What im interested in is knowing what makes you say she's gonna flip town.
forum
Newbie Game 15: Rise From The Ashes [Game over!]
posted
Total Posts
1,196
Because time is running low
I have a feeling she's just playing regular jess?
Either way if she flips scum or town, you can't really link her to anyone else lol
her scumbuddy probably won't even defend her
Either way if she flips scum or town, you can't really link her to anyone else lol
her scumbuddy probably won't even defend her
Also im gonna drop my pursuit of Hika in favor of cohesion, i did notice some differences in her play in Lovers mafia, i just dont understand why people think she townslipped, but since a lot of my townreads (Frosty, B1rd, rEdo) seem to think so i'll let it go as im starting to feel like im beating a dead horse here. But if she does turn up being scum, expect a word of "I told you so!" from me at endgame.
This puts me in here:
Town:
rEdo
B1rd ^
Frostings ^
Leaning Town:
beeboy V
Hika ^
Leftovers:
abraker
Jess
(the arrows just indicate changes across my reads from their last position)
If Jess is town then im going wrong somewhere.
This puts me in here:
Town:
rEdo
B1rd ^
Frostings ^
Leaning Town:
beeboy V
Hika ^
Leftovers:
abraker
Jess
(the arrows just indicate changes across my reads from their last position)
If Jess is town then im going wrong somewhere.
That self-vote thing triggered me to thinking she's frustrated that we scumread her so she self-voted.Sakura wrote:
What im interested in is knowing what makes you say she's gonna flip town.
Do you have reasons to believe she wouldnt do this as scum?rEdo wrote:
That self-vote thing triggered me to thinking she's frustrated that we scumread her so she self-voted.Sakura wrote:
What im interested in is knowing what makes you say she's gonna flip town.
I don't want to be mean, but to be honest I don't believe she's intelligent enough to pull that off xdSakura wrote:
Do you have reasons to believe she wouldnt do this as scum?
She's basically done 3 pro-scum actions:
1) Hammering a player without letting them claim.
2) Self-voting which muddles VCA and if town, she's literally voting the only player that is conftown to her (herself)
3) Not contributing anything overall.
Sure, 2 could have been caused by frustration, but it's Jess we're talking about.
1) Hammering a player without letting them claim.
2) Self-voting which muddles VCA and if town, she's literally voting the only player that is conftown to her (herself)
3) Not contributing anything overall.
Sure, 2 could have been caused by frustration, but it's Jess we're talking about.
I mean as far as i recall, she's done the self voting thing before, why wouldnt it become a scum tactic.
Now let's assume for the sake of argument that you're right and she's town.
What happens then if we mislynch today, even if scum dont pull a lynch on her at XyLo, im worried she'll vote wrong, i mean, she already did it D1 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Now let's assume for the sake of argument that you're right and she's town.
What happens then if we mislynch today, even if scum dont pull a lynch on her at XyLo, im worried she'll vote wrong, i mean, she already did it D1 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
While we do have time, why do you two have a town read on Frostings? I had a scum read on him before, and I haven't analysed frosty's recent posts, but him being scum is still a possibility IMO.
Dude frosty scum is soooo possible.
Everything is always a possibility, I just think the chances are very unlikely. And my read on him comes entirely from Experience, specially coz i've been in his crosshairs several times in the past on games.B1rd wrote:
While we do have time, why do you two have a town read on Frostings? I had a scum read on him before, and I haven't analysed frosty's recent posts, but him being scum is still a possibility IMO.
Also, it's just jess, Sakura. If she turns out town, whoops.
If not then okay; we will just figure something out.
If not then okay; we will just figure something out.
Literally the only reason for people to say she's town is
"OMG SHE SELF VOTED SHE'S SO TOTES FRUSTRATED AND TOWN"
I know the deal trust me, it's a strategy i used to use too, and no it shouldn't be encouraged.
"OMG SHE SELF VOTED SHE'S SO TOTES FRUSTRATED AND TOWN"
I know the deal trust me, it's a strategy i used to use too, and no it shouldn't be encouraged.
