1. Transcendence (6.04 stars, 1292 notes)

EphemeralFetish wrote:

W E L C O M E T O F L A V O U R T O W N

• General

1. all good
2. omg the bg is already in a qualified map you cant rannk it noww!!

• rising above something to a superior state

1. 01:31:621 (1,2) - These are the only really overlapping objects in the whole section, nitpicking sure but it kinda looks out of place
2. 01:45:414 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - alright so these sliders abuse slider leniency way too much imo. To me they just feel really uncomfortable to play since you want to move your cursor at a straight 90 degree angle to where the sliders point. Doing what i did in the screenshot will still keep your expanding pentagon and keeping the star-ish jumps while making them more comfortable without abusing the sliders. knowing you youll still deny this either way so idk why i bothered
   
   SPOILER

   
3. 01:53:173 (1,2) - to me the wubs sound like they're on 01:53:173 (1,2) - and not 01:53:345 (2,3) - . Its much more quiet than the two before but i still think this has more reason to be a slider than 01:53:518 (3) - has
4. 02:06:449 (3) - you're clearly following the wubby noises here but 02:06:449 (3) - this isnt a slider for some reason while 02:06:793 (2) - this is. 02:09:207 (1,2) - you mapped it correctly here so im assuming its a mistake or smth
5. 02:15:242 (2,3) - The two beats here arent really emphasized at all, but you emphasize 02:13:862 (2,3) - , 02:14:552 (2,3) - 02:20:069 (2,3) - etc, why?
6. 02:17:828 (4,5,6) - You accelerate quite a bit on these notes only to have 02:18:345 (7) - very close to the slider before, with the 7 being the strongest beat of the bunch id space it a bit more to make it easier to play properly
7. 02:30:414 (2,3) - This is a really strong beat but the jumps are extremely close and then you choose to space 02:30:587 (3,4) - these more? why?
8. 02:31:793 (2,3) - ^
9. 03:41:276 (1,1) - Honestly the spacing between these two confused me a lot every time i played it, they're close enough together in the timeline to not make the player break but i always end up clicking too early on the slider because of the already sudden movement change with the jump. It looks like the stream continues when it doesnt. Id either move the slider further away from 03:41:276 (1) - or stack them somehow
10. 03:43:345 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - These feel fucking amazing to hit so good job there
11. 03:44:035 (1) - tfw not properly spaced between 03:43:949 (4,1) - would NOT rank this bad map
12. 04:08:345 (1,2) - same as 01:53:173 (1,2) -
13. 04:10:069 (2,1) - Im probably missing something here but the main wubs are these 04:10:069 (2,1) - and you choose to mirror these 04:10:242 (1,2) - beats when id mirror the two before.
14. 04:10:587 (3,2) - Pointing out too many things here so im probably missing the rhythm you're following but why is the last one here a slider and not the first? The measures after have pretty much the same rhythm and there you map it like im explaining
15. 05:04:035 (1) - gj fetish

1. 00:38:345 (2,3) - Imo this kickslider feels kinda out of place because I don't really understand why you would put a kickslider directly next to it's next object that even has a strong sound on it (actually just an hitsound but whatever) while normal 1/2 patterns have normal distance.
2. 00:45:414 (3) - Is there a purpose behind this slider being the only 3/4 in this section? I just assume it's not because of the vocals since you ignored them later on.
3. 00:58:345 (6) - I'd actually like to have the slidertail here clickable because you start following a more audible rhythm here so it would be a better transition into that.
4. 01:10:242 (3,4) - 01:10:931 (1,2) - It bothers me that the distance between these objects is way smaller compared to all the other ones even though it's the same snare with the same volume.
5. 01:28:001 (3) - It's fine that you undermap these sounds by just using 1/2 + triplet and so on but it's really weird that you "overmapped" this circle because it's already that quiet that it's not giving any feedback anymore while playing. If you listen closely to it you will notice that there's a silence at exactly this object.
6. 01:34:380 (1,2,3) - 01:38:518 (1,2,3) - Considering that they have a way stronger sound on them than all the other usual objects it feels quiet odd that they still use the same spacing. It just doesn't feel right by only emphasizing them with a different placement.
7. 02:13:345 (3) - I actually dislike the volume of the whistles you used here, mind making them a bit quieter so the music itself is actually audible too? lol
8. 03:48:345 (2) - For what reason are you not using this slidershape for the wub sounds properly? This one does it right but I don't really see a reason to use it 03:48:173 (1) - here when 03:48:690 (2) - has a way better fitting sound for that.
9. 03:50:026 (2,3) - After some testing it feels way more natual by placing it on the 1/8 snap before because the vocals actually start there.
10. 04:00:069 (4,5) - I'd personally space them slightly more because it isn't only weird to play this way but also kinda hard to read since it's an unexpectable pattern because you never used one like this before. And since this whole section is fast and has some spacing it would definitely feel better.
11. 04:29:207 (1,2,3,4) - I don't think a 1/8 sliderspam would be that bad. Wouldn't change anything gameplay wise but fit better to the music.

