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3L - Macrophylla Parasol

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Scub

pimpG wrote:

to make my hitsounds consistent and nicer.
slider tick rate 4 is as rankable as slider tick rate 3 2 or 1 anyway.
so basically you're completely ignoring the entire gameplay aspect of slider tick rates and only focus on getting good hitsounds on the map? I think you're kinda missing the point that hitsounds are made to give feedback to a player, not making the map sound better in the editor. Besides you do know that most people disable beatmap hitsounds anyways right, so any effort you make in justifying the tick rate would be redundant once the map gets qualified, not even pointing out a majority of players that would complain about the slider tick rate just for you to tell them to "justify" them using empty points?

oh and also slider tick rate 2 sounds no different, as 1/4 slider ticks almost make no sound, so why not use that if you still insist on using these hitsounds? I'm sure players and modders will appreciate this as well.
Topic Starter
pimp
my map is fine the way it is, already explained all of this before and I'm not going to explain everything again.
if you read the thread and are still not going to respect my decisions, then there is nothing I can do for you.
if my map doesn't meets your needs I kindly suggest you to find other map.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

updated.
changed some things following TheKingHenry's suggestions.
TheKingHenry

pimpG wrote:

updated.
changed some things following TheKingHenry's suggestions.
This means about the following (all in addition to the things already changed before with my previous checks with the mapper):
  1. Discussed the messy NCing in the flute solo, most of it stays as is due to what mapper intended.
  2. Applied changes to the doubles in the kiais, creating progression from more lenient patterns to more difficult.
  3. Discussed the slidertick hitsound usage, mainly basing on what was my 1. point in last mod post, and thus changed the couple sliders that were utilizing slidertick hitsounds to create feedback of a different rhythm than the pattern itself. Didn't tackle on similar usage when it was practically unnoticeable to the player.
  4. Some minor things other than these
Since this had some heated discussion here before, I'll leave this open for couple days if someone wants to add/ask about something that they think should be addressed.
Aeril
i thought muting slider ticks and slider slide at the same time was illegal zzz... if im not wrong doesnt that happen multiple times or i may just have hitsound volume too low, nothing against the hitsounds just dont want dq/pop for dumb reason
Topic Starter
pimp
maybe you have the old version of the map?

I don't have muted sliderslide files anymore. i used green lines in a way that it only affects the ticks, not the slide sound. you can check that by reducing the song volume in the editor and keeping the effects volume loud.

glad you are interested in my map :)
edit: since you mentioned, i decided to check them one more time, and looks like i forgot to adjust the volume for the parts I changed from TKHenry's suggestions. also found a few wrong volume changes.

should be fine now, thanks.
TheKingHenry
Allright here we go
Xinnoh
Greetings
You should probably delete this file

Mir
omar is a shithead.mp3
Shiguma
How does that even happen lmao
Topic Starter
pimp
@TheKingHenry

I am really sorry about this. someone asked me to edit this mp3 a few days ago and somehow I managed to drop in the map folder :cry:

updated


edit: I'll include my wip osuka map in this post to help clearing my name xD: https://osu.ppy.sh/s/693956
Bonsai
yo very cool map, but what's the timing seciton at 00:57:863 for?
bc if it's for resetting the Nightcore-stuff, you'd also need sections at 04:32:408 and 04:37:863 right

also why did you set all the unnecessary sliderticks to inaudibly low volume instead of just using a silent wav for those, aren't you using different samplesets for the hitsounded ticks anyways?
also, a random find, around 01:31:613 there's a lot of lines that don't do anything so the unnecessary sliderticks are actually audible here, is that intentional? :?:
tbh at this point I'm questioning how meaningful that metronome-hitsounding is when it's not there to enhance gameplay but just adds penetrative noises to a well-crafted song, I mean why even add it in the first place, but sure lol I'm not here to make a big deal out of it ^^
Topic Starter
pimp

