i've been working on some stats stuff lately based on information i could gather(so a lot of info is sadly missing), but once the teams are all out, i might whip up some stat stuff based on the teams that passed(since i don't have access to the info on teams that didn't get in)

Gummy wrote:

Loctav wrote:

Wiki | Livestream
Welcome to the osu! World Cup 2016 Discussion Thread.
Here you can discuss everything related to the biggest worldwide osu! tournament.

Who designed the banner?

The strangest banner in World Cup history

Tournament management is running pretty slowly this year. Hopefully teams are going to be given a couple days at least to sort out their team.

Huh...

a loli wrote:

Tournament management is running pretty slowly this year. Hopefully teams are going to be given a couple days at least to sort out their team.

the time span between drawings and registration end is also an entire week longer than last year. don't grow impatient.

Loctav wrote:

Fair question, I would have problems figuring out a proper multiplier for it (given we use scorev2). Would it be a positive one? (it obviously makes things harder) or a negative one? (since it makes you less likely to fail.. ok weak argument)

I am not an EZ player or have much insight in this aspect, so if you have suggestions in how to design it, feel free to propose something!

(without a multiplier, it would sort of lose its tactical purpose, wouldn't it? dunno...)

(i was gonna post this a week ago but forgot.)

It's a good question, actually. I would ideally prefer some kind of dynamic score multiplier(and i really think it should be made for every mod if scoreV2 becomes the official system), judging how difficult a map is to read/understand, but that's a bit too ambitious.

However, you should know that while EZ makes maps very hard to understand for the uninitiated, it also reduces the physical(aim/speed-wise) difficulty by a lot, and those that practice it can in most cases do better on maps with EZ on than they could without, given that they've practiced them. So having it give a positive score multiplier(or no penalty at all) would give those people a great advantage over others who don't play it on the regular, and i don't think that's the kind of skill that should be rewarded in a tournament like this.

I had trouble coming up with a reasonable multiplier for it myself, though. Using the old 0.5x multiplier wouldn't make it very useful for scoreV2 tournaments, i think. So i propose something like this:

Nomod gives 700 000 for combo + 300 000 for accuracy for a max score of 1 000 000.
EZ would give 550 000 for combo + 150 000 for accuracy for a max score of 700 000.

I estimate a 95% FC to be ~850k for nomod and ~625k for EZ with the current scoreV2 accuracy dropoff rate.

Obviously the accuracy part is lowered because of the low OD in comparison, but only reduced it to half the value, as to not devalue scores with high accuracies. Accuracy on EZ is more about the big mistakes you do rather than how well you follow the music, but it can still be hard to get above 99% on very demanding maps - and i think that's where picking EZ would be most helpful. In addition, picking EZ makes it easier to spam through harder parts of a map at the expense of accuracy, so i wanted to still keep it a little rewarding.

For the combo part - EZ consistency is really, REALLY hard to attain. Using it seriously in a tournament can be very risky, so i didn't drop it that much. For a tournament based score system, i think it makes sense. Compared to the accuracy part, i think most of the score should come from your combo when using EZ.

...so that's my proposal. Everyone loves EZ plays, so giving it a chance to be used on freemod picks might be good for entertainment's sake, at least, and with this, it'd retain some tactical value as well. It might be a little late to try to implement right before OWC, and it's not that important for most players, but if it's going to be a possibility, i'd want to see it executed something like this.

Mh.
I'm still waiting for feedback on the suggestions given on the score v2 discussion thread.
It was started with OWC as the incentive and now it's like whatever. Weird.

Also what farto said. :/

-GN wrote:

Loctav wrote:

Fair question, I would have problems figuring out a proper multiplier for it (given we use scorev2). Would it be a positive one? (it obviously makes things harder) or a negative one? (since it makes you less likely to fail.. ok weak argument)

I am not an EZ player or have much insight in this aspect, so if you have suggestions in how to design it, feel free to propose something!

(without a multiplier, it would sort of lose its tactical purpose, wouldn't it? dunno...)

(i was gonna post this a week ago but forgot.)

It's a good question, actually. I would ideally prefer some kind of dynamic score multiplier(and i really think it should be made for every mod if scoreV2 becomes the official system), judging how difficult a map is to read/understand, but that's a bit too ambitious.

However, you should know that while EZ makes maps very hard to understand for the uninitiated, it also reduces the physical(aim/speed-wise) difficulty by a lot, and those that practice it can in most cases do better on maps with EZ on than they could without, given that they've practiced them. So having it give a positive score multiplier(or no penalty at all) would give those people a great advantage over others who don't play it on the regular, and i don't think that's the kind of skill that should be rewarded in a tournament like this.

