Zexion wrote:

I would prefer to have imput from all players before making serious voting, don't you think so?

Navizel wrote:

Mine and SNB's vote are definitely RVS so he's null just like everyone else

Sakura wrote:

Not exactly, people do everything for a reason, even their posts in RVS, come from the information they have by their Role PM, so it's possible to extract information even from RVS posts.
Drezi felt the need to put those 2 ppl as townreads (one which was me when i hadn't even posted) and you as scumread (who hadn't even posted either).
You decide to ignore the fact that this could stem from the possibility of Drezi having some sort of pre-game plan of trying to designate you as a target mislynch, you don't see anything odd with it.

Possible reasons:
- You're scum, so you know that's obviously not the reason.
- You didn't actually bother trying to analyze the post.
- You're just derp.

I'm trying to figure out which of the 3 possible reasons it is, also im trying to figure out why did you decide to stick with your vote on me, instead of moving the more suspicious RVS vote of Drezi after you realized it wasn't a post made by me.

I've already outlined by own reasons by which i think it's probably not a scum tactic, but you didn't even feel a slight bit of need to check what was going in Drezi's mind when he made the reads list? I find that hard to believe.

On the other part of your post, yes i know he was scum in medical mafia, but i don't remember much of what he did in that game, and i wasn't on that game from the start either. All I care about a person's scum game right now is how they perform early game, which is the state at which we currently are at right now.

Sakura wrote:

Not exactly, people do everything for a reason, even their posts in RVS, come from the information they have by their Role PM, so it's possible to extract information even from RVS posts.
Drezi felt the need to put those 2 ppl as townreads (one which was me when i hadn't even posted) and you as scumread (who hadn't even posted either).
You decide to ignore the fact that this could stem from the possibility of Drezi having some sort of pre-game plan of trying to designate you as a target mislynch, you don't see anything odd with it.

Possible reasons:
- You're scum, so you know that's obviously not the reason.
- You didn't actually bother trying to analyze the post.
- You're just derp.

I'm trying to figure out which of the 3 possible reasons it is, also im trying to figure out why did you decide to stick with your vote on me, instead of moving the more suspicious RVS vote of Drezi after you realized it wasn't a post made by me.

I've already outlined by own reasons by which i think it's probably not a scum tactic, but you didn't even feel a slight bit of need to check what was going in Drezi's mind when he made the reads list? I find that hard to believe.

On the other part of your post, yes i know he was scum in medical mafia, but i don't remember much of what he did in that game, and i wasn't on that game from the start either. All I care about a person's scum game right now is how they perform early game, which is the state at which we currently are at right now.

Sakura wrote:

Also i missed the last part of your post.
Yes i'd also like input from the other players, but that doesn't prevent me from interacting and forming reads from what has been posted or from people that are actually here to reply to my questions or interact with them.

Sakura wrote:

I usually dont put much into account into the early posts, other than "why X instead of Y", but while Drezi's post was amuzing and suspicious, my current pet peeve is why Zexion decided to not question it, heck he even calls me and Drezi a scumteam... then follows it with a "maybe", uncommital, easy to flee if things dont go his way, and not actually trying to read people.

Sakura wrote:

my current pet peeve is why Zexion decided to not question it, heck he even calls me and Drezi a scumteam... then follows it with a "maybe", uncommital, easy to flee if things dont go his way, and not actually trying to read people.

Navizel wrote:

I don't know about SNB. I searched his past game and I found Medical Mafia. The first was an RV on Sonatora and SNB voted him too though there were others before his vote so I can't really refer to that. I'm just going to say his vote here is really just an RV.

Sakura wrote:

While yeah, im missing most of the picture, if i consider your current posts scummy im going to dig deeper into your thoughts, to try to either solidify that scumread or to see if im wrong and you're actually town, you don't seem to be helping much in that regard. There's something wrong in your thought process. You say you dont have a clear scumread on me, and you're voting me out of entirely RVS reasons. That is valid but... are you just going to sit there looking at the sky with your vote parked until every single person decides to do something Non-RVS-like? Like... you don't even seem to try to sort me out, you ask questions that seem like they might be trying to sort what im dong, yet you're drawing no conclusion from them.

