petit milady - Hakone Hakoiri Musume · forum

Lami

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-01T17:26:34+00:00

Xexxar wrote:
Well if you decide to stop being conceited and are willing to work to improve your map with me, you can call me back and I will reconsider your map. Until then Lasse will be unable to bubble this map based on the new rule.

i just worried my plan, whether i find new 2 BN or just follow your opinion.

i don't mind to improve my map, but im not sure that your modding have enough vaild thing for improve map.
because i ask opinion some people, but many people don't agree with you.

Yuii-

2,502 posts

Joined July 2013

Yuii- 2016-11-01T17:33:05+00:00

Hello Lami,

Personally I would strongly recommend you to re-consider Xexxar's mod from the scratch. The highest difficulty does indeed have some major issues that Xexxar talked about in his mod.
From my point of view, everything I can tell you is that 00:18:532 - said section should be mapped differently rhythmically speaking (not so 1/2 spamm-y), and so, a different intensity. The map looks rather "generic" from what I have seen and using a different mapping technique might be more than appreciated.

Feel free to ask Xexxar for mod help, I am more than sure he will help you out with a lot of things you might encounter on his mod.

I Must Decrease

908 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-11-01T17:40:34+00:00

If I wasn't clear enough with the main issue I have with this map.

The real issue I have with this map is that everything is a bland jump with no unique pattern designs: no linear motion, no real rhythmic variety, no real focus on vocals (the most dynamic part of the song), no aesthetic variety to match different parts of the music. Everything feels washed out and it doesn't feel like I'm appreciating the music when playing. With a song that has a very similar baseline throughout, you should be trying to appreciate the vocals as much as possible, because they are the most unique part of the song that allow for that.

Honestly I believe this map needs nearly a complete remap and heavy alternations to make it so that music is being more appreciated, rather than just the generic mapping that doesnt have any weight or musical justification behind it.

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-01T17:40:57+00:00

of course, i don't want to say just "no".

prefer to discuss mapping idea with modder.
just i afraid of that if we can't understanding with each others.
i already saw simliar case before previous ranked map.

btw, i want other people join this discussion. (include non-mapper)

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-01T18:27:11+00:00

Xexxar wrote:
If I wasn't clear enough with the main issue I have with this map.

The real issue I have with this map is that everything is a bland jump with no unique pattern designs:
i don't know what's mean unique partten + why i have to use this.
non-unique partten = lack of quaility?
no linear motion,
why i have to use linear motion? it's just your personal taste
no real rhythmic variety,
?
no real focus on vocals (the most dynamic part of the song)
specially, i saw your map for understanding, but your map doesn't focus on vocal, too. why do i have to focus vocal, despite of you didn't??
vocal = circle, vocal = circle => it's too strict,
no aesthetic variety to match different parts of the music.
where is vaild reason? i can't find someone who agree with this.
there isn't symmetry thing? not keep blanket?
if you don't give more vaild reason which many people can agree with you, include me., i can say only "no".
Even if you bring good reasons, if you make antipathy to many people + mapper, that is bad reason.
if you want to forced your taste, it's same with QAT direct dq system.
Everything feels washed out and it doesn't feel like I'm appreciating the music when playing. With a song that has a very similar baseline throughout, you should be trying to appreciate the vocals as much as possible, because they are the most unique part of the song that allow for that.

Honestly I believe this map needs nearly a complete remap and heavy alternations to make it so that music is being more appreciated, rather than just the generic mapping that doesnt have any weight or musical justification behind it.

im looking forward modding v2.

im not disagree 100% with you, but you need more vaild reason. why mine is incorrect, yours is correct

and i want to more definitely something before this discussion.

your modding is opinion for mapper? OR your modding is command to mapper?

Last edited by Lami 2016-11-01T18:33:03+00:00, edited 2 times in total.

