forum

osu! World Cup 2016 - Discussion Thread

posted
Total Posts
171
show more
nya10
I wonder where is the data spreadsheet.
archer-
Is there a challonge bracket or at least a list of the groups?
Nwolf
Railey2
can we not have proper sound quality for the commentators voices?? Buy some microphones, please. Some of them sound like they speak into a potato.
Minhtam
If you convince the staff to onboard me as a commentator, I will be ready with my Blue Yeti microphone.
Topic Starter
Loctav
Wiki updated with pmuch everything~ Now I can sleep happily
sify11
Where can i buy a support tag for my team like last year?
also polska 4:0 hype! :D
nya10
Just a suggestion for the statistician:

Would you mind to freeze 1 column from the match overview, so we can scroll it to the left and right while still being able to see the maps played?
deadbeat
I froze column 1 half way through group stage. I guess it doesn't work so well with the /pubhtml link
Not sure how to fix that sorry
fartownik
Is it possible to change the skin to a different one than the default? Sole fact of the screen being split in 8 parts makes following the games hard, adding the default skin with all the lights, 300s etc to that makes for even more confusion. Also you can't really notice *why* someone missed on a map with the current skin, you can only see briefly where, but not in what circumstances.
Minhtam

fartownik wrote:

Is it possible to change the skin to a different one than the default? Sole fact of the screen being split in 8 parts makes following the games hard, adding the default skin with all the lights, 300s etc to that makes for even more confusion. Also you can't really notice *why* someone missed on a map with the current skin, you can only see briefly where, but not in what circumstances.
I agree. At the MINIMUM, remove the 300's on the screen. it would make it obvious where the misses, 50s, and 100s are.
-ZackFair-
The mappool of the round of 16 makes me horny
Endaris

Minhtam wrote:

fartownik wrote:

Is it possible to change the skin to a different one than the default? Sole fact of the screen being split in 8 parts makes following the games hard, adding the default skin with all the lights, 300s etc to that makes for even more confusion. Also you can't really notice *why* someone missed on a map with the current skin, you can only see briefly where, but not in what circumstances.
I agree. At the MINIMUM, remove the 300's on the screen. it would make it obvious where the misses, 50s, and 100s are.
Alternatively just include an animated version of the regular 300s with a higher animation framerate so that they aren't all over the place.
-Visceral-
Since Loctav told me to post my opinions on the mappool:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lv_ ... cHHlL8/pub

Please read all of it.
Ascendance
Taking a reply from the reddit thread:

i get that old map/relatively low ar reading is important but isn't this a bit much? It's almost half the pool lol
I'm all for having old style maps in the pool, but I think the map selectors went a bit over the top with these.
In the past, old maps have been used as a sort of niche, unique, power pick that some teams could use to their advantage over other teams by having diverse players. When that becomes the dominant part of the map pool, the old style maps lose that unique feeling of having them as a back pocket pick and more of "which AR8 map do we pick this time".

Also, freemod should be a category where a team is afraid to use a mod, not a category where mods make the maps easier to play (hi rog unlimitation and night of knights). just my two cents!
NaTha
what do you think, whos your favorite team and who will win? I think South Korea is pretty good this year
Topic Starter
Loctav
Updated the wiki!
Enon
holy moly the mappool of this round
chainpullz

Ascendance wrote:

Taking a reply from the reddit thread:

i get that old map/relatively low ar reading is important but isn't this a bit much? It's almost half the pool lol
I'm all for having old style maps in the pool, but I think the map selectors went a bit over the top with these.
In the past, old maps have been used as a sort of niche, unique, power pick that some teams could use to their advantage over other teams by having diverse players. When that becomes the dominant part of the map pool, the old style maps lose that unique feeling of having them as a back pocket pick and more of "which AR8 map do we pick this time".

Also, freemod should be a category where a team is afraid to use a mod, not a category where mods make the maps easier to play (hi rog unlimitation and night of knights). just my two cents!
I think one of the challenges with including ar8 and wanting it to be relevant is that if you don't include much of it and your matches are short enough it gets completely ignored. An important question when designing a map pool is what kind of player you want to come out on top. If you want it to be the most well rounded player then you need each map in your pool to have a large coverage as far as the skills necessary to excel on them.