Yeah, i know you probably wouldn't know how to make that assumption in the game, but the way you're drawing the conclusion comes from no more than an OMGUS. "Mommy, mommy they are voting me they must be bad people!", i would assume if you're voting me, for RVS or otherwise you intend to interact with me, and strengthen or cancel your scumread, but i still DONT see you doing anything of the sort with any of the things you're asking me. You haven't even tried to figure out a scum motivation for what i'm doing, you're just sitting there doing nothing while im here, and around, and open to answer questions and interact. You don't seem to be interested in actually sorting people, just because some people are missing doesn't mean you can't interact with someone and find their alignment.

Disclaimer: However that's more over my playstyle since i get reads from interaction much more than just reading what people do, while is a starting point, i usually get stronger reads from interaction, and while this is my playstyle, it may not be something you're used to, but i still see you... doing... NOTHING, with the questions you're asking.

Sakura wrote:

Yes, I made an OMGUS vote, then you turned around and OMGUS'd Drezi too, with again as mentioned before an uncommital read. Your vote doesnt scare me, i'm just wondering why the fuck you're doing nothing with it, because my view of a town person would be trying to decipher is if im town or not, not just sit there and do nothing and hope the world falls on me.

Since you bring up Navizel, one thing i've noticed is that he's... playing differently from what I remember, Instead of resorting to one-liners he seems to be actually trying to express his thoughts. This is entirely different from what I remember from either alignment of Navizel and im just thinking it might be an improvement in playstyle.
The "Yeah I agree" comes backed up, so i didnt pay it much mind, do you disagree? if so why?.

The SNB thing was just an example of how you can generate discussion even from the 2nd post of the thread u.u

Yeah i agree it was probably pure randomness, and i've already stated as such and why, so why did you feel the need to mention it again?

Navizel wrote:

calling Jess to post something. Saw her posting in forum games a while ago so she should've noticed this thread.

Sakura wrote:

Also since you're obviously reading Navizel's posts, to notice he's agreeing with me what do you think of this:

Navizel wrote:

calling Jess to post something. Saw her posting in forum games a while ago so she should've noticed this thread.

Zexion wrote:

Sakura wrote:

Yes, I made an OMGUS vote, then you turned around and OMGUS'd Drezi too, with again as mentioned before an uncommital read. Your vote doesnt scare me, i'm just wondering why the fuck you're doing nothing with it, because my view of a town person would be trying to decipher is if im town or not, not just sit there and do nothing and hope the world falls on me.

Since you bring up Navizel, one thing i've noticed is that he's... playing differently from what I remember, Instead of resorting to one-liners he seems to be actually trying to express his thoughts. This is entirely different from what I remember from either alignment of Navizel and im just thinking it might be an improvement in playstyle.
The "Yeah I agree" comes backed up, so i didnt pay it much mind, do you disagree? if so why?.

The SNB thing was just an example of how you can generate discussion even from the 2nd post of the thread u.u

Yeah i agree it was probably pure randomness, and i've already stated as such and why, so why did you feel the need to mention it again?

And me trying to figure out whether you're town or not involves me leaving that vote there for the moment. Because as I've said that's the best place it can be at the moment, while the other 4 people say something.

Oh, so now agreeing to everything other person says and playing passively (i.e. following other players ideas and being reactive just like I was) is an improvement on playstyle? Are you serious? I remember doing the same (with the "backed up" part) and ended up accused for parroting. Silly that you find there's nothing wrong with that.

Okay e.e

I brought Drezi again because I was mentioning every player that has posted so far. Nothing more to say.