Kalibe

2,060 posts

Joined October 2013

Kalibe 2016-11-01T18:29:44+00:00

From my point of view the section 00:18:532 (1) - feels pretty fine as it is.
Most sliders are put on kicks, rhythm is almost constant 1/2 and vocal is offbeat at some point so...

i see u missed 00:24:805 (6) - finish on head + maybe curve it like you did with 00:20:441 (6) - ?
about 00:28:896 (3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - try to decrease density by using 1/4 repeaters, will be pretty cool though.
and ye 00:27:259 (1) - missed finish too =w=

I Must Decrease

908 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-11-01T20:16:24+00:00

Ok. Good luck finding another BN who agrees with your view then.

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-01T20:46:05+00:00

ok i will check other(yuii and kalibe) post when i have time.

Len

2,812 posts

Joined June 2012

Len 2016-11-02T06:38:36+00:00

계속 Xexxar의 의견을 무시하고 난 다른 BN 두명 찾아서 랭크시킬거다 라는걸 계속 말하고 다니는것보단 차라리 애매모호하게 끝내버리는게 더 좋았을텐데.. 라는게 제 의견입니다

모딩v2 나오면 저 모딩에 대해 다른 사람들이 댓글 답글같은걸로 논쟁하고 그럴수 있으니 조금 더 편한점은 있을듯

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-02T07:51:18+00:00

흐음... 저는 무시하지않고 제 생각하는바를 적어서 답을 했다고 생각합니다만은...
애초에 쟤도 저보고 내말대로 고치기전에는 계속 거부권행사할꺼다.이랬는데
향후 이 맵의 방향에 대해 언급했으니 저도 그에 관련된 답을 할수밖에요

Shiro

Global Moderator

4,984 posts

Joined May 2009

Shiro 2016-11-02T09:10:19+00:00

Lami wrote:
Xexxar wrote:
If I wasn't clear enough with the main issue I have with this map.

The real issue I have with this map is that everything is a bland jump with no unique pattern designs:
i don't know what's mean unique partten + why i have to use this.
non-unique partten = lack of quaility?
no linear motion,
why i have to use linear motion? it's just your personal taste
no real rhythmic variety,
?
no real focus on vocals (the most dynamic part of the song)
specially, i saw your map for understanding, but your map doesn't focus on vocal, too. why do i have to focus vocal, despite of you didn't??
vocal = circle, vocal = circle => it's too strict,
no aesthetic variety to match different parts of the music.
where is vaild reason? i can't find someone who agree with this.
there isn't symmetry thing? not keep blanket?
if you don't give more vaild reason which many people can agree with you, include me., i can say only "no".
Even if you bring good reasons, if you make antipathy to many people + mapper, that is bad reason.
if you want to forced your taste, it's same with QAT direct dq system.
Everything feels washed out and it doesn't feel like I'm appreciating the music when playing. With a song that has a very similar baseline throughout, you should be trying to appreciate the vocals as much as possible, because they are the most unique part of the song that allow for that.

Honestly I believe this map needs nearly a complete remap and heavy alternations to make it so that music is being more appreciated, rather than just the generic mapping that doesnt have any weight or musical justification behind it.
im looking forward modding v2.

im not disagree 100% with you, but you need more vaild reason. why mine is incorrect, yours is correct

and i want to more definitely something before this discussion.

your modding is opinion for mapper? OR your modding is command to mapper?

In a way, yes. Assuming that your goal when mapping is to actually represent the song, then you should be following the song's changes in intensity, instrumentation, phrases, etc. which means that if there are changes in the song (for example, a slower part), then your map should also change accordingly (reducing density, spacing, or however you want to represent it). The issue Xexxar is pointing out is that your map does not have any major structural changes, and so does not follow the song it's based on.

I hope this clears it. I'm willing to give you more details or more in-depth explanation if you want me to.

Doyak

osu! Alumni

2,621 posts

Joined November 2012

Doyak 2016-11-02T09:37:25+00:00

Call me if you need an interpreter.

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-02T10:23:43+00:00

remove misread sentence

Last edited by Lami 2016-11-02T10:34:06+00:00, edited 2 times in total.

