pieguy1372 wrote:

also, if anyone has any card that, for instance, fails on someone with 0 cards, it's possible to prove I currently only have LDS by me burning it on anyone (since no one is KO'ed) and them using it on me

Okay, I got confirmation. If you use LDS, you will prove either way whether you have other cards or not.

what's the effect? o.O

long-distance shot kills a KO'ed player

since Ank isn't KO'ed, it should just do nothing

then Ank has some way of confirming I have 0 cards remaining after using it - the idea being to prove that I had *only* the one card at daystart and thus discarded my entire hand last night

Sakura just PM'ed me saying I apparently can't use it at all (rather than it failing). so that's not going to work.

le sigh.

two things I can think of that I want to do:

1. massclaim cards (aka everyone claim the card they drew at daystart today - mine was LDS)

2. mass neighborhood claims. I can't see any reason not to do this at this point. as I said before, I'm the last Orange Team member.

The way you behave is just way too fishy to be honest. Also, the way you want to get towncred by asking stuff like that again after Anka put suspicion on you, it just doesn't feel right for me. But I don't get how everything like that happened, because I was not suspecting one of you both from begin on.

I agreed with the way Anka did it, he's put an order following his scum reads, but you just give all information right away. It's not bad per se, but seems desperate to me.

it's not "desperate", it's the theoretically correct play

if there exists a way to confirm a claim in a role madness game, it's better to do so - this involves me laying out exactly what I did

you are really dumb and know nothing about how to play this game if you think this is a scum tell. tbh, if we're basing it off general play I would say Ank is the more likely scum here, so if you're town you need to get over shit like this (hint: you being brought to this lylo, plus Ank's start-of-day read on me, is part of why I think he might actually be scum here).

also, part of why I wanted neighborhood claims is that you being killed N2 makes sense if, for instance, one of {rEdo, Nyquill} and Ank and then you were all in one neighborhood

that would be a 2-scum neighborhood with you as the only town in it - it would make sense that you would be NK'ed because of that

if you don't want to listen to me talk about theory, I ask that you wait for Ank - he should agree card/neighborhood claims are the theoretically correct play regardless of what his alignment here actually is.

pieguy1372 wrote:

it's not "desperate", it's the theoretically correct play

if there exists a way to confirm a claim in a role madness game, it's better to do so - this involves me laying out exactly what I did

you are really dumb and know nothing about how to play this game if you think this is a scum tell. tbh, if we're basing it off general play I would say Ank is the more likely scum here, so if you're town you need to get over shit like this (hint: you being brought to this lylo, plus Ank's start-of-day read on me, is part of why I think he might actually be scum here).

lol

you know how Irre is -.-

fwiw I do think you attempting to confirm my claim today is a town tell. I wouldn't vote on just that without making some kind of effort to refine the read first.

there's also a bunch of things I still don't think make sense about this setup, which I'm writing about in a separate post

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Tess wrote:

"Give the target a card, then learn their alignment. <Night>"
Hika had used it before me on CalignoBot, who turned out to be town.

Sakura wrote:

Apparently... not everyone was safe. who could've thought that they would roll 8 on attack?

GuyInFreezer Kai from the Orange Team has been killed Day 2

Votes are reset.

so I have a few things I'm thinking about before factoring play into this. first thing is that I don't believe we've seen any card this game capable of redirecting or manipulating investigation roles - and if the latter existed in the game, it would be really inelegant because it's completely useless for a town player. the only thing I can think of that would allow the inno on Ank to be false is if there was an outright godfather role in the game. now, looking at it from the top, both Hika/Tess and CTs drew Scary Solicitation, which gives an alignment result - so depending on how many Scary Solicitations were in the deck, I could potentially see Sakura including a GF as a catch-all to hopefully prevent people from mass clearing a bunch of people in the game *if* Sakura assigned alignments before creating roles. this isn't to say he's scum for it, but it is something I am keeping in the back of my mind when rereading

the second thing is that GIF's kill wasn't caused by a card - not sure what to make of this, except for what I'm getting into next

third, the no kill N2. I still cannot think of any reason scum would have no killed or killed Irre.

