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osu!Skandinavian All Modes Tournament 2015

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1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766

Natsu Dragion wrote:

greia med at det er 4-6 stjernes sanger på alle game modes, men når det kommer til mania er det beste dere kan få til 3.06?! er det noen vits i ta med mania, når sanga er så enkle at alle kan ss dem?
Thank you for mappool feedback. I am not much of a mania player myself so I appreciate it. I will see if I can't anything more fitting. Chillax ;)
Setomi
153 posts
Joined December 2012
Setomi
ctb pool going from platter/salad > Overdose > Harder overdose

Maybe add some more variety? :s

Salad/platter > Rain/easy overdose (or hard rain) > overdose/hard overdose

Platter/rain > easy overdose/overdose > hard overdose

Platter/rain > hard rain/easy overdose (or just overdose) > overdose/hard overdose

Feels a bit wierd having really easy songs at first and then going that "difficult". A player who can barely fc platter/salad will absolutely not be able to contest the later stages
Last edited by Setomi , edited 1 time in total.
Octagon
94 posts
Joined August 2014
Octagon

Setomi wrote:

ctb pool going from platter/salad > Overdose > Harder overdose

Maybe add some more variety? :s

Salad/platter > Rain/easy overdose (or hard rain) > overdose/hard overdose

Platter/rain > easy overdose/overdose > hard overdose

Platter/rain > hard rain/easy overdose (or just overdose) > overdose/hard overdose

Feels a bit wierd having really easy songs at first and then going that "difficult" a player who can barely fc platter/salad will absolutely not be able to contest the later stages
I like the platter/salad 2-3 stars in round 1,2,3 then the tiebreaker is a 4,78 star rain. :^) Nice Tiebreaker
Reimo
15 posts
Joined August 2014
Reimo
Rip mania mappool xD
Patliss
2 posts
Joined August 2013
Patliss
best mappool
Jona
131 posts
Joined July 2013
Jona
Closet otaku Taiko Oni freemod and Yoru naku usagi Muzukashii tiebreaker? Burde ikke disse to switche plass? 8-)
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766

Setomi wrote:

ctb pool going from platter/salad > Overdose > Harder overdose

Maybe add some more variety? :s

Salad/platter > Rain/easy overdose (or hard rain) > overdose/hard overdose

Platter/rain > easy overdose/overdose > hard overdose

Platter/rain > hard rain/easy overdose (or just overdose) > overdose/hard overdose

Feels a bit wierd having really easy songs at first and then going that "difficult". A player who can barely fc platter/salad will absolutely not be able to contest the later stages
I agree, there should be a middle stage, and the final ones shouldn't even be that hard. I don't pick the ctb maps though.

Jona wrote:

Closet otaku Taiko Oni freemod and Yoru naku usagi Muzukashii tiebreaker? Burde ikke disse to switche plass? 8-)
Why? The Muzu is rounds 1, 2 and 3 tiebreaker, while Closet Otaku is for the two best teams. In my mind this makes perfect sense.

AzD wrote:

Rip mania mappool xD
How about now?
Jona
131 posts
Joined July 2013
Jona

Kiwi Stick wrote:

Why? The Muzu is rounds 1, 2 and 3 tiebreaker, while Closet Otaku is for the two best teams. In my mind this makes perfect sense.
My bad, misunderstood the map-pool system :P
Mile
20 posts
Joined June 2013
Mile
jeg har 2,7k pp taiko og 5,1k pp ctb også synes jeg det blir lettere å passe/fc taiko mappolet x) #drøytCTBmappol

ville likt mer hard < insane < extra "cirka" i oppbygging på alle gamemods
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766

BLACK-NINJA3000 wrote:

#drøytCTBmappol
Yup xD
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake
New CtB mappool out now.

Explanation of my thought process:
I was looking for something that could challenge at each level of play (based on average skill lvl at the different rounds). This is the result. I wont claim its perfect, but i hope its good enough. As always, feedback is appreciated.
Setomi
153 posts
Joined December 2012
Setomi
I guess the map pool is better now, I'd recommend switching one of the platters with a easy/standard rain
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766
Now that it's only 3 weeks left, I feel like there should be an announcement of some sort where you also release the schedule.

