What lead you to think NH is scum?

Neighbours are benefits more town than scum. Since they have more places to discuss their scumreads and create strategies about the use of cards and hypers. If done properly, they can force scum to act like they want to and not the opposite. Just saying my opinion and what would be an ideal situation.

pieguy, you say selfvoting is better than just summarizing and throwing random questions?

I like this Choofers guy.

pieguy1372 wrote:

I'm assuming this is based on something he did in the neighborhood?

DakeDekaane wrote:

What lead you to think NH is scum?

I'm joking of course

DakeDekaane wrote:

pieguy, you say selfvoting is better than just summarizing and throwing random questions?

and self-voting is indicative of not scum hunting, how? I think it's fairly obvious I'm at least forming reads here.

DakeDekaane wrote:

Neighbours are benefits more town than scum. Since they have more places to discuss their scumreads and create strategies about the use of cards and hypers. If done properly, they can force scum to act like they want to and not the opposite. Just saying my opinion and what would be an ideal situation.

Having neighbor chat is more useful to town than scum, but knowing who's in which color team seems a bit useless as a townie, as far as I'm concerned

Frostings wrote:

Alright guys, I think I got it

NoHitter is scum

"woah someone's callin me out on mah brb using ogi to save face"

*on mah bullshit

huge post incoming in roughly 5 minutes everyone be real

you know how i get in mafia

Frostings gets + townpoints from me, the concern seemed genuine enough to convince me. On the other hand, Dake's super-new and innovative opinion that revealing our colors is not beneficial for town seems like a filler-post.

I see potential scum in JInxy, Dake and Hika (depending on her hooge post that is written right now tho).

Getting back to the setup, Sakura's answer on Frostings' question being neutral indicates that the cards do affect neighbors after all. Otherwise she'd just say 'no' and there would be no concern about the thing + the neigbor role itself makes more sense this way in this setup. Not like people were about to claim their colors right away, since that'd be kinda ridiculous and would cost them a scumread from me.

First of all, because this game is completely nonsense to me atm. I want to see everyone's stance after this post.
Unvote

pieguy1372 wrote:

and self-voting is indicative of not scum hunting, how? I think it's fairly obvious I'm at least forming reads here.

Personally, I think that self-voting does not prove to be an appropriate strategy because I see it as diverting attention from yourself in the manner that if you do it, no one will be willing to vote for you in the 50/50 chance that you are either scum or town. So I prefer it if none of you guys self vote and use it as an explanation for "scum hunting" because there is more town than scum. At least I hope so. I need to reread the rules a few more times again.

rEdo wrote:

[*]Hika with the DD vote, either not paying attention to the game or trying to counterwagon

Wagon was an accidental slip. 3 + 4 = 7, you can't split 7 in half and you most definitely split a person's vote in half, so 3 is getting a little closer to 4 which is a lot more than 3. My point is, wagon was a wrong choice of words, especially since I just glanced, saw names and started with RVS because no one is saying anything important, but so far, after reading ALL ISOs, GIF is very scummy and I don't like him right now. Why would you hold out information that could be useful to everyone on seeing how to end the day?

Choofers wrote:

GuyInFreezer wrote:

If I wanted to elaborate now I already would have done so.

okay let me be more explicit since holding out on supposed information is inherently scummy: why was your vote non-rvs? do you have a gut read on pieguy this early on in the game? are you fishing for reactions?

GIF, elaborate or you have all of my suspicion.
WIFOM, WIFOM, WIFOM!

rEdo wrote:

Looks like a good start. Hika, why do you think GIF voted pieguy?

Why do you ask me? I think it was because pieguy voted himself. Simple as that, no further explanation needed. I would vote for him too but can I have everyone's stance first?

Frostings wrote:

Why is the question directed to Hika, of all people as well

Why not ask GIF directly if he has any reason to retain his vote on pieguy other than trolling in RVS which is ubiquitous in all mafia games

I agree, why ask me? But I as I stated after the above quote to rEdo, I think it's because he voted himself. I would do the same thing if I was here to SEE him do it in action because that is super duper scummy. I wouldn't do that at all.

pieguy1372 wrote:

my issue with rEdo is that, despite listing off all the stuff that happened, he didn't take any kind of stance on any of it.

the point about Hika trying to "counterwagon" me is meh. it feels like an odd thing to focus on in early game. I'd like to know what he thinks knowing this would tell him about Hika's alignment.