A pool of diverse specialist picks doesn't benefit the well rounded player much because it encourages the kind of strategy that involves winning all of your own picks and either getting a lucky break point or winning the tiebreaker. This puts an enormous weight on the quality of the tiebreaker which can even further skew results in an undesired direction.

I'm not saying specialist picks are bad. You should definitely use them to round out a pool as they make things more interesting in terms of strategy and spectating. If you want the most rounded players to come out on top however you should tailor your pool so that specialist picks tend only be the deciding factor in close matchups.

TL;DR: I don't think having ar8 or any skill for that matter present in a majority of the maps is a huge deal as long as that set of maps featuring this skill is diverse in it's own right.

Also I think smoothie's map pool template does a pretty good job of ensuring all skills are at least present. Simply following it will give you a decent spread and skillfully applying it can give you a really good pool. The difference coming down mostly to which specific maps you pick to fill each role.
nya10
I don't know if it's just me or is it felt by another player in the tournament, but having less maps (and less bans!) in mod specific bracket making the tournament might be a bit uncomfortable in a tournament view, while the diversity of the mappool is much at a higher level (not to mention diversity is good, but having only 1 ban is pretty painful). Also imo with only 2 maps per mod specific bracket might have those map in specific bracket are in black or white zone (example on RO16 HR mappool, ymir is pretty much the "black" pick or technical pick, and the supercell map is the "white" pick or normal pick, there's no in between the "super technical" map and "normal map"). Having 3 maps in one mod specific map allows the map variety to be more interesting by putting 1 map on a "grey" zone in the mappool, or just as Smoothie World mentioned.

I don't really like the tiebreaker too, the skillset tested is too specific (AR8 + streams if I'm not wrong) in the tiebreaker (which the tiebreaker purpose should be fair to all participants a.k.a testing most of the skill possible in a balance manner, for example Playing with Fire did a great job in this). The QF tiebreaker might be the biggest issue in the mappool though.

That's all my 2 cents.

(Not to mention the map selector did a great job at group stage mappool though)
Reyvateil
I think the main issue with the tiebreaker pick after reading the Q&A from Skystar about the decisions behind this mapping pool is that it was treated more as another Free Mod pick than a Tiebreaker when making the decision. While the freedom to pick mods in the Tiebreaker exists, by nature it shouldn't try to be a niche pick that forces player to play something too different/unique/uncomfortable trying to force mods to improve readabilty (not to mention this is very streamy, AR8 and high CS...it's just too niche)

As Smoothie said, it's something supposed to be fair to all players of both teams, it should include elements from all possible niches and not just one predominant aspect, both teams lives are riding on this last map and if you have a map that can clearly favor a certain skillset a team that isn't favored by it doesn't even have a chance if the other can deal with these specific skills.

(Not to mention the map selector did a great job at group stage mappool though)
Didn't the group stage hava a map that players failed while holding full combos. Nothing is perfect...
Blitzfrog
I think they should display the current commentator during live stream OWC
deadbeat

Blitzfrog wrote:

I think they should display the current commentator during live stream OWC
!commentator
Sandalot
Can you have the difference in team score displayed on screen?
Like have the difference subtracted and colored to the winning team.

Taiwan and France had some really close matches that had my eyes dashing between scores.
- Jade -
USA vs. Brazil actually had me anxious for a moment. I guess that made the tiebreaker even more enjoyable to watch (it was like that for me, anyway). Taiwan vs. France was good, too. :oops:
Topic Starter
Loctav
wiki updated!
F D Flourite
United States 10:00 am vs. China 0:00 am...

Is this match really scheduled?
nya10

F D Flourite wrote:

United States 10:00 am vs. China 0:00 am...

Is this match really scheduled?
Pretty sure the scheduling is not that good for them, prefering US at 8pm and China at 10am (Sunday).
That match is hard to schedule anyway. Just to take for staff consideration in the future
Rixia Mao

nya10 wrote:

F D Flourite wrote:

United States 10:00 am vs. China 0:00 am...