Doyak

osu! Alumni

2,621 posts

Joined November 2012

Doyak 2016-11-02T10:27:46+00:00

Shiro가 말하는 건 unique pattern 쪽은 아니고, 노래가 변함에 따라 맵의 구조적인 변화도 있어야 한다는 걸 강조하고 있는데 이 부분에 대해서 설명을 하셔야 될 거 같습니다.

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-02T10:31:19+00:00

영어 너무 어렵;; 노래가 변함에 따라 맵의 구조적인 변화... 이거 무슨 말이죠;;

DS랑 sv는 곡 분위기에따라 이미 바꿔넣었는데..

Doyak

osu! Alumni

2,621 posts

Joined November 2012

Doyak 2016-11-02T10:33:15+00:00

양측으로 번역해드릴 수 있으니 어려우신 부분 있으면 말씀하세요

맵 내용에 대한 건 제가 아직 오스를 못 들어가서 봐드리긴 어렵겠네요. 한 2시간쯤 뒤에 집 들어갈 듯?

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-02T16:21:12+00:00

applied some suggestion after some discussion with some mapper.

* 00:27:259 - reduce spacing, rhythm this section
* 00:18:532 - adjust some placed(guess 70% redesign here). about rhythm, i try to more 1/2 rhythm with keep emphasis finish <=> 1/1 sldier.
* add hitsound what kalibe's mention.

@shiro : ok, i see. i get this idea what i do. after some discussion. so i could * 00:27:259 -
thanks you for your help

@yuii: spacing problem is fixed. and redesign something 00:18:532 -

######

try to fix again with something

*reparttening at 00:01:078 -
*adjust some DS, placement with consistent or with vaild reason.

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-03T19:21:09+00:00

unintended double post rip

Pentori

1,157 posts

Joined November 2015

Pentori 2016-11-04T11:31:32+00:00

irc

22:13 Pentori: flow is fine
22:13 Pentori: regarding rhythm
22:13 Pentori: 00:05:305 (7) - maybe remove this?
22:13 Pentori: and stack 00:05:168 (6) - on 00:05:441 (1)
22:14 Pentori: because then it plays the same as 00:02:987 (6,1) -
22:14 Pentori: since the sounds are the same
22:15 Lami: hm.. how about think my reason? http://puu.sh/s673q.png
22:15 Lami: i won't keep if many people feel weird in here
22:16 Lami: because already some people say about that owo
22:16 Pentori: i dont really understand that explanation
22:16 Pentori: what are you following with it?
22:16 Pentori: the techno?
22:18 Lami: try to follow this sound 00:01:350 - , 00:01:487 - , 00:01:759 - 00:02:032 - , 00:02:305 - , 00:02:578 - , 00:02:714 - , 00:02:987 -
22:19 Pentori: but that sound isn't on 00:05:305 (7)
22:19 Pentori: its on 00:05:168 (6)
22:21 Lami: i already some opinion about that but it's kinda vaild reason only for me... i will fix to that. thanks you :3
22:24 Pentori: 00:11:441 (1,2,1) - i'd make 00:11:714 (2,1) - bigger jump
22:24 Pentori: 00:11:441 (1,2) - smaller jump
22:26 Lami: ok i agree, fix too
22:29 Pentori: rest seems fine~

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Monstrata 2016-11-16T05:04:55+00:00

Hakone

00:15:805 (2) - Kickslider here, but not 00:16:078 (4) - ? seems a bit inconsistent.
00:18:259 (1) - Construct it more like a lightning bolt so it looks a bit cleaner.

~

00:53:168 (5,6) - I would make this a 1/2 slider instead so there is a transition into the jump sequence on 00:53:441 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - . Right now they feel like the same sequence but i don't think that's your intention since you used NC spam, (also those jumps follow the drum a lot more closely imo).
01:19:487 (7) - There's no note here. Make 6 a slider instead please.
01:23:850 (7) - This one's really feint too, i would make 6 a slider too here. That way theres a transition into 01:23:987 (1,2,3) - instead of everything being jumps here,
01:35:714 (2) - I would NC here, remove NC on 01:35:986 (1) - and NC 01:36:532 (2) - instead. That way the NC's correlate with different phrases.
01:38:714 (1,1) - This is a surprisingly low spacing. Give it a bigger jump?

