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Two_old
if it's so obvious, what is my real role?
Chris_old

akrolsmir wrote:

Okay, thank you very much. That wasn't so hard, was it?

Now, unless someone can remember a game which had a day serial killer, it should be patently obvious that Two is lying about his role.
lol @ you still trying to dig up games with serial killers subtly

no not gonna help you sorry
akrolsmir
Who knows. Some kind of day vig. You haven't shown us any proof of needing to know the game of a person to gain lynchproof, or anything.

@chris- The point was just to disprove Two's insane roleclaim.
Chris_old
considering my role I really doubt his claim is fake
Salvage
i'd suggest you to read my post when i asked two about his game chris .. cause idk how you know he can win with town (no sk can win with half the votes as far as i know)


plus i hardly doubt there are much mafia members in that list .. 1 or 2 max i think, and it's more probabble that he hits town (x2 town deaths 1 day .. maybe 3 if misslynch), on the long run that won't help town and you're encouraging it too much .. why is it?
Two_old
for the last time, I don't win with town
Chris_old

Salvage wrote:

on the long run that won't help town and you're encouraging it too much .. why is it?
cause it's impossible for mafia to win using this strategy

duh

but you wouldn't understand how that is due to the fact mafia don't have to comprehend whats being said in the game
Salvage
yeah you're not making sense at all chris .. and trying to saying that cause i don't get you're weird logic then i'm mafia .. rofl.




Two wrote:

for the last time, I don't win with town


you said you win with half the votes, that's what i pointed out.
Two_old
yes, that means I have to be alive with 1 other person in order to win
Mashley
Honestly what akrolsmir is saying does make sense. The first thread clearly said 'Every role in this game is going to refer to a character in a mafia game'. If you don't have a game to match your roleclaim is very hard to believe. It's entirely plausible that he's a standard SK who made the whole game names thing up to guarantee himself a win. I'm not saying we should try to lynch him now, as long as he kills who we say to kill he is worth having around and if he is telling the truth we would miss the lynch.
We have to lynch him eventually though. If he is really lynchproof, and the people who softclaimed didn't lie we are completely fucked. But since he's unwilling to back up his roleclaim, that seems unlikely.
Two_old
but there are no serial killers in the werewolf game
Chris_old
except the fact that if he can kill based off softclaims that leaves it completely open that mafia can benefit off of it as well

and no we don't have to lynch him ever
Two_old
aw thx chris
Chris_old

Two wrote:

aw thx chris
the way I see it is

1.) you help kill everybody off faster

2.) i'm invincible, you/mafia can't kill me

3.) 1:1 will be me + you assuming you really are bulletproof

town eliminates all mafia and you get 1:1

we both win
Two_old
if you're a tree stump you have no vote and would lose by default
Chris_old

Two wrote:

if you're a tree stump you have no vote and would lose by default
I'm not

wojjan counted my vote remember
Salvage
that's a really believable role then ..


well i don't really care about two as long as he helps town but eventually it'll hurt town since as i already said i actually don't think that there is more than 2 mafia in that list, maybe only 1,

it's not really nessesary that he softclaim cause it's right it can help mafia too, but how would he help town at all in case there is no more than 1 mafia in that list for example? ..

killing towns faster for a mafia win?. That's what i'm talking about him and i can't see how is that hard to understand it Chris .. maybe cause u want towns to die faster.
Chris_old

Salvage wrote:

killing towns faster for a mafia win?. That's what i'm talking about him and i can't see how is that hard to understand it Chris .. maybe cause u want towns to die faster.
I want you all to die actually besides two
Backfire
You know, I dunno if you guys said this yet, but how many mafia are we supposedly looking at? 3 or 4?
Two_old
5 probably
Salvage
5 i guess.
Salvage
ninja'd.
Two_old
far too slow
Chris_old
no more than 6

