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Multiplayer "No-fail" in single player

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26
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +68
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat
Have an alt for the "No-fail" mod that is similar to how failing in multiplayer works

I really like in multiplayer that the game will let you know you have failed by turning gray, with giving you a chance the revert the screen back to normal if you fill the life meter back up. I find myself despreatly trying to get my screen back to the regular color when this happens (which I think makes me play better with the pressure on keeping the combo). With the single player "No-fail" mod, it does not have as much presence to when you have failed.


Also - Having the multiplayer version as an alternative will allow players that like the regualr "No-fail" mod continue to use whichever they want.
CeilingPanda
148 posts
Joined June 2012
CeilingPanda
Even if it is quite unnecessary I do like this idea.
It is already in the game basically(I believe, depending on how peppy coded it) so it would just need a new button when you click nofail twice such as DT and NC.
It sort of also give you a heads up on what sections you perform better on as you sometimes do not have time to look at the meter at the top left.
quaternary
320 posts
Joined February 2013
quaternary
I like the idea but...

Won't this break every skin, ever?
vape
69 posts
Joined April 2013
vape
I've noticed I play worse with NoFail because there's no pressure. Maybe this would help.
Raging Bull
2,809 posts
Joined June 2010
Raging Bull

tuddster wrote:

I like the idea but...

Won't this break every skin, ever?
How? It only changes the combo color to grey.
quiz-chan_DELETED
quiz-chan_DELETED
Nice idea TBH, but I think this will be hard to implement
changed my mind...
Last edited by quiz-chan_DELETED , edited 2 times in total.
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Quiz-chan wrote:

Nice idea TBH, but I think this will be hard to implement
How hard?

It already works without any problems in multiplayer, there just needs to be an option to activate it for single player.
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Oinari-sama
I don't mind this if Failing doesn't grey out the notes. Grey colour doesn't work well with some map bg/movie/sb and it may be counter productive for those who likes to play with nothing disabled.
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Oinari-sama wrote:

I don't mind this if Failing doesn't grey out the notes. Grey colour doesn't work well with some map bg/movie/sb and it may be counter productive for those who likes to play with nothing disabled.
What if the mulitplayer fail just changes the back ground grey. I guess that would help people get back on track if they had not changed video viewing settings.

I submitted the Multiplayer no-fail mainly due to the regular no-fail having nearly no presence while playing (it also pushes me to get the screen back to normal once I have failed). Also allow you have play the whole song if you are having trouble on a higher difficulty, but still would want to enjoy the song.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
That multiplayer fail thing where everything goes like black and gray is probably one of the dumbest features osu! has, why are you even discussing this...
wolfn
123 posts
Joined March 2011
wolfn

Wishy wrote:

That multiplayer fail thing where everything goes like black and gray is probably one of the dumbest features osu! has, why are you even discussing this...
I don't think it's a bad thing in multiplayer, but its use in singleplayer does seem kinda why. It would have the same score penalty as no fail; I don't find its functions particularly desirable for solo play...
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Wishy wrote:

That multiplayer fail thing where everything goes like black and gray is probably one of the dumbest features osu! has, why are you even discussing this...

[quote="BlackStat" Also allow you have play the whole song if you are having trouble on a higher difficulty, but still would want to enjoy the song.[/quote]

The way I know how multiplayer fail works is
1. If player does not fail, player keeps whatever score earned and it submitted to the global leaderboards
2. If player does fail, player can keep playing until song ends
3. If player does fail, player score does not submit to the global leaderboards
4. No score modifiers are present while playing in this mode

The only change I can see fit (since there seems to be quite an audience that does not like the notes changed monotone colors) is that the back ground ONLY changes black/white, while the notes are still the correct colors.
Lust
osu! Alumni
2,667 posts
Joined January 2013
Lust
Well that would kind of defeat the purpose of failing a map since you can just turn this mod on and fail, get back in to the map without any penalties to your score when it submits.
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Side Pocket wrote:

Well that would kind of defeat the purpose of failing a map since you can just turn this mod on and fail, get back in to the map without any penalties to your score when it submits.
If you fail, the score doesn't submit.
I don't recall my scores being submitted when I fail in a new map on multiplayer.
Dexus
982 posts
Joined July 2009
Dexus
semi related: No fail should be removed from multiplayer, it's pointless except causing future misery for newer players.

But yeah I like this idea, it would make no fail more interesting to try, because then you would actually know if you died or not.

Plus it would make it more obvious if someone is using no fail or not.