Dailycare

00:29:714 (1,2,1,2,1,2) - Man, this overlap is so confusing lol. I think doing a partial overlap is better than doing a full overlap here.
00:35:714 (4,1) - Spacing is surprisingly small for the sound on 1. You're entering a more upbeat section, so put a jump here?

Nice

Little

00:57:805 (1,2) - How about using the same slider design instead? It follows your symmetrical sliders and beat-pairing from earlier: 00:55:623 (1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) -
00:58:487 (4) - This slider design seemed kinda random for the section.

Kalibe

00:07:623 (1,2) - I don't like this 1/1 gap mainly because you're sacrificing rhythm choice for a specific pattern design. I think its better to map out the triplets on 00:07:759 - rather than create a large 1/1 gap spacing.
00:11:441 (2) - NC since you NC'ed 00:13:623 (1) -
00:15:805 (2) - I would also NC here too, but this is less important. 01:36:532 (2) - too

thzz

00:54:805 (2,3,4,5) - Okay, i'm not really getting this rhythm at all. I want to say Ctrl+G 00:54:805 (2,3) - but then circle into triplet seems really dense.

Try this rhythm instead?

eiNess

AR 5.5 is better imo just because of how high the bpm is.

Normal

Good!

[]

I don't really agree with the reasons for the pop. I don't think you should ever have to map to vocals. Some people prefer mapping to the instrumental track in order to supplement the vocals. Also, mapping quality isn't always determined by aesthetics. Of course, if your map looks nice, then its more likely to be high quality, but we shouldn't rely only on visual/aesthetic quality because not all mappers base their mapping on structure and easily-distinguishable patterns in editor.

Anyways, call me back when everyone's replied. I'll assume since this has been bubbled before, that metadata has been confirmed somewhere?

Kalibe

2,060 posts

Joined October 2013

Kalibe 2016-11-16T08:37:35+00:00

fixed all

thx monstratos

osu file format v14

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AudioFilename: Hakone Hakoiri Musume.mp3
AudioLeadIn: 0
PreviewTime: 72873
Countdown: 0
SampleSet: Soft
StackLeniency: 0.5
Mode: 0
LetterboxInBreaks: 0
WidescreenStoryboard: 1

[Editor]
DistanceSpacing: 1.5
BeatDivisor: 4
GridSize: 4
TimelineZoom: 1.5

[Metadata]
Title:Hakone Hakoiri Musume
TitleUnicode:ハコネハコイリムスメ
Artist:petit milady
ArtistUnicode:petit milady
Creator:Lami
Version:Kalibe's Insane
Source:温泉幼精ハコネちゃん
Tags:Onsen Yousei Hakone-chan 悠木碧 Yuuki Aoi 竹達彩奈 Taketatsu Ayane eINess thzz Little cloudsplash16 kalibe Dailycare intoon
BeatmapID:1081149
BeatmapSetID:374820

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HPDrainRate:6
CircleSize:4
OverallDifficulty:7.5
ApproachRate:9
SliderMultiplier:1.55
SliderTickRate:1

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226,67,68714,6,0,P|223:105|210:155,1,77.5
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thzz

579 posts

Joined May 2012

thzz 2016-11-16T08:38:55+00:00

@Monstrata
changed in another way (using 1/1 slider)
thank you!

