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I believe there is still an imbalance in difficulty here throughout this section primarily within
04:24:315 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - This patterning is far different in terms of the inputs and mechanics you need throughout the kiai with no clear reasoning for it
Last edited by coolkid .
i wanted to use contrast to accentuate how massive of a gap in difficulty it is, don't take it too literally.
that being said, i still don't see anyone trying to go for attempts on the full map due to the imbalance in difficulty. all top players capable of playing the map were just cutting out the final kiai and putting it in a separate diff, which kind of defeats the purpose of ranking a map imo.
Last edited by Phob .
Hello again, i'm here to show some big issues with the map
i will argument with points and after that i will give my full map opinion. (btw, i don't main english to explain perfectly about this so i will use "examples" to make you understand my points)
00:50:372 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - This section and rhythm that repeats in the map using 1/8, i just made a example of what you should do here and why not fully mapping it 1/8. (https://youtu.be/er-vyHrVBEA)
Also, the reason of using so much 1/8 it's not really worth... the old version of _asriel has a spacing between those that made it feel more rhythmic in the way you hear and play it.
My resolution is to decrease the usage 1/8 in the map and not for this part only.
00:58:258 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - those kicks shouldn't be made this way, use just a little note for the kick and then a movement stack with 1/8 but keep the rhythm.
01:03:058 (3,4,5,1,2,3,4) - https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/19278546/b124, remove some random 1/8 to the rhythm and make it a better fitting pattern for it.
01:19:858 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - this kind of sections are being made in 1/8 when it could be made in 1/4, https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/19278556/c8a6 example here and same will be going for the other parts.
01:20:543 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) - my opinion in these sections or kind of sections goes related to the first issue, so nothing to say. Just make some spacing between break notes ending with 1/4 instead of using the 1/8 the entire part.
01:23:286 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3) - this entire section feels empty, straight patterns and very low quality doing here... just do something with it, cook something with some 1/8 rhythms using sliders like the asriel one or do something FUN to play in this section :)
01:45:229 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2) - i have no comments to describe what you should change here, i would say everything on this section is wrong
i would change the way the map is represented by using a lot of 1/8 when you can do something like this or do variations with it instead of FULL 1/8 THE ENTIRE THING, here is my example: https://youtu.be/jKZGDfXybvc
01:56:201 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2) - this section is weird and boring to me, try using other patterns and stop using too much 1/8 pls...
02:07:172 (1,2,1) - Don't use too much this kind of stacks, players during the years have been taking a dislike towards this and a example is the booth of figthers (050 map) and others like this. This just use something like this example: https://youtu.be/ommtiUp4BdQ
02:22:258 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - isn't there any other pattern or rhythm you could use? like, the map as been using the same style the entire time until this point for now :)
Now... getting on the most discussing part of the map, we're here for this mostly. The kiai.
The kiai is a great example of overmapping and overdone, why? the patterns just simply doesn't fit and the rhythm is overmapped, overcharged of 1/8 stream when i gave already my points on first one and other parts corcening about being 1/8 the entire stream parts when it could take 1/4 breaks.
The patterning is useless, in this point the way that the song was represented in the entire map falls down because now the audio goes a bit hype than before then it proceeds to become a DISASTER in terms of difficulty compared to the rest of the parts.
Now my opinion in the entire map is the next: The entire map is weak, the idea was not bad but bad executed and simply empty in some "slow parts" providing not fun at all, it it's like you have two sections that make this map 11* but the rest make it like 8* and this point is the one i would like to talk about. The song itself is NOT MADE FOR 10* type of map, this is clear to me hearing the song, it could be done 9* if we talk about patternings that could be used in the entire map without caring too much about SR and things.
The map itself is overdone and has so much overusage of 1/8 even on little breaks from 1/8 long stream parts. just use 1/4 more instead of overusing it.
I could put more points here but as i told Ascendance, my english is not that good and i hope you guys understand that i won't take more than one hour doing this (it took me one hour to make this one... and it's simple).