Zexion wrote:

It tells me nothing at all and keeps with the same attitude. Gameplay-wise is a totally irrelevant line. (i.e. there was no need to mention that)

Sakura wrote:

It's still kinda early to call something like that parroting, besides he directly quoted my post and said that it was his thoughts exactly, parroting is different, unless you think you shouldn't agree with what other player says?
Parroting is when you contribute nothing to the thread other than what's already been said by someone else, but in this case, do you think there was something else he could've contributed to it? OH SUPRISE! he did, he talked about Jess, so no, it's not parroting, he agrees with my stance re-you.

So basically trying to figure out whether im town or not involves voting me... and... doing nothing else? or did you expect to magically divine your alignment like a day cop when other people started posting.

Navizel wrote:

Sakura wrote:

my current pet peeve is why Zexion decided to not question it, heck he even calls me and Drezi a scumteam... then follows it with a "maybe", uncommital, easy to flee if things dont go his way, and not actually trying to read people.

My thoughts exactly.
I don't know about SNB. I searched his past game and I found Medical Mafia. The first was an RV on Sonatora and SNB voted him too though there were others before his vote so I can't really refer to that. I'm just going to say his vote here is really just an RV.

Navizel wrote:

Calling for Jess just means I want her to post and contribute something to the game. I didn't call on everyone else because I checked their history and they weren't online when the game started. However, Jess was.

Sakura wrote:

Zexion wrote:

It tells me nothing at all and keeps with the same attitude. Gameplay-wise is a totally irrelevant line. (i.e. there was no need to mention that)

Do you think there might be any compelling and alignment indicative reason for Jess not posting here?
If it's an irrelevant line, in addition to your assesment of Navi's "parroting" what does that tell you about his alignment?

Ok maybe im just kinda mad that no one's doing anything after a few hours of no one being around at all u.u

Sakura wrote:

Bah, whatever, the tone and stances on Zexion's words, seems he firmly believes this is the best way to go for him, so i'll just look somewhere else.

Navizel wrote:

Where are the others

I feel like Drezi's reads are just for rvs therefore insignificant. If it's not, I would like to know the reasons as well. He ignored my vote too. (it's an rv but still)

and unicorns aren't real :< [spoiler]I wish they are[/color]

Sakura wrote:

Navizel wrote:

Calling for Jess just means I want her to post and contribute something to the game. I didn't call on everyone else because I checked their history and they weren't online when the game started. However, Jess was.

Was online when the game started or... was online when you called her.

Sakura wrote:

Navizel wrote:

Where are the others

I feel like Drezi's reads are just for rvs therefore insignificant. If it's not, I would like to know the reasons as well. He ignored my vote too. (it's an rv but still)

and unicorns aren't real :< [spoiler]I wish they are[/color]

^
@Zexion.

Sakura wrote:

Yeah, I just checked and her last post was somewhere around 2 hours ago.
It doesnt show that she's currently online tho.

Possible Reasons:
- She had limited time so decided to just post something in a forum game rather than an RV here.
- She's scum avoiding the thread <- Very unlikely imo, what motivation would there be for a scum to avoid the thread at this point, besides any newb scum would've beetlejuiced by now.
- ? Can't think of others.

Sakura wrote:

That's also possible, if you look at her post history, she was actively posting at 10 hours ago, which is also when she confirmed, then just made a short post saying aru~ in a random forum game, and she's no longer online. So it's quite likely she didn't want to bother or didn't even check the mafia forum. Forgot about that.

Sakura wrote:

Bah, whatever, the tone and stances on Zexion's words, seems he firmly believes this is the best way to go for him, so i'll just look somewhere else.
Unvote
Vote: Navizel
1) Why did you think it was relevant to say that Jess was posting in forum games, but not here? Do you think she's purposefully dodging the thread when the day only started a few hours ago?
2) If you agree with my stance re-zexion what do you think of his later posting and his explanation of his uncommital scumteam post? We've been discussing for a while, if you agree with me, you certainly have something to comment in everything that's been said, yet you didn't say anything.