fourth, Irre is the only person in this game who claimed they don't have a hyper. now, the first post alludes to this by saying "anyone with a hyper ability has a hyper ability stated in their role PM", etc. but I'm actually thinking that the D2 GIF kill may have been some kind of delayed kill mechanic where scum can daykill a player in exchange for forfeiting the kill the next night. I think there's a nonzero chance Irre is just lying here and scum had this as a hyper ability. this isn't *really* much of a point bc if it existed in this game it could have just as easily belonged to rEdo instead of Irre, but I really do not know if it makes sense for there to exist a character without a hyper in the game unless it didn't have one in canon either, which Kyousuke does.

now that I think about it more, I don't make anything of Frostings dying N4. it makes as much sense coming from Ank (mislynch me with Irre today) or Irre (doesn't know what the fuck he's doing the majority of the time - alternatively, could be something else I'm not thinking of).

@MOD: is it public knowledge whether alignment was determined before/after role?

Sakura followed canon in the first game in that the only characters who were missing a hyper were ones that lacked one in the actual game.

pieguy1372 wrote:

@MOD: is it public knowledge whether alignment was determined before/after role?

Alignments were rolled after roles.

eh

I don't *actually* think that means anything since Sakura has historically put conditionals on roles when designing setups in this way, that is, they wind up being different depending on what is rolled (TH upicks as an example - the first one I'm pretty sure would have had said delayed-kill mechanism I was talking about if GIF's role would have rolled scum). but I'm trying to figure out, *if* Ank has a GF role, whether this would be tied into a town ability or if she was just like "herpaderp this random character will be a GF if they roll scum". I can't figure out what would fit with a GF, whereas the latter really doesn't make much sense and isn't like what I'm used to from her.

Irre, did you use a card last night?

The GIF kill was definitely a hyper. Even the other suggestion you put out requires it to be a hyper.

I think Irre would have killed me night 3 instead of Tess. I was setting a trap and I know you have a lot more experience with how I think at night than Irre does, so me not dying when I was advertising that I could break the game open more indicates you as scum than him.

Actually, why would Irre keep me alive over Frostings?

pieguy did you ever use your hyper? I found your massclaim post and saw nothing about it.

no. my hyper (Dance, Long-Eared Beasts) is to KO a random person, I haven't used it at all this game.

my passive is that I get 1-shot KO immunity for each person I KO - likely having to do with Krila gaining an extra HP each time someone hits the Dance, Long-Eared Beasts trap in-game

I think you're going down the wrong track reading into the N3 kill. both you and Tess were confirmed town (or at the very least almost confirmed town). I don't think a hypothetical scum-Irre would have seen much of a difference in the two kills. I'm also not reading into the kills at all for the most part bc I don't have faith that Irre would actually pick kills in a way that is logical or makes any sense - and even if he would, I could easily enough see a scenario where, for instance, he thought I was lynchable and wanted to kill Frostings specifically bc Frostings was calling him "conftown" and thought people would speculate on the NK. (I'm not saying he's scum for this specifically, just that there exists some scenario where the kills make sense coming from Irre-scum.)

bbl, promise me regardless of anything else you don't do anything drastic until Irre at the very least answers my question

pieguy1372 wrote:

you know how Irre is -.-

After reading this I don't even think I need to say anything anymore, because I'm me anyway. I guess it's up to you to decide what to do -_-

something that I just thought of that I feel it's safe to reveal is that I'm almost positive Ank-scum would have NK'ed me at some point in the game

for one basic reason: he knows that I'm one of the few players who will question investigative results in role madness games or in situations where I don't think they make any sense. if you're a GF and you get investigated, literally all you need in order to win is for people to accept the result at face value. I'd likely be one of the only players in the game, if not the only one, who wouldn't just write him off as "conftown".

going to bed. Irre needs to answer my question next time he arrives (yes, I am going somewhere with this).

pieguy1372 wrote:

going to bed. Irre needs to answer my question next time he arrives (yes, I am going somewhere with this).