Yunomi wrote:

sick bg hunni

Rapthorn wrote:

ok i want fetish to stop abusing me so here goes

• General

1. all good
2. omg the bg is already in a qualified map you cant rannk it noww!! see response

• rising above something to a superior state

1. 01:31:621 (1,2) - These are the only really overlapping objects in the whole section, nitpicking sure but it kinda looks out of place k
2. 01:45:414 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - alright so these sliders abuse slider leniency way too much imo. To me they just feel really uncomfortable to play since you want to move your cursor at a straight 90 degree angle to where the sliders point. Doing what i did in the screenshot will still keep your expanding pentagon and keeping the star-ish jumps while making them more comfortable without abusing the sliders. knowing you youll still deny this either way so idk why i bothered fwiw i agree
3. 01:53:173 (1,2) - to me the wubs sound like they're on 01:53:173 (1,2) - and not 01:53:345 (2,3) - . Its much more quiet than the two before but i still think this has more reason to be a slider than 01:53:518 (3) - has these are circle/sliders based on the kicks as well as the wubs, they're fine as-is
4. 02:06:449 (3) - you're clearly following the wubby noises here but 02:06:449 (3) - this isnt a slider for some reason while 02:06:793 (2) - this is. 02:09:207 (1,2) - you mapped it correctly here so im assuming its a mistake or smth I'm not fetish but it's clear he understands the purpose of combining the kicks and the wubs together rather than focusing on one or the other
5. 02:15:242 (2,3) - The two beats here arent really emphasized at all, but you emphasize 02:13:862 (2,3) - , 02:14:552 (2,3) - 02:20:069 (2,3) - etc, why? Because, as the final four beats of the musical pattern, they are weaker, and thus they're "emphasized" less. It's really just got to do with tempo and movement.
6. 02:17:828 (4,5,6) - You accelerate quite a bit on these notes only to have 02:18:345 (7) - very close to the slider before, with the 7 being the strongest beat of the bunch id space it a bit more to make it easier to play properly Again, this has to do with tempo. The exact movements aren't what's important, but the way the pattern is shaped. 7 is in the best spot possible to tie the shape together, rather than being spaced way far out.
7. 03:41:276 (1,1) - Honestly the spacing between these two confused me a lot every time i played it, they're close enough together in the timeline to not make the player break but i always end up clicking too early on the slider because of the already sudden movement change with the jump. It looks like the stream continues when it doesnt. Id either move the slider further away from 03:41:276 (1) - or stack them somehowI mean if you're mashing like crazy then yeah you'll miss, but generally speaking when you're streaming you can easily tell which notes have a major beat on them (hint, it's the new combo), and you'll recognize that there's a pause on the last beat. I've not seen many playtests miss this stream at all, unless they were, of course, mashing rather than streaming.
8. 03:43:345 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - These feel fucking amazing to hit so good job there
9. 03:44:035 (1) - tfw not properly spaced between 03:43:949 (4,1) - would NOT rank this bad map
10. 04:08:345 (1,2) - same as 01:53:173 (1,2) -
11. 04:10:069 (2,1) - Im probably missing something here but the main wubs are these 04:10:069 (2,1) - and you choose to mirror these 04:10:242 (1,2) - beats when id mirror the two before.
12. 04:10:587 (3,2) - Pointing out too many things here so im probably missing the rhythm you're following but why is the last one here a slider and not the first? The measures after have pretty much the same rhythm and there you map it like im explaining
13. 05:04:035 (1) - gj fetish

Stjpa wrote:

This map is pretty neat because it's just so different than all the other Camellia maps that basically look and play the same. Good job at that. :v

And first of all, I suck at modding extras so modding a map of you will probably don't help at all xd

1. 00:45:414 (3) - Is there a purpose behind this slider being the only 3/4 in this section? I just assume it's not because of the vocals since you ignored them later on. cloooose. your eyes. well, it's a fairly thin reasoning but i like how it flows atm.
2. 00:58:345 (6) - I'd actually like to have the slidertail here clickable because you start following a more audible rhythm here so it would be a better transition into that. I prefer the 1/1 hold over making it like 1/2 and a note, and making it 3/4 would just play weird. Sacrifices must be made.
3. 01:10:242 (3,4) - 01:10:931 (1,2) - It bothers me that the distance between these objects is way smaller compared to all the other ones even though it's the same snare with the same volume.
4. 01:28:001 (3) - It's fine that you undermap these sounds by just using 1/2 + triplet and so on but it's really weird that you "overmapped" this circle because it's already that quiet that it's not giving any feedback anymore while playing. If you listen closely to it you will notice that there's a silence at exactly this object This has more to do with simple patterning. In some cases, a missing beat in a track can be very jarring, especially when there's a weird rhythm moment directly after it. The player would lose all of their ability to keep rhythm based on the numbering and patterning of the notes. And then there are missing beats that should be emphasized very powerfully, which we do in the kiai sections with the momentum-killing pauses - the lack of a beat is thereby emphasized there because the rhythm is still very consistent and predictable and can be picked up very easily.
   