Is this match really scheduled?
Pretty sure the scheduling is not that good for them, prefering US at 8pm and China at 10am (Sunday).
That match is hard to schedule anyway. Just to take for staff consideration in the future
HAHAHAHAHhahahahahaahHAHAHAHAHAHahahaahahahhahHAHAHAH
i haven't laughed this hard in ages
good stuff
Topic Starter
Loctav
China purposefully requested this time slot because of exams. They otherwise would have had to play at a time where no one would've been around so we came to this compromise.
nya10

Loctav wrote:

China purposefully requested this time slot because of exams. They otherwise would have had to play at a time where no one would've been around so we came to this compromise.
It is good to hear this
pivco_old
Does anyone know why Cinia Pacifica joined SK team only to leave for mandatory military service (according to his userpage) and not playing in single match?

Also, dear OWC staff, can you please keep up to date with uploading VODs? I always prefer to watch the mappool showcase on the day of the matches instead of live. Right now there are only RO16 VODs on twitch. Thanks!
pivco_old
nvm, quarterfinals VODs are up. Ro16 was uploaded later than QF so they appeared as most recent and I assumed QF are not yet uploaded. Sorry.
deadbeat
i got a bit slack with that sorry. i'll have everything up to date soon. i'll just spread things out a bit so i don't flood youtube subscription feeds. expect QF stuff maybe monday, and then semi's later on like thursdayish
pivco_old
omg could have been so much closer match with Rucker! That army thing going on in Asian countries... Doesn't army understand there is OWC going on? Make less war and more love pls...

That SS from My Aim Sucks tho... scary thing (his aim sucks tho so please army stay away ok?)
Yuri Goggles
Last week I wanted to get a better idea how teams stacked up, so I decided to write a script to take a team's score for a map minus the average of every other team that played the map, added that together for each map and divided it by the number of plays to get an average relative score for each team. Since then I've tweaked the script in preparation for the semi finals, and also added more statistics. Here they are for anyone who's interested. I tried to be careful to check for typos, but since I entered all the data manually, there might be mistakes. The data is just for the round of 16 and Quarterfinals. Group Stage is too much work. I'll enter the Semifinals data when the matches are done. I didn't include the Raijin no Hidariude stats due to team fails.

Edit: Updated with Semifinals data.

Round of 16
SPOILER
Average Relative Score
United States: 482673
France: 465651
Taiwan: 410287
Brazil: 287794
Poland: 270660
Russian Federation: 184077
South Korea: 169856
United Kingdom: 7224
Norway: -22816
China: -87556
Germany: -120923
Canada: -237929
Italy: -396276
Australia: -462694
Finland: -522517
Argentina: -681116

Percent of Plays Above Averages
Poland: 88
United States: 83
France: 83
Taiwan: 78
Russian Federation: 75
South Korea: 67
United Kingdom: 67
China: 57
Brazil: 50
Norway: 44
Germany: 33
Australia: 29
Canada: 17
Argentina: 17
Italy: 0
Finland: 0

Simulated Head to Head Matches Win Percentage
France: 100
South Korea: 91
United States: 85
Poland: 79
Taiwan: 75
Norway: 69
Brazil: 67
Russian Federation: 67
United Kingdom: 46
Germany: 42
China: 33
Canada: 31
Australia: 14
Argentina: 13
Finland: 7
Italy: 0

Map Statistics
Answer
Average points: 2752398
Taiwan: 3617689
Australia: 2828846
Norway: 2656308
China: 1906747

AVALON
Average points: 3249579
Norway: 4068146
Taiwan: 3855546
South Korea: 3726535
United Kingdom: 3527389
United States: 3452015
France: 3395229
Brazil: 3151097
Germany: 3042284
Italy: 2931194
Canada: 2902652
Argentina: 2533670
Finland: 2409188

d:for the DELTA
Average points: 2324874
Taiwan: 2828220
Norway: 1821528

Extreme Fantasy
Average points: 2479081
Russian Federation: 2867133
Australia: 2745835
China: 2736943
Poland: 2254157
Brazil: 2214814
Finland: 2055603

Kamisama Nejimaki
Average points: 2980608
Brazil: 3823758
United States: 3554342
Poland: 3231124
Taiwan: 3045762
China: 3015639
Australia: 2970481
Russian Federation: 2717004
Norway: 2499499
Argentina: 2494612
Finland: 2453863