Edit: This would also shy people away from using no fail as well, which is a good thing. Players shouldn't have to rely on this mod, because if you absolutely can't do a map then there's no point in playing it. Try again later when you're better, or fix what you're doing wrong by retrying.
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Dexus wrote:

semi related: No fail should be removed from multiplayer, it's pointless except causing future misery for newer players.

But yeah I like this idea, it would make no fail more interesting to try, because then you would actually know if you died or not.

Plus it would make it more obvious if someone is using no fail or not.

Edit: This would also shy people away from using no fail as well, which is a good thing. Players shouldn't have to rely on this mod, because if you absolutely can't do a map then there's no point in playing it. Try again later when you're better, or fix what you're doing wrong by retrying.
Logically no-fail can't be removed since the game can't just stop if one person in the room fails. It's much better to have all players play through the whole song.
(I am assuming you are talking about the grey screen thing and not the mod. The mod is practically useless I can agree)

The only reason I see no-fail mod in single-player is for players to be able to try the whole song, even if they can't pass an area. I like playing really hard beatmaps, and sometimes can't pass them, which I turn no-fail so I can at least play the the in its entirety. (Plus I get to listen to the whole song)
Dexus
982 posts
Joined July 2009
Dexus
Multiplayer works on no fail automatically. The game greys out. Using no fail in multi just puts a crap score in that you may not be able to fix for a long time (looking at new players who go into multi and turn on no fail without realizing they're going to have to go back and fix it). It happens a lot and it happened to me when I was still a little babby nub, but that was when I also didn't notice spun out became ranked and I trashed a bunch of songs.

I digress though because this is off-topic to the request. Just continue about talking about the main topic
wolfn
123 posts
Joined March 2011
wolfn

Dexus wrote:

Edit: This would also shy people away from using no fail as well, which is a good thing. Players shouldn't have to rely on this mod, because if you absolutely can't do a map then there's no point in playing it. Try again later when you're better, or fix what you're doing wrong by retrying.
I know players who don't take don't take so "hardcore" to this game and prefer playing crazier maps with no fail regularly. Not everyone is trying to get better.
Aquamarine
222 posts
Joined February 2011
Aquamarine
Yes, please.

I strongly believe that implementing this will immensely change the perception of osu!'s general gameplay. This will be a great change. It'll likely attract new audiences of gamers. There have been requests and discussions about removing the HP bar. This "no-fail" request is overall more lenient, and more compromising.

If only I can write my thoughts down so it can be understood by all. Please consider giving out thought on how implementing this will affect the psychological and philosophical mindset of osu! players(especially to those starting out). Then consider how that will effect all aspects of osu! as a whole.

And yes; unlike multiplayer, disable the effect of removing hit circle colors after failing. That seems like common sense to me. "Fuzz" the BG or something. Many other ideas. So many options instead of grey notes.

It's likely I'll be supporting this request always with stars whenever I get them.

I'd also like to point out that this request will not effect competition at top levels. In fact it may actually increase. Reason being is the cause of the potential increase in variety of mindsets relating to osu!. With this in mind, competition in relationship to the term "e-sports" will potentially rise. Unfortunately for me this reasoning may be difficult to understand because of my poor wording usage. The concept itself is also complex.

This request..... and if the scoring of accuracy and combos would be revamped... but that's another topic for discussion. :)
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Aquamarine wrote:

Yes, please.

I strongly believe that implementing this will immensely change the perception of osu!'s general gameplay. This will be a great change. It'll likely attract new audiences of gamers. There have been requests and discussions about removing the HP bar. This "no-fail" request is overall more lenient, and more compromising.

If only I can write my thoughts down so it can be understood by all. Please consider giving out thought on how implementing this will affect the psychological and philosophical mindset of osu! players(especially to those starting out). Then consider how that will effect all aspects of osu! as a whole.

And yes; unlike multiplayer, disable the effect of removing hit circle colors after failing. That seems like common sense to me. "Fuzz" the BG or something. Many other ideas. So many options instead of grey notes.

It's likely I'll be supporting this request always with stars whenever I get them.

I'd also like to point out that this request will not effect competition at top levels. In fact it may actually increase. Reason being is the cause of the potential increase in variety of mindsets relating to osu!. With this in mind, competition in relationship to the term "e-sports" will potentially rise. Unfortunately for me this reasoning may be difficult to understand because of my poor wording usage. The concept itself is also complex.

This request..... and if the scoring of accuracy and combos would be revamped... but that's another topic for discussion. :)

O-oh wow... I had no idea another person had such strong feelings for my idea.