Also, have you gotten the osu!tourney yet? :)
Hjeg
6 posts
Joined June 2013
Hjeg
The mappool is still sh!t. Sorry, but it's true. Standard, Taiko is too high diff in comparison to Mania and CtB.

Round one star rating for all modes:

Standard - Nomod : 4.45*
Standard - Hidden : 4,30*
Standard - Hard Rock : 2,86*
Standard - DT : 2,75*
Standard - Free mod: 3,97*
Taiko - Free mod: 2,81*
Catch the Beat - Free mod: 2,12*
Mania 4k - Free mod: 1,93*
Mania 7k - Free mod: 1,57*


Why is there such a big gap in star rating? Shouldn't it be almost equal throughout the modes?
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766
Truth of the matter is that the majority of players in this tournament can only play 2 modes at most on a decent level. Most of the players know how to play std, but barely anyone can play the others. This mappool is shitty in that sense, I agree, but it would be boring to watch a team fail every other map because they can't play the game mode accordingly.

Basically, I wanted to make sure each map is passable for everyone in the first rounds. Then again, the maps may be too easy on the semi and final stage.


And just to put it out there: As far as I know, there are no player in Skandi who mainly plays "all-modes". Unlike other tournaments that focus on one specific mode and lets the players who mainly plays that mode compete with eachother, this tournament doesn't really have a specific group of players to appeal to. I hope people see that making a mappool for this tournament is way harder than making a mappool for the OWC.

PS: Star ratings across the game modes are not equal in difficulty. A new player who's never played before would nail 4 star standard maps way before he could 4 star ctb maps.

I hope this answers your question.
Azy
4 posts
Joined March 2014
Azy
i have been playing std just as long as i have been playing mania and i think std 4 star maps are way harder then mania 4 star maps.

''but it would be boring to watch a team fail every other map because they can't play the game mode accordingly''

i'm going 2 fail these std maps cus they are way 2 hard for me and i have been playing std for a year now.
i might be able to get through round 1-3 but, my friend probably doesn't have a chance, and after that i myself won't have a chance after the first rounds.

so either we take the std diff down a star or we take mania up a star.
Hjeg
6 posts
Joined June 2013
Hjeg
What about those who don't play std.

Those who play mania only is feeling a little left out.

You are basicly saying that everyone should be able to play those maps. "It's easy. If I can do can you." No. That is not how things work.
I'm in this competition just to show off my skills in the one mode I know how to play. And when that mode just get 1-2* songs I get dissappointed. It's just too easy.

You have said yourself that you don't play much mania. Why not leave it up to the mania players to pick out some interesting maps. Cuz surely you have picked out some interesting maps for the rest of the modes.

EDIT:
PS: Star ratings across the game modes are not equal in difficulty. A new player who's never played before would nail 4 star standard maps way before he could 4 star ctb maps.
4* std maps are clearly harder then 1* mania maps....
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766
I'm sorry for doing a poor job for the mania players. The mappool has been public for a long time, and a long time before the tournament officially started too. You did post feedback on the first mappool and I answered with some harder maps. You could have craved even harder maps, or contact Divine Cake and ask to pick the mania maps instead of me. I don't know if he'll approve of a change in maps now, but I don't really care at this stage.

If the mania maps bother you, PM him.
The Quarryman
5 posts
Joined May 2013
The Quarryman

Kiwi Stick wrote:

If the mania maps bother you, PM him.
He tells us to bother you FYI

Also, why not ask mania players about maps, instead of deciding to do everything yourself? One guy choosing all the mania maps has proven to go wrong (even two guys as seen in MWC).
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
Uh, well, if what you want to do is to show off your skills in one particular mode, then maybe not do that in an all mode tournament? The tournament is supposed to show your prowess in every mode, not just the one you specialize in. If you think taiko and standard is too hard, then strategize accordingly when you pick maps during the match.