Kunoichi demo Koi ga Shitai
Average points: 2495430
Poland: 2945953
Russian Federation: 2607966
Germany: 2475885
Italy: 2439937
Canada: 2269318
South Korea: 2233521

Nightmare
Average points: 2914684
France: 3808286
Norway: 3580414
China: 3514309
Canada: 3290392
United States: 3050203
United Kingdom: 3043510
Taiwan: 2933506
Germany: 2411144
Australia: 1817382
Argentina: 1697697

Poinsettia
Average points: 2379255
Norway: 2993495
Taiwan: 2378750
France: 2099860
United Kingdom: 2044914

Remember History
Average points: 3389909
Brazil: 4389625
Russian Federation: 3797044
Poland: 3596448
Finland: 2938028
Germany: 2933839
Canada: 2684472

Renbei no Searchlight
Average points: 3140604
Germany: 3463733
South Korea: 3346248
Poland: 3274392
Canada: 2950498
Russian Federation: 2921059
Italy: 2887695

Sakura no Uta
Average points: 3253777
Taiwan: 3620025
Russian Federation: 3478468
Poland: 3453364
Norway: 2463252

Sins -Kokoro no Tsumi-
Average points: 3929931
France: 4767688
United States: 4737414
South Korea: 4290067
Poland: 4277369
Norway: 4209978
Germany: 4157814
Russian Federation: 4102748
Brazil: 4062098
Taiwan: 3921435
Canada: 3816891
China: 3802332
Australia: 3771279
Finland: 3475785
United Kingdom: 3248132
Argentina: 3136169
Italy: 3101703

sola
Average points: 2549892
France: 2949917
United Kingdom: 2774794
South Korea: 2375924
Italy: 2098934

Wizdomiot
Average points: 2955702
France: 3484609
United Kingdom: 3378981
South Korea: 3328436
Argentina: 3090887
Finland: 2867332
Brazil: 2842167
United States: 2830612
Italy: 2797733
China: 2497363
Australia: 2438895

Ymir
Average points: 2775368
United States: 3794579
Poland: 3275082
Russian Federation: 3174170
Taiwan: 3037180
China: 2902595
Norway: 2572090
Argentina: 2147968
Australia: 1299276

Quarterfinals
SPOILER
Average Relative Score
Brazil: 385343
Taiwan: 350750
Poland: 333484
South Korea: 259304
United States: 233448
China: 203070
United Kingdom: 101195
Canada: 95960
Germany: -42379
Russian Federation: -45843
Norway: -66364
France: -107800
Italy: -235138
Australia: -530735
Finland: -577274
Argentina: -1073376

Percent of Plays Above Averages
Poland: 100
Brazil: 89
Taiwan: 78
United States: 78
China: 71
Russian Federation: 60
South Korea: 57
United Kingdom: 56
Canada: 50
Norway: 44
Germany: 43
France: 33
Finland: 17
Italy: 0
Australia: 0
Argentina: 0

Simulated Head to Head Matches Win Percentage
China: 100
Brazil: 87
Taiwan: 86
United States: 79
Poland: 71
South Korea: 70
United Kingdom: 67
Canada: 45
Russian Federation: 45
Germany: 38
Norway: 33
France: 27
Australia: 23
Italy: 18
Finland: 7
Argentina: 0

Map Statistics
ALONE
Average points: 2629063
United Kingdom: 3399569
South Korea: 3187335
Germany: 3162008
China: 2862071
Russian Federation: 2790510
Poland: 2726243
Norway: 2535682
Finland: 2208694
Australia: 2034759
Argentina: 1383756

boot
Average points: 2760386
Poland: 3190712
United Kingdom: 3163254
Russian Federation: 3080808
Norway: 2712932
China: 2529995
Australia: 1884614

Chinese Restaurant
Average points: 3008163
United States: 3526733
China: 3433133
Poland: 3199576
Brazil: 2992591
Germany: 2886411
South Korea: 2705727
France: 2661064
Taiwan: 2660065

Connect
Average points: 3249908
Brazil: 4075131
South Korea: 4022588
France: 4001432
Germany: 3825734
Taiwan: 3663487
Russian Federation: 2742655
Australia: 2705761
United States: 2657900
Argentina: 2404990
Finland: 2399402