I don't want random hammer without my point and my questions being answered and said. That is all. I am afraid that someone may make a mistake if they're not paying attention. I am speaking of past games but I just want everyone to know that if someone is about to be HAMMERED, let them make a defense statement. That should be obvious, but just saying so far.

Sure, it's an odd thing to focus on in early game but I want to know everyone's stance on each other after my questions are answered.

@rEdo, Choofers, DD: Stance on everyone thus far? I know it may be RVS so far but please take into consideration ISOs.
@GIF: Read above, why did you vote pieguy and say it was non-RVS when his ONLY action was voting himself. Do you think this is scummy as well?

P.S - Also I want to hear from NH when he gets back. o/

I am here for another 30 minutes to an hour if anyone would like to ask me questions.

Nooo my perfect pagetop ;A;

I took it because I deserve it :u
I love you all the same <3

Hika wrote:

Personally, I think that self-voting does not prove to be an appropriate strategy because I see it as diverting attention from yourself in the manner that if you do it, no one will be willing to vote for you in the 50/50 chance that you are either scum or town. So I prefer it if none of you guys self vote and use it as an explanation for "scum hunting" because there is more town than scum. At least I hope so. I need to reread the rules a few more times again.

you're missing the point

DD was saying that me "self-voting" is no better than what rEdo did (not scum hunting). which is dumb because in no way does me self-voting stop me from scum hunting - it's pretty clear that I have reads and think at least one person (rEdo) is scum. rEdo, on the other hand, doesn't; the only thing he's done has been asking you about GIF's vote on me. yet he either missed or just ignored what my point here actually was.

the self-vote was done, btw, because I had no idea how to move the game forward and thought someone might do something interesting if I wagoned myself. there's no "diverting attention from myself" about it, and you have a very one-dimensional view of things if you think there is

Hika wrote:

Sure, it's an odd thing to focus on in early game but I want to know everyone's stance on each other after my questions are answered.

this was referring to what rEdo was saying, not anything you did

Hika wrote:

Why do you ask me? I think it was because pieguy voted himself. Simple as that, no further explanation needed. I would vote for him too but can I have everyone's stance first?

why do you need everyone's stance before voting me?

if it's "not wanting a hammer to happen", I think it's misguided at this point in the game since I only have I think 2 votes.

I reread again and I am just blind. After Sakura posted vote count on this page I actually LOOKED at the vote count.

Will post again after sleep, good night o/

self-voting is usually not too alignment indicative, as it's used by lackluster players to "generate discussion" regardless of alignment, and it's used by experienced players to perform gambits or to end a day early in order to keep the town from discussing things

I don't have super strong reads on anyone at the moment, although I will say that it looks like Hika's playing from a town mindset; I don't think scum generally wants to lead in a game like this

I'm working on homework and another game on a different site with shorter day phases, I'll put in some extreme work when we hit night phase over there

Trying to sift through ISOs with a barely working net is not a fun time I tell you what

fartownik wrote:

Frostings gets + townpoints from me, the concern seemed genuine enough to convince me. On the other hand, Dake's super-new and innovative opinion that revealing our colors is not beneficial for town seems like a filler-post.

It's funny because Frostings wrote that in the first place, not Dake

And what "concern" are you even talking about? He asked the mod 3 questions: First was if multiple scum can be in a neighbourhood which is totally in the opening post if he had read harder

Sakura wrote:

Differences:
-
-
- It's possible that all the mafia team is in the same neighborhood, they'll be completely randomized.
-
-

While the second and third questions are run-of-the-mill and could be asked by anyone, there's nothing substantial there

And the whole choof thing is pretty contradictory. His accusation of choof of bussing GIF implies he thinks GIF is scum yet doesn't question any further on GIF's vote after saying the last paragraph in this post, and instead turns around to attack choof for asking further. Completely drops the accusation when choof asks him for any read/evidence as to why he's accusing choof of bussing.

And then his closing statement after getting absolutely nowhere from the accusation is a fluff joke post about NH (if anyone is still wooshing, the joke is NH is V/LA and most likely hasn't said shit anywhere)

Jinxy wrote:

And what "concern" are you even talking about? He asked the mod 3 questions: First was if multiple scum can be in a neighbourhood which is totally in the opening post if he had read harder

Frostings wrote:

Having neighbor chat is more useful to town than scum, but knowing who's in which color team seems a bit useless as a townie, as far as I'm concerned

I agree on not revealing our neighborhood color, imo it's useless for town if any neighborhood can have more than one scum.

