1. Extra (5.24 stars, 1122 notes)

Bubblun wrote:

From #modreqs doing M4M

SPOILER

00:15:747 (2,1) - I'm looking at the spacing and comparing it to 00:14:947 (1,2) - 2 things I noticed about the first pair I mentioned.
00:15:747 (2,1) - Not only is the flow here bad, the distance is even greater. You could flip the slider so it curves outwards and feeds into 1. flipped slider, distance is kept for piano emphasis.
00:18:147 (3) - Just a suggestion, but I think it'd look better if you added a pattern, or at least curved the slider. A slider this long looks boring to me. It would be a different story however if the map had high SV, but so far the SV isn't high, so I'd make this look better. ok
00:21:347 (3) - Same as above. Another idea I thought of is they could both share the same pattern, or fit into each other some how. copy+paste the other slider i changed
00:30:947 (4,5) - Flow here isn't the best. There is a number of things you could do here, but just please not this! You could blanket 5, or add an anchor point at the end of 4 so it turns back a little. (I'm referring to those sliders that go back on themselves, but are at an angle so they direct the player to another direction and don't break the ranking criteria.) As much as your suggestion makes sense, I personally disagree with it because a. the slider can be held down at the head and still easily get 300 and b. even if you follow the sliderbody, it shows emphasis on the piano, which was my intention.
00:30:947 (4) Also why not add an NC here since it's the start of a new pattern, and you hear a strong beat.
00:31:747 (1) - The flow and distance here isn't consistent with the previous patterns, yet there is no exaggeration. If you press ctrl + g it will fix both the flow and distance at once. as much as i like symmetry you do have a point, fixed
00:44:147 (2) - Although you could probably get away with this, I'd ctrl + g this so you have some circular flow. eh, couldn't hurt
00:46:147 (1) - From the previous 3 notes, you established circular flow, and then go back on that. I'd move 1 to where the stack is, and rotate the other notes so it's even. This is for heavy emphasis on the piano. I like flow that makes players think before they move, if that makes sense.
00:55:547 (4) - You've pointed out the double here by placing a note on top of the slider. Isn't that enough for an NC too? sure i guess
00:57:647 (7) - ^
00:59:247 (7) - ^
01:07:347 (2,1) - This slider points up, but the bad flow might cause the player to miss the stream. You probably don't even have to re-map this part. Some vertical flipping and re=snapping some distance should fix it. Decreased spacing between the 2 sliders to make hitting the stream a bit easier
01:21:947 (1,2) - You have 1 facing outside, while 2 is towards the inside. I'd adjust the last 2 points on 1 so it faces towards 2. If you listen to the vocal, it fades out and in, which is why I made the slider end point opposite, as a sort of emphasis. I don't feel like it would particularly harm flow.
01:22:547 (2,3) - Flow here isn't the best. You could place 3 to the right of 1 and create an even more interesting pattern. Played around with it a bit.
01:24:547 (4,5) - Although this is just a personal suggestion, Maybe turn this into curved red-point sliders. So you can keep them parallel while improving the overall flow. I wouldn't really see hwo that would help flow, honestly.
01:27:747 (5) - This reverse slider ends on a strong beat. I'd remove the reverse and try to fit a circle somewhere on the play field. I disagree as the flow I have set up really doesn't warrant a hit circle.
01:27:747 (5) - If you do add in that hit circle, put an NC and clap hit sound on them as they sound important.
01:28:947 (7) - You could horizontally flip this so it flows into 8 better.
01:31:347 (5) - I hear the beat, so I think that's good enough for an NC. Couldn't hurt
01:33:347 (1) - Snapping problem? Huh?
01:34:547 (5,1) - Remove the NC on 1, and apply NC to 5. (Makes more sense.) Removed 1's NC but didn't apply one to 5 for consistency
01:38:147 (5) - This reverse slider also ends on a strong beat, so I'd remove the reverse and fit a circle in there somewhere. As with the previous suggestion, this messes up other flow and I don't quite like it.
01:39:747 (1,2) - As much as I like this pattern, the flow isn't good, so I'd try to keep a similar style but make sure the sliders feed into each other. I'd do this for a hard, maybe an Insane even, but for an extra, a player knows when they can let go and go to the other slider.
01:51:947 (3) - ctrl + g so it flows into the next note better? While I didn't ctrl+g for the same reason as stated above, i noticed spacing was quite high for no reason and changed that \o/
01:53:347 (5) - Just a suggestion, but since the flow isn't that good here, I have a better idea for this part. Add a reverse to the slider, and delete 6 and place a hit circle instead. This maps the lyrics, while adding flow into the map. Yeah, that'll work
01:56:747 (3) - ctrl + g (same reason as 2 mods above) for consistency purposes and the previous reason, no
