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awp
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awp
Gloss is a step in the wrong direction. Make it look rougher, maybe. Might need to rely on the textures, but here's a thought:

for the pink bangs, make them thinner. Right now they're pretty circular like "O" but maybe they should be closer to "=". Might help.

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Loginer
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Loginer
I have made the bangs thinner (Although you really can't notice it from the front), and improved their mapping coordinates. I've also increased the contrast on the textures. How's this?

awp
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It looks better than it did before imo; how does it look from a more intended resolution?

Loginer
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The face will be seen up close when you're about to fail, I assume, but anyway. Massive difference.

adamskii_uk
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adamskii_uk
Looking good so far. :)
ShaggoN
689 posts
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ShaggoN
Very nice :) .
Rolled
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Rolled
360 degrees shots pls?
Loginer
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Rolled
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Rolled
Well.. I guess that works :P I just wanted back/front/sides.
awp
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awp
Belt buckle's a tad small and something about the shape of the upper torso doesn't quite sit right with me, but I can't pinpoint it. She might be a little too thin, as well.
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awp
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Yeah, they actually ARE longer than the gloves in my avatar. How the fuck did I screw that one up
Loginer
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Loginer
How about halfway up the forearm?

awp wrote:

Belt buckle's a tad small and something about the shape of the upper torso doesn't quite sit right with me, but I can't pinpoint it. She might be a little too thin, as well.
Well, her back is flat. I should probably fix that too. I don't think she's too thin, though; Making the torso thicker than the thigh would just look weird.
awp
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awp
No, like, depth thin. Like the end of Saw V thin. As if she were standing straight and her front and back were compressed together by a trash compactor sort of thin.

Re: gloves - they go about 3/4 of the forearm. One second...

http://up.ppy.sh/files/pippigloveexample.jpg - about that
Loginer
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Here's the latest version (Sorry for the delay, I blame the cold I caught). I don't know if I've fixed the flatness, but it's definitely better than the last one. Ignore the weird-looking shoes in the back view, I already fixed that problem.
Also, does anyone think stages would be a good idea?





Rolled
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Rolled
Her thigh is about as thick as her calf. Calves could use a bit thinning down. Maybe even the thighs a bit, as well.

Also may I ask whats up with the shoes?

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RemmyX25
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Rolled wrote:

Also may I ask whats up with the shoes?
asking as well.

They look like rocket boosters or something imo.
awp
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awp

Rolled wrote:

Also may I ask whats up with the shoes?
The profile on the boots is too low. It just looks a bit like thick socks with platform-soles; it wouldn't take much to fix.

My biggest issue is with the eyes and the overall shape of the face. Given how flat it is (absence of cheekbones is one major player in this) the face looks almost alien, like those classic huge-black-eyed-bald-with-very-round-head type aliens. Seriously, the eyes are still a bit dark and not vibrant enough. Don't make me hotlink my avatar again >=(
Starrodkirby86
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awp wrote:

Rolled wrote:

Also may I ask whats up with the shoes?
My biggest issue is with the eyes and the overall shape of the face. Given how flat it is (absence of cheekbones is one major player in this) the face looks almost alien, like those classic huge-black-eyed-bald-with-very-round-head type aliens. Seriously, the eyes are still a bit dark and not vibrant enough. Don't make me hotlink my avatar again >=(
I concur with this. I thought this was supposed to be a specific style you were aiming for Loginer, but apparently if someone is complaining about it I might as well too.

Oh, and where's the ears...?

Nevertheless that's a really nice model you have. :)
RemmyX25
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Starrodkirby86 wrote:

Oh, and where's the ears...?
Behind the hair, don't you see them? :P
Loginer
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I've thinned the calves down slightly, and I've improved the boots.
I've also added some cheekbones. I'll improve them if necessary, but do they give the face more depth or not?



awp
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awp
Every little bit brings it closer and closer. That might be pronounced enough; it's a bit hard to tell from just one view, and with the texturing incomplete.
LuigiHann
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awp
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awp

LuigiHann wrote:

I think once you give her a mouth, she'll look like a person, and people won't nitpick the face as much.
Oh, don't misunderestimate me~

LuigiHann wrote:

As for the boots, the soles should be more solid; right now it looks like each boot is sitting on two discs. Something like this would look better, I think. http://www.whitesboots.com/assets/img/categories/boots.jpg
Those boots are a pretty good example, actually. At first I was like "well, not quite" but then I looked at it again and went "oh yes".
Loginer
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LuigiHann wrote:

As for the boots, the soles should be more solid; right now it looks like each boot is sitting on two discs.
If you mean the soles being too "round" at the bottom, I think I've solved the problem. Or is it something else?
And here's another face render. Guess I have to "focus" the cheekbones more.