Your defence of him including experience is starting to be a weak arguements for me. More the reason a fellow scum is protecting scum. Like you seem too defensive of him.Sakura wrote:
Everything is always a possibility, I just think the chances are very unlikely. And my read on him comes entirely from Experience, specially coz i've been in his crosshairs several times in the past on games.B1rd wrote:
While we do have time, why do you two have a town read on Frostings? I had a scum read on him before, and I haven't analysed frosty's recent posts, but him being scum is still a possibility IMO.
If Jess flips town, you are and Frosty will be in my watch list
We've been on your watch list for a while. What's new?abraker wrote:
If Jess flips town, you are and Frosty will be in my watch list
To be clear, it's as if the subtle mentioning of "Frosty might be scum" sets off a "I know he's not from experience" trigger
It's starting to wet off red flags for me
*set
I mean i have a hard time explaining my townread on Frosty
Just like people have a hard time explaining why they think Jess will flip town from the self vote despite it being null at best.
Havent you ever heard about gut?
Just like people have a hard time explaining why they think Jess will flip town from the self vote despite it being null at best.
Havent you ever heard about gut?
I play gut only on first day when there is nothing to go by. I will need find something that doesn't exist if you want me to play by "gut".
Failure to explain something leads to suspicion
Failure to explain something leads to suspicion
A subtle mentioning?abraker wrote:
To be clear, it's as if the subtle mentioning of "Frosty might be scum" sets off a "I know he's not from experience" trigger
Is this subtle to you?:
B1rd wrote:
While we do have time, why do you two have a town read on Frostings? I had a scum read on him before, and I haven't analysed frosty's recent posts, but him being scum is still a possibility IMO.
Sure, but you're not going to impress anyone else with contradicting reads with your only reasoning being your "gut feeling".
Lol. I read that in the thread you linked and I was thinking of quoting it myself.Sakura wrote:
Literally the only reason for people to say she's town is
"OMG SHE SELF VOTED SHE'S SO TOTES FRUSTRATED AND TOWN"
I know the deal trust me, it's a strategy i used to use too, and no it shouldn't be encouraged.
"Subtle"
I will admit, you can now see how I can easily dismiss things as something lesser and prioritize things that are that align with the pile of coincidences I have found. To be clear though coincidence =/= fact, but it is my digging grounds for facts
I will admit, you can now see how I can easily dismiss things as something lesser and prioritize things that are that align with the pile of coincidences I have found. To be clear though coincidence =/= fact, but it is my digging grounds for facts
My gut comes from direct play experience with Frosty, i can try and explain it but im not very good at explaining feelings.
You're saying i went and said that he's town from experience at the lightest subtle suspicion.abraker wrote:
"Subtle"
I will admit, you can now see how I can easily dismiss things as something lesser and prioritize things that are that align with the pile of coincidences I have found. To be clear though coincidence =/= fact, but it is my digging grounds for facts
But that's not true, I was asked a direct question.
Well I think frostings is actually scum from experience.
He's not pulling his "I know I'm town" strings like he usually does.
He's not pulling his "I know I'm town" strings like he usually does.
My theory right now is Frosty+Sakura scum. My agenda right now is to find any coincidences that align with that theory and hopefully stumble upon a fact that may prove or disprove this theory.Sakura wrote:
You're saying i went and said that he's town from experience at the lightest subtle suspicion.abraker wrote:
"Subtle"
I will admit, you can now see how I can easily dismiss things as something lesser and prioritize things that are that align with the pile of coincidences I have found. To be clear though coincidence =/= fact, but it is my digging grounds for facts
But that's not true, I was asked a direct question.
Not exactly, Frosty hates playing as scum.
At game start the way he went after you and Dawn reminds me a lot of how he went after me in Madoka, and idk, i feel like he'd be like more lost and confused instead of straightforward if he was scum.
At game start the way he went after you and Dawn reminds me a lot of how he went after me in Madoka, and idk, i feel like he'd be like more lost and confused instead of straightforward if he was scum.