01:58:147 (3,4) - The flow from the previous slider isn't good. I'd hate to say to re-map this pattern, but you could see if pressing ctrl + g will work. Maybe? I disagree. In fact, I think it flows fine. If this is brought up again I'll change it, but I feel like the pattern works quite well, and ctrl+g makes it much worse.
02:08:147 (7,1) - Flow here isn't good. ctrl + g (1,2) then (3,4) Improves flow while keeping the same structure.
02:11:747 (1,2) - Turn these into curvedd red-anchor point sliders so they flow into each other better, and add some variety into the map. I don't think it affects the flow positively, in fact I find sliders like that distracting personally; the exact opposite of what I would like. These patterns of 4 sliders are intentionally supposed to test aim instead of reading like some parts of the map do.
02:12:547 (3,4) - ^
02:13:647 (2) - I understand you're mapping to the lyrics here, but this spacing might be too much for a player to read. The player might read this as a 1/2 slider, but if it's closer the player will learn immediately the slider is mapped to the lyrics. (Or 1/4) At 150BPM, this song is definitely slow enough to where a player should be able to tell apart 1/4 from 1/2 especially if they're playing an extra.
02:14:147 (4) - ^
02:24:147 (7) - NC since you have a unique sound here. Fair enough
02:25:747 (4) - ctrl + g for circular flow. I personally disagree with circular flow for this in particular because the patterns of 4 are supposed to be purely symmetrical.
02:26:147 (5) - ctrl + g this if you did the mod above.
02:26:947 (8) - Since this note is after the pause in the lyrics, why not NC? Missed nc. My bad
02:31:747 (3,4) - To improve the flow, you can invert the curves, and ctrl + g. I don't feel like that flow is much better than what's there already.
02:38:347 (4) - Should ctrl + g so it flows into 1 better. One, spacing would be much too high, and second, as stated before, a player who's playing an Extra should be able to tell when to go to the next slider.
02:39:347 (2,3) - Should ctrl + g these sliders so they flow into each other. I prefer it when you have to move your aiming device a bit more, as it emphasizes the vocals.Also, something somethign aesthetic
02:42:947 (3) - ctrl + g for better flow? Makes flow afterward weirder and I'm not a big fan of it.
02:45:347 (1,2) - Curved anchor-point sliders so they flow better. A slight variation in slider shape, at least to me, does not effect flow.
02:49:347 (3,4) - Because of the way flow works, I looked at 4 before I saw 3. (Because sliders generally aim towards the next note, unless the player isn't snapping.) Ctrl + g the pair. Flow isn't objective; but you have a point. Also, it gives me an excuse to use counter-clockwise flow which is pretty fun
02:57:547 (4) - Horizontally flip and re-snap to improve flow. Ugly overlap and makes 02:57:947 (1) - uglier to play, imo.
03:02:947 (1) - ctrl + g or curve this slider so it flows into 2. Done for spacing purposes
03:13:547 (3) - ctrl + g so it flows into the next note better. For consistency, no. Also, keep in mind you don't have to move your mouse to 300 the slider lol.
03:21:147 (2) - Turn into either a straight slider, or invert the curve so it flows into the next note better. That looks awful and feels weird to me.
03:28:547 (1,2) - These notes don't flow very well. I don't know of a way to fix them without re-mapping this section sadly. The patterns of 4 are to test raw aim and reaction to sometimes weird movements (although not all patterns do the latter). I did stack 2 onto 03:27:747 (1) - for aesthetic tho
03:29:347 (3,4) - ctrl + g these sliders so they flow into 1 better. Messes up the flow. CTRL+G'd 4 for symmetry purposes.
03:36:847 (2,3) - ctrl + g each of these notes separately so they're easier to read. Lowered spacing is awkward and inconsistent. This map is not supposed to be a cakewalk easy-peasy to read or aim, and that's intentional.
03:43:247 (2,3) - ^ How is that difficult to read? I've clearly established that the 2nd note will always feed into the first.
05:11:347 (2) - ctrl + g for circular flow.
05:11:347 (2) - Might want to curve this slider so it flows into 3 better.
05:11:747 (3) - I don't hear a triplet, or any need for this reverse, so why not just a simple longer slider so it flows better?If you listen carefully to the vocals, you can tell that there is a slight "distortion" on vocal on the 1/4, but since it's tamer, the anchor isn't as "strong" as 05:24:547 (3) - which is very clear.
05:12:147 (4) - You could however place a reverse slider here so it continues the flow into 1.
05:17:347 (1,2) - Turn these into curved red-point sliders for better flow. I don't like curved red point sliders in this case, but I added a curve as I thought it looked quite pleasant.
05:18:147 (3,4) - ^
05:19:547 (3) - Nothing is being held here, so a simple hit circle will do. Yes there is..?
05:23:747 (1,2) - Turn into curved anchor-point sliders for better flow. Disagree, flow really isn't made better by slight variation of slider shapes in my eyes.