@Lami
http://puu.sh/sjXWD/8e38f5d971.osu

Dailycare

Beatmap Nominator

1,072 posts

Joined May 2012

Dailycare 2016-11-16T12:08:12+00:00

Monstrata wrote:
Dailycare

00:29:714 (1,2,1,2,1,2) - Man, this overlap is so confusing lol. I think doing a partial overlap is better than doing a full overlap here. Fixed it but I'm still not sure whether the new pattern is good enough
00:35:714 (4,1) - Spacing is surprisingly small for the sound on 1. You're entering a more upbeat section, so put a jump here? hai

Nice ^.^

Thanks mr monstrata

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TitleUnicode:ハコネハコイリムスメ
Artist:petit milady
ArtistUnicode:petit milady
Creator:Lami
Version:Dailycare's Extra
Source:温泉幼精ハコネちゃん
Tags:Onsen Yousei Hakone-chan 悠木碧 Yuuki Aoi 竹達彩奈 Taketatsu Ayane eINess thzz Little cloudsplash16 kalibe Dailycare intoon
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434,65,22487,1,2,0:0:0:0:
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144,154,57941,1,2,0:0:0:0:
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428,41,61487,1,8,0:0:0:0:
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Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-16T13:41:46+00:00

Monstrata wrote:
Hakone

00:15:805 (2) - Kickslider here, but not 00:16:078 (4) - ? seems a bit inconsistent.
because 00:15:873 - only have unique drum in blue tick, at 00:15:805 (2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) -
00:18:259 (1) - Construct it more like a lightning bolt so it looks a bit cleaner. will try
~
00:53:168 (5,6) - I would make this a 1/2 slider instead so there is a transition into the jump sequence on 00:53:441 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - . Right now they feel like the same sequence but i don't think that's your intention since you used NC spam, (also those jumps follow the drum a lot more closely imo).
change slider
01:19:487 (7) - There's no note here. Make 6 a slider instead please. ok
01:23:850 (7) - This one's really feint too, i would make 6 a slider too here. That way theres a transition into 01:23:987 (1,2,3) - instead of everything being jumps here, since 01:23:850 - have pretty drum here. then i'd like click circle here. hmm.. also, i think it doesn't make confuse here, by high AR
01:35:714 (2) - I would NC here, remove NC on 01:35:986 (1) - and NC 01:36:532 (2) - instead. That way the NC's correlate with different phrases.
this NC usage by strong beat, since at 01:34:895 - , 01:35:986 - have pretty strong beat here.
you may worried this modding by 01:30:532 (1,1) - , or 01:32:714 (1,1) - this NC usage. because they take break during long rhythm. so
for divide partten in here. but 01:34:895 (1,2,3,1,2) - doesn't have long break, like previous.
01:38:714 (1,1) - This is a surprisingly low spacing. Give it a bigger jump? yea

Normal

Good!

[]

I don't really agree with the reasons for the pop. I don't think you should ever have to map to vocals. Some people prefer mapping to the instrumental track in order to supplement the vocals. Also, mapping quality isn't always determined by aesthetics. Of course, if your map looks nice, then its more likely to be high quality, but we shouldn't rely only on visual/aesthetic quality because not all mappers base their mapping on structure and easily-distinguishable patterns in editor.

Anyways, call me back when everyone's replied. I'll assume since this has been bubbled before, that metadata has been confirmed somewhere?
1. p/4723765
2. https://osu.ppy.sh/s/470000 (ranked map)

thanks for modding

@Advanced : fix to AR 5.5

Last edited by Lami 2016-11-17T08:43:21+00:00, edited 1 time in total.

Little

2,509 posts

Joined November 2012

Little 2016-11-17T02:16:37+00:00

Fixed. Thanks.

Little's Extra

osu file format v14

[General]
AudioFilename: Hakone Hakoiri Musume.mp3
AudioLeadIn: 0
PreviewTime: 72873
Countdown: 0
SampleSet: Normal
StackLeniency: 0.7
Mode: 0
LetterboxInBreaks: 0
WidescreenStoryboard: 1

[Editor]
DistanceSpacing: 1.3
BeatDivisor: 4
GridSize: 4
TimelineZoom: 2.799999

[Metadata]
Title:Hakone Hakoiri Musume
TitleUnicode:ハコネハコイリムスメ
Artist:petit milady
ArtistUnicode:petit milady
Creator:Lami
Version:Little's Extra
Source:温泉幼精ハコネちゃん
Tags:Onsen Yousei Hakone-chan 悠木碧 Yuuki Aoi 竹達彩奈 Taketatsu Ayane eINess thzz Little cloudsplash16 kalibe Dailycare intoon
BeatmapID:0
BeatmapSetID:-1