LuigiHann
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lukewarmholiday
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lukewarmholiday
face is too triangular, flat and doesn't have much definition whatsoever, adding a mouth wont change those problems and people will still nitpick the face.

I'm about to just draw what I think would fix it since I'm terrible at describing. the hair also doesn't cover enough of the head. but i think you already mentioned that needed to be fixed. One immediate thing I noticed was the chin. In fact I think ill just bring up the original picture.



The chin doesn't start closing until below the eyes.

From what i've seen from more accomplished modelers is that they try to form the body right from a profile view, then they try to make it look correct from a side view and then clean it up.(but this process would require a profile pic and a side view pic)

I really hated making this post because I have next to 0 experience with 3D modeling.
Loginer
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LuigiHann wrote:

You fixed one issue with the boots, but not the main problem I have. Hope this illustrates it a bit better.

Look at the bottom of any pair of shoes or boots. The sole is all one piece, even though it's thickest at the heel.
Ah, now I get it. Should be easy to add.

lukewarmholiday wrote:

face is too triangular, flat and doesn't have much definition whatsoever, adding a mouth wont change those problems and people will still nitpick the face.

I'm about to just draw what I think would fix it since I'm terrible at describing. the hair also doesn't cover enough of the head. but i think you already mentioned that needed to be fixed. One immediate thing I noticed was the chin. In fact I think ill just bring up the original picture.

Img

The chin doesn't start closing until below the eyes.

From what i've seen from more accomplished modelers is that they try to form the body right from a profile view, then they try to make it look correct from a side view and then clean it up.(but this process would require a profile pic and a side view pic)

I really hated making this post because I have next to 0 experience with 3D modeling.
The face only looks like it's flat because of the lighting, and I'm working on the definition. I'll see what I can do with the chin, though. And yes, I know about modeling stuff that way, but no one was up for the job of drawing references back when I started modeling Pippi.
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awp
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I drew Pippi from the shoulders up twice in the last month at face view and side view
Loginer
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I don't think it would be very useful now, though.
awp
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awp
It's never too late~
Echo
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I didn't read all the posts, but if no one has pointed this out before I think her head is too small. Isn't a human head ~1/4 - 1/5 the height?
ViscoS_old
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NCDyson
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NCDyson
A friend of mine who knows Sarumaru said he's been pretty busy these last few months.

When you get as far as rigging and animating her, you should totally do a video of her dancing...
I wanna see her shake her groove thing :)
Loginer
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I've updated the shape of the head slightly. This is what the head would look like if it was 1/4 of the height (it is currently 1/6, and let's pretend the neck is a little longer than it is). I think it's too large.

While we're at it, this is what the head would look like in a nightmare.

Oh, and I fixed the shoes.
Rolled
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Rolled
Personally, I think the bigger head looks amazing. Sure it may not be very anatomically correct, but it really pulls it all together imo. It's just when the head was smaller it seemed like something was missing, and a lot of that was filled imo when you made it larger.

Also, boots look much better. Legs look much better. Everything really went a step up.

edit: shoes do look better, but I think the bridge from heel to toe can be brough down a bit further.
Starrodkirby86
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Last edited by Starrodkirby86 , edited 1 time in total.
devkit4384
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great improvements
Last edited by devkit4384 , edited 1 time in total.
Loginer
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I've resized the head properly, new picture below. Should I make the scarf bigger or not?

Starrodkirby86 wrote:

But looking at the drawing over there, it doesn't seem the buttons should be that large.
Fixed.

Starrodkirby86 wrote:

EDIT: Curiosity question. I noticed in the Saramaru drawing and in the Catch the Beat picture Pippi has a cleavage at where the star is on her chest. Though there's other images of her (Most notably the famous chibi of her I think and your model) with the cleavage not apparent and no skin showing at the star area...I never been long enough to see the creation of her so I'm a bit confused with this matter. Regardless, nice model...nice model...
The star was originally supposed to have a hole in the middle, but that was removed from the design at some point. The hole on the CtB Pippi is not supposed to be there.

devkit4384 wrote:

with the release of my updated oto2 theme i give you:
*combo.png*
That reminds me: You'll be able to modify Pippi's textures.

lukewarmholiday
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lukewarmholiday
Nice job
LuigiHann
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I think the head is a leeeetle too big, can you make it halfway between what it is now and what it was before?