I had trouble coming up with a reasonable multiplier for it myself, though. Using the old 0.5x multiplier wouldn't make it very useful for scoreV2 tournaments, i think. So i propose something like this:

Nomod gives 700 000 for combo + 300 000 for accuracy for a max score of 1 000 000.
EZ would give 550 000 for combo + 150 000 for accuracy for a max score of 700 000.

I estimate a 95% FC to be ~850k for nomod and ~625k for EZ with the current scoreV2 accuracy dropoff rate.

Obviously the accuracy part is lowered because of the low OD in comparison, but only reduced it to half the value, as to not devalue scores with high accuracies. Accuracy on EZ is more about the big mistakes you do rather than how well you follow the music, but it can still be hard to get above 99% on very demanding maps - and i think that's where picking EZ would be most helpful. In addition, picking EZ makes it easier to spam through harder parts of a map at the expense of accuracy, so i wanted to still keep it a little rewarding.

For the combo part - EZ consistency is really, REALLY hard to attain. Using it seriously in a tournament can be very risky, so i didn't drop it that much. For a tournament based score system, i think it makes sense. Compared to the accuracy part, i think most of the score should come from your combo when using EZ.

...so that's my proposal. Everyone loves EZ plays, so giving it a chance to be used on freemod picks might be good for entertainment's sake, at least, and with this, it'd retain some tactical value as well. It might be a little late to try to implement right before OWC, and it's not that important for most players, but if it's going to be a possibility, i'd want to see it executed something like this.

I like the idea to weighten the different score portions differently when EZ is activated. Maybe this is even a viable idea for other modes (maybe?!). However, I have to agree with you that it is a little late to implement this and test this properly just in time, but given this smart idea, I will definitely think about adding EZ as possible choice for the next year.

On other news, the participants list has been updated vastly. Check it out!

Btw, have you thought about introducing unranked maps in the mappools? This has been practiced in a number of big tournaments throughout years, and with the Loved section added I believe the maps chosen could also automatically gain that status after being picked for OWC. This could sort out some issues with maps being reused over and over plus it would give mappickers a lot more space to work with.

We are considering the usage of unranked/Loved beatmaps in higher stages, do not want to make promises in this regard however. This depends whether we are able to find suitable beatmaps that are Ranked and fit in the mappool or not. You are always free to contact any of our map selectors and bring them suggestions of maps you deem fitting for the OWC mappool, but try to keep it reasonable. We don't need 500 people suggesting THE BIG BLACK (again)

On other news, the list of all countries is now public. Please keep in mind that there is a rare chance that this might still change, depending on the team captain's success or failure to form a team. Obviously, if a team captain is unable to form a team in time, we will give the slot to another country that unfortunately did not make the cut this year. However, we do not expect this to happen, so consider the list of countries as sort of final, but not absolute final. (Does that make sense? I hope it does)

It feels weird not seeing Japan on that list.

Welcome to the worst OWC this far! I'm so hyped for this!

fartownik wrote:

with the Loved section added I believe the maps chosen could also automatically gain that status after being picked for OWC. This could sort out some issues with maps being reused over and over plus it would give mappickers a lot more space to work with.

You should really consider doing this with other modes at least, since they all use a ton of unranked maps. I'd really appreciate it if you could retcon past world cups too, since otherwise maps such as https://osu.ppy.sh/b/885078&m=3 and https://osu.ppy.sh/b/697682&m=3 will never have a scoreboard

Sir, why didn't we qualify this time?

Frc wrote:

Welcome to the worst OWC this far! I'm so hyped for this!

I sense OWC 2014 Deja vu

No drama or complaints yet, actual constructive discussion in the tournament thread, as well as responsive management.

I think this is the best one so far yet.

Athrun wrote:

Frc wrote:

Welcome to the worst OWC this far! I'm so hyped for this!

I sense OWC 2014 Deja vu

2014 at least had decent teams LUL

a loli wrote:

No drama or complaints yet, actual constructive discussion in the tournament thread, as well as responsive management.

I think this is the best one so far yet.

Wait for it 8)

a loli wrote:

No drama or complaints yet, actual constructive discussion in the tournament thread, as well as responsive management.

I think this is the best one so far yet.

Wait wait this is sarcasm right

yes OWC is so bad because Japan isn't playing!!





wait they only got to Group Stage last year because Japanese players didn't want to play then too...

Cof cof cof South Korea XD

Ntiger wrote:

yes OWC is so bad because Japan isn't playing!!





wait they only got to Group Stage last year because Japanese players didn't want to play then too...

Nice meme saying OWC is bad just because of Japan.

I mean it's pretty much already known lots of teams don't get competitive players because they don't even care about OWC at this point with the mess of other years.

better prepare some popcorn.

Frc wrote:

Ntiger wrote:

yes OWC is so bad because Japan isn't playing!!





wait they only got to Group Stage last year because Japanese players didn't want to play then too...