Kanye wrote:

Hi!

M4M from your queue. Sorry I'm late, had a LOT on recently.

[General]

All seems good!

[Extra]

(*) 00:13:347 (1,2) - Could you blanket these a little better? Maybe rotate (1) a bit anticlockwise. fixed
(*) Why have you gone from NC every 2 stanza to NC every stanza here 00:13:347 (1,2,1) - . It may be better to keep it consistent, and just NC on the second stanza here. Or you can just NC every stanza previously. (Every large white tick) Piano emphasis. The piano noise that I NC'd is unique for that section.
(*) 00:16:947 (2,3) - Could probably blanket this a bit better. k
(*) 00:39:947 (2,3,4) - Reduce this DS, way too big, and you've also used a much smaller DS here 00:46:347 (2,3,4) - for the same sound? fixed
(*) 00:50:147 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - The sound here is similar to previously at 00:49:347 (1,2,3) - but your DS is significantly higher? Maybe keep (1 - 4) a lower DS and increase for 00:50:947 (5,6,7) - since it is "louder" Played with it.
(*) 00:54:147 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,1) - I don't think it's a good idea to overlap this, makes it really confusing. This is intentional. Maps don't always have to be sightreadable. The NC on 00:54:747 (1) - also makes it much easier to read.
(*) If you follow this then remove NC at 00:54:747 (1) -
(*) 00:55:647 (1) - You wanna NC every stanza, so remove the NC here and the combo should run to 9. You've done this throughout this section so I suggest going through and fixing it. Since there is no change in SV or any large DS change it's fine to leave NCs every stanza (Large white tick). Will change if mentioned again, but I prefer it as this
(*) 01:20:347 (1,2,1) - Same as before
(*) 01:21:947 (1) - You've under mapping a note here, shorten the slider by 1/2, and remove NC on this slider and NC the next note. Vocal mapping.
(*) 01:28:347 (6) - Same here
(*) Same thing keeps recurring.
(*) 01:41:747 (2) - Stack this on the tail of 01:40:947 (5) - okay.
(*) 01:59:547 (5) - I never really like sliders on red ticks, it doesn't sound right most of the time. Here it doesn't fit, maybe replace with a circle then a 1/2 slider instead. Same thing goes for a couple others. There's vocal there. I'm mapping to the vocals. The vocal is 1/1. It DOES fit. Objectively, even.
(*) 02:05:347 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - DS should be consistent here, no need for the jumps. There IS need for the jumps. You can hear buildup intensifying. However, i did slightly lower DS for buildup consistency
(*) 02:48:347 (1) - Stack on tail of 02:47:747 (3) - Both 02:48:147 (4,1) - are stacked on the direct middle of sliders.
(*) 02:59:147 (4) - Either stack on (2) or blanket (2) around this Aight
(*) 03:00:747 (4) - Stack on the slider previously Aight
(*) 03:12:147 (4) - Stack on top of (2) or move it off. Aight
(*) Okayyy lot's of stacking issues, try run through the map and just look visually if there are any stacks that don't look good, and try fix them up.
(*) 03:27:747 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,1) - Definitely not okay, the spacing between (1 - 5) is okay, but the spacing of (1 2 1) is waaay to big, and especially since this is stacked on top of the burst it is impossible to sight read. Decreased spacing.
(*) 03:29:749 (4) - Object isn't snapped. Damn lol
(*) 03:53:947 (1,2,1) - Seems to be a lot of these. I get what the idea is, and it's cool, but in reality it'll be impossible to sight read, unless you've a god at ar9. After the first instance (or maybe the 2nd) of this pattern, the player SHOULD be able to tell when this pattern will occur. They might have to restart within the first minute, but other than that they should be able to understand when this pattern will occur (by listening to the first burst they should be able to react fast enough).
(*) 04:26:047 (1) - I'm not sure an 1/8 kick slider fits here, there's not really any beat here to need this. I suggest just removing it. Yeah I agree with that
(*) 05:04:547 (1,1) - etc. you don't need to leave a gap in between these, just map the ends to 1/8 and it should be okay. Aight. Might change this back depending on how well it is received

