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Lagel
181 posts
Joined October 2014
Lagel

Monstrata wrote:

Quite a few of my maps are here for fun, and for people's amusement, but this actually tries to make a serious, though very subtle and probably unnoticed statement. I want to stress the part about laughing with the map though, because by laughing with the map, you do embrace it, for all its craziness. The song itself is meant to be ridiculous, and the concept, both from drastically diverging song styles, to the absurd music video, to the lyrics, all reflect this ludicrousy. If you think I am mapping solely for lolz, then you are mistaken, so please let me explain. This map strives to embrace not merely the prettiness in surface mapping, in aesthetics,... in people... but also their internal elegance. In the real world, you can always chase people who are good looking etc..., but truly, when you get to know someone, its whats inside, what constitutes them, what makes them special, that counts. On the surface, you could be ugly, you can perceive yourself to have flaws, you were born a certain way, you are a certain height, a certain orientation, etc... It doesn't make you any less of a human being, and it doesn't make anyone else less of a person. This map boasts a horrendous amount of "ugly" sliders, and ostensibly messy patterning, but if you are able to look past the murky exterior, if you are able to embrace the patterns, just like you would someone you've met, and grown to cherish, you begin to see the exquisite flows, movements, rhythms, harmony, the beauty inside all this superficial ugliness.

jk lolo ^___^ im obviously mapping for m33ms and pp farmers xddddDDD~~1! what kinda m3m3r dares to map with such philosophical intent xddd
what the fuck, this is a game
go to tumblr
this isn't 9th grade english class
but congratulations you've recognized common sense
someone end my life there's no point going on anymore when this is the reasoning for a shitty map; comparing a beatmap to real life. please be a shitty joke
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

Lagel wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Quite a few of my maps are here for fun, and for people's amusement, but this actually tries to make a serious, though very subtle and probably unnoticed statement. I want to stress the part about laughing with the map though, because by laughing with the map, you do embrace it, for all its craziness. The song itself is meant to be ridiculous, and the concept, both from drastically diverging song styles, to the absurd music video, to the lyrics, all reflect this ludicrousy. If you think I am mapping solely for lolz, then you are mistaken, so please let me explain. This map strives to embrace not merely the prettiness in surface mapping, in aesthetics,... in people... but also their internal elegance. In the real world, you can always chase people who are good looking etc..., but truly, when you get to know someone, its whats inside, what constitutes them, what makes them special, that counts. On the surface, you could be ugly, you can perceive yourself to have flaws, you were born a certain way, you are a certain height, a certain orientation, etc... It doesn't make you any less of a human being, and it doesn't make anyone else less of a person. This map boasts a horrendous amount of "ugly" sliders, and ostensibly messy patterning, but if you are able to look past the murky exterior, if you are able to embrace the patterns, just like you would someone you've met, and grown to cherish, you begin to see the exquisite flows, movements, rhythms, harmony, the beauty inside all this superficial ugliness.

jk lolo ^___^ im obviously mapping for m33ms and pp farmers xddddDDD~~1! what kinda m3m3r dares to map with such philosophical intent xddd
what the fuck, this is a game
go to tumblr
this isn't 9th grade english class
but congratulations you've recognized common sense
someone end my life there's no point going on anymore when this is the reasoning for a shitty map; comparing a beatmap to real life. please be a shitty joke
Stop! Stop Lagel Upload!!

There's more to life than just osu, and mapping, and the online world. You still have to much to see. The world is a really beautiful place if you find the courage to go out and explore it. I know it can be challenging, life can be shitty sometimes, and certain circumstances really make us question what it is that we are living for. Don't let whatever is troubling you prevent YOU from living your life to the fullest. You just need to take the first step, and everything else will follow, so hold on and stay strong man! Here are some motivational and inspiration quotes I often fell back to whenever I was feeling depressed.

"It always seems impossible until its done." Nelson Mandela

"In order to succeed, we must first believe that we can." Nikos Kazantzakis

"I'd rather attempt to do something great and fail than to attempt to do nothing and succeed." Robert H. Schuller

"What you do today can improve all your tomorrows." Ralph Marston

"You are never too old to set another goal or to dream a new dream." C. S. Lewis

"With the new day comes new strength and new thoughts." Eleanor Roosevelt

"It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you do not stop." Confucius

"Infuse your life with action. Don't wait for it to happen. Make it happen. Make your own future. Make your own hope. Make your own love. And whatever your beliefs, honor your creator, not by passively waiting for grace to come down from upon high, but by doing what you can to make grace happen... yourself, right now, right down here on Earth." Bradley Whitford

"The secret of getting ahead is getting started." Mark Twain

"Don't watch the clock; do what it does. Keep going." Sam Levenson

"Keep your eyes on the stars, and your feet on the ground." Theodore Roosevelt

"Good things come to people who wait, but better things come to those who go out and get them." Anonymous

"What seems to us as bitter trials are often blessings in disguise." Oscar Wilde

"The starting point of all achievement is desire." Napoleon Hill

"Whatever the mind of man can conceive and believe, it can achieve." Napoleon Hill

"Eighty percent of success is showing up." Woody Allen

"If you can dream it, you can do it." Walt Disney


God bless you, my friend.
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
k let's hide that mass of quotes behind a new page
Kuki
722 posts
Joined October 2013
Kuki

Monstrata wrote:

well guys actually it's a statement and i've done it before like cause u know don't judge a book by it's cover

Monstrata wrote:

because because because because because because because because because because because because because because because
the song is ugly so the map is ugly? but ugly is often bad, but we shouldn't look at ugly maps and say they're bad, so bad maps are good, so every map with problems is now ok because we don't want to be rude and force our opinions on you

i didn't want to agree with lagel but mans has a point this is feeling like tumblr dude, you're like a beatmap social justice warrior

dude

Monstrata wrote:

stop being so superficial my beatmap is beautiful just how it is
Sophia_old_1
266 posts
Joined December 2013
Sophia_old_1
You should be making a map, not trying to reenact "The Ugly Duckling".

However, if you want to do it that's entirely your choice. Just stick by it. You can't write paragraphs upon paragraphs telling me "this is my aesthetic, I'm going for something deep" and then when you're in a PM box with someone inside the game you say "yeah im mapping this for people to laugh at the map lol". It just makes every single one of your arguments that defend your aesthetic and whatever deep thing you could be making out of this map fall apart and really makes it look like you're mapping it "for the lolz", which is disappointing and a massive "fuck you" to mappers who struggle every day to get their maps ranked and those that take their mapping seriously.

Good luck with your map, hope to see consistency from your answers as to why you're doing this from this page onwards. If you're trying to do something that delivers a subtle yet elegant message then argue for that justification. Not for "I want people to laugh at the map". After all, you're trying to make people like the ugly for the structure behind it. Not like the ugly because it looks so ugly that we laugh at it.
juankristal
osu! Alumni
1,408 posts
Joined August 2010
juankristal
Seems like some people doesnt understand the meaning of dont do nonsense in the forums. Oh well, its a shame. Time to do another cleanup.

Once again I advice all of you that you should give only constructive feedback or at least a reasoning behind what you do. Sure, Monstratas thing might sound weird but he still has more points that some people.

As another thing, the next thing that goes into nonsense here will not recive any more warnings, hope you understand!
Yuii-
2,501 posts
Joined July 2013
Yuii-
Soon™
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

Sophia wrote:

You should be making a map, not trying to reenact "The Ugly Duckling".

However, if you want to do it that's entirely your choice. Just stick by it. You can't write paragraphs upon paragraphs telling me "this is my aesthetic, I'm going for something deep" and then when you're in a PM box with someone inside the game you say "yeah im mapping this for people to laugh at the map lol". It just makes every single one of your arguments that defend your aesthetic and whatever deep thing you could be making out of this map fall apart and really makes it look like you're mapping it "for the lolz", which is disappointing and a massive "fuck you" to mappers who struggle every day to get their maps ranked and those that take their mapping seriously.

Good luck with your map, hope to see consistency from your answers as to why you're doing this from this page onwards. If you're trying to do something that delivers a subtle yet elegant message then argue for that justification. Not for "I want people to laugh at the map". After all, you're trying to make people like the ugly for the structure behind it. Not like the ugly because it looks so ugly that we laugh at it.
My dear friend, I really do apologize for confusing you with my poor choice of words. Laughing with the map is an elegant thing, and it's something I want to emphasize. It makes light of your insecurities and brushes it off. If you are able to laugh at something bad that's happened to you, you've clearly overcome that time of turmoil and have emerged as a stronger person. This map strives to make light of the ugliness in the world, because by looking past the ugly, trivial insecurities in our life, the stuff that we have to put up with, and the ordeals that we have had to go through, through overcoming all that, we are able to see the beauty that life really has to offer! Remember that the darkest hour is just before dawn! I really want to leave you with a song from one of my favorite singers, Christina Aguilera, it's called "Beautiful" and I think it really speaks to the intentions of this map.



Whatever circumstances life has put you in, just hold on and stay strong my friend! Take care, and God bless!
Sophia_old_1
266 posts
Joined December 2013
Sophia_old_1
Why are you meme'ing around when I'm honestly asking you why you, as a beatmap nominator, are so insistently spitting on what the ranking system stands for and trying to rank a map "for people to laugh at it"?
Yunomi
292 posts
Joined May 2014
Yunomi
osu! needs more sana
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

Sophia wrote:

Why are you meme'ing around when I'm honestly asking you why you, as a beatmap nominator, are so insistently spitting on what the ranking system stands for and trying to rank a map "for people to laugh at it"?
I'm not trying to rank a map "for people to laugh at". Please don't toss away my poignant and sensitive explanation as simple meme'ing, because I am speaking from the bottom of my heart. There is a great difference between laughing at someone, and laughing with someone. I hope one day you'll be able to understand.
VINXIS
Featured Artist
3,161 posts
Joined April 2014
VINXIS
estellia-style-post

the map has litaerlly tilted evry1 including mosntrata lol.. all of ur posts r like whAT THE FUCK ? ? ? ?