Giving more thought in changing Mulitplayer No-fail. If this feature does make it into the game, there could be a chance in re-work. It would be great to keep the colors of the hit circles so they stand out, but the back ground could blur/fuzz out into gray. I find having the background/video while playing the beatmap is more enjoyable, and might as well could be the same for others. This would push players to recover.

Thank you for your thoughts!
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Oinari-sama

BlackStat wrote:

O-oh wow... I had no idea another person had such strong feelings for my idea.

Giving more thought in changing Mulitplayer No-fail. If this feature does make it into the game, there could be a chance in re-work. It would be great to keep the colors of the hit circles so they stand out, but the back ground could blur/fuzz out into gray. I find having the background/video while playing the beatmap is more enjoyable, and might as well could be the same for others. This would push players to recover.

Thank you for your thoughts!
I think BG blurring will be a lot better than a grey BG, since it may not work so well with some hit object colour schemes. Blurring at least preserves that colour balance.

There should also be an instant audio feedback, a "Fail" sound to cater for those who plays with 100% dim. That also means that a "Revival" sound will be required too.
_noone_
48 posts
Joined April 2010
_noone_
<>
Last edited by _noone_ , edited 1 time in total.
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

Oinari-sama wrote:

I think BG blurring will be a lot better than a grey BG, since it may not work so well with some hit object colour schemes. Blurring at least preserves that colour balance.

There should also be an instant audio feedback, a "Fail" sound to cater for those who plays with 100% dim. That also means that a "Revival" sound will be required too.
Actually, why stop at blur?

"Revival"
What a great idea

-Adds Blur effect onto BG
-Adds Muffle effect onto song

The sounds for the Fail indicator/Revival indicator could be changed with skins too.
Maybe an intensified version of the combo break sound would be good for the Fail indicator.
Ideas for the Revival indicator would be great.

Also maybe change the hp bar to all red when trying to build back up for Revival? Many times in multiplayer is looks like I have gotten back into the game, only to find out that it was not full-full and I accidentally missed a note, resetting my revival progress.
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Oinari-sama

BlackStat wrote:

-Adds Muffle effect onto song
I don't like the idea of tempering with the song. This is a rhythm game and I don't think it's a good idea to force players to play through "muffled" music.
-----
257 posts
Joined June 2008
-----

Oinari-sama wrote:

BlackStat wrote:

O-oh wow... I had no idea another person had such strong feelings for my idea.

Giving more thought in changing Mulitplayer No-fail. If this feature does make it into the game, there could be a chance in re-work. It would be great to keep the colors of the hit circles so they stand out, but the back ground could blur/fuzz out into gray. I find having the background/video while playing the beatmap is more enjoyable, and might as well could be the same for others. This would push players to recover.

Thank you for your thoughts!
I think BG blurring will be a lot better than a grey BG, since it may not work so well with some hit object colour schemes. Blurring at least preserves that colour balance.

There should also be an instant audio feedback, a "Fail" sound to cater for those who plays with 100% dim. That also means that a "Revival" sound will be required too.
I don't see any reason why would we need to go as far to change the skin elements to adapt this mod. Didn't it work well already on multiplayer games, since I don't see anyone complaining that it break skin elements?

The idea is you select this mulitplayer-style nofail modifier on map select screen, play a map, and if you ever make the HP bar empty, which is precisely your fault, the game just make it work the way it did and appeared in the mp game. Because that's the purpose the mod is for: to emphersize you just failed this map and you need to work your health up as much as possible. We don't need to try adding any other fancy functions in this case.
BlackStat
38 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
BlackStat

----- wrote:

Oinari-sama wrote:

I don't see any reason why would we need to go as far to change the skin elements to adapt this mod. Didn't it work well already on multiplayer games, since I don't see anyone complaining that it break skin elements?

The idea is you select this mulitplayer-style nofail modifier on map select screen, play a map, and if you ever make the HP bar empty, which is precisely your fault, the game just make it work the way it did and appeared in the mp game. Because that's the purpose the mod is for: to emphersize you just failed this map and you need to work your health up as much as possible. We don't need to try adding any other fancy functions in this case.
Well, yeah. The main point is to add an option for the Multiplayer Failing mechianic into single player.
But, if possible people have noted that turning the notes gray when you fail isn't the best thing to help the player get back up. The cosmetic appeal of the Multiplayer Fail is actually effecting game play because the notes are blending into the bg sometimes. It would be great if this problem was fixed with implementing the feature into Single player.

Even if it wasn't fixed though, I would be happy to see this in Single player
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