Bonsai wrote:

yo very cool map, but what's the timing seciton at 00:57:863 for?
bc if it's for resetting the Nightcore-stuff, you'd also need sections at 04:32:408 and 04:37:863 right (lol yes, nightcore, finally someone who "speaks my language". it's funny because i always check this when i'm requested for timing checks, but i didn't checked my own map completely, i'm hopeless Q.Q)

also why did you set all the unnecessary sliderticks to inaudibly low volume instead of just using a silent wav for those, aren't you using different samplesets for the hitsounded ticks anyways? (I used to have them silenced with muted files but people complained and I made it that way)
also, a random find, around 01:31:613 there's a lot of lines that don't do anything so the unnecessary sliderticks are actually audible here, is that intentional? :?: (yes those are intentional. i had a very complex hitsounding in the slider ticks a few weeks ago but i decided to roll back to simpler one. still kept one or two parts with audible ticks, since this part is very loud. i think it sounds nice and the volume is not too loud, so it won't sound random imo.)
tbh at this point I'm questioning how meaningful that metronome-hitsounding is when it's not there to enhance gameplay but just adds penetrative noises to a well-crafted song, I mean why even add it in the first place, but sure lol I'm not here to make a big deal out of it ^^ (metronome hitsounding is like the most used hitsound patterning we see in this game, that's because unlike the other rhythm games, we don't have specific audio files for every single hit object. the thing is that i needed to do this metronome hitsounding on sliderticks too since my mapping is not a generic 1/1 1/2 spam).
i believe you will agree with me with this since i saw you ranting about generic mapping recently, somewhere.. xD
the lines are going to be added, thanks :)
Scub

pimpG wrote:

my map is fine the way it is, already explained all of this before and I'm not going to explain everything again.
if you read the thread and are still not going to respect my decisions, then there is nothing I can do for you.
if my map doesn't meets your needs I kindly suggest you to find other map.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

updated.
changed some things following TheKingHenry's suggestions.
I know it's fine but it's really just a bizarre choice to do. Either way I won't delve into it any further since eh it's not worth it
TheKingHenry
For some reason I haven't been able to get this mapset to work in osu! anymore since couple last updates (read = opening in osu! it just disappears) so if someone wants to take over they're free to do so atleast from my part. Well, I'll still obviously try some things to get stuff to work again though. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
TheKingHenry
Finally got it to work so here I am. Let's try again
bossandy
This one should to go!
Topic Starter
pimp
should be done soon 8-)
Xinnoh
just noticed but your sb needs epilepsy warning

yes, it doesn't look like that much when you look at it from the editor, but kiai also flashes in gameplay when it starts. combine those two together and it spooked me too much. please fix that.
Topic Starter
pimp
not necessary since the combo colors i use are mostly dark, so the kiai effects are minimal
the sb pulse itself is not as bright and constant as the ones from storyboards that needs epilepsy warning

seems to be personal opinion too, since noboby suggested this so far iirc. also nobody suggested this for xxheroxx's map, that uses the same storyboard as i'm using t/89121 (and yes, the epilepsy warning existed 6 years ago / hero gave me permission to use his sb)

will discuss this with the next nominator anyway
Net0
E ai pimpG o/
Converte failsound.mp3 pra .wav usa o epilepsy warning. Por favor evita confusão com o pessoal, realmente não vale a pena, só ativa isso. É melhor pecar pelo excesso de zelo e cuidado do que com a falta. No mais o mapa tá pronto pra ir pra frente.

o.O
Topic Starter
pimp
failsound é mp3 por padrão na default skin template
Net0
Okay one last thing;
04:32:181 (1,2) - I don't quite understand why the new combo here is not on the main downbeat transition when in all other chorus sections it was; 01:56:044 (1) - /03:30:590 (1) - . In my opinion this pattern work together 04:30:590 (1,2,3,4,1) - and this is the main transition 04:32:408 (2) -
Topic Starter
pimp
the way you map affects the way you want/can use new combos, it's no different with symmetry.

so it's:



VS



my version is more appropriate for symmetry than the suggestion.
also the 3rd kiai starts/ends differently than the other two kiai, they don't have that slow down, and this slow down ends after the kiai stars for the previous two, just compare 01:55:363 (3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5) - to 04:29:908 (3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - .

