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Moving to Insane maps

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Total Posts
42
Android34
3 posts
Joined July 2014
Topic Starter
Android34
Probably a very common topic here.

Okay so I've been playing osu! for less than a month now. I can complete the Hard level maps at my current stage, with a few exceptional hard ones though. So I've been trying out the Insane maps for a couple of days, with the No-Fail mod duh. I'm practicing on certain maps with this mod to learn to cope with the speed.

The gap from Hard to Insane is immense. Can't seem to complete a single one without the mod. For a player who isn't even a month old, should I even be touching them? It does feel easier to complete the Hard level maps after practicing on the Insane ones.

How long did it exactly take you guys to learn to complete Insane maps? Also, a bunch of tips would be really appreciated.
E m i
E m i
eh, you're not gonna do good on insanes if you're getting Cs and Bs on hards.
but do whatever you want.
Mahogany
2,684 posts
Joined August 2014
Mahogany

Android34 wrote:

For a player who isn't even a month old, should I even be touching them?
No. From the sounds of it you shouldn't be playing hards either.

osu! focuses on getting full combos with an S rank. Most of your top plays are Bs, which is pathetic.

You should be playing the hardest maps you can consistently Full Combo, not the hardest maps you can pass.
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
Well, only passing a map is usually not a very hard thing to do, so even if you can pass hard maps, it doesn't necessarily mean that you are good enough to actually "play" hard maps. If you were playing, say, a guitar, and you mess up 1/10th of every song you try to play, you wouldn't consider yourself being able to play the guitar at that level, right? Similarly, getting between 80%-90% (most of your top performance hard maps) isn't really being able to play said difficulty properly. It might be fun to challenge yourself with faster and harder maps when you pass something, but doing so will result in you picking up bad habits (such as mashing or flinging your cursor and hoping you hit), and will make your life much harder later on.

The best thing you can do right now is probably working on your fundamentals until Hard maps are a breeze, and at that point you've probably already done pretty well on a few insanes.
KanoSet
906 posts
Joined October 2014
KanoSet
play whatever u can complete and don't rush, for me it took 3-4 months i guess but it's diffrenet from player to another :)
just play and have fun.
and by looking to your profile u got a bad accuracy there..
so basically play maps that u can get B or A on it maybe with a good accuracy as well.. u need to master them no ? ^^"
and for training play something u can hardly clear with a C or u even don't cuz of a few misses.. play them with or without nofail it's up to u.. but don't focus on them.. i mean don't just train 24/7.. have some fun playing something u can do it with a good result
at least that how it is to me
EneT
1,022 posts
Joined August 2014
EneT

[ Momiji ] wrote:

eh, you're not gonna do good on insanes if you're getting Cs and Bs on hards.
but do whatever you want.
should be getting As and S's
dung eater
2,400 posts
Joined December 2013
dung eater
missing a circle is a mistake

tapping off rhytm is also a mistake

nobody is perfect (expect those guys who farm ss and dump other scores)

keep these things in mind, try to play better and keep improving :3

and have fun
ZenithPhantasm
ZenithPhantasm
Play more
Android34
3 posts
Joined July 2014
Topic Starter
Android34
I wasn't aware moving to Insane maps with Bs and Cs in Hard ones would be a bad thing. I was hoping more like, if I can learn to 'cope' with the speed of Insane ones, I'd manage to get As and S's in the Hard ones if I tried them out then.

Like, it worked for me when I coped with the Hard maps and was then able to get As and S's in Normal ones. Shouldn't the same work here?
EneT
1,022 posts
Joined August 2014
EneT

Android34 wrote:

I wasn't aware moving to Insane maps with Bs and Cs in Hard ones would be a bad thing. I was hoping more like, if I can learn to 'cope' with the speed of Insane ones, I'd manage to get As and S's in the Hard ones if I tried them out then.

Like, it worked for me when I coped with the Hard maps and was then able to get As and S's in Normal ones. Shouldn't the same work here?
No, it will cause you to have bad habits instead, button mashing, shit accuracy etc.
Fleuret
131 posts
Joined October 2011
Fleuret

Android34 wrote:

I wasn't aware moving to Insane maps with Bs and Cs in Hard ones would be a bad thing. I was hoping more like, if I can learn to 'cope' with the speed of Insane ones, I'd manage to get As and S's in the Hard ones if I tried them out then.

