No mapset can have more than 6 total difficulties. Too many difficulties in a mapset becomes pointless and just makes the set much bigger than it needs to be.are taiko difficulties included in this rule? it should be specified
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[Rule] No mapset can have more than 6 total difficulties
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Lunah_old
Yeah I believe they are.
Does approval count too anyways?
Does approval count too anyways?
I think approval can get a exception of this.
6 should be the hard maximum for approval and ranking. If you want more maps on your difficulty, split them into separate beatmaps.
2 is the hard minimum for ranking.
Not only is a 6 difficulty beatmap tedious to mod already, but there's bound to be many mistakes which are likely to be passed over.
having a total playing time of 20 minutes is around the limit for a decent mod.
2 is the hard minimum for ranking.
Not only is a 6 difficulty beatmap tedious to mod already, but there's bound to be many mistakes which are likely to be passed over.
having a total playing time of 20 minutes is around the limit for a decent mod.
That's ridiculous for approval maps. Approving two (or even more) maps of the same song just for this is just useless when you can just have one map for it.ziin wrote:
6 should be the hard maximum for approval and ranking. If you want more maps on your difficulty, split them into separate beatmaps.
Difficulties are usually only a few bytes of size. We could maybe encourage larger taiko spreads tee hee.
GIVE US TAIKO MODDERS SOME MORE WORK
GIVE US TAIKO MODDERS SOME MORE WORK
Impossible as far as I know. If the beatmaps have the same artist and title, they're gonna be recognized as the very same maps by the BSS.ziin wrote:
If you want more maps on your difficulty, split them into separate beatmaps.
Also, what again was the reasoning for having 6 difficulties at max? I'm not exactly sure what justifies it at this point, except for possibly avoiding clutter...
I don't see what the problem is with lots of difficulties. As long as the lower difficulties are fairly represented, it should be okay.
The one problem for me with having too many diffs is that the player can get confused when the first download the map, and think 'Which diff am I supposed to play?'. Not a big deal, but still.
Inspector K - Disconnected Hardkore (CanBlaster Remix)Larto wrote:
Impossible as far as I know. If the beatmaps have the same artist and title, they're gonna be recognized as the very same maps by the BSS.
Inspector K - Disconnected Hardkore (CanBlaster Remix)
it's possible.
I think having an organized maximum is best used to avoid people spreading tons of one difficulty level compared to others (cough8insanes)
Then make that the rule: no more than 33% insanes or something like that.
"remix)"Shiirn wrote:
Inspector K - Disconnected Hardkore (CanBlaster Remix)
Inspector K - Disconnected Hardkore (CanBlaster Remix)
it's possible.
"Remix)"
That doesn't count and is silly and can't always be done.
What about the masterpiece maps?
Those were split and work alright. And unless I'm blind, their titles are identical.
/E: Oh wait, those are from different mappers orz
Those were split and work alright. And unless I'm blind, their titles are identical.
/E: Oh wait, those are from different mappers orz
A lot of difficulties is not a good idea, 4 difficulties (Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane) it's perfect, also you can add an "Extra insane difficulty" for pro players and taiko difficulties, but more than that is just crap.
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/18315eldnl wrote:
A lot of difficulties is not a good idea, 4 difficulties (Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane) it's perfect, also you can add an "Extra insane difficulty" for pro players and taiko difficulties, but more than that is just crap.
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/7932
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/5947
Sure, why have lots of fun difficulties when we can have the same boring shit every day?
I agree with BD. Why should we prevent having a lot of maps, as long as they're fun to play? It's not "making the set bigger than it needs to be", if there's a quality diff why would including it be worse?
Also, in approval, there should be no problem with having >6 diffs, even if they're all Insanes, since approved maps don't have to follow diff spread rules
as long as it's fun to play it should be fine...
Also, in approval, there should be no problem with having >6 diffs, even if they're all Insanes, since approved maps don't have to follow diff spread rules
as long as it's fun to play it should be fine...
Cheer-no
Pretty much this. There still needs to be a limit obviously, otherwise there's just tons of clutter and slight glitching in the beatmap selection menu (Vuvuzela, Helvetica Standard, etc.) but it should definitely be higher than 6 for approval maps.pieguy1372 wrote:
I agree with BD. Why should we prevent having a lot of maps, as long as they're fun to play? It's not "making the set bigger than it needs to be", if there's a quality diff why would including it be worse?
