she's about to escape, another character has like a motivational speech where she basically tells her "the outfit is cute tho, you wanted that right", and this somehow convinces her that everything is alright, she stays and her PTSD is healed, she never really questions this reality and way of life ever again in the anime.
And it's just, maid cafes are so, so romanticized in this anime. You would assume that for a anime that has yakuza be maid cafes they would be critical of these, but no, not at all, half the anime is THE GOAL OF A MAID IS MAKIGNG THE MASTER REALLY HAPPY BECAUSE THAT IS OUR LIFE OBJECTIVE AND LOVE WILL RULE OVER ANYTHING ELSE like bro wtf the salary isn't even that good
they're not even cute at all either, it's not a moe anime, so like, what the fuck at this point
A lot of characters are introduced, barely have screentime and then you're expected to care heavily for them. It really falls into a lot of tropes of other animes, like having a episode about them playing baseball but the baseball is wacky that i've already probably seen 3 or 4 times by now
also, like, a lot of the jokes just kinda feel like second hand embarrasement, I can't really say of any gag or anything that has really made me laugh either
This is going to the how could you do this to me tier.
----------------
no more anime to watch
i'm actually close to finishing sleeping dogs
I force myself to give at least a 5 if I have been able to finish it, it honestly may be lower, and there is nothing wrong with enjoying things I don't, as long as you're enjoying things that's good, it's better to have a average score of 8.7 than one of 4.2, also yes, i'm in the minority for hating this anime lolBehrauder wrote:
I rated it a 10, but I would actually rate it a 9. Because it's an anime that mixes maids with mafia or something like that, I decided to give it 10, since if it weren't for it, there wouldn't be another anime like it.Patatitta wrote:
emajakolic wrote:
AKIBABehrauder wrote:
https://myanimelist.net/anime.php?id=52193Akiba Maid War
I see you behrauder have given it a 10, it seems like you, emajakolic also enjoys this, and for me personally, it's probably on my bottom 5 anime, excluding the ones i've dropped.
I don't get what you see on this anime, it just feels awful. It's a mafia/yakuza anime except that the yakuza are maid cafes, and it's just complete and utter nosense for the rest of the anime. I get this is also a comedy anime, that it's supposed to feel absurd, but it's not entirerily comedy, the tone of the anime really gets serious past a certain point, and it's those segments I hate the most
One thing is having absurd comedy, another is making the anime up as you goe, and given that this is a anime original, it's no exaggeration. Like really, nothing has more than 1 episode of developement in this anime, if something happens it's either set up on the asme chapter or it's just handled really badly. There really isn't any real plot to this anime either, there isn't any goal they're working for, any real big bad, the anime kinda just ends at a certain point and it's not satisfactory at all.
the characters are also really poorly written. In episode 1 the protagonist signs up for being a maid at a maid cafe, then later sees her coworker literally murder someone in front of her eyes and then has to run out of an armed conflict, this literally causes her PTSD as we have scenes on episode 2 of her seeing like food being cooked and she being reminded of what she saw, and then, when she's about to escape, another character has like a motivational speech where she basically tells her "the outfit is cute tho, you wanted that right", and this somehow convinces her that everything is alright, she stays and her PTSD is healed, she never really questions this reality and way of life ever again in the anime.
And it's just, maid cafes are so, so romanticized in this anime. You would assume that for a anime that has yakuza be maid cafes they would be critical of these, but no, not at all, half the anime is THE GOAL OF A MAID IS MAKIGNG THE MASTER REALLY HAPPY BECAUSE THAT IS OUR LIFE OBJECTIVE AND LOVE WILL RULE OVER ANYTHING ELSE like bro wtf the salary isn't even that good
they're not even cute at all either, it's not a moe anime, so like, what the fuck at this point
A lot of characters are introduced, barely have screentime and then you're expected to care heavily for them. It really falls into a lot of tropes of other animes, like having a episode about them playing baseball but the baseball is wacky that i've already probably seen 3 or 4 times by now
also, like, a lot of the jokes just kinda feel like second hand embarrasement, I can't really say of any gag or anything that has really made me laugh either
This is going to the how could you do this to me tier.