5. 01:34:380 (1,2,3) - 01:38:518 (1,2,3) - Considering that they have a way stronger sound on them than all the other usual objects it feels quiet odd that they still use the same spacing. It just doesn't feel right by only emphasizing them with a different placement The slight change in slider velocity is emphasis enough for these beats. I may request the hitsound volume be lowered for them, though.
6. 02:13:345 (3) - I actually dislike the volume of the whistles you used here, mind making them a bit quieter so the music itself is actually audible too? lol I want them quieter too lol
7. 03:48:345 (2) - For what reason are you not using this slidershape for the wub sounds properly? This one does it right but I don't really see a reason to use it 03:48:173 (1) - here when 03:48:690 (2) - has a way better fitting sound for that This is for patterning, not following the wub sound perfectly.
8. 03:50:026 (2,3) - After some testing it feels way more natual by placing it on the 1/8 snap before because the vocals actually start there. no
9. 04:00:069 (4,5) - I'd personally space them slightly more because it isn't only weird to play this way but also kinda hard to read since it's an unexpectable pattern because you never used one like this before. And since this whole section is fast and has some spacing it would definitely feel better I'm already spaced enough since they're literally spaced at this point >_<
10. 04:29:207 (1,2,3,4) - I don't think a 1/8 sliderspam would be that bad. Wouldn't change anything gameplay wise but fit better to the music. yeah sure i guess, i'll start putting 1/8 slider bits... =_= will do more later

Monstrata wrote:

You can't spell Transcendence without Ascendance.

Faust wrote:

Hi.


Transcendance:


Still feel the BG is way too out of place for this track.
Too heavy on the earthly palette, with the combo colors following suit.
Can't help but feel it contrasts against the song.
oh well
And the grid-size you're currently on makes it complete ass to modify slider lengths because of timeline-to-grid correlation but I'm just whining.


- 00:20:931 (3,4) - Totally fine, though why the pair of linear sliders ? why not

- 00:35:069 (1,3) - Alignment is actually off because the end-points aren't set straight or parallel. fix

- 00:39:897 (3,4,5,1) - Runs fine but I have to say it was very noticeable that there was a note that wasn't mapped on - 00:40:242 - ok

Why not just include it. Makes the rhythm whole in my opinion.

- 03:00:931 (4,5) - Don't really feel like these 2 should be obscured. This section makes me think about more prominence in clarity/field of vision. ok

- 03:42:655 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - Neat. neat

- 04:41:276 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - Kind of running a risk here. fetish has balls

Could try getting - 04:41:276 (1,2,3,4) - to cut at a higher angle
while - 04:41:621 (1,2,3,4) - could be patterned to end 4 at the end-point of - 04:41:966 (1) -


That's about it. Not much to touch on.

Generally everyone here knows what they're doing.
It's just a small handful of fine points people might nudge you about, but ultimately I see most as arbitrary against the big picture.

Anxient wrote:

because daddy shiirn told me to

transcendance
00:15:931 (4,1) - pls send fix :c http://puu.sh/r8GEZ/95a46bfe03.jpg Fuck that
00:35:069 (1) - i cant tell if this is supposed to be 1/4 shorter or 1/4 longer. if its 1/2 shorter, fill in this 00:35:414 - pls. if its 1/4 longer, add a whistle to the sliderend. if it happens to be neither, delete the unused timing points. This is intentioally short, the inherited points are in case we ever forcibly place a note there, so we don't forget there's suppose to be a ting sound there.
00:58:173 (5,6) - pls blanket better ;c oh my fucking god
01:05:242 (5) - why increase DS? keep it same ;c it fits better this way fuck ds
01:25:759 (9,10,11,12,1) - whats with the sudden spike downwards? i dont hear anything in the song :c It's just changing direction with the kick. There's no real momentum emphasis.
01:28:518 (3) - have this face upwards? at this rate youll have me and a billion other players misreading this http://puu.sh/r8GWI/727caaf6e7.jpg It's not my problem if people are so used to playing whack-a-mole that they don't pay attention to approach circles (or, if they play HD, fade timers)
01:35:414 (7,8,1) - have (8) be closer to (7), coz emphasis is on (1), not (8). Emphasis actually is on 7 and 8 at the same time, tho.
01:50:931 (1,1) - oh damn this is some good shit. try making them align better? :/ it's practically perfect already wtfffff
01:53:000 - and simialr parts, why not map this one? feels empty without it :c what do you think of this? This has been mentioned before. I will not be changing this. The music has no beat here. The pause is part of the music.
02:24:035 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - it might be just me, but these jumps feel random :u. well, 02:25:587 (2) - pull this one a bit closer to (1) coz of emphasis and we'll be all good. i suggest x251 y188. Jumps are based on kicks and bass, but that one was off so fixed
02:48:862 (1,2,3,4,1) - pls fix the blanket :c http://puu.sh/r8Hqa/3c800ca039.jpg ok
03:04:380 (2) - if this wasnt meant to be a blanket, maybe can make it less blankettish? ok
03:06:621 (5) - try doing something like this, coz the distance between 03:06:449 (4,5,1) - rn is kinda wonky because of emphasis. try doing something like this? http://puu.sh/r8Hy2/770315f392.jpg it's fine
03:19:552 - well this speed spike is kinda high. mind dropping it to 0.9x? imo its less jarring than 1.1x it's fine
03:37:828 (1,1) - this greatly triggers me. pls fix :cccc ok
03:50:242 (3) - compared to the other parts, this one lacks punch imo. try doing this? http://puu.sh/r8HK9/c07a2e78d8.jpg it's fine, there shouldn't be that much punch on these anyway
04:08:173 - probably mentioned this before, but ill say it again just in case, why not map this part? i feel like the map could be made more interestign with this in the picture http://puu.sh/r8HPh/7fc3123b35.jpg. i mean this map is super jumpy and fun ;v but when it suddenly stops, kinda ruins the mood. well thats what i think anyway. The pause is part of the music. Adding something there would be saying that the music is wrong to pause there. I'd be disagreeing with the music itself, which is inherently a shitty concept.
04:25:414 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - this part is relatively calm compared to the other parts, so maybe wanna pipe down the jumps? :d make em smaller i mean. it's fine
05:04:035 (1) - kreygasm