I haven't.

i am going to be blunt

i think you're lying about card usage

i think you're deliberately dodging this question because you don't know how to answer it in a way that won't make you look like obvious scum

i don't think you'd be this much of a fuckwit and deliberately dodge questions for ... no reason ... as town. this is your last chance to answer it and convince me i'm wrong.

like, you realize that if I explain exactly why I'm thinking this your answer will no longer count, right?

pieguy1372 wrote:

like, you realize that if I explain exactly why I'm thinking this your answer will no longer count, right?

If you knew what I did, why not stating it? The way YOU behave is a shit like town.

the entire point is that if you're town, you should be able to answer the question without knowing why, specifically, I'm asking it

on the other hand, if you're scum, and I immediately lay out what I think happened, you can change your answer around to fit with what I said so that it doesn't contradict anything

this is basic stuff

Prodge. Mostly just waiting to see where this goes.

actually, I'm entirely overthinking this

Sakura wrote:

A trap has been activated!


Trap has failed, Target got no cards to discard.

this trap was not activated because of a card. if it was, Sakura would have confirmed a card was used. this trap must have been activated because of an ability. mod can confirm both of these things (confirming card usage and traps being able to be activated via abilities).

the trap was necessarily placed on Irre. it couldn't have been Ank since mod confirmed Ank placed a trap card after this, and I have LDS (even if you believe I'm lying about having it, I have to have at least *some* card unless there exists a way I could have played one without mod revealing it, which I don't *think* exists).

it follows that

1. Irre had no cards at daystart. not even the one you usually draw when day starts. how is this possible? the only way is that he lied and used Passionate Research last night - if you go back and look, that replaces the card you draw at daystart with another hyper shot.

2. Irre is thus lying about having used Nice Jingle, since he couldn't have had any cards. you will notice that mod never actually confirmed a card was used today - and, conveniently, he "used" it in private instead of declaring it in thread. as I said before, mod can confirm that if Irre had used a card she would have announced that a card was used in thread.

there is a _lot_ more (I have a huge wall typed up that I was going to post instead of this, then I asked the mod about some specific role interactions and got this as a result. either way Irre is lying about at least one thing), but as just one point, from my POV the trap necessarily was activated because Irre used a hyper ability (from an outside POV there is technically a chance I'm lying about my hyper and I targeted Irre with it, however I know 1. my hyper is night-only, 2. my hyper is random which would have made it a complete crapshoot). there's nothing else that could have done it unless Irre lied about what his passive ability was or if Ank did something, but I don't believe he's faking his hyper and he couldn't have used it on Irre as Irre had been KO'ed on N1.

everything after this is speculation, but one more thing: I think he was responsible for the GIF kill D2, and thus didn't claim a hyper bc he couldn't claim his *actual* hyper and didn't know what else he could claim

this would explain why he would have used Passionate Research: if he gets another daykill he wins immediately. I also think that it's limited to players who are KO'ed - which would explain why he didn't just use it immediately at daystart today (there were no viable targets). I alluded to this before, but when Sakura does setups in this way she usually allows for slight modifications in roles depending on what alignment they are. I don't really see Sakura putting "this person has ability X if town, and is a GF if scum"; what *does* make sense? "this person can daykill a KO'ed player if town, and can daykill a KO'ed player in place of the next night's NK if scum".

either way, Irre is at the very least lying about card usage and not having a hyper

@Ank: I'm at the point where I'm ready to vote unless Irre has an explanation for this. if you need anything else from me, or if I screwed my logic up somewhere, ask. either way I'm almost positive Irre is lying about at least one thing somewhere in here bc a lot of things about this game don't add up with the claims so far. from the (admittedly limited) rereading I did, I also think you're more likely to be town here due mostly to recent play (Irre has primarily floated through and done for the most part nothing the past few game days).

Nice, and now vote me already.

Irreversible wrote:

Nice, and now vote me already.

It's not sarcastic by the way, what you said was right and there's I can't come up with more lies, the Nice Jingle one was kind of a last resort which wasn't going to work anyway, because well.. the cards didn't make it possible. I messed up badly by misreading my hyper, sooo~ GG

Activate Hyper: Magical Massacre

Just for shiggles, I guess.

Vote: Irreversible