It's exhausting, i'm here just to drop little feedbacks and issues in general :)
Last edited by -Story- .
00:50:372 - gonna keep 1/8 usages because i won't skip those sound to go to safe mapping
00:58:258 (1) - yea somehow it is speedmapped and hdash was incorrect to emphasize properly. changed
01:03:058 (3) - if you think 1/8s as grace or double for some samples, it will be better to understand it
01:19:858 (1) - I hear sounds on background which surlely support 1/8s that's also why hdashes are used as burst not consistently
01:45:229 (1) - same
01:56:201 (1) - kept idea from asc part and i can say the part isnt that free or boring. some bursts still require concentration
also wrote your comments. regardless theres a perfect way to describe the song as a map, mappers have their thoughts to express on their way. ofc if it goes too far away or too subjective, it should be stopped from bns as veto. that's why qualified section also exists. but as a collab mapper of this map, i dont think current patterns must be changed to hit common sense. i will prove this way can be also understandable
01:34:258 - 01:41:801 - this whole section feels so underwhelming to me, like the song's getting intense but instead of following what was done there 01:23:286 - 01:34:258 - and doing something harder or something that tells the player they're getting into the hard part in your own style (idk if this part is mapped by only one of u two) the intensity was reduced by doing a vertical-only part that's somewhat boring imo
hitsounds (mostly @vaqu)
00:44:886 this could be hitsounded, there's a very popular sample of a reverbed kick that will fit
00:50:415 (2,3,4) - these should not be soft-hitnormals since it's still a part of the growls like these 00:50:543 (5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12) - that if you wanted to emphasize more then you could've added whistles on top of those
00:50:972 (12) - sliderend is not supposed to be a soft-hitnormal aswell
^ ^ these apply to all future iterations of this sound, like here too 00:51:058 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12) -, 00:51:743 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12) - here aswell, you get the idea
can we please not use normal-hitwhistle as a kick? we already as hitsounders went past that and started using hitnormals for kicks for better contrast and emphasis (and for the usage of hitwhistle for other samples, like whistles?)
drum-hitwhistle is unbalanced in terms of volume, if you went to amplify it in audacity you would see that's it's clipping almost +9 decibels, which is... a lot; soft-hitwhistle on the other hand is quiet, it's -4 decibels in audacity
normal-hitclap does not fit the snare in the song at all
02:53:972 (2,3,4,5) - why these are s-hn and these 02:56:715 (2,3,4,5) - are d-hn?
also why is the entire map in 70% volume? 03:02:029 this section can be much quieter since it's a ((considerably)) slower part, probably like 45% or so, just hurts the ear
04:59:972 (1) - the song starts getting quieter here, additional volume lines with decreasing volumes will be very beneficial
05:06:829 (3) - everything after this is unhitsounded yet is mapped
Last edited by skill issue lol .
00:44:886 - will add sample
00:50:415 (2,3,4) - 00:50:972 (12) - initially these were soft-hn because with the kick the growl actually softens a bit so i kept that unhitsounded, but will add drum-hn for this and all parts similar
02:53:972 - (2,3,4,5) - i didnt look at the map before hand so i kept it soft-hn, will change to drum
ill add some volume control, for 05:06:829 - and beyond, the song is quiet enough where i think it wont need hitsounds.
i think the normal-hc sample currently sounds nice, but if you can find me a sample for it that you think sounds better i'm ok with changing
what is the recommended amount of decibels do you think i should make drum-hw and soft-hw ? im guessing like 0 but if you give me a number that sounds right i'll change it
as for the normal-hw situation, giving the kicks a different sample would lead me to having to re-hs the entire song, which frankly i dont have the patience for as the song is already hitsounded completely.. i understand the default normal-hitwhistle can sound annoying at times however i believe like 10% of the playerbase actually uses it tbh correct me if im wrong lol, they can always have default samples turned off too. if its genuinely like a huge issue just give me like a bit and i can re-hs but to me right now it hasnt gotten to that point yet
Last edited by Vaqu .