[Difficulty]
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CircleSize:3.5
OverallDifficulty:8.5
ApproachRate:9.3
SliderMultiplier:1.7
SliderTickRate:1

[Events]
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//Break Periods
//Storyboard Layer 0 (Background)
//Storyboard Layer 1 (Fail)
//Storyboard Layer 2 (Pass)
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//Storyboard Sound Samples

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Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Monstrata 2016-11-22T11:10:36+00:00

Sorry for the delay. School happened ;c.

A lot of work seems to have been done between Xexxar's pop and this rebubble. In any case, I'm happy with the state that it's in now. Here's your rebubble, and good luck finding your 2nd (3rd?) BN!

smallboat

1,687 posts

Joined January 2010

smallboat 2016-11-26T08:46:41+00:00

Sorry delay so long because have a big busy irl things before, thanks above BNs check and I feel nothing to say that now, let it qua

Seijiro

osu! Alumni

3,438 posts

Joined April 2013

Seijiro 2016-11-26T09:09:07+00:00

heh...

Underforest

5,895 posts

Joined July 2015

Underforest 2016-11-26T09:53:52+00:00

gratz

Reillia

1,162 posts

Joined August 2014

Reillia 2016-11-26T16:26:18+00:00

ㅋㅋ결국 랭

thzz

579 posts

Joined May 2012

thzz 2016-11-26T17:40:16+00:00

gratz, お疲れ様！

Snowy Dream

2,195 posts

Joined September 2009

Snowy Dream 2016-11-26T18:01:36+00:00

温泉幼精ハコネちゃん! gratz !!!

I Must Decrease

908 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-11-26T21:04:17+00:00

tragic

Little

2,509 posts

Joined November 2012

Little 2016-11-26T21:55:06+00:00

grats

Shiirn

2,896 posts

Joined August 2010

Shiirn 2016-11-26T23:44:35+00:00

I mean, it's pretty obvious to see that the mapper just waited things out and then tried again having changed very little at all.

The problem I personally have with Hakone is not whether it maps vocals or instruments or not, but that it has no variance whatsoever in its spacing or vitality.

00:16:350 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2) - Let's take this bit for example. The music has a very obvious heavy drum on the first beat, with three vocal syllables following them. A very good way to map this would be to make the 1s independent from the 2,3,4s by patterning them differently. but alas, the mapper just uses a random 1,2,3,4 pp pattern with no real variance in spacing at all.

And you can't use the "well it's mapping the instruments" excuse because the drums and guitar only appear on the 1,2,3s there. There is no instrument on the 4s so they must be layering the vocals or they are making things up.

The map is fine. It's playable. It even plays well.

But it does not feel like you're playing a map built around the song. It's just using the song as a background rhythm while you play the map. This is the essence of what I call "Whack-a-mole" mapping. Players just have the background music and look for the next object to click on. There's no immersion, there's no automatic, instinctive movement to finish patterns you've established in the song. This map has no coherent theme and no selling point to speak of.

The extra does quite well at representing a theme and having consistent structural choices with certain patterns showing up when the music uses that pattern. It does a very good job of giving each musical pattern a fitting object pattern, and using those object patterns when the music uses that pattern. This is how a map is "consistent", and it's the manipulation of this concept that makes boring TV sizes "good" if mapped correctly. This kind of mapping is done pretty much unconsciously and doesn't seem to really be explained in so many words unless you're directly taught it.

If this was someone's first ranked map, I wouldn't even mention this kind of thing and would simply applaud the mapper on a job well done on their first map. But Lami has 10 other ranked maps, with pretty much the same issue in every single map, and it's about time he took some steps forward as a mapper. He shouldn't hold second torch to his GD extras all the time.

tl;dr The mapset is objectively okay, but the topmost diff subjectively sucks. I like the GD extra as a topmost diff, myself, but that'd be putting down the map uploader ^^''

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-27T03:32:41+00:00

"Shiirn"

I mean, it's pretty obvious to see that the mapper just waited things out and then tried again having changed very little at all.
i had discussion with many mapper. and i get many opinion about them. (some BNs, my map's GDer, my friend, player, etc...)
I didn't proceed with my own opinion.

