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What happened to rank/app mapsets?
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I like how shinde didn't even have to request for mods and it gets approved.Metro wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/35023
Garven is probably like best friends forever with shinde.
More like "It's impossible because I'm lazy". It's always possible to map at least one easier difficulty. If the mapper is too lazy, the map has to stay in WIP/Graveyard.Sakura Hana wrote:
I agree as well, i remember i told ztrot that the mapset could perfectly go for ranking and he said "It's impossible to map something easier for this map, if you think you can do it, go ahead if you want"
I think an approved diff in ranked mapsets is better anyway.
Topic Starter
Just saw it haha xDMetro wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/35023
or he really likes rolling girl.
I've never met a song I couldn't squeeze three difficulties out of.Nharox wrote:
More like "It's impossible because I'm lazy". It's always possible to map at least one easier difficulty.
No, LuigiHann's map called "The Fire" or whatever it was does not count as a song.
meh
lolololawp wrote:
No, LuigiHann's map called "The Fire" or whatever it was does not count as a song.
Actually I got like 6 IRC mods that all said very little, and despite that I spent about an hour in editor for each of them trying to figure out what to improve. On top of that a handful of people told me in IRC that they liked my map, and a few more posted in the thread shortly after a semi-finished version was done. Considering free stars are now obsolete, I'm suprised those people even posted.mochi wrote:
I like how shinde didn't even have to request for mods and it gets approved.Metro wrote:
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/35023
Garven is probably like best friends forever with shinde.
Besides, whenever I ask for mods people usually decline. (It's not like I used to mod a lot and never map, helping others before myself. Doing skin/video/timing work without kudosu. Spending all my KDs on other people's maps. Why should people mod my maps? Plus even in past ranked maps, the mods were usually rather empty and it'd only take til page 2 anyways, so it's not like I'm using up a lot of people's time.) I spent weeks trying to get people to mod it and even when they do they never really came up with anything. I spend a LOT of time myself doing rechecks and modding my own map so that others don't have to. I'm very thorough when it comes to style and rankability issues, because when I put something in Pending, I don't want any walls of text or issues. Now, if people are going to complain about score and approval versus ranked so much, I will keep it firmly in mind for future maps I make or look at. As I said before, there are already 3 full ranked mapsets for this song, you want another ENHI for a 3:30 song? Ok, I'll get right on that. Should only take me 8 months. I am a very slow mapper and I put a lot of time into my maps. Plus I don't sit on osu! all day mapping. You realize it took 4 months to get that approved right?
Also, yes Garven and I are good friends. He gave me constructive feedback through the entire process and recommended people who I could ask for mods, and sat on IRC with me talking about each others maps and life in general quite a few nights. Also we have similar tastes in music and enjoy each other's maps very much, mostly because we both date back to Shinxyn maps and were influenced by them. I've also modded his maps in the past, and he's modded mine. Problem? I'm sure you have friends. .. Right?
If it makes you feel better, I don't even know osuplayer111 personally and he had no complaints. He was like the 10th BAT (not even mentioning MATs I talked to) I asked for a mod over the course of the week and I just assumed he'd be too busy also. ztrot's only complaint was 'Well it's not 18m so I hope no one bitches.' and lo and behold. I'll just quote this too.
I think some of you should re-evaluate your thinking. If the only argument against a map is 'Why is this approved and not ranked? It's only 17m!', then I think I've either done a decent job mapping or you're just too caught up in things. You should probably go read Lyby's linked thread. Also, lesjuh/Gladi wasn't Tijdmachine ranked with 3 Insanes and a 'Normal' Easy difficulty? Pretty sure that's also against some 'rule' stashed away somewhere. While you guys argue over trivialities, I'll be busy doing things I consider fun.Shinde wrote:
Oh, I'll just turn HP Drain and OD back up one so that "No difficulty is allowed to exceed a score of 18 mill" applies then. I thought I'd be nice and lower them one for user accessibility, but if I have to use "logic" and the rules for approval rather than use common sense...
But man, some of you guys are depressing. I thought we were moving away from nazi and restrictive modding? I feel like I'm back in late 2009. I could point out a lot other fallacies and inconsistencies several people in this thread have, (Especially a few key people
) but I'll try to refrain from personal attacks and making people look like dumbasses. I don't get paid enough to do that, and that's stupid. I should've just kept the original settings so I could go, "HERP DERP 19.5M APPROVAL THX"This is a game (and a community), people play games to have fun, not deal with silly bullshit. Are you having fun?
PS. Have a nice day, I will be off enjoying the holidays.