Also, in approval, there should be no problem with having >6 diffs, even if they're all Insanes, since approved maps don't have to follow diff spread rules
masterpiece was originally one mapset, but due to the high amount of insanes, it was split into two mapsets. of course they could've just left it and made it for approval, but meh.Luna wrote:
What about the masterpiece maps?
Those were split and work alright. And unless I'm blind, their titles are identical.
/E: Oh wait, those are from different mappers orz
in regards to this rule, why would you have more than 6 difficulties in the first place? even i'm not sure why Moskau has that many... (i could possibly read the thread to possibly find out, but internet's a pain atm).
last time i checked, taiko was included in the 6 total difficulties thingo. i have no view on this though.
the way i saw it, it was leeway for six evenly spread difficulties [Beginner - Easy - Normal - Hard - Insane - Expert] then after, it just... became that way in any situation? i dunno but 6 seems like a reasonable number anyway.Larto wrote:
Also, what again was the reasoning for having 6 difficulties at max? I'm not exactly sure what justifies it at this point, except for possibly avoiding clutter...
Only logical reason I've red about this 6 diff maximum is that having for example about 12 diffs would make really likely than some mistakes won't be seen until the map gets ranked. Apparently you can't just go and unrank one diff but have to unrank the whole set which is ridiculous but it works like that, so having 12 maps getting unranked because some mistake slipped out in some diff sucks.
And the limit is actually good enough if you don't allow any kind of guest diff. There are AWESOME mapsets like http://osu.ppy.sh/s/29454 that everyone pretty much gave up in ranking because of this rule. Sometimes you make a map with those 5 standar difficulties like Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane, Lunatic. Someone goes and maybe maps two taiko diffs which is cool and then you get offered 2 guest diffs from nice mappers who happened to like the song, you end up with almost 10 diffs and your mapset can't get ranked because... it has more than 6 diffs and that's all? The limit is clearly not enough I think. Of course making the limit go to 12 or 20 or unlimited would make mapsets to be like: E N H I I I I I I I I I I I. But then again it's either that or the same song getting ranked 2 or 3 times for no real reason.
This rule is also related with the "no more than 3 insanes rules", since I think whenever this 6 limit is broken it's because there are lots of insanes, which is expected since you can be creative and map some fun Insane, but when mapping E or N you can't really do much.
And the limit is actually good enough if you don't allow any kind of guest diff. There are AWESOME mapsets like http://osu.ppy.sh/s/29454 that everyone pretty much gave up in ranking because of this rule. Sometimes you make a map with those 5 standar difficulties like Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane, Lunatic. Someone goes and maybe maps two taiko diffs which is cool and then you get offered 2 guest diffs from nice mappers who happened to like the song, you end up with almost 10 diffs and your mapset can't get ranked because... it has more than 6 diffs and that's all? The limit is clearly not enough I think. Of course making the limit go to 12 or 20 or unlimited would make mapsets to be like: E N H I I I I I I I I I I I. But then again it's either that or the same song getting ranked 2 or 3 times for no real reason.
This rule is also related with the "no more than 3 insanes rules", since I think whenever this 6 limit is broken it's because there are lots of insanes, which is expected since you can be creative and map some fun Insane, but when mapping E or N you can't really do much.
I guess the extreme case of what happens because of multiple mapsets due to everyone wanting to make a difficulty is Irony (TV Size). So imagine that they were jammed into one monstrous Irony megaset. Who would want to mod that? Would everyone just step in and mod a few difficulties? What about the BAT who has to check it for ranking? That's a shitton of work and I don't blame anyone for not wanting to do it. However, it would be convenient from a player's standpoint to download the song and video just once instead of four times and to have all the difficulties together.
I don't see a problem with removing the limit as long as mappers understand that with every difficulty they add, it makes it that much harder to get mods for a map. There would be no limit officially but in practice it probably would still hover around 6 anyway.
I don't see a problem with removing the limit as long as mappers understand that with every difficulty they add, it makes it that much harder to get mods for a map. There would be no limit officially but in practice it probably would still hover around 6 anyway.