Zexion wrote:

Sakura wrote:

I usually dont put much into account into the early posts, other than "why X instead of Y", but while Drezi's post was amuzing and suspicious, my current pet peeve is why Zexion decided to not question it, heck he even calls me and Drezi a scumteam... then follows it with a "maybe", uncommital, easy to flee if things dont go his way, and not actually trying to read people.

Because I wouldn't know how to make that assumption this early in the game? You surely don't believe I can make that claim seriously only because two people are voting for me?

Navizel wrote:

Where are the others

CalignoBot wrote:

Vote Count 1.03


[1] Ace Timing -- Static Noise Bird
[1] Drezi -- Navizel
[1] Navizel -- Sakura
[1] Sakura -- Zexion
[1] Zexion -- Drezi
[0] -[Jess]- --
[0] Hika --
[0] sLaiNi --
[0] Static Noise Bird --


[0] No Lynch -
Not Voting -- -[Jess]-, Ace Timing, Hika, sLaiNi

With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch.

Deadline is July 3 at 3:30PM CST (GMT-6).

Zexion wrote:

@Sakura: What do you think about Navizel not reacting at all about the stuff I said?

Navizel wrote:

Calling for Jess just means I want her to post and contribute something to the game. I didn't call on everyone else because I checked their history and they weren't online when the game started. However, Jess was.

Static Noise Bird wrote:

Sorry, drowned in the world of Battleblock Theater for a while there.

I'll read more thoroughly after my shop trip and post if there's anything good I can post about (although from the first glance it seemed like completely stupid shit related to the first joke posts and random votes).

Sakura wrote:

Yeah i was thinking about that earlier, but thing is the way he put me as town before I even posted felt like some sort of early buddying so when he would flip scum people would trace back their posts and look at that then try to tie me up with him. Although i dont remember much of Drezi scum, and even if he was scum, I highly doubt he would go through such a coordinate pre-game plan of suiciding to take me down with him.
So in other words, i hardly feel that scum would've come up with such a risky tactic, and it's more than likely just town trying to get reactions out of RVS. And even in the low chance that he was scum, i doubt he'd be scum together with Zexion, so there's another point in favor towards voting Zexion.

Sakura wrote:

Also, you misread it, i didnt say you'd give me towncred, i said the entirely opposite, you saying i was town before i even posted, if you flipped scum would cause me to get mislynched, but as i said before, that'd be too risky of a move and it'd involve you sacrificing yourself.

-[Jess]- wrote:

Welp

vote: sLaiNi

You are online

Drezi wrote:

You could still vote someone. Even though I'm trying to steer away from it we're still in Random Voting Stage, you can just vote someone because you don't like their name or something silly to get things going. You can just change your vote later anyway.

Drezi wrote:

And this just doesn't seem feasible as I said in my last post, or why else do you think town would decide to lynch you if I flipped scum after putting you as town?

Static Noise Bird wrote:

I'm going to post more if there's anything new not related to the first pages tomorrow/tonight lolol. I can't be arsed to "analyze" anything based on RVS-related (non-)content.

Navizel wrote:

heh.

sLaiNi wrote:

Re-read everything and made some thoughts about everybodies posts.
The way Zexion tried to explain his actions didn't seem like he is a scum. What I am more curious about is, that Navizel only posted:

Navizel wrote:

heh.

when Sakura suspected him of being a scum and made her thoughts about him. Just posting "heh" there doesn't make much sense IMO.

UNVOTE: -[Jess]-

NEW VOTE: Navizel

Sakura wrote:

Maybe help me add pressure here so he'll be more motivated to reply!

sLaiNi wrote:

... now when you are town.

Static Noise Bird wrote:

sLaiNi wrote:

... now when you are town.

Excuse me.

Either you're scum (you know for sure he's town), or you're both scum (desperate bussing).