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/7828
hello
hello
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/7828length
hello
well that made my day :3
4:02 draining timeBass-chan wrote:
Orly
Take a look at this
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/11471
it's ranked so there's no problem?
>2010
new drain time was accepted by peppy in 2011, which means it's already being enforced.
In either case we will discuss internally about the future of approved maps.
new drain time was accepted by peppy in 2011, which means it's already being enforced.
In either case we will discuss internally about the future of approved maps.
May I ask why?Sakura Hana wrote:
In either case we will discuss internally about the future of approved maps.
Because of viewtopic.php?p=1109973#p1109973
Why not just remove approval all together and make everything go for ranking.
I have a feeling this will get no where anyway :I
I have a feeling this will get no where anyway :I
That's exactly what would fix this issue once and for all, in that same thread iirc peppy was thinking of merging the approved maps into ranked or something.Zelos wrote:
Why not just remove approval all together and make everything go for ranking.
I have a feeling this will get no where anyway :I
Topic Starter
The point I'm trying to make is that maps like yours will only attract more people to create short approval maps. The purpose of the approval section has always been for marathons/high score maps/gimmicky maps and your map doesn't belong in that category. You can tell us all about how you need almost a year to create a normal mapset for a 3 minute song :/ Ofcourse I think freedom and fun is important but what's the purpose of the approval category now? Something needs to change. Until then I'll be making 3 minute single diff maps (meh jk lol)Shinde wrote:
sob story
Let's just get rid of the whole approved section, solves this problem too \:D/
Zelos wrote:
Why not just remove approval all together and make everything go for ranking.
No need to repeat it, as peppy said in that thread that was his intention, i just hope it could happen sooner rather than later
I repeat it because I'm stating my opinion.
Stop deleting my posts.
Stop deleting my posts.
Neruell wrote:
Zelos wrote:
Why not just remove approval all together and make everything go for ranking.
Stop posting for the sake of increasing your post count then
You sure missed a lot of points that I don't feel like reiterating. Also your+Gladi's map doesn't belong in ranked when going by the rules. Good job. Don't try to argue common sense either. Rules are pretty serious business and definitely black and white.Lesjuh wrote:
herp derp nice summary
I agree, let's get rid of approval. \:D/
Except this is the reason he's trying to convince the BATs to merge Ranking and Approval?Shinde wrote:
Also your+Gladi's map doesn't belong in ranked when going by the rules. Good job. Don't try to argue common sense either.
Well I do wish that good luck, since that's going to take a lot of effort. Having a large group of people agree on a middle ground when it comes to sticky issues has never gone smoothly in the past. That's been evidenced many times as-is. But osu! could always use less things for people to argue over.
My point with lesjuh was the hypocrisy of saying my map doesn't belong in App. when Tijd doesn't belong in Ranked by those standards. Until those standards and approval are dissolved, I don't see any error in either Tijd or my map.
I would support merge of App and ranked if it were presented in a reasonable fashion.
My point with lesjuh was the hypocrisy of saying my map doesn't belong in App. when Tijd doesn't belong in Ranked by those standards. Until those standards and approval are dissolved, I don't see any error in either Tijd or my map.
I would support merge of App and ranked if it were presented in a reasonable fashion.
that's the easiest way to get banned other than posting CP, ddos, or cheating on a crapload of really hard songs.Metro wrote:
I won't stop posting because of your stupid thinking.
If you remove approval category, will I have to map 3-4 diffs for, say, a 10 minute marathon? It takes a lot of time to map just one dif for such a long song. Don't even try to reply with "Don't map songs like that".
The implications were that there would still be approval-like maps (extremely long maps, pretty much - you can map easier for shorter songs regardless of how bullshitstreamshit of a 40,000,000 score Extra-Another diff you have on a 3:00 song) that might not follow the same rules as the rest of the ranked maps in a ranking process. Special Ranked, maybe?
I don't see a problem with doing 3 difficulties on a 10 minute song. Marathon songs just take more time. No big deal.Natteke wrote:
If you remove approval category, will I have to map 3-4 diffs for, say, a 10 minute marathon?
You just have to be willing to finish it and find people willing to mod it. Yep.
everything is under BATs rules now
osu = BATs game then...
it was right ppl in game complain abt rank and approved map when it was going weird
osu = BATs game then...
it was right ppl in game complain abt rank and approved map when it was going weird
Well, ultrainsane map can give high score, but they're a challenge anyway. So they're an example of what can go into "Ranked" maps.
