Camellia as "Reverse of Riot" - Completeness Under Incomplet

posted
Total Posts
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Topic Starter
Sonix
This beatmap was submitted using in-game submission on den 8 augusti 2017 at 22:51:03

Artist: Camellia as "Reverse of Riot"
Title: Completeness Under Incompleteness
Source: SOUND VOLTEX III GRAVITY WARS
Tags: The 5th KAC Original song contest GRAVITATIONAL RADAR EPISODE 18 SDVX KONAMI BEMANI RIOT DESTRUDO Artcore
BPM: 194
Filesize: 5696kb
Play Time: 00:03
Difficulties Available:
  1. ADVANCED by GD (2,41 stars, 19 notes)
  2. EXHAUST by [ Space ] (4,09 stars, 54 notes)
  3. GRAVITY (6,31 stars, 710 notes)
  4. HYPER (4,43 stars, 396 notes)
  5. INFINITE by GD (5,06 stars, 31 notes)
  6. NOVICE (1,91 stars, 29 notes)


Download: Camellia as "Reverse of Riot" - Completeness Under Incompleteness
Information: Scores/Beatmap Listing
---------------
I'd love for someone to mod completely roast the sh*t out of my difficulties so if you have anything at all to say please do <3
NOTE!! ALL UNFINISHED DIFFICULTIES ARE JUST PLACEHOLDERS, CHANGE WILL MOST LIKELY OCCUR
Basic by Me (WIP) 0.9-1.2* (might ignore and just keep novice)
Novice by Me (WIP) 1.6-2.2*
Medium by GD (Currently Wanted) 2.4-2.7*
Advanced by Me (WIP) 3.0-3.5*
Light Exhaust by Me (Finished, awaiting mods) 4.0-4.3*
Exhaust by [ Space ] (WIP) 5.0-5.25*
Infinite by GD (Currently Wanted) 5.7-5.9*
Gravity by Me (Finished, awaiting mods) 6.3*

Thanks to [ Space ] and mindmaster107 for the mods! ^^
LowAccuracySS
hmm this seems

familiar
Topic Starter
Sonix

[ Space ] wrote:

hmm this seems

familiar
I have no idea what you're talking about :roll:
LowAccuracySS
we talked

00:56 Sonix: hey uhm can I get some like help xD more advice but
00:57 Sonix: I'd like some feedback on the camellia map from someone who somewhat knows what I can improve and what I'm doing wrong
00:57 Sonix: idk if you're one to ask (though I'd be grateful if you are :3) so like, where should I ask or what should I do
00:58 Sonix: idk if posting modreqs, asking random mappers (rude? lol) or posting forum or what I should do
00:59 Sonix: I got like, few people playtesting but it's not like they can tell what I'm doing bad or yea.
01:00 [ Space ]: ok hi
01:00 [ Space ]: woah timing
01:00 [ Space ]: anyway
01:00 [ Space ]: posting on modqueues is probably the best thing you can do
01:01 [ Space ]: I'll take a look
01:01 Sonix: thanks man <3
01:01 [ Space ]: which one
01:01 Sonix: it just came to mind that I could actually look through other's mods lol
01:01 Sonix: o eh
01:01 *Sonix is listening to [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1346151 Camellia as "Reverse of Riot" - Completeness Under Incompleteness]
01:01 [ Space ]: ok
01:02 [ Space ]: definitely a step up from your gd on my first map
01:02 [ Space ]: lol
01:02 Sonix: well it's something
01:02 Sonix: *shrug*
01:03 Sonix: :^)
01:05 [ Space ]: 00:11:038 (3,4,5) - ok so i don't exactly know how to describe it but https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/8617184
01:06 Sonix: think it's too much for such small sound difference
01:07 [ Space ]: hmm
01:07 [ Space ]: ok
01:08 [ Space ]: this still looks ugly in it's current state tbh lol
01:08 Sonix: yea I thought so too
01:08 Sonix: next slider didn't fit
01:09 [ Space ]: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/8617211?
01:09 [ Space ]: nvm
01:09 [ Space ]: this but (5) is at x190 y190
01:09 [ Space ]: lol
01:10 Sonix: waat
01:11 Sonix: doesn't that look way to much like a stream
01:11 Sonix: almost same spacing as (3)-(4) but 1/2 time difference to (6)
01:11 [ Space ]: ah
01:11 [ Space ]: yea
01:12 [ Space ]: idk about that part
01:12 [ Space ]: ;-;
01:12 [ Space ]: also, what's with these timing points
01:13 [ Space ]: no ranked versions of this map have these
01:13 [ Space ]: lol
01:13 Sonix: it's preliminary
01:13 Sonix: I didn't see that there were any ranked vesrions
01:13 Sonix: xD
01:13 Sonix: I'm gonna steal timing points soon
01:13 Sonix: i took em from that old gd i made..
01:14 [ Space ]: LOL
01:14 *[ Space ] is listening to [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1095566 Camellia as "Reverse of Riot" - Completeness Under Incompleteness]
01:14 [ Space ]: also a mania set too
01:14 Sonix: love it
01:14 Sonix: yea I knew mania
01:14 Sonix: well. could've got timing from mania set
01:14 Sonix: brain isn't cooperating
01:14 [ Space ]: 01:02:447 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - oml this stream is so good
01:15 Sonix: u W u hell yea
01:15 Sonix: that's the one I was most worried about LOL
01:15 Sonix: 01:11:726 (4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,1,2) -
01:16 Sonix: really like this part
01:16 [ Space ]: 01:38:710 (5) - slider instead? it's a held sound
01:16 Sonix: ah at the end
01:16 Sonix: 1/4th slider
01:16 Sonix: think there are like 3 other pairs of those
01:17 [ Space ]: 01:38:710 (5) - wayyyy too large of a gap for sounds of equal intensity
01:17 [ Space ]: idea:
01:17 [ Space ]: (5) - x268 y334
01:18 [ Space ]: (6) - x236 y228
01:18 [ Space ]: (7) - x205 y122
01:18 [ Space ]: oh whoops
01:18 Sonix: wat?
01:18 Sonix: LOL
01:18 [ Space ]: wrong timestamp
01:18 Sonix: yea
01:18 Sonix: xD
01:18 [ Space ]: 01:23:169 (5,6,7,8) -
01:19 [ Space ]: and 8 is snapped to 6
01:20 [ Space ]: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/8617275
01:21 [ Space ]: 01:30:901 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16) - explain these jumps because they look kind of just "placed" if you know what i mean
01:21 Sonix: ah yea it does sound more like it's following the drum instead of the high pitch sound
01:23 [ Space ]: 00:59:818 (7) - nice slider lol
01:23 Sonix: they're pretty much just placed
01:23 Sonix: had troubles coming up with anything decent jumpwise
01:23 Sonix: lol.
01:24 [ Space ]: lol
01:24 Sonix: idk about that slider haha
01:25 [ Space ]: have you heard of hexgrids
01:26 Sonix: yea I had one in second chorus but it played badly.
01:26 Sonix: hexgrids look pretty good if well made
01:26 [ Space ]: yea
01:27 Sonix: better than
01:27 Sonix: random triangle
01:27 Sonix: square
01:27 [ Space ]: watch this
01:27 [ Space ]: 01:35:849 (1) - move to x265 y156
01:27 [ Space ]: perfect triangle :D
01:28 Sonix: 1 2 4 = triangle uwu
01:29 [ Space ]: other than that, I think that's it!
01:29 [ Space ]: very nice difficulty
01:29 Sonix: 01:49:071 (4) -
01:29 Sonix: need to do stuffs about these ends also
01:29 Sonix: :^)
01:29 Sonix: but thanks for the tips
01:29 Sonix: I'll fix the jumps
01:29 Sonix: first of all
01:30 [ Space ]: all you need now is a set
01:30 [ Space ]: :D
01:30 Sonix: easy normal hard insane extra special
01:30 Sonix: B)))))))))
01:31 [ Space ]: I can do an extra maybe depends
01:31 [ Space ]: oh jesus i'm getting nostalgic LOL
01:31 Sonix: LOOL
01:31 Sonix: I'll ask if you'd like to when I finish up this diff
Renumi
good luck on your mapseto!! o:
mindmaster107
I may want to make a GD for this. PM me if you are interested!


Thanks for starting an M4M!
When you mod my mapset, choose from any difficulty BUT the extra one. I'm remapping that one since it was the one I made with the least mapping experience.

[EXAUHST]
Ok the AR feels too fast. This is a 200 bpm-ish map, so AR9.3 would be enough at most.
I would recommend reducing it down into AR9, since it is more fun, and more readable as you are using overlaps and a lower AR would help with reading them.

00:06:785 (5,6,7) - Suddenly wide angle. This stands out too much in a section of exclusively sharp angles and sliders. Maybe change the pattern to accommodate a sharper jump?