And you're still keeping your vote?

sLaiNi wrote:

You are right, that I acted a bit fast there but it's more of a newbie action than a direct hop on the wagon. Still, I could understand that you might suspect me now when you are town.

sLaiNi wrote:

Re-read everything and made some thoughts about everybodies posts.
The way Zexion tried to explain his actions didn't seem like he is a scum. What I am more curious about is, that Navizel only posted:

Navizel wrote:

heh.

when Sakura suspected him of being a scum and made her thoughts about him. Just posting "heh" there doesn't make much sense IMO.

UNVOTE: -[Jess]-

NEW VOTE: Navizel

sLaiNi wrote:

...now when you are town.

sLaiNi wrote:

I can't see why you are so sure about me being scum. Just because I used subjunctive to express the possibility of him being town despite me suspecting him being a scum.

Navizel wrote:

It's very contradictory.

-[Jess]- wrote:

sLaiNi wrote:

...now when you are town.

this is self-contradictory.

Sakura wrote:

My vote is now serious.

Zexion wrote:

I would prefer to have imput from all players before making serious voting, don't you think so?

sLaiNi wrote:

You are right, that I acted a bit fast there but it's more of a newbie action than a direct hop on the wagon. Still, I could understand that you might suspect me now when you are town.

Navizel wrote:

heh.

Hika wrote:

Zexion wrote:

I would prefer to have imput from all players before making serious voting, don't you think so?

Either earlier on in the game you were VI, you just didn't realize what you were doing, or you really are scummy.

sLaiNi wrote:

I'm here now. So as inexperienced as I am, I rather stay a little bit in the background and give my thoughts on your ideas rather than creating them myself.

Not answering despite having posted is barely a proof for anyone to be scum. IMO

Thanks Sakura for explaining some of the words people use in this game. Helped me out quiet a bit.

-[Jess]- wrote:

this is self-contradictory.

sLaiNi wrote:

I still think it's strange how Navizel stood in the background, despite others suspecting him, but as soon as I suspect him, he starts to accuse me of being scum.

Zexion wrote:

Also we're not on RVS anymore. Abstain from voting randomly.

Zexion wrote:

I suggest you read the first pages again because I already explained this and the Drezi/Sakura posts. Let's not bring that up again because we already reached a conclusion.

Besides this I don't see anything relevant or helpful on your post. Would you mind developing your ideas about the scumslip or are you just messing around?

Zexion wrote:

Also about the "scumslip"... that doesn't seem like definitve proof. As a non-native english speaker, that sentence would have made perfect sense in my language. I don't know anything about german but it may have had sense on that language too... I'll give it the benefit of doubt and just say it was bad-worded, but it still bothers me.

sLaiNi wrote:

In German, "If you are a scum" means "Wenn du ein Scum(Abschaum) bist". Translating "Wenn" to "When" is a common mistake (even though it's a bit embarrassing for me to make such a mistake). This might sound like a bad excusion therefor, but that's how it happened.

sLaiNi wrote:

Ahh, you posted while I was writing the post above @Zexion.


First, thanks for the nice welcoming. I already took a quick look at the wiki, but I am definitly reading a lot more there after you suggestion.

Yesterday, when I was browsing through the Osu-Forums, I found the Mafia section. After reading some in it, I noticed that it reminded me of a game my "religious education" - teacher used to play with us for one or two times, named "Die Werwölfe von Düsterwald" which is also about some people being werewolf and knowing each other and being able to kill the villagers in the night while these vote for a execution on days end.

That's what made me really interested in trying this out. And even though I seem to be terrible and I barely know how to contribute to the discussion, it's a lot of fun for me.

Hika wrote:

Zexion, this is going completely over your head.

Zexion wrote:

Also we're not on RVS anymore. Abstain from voting randomly.

What if some of us haven't picked up on anything. Not saying that I haven't, but as it is a "newbie game", I will abstain from pressuring as long as everyone can evaluate properly what they are saying. So let people vote as they would like. People are not scumslipping, people are just being very clueless when they post without sense. I still consider RVS but that Navizel post was a little odd and I am examining it as we speak.