I can buy lost and confused but you can act list and confused as scum as well.
As I said before I strictly ignore the "x wouldn't act like y" claims. Those are nothing to me unless you prove why "x would or would not act like y"
As I said before I strictly ignore the "x wouldn't act like y" claims. Those are nothing to me unless you prove why "x would or would not act like y"
For starters he was the first one to mention you could be faking your confusion and then he also was the first one to mention you had townslipped instead, i find it hard to see him doing either of those 2 things as scum.
Ahhh
Sakura please quote.
Sakura please quote.
idk who you are talking to
Hey now... Usually I have a pretty good idea what's going onSakura wrote:
idk, i feel like he'd be like more lost and confused instead of straightforward if he was scum.
At least I like to think that
I was talking to Hika but here are the relevant quotes:
Same with his push on Dawnsday D1.
Frostings wrote:
Hello
I don't know if I'm reading this correctly, but it seems like abraker and B1rd are suspicious of me because they think I have some secret motive or psychology with my votes and reads, but I can't even understand your explanations for my actions let alone come up with them
Hika reminds me of Irre in I think the Tree house game where he acted like he had no idea what was going on. I don't really believe her when she says the setup is confusing, and since Dawn flipped town I think she's still pretty suspicious. The VT claim doesn't help at all.. It looks like she's trying to rack up town points by claiming early, when we already know everybody who's town is VT after rEdo's claim
Jess.. uhhh in the back of my mind I had a feeling she would lynch early. I should have unvoted to get a claim at least but she hammered earlier than I expected. Her action isn't really a tell, but I would be content with a PL to save us headache later
As for the others, I'll have to read the posts again, I just had a quick skim over all the posts
Long story short i have a hard time seeing Frosty pulling this off as scum.Frostings wrote:
So... Hika thought there was only one VT in the game? Even after Tracker got flipped?
... It's actually a pretty convincing townslip, how can you even make this up as scum
Same with his push on Dawnsday D1.
He's still being a little confusing though. His post seem ambiguous and the way he's playing has to be alignment indicative.
I mean saying something like "I'm town" is way more fakeable than the way he approaches the game.
How can you even be using that as a meta tell.
It's just a usual indicator for me that Frostings is town if:
1. Straightforward and doesn't change mindset, regardless of whole town perspective.
2. Always says "but I'm VT, but I'm VT" when he's town.
Number 1 always being the biggest indicator.
1. Straightforward and doesn't change mindset, regardless of whole town perspective.
2. Always says "but I'm VT, but I'm VT" when he's town.
Number 1 always being the biggest indicator.
Frosty also just prevented Hika lynch after being on about her being scum since D1. What kind of scum does that (unless Hika's scum)
He could be scum keeping me alive for WIFOM.
He also jumped in to defend Hika after my Wall post:
If anything im more surprised Hika's scumreading him after this than if anyone else is.Frostings wrote:
I actually don't think Hika could make this up as scum
it doesn't really make sense to claim VT as scum on Day 1 and then push that onto Day 2 to try to "CC" a claimed BP in an open setup, especially after the Tracker flip
It's a pretty believable townslip, I'd be really really surprised if Hika flipped scum
But I already stated that earlier on, I think.
That's why I claimed myself the first time around and made sure I did so scum wouldn't use me for that purpose.
That's why I claimed myself the first time around and made sure I did so scum wouldn't use me for that purpose.
Is this really all you got to say about it?Hika wrote:
He could be scum keeping me alive for WIFOM.
I don't care if he defended me. Someone defending me does not make them automatically town in my eyes. their play is more important to me than me securing a townread in everyone else's reads.
No, because you could be doing the same thing too.Sakura wrote:
Is this really all you got to say about it?Hika wrote:
He could be scum keeping me alive for WIFOM.
I won't know until D3, if I'm alive or not lol
So basically you're implying thatHika wrote:
I don't care if he defended me. Someone defending me does not make them automatically town in my eyes. their play is more important to me than me securing a townread in everyone else's reads.