6-22 seems fair but with two being a SK it probably is 5
Backfire
Huh.
Well...Whats say the possibility that all of you are mafia then? Theres really only 4 or 5 of you talking.
Im just examining, since sometimes, I get a little fishy feeling of all this talk of town auto winning. I mean, I don't NOT trust you but...theres still a possibility.
Backfire
I just think one of you is leading us all along while the others just agree.
Two_old
the possibility is nil

however, the probability that you are mafia for asking how many mafia there are is high
Salvage
the same possibility of you being mafia too
Salvage
DAMN YOU TWO STOP NINJA'NG ME
Backfire
I was asking because I only saw about 5 of you actively getting involved.
Chris_old
ladysuburu salvage akrolsmir animask pieguy

imo

but with your last post maybe you instead of pieguy
Two_old
yes salvage, mafia roleclaim roles that are confirmed by the host easily

a brilliant mind
Salvage
i didn't get that last thing u said two
Chris_old
of course there is always the possibility of lilac/lybydose since they have posted 0
Two_old
I said that if I get the game wrong, wojjan will say in the thread that I am a serial killer

you know, as the penalty for getting it wrong

so tell me how that makes sense to claim as mafia
Backfire
Lilac hasn't posted in the forums for 3 days
Lybydose on the other hand, has been on a good bit.
Backfire
Wait wait, Lybydose posted 3 times here.
Two_old
each time as unremarkable as the last
Salvage

Two wrote:

I said that if I get the game wrong, wojjan will say in the thread that I am a serial killer

you know, as the penalty for getting it wrong

so tell me how that makes sense to claim as mafia

oh, i never said you're mafia i think ..?
Two_old
I'd like for bmin and animask to weigh in
Chris_old

Backfire wrote:

Wait wait, Lybydose posted 3 times here.
oh

I didn't even notice
Sleep Powder
I think we're focusing on Two a little Two much here.

Also, I read somewhere that stumps might need to roleclaim as stump first in order for their effect to work. Haven't
seen it around here before, but its possible. (What makes you think there could be a stump anyways?)

This makes me think that Two is actually a stump... or up to something as usual.

Does Two want us to soft-claim? At first he did, but for a different reason. This has probably been discussed in some form or another, but
Two is hiding a lot of information. I get the feeling he is trying to defend himself in some way. I doubt that this he is in the mafia that does DK instead of NK. So his role only seems questionable after the vig/SK part.

Actually, back to the stump part. I bet the mod is going to roleclaim Two as stump making him useless.
Two_old
I probably misread too as two
Salvage
i forgive you
Sleep Powder
Also, more content, less posts? You guys take pages to talk about a single subject or barely anything at all. Missing the Mafia IRC chat?
Chris_old
two roleclaim stump see if wojjan posts anything

you know what I change my mind shoot animask first
Salvage
about the stump thing two said it cause chris claiemd to be inmortal and that's what stumps are, how him being a stump would even make sense?
Two_old
I'd rather not roleclaim anything for fear of a mafia effect
Salvage
why trying to replace swift animask?
Sleep Powder

Salvage wrote:

about the stump thing two said it cause chris claiemd to be inmortal and that's what stumps are, how him being a stump would even make sense?
Lynch-proof is similar to being a stump. They both can make you... lynchproof.
Two_old
obviously chris and I are both treestumps in the treestump cult, taken from host's poison game
Chris_old
lol treestump cult

arsonist is in this game
Two_old
bmin11
You do realize Lilac is gone till D2 or something, right?

Right now, it's stupid to rolefish from a person we are not even close to lynch, because of the possibility of mafia advantaging from it. We will be gathering more info of Two's role as Day pases and more actions he does. Lynching Two right now wouldn't be really favourable (I think we have talked about this a lot already, right?)

Nothing stroke me heard when I was reading akro's ISO, but when he said "we know for a fact the mafia have fakeclaims" it makes me curious how he is accepting this as a fact when we could only go as far as just an assumption. Slip?

Lynches I'm okay with for D1: LS, Salvage, akro, NoHItter, Lyby

NoHItter's inactiveness worries me. This is unusual for NoHItter as I remember from previous games

Lyby: Same as NoHItter, unusually inactive
akrolsmir

bmin11 wrote:

Nothing stroke me heard when I was reading akro's ISO, but when he said "we know for a fact the mafia have fakeclaims" it makes me curious how he is accepting this as a fact when we could only go as far as just an assumption. Slip?