pls dont reject too many

Swiftis wrote:

First of all, this is my first time modding a map, so plz no hate and enjoy game :^) Maybe nirvana was a poor choice of first mod, and maybe shiirn was a poor choice for first modd-ee. xD i'll try to explain myself.

00:02:655 (1) - This slider looks kinda weird, try to make it look more like this one: 00:08:173 (1) This slider is simply curving off of the normal path of the previous ones. The next one is a standard, normal wave. So they're completely different on purpose.

01:39:724 (4,5,1) - Move the 4th circle above the 5th one. The 4th circle being on the side bothers me a bit :/ The slight curve is intentional. Putting the 4 above would make the entire movement a single circle and that's not what I want.

01:56:966 (1) - Again, this slider looks really weird. They're meant to curve with the previous ones and "explode out" with the wub sound.

02:27:483 (5) - Tune the top of the slider up by one tick, it matches the "wub wub" beat more in my opinion. Like this: http://puu.sh/r90VE/da0bafc706.jpg It's fine like this, these kinds of tiny changes are insignificant in terms of what the player feels and this would make the slider shape uneven.

02:56:449 (1) - Make that slider another circle? (like these: 02:53:690 (1) ) disagree, it's fine as-is

03:27:483 (1,2,1,2) - I don't like the idea of those jumps :/ they're not even really jumps. They're just paired notes, which fits the musical pattern.

03:49:552 (1) - You could also turn the buttom left slidertick down once, like I suggested before on another "wub wub" sound :3 This is just for the slider shape, the slider shape is largely independent of actually following the wub, they're focused more on representing them with a specific shape.

03:49:552 (1) - Make these circles look like this: http://puu.sh/r8Z5H/ca350247ff.jpg It's fine this way.

04:01:966 (1) - I don't like the look of this slider :/ I like it!

04:39:552 (1,2,3,4) - Place these circles up a bit? I don't really see any reason to. They're currently spaced very consistently and that's important due to their jumpstream nature.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

That was everything I noticed, amazing work on the map so far! I wish you good luck on getting it ranked!

Shiguma wrote:

I can look thru the (whole) map

I'm dumb

00:16:449 (1,1) - Not overlapped completely on purpose?

00:44:035 (3) - Having this as a reverse 1/4th slider would sound pretty nice

00:47:138 (6,7,1) - The slider at 00:47:483 (1) - has a decent amount more spacing than 00:47:138 (6,7) - and it seems like its slightly awkward to land. Maybe push 00:47:483 (1) - to the left a bit?

00:58:173 (5,6) - Pixel fix https://puu.sh/r9TrS/0e41d5d147.png

01:15:759 (3) - Perhaps overlap the sliderhead with 01:14:724 (6) - as well for more impact

01:31:966 (2) - Pretty close to 01:31:621 (1) - and touching 01:31:449 (7) - not sure if that's on purpose https://puu.sh/r9TGc/22eb1daf6b.png Could be like this (Not saying to do it like this but wanted to show what I was thinking)

Overlap 01:36:018 (2,5) - these perhaps idk (prob not)

The buzz 01:40:931 (6) - here is lost because of this 01:40:759 (4,5) - what I mean is there is no emphasis for 01:40:931 (6) - because of the triple. Compare to what you did here 01:41:966 (3,4,5) - which works nicely (you basically did it everywhere except that part)

01:45:414 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - Nice pattern. Took me a second to realize they play really well when you think of them as circles instead of sliders. I like it!

01:53:518 (3) - Do a ctrl + j and overlap the end with the others like this: https://puu.sh/r9Ugf/a12297bb4d.png ?