First, thanks Hika and JInxy for posting. Took my time to reread.

pieguy, Self-voting as a way to move people and generate discussion is valid, but does it help you to scumhunt? Did you get the expected reactions? Who is scum for you? Why? I'd like to read this from you. I think rEdo making a single question is more useful to catch other people and maybe pressuring him. That's why I said your selfvoting wasn't better.

And this same question goes for GIF, I think it's time for you to explain your vote on pieguy.

Choofers not knowing about the neighbourhoods couldn't be considered a "townslip", even scum would have missed it if they didn't have chance to talk during pregame. The ignorance about that seemed legit tho. Regardless of this, he's been pretty townie, though his lack of reads disturbs me a bit, but I can't blame him. I'd like to know his opinion about GIF and pieguy, at least.

lol Frostings saying Choofers is busing GIF XD

And as a final point, I'd not be surprised if Nyquill is scum at this point. Call it gut.

bla

These debates on who's strategy works or does not work NEVER gets us anywhere.

But pieguy is a strong townread for that same reason, he's done a significant amount of follow up without specifically bringing attention to shenanigans.

Choofers, can you answer your own RQ. I'm assuming you've played outside the board so I'm curious.





In the mean time, since I seem to be at odd hours with literally everyone else, I'm going to leave some stuff for when people log on later:
Dake, how do you feel about frostings specifically?
Farto: I'm assuming that you dismissing the idea that Dake's idea that revealing neighborhoods as a filler post means that you disagree with it. How will it benefit us?

pieguy1372 wrote:

my issue with rEdo is that, despite listing off all the stuff that happened, he didn't take any kind of stance on any of it. the point about Hika trying to "counterwagon" me is meh. it feels like an odd thing to focus on in early game. I'd like to know what he thinks knowing this would tell him about Hika's alignment.

It was way too early to make a definite stance for me at that point, that's why I wanted to gather information first. I posted It would not help me yet, but that would be something good enough to base on, I believe.

Hika wrote:

Wagon was an accidental slip. 3 + 4 = 7, you can't split 7 in half and you most definitely split a person's vote in half, so 3 is getting a little closer to 4 which is a lot more than 3. My point is, wagon was a wrong choice of words, especially since I just glanced, saw names and started with RVS because no one is saying anything important, but so far, after reading ALL ISOs, GIF is very scummy and I don't like him right now. Why would you hold out information that could be useful to everyone on seeing how to end the day?

Take a closer look at his ISO, you'll find a clue in his exchange of words with Choofers. Also, I didn't ask why GIF's vote on pieguy was cast, but why it's currently active.

lol @ pieguy saying I have no stance about everything so far

To those who are concerned, I asked Hika because it seemed like she tried to CW pie, but apparently (?) she just wasn't paying attention to the topic when it just got real while posting. Either way, it was good to check how everybody reacts to that.

Reads so far:

Town-null:

1. GIF - I like the way he generated discussion, at this point I think he's lurking to fish information.
2. Choofers - seems pretty genuine in his last posts, however the hard townread people are giving him seems farfetched.
3. Frostings - as above, plus a bunch of his last posts were just speculation about the neighbourhood system in this game.

Null:

1. farto - hasn't really brought anything to the discussion except for posting his yet unjustified scumreads and a little bit of the setup speculation.
2. pieguy - not sure if I'm just paranoid but pieguy gives me really weird vibes, even though my gut tells me he's town.
3. Nyquill, Jinxy - gotta read a little more from these two before making a stance. All Jinxy did so far was reminding everyone the rules of the game from OP, while Nyquill just said pieguy is town.
4. Chamelo - is he even in this game
5. NH - he even isn't in this game

Scum-null:

1. Hika - leaning towards scum, hasn't really done anything but answered questions. Saying pieguy's self-voting is scummy seems bleh.
2. DD - some of his posts don't really add anything to the discussion, townreading Choofers as an easy way to fake reads (this is at least what I deduced so far).

@fartownik: Please explain your scumreads, on DD especially.
@Hika: Thoughts on pieguy and DD so far?
@mod: If in range, prod Chamelo please.

pieguy1372 wrote:

the self-vote was done, btw, because I had no idea how to move the game forward and thought someone might do something interesting if I wagoned myself

I'd say there are so many ways to move the game forward without misleading the game like GIF ending RVS unless you're scum trying to get some towncred by self-voting.

