LOLAnxient wrote:
peppy is awake and not happy.
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Mapset and Spread Restructure (Proposed)
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SPOILER
Mr Color wrote:
hey i didn't read the whole thread but if you're reading this chances are you probably already know your idea is borked.
but yeah i'm gonna try and explain why despite not having been around the game in a long time but hey my name's in black so that means if i'm not relevant well at least I was at some point
so this graph in the opening post is like this right
but really that's not what's happening and we all know this. the spread in difficulty is infinitely wider in the higher than lower levels. To me trying to chart this out is already pretty dumb because some maps will have a spread with easy easies, easy normals, easy hards and so on, other with hard easies (which uh good luck with that), hard normal, hard hards, etc. but if we were to chart it out this is what it would most likely look like
obviously this is all relative which is why i disagree with the idea of even charting it out but oh well it will do. so pretty much the idea is that it's actually very stupid to require such a spread when there is absolutely no leeway with how hard/easy difficulties can go. i still don't understand why 1/4 is outright banned from normals. other rhythm games less difficulties yet cover a higher range because hey some songs make easy maps and others make hard maps. (shoutouts to jubeat and REUNION with that lv10 normal)
if you want your difficulty spread to make more sense then you should allow more flexibility into how easy and hard the difficulties within that spread rank. By the way, we have a star rating system that (from what I can tell) works now, so even a name like "easy" and "normal" is kind of whatever because all that matters is that star rating in the end.
let me try to chart what i'm trying to say. we'll take Easy and Ultra as their logical maximum, aka how easy/impossibly hard a map can be.
that's basically my beef with the new set of rules you guys have been pushing, haven't really looked at the rest of the announcement and it's implications but if it makes as little sense to me as this does i'll make another post showing my glorious photoshop skills
This post is gold and should be read by everyone, it explains why this ruleset should've been discussed with actual people and accepted by them before being implemented.
Over half of the new council are rejecting they accepted this new ruleset, i sense powertrip.
Except it is allowed (probably?) vCirno-baka9 wrote:
Since pretty much every post has been "This is bullshit" (even my posts), I will attempt to post a reason why the second rule is horrible (if it wasn't obvious enough).
According to this, we can have a 3* Hard and a 5* Insane, but no way to make a Light Insane that is 4* for good difficulty spread
Please change..
The fact that it is so vague that it is being misunderstood by everyone (it's still a terrible rule though for reasons I've stated previously) reflects on how poorly created this rule is.ztrot wrote:
The difficulty is not dependent on the star rating. The mapping techniques used within the difficulty and the spread to the surrounding difficulties define the category each difficulty level falls into. Difficulties must be named to reflect that.
People complain about shit maps. What you do in return is limit the amount of quality sets.Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
How does that make sense?
ztrot wrote:
Hello everyone, ztrot here with some exciting new news!
ztrot wrote:
some exciting new news!
ztrot wrote:
exciting new news!
lol'dztrot wrote:
exciting
Timorisu wrote:
People complain about shit maps. What you do in return is limit the amount of quality sets.Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
How does that make sense?
hey can we not screw eveything up thanks
DeletedUser_3886246
[/quoteCirno-baka9"[quote="Timorisu wrote:
People complain about shit maps. What you do in return is limit the amount of quality sets.Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
How does that make sense?
I'm sorry I must have missed the 200 posts an hour of people complaining about shitmaps. I don't suppose you have the thread that happened in handy anywhere? Or by "everyone" did you mean "less than 1% as many people as there are opposing this change"?Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
Are you stupid?
Proposing a good change is different from a bad change.
"Make up your fucking minds"
So I can choose between a bad change and a bad change? Oh thanks I'll take the bad change please!
Use new.ppy.shBlind Justice wrote:
Let's fix the website first. It keeps crashing on me every time I reload.
1. Quit mapping and osu
2. We can rank same song in a week, and remove the 6 maps a day rc
After these 2 changes, let us if new one is good
3. quit mapping and osu
Finally a good reason to quit tjis stupid game.