Hika wrote:

Zexion wrote:

I suggest you read the first pages again because I already explained this and the Drezi/Sakura posts. Let's not bring that up again because we already reached a conclusion.

Besides this I don't see anything relevant or helpful on your post. Would you mind developing your ideas about the scumslip or are you just messing around?

Nice, I already got a reaction out of you. It's a reaction test, to see what you will say, and you reacted to it just as I thought.
I can read, I have two eyes, and what it seemed like, to me at least" was a bunch of pointless bickering. It's not like I can disregard it though. You guys ended it on your own terms. Me, however? I have just started to read the thread and will not take things like that lightly, especially if I see walls and walls of text in the beginning of D1.

It is helpful for me so I can keep note of what I am doing and so everyone will know my opinion. You mentioned this earlier on in the game, correct? You mentioned that it would be nice to get the opinion of everyone before being too hasty.

And specify scumslip. You scumslipping or sLaiNi?

Drezi wrote:

Sakura wrote:

Also, you misread it, i didnt say you'd give me towncred, i said the entirely opposite, you saying i was town before i even posted, if you flipped scum would cause me to get mislynched, but as i said before, that'd be too risky of a move and it'd involve you sacrificing yourself.

Yeah but this is the part I don't get, I didn't misread it, I simply understand the hypothetical case you mention this way: "Oh look Drezi turned out to be scum, and he put Sakura as town, let's lynch Sakura" -> "Why? Because scum put her as town! Why does it mean she's scum then? Because scum wanted us to think she's town! Wait she isn't? No scum wanted us to think the other scum is town!"

And this just doesn't seem feasible as I said in my last post, or why else do you think town would decide to lynch you if I flipped scum after putting you as town?

Sakura wrote:

I guess it might be paranoia, but you're right that there's not much to go off and think something like that, it's related to stuff i can't talk about atm, so it'll have to wait.

Hika wrote:

Nice, I already got a reaction out of you. It's a reaction test, to see what you will say, and you reacted to it just as I thought.

Navizel wrote:

Where are the others

I feel like Drezi's reads are just for rvs therefore insignificant. If it's not, I would like to know the reasons as well. He ignored my vote too. (it's an rv but still)

and unicorns aren't real :< [spoiler]I wish they are[/color]

Navizel wrote:

@Sakura - I agree with your thoughts on Drezi. One for one in day one seems outright stupid. Though maybe you two are scum and then since you dissolved the idea, people won't think you're scum in case Drezi died and flipped scum. Idk, I'm being paranoid too

Drezi wrote:

This might be a personality/playstyle thing but I found this a bit excessive "look at me working my townie magic".

Zexion wrote:

There's already plenty of material to read and discuss. All our votes should be serious now, we have imput from about all the players. I don't really get the scumslipping part, when did I imply any of it?

Zexion wrote:

I can't read your mind. The way you worded it sounded like you didn't read any of my discussion with Sakura. If you're not going to take what me and Sakura posted lightly and don't agree with our conclussions, how about you post what you don't agree with instead of looking for an excuse to say something like "hey, I'm doing something to find scum, but I won't tell you!".

Zexion wrote:

Where am I being hasty? Hastly would be voting for any of the newcomers without talking properly with them. I merely stated that in your post you didn't come with new points to work with, just pointed the obvious and proved you didn't read properly the first pages.

Zexion wrote:

Obviously Slain's "scumslip"i. When did I ever scumslip? Care to elaborate?

Hika wrote:

It's just you said something about considering the whole town's opinion before getting too hasty. That is something that I don't agree with here because that can either mean that you're not understanding the whole point of RVS (in a serious sense) or you're taking things lightly yourself. I mean it's okay, you don't have to mind it, but I won't discuss this anymore here because according to you, if it has been settled, it doesn't need to come back up.

I'm just gonna assume it was pointless. But that one line touches me the wrong way.