Like, it worked for me when I coped with the Hard maps and was then able to get As and S's in Normal ones. Shouldn't the same work here?
And is it working for you now? Obviously you wouldn't even need to make a thread about it if it is. Until you can say with absolute confidence that you can FC hard maps with decent accuracy, stick with normal and hard.
Android34
3 posts
Joined July 2014
Topic Starter
Android34
Okay then. I'll take all that into account. The quick replies were appreciated.
Mahogany
2,684 posts
Joined August 2014
Mahogany
Trust me, the only way to be bad at osu is if you spam maps way harder than you can play. It's good you've taken the board's advice to heart.
Yuudachi-kun
5,434 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

Mahoganytooth wrote:

Android34 wrote:

For a player who isn't even a month old, should I even be touching them?
No. From the sounds of it you shouldn't be playing hards either.

osu! focuses on getting full combos with an S rank. Most of your top plays are Bs, which is pathetic.

You should be playing the hardest maps you can consistently Full Combo, not the hardest maps you can pass.
First time I hear you saying what I would say and not talking about acc. 8-)

FC gives you most of the pp (Except at high od). Acc lets you squeeze the map dry.
Mahogany
2,684 posts
Joined August 2014
Mahogany
It's hard to acc well on hard maps. It actually gets easier to acc once you start getting into medium insanes and such because you can keep a steady singletapping motion going.

Learning acc is something you can do later, just don't let it fall too low
pandaBee
2,004 posts
Joined December 2014
pandaBee
Keep in mind that you should generally be moving up in star increments(2.8,2.9,3.0,3.1,3.2....), not named difficulty increments(hard, insane, etc). There are plenty of 'hard' songs that are much harder than 'insane' ones so the categorization is not perfect and is also very wide in range.
Last edited by pandaBee , edited 1 time in total.
Yuudachi-kun
5,434 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

pandaBee wrote:

Keep in mind that you should generally be moving up in star increments, not named difficulty increments.
I think that the diff spread for easy/normal/hard is too close together. I'd like to see hards = 3.5-4.5 and insane being 4.5-5.5 etc, but that's just my opinion.
1319
515 posts
Joined June 2013
1319

pandaBee wrote:

Keep in mind that you should generally be moving up in star increments(2.8,2.9,3.0,3.1,3.2....), not named difficulty increments(hard, insane, etc).
ok let's be honest
how many of you did ^
i know i didn't
E m i
E m i
4.5 hards, nice
pandaBee
2,004 posts
Joined December 2014
pandaBee

Kheldragar wrote:

I think that the diff spread for easy/normal/hard is too close together. I'd like to see hards = 3.5-4.5 and insane being 4.5-5.5 etc, but that's just my opinion.
To you maybe. To a beginner it's certainly not. Easy is stuff you play when you first start out and have no idea what you're doing. It's where you learn how to click on time with the approach circles. Normal is where you get introduced to very simple patterns and the AR tends to get higher as well. Hard is osu basics 101. Insane is like intermediate.
Yuudachi-kun
5,434 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

Faces3 wrote:

pandaBee wrote:

Keep in mind that you should generally be moving up in star increments(2.8,2.9,3.0,3.1,3.2....), not named difficulty increments(hard, insane, etc).
ok let's be honest
how many of you did ^
i know i didn't
I just used Tillerino to check pp values for an fc and moved my diff standards up because I have a rough estimate of what pp values gives me a good amount of ranks.
pandaBee
2,004 posts
Joined December 2014
pandaBee

Faces3 wrote:

ok let's be honest
how many of you did ^
i know i didn't
It's not hard to do when you have...
SPOILER

and do...
SPOILER
Last edited by pandaBee , edited 1 time in total.
Yuudachi-kun
5,434 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

pandaBee wrote:

Kheldragar wrote:

I think that the diff spread for easy/normal/hard is too close together. I'd like to see hards = 3.5-4.5 and insane being 4.5-5.5 etc, but that's just my opinion.
To you maybe. To a beginner it's certainly not. Easy is stuff you play when you first start out and have no idea what you're doing. It's where you learn how to click on time with the approach circles. Normal is where you get introduced to very simple patterns and the AR tends to get higher as well. Hard is osu basics 101. Insane is like intermediate.
I don't want to call insane intermediate; insane should be insane. Hard should be intermediate because they're, well, "hard."

Of course there are also some insanes that are like 5.5 stars, but most diffs there have their own special name or are called extra/another
1319
515 posts
Joined June 2013
1319

pandaBee wrote:

Faces3 wrote:

ok let's be honest
how many of you did ^
i know i didn't
It's not hard to do when you...
SPOILER
what am i looking at here
pandaBee
2,004 posts
Joined December 2014
pandaBee

Kheldragar wrote:

I don't want to call insane intermediate; insane should be insane. Hard should be intermediate because they're, well, "hard."