Broccoly wrote:

Right now, however, you're sacrificing both visuals and playability in an attempt to express the music, which is something that a beatmap should not aim for. Osu! is a rhythm game and not Visual Art.
>sacrificing visuals
>visual art
>basically implying visual art has no visuals
i can tell the point ur tryng 2 make is tht ur killing the map by tryharding visuals but ur sounding rlly contradictory in this sht lo


Monstrata wrote:

I want to stress the part about laughing with the map though, because by laughing with the map, you do embrace it, for all its craziness. If you think I am mapping solely for lolz, then you are mistaken, so please let me explain. This map strives to embrace not merely the prettiness in surface mapping, in aesthetics,... in people... but also their internal elegance.
u contradict/sound like ur contradicting urself A LOT thruout this whole thrd l o this is just the worst 1 imo


Kuki wrote:

the song is ugly so the map is ugly? but ugly is often bad, but we shouldn't look at ugly maps and say they're bad, so bad maps are good, so every map with problems is now ok because we don't want to be rude and force our opinions on you
the fuk is this logic


Spaghetti wrote:

he ignores everyone without particular issues because there isn't any issues to be addressed?
u make it sound lik ppl r stating issues but monstrata is ignoring them cuz he takes them as "not issues"... ur proly tryna say that no1 is even posting issues but u just make it sound lik hes not adressing ppl tht r stating things which is incorrect and gives a bad vibe 2 monstrata l o l

estellia- wrote:

I haven't seen any sound agreement to ranking this map AT ALL, other than the sake of a disgustingly obnoxious statement.
ur post is also an obnoxiOU S STATEMEnt 2... ;/ sry budy. (and so is mine just so wer clear lo.)

--------------------------

Disagree:
  1. "This map is MADE to be around the purpose of being ugly/disgusting." "It's the map's concept." (Partly disagree)
...what the fuck is this Monstrata. This statement itself causes for a whole lot of controversy. Themed mapping is good... usually... but aesthetics play a big role in how WELL the map will play, and can play. Aiming for messy is essentially aiming for a shitfest. Aiming for a shitfest ensures that the map will not play near as well as it could IF it was cleaner (key words: cleaner and messy. Looking nice and looking bad have nothing to do with a map's play-ability). Now I read/know that you are aiming for visuals more than you are for play-ability, and that makes obvious sense, but it goes ENTIRELY against what mapping in general has shaped around/innovated on... since forever. Because of this, you will obviously need to have a strong and firm ground to support the shit people are flinging towards your map, but your contradictions in almost every statement you have made are not really helping you. You need to be more clear as to what you are REALLY basing the theme of this on, instead of jumping around to different ideas like, "I mapped this for people to laugh at," to, literally right after, "I didn't map this for people to laugh at, I actually mapped this for a very deep meaning." I can not side with Monstrata on this until he makes it obvious and clear as to what his map is REALLY aiming for, and what the concept is actually supposed to be.

Here is an idea. Make it clear as to what your true intentions are as how you are trying to explain to Sophia, except put it in the map description so everyone can see it. I do not know how effective it will that be, but I am sure it would clear things up a bit..

  1. "The song's first part is so hard, but the latter part isn't. This is bad."
If we are saying this is objectively bad, then this makes 0 sense. This, first of all, is the song's problem. Second of all, you can't just say that the song's composition is bad just because it has dynamic atmospheres within the song. The song does not fit your taste, so be it. Live with it. IT is NOT going to be the end of the world just because you do not like a song.

  1. Most of what is in Estellia's mod.
It is a messy, unorganized rant. I can not really say anything about it. It is mostly shit though, and it is not really helping Monstrata.

  1. "This map is like a beginner map."
WHAT THE FUCK LOL. This looks nowhere near as shit as a usual beginner's first few maps holy FUCK. The same people who are saying that this map is a spit on the face on new mappers are literally talking shit about this map, doing the same thing back. As a comparison, it is like tumblr SJWs complaining about how they are always oppressed, but the next second they go trash talking cishets and sending death threats to them. The oppressed part is true in most cases, but flinging shit just as bad is not making anything better.

This map has OBVIOUS structure and patterning put into it. What the fuck are you guys on?

Timorisu wrote:

This is seriously the worst thing I've ever seen. The only reason this gets attention and people defending it is because a relatively known mapper mapped it, seriously? If some rank 50k made this and tried to rank it there's no way in hell it'd be possible.
This kind of shit is always the worst kind of thing you can see on threads. It has no definite proof, it just sounds whiny as fuck, and it is just downright disrespectful to any mapper.

  1. "Leave the mapper alone."
As estellia said, "He uploaded this shit-fest, receiving criticism (be it constructive or not) shouldn't be a surprise in any form or manner." This should be no surprise for Monstrata, and he SHOULD HAVE seen this coming if he actually did not expect this backlash.

  1. "Circlejerk."
What does circlejerk even mean anymore. It has lost definite meaning like how "structure" in mapping jargon has.

--------------------------

Agree:

  1. CelsiusLK wrote:

    if the map is intend to be ugly then saying this map is so ugly might be a compliment instead xd
This should be obvious. If the map is doing what it is intending to well, then it is probably good in that sense. The problem is that he (Monstrata) has not been justifying it well enough for people to understand and appreciate it in the same sense.

  1. "The map is shit."
I do not COMPLETELY agree with the statement, but I do dislike the map for what it is. That being said, I can not really do anything about it because that is just my personal opinion about it. Personal opinions at the current state of the ranking system do not matter.

  1. It's rankable.
Yeah, it is rankable. It is rankable though mostly because of the fact that anything can get ranked. The only thing that stands against the map's rank-ability is if people cause a massive shitstorm and send walls of mods at it each time it is qualified (like in Tengaku, and Routing), up to the point where the mapper gives up.

  1. Opinions matter at this place.
Yes, this is a huge thing that ranking SHOULD be about, but it is sadly not. You are not mapping solely for yourself when you are ranking a map. You are mapping for the community.. esp. the players in the community.

  1. "This map should not have been bubbled."
Even though most of this... "discussion," + the extra mods would not have came, the map should not have been bubbled so fast and easily, and I agree that Monstrata should have actively looked for more mods, and possibly more playtests. Even though this was mapped aesthetics > playability, you can not completely ignore playability for a game that people play.

Yeah.

--------------------------

ok le mod

general

  1. lol ur bg res is FUKD.. hers a bettr version
  2. tbh u sud get silent sliderslidez for the quiet part :0

lemod

  1. thx for changign the sliderz 2 1/3 lo
  2. 00:21:206 (1,2) - switch ncs here wot te fuk u fukd up... (if u dont get y then looka t the ncing on all ur other patterns around it D... also the 2 is the actual "strong beat"/measure so lmoa)
  3. 00:31:903 (3,4) - can u space thesea bit farthr THX Cx
  4. 00:56:864 (3,4,5,6) - 01:37:362 (2,3,4,5,6) - y do u do things lik this.. im assuming they play lik complet sht and theyr not rlly adding 2 the 'ugliness' tone of the map anyway :L at least thts wot isee lo
  5. 01:07:259 (1) - 01:12:060 (1) - 01:16:851 (1) - ir y cant tell if they ractualy off time but theY SOUND rlly offtime so idk
  6. 02:53:686 (1,1,2) - do u rlly think thts gunna play well for th e ppl tht can play this pattern lol this is lik evilelviss but wors :L
  7. 04:45:303 (1) - this acutaly sounds a teensy bit late dont u agre also id blanket 04:44:538 (6,1) - lo AESTHETIX XDXDXDXD

fwiw thers a differenc between laughgin at smth and laughign wit something lmoa HOLY FU K U MOSNTRATA ;/

not lookign at this thread anymor until the ranking status changez...... asid for the mod respons lo good nite.

edit: o yhjea plz giv kd.
Last edited by VINXIS , edited 1 time in total.
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

VINXIS wrote:

estellia-style-post



general

  1. lol ur bg res is FUKD.. hers a bettr version ty
  2. tbh u sud get silent sliderslidez for the quiet part :0 ok sure

lemod

  1. thx for changign the sliderz 2 1/3 lo ya
  2. 00:21:206 (1,2) - switch ncs here wot te fuk u fukd up... (if u dont get y then looka t the ncing on all ur other patterns around it D... also the 2 is the actual "strong beat"/measure so lmoa) i actually prefer it like this since it leads into the vocals better. I don't think it causes any discrepencies unless you look in editor.
  3. 00:31:903 (3,4) - can u space thesea bit farthr THX Cx yea sure
  4. 00:56:864 (3,4,5,6) - 01:37:362 (2,3,4,5,6) - y do u do things lik this.. im assuming they play lik complet sht and theyr not rlly adding 2 the 'ugliness' tone of the map anyway :L at least thts wot isee lo I wanted some instances where the flow was poor, at least, to give some ugliness to the flow which is almost always good. But Here I made sure to use a nice structure to compensate for the slight divergence from my intentional theme.
  5. 01:07:259 (1) - 01:12:060 (1) - 01:16:851 (1) - ir y cant tell if they ractualy off time but theY SOUND rlly offtime so idk They don't sound off timed to me hmm.....
  6. 02:53:686 (1,1,2) - do u rlly think thts gunna play well for th e ppl tht can play this pattern lol this is lik evilelviss but wors :L yea i think this is pretty easy tbh... I can 300 this quite easily
  7. 04:45:303 (1) - this acutaly sounds a teensy bit late dont u agre also id blanket 04:44:538 (6,1) - lo AESTHETIX XDXDXDXD I'll assue you meant, early, not late. Moved it back a bit. But ehh i like the heart as it is; asymmetrical. and blanketting with a heart is really difficult from my experience

fwiw thers a differenc between laughgin at smth and laughign wit something lmoa HOLY FU K U MOSNTRATA ;/

not lookign at this thread anymor until the ranking status changez...... asid for the mod respons lo good nite.

edit: o yhjea plz giv kd.
Thanks for the mod~!!
Kibbleru
osu! Alumni
5,846 posts
Joined August 2013
Kibbleru

Sophia wrote:

and a massive "fuck you" to mappers who struggle every day to get their maps ranked and those that take their mapping seriously.
where have i seen this before :D...
_handholding
3,109 posts
Joined April 2014
_handholding
I think your intention was to make it messy rather than ugly. If so maybe if you start saying that you might get less hate... maybe.. probs not lol
Broccoly
1,359 posts
Joined May 2012
Broccoly

VINXIS wrote:

estellia-style-post

the map has litaerlly tilted evry1 including mosntrata lol.. all of ur posts r like whAT THE FUCK ? ? ? ?