Nice meme saying OWC is bad just because of Japan.

I mean it's pretty much already known lots of teams don't get competitive players because they don't even care about OWC at this point with the mess of other years.

you must be following a different tournament than I do.

Loctav wrote:

you must be following a different tournament than I do.

You must not have asked a lot of players then lol, pretty much everyone in Spain was like that

Frc wrote:

Loctav wrote:

you must be following a different tournament than I do.

You must not have asked a lot of players then lol, pretty much everyone in Spain was like that

Spain has a lot of players?

Seeing how the mappool looked like back in 2015, I'm honestly looking forward to this year's mappool.

Spain is pretty low rank without waaiiru who didn't sign up this year, so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't qualify in the 32 spots.

Loctav wrote:

We don't need 500 people suggesting THE BIG BLACK (again)

lmao xd

a loli wrote:

Spain is pretty low rank without waaiiru who didn't sign up this year, so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't qualify in the 32 spots.

Well they classified too bad for you 2015

Didn't actually see the updated roster, just assumed they weren't on there since there was a post from a top rank Spain player that was asking why they weren't on the list.

here's a comprehensive list I made, hopefully it helps
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... k/pubhtml#

massive roster update, just one team missing \:D/

Hello , might I ask about how seeding works this time?
Is it from the top 4 average pp or top 6/8 average pp?

To the tournament staff:
Please, keep in mind that some teams don't have a single timezone for all of its players. This is very important.

And one more thing:
> Rescheduling after the release of the Schedule on the wiki can not be done in any circumstance.
I would like to suggest one possible exception to this rule. All conditions should be met.
Allow the rescheduling to take place if captains of both teams agree and the new time for the match is still within the same weekend. In double elimination stages the new time must not overlap / influence the time of the possible further matches.

The team availability should have a higher priority than the availability of people who livestream the matches.
Thank you.

Kert wrote:

To the tournament staff:
Please, keep in mind that some teams don't have a single timezone for all of its players. This is very important.

And one more thing:
> Rescheduling after the release of the Schedule on the wiki can not be done in any circumstance.
I would like to suggest one possible exception to this rule. All conditions should be met.
Allow the rescheduling to take place if captains of both teams agree and the new time for the match is still within the same weekend. In double elimination stages the new time must not overlap / influence the time of the possible further matches.

The team availability should have a higher priority than the availability of people who livestream the matches.
Thank you.

The only issue I see with this is as soon as you introduce more wishy-washy rules like this you end up with situations where one side begrudgingly accepts a reschedule with uncertainty about whether everyone can make it (since it's at a time other than the scheduled one) but if they were to decline they would look like bad sports. Fast forward a few days, some people can't make it like they thought they could, there are arguments over who should get the free win, it all blows up because there are thousands of spectators and reddit is always hungry to turn anything into a major drama.

TL;DR: Sounds like a good idea but in practice there are a lot of ways it can blow up.

We are not altering the scheduling rules, especially not to what you proposed, because it backfired at minimum 6 times in the course of 2 years when we did exactly that.
Team availability or availability of people to stream the stuff has no input in scheduling. Scheduling happens solely around the intention to give everyone a suitable time to play. We are not allowing rescheduling, because if one team requests it, all teams request it and then we have OWC#2 all over again, where one team never makes it to the Grand Finals, because they constantly want to reschedule - or TWC#3 where one bunch of teams was kind enough to make arrangements to attend to the matches, whereas other people felt like they have to reschedule just because they can't get ther ass up out of bed before midday.

On other news, all rosters are now complete!

I am excited to see how these teams will play in this year's competition. Keep in mind that the drawings will take place on Friday, 4. November 2016 at 12:00 UTC+0 on the osulive twitch.tv channel. After the drawings, we will showcase the mappool for Group Stage. The schedules for Group Stage will be released on Sunday, as always.

Made a few tables to do with team pp averages and top 4 pp averages if anyone's interested. https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8R1J30WdQJ1THFpQlJmRkR2b3M/view

Loctav wrote:

We are not altering the scheduling rules, especially not to what you proposed, because it backfired at minimum 6 times in the course of 2 years when we did exactly that.
Team availability or availability of people to stream the stuff has no input in scheduling. Scheduling happens solely around the intention to give everyone a suitable time to play. We are not allowing rescheduling, because if one team requests it, all teams request it and then we have OWC#2 all over again, where one team never makes it to the Grand Finals, because they constantly want to reschedule - or TWC#3 where one bunch of teams was kind enough to make arrangements to attend to the matches, whereas other people felt like they have to reschedule just because they can't get ther ass up out of bed before midday.

Regardless of the scheduling I think based on the previous world cup, the tournament manager has did well in scheduling the game, I rarely see (or never) the match outside their usual biological sleep and wake cycle. I hope this year scheduling will go well again