Are the mania maps too easy? Dunno, it seems like only 7k is starting out at normal difficulties for the first round, which I'd say is fairly appropriate all things considered; it's harder to manage 7 keys than 4 at the same time. 4k, CtB and Taiko seem to be closer to the hard range of things. I guess I could agree standard might have harder maps overall compared to the other modes, but the main mappool are also maps you can play as converts. I haven't looked into how difficult those are in other game modes, but they might balance it out better.
Azy
4 posts
Joined March 2014
Azy
i think i'm decent in all modes except ctb, but i am going 2 get slaughtered in all of them except mania. so if i can't even slaughter other people in my main mode because tha maps are 2 easy why am i even competing?
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
Mania maps are easy because it's your main mode. You'd "slaughter" me in any 7k mania match we have, even at these difficulties because I suck at it. They're not easy for a complete beginner, which is true in every mode here. Every other team isn't going to be well rounded in everything except mania; they might be in the same situation as you, where they only excel in one mode and do decent in another.

Also, for a decent player in a mode vs a good one, the matches will be closer, yes, but unless you're a buster, the better player should win in the end.

The only thing I can agree to is that the overall difficulty of standard is fairly high compared to the other modes it seems, but I don't know the situation with converts, so they may be fine overall anyway. I dunno.
Azy
4 posts
Joined March 2014
Azy
yeah but i think we should take all the modes down to between 3-4 star.
because my skills are going 2 be compared to a beginners skills against everyother player that don't play mania. so i think that everybody not playing mania should be compared the same way as me in the other modes.
so if you guys are going to rekk me in std, taiko or ctb, it's only fair that i get to do the same to you.

and that comes down to that every mode should have almost the same star rating, but this is what i feel we should do so it can be equal between all modes.

PS i suck at writing english sry XD
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
You're probably overestimating the "mania noob". I don't think those maps are easy for someone who barely plays mania.

Also fyi, there won't be any "rekking" if your opponent fail before you even get to the flashy parts where you can show off your skills :P
Azy
4 posts
Joined March 2014
Azy
so let's say the mania part is ok.
but non of the other modes are, i will fail long before any of you get to the flashy parts.

and i think i'm speaking for all the mania players competing.
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake
Ok clearly i have some explaining in my thought process of selecting the mappool.

The diffs of each stage was selecte based on the AVRAGE rank of players compeating in that mode. That means that for the avrage player the osu maps should be able to pass it, but it would still be hard eanogh for the better player to win based on aim accuracy speed etc.

We were also three peoples working on this, mabey with diffrent ideas. We tried to conteract this with an open mappool erly to find mistakes, and it worked for CtB. With a large consensus on them beeing to hard, eaven for CtB mains. Therefore i asked Razor to either change them or i would change them myself. Mabey i chose too easy diffs this time around as an overreaction to razors a bit to hard maps. But i asumed everything was fine once nobody had any major complaints for more than a week.

To conclude. If no further arguments on why the mappool shuld be switched last minute i will keep it as it is, as practice is an importaint part of tournament play. This is mostly because the mappool is based on the avrage skill level of the players compeating.

The point of the tournament as CXu said is not to show prowess in one mode, but rather the most broadly able player. Exceling at all this game has to offer of challenges.
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake
Over to a new note.

I am trying to improve on this tourney mode too. i will take into consideration everything that has been said in the last day the next time i attempt making one of these types of tourneys.

Remeber that this mode is in its infancy. organized by a person who has no previous experience, nor does he play taiko or mania. I thank each and every one of those who have been helping me along the way. Making something i've been missing for a year into a reality.
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu

Natsu Dragion wrote:

so let's say the mania part is ok.
but non of the other modes are, i will fail long before any of you get to the flashy parts.

and i think i'm speaking for all the mania players competing.
Then you'd be in the same boat as a CtB player who has no experience in the other modes: you win against the non-CtB players, and lose against them in their game mode.