01:58:173 (1) - Move this so it looks fuckin sick with 01:56:793 (2,3) - because right now 01:58:173 (1) - has less spacing than 01:56:793 (2,3) and it feels cramped or w.e.

01:59:724 (1) - Overlap with head of 01:59:207 (1) - ?

02:04:207 (1,2,3,1) - really nice

02:05:931 (2) - I'm assuming because of the sound here it's not a copypaste of 02:05:759 (1) - ? But then 02:07:138 (1,2) - these are copy paste

02:26:621 (2) - I feel like this should overlap 02:25:932 (4) - because you overlapped 02:26:449 (1) - with 02:26:793 (1) -

02:29:207 (4) - Seems noticeable that it isn't perfect overlap with 02:28:518 (1) -

02:30:587 (3) - My mouse wants to move to the sliderend of 02:29:897 (3) - err... rather 02:30:242 (1,2,3,4,1) - this entire thing seems off with the hitsounds and everything. 02:30:587 (3) - Has the strong clap sound but there is no jump? 02:30:759 (4) - Is aesthetic in this 02:30:242 (1,2,3,4) - combo, but it doesn't make sense for it's actual spacing/emphasis

02:31:621 (1,2,3,4) - same as ^ Compare with 02:28:518 (1,2,3,4) - and hopefully I'll make some sense :p

02:35:069 (1) - Move this here? https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/6085365

03:41:276 (1) - Why does this go to the right instead of the left lol https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/6085388

03:46:104 (4,2) - Turn down stack leniency?

03:53:949 (2) - Overlap with 03:52:828 (3) - ?

03:56:965 (5) - Either make this move an even distance as 03:55:587 (1,1) - are doing, or overlap with sliderend of 03:55:931 (1) -

04:14:724 (3,1) - hmm.... https://puu.sh/r9VKa/0d5fc03268.png

04:40:931 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - It's perfectly readable, but idk...

04:48:518 (3,1) - https://puu.sh/r9VQT/0acd5fa2d5.png lul

05:04:035 (1) -

Shiguma wrote:

Shiguma wrote:

I can look thru the (whole) map

I'm dumb

00:16:449 (1,1) - Not overlapped completely on purpose? yep on purpose

00:44:035 (3) - Having this as a reverse 1/4th slider would sound pretty nice i hear the beat but don't think it's really that worth emphasizing

00:47:138 (6,7,1) - The slider at 00:47:483 (1) - has a decent amount more spacing than 00:47:138 (6,7) - and it seems like its slightly awkward to land. Maybe push 00:47:483 (1) - to the left a bit? sure

00:58:173 (5,6) - Pixel fix https://puu.sh/r9TrS/0e41d5d147.png sure

01:15:759 (3) - Perhaps overlap the sliderhead with 01:14:724 (6) - as well for more impact sure

01:31:966 (2) - Pretty close to 01:31:621 (1) - and touching 01:31:449 (7) - not sure if that's on purpose https://puu.sh/r9TGc/22eb1daf6b.png Could be like this (Not saying to do it like this but wanted to show what I was thinking) made to not touch for neatness

Overlap 01:36:018 (2,5) - these perhaps idk (prob not) sure

The buzz 01:40:931 (6) - here is lost because of this 01:40:759 (4,5) - what I mean is there is no emphasis for 01:40:931 (6) - because of the triple. Compare to what you did here 01:41:966 (3,4,5) - which works nicely (you basically did it everywhere except that part) kind of disagree here

01:45:414 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - Nice pattern. Took me a second to realize they play really well when you think of them as circles instead of sliders. I like it! uguuuuuuu

01:53:518 (3) - Do a ctrl + j and overlap the end with the others like this: https://puu.sh/r9Ugf/a12297bb4d.png ? sure

01:58:173 (1) - Move this so it looks fuckin sick with 01:56:793 (2,3) - because right now 01:58:173 (1) - has less spacing than 01:56:793 (2,3) and it feels cramped or w.e. sure

01:59:724 (1) - Overlap with head of 01:59:207 (1) - ? sure

02:04:207 (1,2,3,1) - really nice sure

02:05:931 (2) - I'm assuming because of the sound here it's not a copypaste of 02:05:759 (1) - ? But then 02:07:138 (1,2) - these are copy paste this is due to slight musical differences, they're not paired patterns here but the second one is a pair pattern

02:26:621 (2) - I feel like this should overlap 02:25:932 (4) - because you overlapped 02:26:449 (1) - with 02:26:793 (1) - disagree, but changed the pattern a bit anyway

02:29:207 (4) - Seems noticeable that it isn't perfect overlap with 02:28:518 (1) - THIS WAS LITERALLY 1 PIXEL DUDE

02:30:587 (3) - My mouse wants to move to the sliderend of 02:29:897 (3) - err... rather 02:30:242 (1,2,3,4,1) - this entire thing seems off with the hitsounds and everything. 02:30:587 (3) - Has the strong clap sound but there is no jump? 02:30:759 (4) - Is aesthetic in this 02:30:242 (1,2,3,4) - combo, but it doesn't make sense for it's actual spacing/emphasis