I still don't get Hika's counterwagon on Dake because c'mon, you don't want anyone to accidentally hammer pieguy but instead building up another chance for Dake to be hammered, though it's less likely happen but still, you can just not vote and FoS him.

Call me a slowpoke because I really need to get my brain filled with more analysis and English skill. .-.

@JInxy: was my sarcasm really not obvious enough? Dake's post was a filler-post, trying to easily catch up to a seemingly pointless discussion.

Chamelo just did the same thing btw, a few posts above. Not sure if it's him playing a really bad game again or just scum.

Dake didn't address me at all in his post. Weird.

@Nyquill: damn that sentence is so oddly formulated. But again, I don't disagree with it. I was just sarcastic, isn't that frickin obvious enough? D:

Choofers wrote:

I don't have super strong reads on anyone at the moment, although I will say that it looks like Hika's playing from a town mindset; I don't think scum generally wants to lead in a game like this

Hello scumpoints. What Hika did was nowhere close to leading anything so I have no idea what you're talking about. Seems like you're trying to share some of your own towncred with her. Bad idea my friend.

I have a question for everyone: did any more of you not fully understand this post of mine? Part about Dake

I just woke up

rEdo wrote:

@mod: If in range, prod Chamelo please.

Prods happen when a player hasn't posted for 24 hours.

Ok well I certainly appreciate you making jabs instead of answering the question in my post

Jinxy wrote:

And what "concern" are you even talking about?

I am back, reading a little and will continue with this post I have been saving up

Jinxy wrote:

Ok well I certainly appreciate you making jabs instead of answering the question in my post

Jinxy wrote:

And what "concern" are you even talking about?

The setup concern? The one about cards affecting neighbors? The one she/he was talking about? Hello?

Also Hika, you don't need to announce your holy posts every time you prepare to do them. Unless, you actually do.

Well we can all say whatever we want about pieguy self voting but I will no longer sit on the idea for the time being. We have more important things than picking on someone who at least has MY FoS. If he thinks that the way I am thinking is 1-D, then so be it. I am just trying to get the right person before making a huge mistake. So pieguy, if you say that that was not what you're doing, then okay, I will allow it in my conscience.

Chamelo_Th wrote:

I still don't get Hika's counterwagon on Dake because c'mon, you don't want anyone to accidentally hammer pieguy but instead building up another chance for Dake to be hammered, though it's less likely happen but still, you can just not vote and FoS him.

I will admit something here. I am coming with irrelevant answers to everyone saying "I don't get what Hika is doing, she isn't paying attention" etcetcetc. I didn't want to reveal my intentions until someone thought the same way I thought.

If no one noticed, I will mention it. I usually pick one person to mess around with to see if I can get a reaction out of that one person, mainly. Instead I got the attention from a ton of people. After I voted him, he said that I was trying to counterwagon. I did not say anything. A single thing, because I wanted to see who would say something about it. I'm not counting but a handful of people asked why my intention was to counterwagon. I was trying to see who thought I was scummy or not for just saying that one thing.

A page or so later, he says

DakeDekaane wrote:

So many people I'd want to vote and only one vote

And didn't add very much to it in that post to begin with. But when asked by Frostings what he meant by it, he didn't add much to it and called pieguy and I scummy. It is a little scummy that he wouldn't elaborate on it a little more.

@Frostings - He did reply after you and Choofers had your little talk about scum chat and neighbor chat. Why did you not fish him more for not explaining this? It makes you look like you and DD are scumteam because the suspicion suddenly disappeared in thin air.

rEdo wrote:

@Hika: Thoughts on pieguy and DD so far?

DD is a null-scum read atm. He is not contributing very much as his posts are filler but I will give him one more chance to stop what he's doing. His actions are strange to me and I can't classify them as town mindset AT ALL.

pieguy, eh, he's just a null read. A lot of defending on his point but I guess if him voting for himself is his way of "scum-hunting", so be it. I just want to know his analysis and what he sees is going on from his standpoint.

fartownik wrote:

What Hika did was nowhere close to leading anything so I have no idea what you're talking about.

@farto - You want to explain this for me? I want to know your opinion on this post specifically.

fartownik wrote:

I have a question for everyone: did any more of you not fully understand this post of mine? Part about Dake

I don't think I quite get this. Maybe it's just the context of this, so can you explain this a little more too? Also, I just realize that he did not address you either.

At this point, he has all of my suspicion. I need everyone's stance on him, asap. If you don't say anything, I will call you scum buddies. I want to know what everyone thinks before I vote him.

Please take this post into consideration.

