Gratz Ozzy~~ I know that feel, I was waiting around 4 months to rank my map u.u

Will you rank apparition now?

Okoratu wrote:

I like that diffname, it's witty and allowed through the rc

I like it too, its unique and adds a refreshing spin to the boringness that is taiko difficulty names

That's way too subjective which lead in osu to an abnormal way of diff-name handling from time to time. I told MMzz already, if people really want this, fine. But my reason for this mention is that it is not a difficulty name at all. It doesn't indicate anything at all and animates people to go for more nonsense diff-names as we have it in osu already. What happens in osu with diff names is due to the slacky thinking of people that this isn't anything important and a way to "express their art", which is ridiculous. Because of this mindset, people write whole sentences for a diff name. I mean, really now? That's what you support? Because in your personal opinion it doesn't matter? That's exactly the mindset which will backfire later because, people will always refer to "that one case when it was alowed to have such name", while you (or QAT) can't defend yourself since your opinion isn't objective in any way, but rather a "mh, whatever" behaviour. Didn't you learn anything from the past?

Spider Donut 9999G. Why not in the next Taiko beatmap "The Dragon flys high with its wings"? Or even better, "Uncompressed Fury of a Raging Japanese Taiko God"? I can't figure out your way of thinking which would lead to support this beside personal preferences which do not follow any logical reason.

Don't get me wrong guys. Really. I'm not angry or anything like that. As I said, go your way if you really want it. But the reasoning from you is so weak, it is going into my nerfs. There is no real argumentation which would backup your opinion, beside subjective things or the hide behind the rule which allows such names. And the agurment "this is art" or "it's refreshing" doesn't make people halt to use absolutely unacceptable diff names. And if this should happen once, you have in my opinion no word anymore, since you allowed it previously. But if you still don't allow certain names next time, then you just enforce your own preferences to the mapper since you abandoned the objective thinking. And if this should happen, I will refer to this case here.

That's how I think about this situation. Call me a nazi in this matter. But I'm looking at this from a bigger picture. And if you go already for such small things the "meh, whatever" way, then I wonder what happens when the big things happen. The pure fact that MMzz ignored me isn't very respectful either and should make you guys think a bit about it.

Once again, do it your way if you really have to do it. But at least don't forget what I said and consider it.

My reasoning? Names like [Inner Oni] are boring as hell. The only reason we use them is because we're so hellbound on following the authentic games, but that's not even the diff name in the authentic games, it's just called Ura Oni BECAUSE IT'S LITERALLY INSIDE THE ONI. I've always hated the fact that we have to follow that tradition and have to add [______ Oni] for it to be valid. Having 'Oni' in two different diff names is hideous and I've always hated it. If TnT would have had a better way to showcase their 5th diff or if they didn't follow traditions like all rhythm games love to do, it'd probably be 'Kichigai' or something

Not to mention that literally no one is bothered in cases like this. I wouldn't go as far as to name every diff something dumb, but the freedom of labeling the hardest diff something different has been in osu! for the longest time and I plan to take it to taiko.

Okoratu wrote:

Intersubjectivity is the term you're talking about

That's what happened to Kantan up to Ura / Inner Oni, Ozzy. It was a cause which didn't harm anyone and made everything unified and something we use now since years. Overthrowing it now because of personal preferences I find very overbearing, and the reasons are stated above. Hiding behind a rule without taking care of the sense is more than questionable. But well, if that's how you wanna handle things I can't stop you of course. But it doesn't change the fact that the argumentation has everywhere holes just because people act for their very own preference. And that's a problem in my opinion. Especially when it goes into a bigger scale.

Is anyone harmed by this diffname on a bigger scale Ono?

I refer to my second post again.

Your reasoning goes in circles . One side will say "no it doesn't harm anyone" and the other side will say "this harms the quality of diffnames" and then the whole argument will take off in circles like it did when we discussed this in PM.

this post is not about diff names

[Spider Donut gggg9]

I just gotta ask


Why does stuff like 01:37:382 (412,413,414,415,416,417,418,419,420,421,422) - exist? It's incredibly overdone and has no real relation to the song except short notes in the song that don't even last that long. It feels like a random increase in density without anything happening in the song, additionally we have stuff like 01:35:490 (391,392,393,394,395,396,397,398,399,400) - that should be more noticeable, since that's actual 1/4 in the song and therefore more noticeable if you had no notes, yet everything here is just yet another "long" 1/4 pattern because stuff was overmapped, so you don't notice that there's a difference between equally long 1/4. It's also the only time you overmapped it this much, all other parts use normal triplets.