The problem I personally have with Hakone is not whether it maps vocals or instruments or not, but that it has no variance whatsoever in its spacing or vitality.

00:16:350 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2) - Let's take this bit for example. The music has a very obvious heavy drum on the first beat, with three vocal syllables following them. A very good way to map this would be to make the 1s independent from the 2,3,4s by patterning them differently. but alas, the mapper just uses a random 1,2,3,4 pp pattern with no real variance in spacing at all.
At 00:16:350 (1,2,3,4) - , /// (1) - Drum(no vocal) , (2) - Strong vocal , (3) - Small vocal , (4) Strong vocal than (3).
DS was based on that. <<btw, every DS can't keep consistent by placement.>>
i understand what you say. but i still prefer current style which aimed vocal.
because it's mostly charming part(impressive about vocal) on this song.

And you can't use the "well it's mapping the instruments" excuse because the drums and guitar only appear on the 1,2,3s there. There is no instrument on the 4s so they must be layering the vocals or they are making things up.

The map is fine. It's playable. It even plays well.

But it does not feel like you're playing a map built around the song. It's just using the song as a background rhythm while you play the map. This is the essence of what I call "Whack-a-mole" mapping. Players just have the background music and look for the next object to click on. There's no immersion, there's no automatic, instinctive movement to finish patterns you've established in the song. This map has no coherent theme and no selling point to speak of.
it's really depend on mapper, even if someone want to follow really un-major beat with inconsistent rhythm choice, anyone can't force to fix this choice. i think that 'map = express mapper's think'

The extra does quite well at representing a theme and having consistent structural choices with certain patterns showing up when the music uses that pattern. It does a very good job of giving each musical pattern a fitting object pattern, and using those object patterns when the music uses that pattern. This is how a map is "consistent", and it's the manipulation of this concept that makes boring TV sizes "good" if mapped correctly. This kind of mapping is done pretty much unconsciously and doesn't seem to really be explained in so many words unless you're directly taught it.

If this was someone's first ranked map, I wouldn't even mention this kind of thing and would simply applaud the mapper on a job well done on their first map. But Lami has 10 other ranked maps, with pretty much the same issue in every single map, and it's about time he took some steps forward as a mapper. He shouldn't hold second torch to his GD extras all the time. hmm, I don't receive GD in that sense. Every mapper have different style, then i want player enjoy different style in my mapset, because every player don't have same taste. but maybe, i will try to improve my mapping in the future. because mapping doesn't have 100% correct answer.

tl;dr The mapset is objectively okay, but the topmost diff subjectively sucks. I like the GD extra as a topmost diff, myself, but that'd be putting down the map uploader ^^'' plz do not bad word 'suck', i believe you already know it's pretty bad word, @_@.....

not full reply, because i can't read all sentence for now. as im bad english. :<
will edit when i can read that
ok, i can read finally

thanks for feedback.

Last edited by Lami 2016-12-02T18:30:46+00:00, edited 1 time in total.

Satellite

Beatmap Nominator

3,683 posts

Joined June 2012

Satellite 2016-11-27T07:53:04+00:00

Lami wrote:
竹達彩奈 Taketatsu Ayane

taketatsu ayana is fine.

must be changed online tags ?

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Topic Starter

Lami 2016-11-27T08:04:21+00:00

rip my metadata

Lami wrote:
1. p/4723765
2. https://osu.ppy.sh/s/470000 (ranked map)

Satellite

Beatmap Nominator

3,683 posts

Joined June 2012

Satellite 2016-11-27T08:09:43+00:00

Lami wrote:
rip my metadata

Lami wrote:
1. p/4723765
2. https://osu.ppy.sh/s/470000 (ranked map)

LOL

petit milady - Hakone Hakoiri Musume

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