Deus Ex Machina
Average points: 2609649
Taiwan: 3537424
France: 3070665
Finland: 2173719
Argentina: 1656788

Go Away
Average points: 2727090
Taiwan: 3345170
South Korea: 3033489
China: 2960074
Norway: 2904958
United States: 2881244
Brazil: 2856276
Poland: 2791313
United Kingdom: 2658954
France: 1938220
Germany: 1901205

Mushikui Saikede Rhythm
Average points: 2819075
United States: 3451976
Brazil: 3412570
France: 2656678
Norway: 2635887
Taiwan: 2542665
United Kingdom: 2214676

Night of Knights
Average points: 2848416
Taiwan: 3533740
Brazil: 3268920
China: 3223366
United States: 2994604
Poland: 2950068
Russian Federation: 2863280
Canada: 2778066
Australia: 2623755
Italy: 2375433
France: 1872924

rog-unlimitation
Average points: 2992634
South Korea: 3974316
Germany: 3437034
Norway: 3004067
United Kingdom: 2990863
Canada: 2950053
Italy: 2805270
Finland: 2493467
Argentina: 2286001

Scarlet Rose
Average points: 1968482
United Kingdom: 2638332
Taiwan: 2404986
Norway: 2148502
France: 1789705
South Korea: 1593465
Germany: 1235902

sense
Average points: 3456741
France: 4313282
China: 4042457
United States: 3935689
Brazil: 3876586
Taiwan: 3633259
United Kingdom: 3599799
Poland: 3599084
Canada: 3487518
Italy: 3428314
Germany: 3363310
Norway: 3168560
South Korea: 3149929
Argentina: 2436272
Finland: 2360319

Symphony Of The Night
Average points: 2806336
United States: 3319244
Brazil: 3087905
United Kingdom: 2863450
Taiwan: 2829315
Norway: 2411642
France: 2326462

Yoru Naku Usagi wa Yume wo Miru
Average points: 2846936
Poland: 3885231
Canada: 3276708
Norway: 2973397
Brazil: 2903290
Australia: 2767574
Italy: 2693690
Russian Federation: 2625528
United States: 2554641
China: 2529351
United Kingdom: 2259947

Yuugure Semi Nikki
Average points: 2694569
Brazil: 2989595
Finland: 2905258
United States: 2894418
Argentina: 1989003

Semifinals
SPOILER
Average Relative Score
South Korea: 466255
United States: 272835
Germany: 198332
United Kingdom: 152547
Taiwan: 82990
Poland: 32437
China: -55503
Russian Federation: -64173
France: -72981
Brazil: -308619
Canada: -560041
Finland: -979359

Percent of Plays Above Averages
South Korea: 88
United States: 70
Germany: 63
United Kingdom: 63
Taiwan: 63
Poland: 56
China: 50
France: 50
Russian Federation: 27
Brazil: 17
Canada: 0
Finland: 0

Simulated Head to Head Matches Win Percentage
United States: 100
South Korea: 91
United Kingdom: 73
China: 64
Germany: 64
Taiwan: 56
Poland: 45
Brazil: 33
Russian Federation: 33
France: 27
Canada: 9
Finland: 0

Map Statistics
Big Brother
Average points: 2486637
United Kingdom: 2918836
Poland: 2895178
France: 2759735
Germany: 2721862
Poland: 2699469
United States: 2502266
China: 2423325
Russian Federation: 2383052
United Kingdom: 2303469
Germany: 2127888
Canada: 2052973
Brazil: 2051595

Cyber Thunder Cider
Average points: 2660833
China: 3123339
Poland: 3024402
United Kingdom: 2993094
United States: 2981144
Poland: 2598899
United Kingdom: 2440540
Brazil: 2163468
Canada: 1961777

EOS
Average points: 2484236
United States: 3358946
France: 2893356
Russian Federation: 2810335
South Korea: 2574478
Taiwan: 2559777
Germany: 2547877
China: 2011606
Finland: 1117514

Euclid
Average points: 1849960
United States: 2318740
China: 2052596
Germany: 1892357
United Kingdom: 1810756
Poland: 1564250
Russian Federation: 1461060