Of course there are also some insanes that are like 5.5 stars, but most diffs there have their own special name or are called extra/another
Well sure. Honestly star ranges are a better description anyways, since they're continuous and not strictly discrete categorizations.
It would probably be something like
<3 = beginner/novice
3-3.65 = Advanced novice
3.65-4.3 = Intermediate
4.3-4.8ish = Advanced
etc. etc.

Faces3 wrote:

what am i looking at here
Reread my ninja edit.
Yuudachi-kun
5,434 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

pandaBee wrote:

Kheldragar wrote:

I don't want to call insane intermediate; insane should be insane. Hard should be intermediate because they're, well, "hard."

Of course there are also some insanes that are like 5.5 stars, but most diffs there have their own special name or are called extra/another
Well sure. Honestly star ranges are a better description anyways, since they're continuous and not strictly discrete categorizations.
I don't bother with difficulty names either, it's just annoying when I ask someone what they play and they give me not an actual star value, but a diff name without knowing the star range. I don't know what star your fucking hard is. Is that 2? 3?

I'm still curious why when you group things by difficulty it says 4 stars is 3.5-4.49; why not 4.00-4.99?

pandaBee wrote:

<3 = beginner/novice
3-3.65 = Advanced novice
3.65-4.3 = Intermediate
4.3-4.8ish = Advanced
etc. etc.
<2 = Beginner/novice Easy
<3.5 = Advanced Novice Normal
3.5 - 4.5 = Intermediate Hard
4.5 - 5.25 = Advanced Insane
5.25 - 5.75 = expert Extra
5.75+ = <I can't think of a good name>
Last edited by Yuudachi-kun , edited 2 times in total.
pandaBee
2,004 posts
Joined December 2014
pandaBee

Kheldragar wrote:

I'm still curious why when you group things by difficulty it says 4 stars is 3.5-4.49; why not 4.00-4.99?
They center it around the median/mean i.e. they take the midpoint of the range.
dung eater
2,400 posts
Joined December 2013
dung eater
stars don't take into account pattern or tapping complexity though, difficulty is subjective
Azucchi
280 posts
Joined January 2014
Azucchi
Well if you really wanna get used to the AR of insane maps, you can HR normals. Imo anyone can still read the notes of HR normals. The average AR of insane maps is 9, meaning that the time between the moment that a note appears and the moment when you actually have to click it is exactly one second. Until you can manage AR 8 with high acc, don't attempt AR 9s.
Yuudachi-kun
5,434 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun
AR9 is 600 ms, not 1,000 iirc.
ZenithPhantasm
ZenithPhantasm

jaaakb wrote:

stars don't take into account pattern or tapping complexity though, difficulty is subjective
This.

Tfw ppl care too much about numbers.
Ichi
277 posts
Joined July 2013
Ichi

Mahoganytooth wrote:

osu! focuses on getting full combos with an S rank. Most of your top plays are Bs, which is pathetic.
Wasn´t this a bit too much? lol.

Anyway, its not bad to eventually try harder maps than what your capabilities are and "mash" once in a while. The bad thing is to make it a habit, and be constantly trying to play things you cannot handle, read, or whatever.

You should folow three rules for an all round improvement and not messing up your reading.

1) Play maps you are well acquainted with and try to Full combo (FC) them, in a reasonable amount of retrys ( if not, move on)
2) Play maps Above your level, which you know you cannot full combo but still are able to pass with decent comfort.
3) Move between ars ( 8, 9 and 10) don´t get stuck constantly on one, and go back to old scores to improve them.

Folowing these and be balanced in how much time you spend on each point, will equal in a balanced playing style. Meaning you won´t only be able to play for instance, DT ar8 maps, but also nomod maps with hard patterns, or a high density map. GL!!
Kouya-
Kouya-
Why don't you work on perfecting normals and then move up to hards and so on .

That way you're ready and it won't seem as tough as it would've been .
Winterspring_old
Winterspring_old
Rip english ough it might hurt your eyes.
The worst thing you can do is moving to insane maps without "clear" hard's with Ss and 95%+ accuracy. I'm talking it based on myself.
I started playing osu! because of my friend who played osu for 1 year, and with him I started insane maps ignoring easier. It was really hard but after few days I could pass 4.2 star maps and it was amazing feeling. Based on that feeling I wanted to be faster and better so I started with 4.5-5.2 star maps. I was really proud of myself playing really hard maps after few weeks but... lack fundamentals is visible now. Every jumps are too hard for me. I can't do easy insane maps at 92%+, even hard's are too hard to Fc - Gettin' faster and "better" is no worth to ignore your mental and muscle memory limits.
As you can see reading this post (ofc if you know what I mean :P) - the worst thing is ignore basics.
Last edited by Winterspring_old , edited 1 time in total.
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