Broccoly wrote:

Right now, however, you're sacrificing both visuals and playability in an attempt to express the music, which is something that a beatmap should not aim for. Osu! is a rhythm game and not Visual Art.
>sacrificing visuals
>visual art
>basically implying visual art has no visuals
i can tell the point ur tryng 2 make is tht ur killing the map by tryharding visuals but ur sounding rlly contradictory in this sht lo
"Visual Art" as in people engage by looking at the art piece, whereas in a rhythm game, people can both look at it and play it.

VINXIS wrote:

>basically implying visual art has no visuals
there are visual art with messy visuals -_ - dunno whats up with ur bias that visual art has to look good
or do you not know the difference between 'visual' when it's used in a context like "this map has no visuals" and 'visual' when it's used in a word like 'visual art'??
tilted.
emilia
893 posts
Joined October 2012
emilia
rip i think my mod would've made more sense if i added pics

also vinxis the structure of your post is so fucked can you get good at being estellia- tyvm

also Monstrata IS selectively blind to posts that shit on his map, because that's what he's good at: C I R C L E J E R K I N G

If you can't even process what other people are trying to say because of your own noises in your head about your obnoxious intent to the point where you defend yourself with quotes and trash-tier, sub-par "philosophy", that's pretty sad imo. Calling someone out for being depressed because they took a dump on your map is also pretty lowly. If you could defend yourself with better points instead of shitty edge-tier teenage angst like that maybe your intentions could be made clearer. This map is clearly (AND VISUALLY) an obnoxious statement, and you can't deny that. Laughing it off won't help anything either.

Also stop acting like you're above everything. You're not lmoa, quit your bullshit

cna s oesmo ene jsut s liike t nuyk e thi sa lreayd la m,oo xd d
fartownik
2,189 posts
Joined December 2008
fartownik
Why does this one use HP3? If this was justified anywhere, please lead me to the explanation post.

What's the point in having a 8.5 star map if random players can pass it just by mashing? Such difficulty should be exclusive for the top tier, the toppest of tops, and even a pass should be a sign of a player's great skill.
Cherry Blossom
3,185 posts
Joined October 2011
Cherry Blossom
Finding what is beautiful in something ugly, it reminds me some authors in literature.
I don't really know which magic mushroom you take, because famous writers just took some before composing.
But mapping isn't literature, your concept isn't that bad and i can understand what you think, but don't go that far, it's just a game.
Awh well, good luck with your map !
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
I'll change the HP to 5 like i said about twenty times in my mods xD. I'm keeping it really low so I can testplay without NF xD.
Sophia_old_1
266 posts
Joined December 2013
Sophia_old_1
If you need NF to testplay it I don't think you're the one supposed to be testplaying it in the first place. Also...


Monstrata wrote:

I'm not trying to rank a map "for people to laugh at". Please don't toss away my poignant and sensitive explanation as simple meme'ing, because I am speaking from the bottom of my heart. There is a great difference between laughing at someone, and laughing with someone. I hope one day you'll be able to understand.
23:42 Monstrata: like, to a certain extent i want people to play the map and laugh at how ludicrous it is too lol
23:43 Monstrata: so yea in a sense. i'm not really mapping this primarily for top 50 etc... to pass/fc. its more for ppl to have fun and laugh at/with the map.
You clearly said you're ranking it for people to laugh at. Or with. Regardless, for people to laugh for it being stupid.

Mapping is not an art, and your map is not a literature work. This kind of thing does not fit and should not fit inside ranked maps - You, as a BN, should know that better than any of us. I have no qualms with you using your "meem speesh lol *quote from people and music from cristina aguillera kkkkj*", but at least be consistent and thoughtful while doing so.

I hope one day you'll be able to understand ranked maps aren't your playground to place things you want with justifications such as literature. Mainly because comparing your mapping to literature itself or life choices and situations is beyond delusional. I think that's an important quality for our Beatmap Nominators to have. But if you don't want to understand that, then don't belittle others and only answer to what you want to answer with long-winded explanations just to divert attention so you can rank it later. That's not how anyone should behave in the mapping community. Again, you should know that many of your answers in this thread were fairly unacceptable and pretty much bullshit, and that that's not acceptable from any mapper. But alas, this will get ranked and you or nothing will change from me doing this, so eh.

The fact you can't see how ridiculously high-horse and demotivating your answers are really baffles me and it kinda scares me that the only fact this is going forward is because of your popularity gotten from previous maps, and that no other BN found anything wrong with the things you have been saying.

If this is what the ones who should take care of this section act like, I'm both scared and disappointed with everyone in it and wonder how you got there and where is this section going from here onwards.
Silverboxer
670 posts
Joined December 2012
Silverboxer
If anyone else mapped this it would be laughed at regardless of whether the mapper intended that or not. I'm not going to argue because there is no point but this is obviously not a good map for ranking. It doesn't matter that this was made "for fun" because 99% of other mappers aren't allowed to have this "fun" when going for rank. This is an insult to pretty much anyone that can't get their polished up, proper mapsets ranked because everyone is in favor of shit like this.

Disappointing to see from someone like you monstrata.
Nakano Itsuki
1,218 posts
Joined July 2014
Nakano Itsuki
I just love it when ppl say mapping isnt art l o l
How come it isnt? Its a form of creativity after all XD
Sophia_old_1
266 posts
Joined December 2013
Sophia_old_1

StarrStyx wrote:

I just love it when ppl say mapping isnt art l o l
How come it isnt? Its a form of creativity after all XD
If I smear you with elephant feces and cover you in duck feathers while singing the lyrics to Pensamento Tipico de Esquerda Caviar wearing a watermelon around my neck in front of a cheering crowd that would be an incredibly creative way of publicly humiliating you and making myself look like a retard and that is in no way art.

But let's amuse yourselves that mapping is "art", even for a bit. Do you think mapping is a form of art which could even one day hope to compare to literature? If you do, then well, good luck. I'll be looking for the day you mapping the next TV Size Anime Opening by LiSA makes an impact in society or any form of culture in the world in a relevant way.
-kevincela-
Elite Mapper
2,846 posts
Joined February 2010
-kevincela-
I haven't been following the situation, but the last post just feels so wrong that i somehow have to reply in a way or another.

Sophia wrote:

If I smear you with elephant feces and cover you in duck feathers while singing the lyrics to Pensamento Tipico de Esquerda Caviar wearing a watermelon around my neck in front of a cheering crowd that would be an incredibly creative way of publicly humiliating you and making myself look like a retard and that is in no way art.
Let's just skip this part, which is nonsensical and also quite embarassing.

Sophia wrote:

But let's amuse yourselves that mapping is "art", even for a bit.
Let's pick a dictionary and search for the word "art". Here is the definition, according to Oxford Dictionaries (http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/defin ... nglish/art):

The expression or application of human creative skill and imagination
What is a map, if not an expression of somebody's imagination and skill? If we also take the fact that mapping is based on music, which is by some considered as the most direct type of art, then we can say that mapping is also an art. This is based on a DEFINITION, so I don't think there's really much to say about this!

Sophia wrote:

Do you think mapping is a form of art which could even one day hope to compare to literature?
Why are you even comparing mapping to literature? It's like comparing engraving to music, they have nothing in common except for the fact they're both art expressions. They have completely different audiences as well as intentions, why the heck would you do this? lol

Sophia wrote:

I'll be looking for the day you mapping the next TV Size Anime Opening by LiSA makes an impact in society or any form of culture in the world in a relevant way.
Even a tv size map can be art, it would probably "low quality" art, but it's an interpretation of a song by somebody nonetheless, thus it is art. Also, do you really think art's purpose is to impact society in any way? Haven't you studied the Aesthetic and Romantic movements, where writers wrote mostly just for themselves, recluding themselves from the outer society? Only some art currents have this purpose of "impacting" someone, it's still mostly something depending from the subject who wants to create that piece of art for his own reasons.

I don't know the context in which this whole discussion has been put into, but whatever conception somebody has on an object can be considered as art, even if we're talking about mapping. Hell, Duchamp went as far as saying that art can be a mere process of selection, instead of creation!

The OT ends here for me, I hope you understood what I meant and have a good day.
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
Mapping is an art. I understand that the concept might be difficult for you to comprehend. Perhaps you should try mapping before you reject it as a form of expression.