02:31:621 (1,2,3,4) - same as ^ Compare with 02:28:518 (1,2,3,4) - and hopefully I'll make some sense :p stuff

02:35:069 (1) - Move this here? https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/6085365 sure

03:41:276 (1) - Why does this go to the right instead of the left lol https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/6085388 nah

03:46:104 (4,2) - Turn down stack leniency? i like stacks tho

03:53:949 (2) - Overlap with 03:52:828 (3) - ? sure

03:56:965 (5) - Either make this move an even distance as 03:55:587 (1,1) - are doing, or overlap with sliderend of 03:55:931 (1) - sure

04:14:724 (3,1) - hmm.... https://puu.sh/r9VKa/0d5fc03268.png hahahaha

04:40:931 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - It's perfectly readable, but idk...

04:48:518 (3,1) - https://puu.sh/r9VQT/0acd5fa2d5.png lul sure

05:04:035 (1) -

That's all, great map

1. 00:48:862 - any reason why you're skipping those? From what i understand you're following the bell-like sounds as well as the little synth beeps in the background, but there's clearly a small beep here, I'd suggest at least mapping a 1/2 slider instead.
   More importantly, this rhythm is unexpected as it skips a major downbeat, and the spacing you're using here is not really helping with reading that. You're suggesting to the player that you're using the distance/time equality rule aka DS for this section, but suddenly decide otherwise on 00:56:793 (5,6,1) - and such, for no discernable reason in my opinion since you have the same note at 00:56:104 - and 00:56:449 - which aren't emphasized and sometimes even end up on slider ends.
   All of this isn't that big of a deal, but would benefit a lot from being investigated, also I would suggest avoiding obtuse angles if you were to keep jumps like 00:56:793 (5,6,1) - . Obtuse angles create a sort of linear flow which is generally harder to read, play and anticipate, especially with this spacing configuration.
   Of course this applies for the whole section.
2. 01:48:949 (2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5) - could blanket 01:50:069 (1) - better, would look great to have an evenly round shape here.
3. 01:50:069 (1,2) - somehow it feels weird to play those, first one isn't really mapped to anything even if i get your intent, second is mapped to something which would be better represented by a slider. I'd either drop those, or put a spinner ending on 01:50:069 -
   01:52:828 (2,1) - there are no hints that helps the player notice this sudden change in rhythm, moreover, you're skipping quite an important beat on 01:53:000 - .
4. 01:58:345 (2,1) - ^
5. 01:53:690 (1,2,1,2) - all this linear flow is quite awkward to play
6. 02:04:207 (1) - not sure the NC here is a wise decision here, first because it's on a red tick, second because it would rather indicate a change in rhythm (to 1/3 for ex) instead of a wider spacing, and lastly because it blends (1) with (3) color-wise, making the whole thing harder to read.
7. 02:09:379 (2,1) - etc etc
8. 02:13:518 (4,1,2) - awkward linear flow, plus (1,2) is more accentuated than (4,1) even though the strong beat is on (1)
9. 02:15:414 (3,4,1) - ^
10. 03:27:483 (1,2,1,2) - you're giving up this pattern really quickly, even though the song doesn't change much except in intensity. It would make more sense to continue this pattern instead of placing random circles 03:28:173 (1,2,3,4) - . This doesn't mean you have to give up the build-up, just raise the spacing, but keep the pairs.
11. 03:38:518 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - More intensity, yet you're giving up on the stream jumps every 5 notes?
12. 04:22:914 (2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - more personal, but those could use a bit more spacing, try stream jumps like this, works quite well thanks to the back-n-forth flow:
    
    SPOILER

    
13. 04:33:690 (1,2,3,4,1) - ^
14. There is an awful lot of badly used "linear" flow and weird spacing everywhere, and as a result the map plays quite awkwardly, and feels "slippery" because you have to constantly control your aim and be conscious of it (well, way more than usual). It's not really a question of being precise, but rather of constantly having to "reset" your momentum, and often in places you expect it the least. Especially in a wubs map, you'd rather focus on reading and letting your aim work for you, if that makes sense (though this part is mostly subjective).
    There are some example ^ earlier in the mod, a few more here: 02:16:449 (5,6,7,1) - 02:18:000 (5,6,7) - 01:52:828 (2,1) - 02:18:518 (1,1,2) - 02:27:828 (6,7,1) - etc

Shiirn wrote:

I've not seen a single playtester on this map ever call it anything but "pretty good". They either found it played normally, or it was a refreshing change that didn't smack them in the face. It was, and is, different without being difficult. I use extensive playtesting (and experience watching playtesters and how they play/react - seriously there's a ton of tells) as well as experience and knowledge to supplement (or replace) personal playtesting (which, objectively speaking, is what you said was necessary). There were a small number of players who struggled with some concepts (shout out to logic agent who still fails the perfectly overlapping slider bits) but invariably there wasn't any real commentary towards "the feel" of the map other than it being different, and their movements followed what I want them to be.