----------------
no more anime to watch
i'm actually close to finishing sleeping dogs
Anyway, seeing you be so critical about things I've watched makes me question whether I have any sense of criticism at all. I don’t know how to feel about that. Just as it makes me appreciate the things I watch more, it also doesn’t sound like a good thing, I don’t know... my average score on MyAnimeList is 8.69, and a few months ago it was 8.67.
Still, you gave the anime a 5, which is further from 7.59 (the average rating of the anime on MyAnimeList) than the rating I gave it (10, but it would be 9), so I don't know.
I don't even know why I'm making this post, actually.
Just enjoy things, even if the reason for liking them is "I find it cool". No need to look or see Patatitta as some sort of quality media God.Behrauder wrote:
I rated it a 10, but I would actually rate it a 9. Because it's an anime that mixes maids with mafia or something like that, I decided to give it 10, since if it weren't for it, there wouldn't be another anime like it.Patatitta wrote:
emajakolic wrote:
AKIBABehrauder wrote:
https://myanimelist.net/anime.php?id=52193Akiba Maid War
I see you behrauder have given it a 10, it seems like you, emajakolic also enjoys this, and for me personally, it's probably on my bottom 5 anime, excluding the ones i've dropped.
I don't get what you see on this anime, it just feels awful. It's a mafia/yakuza anime except that the yakuza are maid cafes, and it's just complete and utter nosense for the rest of the anime. I get this is also a comedy anime, that it's supposed to feel absurd, but it's not entirerily comedy, the tone of the anime really gets serious past a certain point, and it's those segments I hate the most
One thing is having absurd comedy, another is making the anime up as you goe, and given that this is a anime original, it's no exaggeration. Like really, nothing has more than 1 episode of developement in this anime, if something happens it's either set up on the asme chapter or it's just handled really badly. There really isn't any real plot to this anime either, there isn't any goal they're working for, any real big bad, the anime kinda just ends at a certain point and it's not satisfactory at all.
the characters are also really poorly written. In episode 1 the protagonist signs up for being a maid at a maid cafe, then later sees her coworker literally murder someone in front of her eyes and then has to run out of an armed conflict, this literally causes her PTSD as we have scenes on episode 2 of her seeing like food being cooked and she being reminded of what she saw, and then, when she's about to escape, another character has like a motivational speech where she basically tells her "the outfit is cute tho, you wanted that right", and this somehow convinces her that everything is alright, she stays and her PTSD is healed, she never really questions this reality and way of life ever again in the anime.
And it's just, maid cafes are so, so romanticized in this anime. You would assume that for a anime that has yakuza be maid cafes they would be critical of these, but no, not at all, half the anime is THE GOAL OF A MAID IS MAKIGNG THE MASTER REALLY HAPPY BECAUSE THAT IS OUR LIFE OBJECTIVE AND LOVE WILL RULE OVER ANYTHING ELSE like bro wtf the salary isn't even that good
they're not even cute at all either, it's not a moe anime, so like, what the fuck at this point
A lot of characters are introduced, barely have screentime and then you're expected to care heavily for them. It really falls into a lot of tropes of other animes, like having a episode about them playing baseball but the baseball is wacky that i've already probably seen 3 or 4 times by now
also, like, a lot of the jokes just kinda feel like second hand embarrasement, I can't really say of any gag or anything that has really made me laugh either
This is going to the how could you do this to me tier.
----------------
no more anime to watch
i'm actually close to finishing sleeping dogs
Anyway, seeing you be so critical about things I've watched makes me question whether I have any sense of criticism at all. I don’t know how to feel about that. Just as it makes me appreciate the things I watch more, it also doesn’t sound like a good thing, I don’t know... my average score on MyAnimeList is 8.69, and a few months ago it was 8.67.
Still, you gave the anime a 5, which is further from 7.59 (the average rating of the anime on MyAnimeList) than the rating I gave it (10, but it would be 9), so I don't know.
I don't even know why I'm making this post, actually.