Mapping is not literature, it is philosophy. Literature is what you read, it is simply a medium from which ideas are spread. Other mediums include film, photography, anime, music, poetry, painting, food... The list continues. Fundamentally, every piece of art strives to convey a message, however small it may be. At the elementary level, drawings, sketches, photos, paintings, they try to show us the world, from the eyes of the artist. From a different perspective. With a different focus. At a different angle. Using different juxtapositions. They try to show us beauty, to revel in the magnificence of nature, of flavours, of music in harmony. Art allows for ideas to be filtered through the perspective, the opinions, the mental process of the artist. Art doesn't need to impact society, or any form of culture in the world to be successful. It just needs to get its message across. You may disagree with the artist, but whether you agree or disagree, you still process the artist's idea.

While no TV Size Anime Opening by LiSA did make an impact in my life, another song really moved me to pursue my dreams and ambitions, and to really live life to the fullest. It told me that even if the world was ending, even if the entirety of the world were to melt away, that as long as I had something to live for, something that kept me going, my life would not be a waste. The artist acknowledges how ephemeral life can be. That we are simply a ripple in the ocean of life. However, she sings that no matter how futile we may feel, even if the world were to disappear, that nothing should stop us from making the most of our lives. In a sense, she echoes the works of poet Horace's Odes by urging her audience to seize the day. This concept of "carpe diem" is interwoven even in society today, through the more vernacular "yolo" but the artists' messages from two thousand years ago to today continue to be relevant. This song really taught me to make the most out of my life. To do what I want to do, to not look back, to not waste my time worrying, to fully immerse myself in life's beauty. Life is fleeting, so lets make the most out of it! Please listen to this song, perhaps it will give you a new lease on life as it did mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULHQPm8hmVk
ac8129464363
1,566 posts
Joined October 2013
ac8129464363
im done

officially
Spaghetti
1,118 posts
Joined August 2014
Spaghetti
LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
Te Amo
246 posts
Joined January 2013
Te Amo
I am touched.
winber1
4,519 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1
i love boobs
Nelly
Beatmap Nominator
1,536 posts
Joined August 2014
Nelly
Im done...
aesu
136 posts
Joined April 2013
aesu

Monstrata wrote:

Mapping is an art. I understand that the concept might be difficult for you to comprehend. Perhaps you should try mapping before you reject it as a form of expression.

Mapping is not literature, it is philosophy. Literature is what you read, it is simply a medium from which ideas are spread. Other mediums include film, photography, anime, music, poetry, painting, food... The list continues. Fundamentally, every piece of art strives to convey a message, however small it may be. At the elementary level, drawings, sketches, photos, paintings, they try to show us the world, from the eyes of the artist. From a different perspective. With a different focus. At a different angle. Using different juxtapositions. They try to show us beauty, to revel in the magnificence of nature, of flavours, of music in harmony. Art allows for ideas to be filtered through the perspective, the opinions, the mental process of the artist. Art doesn't need to impact society, or any form of culture in the world to be successful. It just needs to get its message across. You may disagree with the artist, but whether you agree or disagree, you still process the artist's idea.

While no TV Size Anime Opening by LiSA did make an impact in my life, another song really moved me to pursue my dreams and ambitions, and to really live life to the fullest. It told me that even if the world was ending, even if the entirety of the world were to melt away, that as long as I had something to live for, something that kept me going, my life would not be a waste. The artist acknowledges how ephemeral life can be. That we are simply a ripple in the ocean of life. However, she sings that no matter how futile we may feel, even if the world were to disappear, that nothing should stop us from making the most of our lives. In a sense, she echoes the works of poet Horace's Odes by urging her audience to seize the day. This concept of "carpe diem" is interwoven even in society today, through the more vernacular "yolo" but the artists' messages from two thousand years ago to today continue to be relevant. This song really taught me to make the most out of my life. To do what I want to do, to not look back, to not waste my time worrying, to fully immerse myself in life's beauty. Life is fleeting, so lets make the most out of it! Please listen to this song, perhaps it will give you a new lease on life as it did mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULHQPm8hmVk

amen
melloe
275 posts
Joined February 2013
melloe
stone-faced, inscrutable, the greatest memer of our time
a method actor who betrays nothing, he does not break character because he is character

although i like that the sliders are messy, I don't like that they seem completely random and distended in dissimilar ways. the song itself is not THAT unorganized, it's a bit heavy and unkempt but it still does maintain a level of structure and discipline. would you consider keeping some of the sliders messy but making them messy in the same way if they're expressing related sounds? for example
02:10:385 (1) -
02:11:311 (1) -
02:12:238 (1) -
02:13:164 (1) -
02:14:100 (1) -
02:15:026 (1) -
02:15:953 (1) -
02:16:880 (1) -

these sliders are all expressing the exact same sound but it seems like you went out of your way to make some of them as different as possible. i appreciate the concept and i think it works well to an extent, but some of these sliders are so jagged and threatening and others are smooth and have no corners at all. the map is more messy than the song and a good way to trim it just a little bit would be to at least make some of the messy sliders messy in the same way, particularly the long ambitious ones that emphasize heavy beats

some more examples:
01:42:186 (1) -
01:42:836 (1) -
01:43:942 (1) -
01:45:025 (1) -
01:45:670 (1) -
01:46:531 (1) -
01:47:183 (1) -
01:48:241 (3) -
etc

00:31:475 (1,2,3,4) - these sliders, though short, are so fundamentally different that just looking at them is far more jarring than the song itself. especially 00:33:832 (4) - when considering the previous three sliders, it's just so painful.

i absolutely love this 01:38:058 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5) - though, think it fits perfectly, his voice is seriously going wild at that point

didnt comment on flow or playability or anything because im not top 100 rank, but aesthetically i like it for the most part
Last edited by melloe , edited 1 time in total.
idke
Former osu! Champion: 2019
107 posts
Joined July 2014
idke
where did your pp maps go
why did you make art not pp

why
-M4x
296 posts
Joined July 2014
-M4x
well spoken monstrata!
OzzyOzrock
5,185 posts
Joined August 2010
OzzyOzrock
yawn
Alyseka
25 posts
Joined April 2015
Alyseka
2 Philosophical 4 me

I still think AR10 is the best option for this map. The note density on the current AR is a bit high. Hell, i would say even with AR10 some of the parts are still hard to read.
And considering the players who would actually play this map, the slow part doesn't even factor into this.

ppy please implement AR11 in the map editor
/s
Side
1,127 posts
Joined October 2013
Side
even if :^)
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
i would like to shitpost as well


:poop:
emilia
893 posts
Joined October 2012
emilia
call it art, call it philosophy

but if no one circlejerks it will have no value

this is why "modern" art is considered one of the largest, most successful circlejerk ever to plague our planet lol
Noobish
63 posts
Joined September 2010
Noobish
monstrata was the first mapper to break away from realism and nonpresentational abstract 'art,' the kind that any 3 year old with an editor could reproduce. Are we better off?
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

Forlornly wrote:

stone-faced, inscrutable, the greatest memer of our time
a method actor who betrays nothing, he does not break character because he is character

although i like that the sliders are messy, I don't like that they seem completely random and distended in dissimilar ways. the song itself is not THAT unorganized, it's a bit heavy and unkempt but it still does maintain a level of structure and discipline. would you consider keeping some of the sliders messy but making them messy in the same way if they're expressing related sounds? for example
02:10:385 (1) -
02:11:311 (1) -
02:12:238 (1) -
02:13:164 (1) -
02:14:100 (1) -
02:15:026 (1) -
02:15:953 (1) -
02:16:880 (1) -

these sliders are all expressing the exact same sound but it seems like you went out of your way to make some of them as different as possible. i appreciate the concept and i think it works well to an extent, but some of these sliders are so jagged and threatening and others are smooth and have no corners at all. the map is more messy than the song and a good way to trim it just a little bit would be to at least make some of the messy sliders messy in the same way, particularly the long ambitious ones that emphasize heavy beats

some more examples:
01:42:186 (1) -
01:42:836 (1) -
01:43:942 (1) -
01:45:025 (1) -
01:45:670 (1) -
01:46:531 (1) -
01:47:183 (1) -
01:48:241 (3) -
etc

00:31:475 (1,2,3,4) - these sliders, though short, are so fundamentally different that just looking at them is far more jarring than the song itself. especially 00:33:832 (4) - when considering the previous three sliders, it's just so painful.

i absolutely love this 01:38:058 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5) - though, think it fits perfectly, his voice is seriously going wild at that point

didnt comment on flow or playability or anything because im not top 100 rank, but aesthetically i like it for the most part
I want to keep the sliders uniquely messy. I think there's already enough structure involved, both in the consistency of my rhythm choices, and the flow/movement choices between these patterns. Making the sliders symmetrical, or having their shape reflective of what they "sound like" just causes too much order in the map and defeats my intentions. The sliders are there to show chaos, and you can see the slider shapes and patterns devolving in places like 00:27:409 - (orderly to chaotic) 00:36:647 - as well, going from more ordered to chaotic as the vocals rise and become harsher. 01:33:779 - Etc.. the same idea here.

02:03:140 - Here I do a full section of symmetrical sliders to juxtapose with the later section after 02:10:385 - when you hear the vocal switching.

