noob_questions.txt

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Topic Starter
Nyarky
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Hello everyone !

I started playi tryharding Osu!Mania around 2-3 months ago , after being a Osu!Catch player only for almost 4 years .

As a Mania noob , i do have some questions about it . I've read the FAQ so i already have some answers , but here are my other questions :

1- Sliders , how do they work ?

By that i mean , when do i have to press and release to get a 300/300g ? Most of the time , i only get 300/200 and when i'm getting a 300g i feel like i'm either horribly early or late q_q .

2- Bonus PP with mods

I do know that DT does gives a bonus , but to what extend ? And do we get bonus PP with other mods or are they just here for fun ? (Which is totally fine)

3- Tapping speed

Now this is more like a personnal problem , but i've been looking at some high difficulty maps replays , it looked fine , but then i wanted to try them with NF and it was legit impossible because of how fast it is required to tap. My question is , i guess it's all about practice , but is it also about how i'm placing my fingers ?

4- Am i right ?

Jakads is OP @_@
[TAS]
Ok so I'm new to O!M as well and relatively new in music games like this so I might get some stuff wrong here.

Difference between 300/300g (We will say 300/300 perfect for me since that's what i am used to) is not a whole lot. If you think about it in frames put it simpley the 300 would mean that you are hitting the note about 0.15 frames off. Now the 300 perfect would mean that you are hitting the note EXACTLY on the frame. Now this is where my experience kinda plays in. Those might not be the right number of frames but you get the idea at least. The 300/300g all depends on acc and how accurate you hit the notes. It does take some time to get used to it took me 3 months and like I said earlier, I have been playing games like this for a little while.

I might be wrong on this but you can actually see how much of a increase or decrease your score will get if you put mods on. I assume that, that same increase or decrease in score will stay true for the pp. So say I played a song normally and got 100 pp for it. Then I put on DT and it said something along the lines of 1.80x (usually at the top of the screen above the mods) meaning an 80% increase. So I would get 80 added to my 100 pp already which equals 180. Now with this one I'm not sure to be honest. I'm just guessing here so don't take my word for it.

FINALLY something I can actually help with! Ok so first you have to find a comfortable way to play. Might sound simple but trust me its more complex then you think. This includes finding the right skin for you, the scroll speed, where you place your fingers, the frame rate, etc etc etc. After you figure all that out you have to practice. Find songs that you either get around 650k pts in or 80-88% acc in and practice the living daylights out of these songs. Because they are probably at or near your limit in terms of ...well everything. Once in a while you can dip down into easier songs or increase the difficulty and try harder songs but mainly stay with songs that you just cant quite get an A ranking on. I has helped me get through so many walls and roadblocks I couldn't even tell you.
You can also set a goal song. People really underestimate how useful this is. If you find that you really like a song and want to be able to play it one day then set it as your goal to be able to accomplish it. This will keep you inspired and also at the same time tell you what patterns you need to get a lot better at in order to play the song. It also keeps the game fun because you have something to look forward to.
Play people at or around your level of skill. Its no fun playing people that are a lot worse then you or a lot better. Though the latter is in fact a little more fun then the former. If you play people at your level you will always have the drive to do better then them. The competition will be fun and it just keeps the game light and enjoyable for your both.
Contrary to my previous statement, have a teacher. Might sound weird and not a lot of people do this but I have a 'teacher' in this game. Have them always pick the song so you know its going to be hard for you and try to keep up with them. They will most likely win but its not only a good way to get to know what your lacking but also a good way to set songs as your goals.

And yes Jakads is pretty OP. But at the same time so many other players are to :D

P.s. There is a slight score difference between 300/300g the 300 would be lets say 100 pts and the 300g would be about 80 pts. (not exact numbers)
Yyorshire
I'll do my best to answer your questions and fix some of what Shroudborn said (not tryin to be mean just some corrections, other people feel free to correct me if I'm wrong).