Then it's better to make it a guideline, IMO.Soaprman wrote:
I don't see a problem with removing the limit as long as mappers understand that with every difficulty they add, it makes it that much harder to get mods for a map. There would be no limit officially but in practice it probably would still hover around 6 anyway.
mekadon_old
I think making this a guideline seem fine imo. People have enough logic to know the facts stated at above posts. Besides, if the map has difficulties like SuperEasy+Easy+Normal+Hard+Insane+Hard Taiko+Insane Taiko I think it should be fine, as long as there aren't too many insanes and the difficulty spreads are balanced.
I think a 8 diff limit works better imo, that way it allows for Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane, Taiko Kantan, Taiko Fuutsu, Taiko Muzukashii, Taiko Oni
that way we can have all diff levels of taiko as well as Standard and probably no need for Taikosu!
that way we can have all diff levels of taiko as well as Standard and probably no need for Taikosu!
Just make it a guideline... there isn't really anyone who's gonna complain because a map has some extra diffs.
This.Wishy22 wrote:
Just make it a guideline... there isn't really anyone who's gonna complain because a map has some extra diffs.
Just make it clear that maps with a lot of diffs are a pain to get mods for (well, they are! :P). That alone should be enough for most people to not go overboard on diffs unless they have a damn good reason to, since it takes long enough for most people to get their maps ranked as it is.
UH HUH, OH YEAHSakura Hana wrote:
I think a 8 diff limit works better imo, that way it allows for Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane, Taiko Kantan, Taiko Fuutsu, Taiko Muzukashii, Taiko Oni
that way we can have all diff levels of taiko as well as Standard and probably no need for Taikosu!
Having taiko easy/Normal would be stupid.
Muzukashii is easy enough, because they are really supposed to follow the beat without many 1/4 beats, mainly 1/2.
A player would not grasp skill either, especially seeing that the gap between normal and hard is very big.
Muzukashii is easy enough, because they are really supposed to follow the beat without many 1/4 beats, mainly 1/2.
A player would not grasp skill either, especially seeing that the gap between normal and hard is very big.
I have to agree with MMzz since I am really bad playing taiko and yeah Muzukashii are easy enough to be played with pretty much no previous knoweldge of the game.
6 is fine for ranking imo, but approval maps should be able to have more.
And how many mappers do you know that include both Muzukashii and Oni? most include Oni only because they get a guest Insane or something then they run out of diff slots.
mekadon_old
This.Sakura Hana wrote:
And how many mappers do you know that include both Muzukashii and Oni? most include Oni only because they get a guest Insane or something then they run out of diff slots.
And its not that mappers do not want but they do not actually want to consume 1/3 of the whole mapset with 6 diffs which doesn't sound nice to me imo. Thats why people make a Taiko Insane instead and rely on osu! diffs to cater the other difficulties
6 max standard+taiko slot and 2 only taiko slot are good.
You don't want to kill us modder right?
And then. Allow CatchTheBeat only difficulty.
You don't want to kill us modder right?
And then. Allow CatchTheBeat only difficulty.
so it looks like our views right now are either
1) rule stays the same (6 diffs. max)
2) 8 diffs. max
it looks like more of us are leaning towards 8 diffs. max, due to most people not going to have their maps with diffs. more than 6 anyway. now the only thing is how to word this...
1) rule stays the same (6 diffs. max)
2) 8 diffs. max
it looks like more of us are leaning towards 8 diffs. max, due to most people not going to have their maps with diffs. more than 6 anyway. now the only thing is how to word this...
it's 6 +2 =/ 8
as 6 difficulty slot with 2 bonus slot useable for Taiko.
However, i would like to see CtB maps rankable
as 6 difficulty slot with 2 bonus slot useable for Taiko.
However, i would like to see CtB maps rankable
different issue altogether, although i don't personally see why they aren't. ask another MAT/BAT about this, but keep on topic please.HakuNoKaemi wrote:
However, i would like to see CtB maps rankable
EDIT: and yay 1900th post
i have only one thing to add.
if you want to add a rules about minium difficulty number, say TV Size minium is 3/4, Full Size is 2/3, Extended Size is 2.
if you want to add a rules about minium difficulty number, say TV Size minium is 3/4, Full Size is 2/3, Extended Size is 2.
again, this is a different topic of discussion.