Wojjan wrote:

Those that I replace with different roles shall be given to the mafia as fakeclaims.
Two_old
why ever are you helping us akrolsmir
akrolsmir
Because, as you see, I'm mafia that wins with town.
bmin11
Oh right. Thanks akro. Now I'm seriously FoSing people who have claimed since that would be an easy way to earn town points without much risks they would take. Well, not until we found out Two's role heh
Two_old
if you'd like to share details without full on roleclaiming (but in a more direct way than swiftwolf) we may consider not lynching you today
bmin11
As I said, my role is indeed from a role from games in this forum. The win condition is different from the game it is from, but the method it uses to use it's ability is the same. Most importantly, my role is town-aligned.

I think this is the safest I can every get.
Two_old
I didn't mean you but thx anyway
pieguyn
o.o I'm not even sure what's going on.

Given Two he's obviously hiding something, but we have no way of figuring out exactly what it is. I propose at this point we just go on and if we reach a contradiction based on his information, we'll have more insight as to what his role actually is.
Rantai
This is so god damn obnoxious. Something about 3 Two's?

We have a clearly anti-town role looking for a bid to win through mutual interests, which don't actually favour us any more than an extra mislynch.

We have an invincible 'town' that wants to champion the whole game and half a roster of no opinions.

I'm going to address this right now;

Chris wrote:

the way I see it is

1.) you help kill everybody off faster

2.) i'm invincible, you/mafia can't kill me

3.) 1:1 will be me + you assuming you really are bulletproof

town eliminates all mafia and you get 1:1

we both win
No one knows what alignment you are. I don't care what you say, you are hardly confirmed. I'm not willing to bet the whole game on this giant festival of wifom. From my perspective you asking me to trust you on that is like me asking you to trust me on the exact same thing... see the problem there?

It's completely naive to think you're 100% guaranteed to be the last 2 standing. If just 2 mafia slip through the lynch/killing then you and Two are finished, they'll win by default. A 1:1 means Two wins by default. He's already stated he doesn't win with town and as far as I'm concerned, won't joint win.

What you put forward there is basically an excuse to have free reign in the killing of who you see fit (and if someone disagrees, bam votes and threats of shooting), regardless of alignment under the guise that you will champion this whole game yourself and everyone else is just a filler. I'm quite annoyed to see that no one is disagreeing with you at all, just going "Hmm I don't know, let's attack whoever they are to get on their good side!".

You two are also (or is it just Two, but right now I'm lumping you together for your extensive buddying) seem to be attempting to coerce people into claiming. Does no one see a problem with that at all?

Quite frankly I've had enough and just going to say that both of you are about as anti-town as you can publically get in my eyes. Go ahead and scumpaint me all you want now. I just don't care.

Vote: Chris

Convince me otherwise. Then again you probably won't try and attempt to get me killed.
Two_old
you can't lynch one invincible, might as well go for the other, right?

I have no qualms about lynching you over akrolsmir rantai, though it would sadden me a bit since you've put more into 1 post than all of his posts combined
Rantai

Two wrote:

you can't lynch one invincible, might as well go for the other, right?
I'd love to lynch you. But, unfortunately, you have some evidence of telling the truth so risking the lynch is not worth it. Right now I'm only comfortable with either of you simply because of how blatantly selfish and scummy (add on lacking integrity, trust) both your plays are at the moment.

I just don't see how it can be glossed over so easily. It's like an innate fear or something.
Two_old
selfish is silently picking off people

I am extending a hand. I want to work together ;)

chris was the only one who actually claimed something and it frankly doesn't matter if it's a lie since it's foolish to lynch someone who does that day 1
Rantai
Extend that to a mafia who has a safe claim. Add on a claimed unkillable role (weren't you the one who didn't believe bulletproof/NK proof claims in another game?) and that mafia have countermeasures so claiming at all is a risk in itself. What I see there is something fabricated as he cannot/doesn't need to verify it.

I understand your outwards intentions and just because it's you I am not completely disregarding it's trustworthiness (but I am 95% skeptical).
KRZY
Chris are you lynchproof also?
akrolsmir
I'm not sure about chris, but I'm still firmly convinced that Two wins with town- the fact that it is Two should give you more, not less reason to doubt the authenticity of his statements.