While we're at it, 01:15:208 - 01:23:556 - is also non-stop 1/2 while the part after this is not. The difference in how loud these parts are is VERY big though, but the mentioned part feels more powerful due to giving you no break at all. And yes you could've mapped non-stop 1/2 after that too, it would've made stuff even worse though :3. Suggestion would be to remove all dons in the mentioned parts because basically the main melody is kats.


I also think that 00:33:469 - 01:06:860 - could use a few more breaks, or at least 00:50:164 - but that's entirely different and more subjective (the 1/4 is too much here partially too though), the stuff above is more troublesome

weff

nwolf, the stream at the end is mapped to the rising rhythm (dudududududu) leading into the big notes, simple as that. it could have been mapped something like k kkd ddk k or something, but i need to keep my image of a shitstream mapper

as for that 1/2 part, yeah i guess you could see non-stop 1/2 as being more intense, but i don't lol. being slower and easier to read has much more worth as being easier at this BPM imo. as for the transition both parts go 'something with breaks -> same thing but with no breaks', so basically consistency's sake as far as variation goes.


Megpoid GUMI - Sorry For Being a Shitmapper

exactly, the dududuudud is 01:39:208 (428,429,430,431,432,433,434,435,436,437,438,439,440,441,442) - (I guess?) but 01:37:382 (412,413,414,415,416,417,418,419,420,421,422) - makes it seem less note-worthy. It feels very out of place in the overall map

it's definitely 'not worthy' of a stream (it's not 1/4 but literally so many things in the song aren't) but it's how i felt like mapping that rhythm xd

OzzyOzrock wrote:

it's definitely 'not worthy' of a stream

Then you already know what to do for that pattern

About 01:15:208 - 01:23:556 - , it's perfectly fine, the rest of the song is mapped with a high density, so going full 1/2 with no breaks is not a problem, it's better to follow without interruptions the melody here, maybe just delete the 1/4 notes there to keep the melody clean.

As for the diff name, let me state my view about it. I kind of understand the difficulty name, but the problem here is that it's out of semantics with the rest of the difficulty, (imagine writing some philosophical term in your grocery list), it's odd, out of place. Since you're stubborn about it, I'd suggest to: follow the standard difficulty naming, go full custom names (I haven't completed the game so I have no idea if it's possible to fill the list with related items), or isn't just "Spider Donut" an option?

But fix the stream, please. You say it's leading into the big notes, but for the same reason, the stream somehow opaques the big notes.

I say 'not worthy' because if it was being mapped easier, it wouldn't be mapped that way. But since I am specifically choosing to overmap, I will choose to. everyone knows my signature endings...

Spider Donut would not work, because then you don't know if it's 7G or if it's 9999G.

It seems that the spider is not dancing anymore

ok the only thing killing me is the last big note because my hand still keeps the 1/4 motion so i miss like a bitch

maybe add a note here 01:40:186 - and remove the finisher on the last note so it's ended like a stream?

as for the 01:37:382 (412,413,414,415,416,417,418,419,420,421,422) - im totally ok with it so ye

call me when youve considered this

You shouldn't be forcing patterns where they don't belong to just because you felt like it. Rest of overmapped stuff isn't bad because it fits and complement nicely the music, but this one isn't

It's not forced. There is a change in melody that I'd like to emphasize with a stream.

discussed that last suggestion with the mapper

I see no reason to not push this forward again

reminder to put your cover on the description you can thank me later

ok, better reasoning for the kdkdkdkkkdkdkdk is flow in general, with the constant kdkdkdkdk easily leading into a satisfying big note hit, ty

I think what Ozzy means is the difference in melody at 01:37:643 with the higher pitched 1/2 which is indeed a bit different compared to previous parts, am I possibly right Ozzy? On the other hand I can understand why people mentioned this, since these higher pitched sounds start a bit later than the stream:

1. 01:37:382 - start of the stream
2. 01:37:643 - difference in melody

That's why I would rather suggest a middle way instead of keeping it or changing it entirely. How about just deleting note at 01:37:577 (415) - . The benefits of this would be to continue with the consistency of kkd, keeping a stream as you wanted and following by this the pace in a more accurate way. One note makes a big difference here and actually makes the pattern more accurate which follows your reasoning.

As for the 01:40:121 (442,443) - , personally I don't find it that problematic because you have the possibility to switch from kat to don which makes it easier to play due to finger switch. But just to make sure, maybe asking for more opinions woulnd't hurt, right?

And one more thing about the difficulty name, since Dake mentioned it. Isn't it possible to have a middle way here, too? I don't know the game, so I can't give any suggestion. But is it possible to bound this name somehow with the difficulty "Oni"? You know, things like we had already in the past: Wrath Oni, WereOni and stuff.

