1. osu! forums
  2. osu!
  3. Feature Requests
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +0
posted
I think the offset wizard as it is now is lacking usability. It's confusing to adjust and needs improvement.
I have an idea on how to improve it and make it easier to use:

Calibration
  1. Use calibration to adjust the offset
  2. Calibrate by playing a short map through the wizard (with NoMod)
  3. Offset will be adjusted after the map ends

I think the ability to adjust your offset by playing a map through the offset would be a really helpful addition to the offset wizard.

Here's what I have in mind:
When you go into the offset wizard, there will be a button to calibrate the offset. The manual adjustment will stay.
When you click on the calibrate button, you can choose from any ranked map with no online offset, ensuring near perfect timing.
When you select a map, you play through it on NoMod and the score will not be ranked.
At the end of the map, your offset will be adjusted to your average hit error. From there, you can go back into the wizard and manually adjust if you'd like.
If the map doesn't give an accurate offset, you could always choose a different map to calibrate with.

To show that this is better than other options:
I have heard about using this map to sync the offset in the wizard. However, this isn't a good way to set the offset.
First of all, it does not account for input lag, so if a player uses this method chances are it's not going to give them a correct offset.
Additionally, players' offset relies on personal judgment. If a player consistently taps 25-30ms early, then their offset should be 25-30ms early. Setting offset through this method ignores that as well.
Setting the offset manually is confusing. There are no directions that come with the offset wizard, so it's a hassle to have to look up how to set it.

Concluding:
This option is the easiest for the user. There is nothing the user has to remember/take note of to go back into the offset to change. There is no work the user has to do. The only thing the user has to do is pick a map and play it.
This would work for most skill levels, too. Anyone with any sort of sense of rhythm will be able to utilize this calibration to help them.
Seeing as the offset wizard doesn't seem to be implemented in osu!lazer yet, I think it could undergo some changes before its implementation.
Thank you for reading and I hope this suggestion is considered.

EDIT 1:
Another feature that seems more reasonable is one that simply has you tap to the beat. An example would be the offset setter in Bang Dream, where it has you tap four times to a beat and sets your offset at the average.
posted
Offset should only be set to compensate for forms of delay in hardware, not because a user can't be patient enough to hit notes accurately to the music.

Prompting offset changes this way gives the wrong impression as to what it's for.
Changing offset because of their inability to hit accurately hurts them more than it helps, especially down the line.
posted

Dntm8kmeeatu wrote:

Offset should only be set to compensate for forms of delay in hardware, not because a user can't be patient enough to hit notes accurately to the music.

Prompting offset changes this way gives the wrong impression as to what it's for.
Changing offset because of their inability to hit accurately hurts them more than it helps, especially down the line.
Offset can't compensate for all forms of delay simultaneously.

The standard for most osu! players is setting the offset so hitsounds sync to the music when the notes are pressed with zero error (as measured by the game), at least roughly (it is impossible to make them sync them perfectly, by the way the buffer in the sound engine works). The best way to set the offset with this criteria is by recording the game audio while playing with auto-mod, and then analyzing the soundwave of the music compared to the hitsounds.

If hitsounds are synced to the music, players learn to hit the notes early compared to the music in order to maximize accuracy. The delay (which is usually ~30-70 ms depending on the computer) is filtered out subconsciously so players feel they are pressing keys in perfect sync to the music.

People who play with hitsounds off (a rather popular option in osu!mania players, specially if they come from other games that have no hitsounds) have no need to adhere to that standard. The most correct offset is the one that maximizes their accuracy as measured by the game, and the best way to find the correct offset value is by statistical means.
posted

Dntm8kmeeatu wrote:

Changing offset because of their inability to hit accurately hurts them more than it helps, especially down the line.
Depends. My way of correcting for my inability to hit accurately because I look at the bottom of the screen in mania was to cover the area. This made my hits accurate, but ruined my ability to read maps without cover forever.
posted

Dntm8kmeeatu wrote:

Offset should only be set to compensate for forms of delay in hardware, not because a user can't be patient enough to hit notes accurately to the music.

