Monstrata wrote:
Raiden wrote:
Ephemeral wrote:
they'd become more open from the sheer fact that applications would be:
a) always open
b) only minimally influenced by the 'ruling circle' opinions on their personal worth (this is a HUGE issue with non-standard gamemode QAT at the moment and is one of the big reasons for the rework, funnily enough)
c) actually promoting an atmosphere of common discourse among a gamemode instead of blind deference to those "at the top"
stability is great, i agree. the BN have been extremely stable for the most part. the BN in particular have largely outperformed expectation in regards to keeping things well-oiled and moving, so we need more of them, and less of the rest. we want to empower people who want to get involved at the "depth" that they feel comfortable at, so that people don't think their opinions aren't worth anything just because they're not orange or whatever.
allowing the other gamemodes to cloister off into a defunct system that actively promotes leaving people in positions of power for years at a stretch is not the way i think anyone wants to see things proceed.
you might note this is a particularly scathing rebuke of this proposal, and this is largely because much of the sickness in the previous system manifested itself predominately in the other gamemodes. others outside the QAT were not privy to this - i was. standard dodged a bullet because it held the proportionally largest distribution of people which diluted much of the grossness down significantly. it is my hope that expanding the number of people involved in the other gamemodes will do the same there, too.
About a), I can't say much. Agree nor disagree, as I don't have the empirical proof that this would work better than standarized timely applications.
I'm sorry but can you elaborate further on "b)"? I don't seem to be able to grasp what all of that means, unless this is a subtle way of implying that we don't care about work but only about our personal grudges.
Also, what does "promoting an atmosphere of common discourse" mean other than completely abolishing any existing quality standard (which is most likely what you wrote but trying to taint it in a bad light), which is what caused osu!standard to need this rework? The deference is not blind when those at the so-called top have rightfully earned their "top" title through long years of effort.
Maintenance of current system is your main priority, but this proposal puts way too much focus onto giving current QAT leadership complete control over everything. In practice this is already very much a thing, from talking to various people in old Taiko community.
Again, QAT leadership's job is to bridge the communication between higher-ups and the QAT. "From talking to old Taiko community" you can extract as much biased information as you want, that does not make it necessarily true. In their time it may have been like that, but things have surely changed. I don't know if for the better or for the worse. We don't have nearly as much authority as the old QAT used to have back in 2014-2015.
"allowing the other gamemodes to cloister off into a defunct system that actively promotes leaving people in positions of power for years at a stretch is not the way i think anyone wants to see things proceed." Have you asked anyone here though? Having people for years in a position of power does not exclude other people joining in said positions of power if they do good enough.
Only the people at the "top" will be able to decide when someone is "good enough" to join a position of power under this proposal. You can see how this is a big issue.
While I personally do not find this an issue, since we have not had any problem with this method of selection, there could always be alternate ways of choosing those on the top. Yes, even a popularity vote would be valid, if you stretch me enough.
On the last paragraph, it's been difficult for me to understand due to me not being a native speaker, but what I get from it is that you think our modes are actually WORSE than standard because of standard's bigger community dilluting down the "grossness". That's new. I never heard anything from you about this, which makes arguing kind of pointless here, especially if you already convinced yourself that you know what's the best for the other modes.
It's quite true though. Lack of leadership positions in minigame modes results in more constrained viewpoints. There are at most 3 people whose opinions and views are taken into consideration. For example, I don't know if Nardo still does this, or if the old japanese Taiko community just dissipated, but there used to be huge contention (not on forums of course) over how Nardo was checking spread issues and putting too much focus onto stuff like that. However, there was no way to "oppose" this. But this is from discord messages and community, etc... Gladly people in Taiko prefer to just suck it up and fix things instead of arguing, but this just illustrate potential problems in the future. What if another group of Taiko mappers emerges and has differing views to the current leadership position, but vehemently maintain that their method is sound?
Basically, with Mao's system, BN's are given more power to dictate these scenarios, and QAT's no longer concern themselves with this, and are instead concerned with administrative issues and "keeping the system working". Which is what you want right? A preservation of how these modes are currrently operating.
That simply does not happen anymore. First of all, the QAT does not have an inch of the authority they used to have in 2014-2015. Secondly, spread regulations, while having always been a very strict element of the taiko mapping/modding scene, have certainly softened due to the community's large input. If that said group of new taiko mappers reason well enough that their viewpoint is sound, there would be legit zero issue on letting them keeping that method. I insist, the leadership does not correspond to an opinion dictatorship; only to answer to higher ups in the name of the mode.
And lastly, BNs already have the power to dictate the scenario by sheer nomination power. The QAT in our modes have not expressed a desire to exclusively keep themselves occupied on administrative tasks, which makes the last point kind of unnecessary.
The input is much appreciated.