Has anyone else noticed that sometimes a 200 BPM song is way slower than a 120 BPM song? I have pretty much given up on trying to predict how hard a song is going to be based on BPM, because it never seems to really tell you how fast the song is. I can only figure that BPM isn't really about the speed of the song, but maybe more about the density of beats. Is this correct? If it is just about beat density, then does it effect the approach rate somehow maybe? I'd just like to know more about how this works. Discuss!
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A 200 BPM song that only uses 1/2 beats is the same speed as a 100 BPM Song with lots of 1/4s
It basically tells you the maximum speed that stuff like streams can have, and usually it's a decent indicator for general difficulty
It basically tells you the maximum speed that stuff like streams can have, and usually it's a decent indicator for general difficulty
So long as I know the map will contain 1/4 streams, the bpm is very useful. Sometimes, you may find a 200 bpm map that plays exactly like a 100 bpm map would, and the streams consist of 1/2 instead. Or take for instance valstyle maps at above 250 bpm that all play like they're spaced 120 bpm+ streams.
Topic Starter
Oh, I see! It often does seem that the higher BPM is harder, of course. I was just curious, because there are a lot of low BPM maps that I find harder than higher BPM maps much of the time. You've enlightened me a little now, though.
Edit: I often find that I have a lot of trouble DTing a song that is higher than about 125 BPM at the moment. I'm working to get better at this. Is it because the 125 BPM and lower maps are using more of these 1/2 beats, and such? I have a hard time with a lot of regular 200 BPM maps, but reasonably 125 BPM multiplied by two should be 250, so it often surprises me at how I can play a map at that speed on DT, but at 200 BPM I can often have more trouble.
Edit: I often find that I have a lot of trouble DTing a song that is higher than about 125 BPM at the moment. I'm working to get better at this. Is it because the 125 BPM and lower maps are using more of these 1/2 beats, and such? I have a hard time with a lot of regular 200 BPM maps, but reasonably 125 BPM multiplied by two should be 250, so it often surprises me at how I can play a map at that speed on DT, but at 200 BPM I can often have more trouble.
err DT won't multiply the BPM by 2, it would multiply by 1.5 instead. So 120 BPM DT'd would play at 180 BPM
also 1/4 beats (streams) are faster than 1/2, it -should- be easier to DT if there's more 1/2 beats (unless you have more trouble with spaced 1/2 notes than compressed 1/4 notes or something)
also 1/4 beats (streams) are faster than 1/2, it -should- be easier to DT if there's more 1/2 beats (unless you have more trouble with spaced 1/2 notes than compressed 1/4 notes or something)
Topic Starter
I personally am not very musically knowledgeable, but what I was trying to ask was if the 1/2 beats were making the 125 BPM maps easier on DT. I think you read it as the opposite.
I did not realize that doubletime caused a 50% speed increase only! I just assumed that it doubled the speed. In retrospect it does make more sense that it's only 50%, because it doesn't really feel like doubled speed, and it explains how people can DT 200 BPM maps. XD I am so glad that I know this now. Actually, this is leading me to believe that I perform best around 190 right now. Very useful information to help me pick difficulties!
I did not realize that doubletime caused a 50% speed increase only! I just assumed that it doubled the speed. In retrospect it does make more sense that it's only 50%, because it doesn't really feel like doubled speed, and it explains how people can DT 200 BPM maps. XD I am so glad that I know this now. Actually, this is leading me to believe that I perform best around 190 right now. Very useful information to help me pick difficulties!
ampzz
The half beat formula for a combo section mapped at 1/2 beats played at double time would be like so:
125 ÷ 2 x 1.5 = 93.75bpm
So basically you would be tapping at about 94bpm for the majority of the combo sections until you get to triplet and/ or stream areas which results in the full 187.5bpm figure.
The main difference is whether the user has set the overall difficulty to a high level or not.
125 ÷ 2 x 1.5 = 93.75bpm
So basically you would be tapping at about 94bpm for the majority of the combo sections until you get to triplet and/ or stream areas which results in the full 187.5bpm figure.
The main difference is whether the user has set the overall difficulty to a high level or not.
Topic Starter
Overall difficulty? You mean Insane vs Hard, and what not? I make it a point to play nothing below Insane, personally. Is there some other difficulty gauge?
ampzz
Overall difficulty relates to an option which is selectable in editor mode that denotes how accurate you have to be within a case of [number] ms to register for a perfect 300 hit and generally how much harder it is on spinners to get them to wind up.
Here is how the window frame in editor looks like:
The higher this value is the harder a map is to maintain high accuracy unless you're used to these higher values as you have to rely on a very small time margin to successfully land perfect hits.
Here is how the window frame in editor looks like:
The higher this value is the harder a map is to maintain high accuracy unless you're used to these higher values as you have to rely on a very small time margin to successfully land perfect hits.
Topic Starter
Ah, ok, that makes sense. I had suspected something like this was going on in the map making, because I could feel the difference in certain maps.
Music generally is composed with a certain tempo, or BPM. In electronic music there is usually a static tempo, so it never actually changes. In live music, human error forces the BPM to vary slightly, making it incredibly difficult to correctly import it into a rhythm game like osu.
However, BPM does not necessarily mean the same thing as tempo. BPM is literally Beats Per Minute. You can read up more on tempo here, if you want to. The basic part of tempo though is that it describes not only how fast the song should be played, but the feeling or mood of the song. The wikipedia article mentions the difference between "allegro" and "presto" as allegro comes with the connotation of "joy", whereas presto just means fast.
Happy! Lucky! Dochy! is BPM 235
t/16868]Mei[/url] is BPM 200, but is clearly faster. The melody in mei is very fast, whereas the melody in happy lucky dochy is essentialy halftimed.
As for the difficulty difference you're noticing in the song, especially the approach rate, this is all due to the difficulty settings.
Very low BPM songs are usually either very difficult or just slow. Very high BPM songs usually play as if they were half timed. Around 130 to 200 BPM is where most songs fall for osu, though many songs are much slower. Few songs are truly faster than that. Speedcore is kind of silly in that regard. You can also define a "beat" differently. In time signature 6/8 it's common to either count each eighth note as a beat, or each dotted eighth note as a beat, so it's either 6 beats to a measure or 2 beats to a measure.
However, BPM does not necessarily mean the same thing as tempo. BPM is literally Beats Per Minute. You can read up more on tempo here, if you want to. The basic part of tempo though is that it describes not only how fast the song should be played, but the feeling or mood of the song. The wikipedia article mentions the difference between "allegro" and "presto" as allegro comes with the connotation of "joy", whereas presto just means fast.
Happy! Lucky! Dochy! is BPM 235
t/16868]Mei[/url] is BPM 200, but is clearly faster. The melody in mei is very fast, whereas the melody in happy lucky dochy is essentialy halftimed.
As for the difficulty difference you're noticing in the song, especially the approach rate, this is all due to the difficulty settings.
Very low BPM songs are usually either very difficult or just slow. Very high BPM songs usually play as if they were half timed. Around 130 to 200 BPM is where most songs fall for osu, though many songs are much slower. Few songs are truly faster than that. Speedcore is kind of silly in that regard. You can also define a "beat" differently. In time signature 6/8 it's common to either count each eighth note as a beat, or each dotted eighth note as a beat, so it's either 6 beats to a measure or 2 beats to a measure.