Scum Frosty decided to ignore an open road to a mislynch that would make a towny look bad, in favor of WIFOM?
I really have a hard time believing that and it feels more like you're trying to scramble for reasons to lynch him, but hey, apparently your supposed townslip means i shouldn't pursue you anymore right? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I'm not even gonna be mad if i lose when you're scum at this point.
Are you referring to him pushing a D1 lynch or D2 lynch?
D2
Hold on, I'll reply to you after I reread his ISO because I'm not sure what you mean.
+ I've been at the doctor for an hour and finally got a room wtf yay
The momment you posted this:
This post signifies 2 things
Either you're scum that is trying to scramble for reasons to scumread Frosty.
Or you're town so deep in confbias that you cant think of anything else of why he would be scum, but just WANT him to be scum.
You already revealed your true motives.Hika wrote:
He could be scum keeping me alive for WIFOM.
This post signifies 2 things
Either you're scum that is trying to scramble for reasons to scumread Frosty.
Or you're town so deep in confbias that you cant think of anything else of why he would be scum, but just WANT him to be scum.
I think you might be looking too hard into it, actually
Because afaik, you just said on the last page that Frosty is town because GUT FEELING.
Yeah and i explained where that gut feeling came from.
Too bad your little mislynch vanished into thin air huh
Unvote
Vote: Hika
Literally dont care why everyone thinks she townslipped at this point.
She just went from looking for any reason to scumread Frosty to trying to discredit me.
This is scum.
Wow, that's bold. Sakura, she's been doing that to pretty much everyone who's been suspicious of her at slightest, as far as I have seen, ourselves included. Do you imply this is a bold scum move?
Eh, I'm not gonna question it because I'm town.
She was my scum read anyway lel
She was my scum read anyway lel
No you're not
You're my conf townread
Hika wrote:
bboy + frosty
or bboy + Jess
are my corrected scumteam reads.
?????????????????????????????Hika wrote:
Eh, I'm not gonna question it because I'm town.
She was my scum read anyway lel
bboy frosty Sakura
Why abraker isn't included on this list? Why do you want to lynch Jess?
Sakura because she tried to defend frosty not being scum.
Bboy because I have no idea wtf he's on about.
Frosty because he's flopping his reads too much. This can be applied to Sakura too.
Bboy because I have no idea wtf he's on about.
Frosty because he's flopping his reads too much. This can be applied to Sakura too.
abraker not on my list because he interrogated me D1 and I believe he doing his best to scumhunt.
Jess I'm willing to lynch bc she is anti town.
Jess I'm willing to lynch bc she is anti town.
I'll let myself use the red color to respond to this.
Hika wrote:
Sakura because she tried to defend frosty not being scum. Is that really a scumtell that you don't agree with somebody?
Bboy because I have no idea wtf he's on about.
Frosty because he's flopping his reads too much. This can be applied to Sakura too. How is he flopping? Provide examples.
Hika wrote:
abraker not on my list because he interrogated me D1 and I believe he doing his best to scumhunt. You seem to be agreeing with him on the Frostings scumread. You see, you said you believe he's doing his best. Shouldn't the same logic apply for Sakura's townread on Frosty?
Jess I'm willing to lynch bc she is anti town. Why would you lynch anti-town on top of scum?
Formatting.rEdo wrote:
I'll let myself use the red color to respond to this.Hika wrote:
Sakura because she tried to defend frosty not being scum. Is that really a scumtell that you don't agree with somebody?
Bboy because I have no idea wtf he's on about. Fine.
Frosty because he's flopping his reads too much. This can be applied to Sakura too. How is he flopping? Provide examples.Hika wrote:
abraker not on my list because he interrogated me D1 and I believe he doing his best to scumhunt. You seem to be agreeing with him on the Frostings scumread. You see, you said you believe he's doing his best. Shouldn't the same logic apply for Sakura's townread on Frosty?