But this also gives you the opportunity to win against said CtB player in taiko, because you might be better at the mode than them, even if neither of you play it as a main mode.
Hjeg
6 posts
Joined June 2013
Hjeg

Divine Cake wrote:

The point of the tournament as CXu said is not to show prowess in one mode, but rather the most broadly able player. Exceling at all this game has to offer of challenges.
Then why does the Osu!std maps go against your policy? Sure the "average" player in this tournament is highly skilled in Osu!std. But why should they be able to "show off" their skill. While those who play Mania, for example, gets to play easy songs that is not even fun to play. The 1. round is going to get stomped. Same with the 2. and even the finals is eazy. (I could DT all the maps before the finals and get an S. That is not fun)

If you want to see everyone clear every map, then Mania is "ok", the maps are still shitty, but then we need a mappool that is easier for those who do not play standard. Even if that means that the Osu!std players will feel a little butthurt you will get that broad player all the way to the finals, instead of just standard players in the quarter, semi and finals.

If you want "the most broadly able player" to win then we need lower diff on std or higher on the other modes.

EDIT:

CXu wrote:

I guess I could agree standard might have harder maps overall compared to the other modes, but the main mappool are also maps you can play as converts. I haven't looked into how difficult those are in other game modes, but they might balance it out better.
Noone likes auto-converts. Sorry, but I don't get how that is going to work out anyways
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
You don't like autoconverts. Speak for yourself, not for everyone. (Yes I know a lot of people don't like autoconverts, but they're part of the game, and is also a choice if your goal is to "show off your skills")

I don't mind either way if standard gets nerfed or not, but you're mistaken if you think they're just automatically going to win because lolstandard. Unless you're not confident that you can win in your own game mode that is. If a standard and a mania team plays, at most they can pick the equal amount of maps from their gamemode, and then the tiebreaker will be CtB or Taiko. You won't get far at all with only one skillset in a tournament like this.

And it's a team effort. If you know you're bad at standard, you should've teamed with a standard player.
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake
I will repeat what i said. The difficoulty of each mode is based on the AVRAGE skill level of the player base. If i had all the time in the world i would watch 100 60-70k osu!std players as this is the avrage skill level for standard in this tourney. but i dont have that kind of time. i based my jugment on 20-30 ish players of rank 71-73k rank in osu!std and picked maps according to what they could pass
Azy
4 posts
Joined March 2014
Azy
i found out that the average std rank of the players competing is 85k. i then checked what someone in that rank can play, and that is 4.5 star map with a B.
maybe a 4.2 with an A and rarely a 4.1 with 99% S.

so they might get through the first 3 rounds, but no more after that. so pls make this map pool fit to 85k players and what they are capable of doing (that is not 5 star maps).


PS jeg må selv beklage vist vi kommer fram som litt hostile, men mania tourny's er noe vi mania spillere sjeldent kommer over så dette er noe vi vil spille og ha det artig med. ikke sitte og spille dritt 4 star maps.
og vist det er sånn at vi knuser dere på 3-4 star maps. hvorfor ikke la oss knuse dere på noe vi faktisk syns er artig og spille?
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake

Natsu Dragion wrote:

i found out that the average std rank of the players competing is 85k. i then checked what someone in that rank can play, and that is 4.5 star map with a B.
maybe a 4.2 with an A and rarely a 4.1 with 99% S.

so they might get through the first 3 rounds, but no more after that. so pls make this map pool fit to 85k players and what they are capable of doing (that is not 5 star maps).
If everybody would play the semi and finals map your argument would be extreamy relevant. However, only those who play in the semi finals those who lose in the semi finals winner and losers bracket and the finals will play the harder maps. since most of the worse player will be knocked out before this stage of the tourney we raised the difficulty of all the maps.