Differently, maps that give an ultrahigh score in a relatively easy manner, they should go into Approved too with particular maps (with things that aren't so rankable or so, including the gimmick maps like ziin DJ Max style or Jubeat)
Differently, maps that give an ultrahigh score in a relatively easy manner, they should go into Approved too with particular maps (with things that aren't so rankable or so, including the gimmick maps like ziin DJ Max style or Jubeat)
This whole fucking thread is bullshit. Let's get rid of approval? Well, let's just get rid of the whole damn game then. If scoring metrics doesn't matter anymore, then why should it matter how many maps are in a set?
If I want one diff set for a hard map that is meant to give a challenge, that is what I'm going to do. Getting rid of approval isn't going to force rules of approval, it just means the marathon maps are just going to add score based on a per-map basis (I.E Top 40), and on a monthly chart. This thread will solve nothing. Instead of bitching and whining (even more so the fact that the bitcher and whiner here did something that breaks the rules far more than these!), why don't you reivew the maps you questioned, since they fit the "CURRENT STANDARDS. Just because some of you can no-life the game and thus have far more skill than the average player doesn't mean the maps in question are easy. Some of you are veteran players, keep in question the rest of the people that play this game, rather than yourself and your groups of friends.
All you're doing now is just blowing hot air since you're upset that your maps don't get ranked as fast as others. So you just try to justify your complaints and in the process, you're doing far more evil than good.
P.S - Gimmick maps aren't meant to be approved, silly jackasses.
If I want one diff set for a hard map that is meant to give a challenge, that is what I'm going to do. Getting rid of approval isn't going to force rules of approval, it just means the marathon maps are just going to add score based on a per-map basis (I.E Top 40), and on a monthly chart. This thread will solve nothing. Instead of bitching and whining (even more so the fact that the bitcher and whiner here did something that breaks the rules far more than these!), why don't you reivew the maps you questioned, since they fit the "CURRENT STANDARDS. Just because some of you can no-life the game and thus have far more skill than the average player doesn't mean the maps in question are easy. Some of you are veteran players, keep in question the rest of the people that play this game, rather than yourself and your groups of friends.
All you're doing now is just blowing hot air since you're upset that your maps don't get ranked as fast as others. So you just try to justify your complaints and in the process, you're doing far more evil than good.
P.S - Gimmick maps aren't meant to be approved, silly jackasses.
I agree with ztrot - the rules we have compromised with already give tremendous edge to the higher tier players who are arguably the ones catered for the most by mappers. I think out of all the people entitled to complain about the rules and regulations, good players are not a part of that.
What we should be doing is focusing less on this extremely vocal minority and instead tinkering with some ideas to get mappers proactively creating good easy/normal/hard difficulties instead of them being additions to an otherwise extremely difficult insane map.
Removing approval changes nothing. Approval has always been centered on score limit to preserve what pathetic fragments of tangible score metric that we have left. You would think that people who are well versed in said metric would wholeheartedly understand the need to cap the number of maps with extremely high scores in order to keep it some semblance of competitive.
What we should be doing is focusing less on this extremely vocal minority and instead tinkering with some ideas to get mappers proactively creating good easy/normal/hard difficulties instead of them being additions to an otherwise extremely difficult insane map.
Removing approval changes nothing. Approval has always been centered on score limit to preserve what pathetic fragments of tangible score metric that we have left. You would think that people who are well versed in said metric would wholeheartedly understand the need to cap the number of maps with extremely high scores in order to keep it some semblance of competitive.
I don't understand the reasoning here in terms of "competitive" - competitive is based on individual map basis, isn't it? Has nothing to do with an absurdly high score on a map since they're all relative. Surely nobody around here still believes that Total Ranked Score is a viable metric for one's skill? It hasn't been for years.Ephemeral wrote:
You would think that people who are well versed in said metric would wholeheartedly understand the need to cap the number of maps with extremely high scores in order to keep it some semblance of competitive.
When did this thread become a discussion about skill level and extremely difficult maps...?
I agree with this. That's actually the main reason I made the Easy Series, though it didn't work that well in the end for a variety of reasons. The idea behind it was if there was a collection of good Easy/Normal/Hard difficulties that people would be more willing to make said good Easy/Normal/Hard. But again, didn't work and probably wasn't the best idea in hindsight.Ephemeral wrote:
What we should be doing is focusing less on this extremely vocal minority and instead tinkering with some ideas to get mappers proactively creating good easy/normal/hard difficulties instead of them being additions to an otherwise extremely difficult insane map.
I also agree with this. It's just unfeasible to play almost every map nowadays because there are way too many of them.awp wrote:
I don't understand the reasoning here in terms of "competitive" - competitive is based on individual map basis, isn't it? Has nothing to do with an absurdly high score on a map since they're all relative. Surely nobody around here still believes that Total Ranked Score is a viable metric for one's skill? It hasn't been for years.