Well that's all from me, I know I've missed quite a lot but most of the issues lie with the stacking and NC. There's also that triple/5 note burst stacking issue which I think definitely needs to be fixed. Overall a pretty solid map to start with, you'll need some tuning to do to get it up to par, but it has potential definitely. If you have any questions fee free to PM me, good luck!

FailureAtOsu wrote:

You assume a player who's playing an extra doesn't know how to assume what is going to happen, AND that all maps should be sightreadable. Both of those claims are pretty damn insulting.

Kanye wrote:

FailureAtOsu wrote:

You assume a player who's playing an extra doesn't know how to assume what is going to happen, AND that all maps should be sightreadable. Both of those claims are pretty damn insulting.

I'm not saying players won't know what's gonna happen, but it's safer to assume they won't. Fair enough though, but I do suggest if you keep that same pattern, at least decrease the spacing of the triple, since going from such a small spacing to the lager spacing might be difficult to aim consistently, but it's up to you, just my opinion lol

Realazy wrote:

m4m part 2

[General]

SeemsGood

[Extra]

00:03:747 - why did you decide to not apply hitsounds until 50 seconds later? some basic whistles would've sounded nice didn't hs very intro but hs'd part after
00:50:147 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - i assume this is not what you were going for but why not make this a proper star pattern? good idea
00:56:347 (5) - maybe reverse it horizontally to make it go in the same way as 00:56:147 (4) - since the sound is the same nah, the problem with doing this is that it makes flow look weirder than it is imo, as well as the fact that the sounds don't seem to be the same on some of those examples o_e
00:57:947 (5) - ^
00:59:547 (5) - ^
01:02:747 (5) - ^ etc you get the point
01:00:347 (4,1,2,3) - increase the spacing between those sliders as the pitch goes higher than usual done
01:06:147 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - i think you should keep the same rhythm as before here to emphasize the change in rhythm after 01:06:947 (1,2) - okay
01:10:947 - and here you should stick to the second rhythm you used as there's nothing that calls for it nor the spacing change here 01:11:347 (5,6,7,1) - okay
01:45:347 (1) - a slower slider would probably fit well with the sudden break in the music that's what the weird slider shape is for
02:23:147 (3,4,5) - why not start following the doubles now? gotta force PP in there somehow!(jk fixed)
02:37:347 - why did you stop stacking on previous notes on this part? while i had a reason originally mapping it i've since forgot it, so fixed
03:02:147 - same as 01:45:347 (1) -
03:20:147 (7,4) - missing claps? crap
03:54:147 - same as 00:03:747 - even more so that you're already 4 minutes in problem here is that i feel the kick is too strong for this slow part, the clap is FAR too strong, and most peoples' default finish is too strong as well. therefore, i chose not to hs this part (if i learn how maybe I'll keysound it but that's very unlikely)
04:03:747 (1) - move it a bit to make it point towards (2) fixed a bit
04:16:547 (1) - ^
05:21:747 (8) - missing clap? damn it i thought i got all of these already!!
05:27:147 (2) - why not stack it on (5)'s tail couldn't hurt
05:52:547 (1) - ^ on (3) ^

really solid map, gl

FailureAtOsu wrote:

03:54:147 - same as 00:03:747 - even more so that you're already 4 minutes in problem here is that i feel the kick is too strong for this slow part, the clap is FAR too strong, and most peoples' default finish is too strong as well. therefore, i chose not to hs this part (if i learn how maybe I'll keysound it but that's very unlikely)