And the plan of having chris and Two win at the end was just so ridiculous that I didn't bother worrying about it. There are about a hundred different things that would likely go wrong before then, planning the entire game on day 1 based on a claim from Two makes no sense.
Rantai

Two wrote:

for the last time, I don't win with town
Sigh.
NoHitter
@bmin
By inactive you mean not posting every 12 hours then lol.
I'm posting my usual self, but it's being supplanted by everyone else.

Did Chris just claim independent and lynchproof/bulletproof?
Does anyone else think that we have too many "Don't lynch me." roles?
Plus he also wants he and Two to be alone at the endgame.
HoS: Chris

I would prefer a Chris lynch a lot now.
Two_old
and I would prefer an akrolsmir lynch more now

at first when we were voting him I was like "ok akrolsmir is definitely town" because of how easy it appeared

then when I saw the actual votecount and and lack of enthusiasm in general I changed my mind to "maybe"

with this resistance, he is now definitely mafia in my mind
Salvage
i actually think that akro is most likely mafia, even tho what Rantai says it's pretty logic .. we would we risking a no-lynch in case he's telling the truth .. that i really really doubt but it's not worth taking that risk imo.
Salvage
specially not d1.
Lybydose
Two's role smells like a huge pile of bullshit. I highly doubt Wojjan would include a role that could only win if people mass claimed, something he specifically recommended not doing.

It's "convenient" that the role just so happens to make him immune to death.

It's alarming that people are actually willing to follow him for some reason. It's even more alarming that one person, Chris, is proposing that we can't possibly lose since he is bulletproof + Two is everything proof (except it's still completely possible to lose if the mafia outnumber the town, plus this situation would result in only Two winning anyway).

I'm thinking Two is actually mafia with the ability to kill people who claim. One of Wojjan's "anti-claim" measures. The amount of damage such a role could do if left unquestioned is huge with the number of people that have game claimed thus far. It would be stupid to lynch him though, because there's still the slight chance he's actually telling the truth and a role this stupid exists.

I propose that Two intentionally guess the wrong game for someone Day 2. If he's been telling the truth all along, he will be "exposed as the SK" after guessing wrong. Otherwise we will know he's been lying this whole time.
Two_old
Lybydose, I'm not immune to death. You should be familiar with the concept of a strongarm. Is there a reason why you're excluding that from your argument?

What's alarming to me is how quickly the group of you are willing to throw away a potential bulletproof player (chris). Even if he isn't bulletproof, there are other town reasons for him to have claimed to be. The only logical reason to vote for him today is if you don't want to deal with that as mafia.

Lybydose, you don't have to worry about me intentionally getting a game wrong. I am sure I will with one of the first people I try to kill.
pieguyn
I'm thinking Two is actually mafia with the ability to kill people who claim. One of Wojjan's "anti-claim" measures. The amount of damage such a role could do if left unquestioned is huge with the number of people that have game claimed thus far. It would be stupid to lynch him though, because there's still the slight chance he's actually telling the truth and a role this stupid exists.
woah, someone else thought exactly what I was thinking...

I agree with Lyby's proposition, of course.
Two_old
lets review:

Day 1 mafia tell: minimal posting

Day 1 town tell: offering information

now who did what
akrolsmir
I guess a boatload of incorrect and misleading information is still information.
Two_old
now you're catching on
Rantai

Lybydose wrote:

I propose that Two intentionally guess the wrong game for someone Day 2. If he's been telling the truth all along, he will be "exposed as the SK" after guessing wrong. Otherwise we will know he's been lying this whole time.
If it were only that easy. He's already got guaranteed lynch proofs (if he is telling the truth) via the claims. Hence my original proposal of lynching off the claims to give us a chance. That of course backfires if all of them are town.

@Salvage - I might have read that wrong, but I never said to lynch Two today. Chris in the other hand is definitely not lynchproof or this set up is as broken as paska.