Alheak wrote:

As we have seen during those last years, wubs maps were at first very hard to read and people really struggled playing them for a long time, but they still played well if you could read them. Now they've pretty much become the norm, without losing one bit of their actual difficulty. We just got better.
Unfortunately, wubs songs have stayed mostly the same, and most ways of mapping them effectively have been tried already.
I'm not saying you shouldn't try to find some more, but I fear that what you have here just does not work.

Pentori wrote:

hey

[General]
don't need enable countdown :p shiiiiieeeet
afaik, you only tag users if they mapped/storyboarded. not too sure about hitsounding He put a lot of work into the map and due to his hitsounding some of the sections were changed outright so it's potentially arguable that he mapped some of the map itself by doing so.
hp is kinda low.. why not use 6 - 7 Any higher makes Hard Rock a bit iffy towards the end with the long weak section into the extremely long slider. I prefer the HP being too low rather than too high.

regarding metadata, why is the formatting of the title and artist ignored?
artist: kors k feat.ЯIRE
romanised: kors k feat.RIRE
title: Nirvana(Camellia's "BinaryHeaven" Remix)

Changed those, I think the formatting just got buggered up in a .osu-via-puush thing and I fucked up while changing it back. (the Я changes to gibberish if you upload a .osu with it to puush since puush converts it to plaintext instead of UTF-8)

[Transcendence]
00:35:069 (1) - the bells are pretty important in structuring the melody, so why choose to ignore this one but use the others? the entirety of this section largely passes over the bells where they're not overlapping with the 3/4 rhythm used.
00:44:035 (3) - use a 1/4 reverse slider? since there are 3 sounds here there are 3 sounds there, but they're not the same sounds as the three sliders are following.
00:51:966 (6,1) - would make more sense to swap the nc's here given in other cases you had the nc right after the slider 00:58:862 (1) - 01:03:000 (1) I'm not completely sold on this change because of how the 1/1 slider starts on a very significant beat, but my qualms are low enough I'll change it.
01:34:380 (1,2,3) - i hear 5 buzzes here. there are two on 01:34:552 (2) - so using circles would make more sense imo and on 01:34:724 (3) - using 2 kick sliders for each buzz would be nice and lets u map the kick drum on 01:35:069 . and hitsound these of course I don't know what you're listening to hear - those buzzes are hitsounded, the actual music has the beats much more muted and there's just the three.
01:39:035 - ^ these buzzes come in 4 like at 01:40:587 (3,4,5,6,7) - and 01:41:966 (3,4,5,6) - so u should hitsound them appropriately If i were to map these sounds perfectly accurately, they'd be 1/8 longer, but those play like ass and don't follow the tap-hold of 1/4 sliders very well at all. The buzz vs kick mirror is intentional, and imo works quite well.
01:50:931 (1,1) - 01:56:449 (1,1) - if you were a perfectionist you'd polish these up. http://puu.sh/rKEVe/ea9e95128e.jpg my god my eyes do people play on 1080p and use magnifying glasses to check this shieeet
03:01:449 (1) - map bell pls. u did it for 02:58:690 (2,3) eh fine

poke me when you've replied

Ongaku wrote:

Never knew he mapped it by himself, but I promise you i made the ending slider myself. If its really such a big deal, im willing to remap the slider.

Ongaku wrote:

Its mine because i mapped it?? I will say its inspiration from his slider, but i mapped it in my own vision with the two stars.

Hikaru Rose wrote:

Why would you collab with someone else but keep parts from EphemeralFetish in your map?

Shiirn wrote:

Hikaru Rose wrote:

Why would you collab with someone else but keep parts from EphemeralFetish in your map?

kindly, first off, fuck off - thanks

second off, i did not like ongaku's slider replacement for fetish's, and decided to leave the current one. It is my fault for not clarifying, but of course, i disappeared due to real life circumstances and didn't really explain to anyone. - understandable

third off, me and ongaku are going to create a replacement together that will thematically have the same two-star concept that i suggested to fetish - that's nice to hear!

fourth off, i wasn't pressing to rank it with fetish's slider so don't get all indignant like a little bitch - Fetish was planning on ranking his before his restriction so don't insult me for.. Nothing??

fifth, it was exactly one slider that was not replaced, so fuck off again - 01:50:069 (1,2,1,2,3,4,5) - first thing I recognized. I could try and look for more but I have better things to do !!

Hikaru Rose wrote:

01:50:069 (1,2,1,2,3,4,5) - first thing I recognized. I could try and look for more but I have better things to do !!

Lasse wrote:

as "requested" I guess?

is the hp4 really needed? I didn't check but it would probably still be passable with hr if you use 5. I mean I played through the map and there were so many spots where I missed a lot and was expeting to fail but nothing happened lol I am a firm proponent of team "fuck HP drain anyway". I'll set it to whatever BNs want it to be set to to rank it, I 100% don't care what that particular setting is set to.