Arguably, I would say this -> 00:18:538 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) is a more intense build up than this -> 01:04:303 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8)
This is why I think wither nerf the second massive stream to start from almost stacked, so it can build up properly, but not that spaced, or buff the first stream.
00:19:775 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - This needs to be more intense.

01:33:375 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) - I personally would not have the stream be this spaced. The song doesn't support it.

01:50:076 (1,2,3) - This is the worst possible way of presenting 3/4 gaps. Maybe try something like using special filler rhythm? Im not good at explaing how to do this. Watch this video ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7jYwSVjiSo ) from about 1 minute to see why 3/4 gaps are bad, and some nice ways into how to fix it.
01:44:509 (1,2,3,4,1) - you love your 3/4 gaps don't you
omg there are so many in this map.

00:21:630 - 00:41:416 - I would argue in this section, the drum (Krakt) sound is the main instrument, not the piano. You can map the piano passively, but it was hard to listen to the music to play the map since you didn't follow the main instrument.

00:46:520 (3,4,5,6) - These feel like they are 1/2 apart visually. This is not the case since you are using these sliders to represent a 3/4 gap. Make the gap between these 1/2 sliders obviously 1/4 using overlaps, at least for the first 1 or 2 instances, so the player can get used to it.
00:48:994 (3,4,5,6) - YOU DID IT CORRECTLY HERE!!!!!!! SIMPLY REPLACE THE FIRST PATTERN INTO THIS!

The spacing for the ending feels arbitrary. When doing spacing on streams, try and follow the intensity of the whole song. This is a subjective matter here, but considering again as I said the piano is not the main instrument here, if you are making a stream for it, please follow the main instrument's intensity.

01:49:071 (4) - This goes very offscreen.

[LIGHT INSANE]
I think I may scrap the 4+ on my queue. Im not qualified for this.

00:19:156 (1) - A single buzz slider feels too weak. Maybe have several buss sliders increasing in SV, and spacing to show off the changing intensity!

00:21:321 (4) - how is this spaced so little? at least make it pop out!

00:40:952 (3,4) - How is anyone going to be able to read this.
Topic Starter
Sonix

mindmaster107 wrote:

I may want to make a GD for this. PM me if you are interested!
I have three gd's pending and one already asked but I'll consider if it comes to it ^^


Thanks for starting an M4M!
When you mod my mapset, choose from any difficulty BUT the extra one. I'm remapping that one since it was the one I made with the least mapping experience.

[EXAUHST] *GRAVITY <3 ^^
Ok the AR feels too fast. This is a 200 bpm-ish map, so AR9.3 would be enough at most.
I would recommend reducing it down into AR9, since it is more fun, and more readable as you are using overlaps and a lower AR would help with reading them. AR has been reduced to 9.3, I agree with ar9 being fun but I think playability improves with ar being a bit higher.

00:06:785 (5,6,7) - Suddenly wide angle. This stands out too much in a section of exclusively sharp angles and sliders. Maybe change the pattern to accommodate a sharper jump? These objects 00:05:548 (1,2,3,4) - are actually a wide angle so it doesn't come as a surprise ^^ even though it may not be the most apparent one looking at it I think it plays completely fine

Arguably, I would say this -> 00:18:538 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) is a more intense build up than this -> 01:04:303 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8)
This is why I think wither nerf the second massive stream to start from almost stacked, so it can build up properly, but not that spaced, or buff the first stream. I agree with the buildup to chorus being overexaggerated compared to the previously mentioned one, I'll most likely buff the first one by a small bit!
00:19:775 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - This needs to be more intense. It'll come together with what I just said ^^

01:33:375 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) - I personally would not have the stream be this spaced. The song doesn't support it. I have considered reducing the difficulty for the stream but as of right now I believe it still has it's place as second nc with more spacing comes just as sound starts clearing up. Pretty heavy drums but I'll reconsider once more if there are more objections!

01:50:076 (1,2,3) - This is the worst possible way of presenting 3/4 gaps. Maybe try something like using special filler rhythm? Im not good at explaing how to do this. Watch this video ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7jYwSVjiSo ) from about 1 minute to see why 3/4 gaps are bad, and some nice ways into how to fix it. Yes, I'll do something about the first occuring 3/4 gaps but I at least want to believe that it's playable just by reading due to most objects spacing.
01:44:509 (1,2,3,4,1) - you love your 3/4 gaps don't you Yes, you are correct
omg there are so many in this map. Yes, now I'm sorry. I'll most likely do 1/2 sliders with 1/4th gaps as blankets around the triangle at 01:39:870 (2,3,4) -