First of all, the "sliders" are more popularly called long notes or abbreviated to LNs, though most people would understand what you are talking about if you used the "slider" terminology. For LNs, you have to press the beginning of the note and release at the end of the note, nothing fancy about it. Most players starting out have an issue with these types of notes and continue to have issues even when they begin to "git gud" at the game and develop a hatred for them in general (plz dont hate my babies :( ) As for the best judgement you can get (i.e. a rainbow 300) we call those MAX's and the other 300 we just call 300 (why did they do it this way?). You don't have to hit a note exactly on a perfect frame to get a MAX, you have some leniency. I will use OD 8 as measure of this:

MAX timing window: + - 16.5ms
300 timing window: + - 40.5ms
200 timing window: + - 73.5ms
100 timing window: + - 103.5ms
50 timing window: + - 127.5ms
And a miss is a miss, or a note hit way too early.

As you increase or decrease OD, the timing windows will get tighter or more lenient respectively. The timing windows aren't necessary to know to hit a note correctly, this comes intuitively as you play the game more, so you'll get the hang of it eventually, or you might not at all, like me who sucks at accuracy.

No other mods give bonus pp other than DT currently (please God keep it that way, and remove DT pp). As to how DT amplifies your pp, I'm not sure, but lets just say it's a lot. I think it just takes the star rating of the song you DT'd and calculates it as if it were a normal map (I have no clue). DT does not affect score in any way, nor do the other mods.

First things first, make sure you have BPM scaling/ scroll speed remembering off in the settings. This is located in the gameplay tab in the options, or the 3rd circle looking thing. This will allow you to find a comfortable scroll speed that you can get accustomed to and will greatly help your accuracy. As for tapping speed, my fingers are probably just as fast as your's. The main difference in skill here is reading ability, or the ability to see the patterns that the notes flying down (or up I don't judge) at you are. This comes with getting muscle memory down as you play through patterns on a multitude of different songs. DO NOT "practice the living daylights" out of maps you like or want to get better at. This will lead to mindblocks and you will probably be unable to play that map later on even when you are skilled enough to do so. Instead, focus on improving accuracy on songs and trying new things you have yet to attempt. Everyone improves differently, so find the method that works best for you, but notable methods include: S'ing songs you have A's on, A'ing songs that you have a hard time on, etc.

Goal songs are a great idea, and have been really beneficial in my own improvement at this game. The way I do this is I break up what songs I want to pass in the near future, and songs I want to pass a month or two from now. I've gone so far enough to set ultimate goals for myself to see if I can reach them one day. Point is, this is a great and relatively fun way to improve.

Play with people of all different skill levels. You will probably do most of your playing with people around your skill level, but that doesn't mean you should constrict yourself to this. Playing with higher level players might yield you some great tips at how they have experienced and made progress in the game that you can apply to yourself. Playing with lower level players can lead to some fun times as well, I wouldn't discourage anyone from doing it, as in the end, multiplayer is for the people not the competition in my opinion. You should also make some rivals of some sort like Shroudborn said, the competition between friends is very entertaining and pushes you to do your best.

If you can find someone to coach you, you'll be luckier than most. I've never had a coach, but I can tell you that a great substitute is playing with higher level players like I stated before. Many don't mind answering any questions you have about the game and want to see as many people improve as possible.

Jakads is pretty good ye
Full Tablet

Nyarky wrote:

1- Sliders , how do they work ?

By that i mean , when do i have to press and release to get a 300/300g ? Most of the time , i only get 300/200 and when i'm getting a 300g i feel like i'm either horribly early or late q_q .
You have to press the start of the LN (long note) with the same timing as if it was a regular note; and the note has to be released just when the LN ends.

The correct timing for releasing a note might feel early at first for several reasons:
  1. The time it takes to lift your finger from the keys is usually a bit longer than the time it takes to press the keys with your fingers.
  2. If you have played osu!standard for a while, it might feel unnatural to release buttons at just the right time, since standard encourages releasing sliders late to ensure you get the 300.

To be more precise, you need to fulfill 2 conditions to get the 300g (the numbers are from memory, so they might be slightly off).
  1. Press the beginning of the LN with less than 19.5ms absolute error (20% more lenient than a regular note).
  2. The sum of the absolute error of the press and the release must be less than 38.5ms

    The judgment is given after you release the LN, so when you don't get a 300g, it might give the impression you made a mistake in the release, while the mistake might have been done in the initial press.