@Two - if someone else claims to be bulletproof would you start to question the integrity of each person's claim (applying to bulletproof only)?
Lybydose
Lets review:

Day anything mafia tell: scumpainting someone who questions your role by proposing an action that would easily confirm you
Rantai
Stop ninjaing my english fail edits. >.>
Two_old
just like I didn't question game claims, just like I didn't question role claims (in video game), I have no intentions of questioning any sort of claims here

any information is good information day 1

a lie still tells you things
NoHitter
@Two
So basically I just have to claim Bulletproof/Lynchproof and I won't be targeted for a lynch?
Yes Chris MAY be what he claims, but I highly doubt it.
Lybydose

Rantai wrote:

If it were only that easy. He's already got guaranteed lynch proofs (if he is telling the truth) via the claims. Hence my original proposal of lynching off the claims to give us a chance. That of course backfires if all of them are town.
No he only has guaranteed lynches if he's telling the truth. If he's lying and is really mafia, he's lynchable. So if he kills someone rather than guessing wrong, he isn't acting in the town's best interests by revealing himself, therefore lying, therefore mafia, therefore lynch.
Two_old
well at this point the bulletproof car is pretty full

but sure claim something else if you want
Two_old
an extra lynch day 2 is acting in the town's best interests

having that lynch be luna, ladysuburu or animask may not be in your best interest though, right lybydose?
akrolsmir

NoHItter wrote:

@Two
So basically I just have to claim Bulletproof/Lynchproof and I won't be targeted for a lynch?
That's how bulletproof works. Conversely, if you actually are bulletproof, don't tell anyone and hope mafia accidentally shoots you.
Lybydose
The only "information" you've revealed Day 1 is information that ONLY helps you. Regardless of what role you actually end up being - SK or Mafia.
Lybydose

Two wrote:

an extra lynch day 2 is acting in the town's best interests
No, acting in the town's best interests is making for damn sure you aren't a mafioso that gets an extra kill every day. An unchecked role like that would end the game quick, and certainly not in the town's favor.

The fact that you resist makes you even more likely to be mafia.
Two_old
please explain how informing you all of exactly how and why someone died in the middle of the day only benefits me

I want mafia dead just as much as you (lol) do, and I have the ability to make their removal much easier for town

it is senseless to not want to cooperate
Rantai

Lybydose wrote:

No he only has guaranteed lynches if he's telling the truth. If he's lying and is really mafia, he's lynchable. So if he kills someone rather than guessing wrong, he isn't acting in the town's best interests by revealing himself, therefore lying, therefore mafia, therefore lynch.
First line is a repeat :P

I see what you're trying to get but isn't that achieving the same thing today? If he lied we can lynch him right now. If he told the truth we cannot. If he lies tomorrow we can lynch him there and then but if he shoots a claimed then all we can do it is go, "well crap".

Right?
Rantai
Assuming he told the truth*
Salvage

Rantai wrote:

Lybydose wrote:

@Salvage - I might have read that wrong, but I never said to lynch Two today. Chris in the other hand is definitely not lynchproof or this set up is as broken as paska.

u did read that wrong, i was talking about Chris.
Lybydose

Two wrote:

please explain how informing you all of exactly how and why someone died in the middle of the day only benefits me

I want mafia dead just as much as you (lol) do, and I have the ability to make their removal much easier for town

it is senseless to not want to cooperate
Two's PM: *mafia role that lets him kill people that claim*
Two: hey guys lets claim

*Swiftwolf dies, host message makes it obvious that it was because of his claim*

Two: oh shit they're gonna suspect me because I got him to claim and then killed him, better come up with some ridiculous role
Two_old
if you were town and subsequently had to pay attention to what you read, you'd have known that it actually appeared at the point when he died that I didn't know what game he was from

to say that I claimed out of fear is laughable
Rantai

Salvage wrote:

u did read that wrong, i was talking about Chris.
Well then I addressed that, Chris is not a lynchproof due to a few factors that I am aware of. 1 being the fact that 2 unlynchables is just stupid.
Lybydose

Two wrote:

if you were town and subsequently had to pay attention to what you read, you'd have known that it actually appeared at the point when he died that I didn't know what game he was from

to say that I claimed out of fear is laughable
So you didn't know what game he was from when he died.

Yet your killing role requires you to know what game he was from.

Swiftwolf claimed the game he was from 9 minutes before Wojjan posted his message.
Two_old
it's pretty ironic that the message you just failed to read properly included a line about you needing to read properly
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