Frostings wrote:

DakeDekaane wrote:

So many people I'd want to vote and only one vote

also this is scummy
want to elaborate or no?
Because I can just say "I';m looking 4 the scumteam gaiz" to fake town activity as well

fartownik wrote:

Also Hika, you don't need to announce your holy posts every time you prepare to do them. Unless, you actually do.

I have to! They are long an unnecessary to some and I don't want people to think I'm scummy for inactivity if I decide to write a holy post.

Also I forgot to add (somehow?).

@DD - What do you think about me?

fartownik wrote:

The setup concern? The one about cards affecting neighbors? The one she/he was talking about? Hello?

Ok.

Well I disagree that any of those concerns had any true substance at all to be worth townpoints and I'm also taking into account that he didn't even see the answer to his first question in the OP. So let's agree to disagree or whatever passive-aggressive phrase is currently up your alley

What do you think of Frostings making an unsupported bussing accusation while not directly calling out GIF, the bussee, though?

Yes, I am leaning scum for Frostings.


As for Dake, his initial posts didn't have much substance but I'm nulling on him right now. I do want to hear something else from him other than about pieguy though, especially when he called Hika scum and proceeded to not talk about it at all. And also maybe something about me, since his last comment was that I was (rightly) fluffy at the time. Any new comment?

ftr, self-voting is not something that I usually do in games

this is I think the second time I've done it, ever

Ok, bussing is probably too strong of a word, but Choofy was definitely trying to distancing himself from GIF subtlety very early in the game, which I've seen happen a lot with scumteams

Choofers wrote:

GuyInFreezer wrote:

Vote is now serious.
RVS over.

care to elaborate on this one, bucko

They ask each other shallow questions and respond with empty answers:

GuyInFreezer wrote:

Choofers wrote:

care to elaborate on this one, bucko

If I wanted to elaborate now I already would have done so.

Choofers wrote:

GuyInFreezer wrote:

When I first voted him my cote wasn't serious.
it became serious after I announced it.

yes thank you we know that
but why

GuyInFreezer wrote:

Choofers wrote:

okay let me be more explicit since holding out on supposed information is inherently scummy: why was your vote non-rvs? do you have a gut read on pieguy this early on in the game? are you fishing for reactions?

I'll just ask you this.
If you're trying to fish reaction, do you explain what your reaction test is? Y/N

They're arguing against each other without elaboration or creating additional discussion

I think Jinxy is scum. his posting reads like scum coasting.

I think DD might also be scum. essentially, I agree with fartownik's assessment. nothing in his most recent post comes off like he's attempting to scum hunt: it's a bunch of softball questions and weak stances, with no real attempt to put pressure on anyone (the only thing there that's really a scum read is the gut read on Nyquill). the questions directed towards me were so weak I could poke a hole in them with my pinky (it should be obvious who I think is scum, for instance, if you read my posts). @GIF: I'd like to know what your read here is, if you have any.

DakeDekaane wrote:

pieguy, Self-voting as a way to move people and generate discussion is valid, but does it help you to scumhunt? Did you get the expected reactions? Who is scum for you? Why? I'd like to read this from you. I think rEdo making a single question is more useful to catch other people and maybe pressuring him. That's why I said your selfvoting wasn't better.

you are, again, missing or deliberately misrepresenting the point

the point being that me "self-voting" is most assuredly not the only thing I've done this game. do you have no comment on any of the reads I've given after RVS ended?

Jinxy, do you have any reads at all outside of Frostings? looking at it again, literally the only thing you've done this game is responding to fandwerik about his Frostings read.

Hika wrote:

@Frostings - He did reply after you and Choofers had your little talk about scum chat and neighbor chat. Why did you not fish him more for not explaining this?

Are you talking about Dake? I'm not sure what reply you're talking about

Hika wrote:

It makes you look like you and DD are scumteam because the suspicion suddenly disappeared in thin air.

I'm still suspicious of Dake, there's a reason I still have my vote on him

Dake is the most scummy for me right now actually, then GIF. I thought Choofy seemed town at first but then his interaction with GIF made me suspicious so I questioned him to see his reaction. I pretty much blanked out when I realized scum can be in the same neighbors because apparently I didn't read the third line of the first post

Hm
I'm starting to doubt my scumreads now because I just realized GIF and Dake both have their votes on pieguy

oh, I should also say that I don't _really_ have a problem with rEdo's most recent post. I don't think he's more likely town but I no longer scum read him.