Every slider, no matter how messy or clean, is done with a specific goal in mind. If you look at it in small sections like above, they will of course look disorganized as similar sound profiles see to be mapped to different shapes. I can assure you though, that these are all part of a bigger thread, and one that I believe, looking through the whole first half of the map, is consistent in its chaos.
melloe
275 posts
Joined February 2013
melloe

estellia- wrote:

call it art, call it philosophy

but if no one circlejerks it will have no value

this is why "modern" art is considered one of the largest, most successful circlejerk ever to plague our planet lol
That's how it is for everything, if people like it then it has some sort of value. Just because you don't like or appreciate it and think it's silly doesn't mean it's fraudulent and some dirty "circlejerk." I don't really get why people think this map is so esoteric and highbrow "art." It's very simple: messy sliders to represent a messy song. I personally think the sliders are TOO messy but that's ok, that's just where monstrata and people like me might disagree. Shiirn did the same thing with his Comfort mapset -- uneven flow to represent a silly, playful song. And people disparagingly called it "art" just because the concept seemed so wild and otherworldly, when really it was just a little bit unusual from the norm.
Mazziv
998 posts
Joined July 2013
Mazziv
Like my comment if you cry yourself to sleep everyday
Comment this if you think mr.monstrata is dungeonmaster
Bubble this for VINXIS nudes
Rank it for drama
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn

Monstrata wrote:

Every slider, no matter how messy or clean, is done with a specific goal in mind.
This sentence has the highest word:bullshit ratio of this year thus far. Just fess up and admit they're made to move in one general direction but have largely randomly placed nodes. That's the entire point of the sliders being ugly as hell while maintaining play structure. You and I both know you haven't spent that much time looking at every single growl and scream. Unless the goal in mind is "lazily shit out a slider and bullshit away critique instead of give consistency to the chaos", then you've failed your goal.

Monstrata wrote:

If you look at it in small sections like above, they will of course look disorganized as similar sound profiles see to be mapped to different shapes. I can assure you though, that these are all part of a bigger thread, and one that I believe, looking through the whole first half of the map, is consistent in its chaos.
My entire personal issue is that the randomly-placed nodes (And if you want to prove me wrong, have fun bullshitting sliders for a few hours, seriously don't waste your time doing that) just make the map look lazy rather than chaotic or ugly. Random red nodes would be more effective than random grey ones, at least then you'll have actual movement instead of insignificant wiggling.

You've mentioned that you specifically have bad blankets and weird overlaps, and that's fine, but weirdo schizophrenic sliders are not a part of that "OCD-triggering" theme, they're just frickin' lazy. It's like midnight right now and I'm going to bed so I won't link the sliders in particular, but I think you know which ones I'm talking about - they're not in any particular section, they're all over the place.


Also the fact that there's that 10-second section near the middle of the beginning and the post-schizo-slider 9 notes that gives the map a full 1.1* of rating, map would be 7.4* if those were more reasonable, damn
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
I think you're misquoting me if you think "specific goal in mind" means every individual node. The specific goal is exactly to make them move in general directions, reflect certain flows I want to use, and be all around chaotic in their appearance, constantly variating, and sometimes even obnoxious.

Idk what exceptionally "weirdo" sliders you are talking about so feel free to link them. However, since each slider is uniquely designed, at least assume I did it on purpose first. You're welcome to disagree and call them weird though :).
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
I have a bit of a quirky mouse.

It oftentimes doubleclicks whenever I click. It's a common problem that mouses get over time, and I have other mouses, but this mouse is the most comfortable so I'm going to use it until it stops working entirely.

As you'd expect, the doubleclicks can get fairly disconcerting when constructing sliders, sometimes turning what I wanted to be a grey node into a red one, or placing two grey nodes several pixels apart.

If I were to create a slider and randomly click along my intended path, I'd end up with a mess of red nodes and weirdly placed grey ones.


Kind of like this.


Or this?


Or this one, which looks like I had a seizure on that cute little mouse of mine.



They're not unrankable, but they're certainly insulting as they're simply lazy and you'd probably dislike if anyone else were doing it, but because it's you you think you can get away with it.


01:41:058 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - still needs to die in a fire
Battle
2,865 posts
Joined February 2014
Battle
does that mean my mouse is dying :/\/\/\/
BlueCrystal004
12 posts
Joined May 2014
BlueCrystal004
that sounds like some hanzer level shit right there
Sophia_old_1
266 posts
Joined December 2013
Sophia_old_1

-kevincela- wrote:

Sophia wrote:

Do you think mapping is a form of art which could even one day hope to compare to literature?
Why are you even comparing mapping to literature?
Because the mapper has, in a form to make other people shut up and to make fun of everyone as to not answer issues regarding his maps, constantly compared this to it.

Anyway, monstrata's clearly growing more and more nonsensical as the thread goes forward and won't answer seriously to any kind of criticism on this map hiding it behind "philosophy" or whatever other deep thing he likes to bullshit that this map has, and it'll eventually get ranked because he's a BN and popular. If this was literally anyone else trying to justify his choices by "philosophy" rather than "the sounds clearly ask for it", they'd probably be bashed down to the ground and laughed at, but here we post "beautiful" and meme around it because "lol circeljerk Xddd rank dis". Worst part? Monstrata could very likely explain why he picked the shapes of most sliders, but he keeps hiding behind a "I have a bigger picture, look for the clean behind the ugly, move forward in life, youtubelink".

I still have no idea how someone like this is allowed to be one of the overseers of this section when he is the one currently shitting the most on the standards of it. Disappointing.
Helyana
205 posts
Joined February 2016
Helyana
oh god monstrata you're creeping me out
emilia
893 posts
Joined October 2012
emilia

Forlornly wrote:

estellia- wrote:

call it art, call it philosophy

but if no one circlejerks it will have no value

this is why "modern" art is considered one of the largest, most successful circlejerk ever to plague our planet lol
That's how it is for everything, if people like it then it has some sort of value. Just because you don't like or appreciate it and think it's silly doesn't mean it's fraudulent and some dirty "circlejerk." I don't really get why people think this map is so esoteric and highbrow "art." It's very simple: messy sliders to represent a messy song. I personally think the sliders are TOO messy but that's ok, that's just where monstrata and people like me might disagree. Shiirn did the same thing with his Comfort mapset -- uneven flow to represent a silly, playful song. And people disparagingly called it "art" just because the concept seemed so wild and otherworldly, when really it was just a little bit unusual from the norm.
already missing the point, so many things have been brought up about this map and you're neglecting everything else

people have already time and time again stated the fact that monstrata contradicted himself by saying its a map he made for "lolz" and yet still has serious meaning behind it, and somehow that meaning is some shitty excuse of "philosophy". boi, if it were anyone who prompted the "artsy" argument first it'd be monstrata trying to be edgy and defending himself in the shittiest way possible lol. the fact that people are still defending monstrata is such a joke.

all i'm typing out here is an opinion. as much as i see no value in monstrata's map, perhaps you see no value in my argument. many things to mention about what you said about what i said but i'm seriously too lazy lol. typing out arguments is a pain in the ass, especially when it won't make sense to you anyways
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
I don't see how those sliders are "lazy". If anything, it takes longer to set up all the nodes. Red nodes end curves and reduce the number of actual turns a slider can have before running out of length. White nodes on the other hand, can theoretically be used indefinitely since they only affect the slider formula for one curve contained between the sliderhead/rednode/slidertail. You're just interpretting hard jagged zigzagged slider shapes using red nodes as the best way to create chaotic sliders. I simply disagree.
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
lol.
Yueliang
1 post
Joined December 2015
Yueliang

Monstrata wrote:

Mapping is an art. I understand that the concept might be difficult for you to comprehend. Perhaps you should try mapping before you reject it as a form of expression.

Mapping is not literature, it is philosophy. Literature is what you read, it is simply a medium from which ideas are spread. Other mediums include film, photography, anime, music, poetry, painting, food... The list continues. Fundamentally, every piece of art strives to convey a message, however small it may be. At the elementary level, drawings, sketches, photos, paintings, they try to show us the world, from the eyes of the artist. From a different perspective. With a different focus. At a different angle. Using different juxtapositions. They try to show us beauty, to revel in the magnificence of nature, of flavours, of music in harmony. Art allows for ideas to be filtered through the perspective, the opinions, the mental process of the artist. Art doesn't need to impact society, or any form of culture in the world to be successful. It just needs to get its message across. You may disagree with the artist, but whether you agree or disagree, you still process the artist's idea.

While no TV Size Anime Opening by LiSA did make an impact in my life, another song really moved me to pursue my dreams and ambitions, and to really live life to the fullest. It told me that even if the world was ending, even if the entirety of the world were to melt away, that as long as I had something to live for, something that kept me going, my life would not be a waste. The artist acknowledges how ephemeral life can be. That we are simply a ripple in the ocean of life. However, she sings that no matter how futile we may feel, even if the world were to disappear, that nothing should stop us from making the most of our lives. In a sense, she echoes the works of poet Horace's Odes by urging her audience to seize the day. This concept of "carpe diem" is interwoven even in society today, through the more vernacular "yolo" but the artists' messages from two thousand years ago to today continue to be relevant. This song really taught me to make the most out of my life. To do what I want to do, to not look back, to not waste my time worrying, to fully immerse myself in life's beauty. Life is fleeting, so lets make the most out of it! Please listen to this song, perhaps it will give you a new lease on life as it did mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULHQPm8hmVk
what the fuck are you smoking, and where can i get some
_handholding
3,109 posts
Joined April 2014
_handholding

estellia- wrote:

call it art, call it philosophy

but if no one circlejerks it will have no value

this is why "modern" art is considered one of the largest, most successful circlejerk ever to plague our planet lol

fun fact: the circlejerk is to hate modern art not appreciate it xdddd
Mint
1,611 posts
Joined February 2013
Mint
my 2c on this
I feel really bad if the sliders in this map do not satisfy your usual 3°-tilted and slightly-curved ones, but if it really bothers you to that degree; feel free to play estellia's version or, even if you can't, map it yourself. I know that puffy answer is really lame and overmeme'd, but when I browse through the thread, the main message from some people I get is: I don't like it, I think it's ugly, so it must be ugly to everyone. I think that 'map yourself' is perfectly applicable to this situation in this case.