2. We can rank same song in a week, and remove the 6 maps a day rc
After these 2 changes, let us if new one is good
3. quit mapping and osu
Finally a good reason to quit tjis stupid game.
Oh my..
I'm very agree for this!XxVivaxX wrote:
Why do we want to change something, that isnt borken. If you look at a average or a new player, they will all have problems to improve. Why do you want people to improve in big steps, instead of little small ones?
This is a change in the system, not the mapping itself. There still can be shitmapping with this new system. Your logic is flawed.Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
Damn I feel bad for the mapping community now. This restriction is a little too excessive. This is a very drastic change that limits mappers to make a variety in their sets. As a modder myself this doesn't quite affect me as really it will be easier to get shit done, but I don't like to condone what people want to map.
The way that it's structured I don't know how well with limiting difficulties in a set would do.
It's ok we as a community don't have power or say in a discussion this big because we are obviously living in an world where Donald Trump exists. Sad, sad world indeed. My regards to all mappers out there. Good Luck with this one 
The way that it's structured I don't know how well with limiting difficulties in a set would do.
Meh
This pretty much reminded me when they wanted to eliminate 30 secs mapa
This pretty much reminded me when they wanted to eliminate 30 secs mapa
the only time this was ever mentioned to the community was by ztrot 2 nights ago on modhelp. Only the council supposedly agreed to this.Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
This isn't the fix we were hoping for.
Broccoly wrote:
This is a change in the system, not the mapping itself. There still can be shitmapping with this new system. Your logic is flawed.Zak wrote:
For months now everyone complains about shit mapping, now we announce a change and everyone says it was fine.
Make up your fucking minds.
Things are not ending, this does not kill your ability make maps, you can still make multiple sets for a single song, you still have options.
And not everything here is final as already stated, it's not like we just ignore what everyone else thinks, there's just too much to reply to currently.
I don't really agree with it. I came in osu when approved map could just be a harder map (doesn't matter the lenght) and from this, it gave me motivation to improve even more to actually pass this map.XxVivaxX wrote:
Why do we want to change something, that isnt borken. If you look at a average or a new player, they will all have problems to improve. Why do you want people to improve in big steps, instead of little small ones?
This has been released without consensus from the whole team. Not sure why.
Locking for now pending further internal discussion; we already have more than enough feedback in this thread (holy crap, fastest moving thread ever on the osu! forums?!). Rest assured we won't be pushing this on anyone just yet. I haven't even read the opening post here.
Locking for now pending further internal discussion; we already have more than enough feedback in this thread (holy crap, fastest moving thread ever on the osu! forums?!). Rest assured we won't be pushing this on anyone just yet. I haven't even read the opening post here.
Assisting ztrot's proposal to move it into the desired path here. If you have questions or concerns about this, you are free to contact him about it.
Given the misconceptions of the way the original amendment was worded, we came up with a better regulation, that reflects the intended change in a better way without implying more "restrictive behavior" than actually wanted.
Along with that, we attempted to improve the free form of designing your spread a bit, while maintaining the basic idea behind the changes proposed.
This basically allows multiple constellations of mapsets, given that every individual difficulty is spread apart from each other in a linear way. For example:
(where U refers to Ultra, now referred as bonus difficulty in the rules)
ENHIIX + U is fine
ENHHIX + U is fine
ENHIX + U is fine
NHIX + U is fine
NHIXX + U is fine
NHIIXX + U is fine
NHIXX is fine
ENHIX is fine
NNHII is fine
ENHHII is fine
NHIXXX + U is not fine (cant be more than 2 X)
NNHHIIXX + U is not fine (exceeds the cap of 6+1)
ENHHIII is not fine (exceeds the cap of 6 and can't have 3 I)
For approval, this would mean
(>5:00 but <10:00 drain time)
E is fine
N is fine
H is fine
I is fine
X is not fine (it's an Expert, must have an Insane or Hard, too)
HX is fine
IX is fine
XX is not fine (still has no Insane or Hard)
IXX is fine
etc.