00:21:630 - 00:41:416 - I would argue in this section, the drum (Krakt) sound is the main instrument, not the piano. You can map the piano passively, but it was hard to listen to the music to play the map since you didn't follow the main instrument. I believe this is fine. The only point where I really emphasize the piano is at 00:39:097 (3) - where the piano obviously takes over. Otherwise what you're hearing is most likely a mixture of the piano and drums coming together, it's not my intention to map the piano in this part and I don't see how I did otherwise

00:46:520 (3,4,5,6) - These feel like they are 1/2 apart visually. This is not the case since you are using these sliders to represent a 3/4 gap. Make the gap between these 1/2 sliders obviously 1/4 using overlaps, at least for the first 1 or 2 instances, so the player can get used to it. Yea I tried doing it slightly obvious by changing the appearance of the first set of sliders but..
00:48:994 (3,4,5,6) - YOU DID IT CORRECTLY HERE!!!!!!! SIMPLY REPLACE THE FIRST PATTERN INTO THIS! Seems like this is a good idea to get the player started ^^

The spacing for the ending feels arbitrary. When doing spacing on streams, try and follow the intensity of the whole song. This is a subjective matter here, but considering again as I said the piano is not the main instrument here, if you are making a stream for it, please follow the main instrument's intensity.
Yes I'll probably have to nerf the entire end-stream in order to mix well with other emphasis for intensity.

01:49:071 (4) - This goes very offscreen. Oops, an attempt to save previous mod mentioning 1/4th slider at the end of the stream with held sound. I'll move stream down and stack other hitcircle to slider (5)

[LIGHT INSANE]
I think I may scrap the 4+ on my queue. Im not qualified for this. The things you mentioned for me helped somewhat! :]

00:19:156 (1) - A single buzz slider feels too weak. Maybe have several buss sliders increasing in SV, and spacing to show off the changing intensity!
I agree, it's a remain after me changing my mind about it originally being a bit above 3* thanks

00:21:321 (4) - how is this spaced so little? at least make it pop out! Done!

00:40:952 (3,4) - How is anyone going to be able to read this. Fixed? Yes I believe so
Thanks a bunch for the mod!
rock time
gravity m4m

first off
correct timing is 626
remove every timing point after the first one
source: https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1094551 (the ranked version of this song's timing points)
also change all other suggestions before changing this one, so the links dont mess up with new timing
and if you need to, use that maps MP3


actual diff
from 00:00:600 to 00:08:641 is a mess imo
its same piano sound over and over, but rhythm choices are changing every measure.
try to make the rhythm structure more uniform. circle circle slider circle circle slider etc or something else, ur current way is too hectic

00:09:259 (2,3,4,5) gap between 2 and 3 confuses players with 1/2 jump, shorten gap

00:12:043 (2,3,4,5,6) why is the distance between 2 and 3 bigger than the rest? there are many examples of this in the map, so i will only point out first one, but there is no reason there should be a bigger distance

00:28:129 (11) i suggest putting it somewhere like here, the current distance confuses players with 1/4 gap

00:29:654 (11,1) while i dont like the overlap, i guess there is nothing wrong with it. but look out for nazi mods they will kill this

00:41:262 (1) i suggest something like this instead, feels nicer. the lack of the 4 takes the energy out of the build up

00:41:571 - remove the spinner, doesnt really make sense. remove spinner and remove the next (1), plays out much better.


00:45:128 - there is sound here, map it

00:55:025 - same

00:59:818 (7) really unexpected SV change and weird flow slider, maybe change

01:08:788 - wtf is this section
delete 01:09:483 (10) and make 9 a 1/4 slider (like this)
move the entire next stream 1/4 earlier, and make 9 a 1/4 slider like the other one
rhythm choice at 01:10:411 - doesnt make sense, i dont hear obvious sounds that hint at that kind of structure. i'd delete and make it all one stream since the piano is still the leading instrument
add a 9 after 01:19:303 (8), and then place next two sliders like this
ok onto other stuff now that that is all done

01:28:427 - kick here, map?