I might have misunderstood the point you gave. correct me if im wrong

Natsu Dragion wrote:

PS jeg må selv beklage vist vi kommer fram som litt hostile, men mania tourny's er noe vi mania spillere sjeldent kommer over så dette er noe vi vil spille og ha det artig med. ikke sitte og spille dritt 4 star maps.
og vist det er sånn at vi knuser dere på 3-4 star maps. hvorfor ikke la oss knuse dere på noe vi faktisk syns er artig og spille?
Ingen skade skjedd, jeg beklager altså for problemene. Men med kun 2 uker unna start turnering kan jeg ikke uten en veldig god grunn forandre mappoolen. til noens fordel. Prøv heller å skape intressange løsninger på problemer med maps dere ikke klarer og gi dere selv ekstra utfordringer på mania. I fjord ga jeg meg selv en regel om å holde inne boost knappen under hele CtB mappoolen fordi laget vårt var overlegent gode i den moden. Bare fordi det var gøy. Det er det som er poenget med denne turneringen også. Sure man kan vise man er den beste allrounderen, men jeg var med på fjorårets og årets turneringer fordi jeg synes det er morsomt.

Angående få mania tureringer så har jeg bare en løsning: lag en selv. Så vidt jeg vet var Kiwi's AMT turnering den første, og siden han ikke lenger hadde tid til det var jeg nødt til å ta over. Ellers hadde nok ikke blitt en ny en på år.
Hjeg
6 posts
Joined June 2013
Hjeg
Den er grei. Får spille med ringe - lillefinger på 4k, da ;^)

PS: Til neste gang dere lager en "all modes" turnering: Få noen som mainer en mode, f.eks mania <3, til å velge noen kule maps. Slik at ingen blir skuffet, slik som skjedde nå.
roufou
987 posts
Joined September 2011
roufou
gidder ikke lese alt men hvis det ikke ble sagt tidligere så gir det litt mening at andre modes sine maps er lettere siden de fleste spiller standard og standard har mere gode spillere, på den måten blir standard lettere enn de andre.

har ingen mening om hva som ville vært bedre though
Hjeg
6 posts
Joined June 2013
Hjeg
Hvis "average" forsatt er argumentet burde mania få høyere diff, ettersom at det er mange i turneringa som maina mania. Ihvertfall flere enn de som mainer taiko og CtB.

EDIT: Skal vi ha "warm-up"?
Azy
4 posts
Joined March 2014
Azy
er det finally time for putin's boner? ;)
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766
Om det blir warm up vet jeg ikke, men vil gjette på to warmup maps per kamp.
Hjeg
6 posts
Joined June 2013
Hjeg

Kiwi Stick wrote:

Om det blir warm up vet jeg ikke, men vil gjette på to warmup maps per kamp.
Valgfri mode?
Lanki
52 posts
Joined April 2013
Lanki
Den som er kapteinen på sitt lag for nok velge hvilken som helst mode de vill spille som warmup tenker jeg nok
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766

Hjeg wrote:

Valgfri mode?

lanki33 wrote:

Den som er kapteinen på sitt lag får nok velge hvilken som helst mode de vill spille som warmup tenker jeg nok
Iallfall slik jeg arrangerte det i fjor.
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake
Warm ups goes like this. Each team can choose a maximum of 2 warm up maps. No fail is obligatory from both sides, as skill difference can be huge between each team. NF is to prevent one team to either sabotage on purpose or to not be good enough at the game mode, and therefore fail before the map is finished.
Cuppp
113 posts
Joined February 2013
Cuppp
Lykke til med turneringen
Wulfzz
312 posts
Joined November 2012
Wulfzz
Takk takk. :3
Taboki
50 posts
Joined November 2012
Taboki
Humm. Lykke til!
Wulfzz
312 posts
Joined November 2012
Wulfzz
Her er det en link til alle som vil følge kanalen vår før vi begynner å streame!
http://www.twitch.tv/osuskandiamt
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766
24 timer til Launch! Håper hypet er der hos deltakere og ellers andre interesserte!
Gumpy
2,418 posts
Joined June 2014
Gumpy
Hype!
1794766
93 posts
Joined July 2012
1794766
The Schedule has been updated, since we can't stream any matches this upcoming saturday. Please check the schedule for your next match.

The rules have also been updated and everyone in the staff know them by heart now so no more blunders like last weekend. You can have a new read at them yourself in the OP.
Octagon
94 posts
Joined August 2014
Octagon
Divine Cake is quite smart
Divine Cake
152 posts
Joined November 2013
Topic Starter
Divine Cake

Ketchup wrote:

Divine Cake is quite smart
<3
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