___________________________________________________________________________________
@Raiden: While it is of course mappers decision how he makes his patterns, you are still not allowed to bubble maps until conclusions haven't been found. You went over Dake and Nwolf's concern without waiting for their final answer, especially Dake.

DakeDekaane wrote:

You shouldn't be forcing patterns where they don't belong to just because you felt like it. Rest of overmapped stuff isn't bad because it fits and complement nicely the music, but this one isn't

No agreement found yet. The bubble was too rushed. Hence, normaly it should be popped until things are settled. After that you can go for the rebubble.

BN rules wrote:

1. Do not rebubble a manually popped bubble without talking to the actual popper beforehand. (Ono: Here it is a DQ, tho)
2. Setting the popped bubble icon on a map's thread means you found issue in a bubbled map that hinders it from being qualified enough for being Qualified. You can also pop over other things like overmapping or things you really feel are just not right.

You are too unconcerned / slacky. And Ozzy's reasoning with all the memes and flow stuff too weak. everyone knows my signature endings... is like saying you can do whatever you want just because it's a mapping lable for you. And we all know, such things with such reasonings ain't work. Though, I backed up some points a bit since I believe I understood the purpose here. But it's not professional, this whole talk from mapper side.

Ozzy answered to their concerns (so there's a conclusion of this), and I agreed with them, hence I am totally allowed to rebubble if I deem fit. I am not unconcerned/slacky in any way.

Dake did not state that it is resolved, did he

A conclusion isn't found by mapper declining the points. If a concern has been raised and it got backed up by several people for various / same reasons it can't be ignored and should be given several thoughts + possible other solutions. Aka a middle way.

Btw. bananannian told me the addition of "Oni" has been already talked about. I probably just missed it. So you can ignore that point.

peppy wrote:

MORE PEOPLE CHECKING YOUR MAP IS SOMETHING YOU SHOULD BE THANKFUL FOR> THEY ARE DOING IT FOR FREE> IF YOU DON"T AGREE THEN FOLLOW UP IN THE THREAD< (BUT STOP FUCKIGN COMPLAINING) > THE THINGS WRITTEN BY QATS ARE NOT FINAL> IF YOU DONT AGREE THEN SAY YOU DONT AGREE>

put the irrelevant thing in brackets
I don't think a middle way has to be forced as this was discussed reasonably *at least from what i can tell*

Okoratu, it doesn't help what you post. People want to find solutions (since as it seems, more guys said something about it) and expect a proper answer by mapper. He doesn't have to accept it, no! But he should answer at least to everything properly. Right now, the bubble has just been rushed and previous people ignored. That's not acting respectful. And please, just let the Taiko guys now settle this in a calm way. I'm really not interested to talk to you about such things when I exactly know that I (or we) can talk to Ozzy freely. We know each other long enough and don't wanna harm him anyway. He knows it.

Right Ozzy...?

I discussed with Ozzy a bit about this map couple hours ago.

Difficulty name: basically he's making a point. He's probably not going to relent on the matter either, so the difficulty name's not changing, no adding "oni" anywhere, no theming Kantan --> Oni around spider donuts either. You either go all the way or you go home I guess.

Ending stream with the finisher at the end:
One, symmetry, a valid reason I suppose;
Two, satisfying finisher at the end, keyword being satisfying
Three, the melody long note ends at 01:40:121, so not continuing the stream would reflect that
I suggested changing the D at the end to K so Raiden could keep his 1/4 hand movement, but he didn't reply about it lol

kkdkddkdkkk: I too suggested breaking it up into smaller plets but I went with kkdkd kdkkk and he said no, I guess we should wait for his feedback on kkd ddkdkkk.

Anyways chill, Ozzy isn't even online and he's the mapper, just wait until he wakes up lmao

It seemed to me that you were pretty insisting to the point where it seemed forceful, as this doesn't seem to be the case, sorry and thanks for clearing that up.

So I screwed it up with my english again? Arg, my bad as well.
And thanks for your feedback bananannian.

Now is when you ask the community about this

As for a compromise, I can see the note deletion suggested by Ono working. Though I'd add a suggestion to delete 01:37:577 (415) - too, since the melody is still the same as previous pattern .

I let him bubble because as mentioned, I believed I had responded to everything. Maybe it was hard to notice since I never directly quoted? The last note is big because I've always thought that the sound a 'D' makes ends songs perfectly, and my answer to Dake is right after his post... also, stop reading my small text as if what it says is serious

Anyways, to avoid causing any more pointless drama I deleted 01:37:577 (415) - (it's actually a nice suggestion!!! clap clap!!!)

And like I've said, I will not make the highest diff have Oni in the name.

Mapping is serious business.

Kantan verSON is Gyuud2watch., my ears

Mantap gan

Grats with qualify Ozzy 0w0

offset is totally wrong...
try +10