01:34:767 - start spinner 1/4 earlier

01:41:339 - the rhythm here is... idk. very inconvenient and hard to play. try to find better solutions with sliders? idkkkk

01:50:849 (2,3,4) why so spaced

overall
overall its a pretty cool map. you need to work on some rhythm choices though, they feel very chaotic and all over the place. work on uniformity

hope the mod helped!

also have u looked at my map yet? thanks in advance
Topic Starter
Sonix

fufu- wrote:

gravity m4m hype (/uwu)/

first off
correct timing is 626
remove every timing point after the first one
source: https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1094551 (the ranked version of this song's timing points)
also change all other suggestions before changing this one, so the links dont mess up with new timing
and if you need to, use that maps MP3

I'll look into this again but I'm certain that something's wrong with the ranked version, sounds really off in my opinion. I'll let someone very experienced have a look if copying mp3 doesn't solve it for me..


actual diff
from 00:00:600 to 00:08:641 is a mess imo
its same piano sound over and over, but rhythm choices are changing every measure.
try to make the rhythm structure more uniform. circle circle slider circle circle slider etc or something else, ur current way is too hectic
I'll try to do something more simplistic that will still emphasize some of the sounds I already have pointing out. I agree with it being a bit all over the place though

00:09:259 (2,3,4,5) gap between 2 and 3 confuses players with 1/2 jump, shorten gap Done!

00:12:043 (2,3,4,5,6) why is the distance between 2 and 3 bigger than the rest? there are many examples of this in the map, so i will only point out first one, but there is no reason there should be a bigger distance I felt like it was better for playability but distance to slider(s) will be fixed so it matches stream's distance

00:28:129 (11) i suggest putting it somewhere like here, the current distance confuses players with 1/4 gap
Done thanks!

00:29:654 (11,1) while i dont like the overlap, i guess there is nothing wrong with it. but look out for nazi mods they will kill this
I have actually removed two of these stacks already so this would be a problem to read since it's stacked behind a reverse-arrow. Thanks for heads up

00:41:262 (1) i suggest something like this instead, feels nicer. the lack of the 4 takes the energy out of the build up I like how the single (1) puts an end to the buildup since there isn't really a strong sound to map at the (4) you consider that I add but at the same time I think the spinner does not make for very fun gameplay so I'll probably end up mapping the remaining

00:41:571 - remove the spinner, doesnt really make sense. remove spinner and remove the next (1), plays out much better.

Spinner removed, re-made entire part after

00:45:128 - there is sound here, map it

00:55:025 - same I don't believe these sounds are important enough to be included as it'd most likely confuse the player as I'm changing focus to another sound

00:59:818 (7) really unexpected SV change and weird flow slider, maybe change Are you saying you DISLIKE?! my sliderART?!?
Yes I'll re-do.

01:08:788 - wtf is this section
delete 01:09:483 (10) and make 9 a 1/4 slider (like this) Slider created at (9) to make stream easier as it has the same amount of notes as next in this case
move the entire next stream 1/4 earlier, and make 9 a 1/4 slider like the other one Moving entire next stream 1/4 earlier would start the stream on a snare and not when the actual piano starts playing, as I'm trying to get the focus on the piano I'll keep it as it is.
rhythm choice at 01:10:411 - doesnt make sense, i dont hear obvious sounds that hint at that kind of structure. i'd delete and make it all one stream since the piano is still the leading instrument I believe there is a noticeable change in the tone of the piano. Otherwise this would have to be removed aswell since the difference is even smaller here though it in my opinion fits really well 01:14:200 (7) -
add a 9 after 01:19:303 (8), and then place next two sliders like this There's really no sound at all to make for a (9)
ok onto other stuff now that that is all done

01:28:427 - kick here, map? Done!

01:34:767 - start spinner 1/4 earlier Done!

01:41:339 - the rhythm here is... idk. very inconvenient and hard to play. try to find better solutions with sliders? idkkkk I already changed first occuring 3/4 gaps so I think players will have to be able to read the notes as they are, I'll try nc's for the jumps to clarify even more that something different is happening

01:50:849 (2,3,4) why so spaced Kind of extreme jump for sounds that stand out, I like it spaced in order to keep a good flow

overall
overall its a pretty cool map. you need to work on some rhythm choices though, they feel very chaotic and all over the place. work on uniformity

hope the mod helped! :ok_hand: of course!

also have u looked at my map yet? thanks in advance
You reviewed my mod before you posted this one here so I guess you just forgot to remove this when you posted > w<
I appreciate the mod! ^^
rock time

Sonix wrote:

fufu- wrote:

gravity m4m hype (/uwu)/

00:59:818 (7) really unexpected SV change and weird flow slider, maybe change Are you saying you DISLIKE?! my sliderART?!?
good slider, but not all good sliders can be used all the time

also have u looked at my map yet? thanks in advance
You reviewed my mod before you posted this one here so I guess you just forgot to remove this when you posted > w<
edit: meant my version of this song for the GD

I appreciate the mod! ^^
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