Nah nevermind it's cool
awp
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awp
I thought the big-headed one was a joke, and it's nice to see it toned down a bit, but I feel you could do with another 5% or 10% smaller. Star on her chest is a tad too low. The top point of the star should almost reach the scarf. Also there are little osu buttons on her gloves - they should probably be modeled rather than textured on. And, of course, I'd still like to see the belt as a modeled piece - right now it just looks like an osu! button pinned onto a skirt.
awp
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Just out of curiosity, how would the eyes look when attempting to emulate the more cartoony look of the chibi?

http://up.ppy.sh/files/pippieyel.png
http://up.ppy.sh/files/pippieyer.png
Loginer
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LuigiHann
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Old eyes were better
awp
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She looks possessed by a devil like that. If the cartoon shader can't save it, nothing can. Well, thanks.

I still think the current eyes need a bit of livening up though.
Eschubertsson
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Eschubertsson
i argee it is kinda wierd eyes
Loofah_old
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Loofah_old
The head could do to be a bit smaller.Maybe only a teensy bit bigger than the old head, plus, when it's in a t-pose shouldn't it face forward instead of up a little?

that or you could increase the size of here limbs.

Loginer
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Loofah wrote:

The head could do to be a bit smaller.Maybe only a teensy bit bigger than the old head, plus, when it's in a t-pose shouldn't it face forward instead of up a little?

that or you could increase the size of here limbs.
The majority of the community seem to like the head like this, so no. And the head might as well face to the right, it won't matter in the end when I apply a biped. Fun fact: The legs are pointing forward by about 10 degrees.
Rolled
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Rolled
I was checking out some 3ds max videos on youtube (you use that, right?) and I came accross this mario model and the eyes look rather amazing in it. Mario's eyes are pretty similar to pippi's eyes (if you use the chibi ones) so is it at all possible to use the same technique that the mario model has when referring to the eyes? Make the head model cave in a bit where the eye sockets are, that is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvAM-ijXr9g
Loginer
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It's not that simple. The face is too low-poly to add details like those without messing up the shading really badly, and adding more lines is a pain in the ass due to how the head is connected to the body. MeshSmooth and it's fetish for ruining shapes doesn't make anything easier, either. Just figuring out a way to add a nose without screwing up the shading too much took quite a while. Also, the eyes are separate objects in that video.
I hate MeshSmooth.
Loginer
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LuigiHann
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I don't think she needs a stage.
Loginer
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I'm too tired to improve the physique any further right now, so here's what I've done so far. I know the belt is screwed up, that's easily fixable. I know the star is screwed up, that's easily fixable. I know the hands are horrible, and I guess I'll have to remake them. D:

Rolled
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Rolled
Great pippi pose but man, it really makes me notice how much that head just doesn't feel like Pippi :/

This post is not constructive in the least bit. I apologize :(
RemmyX25
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Rolled wrote:

Great pippi pose but man, it really makes me notice how much that head just doesn't feel like Pippi :/

This post is not constructive in the least bit. I apologize :(
No, I actually agree with you about the head. It feels too.... round? I don't know. But yea, she really doesnt have a Pippi feeling to her...
Loginer
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*looks at hand* ...I seriously need to study more anatomy.
Anyway, I could try to remake the head. The new head would have real eyes, a real mouth, less flatness, a better shape, and much better hair. Would that do the trick?
Rolled
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Rolled
I will tell you as soon as I see it.

Why is no artisticly talented people helping you with models around here. front/back/side of pippi head pls.
awp
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Loginer
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Rolled
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Rolled
Also, regarding the hands:

Palm smaller, especially since pippi is young (forget exact age.) It could probably be about half of that current size. When looking at the hand as a whole, half of the makeup should be the palm and half fingers. If the palm size is halved, fingers could probably stay the same length. However the thumb should really be sized down and made a bit thinner around the bottom half.