Nyarky wrote:

2- Bonus PP with mods

I do know that DT does gives a bonus , but to what extend ? And do we get bonus PP with other mods or are they just here for fun ? (Which is totally fine)
DT gives a bonus mostly according to the increase of star rating, but also gives a bonus from the slight increase of score. If you have 2 ranked maps, one of them, when being playing no-mod, playing exactly the same as the other map with DT, you would get slightly more score in the map with DT than the map being played no-mod by playing exactly the same way, thus earning slightly more pp.

HT changes score according to a simple x0.5 multiplier that is applied to the final score, the pp system just multiplies the score of the play by 2 to calculate the pp the play gives, so there is no inherent advantage/disadvantage when using HT compared to playing no-mod maps that are equally as difficult and with the same star rating.

You could consider maps with DT or HT as completely different maps from their no-mod counterparts. The main advantage DT and HT give for earning pp, is increasing the map pool of ranked maps, giving you more maps that give you relatively high pp values.
Topic Starter
Nyarky
Thanks for all your answers , i'll try to keep everything in mind to improve >:3



Yyorshire wrote:

Playing with higher level players might yield you some great tips
Well i did asked some stuff to Jakads and he was nice enough to answer xd


Full Tablet wrote:

HT changes score according to a simple x0.5 multiplier that is applied to the final score, the pp system just multiplies the score of the play by 2 to calculate the pp the play gives, so there is no inherent advantage/disadvantage when using HT compared to playing no-mod maps that are equally as difficult and with the same star rating.
Maybe i don't understand , but does that mean HT gives the same PP number as a normal would give , just according to it's star number ?
For exemple , if i play a 3.5* map with HT which drops it to 2.8* , it will give the PP for a 2.8* map ? Not less ?
[TAS]
Thank you for your corrections Yyorshire :D

In the end everyone is different I personally like to push my limits all the time so I'm probably not the best person to answer some of these questions lol
Full Tablet

Nyarky wrote:

Maybe i don't understand , but does that mean HT gives the same PP number as a normal would give , just according to it's star number ?
For exemple , if i play a 3.5* map with HT which drops it to 2.8* , it will give the PP for a 2.8* map ? Not less ?
Both would give the same pp.
Bobbias
I want to reinforce something yyorshire said. Do NOT grind plays on maps. Not only can that lead to mindblocks as he said, but when you see improvements on your scores for that song you might think you're actually improving, but all you're actually doing is memorizing that one map. The key to getting better is to practice a wide range of different styles of maps. If it has patterns you hate and are bad at, its probably good practice. The other key to practice is a wide range in difficulty. Playing only stuff you can S will improve your accuracy, but you wont really get any better at harder maps. Playing maps you really struggle with will improve your ability to handle dofficult patterns, but it won't do much for your accuracy.

Also, in case you dont understand the term mindblock, thats when even if you totally know the pattern and should be completely fine playing it, you learned a bad habit or your brain basically refuses to play it correctly. Breaking mindblocks can be very difficult and frustrating so its best to avoid creating them in the first place.
[TAS]
Guess I should clarify what I meant by playing the 'daylights out of' certain maps. What I was trying to say is if you want to improve your speed play a wide variety of songs that you struggle with do not keep playing the same maps. Like said before that will get you into a mindblock.
Topic Starter
Nyarky
Another quick question about global accuracy this time , my current accuracy is 97,56% and sometimes, when i clear a map with a 94% acc , i'll get a +0,08% acc.

And it's what i don't understand , how does it works ? Why do i get + acc when i do less than my global acc and why do i get nothing when i hit a 99,63% acc ?
juankristal

Nyarky wrote:

Another quick question about global accuracy this time , my current accuracy is 97,56% and sometimes, when i clear a map with a 94% acc , i'll get a +0,08% acc.

And it's what i don't understand , how does it works ? Why do i get + acc when i do less than my global acc and why do i get nothing when i hit a 99,63% acc ?
That might be because you are getting a 94% that knocks out a 92% score that you had in another map that was rated around the same level so your overall accuracy got better. It's hard to explain but in general overall accuracy is pretty irrelevant. The same thiing appliies if you score an SS in a 1* map for example, it wont be weighted the same way (or at least I assume thats the case, otherwise it wouldnt make much sense :p).

In any case, feel free to use the osu!mania general discussion (https://osu.ppy.sh/community/forums/topics/388530) or the FAQ thread (https://osu.ppy.sh/community/forums/topics/403431) for future questions!

Have fun o/
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