00:46:707 (4) - does this really need to be mapped? you ignore all the other background 1/4 here and it just seems a bit unfitting together with the 1/4 on 00:46:535 - seeming more noticeable/similar but skipped Originally I was going to have triple emphasis much more consistently but decided against it and never really looked into changing this set because I still felt like it fit (since really it fits either way, it's just inconsistent). I changed it.

01:05:931 (2,3) - map such different sounds, but are pretty much the same? how about just doing http://lasse.s-ul.eu/xdW5c7Jj.jpg here? that would make the sounds on the remaining repeat stand out much more I think The sounds themselves are similar enough, and in the background enough, that making them completely different would just be overkill. I prefer the combo being a simple off-beat pair of repeat sliders, as it builds up better into the next section than having another offbeat 1/2. I wanted to have the 1/4s because of the background waving sound, but actual streams would overkill it.

02:34:466 - there is still some blue tick emphasis stuff goin on and current rhythm felt a bit too bland for that. maybe something like http://lasse.s-ul.eu/BTXZTHQI.jpg ? Bit similar for 02:33:690 (1,2,1,2) - I think, but the more I listen to it trying to figure things out the more unsure I get so lol This is a massive No from me because in no other point in the map does this kind of double-double click pattern happen. It'd be completely unique and inconsistent with the rest of the map, and as it stands now, this "buildup" is more of a "builddown" and having the 1/4 sliders become an entirely unique rhythm in the track would rather be counter-productive to bring down the intensity. I'm open to moving the yellow pair of sliders to potentially make the actual kick sounds at the end "properly emphasized", though. Lemme know what you think.

02:39:897 - mute tail? considering stuff like 02:40:931 - is muted this probably should be too This was an oversight from Karen's mod. We raised the volume from 5% already to make the sliderticks "barely audible" and I forgot to silence the ending.

03:20:587 (1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - seems a bit overspaced overall considering it's only start of the buildup, drums are 1/1 and melody stuff is similar to before. I mean it seemed way harder and intense than 03:27:483 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3) - (except rhythm from the 1/4 sliders) which is much more pronounced in the song I actually disagree. I feel like the spacing is suitably large, as this section is very energetic for a buildup section, and near the ending the pitch and tone are actually lower as it builds into the different rhythm buildup in the next section. This section has high spacing, but it's not difficult spacing.

03:36:362 (4,1) - movement into this seems a bit too harsh, even with how emphasized 1 is, you could rotate 03:36:449 (1,2,3) - by like -15° http://lasse.s-ul.eu/oa2JC5Ep.jpg Moved 03:36:104 (1,2,3,4) - to make it more consistent with the other streamhops and simultaneously make 4->1 be less harsh.
03:39:897 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - kinda wish this was made out of 1/8 sliders instead of circles since something similar was done on 02:22:311 (1,2,3,4) - , but might suck too much for playability in such a long and spaced stream lol My sentiments exactly. It'd be way too long of a 1/8 stream and putting it only near the end would make no sense consistency-wise, so I elected to just have it be differently patterened out.

03:39:897 - shouldn't you switch to the red/blue/.. combocolors here already cause of strong beat and 1/8 stuff? Woops, yeah, that one red 1234 should be a full red, not pale red, the rest is clean.
03:42:009 - is the snapping here intentional? I mean there isn't really any audible beat to snap to so it's alright, but ending it 1/8 earlier seems more reasonable than the random 1/8 I could have fucking sworn it was snapped to the damn white beat. Fixed.

03:54:724 (2) - 3/4 seems a bit unfitting considering the sound it's mapped to is quite short and all the stuff on 03:54:897 - // 04:33:345 (3) - similar here There's actually the deep-pitch growl in the background as well, and it fits that quite well, the higher-pitched whine is more like two noises anyway. For the second one, I'm not entirely convinced of it myself, but I think it's simply because it's the end of that segment and instead of just having two more 1/4 sliders that have been spammed already, Ongaku chose to just have a transitioning slider instead, even if it didn't actually follow the exact click rhythm of that unique transition, it at least did it differently in tune with the music. I'll bug him to change if necessary, though.
03:55:069 (1) - shouldnt this end on the blue tick? stupid 1/6 autosnapping
03:55:587 (1,1,1) - don't really get the 1/6 snaps here either // 03:59:035 (2,4,2) - with noticeable sounds on beats like 03:59:811 - and all
05:04:035 (1) - silencing sliderticks and fading out sliderslide might fit better here For the sake of not needing to beat off inane bullshit crying off with a stick, I'd rather the sliderticks stay audible because the soft-sliderslide might not be audible enough and like Karen pointed out, I want to avoid actually having any potentially unrankable or arguably unrankable issues with my maps that aren't actually part of what I intend to be weird (see: 1/6 sliders) so I did fade out the sliderslide but I'm really hesitant to silence the sliderticks.

k call me back if you have some explanation for the 1/6 things (or if you change them)