Yeah, quoting that.mochi wrote:
When did this thread become a discussion about skill level and extremely difficult maps...?
The actual discussions is to decide BETTER the difference between Ranked and Approved, who the hell just mentioned deleting the "Approved" category?
By far some people Approved map ONLY because they didn't want to map easier difficulties. And no one spitting over that.
It's not about how fast a map get ranked, or how easily, or similiar, really ( i suck as a player, as a mapper and as a modder, still ) or how much a player is experienced. The ranked + approved diff mapset are still a better idea than one ( say 1 ) difficulty mapsets, and when you CAN map an easier difficulty, and you can make all type of players enjoy the song... yeah, it's better, much.
P.S - Gimmick maps aren't meant to be approved, silly jackasses.i don't approve this (silly joke, seeing the discussion). However, they are good maps, the mapper take much time to create, and then ...you just make them end in the graveyard, calling them "silly jackasses" ? This show how much respect someone have for users, really.
Topic Starter
umad? Getting rid of approval would solve the problem this thread is about. Ofcourse it would create a lot of new problems so we have to either make clear rules or change something.ztrot wrote:
This whole fucking thread is bullshit. Let's get rid of approval? Well, let's just get rid of the whole damn game then. If scoring metrics doesn't matter anymore, then why should it matter how many maps are in a set?
If I want one diff set for a hard map that is meant to give a challenge, that is what I'm going to do. Getting rid of approval isn't going to force rules of approval, it just means the marathon maps are just going to add score based on a per-map basis (I.E Top 40), and on a monthly chart. This thread will solve nothing. Instead of bitching and whining (even more so the fact that the bitcher and whiner here did something that breaks the rules far more than these!), why don't you reivew the maps you questioned, since they fit the "CURRENT STANDARDS. Just because some of you can no-life the game and thus have far more skill than the average player doesn't mean the maps in question are easy. Some of you are veteran players, keep in question the rest of the people that play this game, rather than yourself and your groups of friends.
All you're doing now is just blowing hot air since you're upset that your maps don't get ranked as fast as others. So you just try to justify your complaints and in the process, you're doing far more evil than good.
P.S - Gimmick maps aren't meant to be approved, silly jackasses.
I know your map fits the current standards and there's nothing wrong with it, but you should understand that a single diff with under 18 million points that doesn't break any rule could just as well be ranked with two easier difficulties. Do you just want to allow people to create short 1-diff maps for approval, fine. Don't be surprised when more mappers appear with such maps, including me. And stop telling mappers to add easier difficulties and go for ranking.
Just because some of you can no-life the game and thus have far more skill than the average player doesn't mean the maps in question are easy. Some of you are veteran players, keep in question the rest of the people that play this game, rather than yourself and your groups of friends.There are hunderds of maps far harder than yours ranked. I'm not saying that because I'm better than the average player, but because it's a fact.
P.S - Gimmick maps aren't meant to be approved, silly jackasses.Disturbia. Max score 8 million. Approved because of it's gimmick.
honestly, approval is probably there to at least give mappers some incentive to include easier maps in the set in order to push it for ranking instead. if we remove approval, higher tier mappers are just going to start mapping insanes non stop without really catering for the other playerbases.
i'm sure you can see why this is bad, score metric aside
i'm sure you can see why this is bad, score metric aside
So make 80m maps rankable if they have easy;normal diff and then we're all happy, plus you get some more low tier diffs since mappers gonna want their maps ranked instead of approved. Right now if you map some streamy 3m long song you get like 30m max score and you don't even bother with other diffs since you know you can't go for rank. Just delete that score rule and make approval maps those that have NO easy diffs, or those that have about 15 diffs and stuff idk (ofc marathon maps should never be ranked).
80m ranked maps is probably out of the question. at best, i could see the limit being raised to 30-40mil
Lesjuh the current cap is 15 mil so until rules are sorted out and are not in the air or subject to change I will not use them. End of story.
As of the New Rules Draft, Approval are just treated the same as Ranked but with a few difference(about score, draining time and spread). This push people making Insanes Only mapset, just make it return like before, when Approved maps really had something different from Rankeds (other then being 1-diff spreads)
Actually, the definition of the approval category changed silently at some point in time because gimmick maps don't fly anymore.Lesjuh wrote:
P.S - Gimmick maps aren't meant to be approved, silly jackasses.Disturbia. Max score 8 million. Approved because of it's gimmick.
I'm all for reverting it, of course.
Laziness in making another diff?