Hip Song
Average points: 2614390
United States: 3359774
Germany: 3188579
China: 2077607
Russian Federation: 1831599

LegenD.
Average points: 2342389
South Korea: 3279611
Germany: 3140021
United Kingdom: 2631143
Poland: 2495166
France: 2404789
Brazil: 2392971
France: 2346806
Taiwan: 2311871
United Kingdom: 2223987
Poland: 2188297
Russian Federation: 2166272
Canada: 2022491
Germany: 1666714
Finland: 1523312

No More
Average points: 2696652
Poland: 3144165
United States: 3038394
Poland: 2948132
China: 2944813
United Kingdom: 2921592
France: 2890439
Canada: 2038196
Finland: 1647485

Oceanus
Average points: 2183191
Russian Federation: 3380842
China: 2248476
France: 1988698
Germany: 1927524
United States: 1873551
Finland: 1680053

Piranha (Maffalda Reloaded Trap Mix)
Average points: 2621071
South Korea: 3235964
Taiwan: 2650334
United Kingdom: 2459443
Poland: 2138541

Resurrection Spell
Average points: 2576735
Germany: 3517043
Russian Federation: 3278291
United States: 3159826
South Korea: 2906336
France: 2562172
China: 2438656
United Kingdom: 2383907
Germany: 2311782
Taiwan: 2252673
Poland: 2202191
France: 2006467
Finland: 1901474

Saigo
Average points: 2854056
Taiwan: 3539232
Poland: 3337845
Germany: 3205296
United Kingdom: 3190265
South Korea: 3167818
France: 2987203
Germany: 2795602
Brazil: 2760574
Russian Federation: 2626272
France: 2502289
Canada: 2100471
Finland: 2035803

Sakura Zensen Ijou Nashi
Average points: 2744295
Germany: 3335653
United Kingdom: 2953335
China: 2847140
United States: 2572348
France: 2425857
Poland: 2331436

She Runs
Average points: 1946221
Germany: 2160621
Russian Federation: 1731820

Streaming Heart feat. Hatsune Miku
Average points: 2499207
Poland: 2917521
United Kingdom: 2648097
United Kingdom: 2614929
Taiwan: 2542781
Germany: 2461659
France: 2425842
South Korea: 2260300
Brazil: 2122525

World Domination How-To
Average points: 3142404
South Korea: 3633240
Taiwan: 3615911
United Kingdom: 3328930
Germany: 3312262
France: 3241554
Germany: 2983306
Poland: 2532354
Russian Federation: 2491678

Yotogibanashi no Kamikakushi
Average points: 2793293
United Kingdom: 3550549
South Korea: 3533926
Germany: 3211118
Germany: 3142328
Poland: 2813755
Russian Federation: 2750158
Canada: 2638268
Brazil: 2490149
China: 2484757
Taiwan: 2414288
France: 2301545
United States: 2188679

Combined
SPOILER
Average Relative Score
South Korea: 312586
United States: 309017
Taiwan: 288971
Poland: 161892
Brazil: 159197
United Kingdom: 109511
Germany: 85816
France: 27654
Russian Federation: 22396
China: 10565
Norway: -44590
Canada: -275249
Italy: -331821
Australia: -491045
Finland: -693050
Argentina: -877246

Percent of Plays Above Averages
United States: 76
Poland: 74
Taiwan: 73
South Korea: 71
United Kingdom: 61
China: 58
Brazil: 57
Germany: 53
France: 52
Russian Federation: 50
Norway: 44
Canada: 19
Australia: 17
Argentina: 8
Finland: 6
Italy: 0

Simulated Head to Head Matches Win Percentage
South Korea: 100
United States: 100
Taiwan: 80
Poland: 71
United Kingdom: 69
Brazil: 67
China: 62
Norway: 62
Germany: 50
France: 47
Russian Federation: 47
Canada: 27
Australia: 20
Italy: 13
Argentina: 0
Finland: 0
Xayne
Ihd Kee was yuuuuuge today.
juankristal
UK vs Poland, what a game.
Topic Starter
Loctav
updated the wiki!
B1rd
I like Silent Voyage to Eternity in the map pool, I might actually have watched it if it weren't Score V2. I don't think it's a good choice for the hidden pool though.
show more
Please sign in to reply.

New reply