n-hw - it's not a huge deal, i just think it could be improved but i can see how you don't have patience to hs ((TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE)), it's just that hitsounding in this way allows you to use whistles freely for any purpose
n-hc - i'll look at my library a little later and we can settle this in discord dms i think!
d-hw & s-hw - audacity -> ctrl+a -> effect -> volume & compression -> amplify... & then the suggested value;
i think s-hw can be left as it is, however d-hw really needs to be toned down, audacity will automatically suggest the value to change to, for me it happened to be almost -9db
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
Reopened by skill issue lol
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
Reopened by skill issue lol
02:30:143 (11) - needs n-hw compared to 02:31:515 (11) -
@vaqu could you please go over the diff and check hs (in)consistencies :pray: i pointed out some above
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
Reopened by skill issue lol
01:55:172 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - would get rid of drum hitnormals here since there's no dubstep wub wub growl
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
please go over new combos
- #4508735/12009119
- second kiai is inconsistent with ncs (just as an example)
would suggesting going through the entire difficulty and make ncs more consistent :pray:
Last edited by skill issue lol .
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
the growls are a little bit inconsistent in terms of how you map them
02:07:172 (1,2,3) - 3 sliders 1/16
02:08:543 (1,2,3,4) - also 3 sliders 1/16
02:09:915 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25,26,27) - suddenly 1/8ths + a shape in 1/16ths?
02:11:286 (1,2,3,4,5) - nothing?
02:12:658 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14) - 1/8ths??
02:14:029 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - mix of 1/4 and 1/8?
02:15:401 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16) - very easy c-shapes in 1/8
02:18:143 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - 1/8
02:19:515 (5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11) - 1/16 SHAPE?
tl;dr too inconsistent, i would suggest using 1/8ths for the growls since you can do crazy stuff with them and be consistent
some sections are obviously following foreground layer but i will make the rest more consistent
02:07:172 (1,2,3) - same
02:08:543 (1,2,3,4) - same
02:09:915 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25,26,27) - intensity clearly picks up at 5 so 5 is 1/16
02:11:286 (1,2,3,4,5) - higher pitched notes take prio
02:12:658 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14) - fixed, added double layer
02:14:029 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - much higher priority sounds here
02:15:401 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16) - fixed
02:18:143 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - du du du du
fixed some other stuff while i was at it, ty for taking the time to point this out cause u right
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
Reopened by skill issue lol
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
Personally found this section of the map to be very underwhelming in contrast to the rest of the map's difficulty, I know there's hardly any presence of growls and stuff to map 1/8 streams on however instances like 01:25:343 (5,6,7,8,9) could so easily be more difficult with more hyper transitions and like 01:26:886 (10,11,12) could easily be hyper wiggles
I just think these ideas would help even out the contrast in difficulty between sections so this part isn't as underwhelming as I believe it to be currently
i can fix the first half of this part but i think the full vertical part is nice and have had a lot of compliments on it, also transitions into a few later parts. gimme some time and ill figure the first half out
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
i do think the fully vertical part just doesn't fit the map in the context of it. it's way too easy whilst the entire map before and after is pure torture. i do really wish to see it buffed
Reopened by skill issue lol
if you don't like it you're welcome to not nominate it. i've gotten lots of positive feedback on the section from players who i've had test and i think it feels good to play as a reprieve
Marked as resolved by Ascendance
i didn't say i didn't like it, please don't put words into my mouth, i just said it could be changed but whatever
it was more just like a "i like the way this is and probably wont change it so dont feel obligated" thing
Subjective but HP0 honestly might be a better bet as the HP drains way too fast if you chainmiss the stacks
I myself am fine with HP0.2 its just if you wanted to cater to a wider range of players who might be able to pass this when you could consider it
Marked as resolved by Ascendance