Jess I'm willing to lynch bc she is anti town. Why would you lynch anti-town on top of scum?
I will gladly respond to this when I get on a computer, as quoting requires too much effort.
You're on a bus home? It's almost midnight here in Poland, and I've got classes at 12 AM. I guess I ain't responding to that overnight then.
Nobody hammers that shit before I wake up. I double dare you.
Good night.
Nobody hammers that shit before I wake up. I double dare you.
Good night.
I would like you to give us a strong case on Sakura, too. I know it's asking for much, but I just want to know your POV as much as possible.
I can do that.
Also yes, I'm taking the train home at the moment so a reply in the next 2 hours is highly unlikely. A reply to a post that requires me to quote however.
Welp, seems it's gonna be a long day. I guess I'm gonna have to do a fair bit of reading to reevaluate my read on Hika.
I can just imagine, we get to L-1, Jess hammers, then we lynch Jess but it turns out she's town and we lose the gamerEdo wrote:
Nobody hammers that shit before I wake up. I double dare you.
And that's why I didn't vote because she might hammer herself :p
1. It's not exactly a scum tell, but she's saying that I'm pulling the reasons why I'm reading him are incorrect. I'm not saying "oh because she doesn't agree with me, she's scum" but it's more so how hard she's trying to discredit me that makes me seem like she's his scum buddy or I'm probably just looking into it too ez. If she was scum then maybe she wouldn't out herself so much, but I personally think it's unusual because I don't recall a time that she's done this ever. And if she has done it, forgive me but why should it be THAT bad that I'm scum reading her? It's not like I'm asking everyone to vote her because she's scummy.rEdo wrote:
I'll let myself use the red color to respond to this.Hika wrote:
Sakura because she tried to defend frosty not being scum. Is that really a scumtell that you don't agree with somebody?
Bboy because I have no idea wtf he's on about. Fine.
Frosty because he's flopping his reads too much. This can be applied to Sakura too. How is he flopping? Provide examples.Hika wrote:
abraker not on my list because he interrogated me D1 and I believe he doing his best to scumhunt. You seem to be agreeing with him on the Frostings scumread. You see, you said you believe he's doing his best. Shouldn't the same logic apply for Sakura's townread on Frosty?
Jess I'm willing to lynch bc she is anti town. Why would you lynch anti-town on top of scum?
2. I personally think Frostings was flopping bc he was really intent on getting me lynched it looked like, D1. Then all of a sudden he comes to say I've "townslipped" and everyone hops aboard on that claim. I know I'm town of course but the fact that he did that caught me off guard because his usual town play would be to hunt me down all game. I could be wrong, ofc and thinking too hard into that too but that's my thought process on that. Now that I think about it, I probably dont have too much of a clear reason to be scumreading him due to the fact I feel as if I need to gather my reads more.
3. If Sakura wants to townread Frosty, be my guest. I'm not mad about it, it's just the fact she defended him so much that made me want to vote her.
4. Isn't Jess like L-1, L-2 or some shit? No one is gonna follow me if I'm like "hey let's vote bboy guys!!"
Oh look the OMGUS read that i predicted like 20 pages ago.
But there were reasons that led up to it, still think I'd rather vote Jess out tho!!!!
you generated an initial scumread on me when i made the case on you and was scumreading you, when i started thinking you prolly werent scum after rereading lovers mafia you changed back to not scumreading me, and now that im literally voting you, you're scumreading me again
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
And you'd rather lynch Jess over any of your 3 "scumreads"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
And you'd rather lynch Jess over any of your 3 "scumreads"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
nice emote
I'm pretty sure we all came to a consensus that we were voting Jess out?!
Otherwise if we're doing it that way, my voting would be bboy > frosty > you.
So calm down, you're still not my first choice
I'm pretty sure we all came to a consensus that we were voting Jess out?!
Otherwise if we're doing it that way, my voting would be bboy > frosty > you.
So calm down, you're still not my first choice
You did make valid points here and there too. So you wouldn't even be a good lynch for me IMO.