(>10:00 drain time)
every kind of single difficulty is allowed. The level doesn't matter.
We were torn in the Approval rule between allowing only IX or also HX. Maybe you guys have input for that matter, as well. We allowed both in the new proposal, but moving on with the feedback we gather from this thread and other places, we might find it easier to make a decision with that.
Additionally, ztrot reconsidered our transistion method to the new behavior. Instead of allowing beatmaps, that have been bubbled at some point of time, to be excluded from the rule change, we expand this allowance to all beatmaps that are currently submitted. This means, all beatmaps uploaded right now can be ranked under the old conditions, still. Newly submitted beatmaps must follow the new regulations, whenever they kick in. However, after 6 months of transistion time, all beatmaps will be handled under the new conditions, regardless of their submission date.
For now, the topic remains locked until peppy decides to unlock it again. I am just informing everyone that there is active efforts to adjust the proposal to both ends of the needs.
Given the misconceptions of the way the original amendment was worded, we came up with a better regulation, that reflects the intended change in a better way without implying more "restrictive behavior" than actually wanted.
Along with that, we attempted to improve the free form of designing your spread a bit, while maintaining the basic idea behind the changes proposed.
- You can map up to 6 difficulties in a mapset per game mode. The lowest difficulty of your set must be below 2*. All difficulties must be evenly spread apart and offer a linear progression. However, you can add a bonus difficulty. For that, the highest difficulty of your evenly spread set must be above 5.25*. The bonus difficulty does not have to align with the rest of the mapset's spread, but must be hardest of the entire mapset.
- You must not have more than 2 difficulties of the same level in your mapset per game mode.
- Approval maps are allowed to have only one difficuty if they're not Expert level. If it does, it needs an additional difficulty of Insane or Hard level. Maps over 10 minutes of drain time do not account for this rule and can have a single difficulty of any level.
This basically allows multiple constellations of mapsets, given that every individual difficulty is spread apart from each other in a linear way. For example:
(where U refers to Ultra, now referred as bonus difficulty in the rules)
ENHIIX + U is fine
ENHHIX + U is fine
ENHIX + U is fine
NHIX + U is fine
NHIXX + U is fine
NHIIXX + U is fine
NHIXX is fine
ENHIX is fine
NNHII is fine
ENHHII is fine
NHIXXX + U is not fine (cant be more than 2 X)
NNHHIIXX + U is not fine (exceeds the cap of 6+1)
ENHHIII is not fine (exceeds the cap of 6 and can't have 3 I)
For approval, this would mean
(>5:00 but <10:00 drain time)
E is fine
N is fine
H is fine
I is fine
X is not fine (it's an Expert, must have an Insane or Hard, too)
HX is fine
IX is fine
XX is not fine (still has no Insane or Hard)
IXX is fine
etc.
(>10:00 drain time)
every kind of single difficulty is allowed. The level doesn't matter.
We were torn in the Approval rule between allowing only IX or also HX. Maybe you guys have input for that matter, as well. We allowed both in the new proposal, but moving on with the feedback we gather from this thread and other places, we might find it easier to make a decision with that.
Additionally, ztrot reconsidered our transistion method to the new behavior. Instead of allowing beatmaps, that have been bubbled at some point of time, to be excluded from the rule change, we expand this allowance to all beatmaps that are currently submitted. This means, all beatmaps uploaded right now can be ranked under the old conditions, still. Newly submitted beatmaps must follow the new regulations, whenever they kick in. However, after 6 months of transistion time, all beatmaps will be handled under the new conditions, regardless of their submission date.
For now, the topic remains locked until peppy decides to unlock it again. I am just informing everyone that there is active efforts to adjust the proposal to both ends of the needs.
Really? You had to post that after what I said? Before I even read anything? Why?