If this map can make you write essay-lengthed posts where you try to override your own standards and style on someone else's set, then maybe it is just as pathetic as modern art has gotten.

You guys made your point clear; you do not like the map. People do understand that after the first post or two - if you have a big problem with any of these issues, feel free to contact the mapper yourself and talk in private, instead of repeating the same message by spamming this thread with highly-subjective self-centered opinions.

Yes, this ranking process is mostly community-driven, but the ones who gave critique are not the whole community, now are they? If there are a handful of people who can also enjoy this, and this fits the current RC objectively, I don't find this set a problem.

Let's get to the set itself.

[General]
  1. I don't think 100% accurate timing can be achieved with this song, but I assume you already made the final timing changes?
  2. Are you still going to change the HP?
  3. Still my doubts on metadata. マキシマム ザ ホルモン vs. マキシマムザホルモン and Maximum the Hormone vs. MAXIMUM THE HORMONE. I hope you can confirm this.

    https://twitter.com/MTH_OFFICIAL
    http://www.55mth.com/pc/index.php
    http://www.55mth.com/pc/discography/
    http://www.maximumthehormone.jp/news.html
[Expert]
  1. 00:28:922 (1,2,3,4) - Feels cramped compared to other patterns in this section.
  2. 00:40:119 (2) - Not sure what you're trying to emphasize with this note. The vocal slip is too vague to me, while the guitar is still 1/3.
  3. 00:41:339 (5,3) - Hmm.. had trouble reading this, perhaps because both the head and end of (3) are covered by (5). Not too problematic, but (3) is already appears when (5) is still active... up to you..
  4. 00:43:260 (5,1) - For both emphasis, flow and readability. I think it's best to separate these two a bit more.`
  5. 00:45:199 (1) - 00:50:493 (2) - 01:40:522 (8) - 01:52:133 (1) - 02:14:447 (2) - 02:15:026 (1) - 02:16:532 (3) - 02:23:625 (1) - 02:30:920 (12) - 02:40:786 (5) - For once, I can agree with Shiirn a bit. The last two red notes are impossible to actually see it's affects on the slider body, but I feel they do affect SV somehow. Considering the rules have remained untouched concerning sliders like these, maybe simplify it a bit. The other slider mentioned, should be considered to be simplified, that's all.
  6. 00:56:971 (4,5) - Small angled jumps like these play quite awkward on lower BPM, so I doubt they play nicely on high. Seeing that the angles of previous patterns were pretty sharp, maybe do that here too.
  7. 01:37:630 (5) - Seeing other jump patterns, kinda expected a larger jump here instead of one straight line to emphasize the guitar.
  8. 01:38:058 (1,2,3,4) - 02:26:362 (1,2,3,4) - Completely up to you, but maybe some readability issues in the kicksliders can be solved with having NC pattern consistent of 4 objects each. (would really help with stuff like 02:26:778 (5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4) - etc.)
  9. 01:41:058 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - lol this on high bpm doesnt look smart tbh (tho if a player CAN fc the rest of the diff, this should be really doable if the player is at that level)
  10. 01:46:197 (3,1) - 01:50:506 (3,1) - etc. Due to this being 300 BPM tapping + red line earlier than red tick, I find that this might be hard to catch. Either closer or slider-based jump instead feels more right to me. Maybe it's just me...
  11. 01:47:749 (3) - left out on purpose right? just asking lol
  12. 01:59:570 (1) - Sounds like it's almost blending in with the cymbal crash itself, would raise volume for this object.
  13. 02:02:564 (2,3,4,5) - Considering the intensity of the sounds, kinda expected larger spacing tbh. Maybe use 1.1x like 02:09:830 (2,3,4,5) - ?
  14. 02:21:427 (4,5) - Feels weird since it's so close to the slider end... up to you.
  15. 02:24:229 (3,4,5,1,2,3) - Sounds off. (especially (4) and (3, next combo))
  16. 02:29:206 (4) - Compared to most other overlaps, this slider is like 75% covered, unlike others which are still -kinda- readable.
  17. 02:43:239 (1,2,1,2,1,2) - Wish you made the custom stack a little larger in spacing (like 02:39:686 (1,1,1) - )nso you can actually see the NCs lel, they are readable on it's own, especially since most skins do not have 300 skinned, but the stack with the previous stream doesn't make this exactly more comfortable.
  18. 04:49:418 (1) - Unsnapped.
Disagree with a lot of things myself as well, but it seems, despite the hate, there are also quite a bit of people who would love to see this ranked. One map cannot satisfy all.

Let me know if you decide to fix things and I'll see what I can do!
melloe
275 posts
Joined February 2013
melloe

estellia- wrote:

already missing the point, so many things have been brought up about this map and you're neglecting everything else

people have already time and time again stated the fact that monstrata contradicted himself by saying its a map he made for "lolz" and yet still has serious meaning behind it, and somehow that meaning is some shitty excuse of "philosophy". boi, if it were anyone who prompted the "artsy" argument first it'd be monstrata trying to be edgy and defending himself in the shittiest way possible lol. the fact that people are still defending monstrata is such a joke.

all i'm typing out here is an opinion. as much as i see no value in monstrata's map, perhaps you see no value in my argument. many things to mention about what you said about what i said but i'm seriously too lazy lol. typing out arguments is a pain in the ass, especially when it won't make sense to you anyways
There is value in your argument in that it brings up (and is itself) a kneejerk reaction for many people who encounter something they find unfamiliar or ugly, which is to promptly slap the label "art" on it and declare it pretentious frivolity. Is it a logically sound argument? No, I don't think so.

You also have to understand that when Monstrata waxes poetic in his long posts that he is meming. He's invoking Horace (he literally said "yolo" in his post), he's posting huge walls of quotes from Woody Allen and Confucious, he linked Christina Aguilera's "Beautiful." He actually posted the actual god damn Tatoe song. All these posts are not "Philosophy," they are "Memes." I really don't know how any of you can think he's actually being serious when he says those things.

His map isn't a sternfaced, semantic composition on death and its meaning. That's what he's saying when he wants people to laugh at/with the map. It's kind of a silly map with silly sliders, and the song itself is pretty out there and wild. It's an interesting map for people to say, "haha wow this is kinda weird/cool." That's what he means when he says laugh. He's not hoping that people think it's utter crap and ridicule the living shit out of it.

It's not a complete mess of a map. He's already said that "there's already enough structure involved, both in the consistency of my rhythm choices, and the flow/movement choices between these patterns" and has chosen the sliders to be messy out of everything else. There's method and reasoning that has gone into the mapping, it's not a throwaway joke. Does this mean that the map is above criticism? Of course not. There are things I don't like about it and have brought up that he has seriously responded to, and other criticism that he is still now dealing with where he doesn't even once mention philosophy.

It's okay to criticize the map. But we should begin by viewing the map as what it simply is, which is "messy sliders for a messy song." There's a lot of ways you can go from there. Maybe the sliders are TOO messy, maybe the sliders are messy in the wrong way, maybe they come across as lazy instead of messy. Maybe you disagree with the rhythm choices, the flow, the bad blankets. That's where you should start when you begin to criticize the map, and if Monstrata doesn't respond to your satisfaction then that's fine. But you have to know that if your purpose in criticizing the map is to make it exactly how you want because you don't like so many things about the map and you want him to make the sliders all pretty and the map all neat, then short of him bending over and letting you backseat map for him, you are not going to get what you want.

If you notice the types of criticism he has been responding to and how he has responded to it, you'll notice a pattern. Any stupid, ideological qualms about the map, he has responded with in a way that he feels the response is deserving of: equally ideological, equally vague, equally unspecific. But if you actually get down and talk about, say, red nodes and white nodes, he will respond in the same terms. Same with actual mods.

And "it won't make sense to you anyway?" Seriously? What kind of puerile grade school jab is that? I suppose next you'll be just responding with a short post: "too long didnt read i kno im better then u anyway xd"

In conclusion, can we really all just stop screaming out "ART!! ART!! ART!!" and make some more productive arguments? Because there are more productive arguments to be made. And if Monstrata is uncompromising and doesn't get anywhere with his map, that's on him. But we first have to give the mapper a little room for himself and stop trying to enforce our arbitrary standards on him for every little thing.
DuckNess
DuckNess

Monstrata wrote:

Mapping is an art. I understand that the concept might be difficult for you to comprehend. Perhaps you should try mapping before you reject it as a form of expression.

Mapping is not literature, it is philosophy. Literature is what you read, it is simply a medium from which ideas are spread. Other mediums include film, photography, anime, music, poetry, painting, food... The list continues. Fundamentally, every piece of art strives to convey a message, however small it may be. At the elementary level, drawings, sketches, photos, paintings, they try to show us the world, from the eyes of the artist. From a different perspective. With a different focus. At a different angle. Using different juxtapositions. They try to show us beauty, to revel in the magnificence of nature, of flavours, of music in harmony. Art allows for ideas to be filtered through the perspective, the opinions, the mental process of the artist. Art doesn't need to impact society, or any form of culture in the world to be successful. It just needs to get its message across. You may disagree with the artist, but whether you agree or disagree, you still process the artist's idea.