Prompting offset changes this way gives the wrong impression as to what it's for.
Changing offset because of their inability to hit accurately hurts them more than it helps, especially down the line.
This isn't my intention. This offset would be set directly by playing, so it syncs with the user. If the user consistently hits off-beat, then their offset is wrong. Maybe if the user's accuracy is too off, then it shouldn't work to calibrate offset. So maybe it should tell the user to play a song they can get at least a 96% or so in, so this wouldn't be a problem. And if anything, the offset can still be manually adjusted. If a user feels their offset being calculated wrong, they can adjust it themselves.
posted
The only reason to change offset is if your hitsounds when using auto mod are not correct on the offset map. UO is NOTHING to do with personal preference or input latency. It is purely to do with how hitsounds line up with music. The way a person hits notes has absolutely nothing to do with how universal offset works. UO is something you typically do not change, or if you do then you only change it once (unless you change drivers/hardware, but even then it should be 0 or close to 0, unless the skin you're using uses weird audio). If a map is miscalibrated, then you use -/+ to adjust it for that map - but a wizard would not work in that situation.

If you're not using hitsounds, then that is another story because of the latency caused by directsound. Typically there is next to no input latency, and all percieved "input" latency is audio latency from osu itself. The only way this can be removed is by Peppy implementing WASAPI exclusive mode or ASIO - but the game is designed to be played with hitsounds so this is not a problem with offset wizard.

As much sense as your idea may seem to make, in reality it does not make sense - because offset is VERY EASY to set correctly - you can use the a combination of the current offset wizard and auto mod to very effectively and very accurately set it. The thing you're describing is not to do with offset, it is a problem that arises from the inherent flaws of the game coming from it using directsound.
posted

Shizai wrote:

The only reason to change offset is if your hitsounds when using auto mod are not correct on the offset map. UO is NOTHING to do with personal preference or input latency. It is purely to do with how hitsounds line up with music. The way a person hits notes has absolutely nothing to do with how universal offset works. UO is something you typically do not change, or if you do then you only change it once (unless you change drivers/hardware, but even then it should be 0 or close to 0, unless the skin you're using uses weird audio). If a map is miscalibrated, then you use -/+ to adjust it for that map - but a wizard would not work in that situation.

If you're not using hitsounds, then that is another story because of the latency caused by directsound. Typically there is next to no input latency, and all percieved "input" latency is audio latency from osu itself. The only way this can be removed is by Peppy implementing WASAPI exclusive mode or ASIO - but the game is designed to be played with hitsounds so this is not a problem with offset wizard.

As much sense as your idea may seem to make, in reality it does not make sense - because offset is VERY EASY to set correctly - you can use the a combination of the current offset wizard and auto mod to very effectively and very accurately set it. The thing you're describing is not to do with offset, it is a problem that arises from the inherent flaws of the game coming from it using directsound.
Is there an official source you can link me to so I can see this for myself?
And I view this as being a possibility for lazer, so does it still work like this in that client?
posted
No I don't have a source, it's just how UO works in this game. Experiment with it yourself and you will see. Think about it like this - if you set it so that hits are perfectly synced with auto mod and then you go into game yourself and play the same song, the "correct" note timing wouldn't change. The game would still be expecting you to make a hitsound at the same time; the time that it plays when using auto mod.

It can be difficult to understand because there is a delay of around 40-70ms between pressing a key and the hitsound playing (but bare in mind that other audio is out of sync too) - this is because of directsound. When you are playing "in time" you are not actually pressing the key to the beat, you're pressing slightly before in order to make the hitsound play at the correct time. This is what you're trying to compensate for, but in doing so you're throwing off the hitsound timing which is making it harder for you to accurately play because as you play more in time with left hand the game tells you that you're playing more out of time. Essentially there are two options - play with correct auto/wizard offset with hitsounds enabled and just deal with pressing keys a little early (basically all high level players just deal with the delay, a lot don't even realise its there), or find your "true" offset and use keyboard sounds ("true" offset is typically around ~40-60ms LOWER (more negative) than what you use with hitsounds).

Until Peppy implements WASAPI exclusive or ASIO this will be a problem, it is by far my least favourite thing about this game.
posted
I believe this is what you want: https://osu.ppy.sh/community/forums/topics/29546

Also the WASAPI/ASIO stuff Shizai is talking about: https://osu.ppy.sh/community/forums/topics/428222
posted

abraker wrote:

I believe this is what you want: https://osu.ppy.sh/community/forums/topics/29546


Again, people often mistake audio latency for input latency. The main reason for this is because a rhythm game should have zero audio latency - therefore the only other thing it could be is input latency. What they said on the other thread about "Why would a device designed for rhythm games have such high input latency" is a valid point, but it does NOT have such high input latency, it is entirely the fault of the game and yet Peppy refuses to do anything about it.
Please sign in to reply.