I would only scum read you because you're trying to invalidate my scumread on frosty.
And you're protecting him but I guess scum wouldn't publicly do that...
I would only scum read you because you're trying to invalidate my scumread on frosty.
And you're protecting him but I guess scum wouldn't publicly do that...
I didnt know town wasnt allowed to townread a person someone else was scumreading!
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I was asked for my reasons to townread Frosty and i explained them to the best of my ability
You on the other hand proceeded to discredit every single one of them by saying:
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I was asked for my reasons to townread Frosty and i explained them to the best of my ability
You on the other hand proceeded to discredit every single one of them by saying:
Hika wrote:
He could be scum keeping me alive for WIFOM.
Hika wrote:
Because afaik, you just said on the last page that Frosty is town because GUT FEELING.
Following your logic i should be scumreading every person that tried to defend you when i initially scumread you
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Also I didn't realize that I couldn't scumread someone who was protecting one of my scumreads!!!!
What do you not get about the WIFOM thing!!! If I am not lynched nor NK'd, people will think I am scum! Do you not understand the context of WIFOM here? Same thing applies to Jess! If she isn't lynched, she will try to cover her ass and make excuses for the D1 hammer and if it keeps going, scum can use her as a shield!
What do you not get about the WIFOM thing!!! If I am not lynched nor NK'd, people will think I am scum! Do you not understand the context of WIFOM here? Same thing applies to Jess! If she isn't lynched, she will try to cover her ass and make excuses for the D1 hammer and if it keeps going, scum can use her as a shield!
Sakura wrote:
Following your logic i should be scumreading every person that tried to defend you when i initially scumread you
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
also the first line is sarcasm the second paragraph is what I really think
No bc no one is doing the same thing you are doing....
This is a good one, why would you be NK'd over rEdo?Hika wrote:
What do you not get about the WIFOM thing!!! If I am not lynched nor NK'd, people will think I am scum!
Also yes, feel free to vote me. I am completely fine with that, however, we aren't going to do the same thing in terms of reads. We won't have the same reads either, so I don't see why what I've said confused you.
They did, to the point of making me drop it, are you even reading the game?Hika wrote:
No bc no one is doing the same thing you are doing....
Also he'd be NK'd before me IMO
alright, then if someone defends you with 4 different people then okay I'll stop reading you as scum okay?
Because what you said sounded like reaching.Hika wrote:
Also yes, feel free to vote me. I am completely fine with that, however, we aren't going to do the same thing in terms of reads. We won't have the same reads either, so I don't see why what I've said confused you.
Reaching? Define reaching in context.
Reaching i.e grapsing for straws, meaning since you're out of reasons you bring up whatever you can come up with in order to continue the read.
Also used for people that grasp as straws for finding a reason to scumread someone like "OMG they didnt reply within like 1 hour they are scum coz they are buying time"
Also used for people that grasp as straws for finding a reason to scumread someone like "OMG they didnt reply within like 1 hour they are scum coz they are buying time"
WIFOM is the globally used method to try to describe reasoning for why scum would do something when nothing else makes sense.
Your statement about Frosty doing what he did for WIFOM is the epitome of reaching because it's a perfectly universal explanation for anything and you cant find any other reasons to scumread him after my posts, so you take the easy way out. Which is why i mentioned it felt like A) You're scum trying to look for reasons to continue the push or B) You have confirmation bias, after which you tried to discredit me, and then proceeded to magically put me in your scumreads after my vote.
I'd say you're still salty about:
Your statement about Frosty doing what he did for WIFOM is the epitome of reaching because it's a perfectly universal explanation for anything and you cant find any other reasons to scumread him after my posts, so you take the easy way out. Which is why i mentioned it felt like A) You're scum trying to look for reasons to continue the push or B) You have confirmation bias, after which you tried to discredit me, and then proceeded to magically put me in your scumreads after my vote.
I'd say you're still salty about:
Sakura wrote:
Too bad your little mislynch vanished into thin air huh