Again, I'm not a BAT/MAT, you could write
Returning in topic. Mostly are with the 6+2 idea?
SPOILER
Neither Objective, actually.
I do think size-dependant lower-limit are better.
TV Size - minium = 4
Full Size - minium = 3
Extended Minium = 2
Returning in topic. Mostly are with the 6+2 idea?
I don't know how much it would help for osu! mappers to have more slots for osu! diff's, since I never had a problem with a mapset of Normal, Hard, Insane + Taiko's. So I can't say much about it.
But the Taiko mappers would this help a lot, since we have this problem that Sakura Hana have metioned before.
I'm one of the taiko mappers who try to give two Taiko guest diff's with and easy and hard(eg: Muzukashii + Oni) and sometimes it works if it is just for approval(http://osu.ppy.sh/s/37563) or the mapper have enough slots(http://osu.ppy.sh/s/32384 , http://osu.ppy.sh/s/20898) or it is your own map(http://osu.ppy.sh/s/35211).
But most time it happens that osu! player run out with slots so they can't take more. So some players may say ,,Oh god, Taiko Oni again, I can't play that".
Other wise to have generely 8 slots, you guys talked about, is also one.
But the Taiko mappers would this help a lot, since we have this problem that Sakura Hana have metioned before.
I'm one of the taiko mappers who try to give two Taiko guest diff's with and easy and hard(eg: Muzukashii + Oni) and sometimes it works if it is just for approval(http://osu.ppy.sh/s/37563) or the mapper have enough slots(http://osu.ppy.sh/s/32384 , http://osu.ppy.sh/s/20898) or it is your own map(http://osu.ppy.sh/s/35211).
But most time it happens that osu! player run out with slots so they can't take more. So some players may say ,,Oh god, Taiko Oni again, I can't play that".
As I allready mentioned I don't had this problem, so I have no real opinion about it, but if it would work in the way like Skura Hana have said(osu!x6+Taiko x2), this could be maybe a good solution.eldnl wrote:
A lot of difficulties is not a good idea, 4 difficulties (Easy, Normal, Hard, Insane) it's perfect, also you can add an "Extra insane difficulty" for pro players and taiko difficulties, but more than that is just crap.
Other wise to have generely 8 slots, you guys talked about, is also one.
Doesn't mean people will take the time to map a muzukashii.mekadon wrote:
This.Sakura Hana wrote:
And how many mappers do you know that include both Muzukashii and Oni? most include Oni only because they get a guest Insane or something then they run out of diff slots.
And its not that mappers do not want but they do not actually want to consume 1/3 of the whole mapset with 6 diffs which doesn't sound nice to me imo. Thats why people make a Taiko Insane instead and rely on osu! diffs to cater the other difficulties
But honestly you could do muzukashii easy by taking oni and deleting notes, kinda prepares you for the next step.
Mitten we should state the Muzukashii rules.
Like how you can only use ddd kkk pretty much lol.
Like how you can only use ddd kkk pretty much lol.
lol ikr.OzzyOzrock wrote:
Mitten we should state the Muzukashii rules.
Like how you can only use ddd kkk pretty much lol.
Looking at past AC versions (because the newer ones are shit) a muzu diff IS PRETTY MUCH, simple 1/2 patterns with a few 1/4 spanning from 3 notes to the rare 5 note beats, besides the 2000 series, as a beginner those on muzu probably would make you rage.
In le-man terms.
>Taiko learning curve is stupid.
le-lol.MMzz wrote:
In le-man terms.
beatmaps that are more than 20 minutes long are annoying to mod, which is why nobody wants to mod them, and they're hard to get ranked.
It's more likely that the modder will give up on modding it well, and when you consider the rewards of such a mod, it's not worth it. The reason I see to keep a maximum number of difficulties is to not only help modders mod maps in sections, but also to keep ranked beatmaps to a certain standard of quality.
I don't care if there is a limit for approval.
I wouldn't mind extending this to 8 for binary's sake, but right now 6 difficulties fills up the osu screen and fits pretty well.