It isn't that bad compared to NFS Underground 1. Only Earl is a weird.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
good luck with the rubberbanding
yeah, but if theres a heavy trafficsWinnyace wrote:
It isn't that bad compared to NFS Underground 1. Only Earl is a weird.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
good luck with the rubberbanding
The game really isn't that hard, still.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
yeah, but if theres a heavy trafficsWinnyace wrote:
It isn't that bad compared to NFS Underground 1. Only Earl is a weird.AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
good luck with the rubberbanding
mario kart/initial d arcade stage 5AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
mmh, ok, whats is your fav/go to car in the game, and what do you think about the soundtrack?
only starting level 4 tho, you can beat police level 1-3 by driving below the speed limit, i've tested itWinnyace wrote:
The cop chases are frankly the best part of this game and its main selling point. I do agree that they're kind of janky and the forced challenges are annoying, but the chases itself are, in my opinion, interesting and dynamic.
i meant the in game licensed car one, not the game onePatatitta wrote:
mario kart/initial d arcade stage 5AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
mmh, ok, whats is your fav/go to car in the game, and what do you think about the soundtrack?
oh, my bad, I read it as fav car game, I don't really have any preferences, the one that had better stats at that point in the gameAxisPraxisMDS wrote:
i meant the in game licensed car one, not the game onePatatitta wrote:
mario kart/initial d arcade stage 5AxisPraxisMDS wrote:
mmh, ok, whats is your fav/go to car in the game, and what do you think about the soundtrack?
Yes. I would say starting at Level 3, they become aggro and fun.Patatitta wrote:
only starting level 4 tho, you can beat police level 1-3 by driving below the speed limit, i've tested itWinnyace wrote:
The cop chases are frankly the best part of this game and its main selling point. I do agree that they're kind of janky and the forced challenges are annoying, but the chases itself are, in my opinion, interesting and dynamic.
ah, level three!!! i mean i could enjoy lots of things about the earlier heat levels but it was not nearly as dynamic as it would become after the suv was introduced to the police force during gameplay! i loved those chases so much... i remember playing specifically for that for hours, idk how long my longest chases were but it was a sweet faded memory from a more innocent childhood (...well, not exactly...)Winnyace wrote:
Yes. I would say starting at Level 3, they become aggro and fun.Patatitta wrote:
only starting level 4 tho, you can beat police level 1-3 by driving below the speed limit, i've tested itWinnyace wrote:
The cop chases are frankly the best part of this game and its main selling point. I do agree that they're kind of janky and the forced challenges are annoying, but the chases itself are, in my opinion, interesting and dynamic.
noYmir wrote:
I know you've already mentioned how you're able to organise all this, but don't you get burnt out from consuming so much every day? Isn't there ever a moment where you can't really be fucked doing something requested in this thread?
tismYmir wrote:
I know you've already mentioned how you're able to organise all this, but don't you get burnt out from consuming so much every day? Isn't there ever a moment where you can't really be fucked doing something requested in this thread?
I don't think i'm doing autodestructKarmine wrote:
Games:
Auto Destruct
Cyberpunk 2077
Anime:
Hellsing Ultimate
oh i remember this one...! im glad to see its still meaningful to someone, it was neat :> i think i primarily loved the artstyle and the characters and their interpersonal dynamics, this had crazy good sense of art direction honestly from everything to backgrounds and color palettes and ui, it was satisfyingly sentimental and winnie & augustine were easy enough to sympathize with as more was revealedPatatitta wrote:
Cold Front
Short itch.io VN, it has a 2.5D perspective and a little bit of movement sometimes but it is a VN; at a more technical level there are some flaws, I had some lag spikes when I shouldn't have given the game is a VN and some sounds looped with the moment they looped being very apparent, howerver that didn't affect my enjoyement of the game too much
I really don't have much to say about this game, it's kinda cute which is what you expect from this type of game, the art is good (the author 100% draws yaoi), as I said very short, took me less than an hour to beat, while it has some horror elements that try to be psychological, the game isn't really about thinking, as everything is explained by the end, no room for interpretation, I think this is a good move as the game is much more focused on the feelings
not the best itch.io VN i've played but this was enjoyable
Placed in C tier
Press F for the weird car action game.Patatitta wrote:
I don't think i'm doing autodestructKarmine wrote:
Games:
Auto Destruct
Cyberpunk 2077
Anime:
Hellsing Ultimate
I will try cyberpunk
hellsing will do, but I will take a while since i'm in the process of watching all of psycho-pass and that is going to take a little while