Here you go:



In that picture take note of how the thumb sprouts away from te palm, and how the little bit of area connecting the thumb to the wrist bellows out a bit. Pippi's hand almost caves in.
Loginer
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Rolled wrote:

stuff
I've already fixed the hand, but thanks.
Fraeon
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Loginer wrote:

Rolled wrote:

stuff
I've already fixed the hand, but thanks.
pix or it din't hapen
awp
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Download: ATC - Around The World (Tonoicutzu) [miss_dior's Normal].osu
Loginer
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...That's not going to be very useful, I'm afraid. I'm after something like this:

Fraeon wrote:

Loginer wrote:

Rolled wrote:

stuff
I've already fixed the hand, but thanks.
pix or it din't hapen

I can shorten the fingers/palm and rotate the thumb a bit if that's necessary, but there's nothing I can do about the flatness. Either way, I've fixed the biggest problem: The general shape of the palm. <.<

Saturos
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So is this the back of her right hand or the palm of her left? Thumb needs to move inward/outward, either way. Index is too long, ring is too short. Index/ring should be roughly the same size, both being only sliiiiiiiightly smaller than the bird. The wrist could also use a tweak inward so it's not just a straight dive into the pinky finger.

Kinda minor details considering the size that this will be visible in play at, though.
LuigiHann
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Any reason why you'd need Pippi-specific reference images? Just go find some generic anime girl reference from some "how to draw manga" type sites.
awp
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Loginer wrote:

...That's not going to be very useful, I'm afraid. I'm after something like this:
...
Yeah I'm definitely not the person you'd want to get anatomy references from, trust me
CheeseWarlock
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awp wrote:

Yeah I'm definitely not the person you'd want to get anatomy references from, trust me
I dunno, you seem like the type of person who'd have a detailed knowledge of female anatomy, what with your large collection of reference pictures...

The hand still looks a little bit flipper-like to me. A bit too long. The model's looking pretty good now, except for the face. Which has been the tough part all along, but it's just not looking like Pippi. Not sure if it needs to be completely remade, but that could work too.
LuigiHann
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Don't worry about it "not looking like Pippi." This will be Pippi.
awp
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Not if it doesn't look like her >=|
devkit4384
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awp your avatar..........
........please explain this situation
awp
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awp

devkit4384 wrote:

awp your avatar..........
........please explain this situation
Is there something to explain?
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awp
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neo@lex wrote:

God dammit awp.
I thought you were against :pookie: avatars >.>
Are you kidding? That's why I started the James fan club

But oh~ our little Pippi is all grown up~
Loginer
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Sorry for the lack of updates, I blame real life. Anyway, here's the fixed hand. Now, for the head.
(it's the palm of her left hand, BTW)

Echo
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The thumb is fine but the fingers aren't quite right imo... stick your left hand up to the monitor and you'll see what I mean. It's especially obvious with the pinky.
Loginer
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Echo
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No, I mean the palm is too long... my hand looks more like this:

Loginer
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There, shortened the palm slightly and moved the pinky.

And this is how big it's going to be in-game at 1280*960.


awp
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Loginer
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Fixed?

Rolled
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yes ^____^
Loginer
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Great. :D

Here's my progress on the new head so far. I won't be able to model anything for a few days, but I'll try to finish it before Christmas Eve.

awp
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Keep in mind: the head is approximately twice as tall as it is wide. Use of eye-sockets is yay.
Loginer
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I'll make sure to remember that.

Also, remember when you said the general anatomy on this felt "a bit odd"? Good times.
awp
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Baby steps.

It must feel good to know that I'm always going to pick something apart with each new render. One at a time.

Baby steps.
Loginer
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New pic, sorry about the delay. You may now rant about everything but the shape of the nose, shading/smoothing problems and the lack of textures on the eyes.

Saturos
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I tried to think of something to say but all I could do was make a disgusted face.

EDIT: Pic related.

Starrodkirby86
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Yay Andross. :D

I don't know what I really have to say at the moment, but it's pretty hard for me to criticize if there's no eyes...Looks a little dead without them. :P

Though one thing that I should suggest is to change the hair...it looks a little like toothpaste or something tube-like, but eh, we'll see what the more experienced Pippi lovers will say.

Cool job, Loginer.
Loginer
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Yeah, the hair is a bit round. The bangs are also awful, but I think I know how to fix them.
Loginer
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New pic. The shading is still awful, but I've modified and remade a few things. I'm also using awp's demon eyes, since Loofah's irides are cut off.

Rolled
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Am i allowed to rant about the boxiness of her face?
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Lt Morke
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Its...uh...Playdoughey.
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Loginer
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Give me the largest version you have.
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Joined September 2008
Loofah_old


that's the original size, if you need any other textures done just tell me.
awp
osu! Alumni
11,869 posts
Here since the beginning
awp
This map has been deleted on the request of its creator. It is no longer available.
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