While no TV Size Anime Opening by LiSA did make an impact in my life, another song really moved me to pursue my dreams and ambitions, and to really live life to the fullest. It told me that even if the world was ending, even if the entirety of the world were to melt away, that as long as I had something to live for, something that kept me going, my life would not be a waste. The artist acknowledges how ephemeral life can be. That we are simply a ripple in the ocean of life. However, she sings that no matter how futile we may feel, even if the world were to disappear, that nothing should stop us from making the most of our lives. In a sense, she echoes the works of poet Horace's Odes by urging her audience to seize the day. This concept of "carpe diem" is interwoven even in society today, through the more vernacular "yolo" but the artists' messages from two thousand years ago to today continue to be relevant. This song really taught me to make the most out of my life. To do what I want to do, to not look back, to not waste my time worrying, to fully immerse myself in life's beauty. Life is fleeting, so lets make the most out of it! Please listen to this song, perhaps it will give you a new lease on life as it did mine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULHQPm8hmVk
i am fucking sorry but this makes me wanna killmyself
Arusamour
424 posts
Joined April 2014
Arusamour

winber1 wrote:

i love boobs
me2
Ayesha Altugle
3,091 posts
Joined October 2011
Ayesha Altugle
Tatoe
FriendoFox
170 posts
Joined December 2013
FriendoFox
The map is fun, it just feels.. overmapped at some places
If I was good at modding I'd do it, but I'd probably only be a waste of time on reading, the only thing I don't like is the sliderjump-ish-parts, but that's just me.
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
Quote: appleeaterx

my 2c on this
I feel really bad if the sliders in this map do not satisfy your usual 3°-tilted and slightly-curved ones, but if it really bothers you to that degree; feel free to play estellia's version or, even if you can't, map it yourself. I know that puffy answer is really lame and overmeme'd, but when I browse through the thread, the main message from some people I get is: I don't like it, I think it's ugly, so it must be ugly to everyone. I think that 'map yourself' is perfectly applicable to this situation in this case.

If this map can make you write essay-lengthed posts where you try to override your own standards and style on someone else's set, then maybe it is just as pathetic as modern art has gotten.

You guys made your point clear; you do not like the map. People do understand that after the first post or two - if you have a big problem with any of these issues, feel free to contact the mapper yourself and talk in private, instead of repeating the same message by spamming this thread with highly-subjective self-centered opinions.

Yes, this ranking process is mostly community-driven, but the ones who gave critique are not the whole community, now are they? If there are a handful of people who can also enjoy this, and this fits the current RC objectively, I don't find this set a problem.

Let's get to the set itself.

[General]
  1. I don't think 100% accurate timing can be achieved with this song, but I assume you already made the final timing changes?
  2. Are you still going to change the HP? Okay i'll change this now. I think i've testplayed the diff enough now lol.
  3. Still my doubts on metadata. マキシマム ザ ホルモン vs. マキシマムザホルモン and Maximum the Hormone vs. MAXIMUM THE HORMONE. I hope you can confirm this. The spaces don't really matter, but removing them is better so I'll do that. Also ALL CAPS seems to be how they are stylizing their name so i'll do that too.

    https://twitter.com/MTH_OFFICIAL
    http://www.55mth.com/pc/index.php
    http://www.55mth.com/pc/discography/
    http://www.maximumthehormone.jp/news.html
[Expert]
  1. 00:28:922 (1,2,3,4) - Feels cramped compared to other patterns in this section. True. Made this less cramped.
  2. 00:40:119 (2) - Not sure what you're trying to emphasize with this note. The vocal slip is too vague to me, while the guitar is still 1/3. Ehh, At first I wanted the triplet there to maintain that 1/2 clicking rhythm, cuz starting on a red tick felt off to me in terms of clicking rhythm, but It's actually not as bad as I thought, so I just removed the triplet and made 00:39:852 (6) - a repeat slider instead lol.
  3. 00:41:339 (5,3) - Hmm.. had trouble reading this, perhaps because both the head and end of (3) are covered by (5). Not too problematic, but (3) is already appears when (5) is still active... up to you.. I changed the shape of slider 5 so it's easier to see 3.
  4. 00:43:260 (5,1) - For both emphasis, flow and readability. I think it's best to separate these two a bit more.`Added some much needed triangles here.
  5. Note: This is going to be for Shiirn/other people who want to better understand my intentions for slider-nodes as well00:45:199 (1) - Trimmed the ends and removed unnecessary white nodes. 00:50:493 (2) - Trimmed it down too. 01:40:522 (8) - Here too, trimmed it down 01:52:133 (1) - This one's intentional and I think the design is pretty good actually x__x02:14:447 (2) - Reduced some reds and whites02:15:026 (1) - Changed some of the nodes. Basically i made the angle change between red nodes less sharp so theres less of an effect on apparent slider speed 02:16:532 (3) - I think this one's fine though, since it's just a slight bump. 02:23:625 (1) - This one's fine too, since the red nodes aren't changing up the slider's apparent speed. It'll play just like a blanket slider with the same speed, except the edges are sharp.02:30:920 (12) - Made them mostly white nodes instead.02:40:786 (5) - This one's just a bump too so I'd like to keep xP. For once, I can agree with Shiirn a bit. The last two red notes are impossible to actually see it's affects on the slider body, but I feel they do affect SV somehow. Considering the rules have remained untouched concerning sliders like these, maybe simplify it a bit. The other slider mentioned, should be considered to be simplified, that's all. I was imitating some of val0108's sliders tbh xD. Basically, sliders have a consistent SV which we can't alter. What we can do, is use red nodes to alter the apparent SV which is what SV will feel like to players. Having red notes up and down in a zigzag formation perpendicular to the slider will cause the slider to scrunch and slow down, as (given a horizontal slider) there is now more Y axis for the slider to cover. My intentional wasn't to change the apparent SV, it was just to create a lot of small bumps and wonky slider paths. White nodes only increase the formula for a slider curve, but they don't actually end a curve function in a slider, only red nodes and slider-ends do, so in a sense you could get a slider with 40+ white nodes all scrunched up together, and be able to replicate the speed of the slider with just one white node. The second slider with one white node would just look a lot cleaner, but SV and apparent SV remain unchanged. The difference is when more red nodes come into play, because they can actually create apparent SV changes. So I think the majority of my changes here were to make these red nodes as subtle as possible. IE, when they are used, they don't create angles that could make the slider appear slower than necessary. From the images below, you can see that white nodes, despite there being a lot more, have a much lesser visual effect on the slider's apparent velocity, whereas red notes, because they end curves, end up having a much larger effect.
    Visualization

  6. 00:56:971 (4,5) - Small angled jumps like these play quite awkward on lower BPM, so I doubt they play nicely on high. Seeing that the angles of previous patterns were pretty sharp, maybe do that here too. Easy fix
  7. 01:37:630 (5) - Seeing other jump patterns, kinda expected a larger jump here instead of one straight line to emphasize the guitar. Fair enough, changed to something normal xD.
  8. 01:38:058 (1,2,3,4) - 02:26:362 (1,2,3,4) - Completely up to you, but maybe some readability issues in the kicksliders can be solved with having NC pattern consistent of 4 objects each. (would really help with stuff like 02:26:778 (5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4) - etc.) I'd prefer to keep the NCs how they are. Idk, i don't think NC'ing will help with readability in this case, so i'm using the NC's to show how the kicksliders will play. When there's an NC theres a change in flow/movement from up/down to rotational, or left/right etc...
  9. 01:41:058 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - lol this on high bpm doesnt look smart tbh (tho if a player CAN fc the rest of the diff, this should be really doable if the player is at that level) Hey that's my reasoning too. But I think the pattern can still work on high bpm. It works as a nice ending to all the 1/4 kicksliders and I think the song is kinda building up to this point.
  10. 01:46:197 (3,1) - 01:50:506 (3,1) - etc. Due to this being 300 BPM tapping + red line earlier than red tick, I find that this might be hard to catch. Either closer or slider-based jump instead feels more right to me. Maybe it's just me... Made them closer. I already NC'ed them for better readability but yea i think i should supplement that with spacing too.
  11. 01:47:749 (3) - left out on purpose right? just asking lol Yea this one's too close. I made 3 farther away tho.
  12. 01:59:570 (1) - Sounds like it's almost blending in with the cymbal crash itself, would raise volume for this object. Raised
  13. 02:02:564 (2,3,4,5) - Considering the intensity of the sounds, kinda expected larger spacing tbh. Maybe use 1.1x like 02:09:830 (2,3,4,5) - ? I think the 90degree-ness of these squares are enough. Its coming out of a slow section so I don't want to make it too drastic just yet. The next section is really alternator-friendly, and you can even single-tap it with relative ease because of the rhythm, so I think the low spacing here is better since the rhythm density already contributes a bit to overall difficulty. The second one leads into a more intense section so yea, larger spacing.
  14. 02:21:427 (4,5) - Feels weird since it's so close to the slider end... up to you. I kinda like this xP.
  15. 02:24:229 (3,4,5,1,2,3) - Sounds off. (especially (4) and (3, next combo)) Fixed.
  16. 02:29:206 (4) - Compared to most other overlaps, this slider is like 75% covered, unlike others which are still -kinda- readable. Made it less covered.
  17. 02:43:239 (1,2,1,2,1,2) - Wish you made the custom stack a little larger in spacing (like 02:39:686 (1,1,1) - )nso you can actually see the NCs lel, they are readable on it's own, especially since most skins do not have 300 skinned, but the stack with the previous stream doesn't make this exactly more comfortable. Sure.
  18. 04:49:418 (1) - Unsnapped. Report me.
Disagree with a lot of things myself as well, but it seems, despite the hate, there are also quite a bit of people who would love to see this ranked. One map cannot satisfy all.

Let me know if you decide to fix things and I'll see what I can do!

---

Thanks for this mod apple >//< I hope I covered the slider-node issue thoroughly.

EDIT: Removed the quote so the images load better.
Last edited by Monstrata , edited 2 times in total.
Mint
1,611 posts
Joined February 2013
Mint
Changed metadata, fixed another snap issue. The slider designs have been explained in details in the post above, let's see how this goes.
Also, MA´s weird concurrent thing seems like a bug.
Rebubbled #1.
Yuii-
2,501 posts
Joined July 2013
Yuii-
So, we discussed some patterns, but... we didn't really fix anything, it was most likely pure clarification.
Mazziv
998 posts
Joined July 2013
Mazziv
ONE MORE LETS GO
Giralda
1,008 posts
Joined August 2012
Giralda
I love you apple.
ConsumerOfBean
449 posts
Joined April 2015
ConsumerOfBean
Extremely minor thing
02:28:885 (1,2,3,4) -
02:32:313 (9,10,11,12) -
Why does the former have a new combo but not the latter? It's the same sounds so I don't see why it would be inconsistent.
Underforest
5,895 posts
Joined July 2015
Underforest
just saying before you go for qualify, congrats xd
Ascendance
Elite Mapper
4,249 posts
Joined July 2013
Ascendance
do i do it
gremory123_
2 posts
Joined August 2015
gremory123_
do it Ascendance, no balls
cyprianz5
249 posts
Joined February 2013
cyprianz5
i think it should has ar10...
Togetic
128 posts
Joined March 2015
Togetic
i honestly wouldn't be surprised if you could rank your aspire map if this becomes ranked
Togetic
128 posts
Joined March 2015
Togetic
i honestly wouldn't be surprised if you could rank your aspire map if this becomes ranked
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
After a lot of discussion, we've decided that we will flame this map in a day or two. I think it's fair to give the community a chance for some final words. I don't want to make the icons seem rushed, a lot of individual work has been put into pushing this forward, it just happens that everyone was available and ready to icon it today.
deathmarc4
55 posts
Joined November 2013
deathmarc4

Monstrata wrote:

I think it's fair to give the community a chance for some final words
Meet Bob. Bob plays osu. Bob finds a song he likes and wants to map. Bob knows the song doesn't translate well into the game, but Bob maps it because he enjoys mapping and he enjoys the song. Bob really enjoys his map, and Bob uploads it to the osu website so that other people might stumble across his map and enjoy it. Bob lets his map graveyard because he understands that the song itself is unrankable and that not everything he uploads needs to be ranked.

you are not bob
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn

Monstrata wrote:

After a lot of discussion, we've decided that we will flame this map in a day or two. I think it's fair to give the community a chance for some final words. I don't want to make the icons seem rushed, a lot of individual work has been put into pushing this forward, it just happens that everyone was available and ready to icon it today.

wank wank wank wank wank wank wank


there's my words
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

Shiirn wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

After a lot of discussion, we've decided that we will flame this map in a day or two. I think it's fair to give the community a chance for some final words. I don't want to make the icons seem rushed, a lot of individual work has been put into pushing this forward, it just happens that everyone was available and ready to icon it today.

wank wank wank wank wank wank wank


there's my words
I see the song has really moved you.
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
maximum the hormone is basically like



edge in a can
Fezu
41 posts
Joined November 2012
Fezu

Monstrata wrote:

After a lot of discussion, we've decided that we will flame this map in a day or two. I think it's fair to give the community a chance for some final words. I don't want to make the icons seem rushed, a lot of individual work has been put into pushing this forward, it just happens that everyone was available and ready to icon it today.
Can you rank Quaver next please?
Coin
36 posts
Joined June 2014
Coin

Shiirn wrote:

maximum the hormone is basically like



edge in a can
more like
nyathil
24 posts
Joined March 2014
nyathil
AR10 just feels a lot more fitting when playing this. And HP 4.5-4.7 feels more fitting than 5. idk that's just my opinion on the matter...
XII
259 posts
Joined November 2013
XII
This isn't 5 minutes, where is the set? Or am I missing something.

Approved Category is only for Marathon maps. Long maps with over 5 minutes of draining time fit the Approval category. Only then they are allowed to be single difficulty mapsets. If they are below 5 minutes of draining time, a full difficulty spread is needed and the map will have to be ranked instead.
And isn't the approved section dead anyways? I don't see why they would break their guidelines and use a section that has been unused since 2.5 years back.

Edit: Totally forgot about the ol' long spinner at the end.
Last edited by XII , edited 1 time in total.
squishyguppy
1,256 posts
Joined March 2014
squishyguppy

XII wrote:

This isn't 5 minutes, where is the set? Or am I missing something.

Approved Category is only for Marathon maps. Long maps with over 5 minutes of draining time fit the Approval category. Only then they are allowed to be single difficulty mapsets. If they are below 5 minutes of draining time, a full difficulty spread is needed and the map will have to be ranked instead.
And isn't the approved section dead anyways? I don't see why they would break their guidelines and use a section that has been unused since 2.5 years back.

the drain time calculator is kind of broken because it doesn't really count spinners
XII
259 posts
Joined November 2013
XII

[alt][F4] wrote:

the drain time calculator is kind of broken because it doesn't really count spinners
Totally forgot about that!
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
osu!completionist
118 posts
Joined July 2013
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
MAXIMUM THE CIRCLEJERK - A-L-I-E-N [Stop! Stop complaining about my map and let me rank this!]
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

FailureAtOsu wrote:

Extremely minor thing
02:28:885 (1,2,3,4) -
02:32:313 (9,10,11,12) -
Why does the former have a new combo but not the latter? It's the same sounds so I don't see why it would be inconsistent.
The NC's here are placed based on movement and flow, and not rhythm. Since its one consistent updown or leftright movement it has one combo, where as the previous ones can be split into two sets of flows/movements with backforth going into clockwise/counterclock.

Thanks for checking though!

N1k0 wrote:

AR10 just feels a lot more fitting when playing this. And HP 4.5-4.7 feels more fitting than 5. idk that's just my opinion on the matter...
AR 9.7 is high enough imo. Theres already been a lot of discussion going into this, you can check out p/5253277 if you'd like to read more into detail! Thanks for your concerns.

I feel like decimal HP values won't really make much of a difference though, just because of how complicated HP drain actually is. 5 is really just there because people believe 3/4 to be too low for a map of this difficulty. I don't really wanna get into the math of decimal HP drain cuz I myself don't really know how to calculate it lol.
EphemeralFetish
472 posts
Joined May 2014
EphemeralFetish
Posting for clarification.

https://www.discogs.com/Maximum-The-Hor ... se/4887492

Official run time is 4:46. Making this MP3 an edited version. Yet no mention of this in the metadata. (Even though as far as Im aware editing MP3's for more length is against a rule)
Battle
2,865 posts
Joined February 2014
Battle
often times if the mp3 is edited by the user, you still use the same metadata as the source, for example if you cut a song to be shorter such as this due to it being repetitive you still keep the same metadata
lilelf29
120 posts
Joined June 2013
lilelf29

Battle wrote:

often times if the mp3 is edited by the user, you still use the same metadata as the source, for example if you cut a song to be shorter such as this due to it being repetitive you still keep the same metadata
Editing the song to be shorter is very different to editing it to be longer.
I fail to see what point you're making?
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata
mp3 is slightly edited yes. It's not against the current ruleset, but you're welcome to discuss it further, here: t/417977.
lilelf29
120 posts
Joined June 2013
lilelf29

Monstrata wrote:

mp3 is slightly edited yes. It's not against the current ruleset, but you're welcome to discuss it further, here: t/417977.
Wait it's allowed?
I thought you just linked to a thread that says you can't extend the mp3 file, unless I'm missing something.
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

lilelf29 wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

mp3 is slightly edited yes. It's not against the current ruleset, but you're welcome to discuss it further, here: t/417977.
Wait it's allowed?
I thought you just linked to a thread that says you can't extend the mp3 file, unless I'm missing something.
It's allowed currently. The thread is a discussion about making mp3 extension against the rules. I thought i'd link it so people can discuss there instead.
QTS
25 posts
Joined September 2013
QTS
This song should not be qualified nor ranked.

Half of the map is some kind of lullaby that is FC:able by 5 digit players, including me, this necessarily might not be a bad thing, but I personally find it unfit for a 8.5* map.

Other than that, I find that the map isn't of greater quality, even though I probably wouldn't be able to do shit better myself, but I just find it to play awfully bad.
lilelf29
120 posts
Joined June 2013
lilelf29

Monstrata wrote:

It's allowed currently. The thread is a discussion about making mp3 extension against the rules. I thought i'd link it so people can discuss there instead.
Oh damn, I know a few people that are under the impression it's not allowed and so instead are making mapsets of 4min+ songs.
Will spread the news that they don't need to.
unko
521 posts
Joined March 2014
unko
monstrata reply to wank wank wank but not bob
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Topic Starter
Monstrata

lilelf29 wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

It's allowed currently. The thread is a discussion about making mp3 extension against the rules. I thought i'd link it so people can discuss there instead.
Oh damn, I know a few people that are under the impression it's not allowed and so instead are making mapsets of 4min+ songs.
Will spread the news that they don't need to.
Well, if you extend, you should try to make it as natural as possible too. It's sometimes quite hard to extend songs past 5 minutes, especially if theyre like just 4:01 or something. There are a lot of songs i want to map, that are like 4:40-4:50 that I just can't tastefully extend haha.
Sieg
3,981 posts
Joined February 2012
Sieg
placeholder
blahpy
297 posts
Joined November 2013
blahpy

MillhioreF wrote:

Remember: there's nothing wrong with mapping for the graveyard.
Slips
195 posts
Joined November 2015
Slips

Monstrata wrote:

Well, if you extend, you should try to make it as natural as possible too. It's sometimes quite hard to extend songs past 5 minutes, especially if theyre like just 4:01 or something. There are a lot of songs i want to map, that are like 4:40-4:50 that I just can't tastefully extend haha.
Not every map has to be marathon size. Couldn't you just make more diffs?
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