04:32:181 - this is the spot where the slow down ends, it has a louder sound than the previous four objects, sounds much closer to the intensity level of the next objects, i also don't see a problem with not having a new combo on a main beat, the player doesn't pay attention to these things when playing unless the new combo usage is too unreasonable.
Net0

pimpG wrote:

the way you map affects the way you want/can use new combos, it's no different with symmetry.

my version is more appropriate for symmetry than the suggestion.
It only shows you didn't plan the symmetry properlly with the rhythm here 04:30:590 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3) - if you wanted it to have the triangle with only one combo, it's inconsistent and doesn't make much sense to me :/
also the 3rd kiai starts/ends differently than the other two kia It might end differently but starts in the same way compared to the previous, just need to check this 03:29:908 (1,2,3,1) - i, they don't have that slow down, and this slow down ends after the kiai stars for the previous two, just compare 01:55:363 (3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5) - to 04:29:908 (3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - . You're making a comparision of the first chorus with the third, I'm just taking into consideration how the rhythm of the second chorus starts in the same way as the third

04:32:181 - this is the spot where the slow down ends, it has a louder sound than the previous four objects, sounds much closer to the intensity level of the next objects, i also don't see a problem with not having a new combo on a main beat, the player doesn't pay attention to these things when playing unless the new combo usage is too unreasonable.The main transition is still the sound here 04:32:408 (2) - not 04:32:181 (1) - . Indeed there's a distinction of 04:32:181 (1) - compared to the other 1/1 red ticks circles before 04:30:817 (2,3,4) - , but that distinction is nothing compared to the actual start of the chorus here 04:32:408 (2) - , it's applying NC idea for a small transition and not in a major one. I really recommend you re-consider another symmetric idea here 04:30:590 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3) - so that it can allow you to NC 04:32:408 (2) -
Seto Kousuke

pimpG wrote:

the way you map affects the way you want/can use new combos, it's no different with symmetry.
I'm sorry, but yes, it is indeed different...this is a rythm game, not a visual art game~ Additionally, your arguments do not follow your map, because if that was indeed a true and valid reason, not just a stubborn decision, you would have done the same in many other places, for example 02:01:726 (6,7,8,9,1,2,3,4,5) - the (9) is in the middle of a pattern of 1/4 notes, this is not "symmetricall" as you imply, they should've been the same combo with a NC at 02:01:726 (6) - . So if your reasoning is indeed a "valid" point, rework the entire NC of the map to show this is the theme of the map, not just one random section.

Additionally, this is the worst thing you could ever say about a NC :

pimpG wrote:

the player doesn't pay attention to these things when playing unless the new combo usage is too unreasonable.
I don't know if you actually play this game besides mapping, but the reading is part of the rythm of the player, the NCs tells a LOT about the rythm and the intensities, if you place a NC the way you did, you're implying there is intensity on that note, but there is not, it's clearly not the strong sound of the kiai. That can actually make the rythm confusing for some people and even remove a lot of the ''feel'' of the map...so yeah, you're wrong, the player DOES pay attention to NC

If I offended you in any moment, that's not my intention, but please try to understand my points ^^"
Topic Starter
pimp
Mekki
I found a way the comboing would represent the patterns/song really well.



This way you can keep the comboing you want and the intensity of the kiai would be well represented (the triplet clearly provides an great emphasys). And of course, keeping the triplet on the same combo section would be the best thing to do as this 04:32:181 beat would come along with this one 04:32:408~

I hope the explanations made sense somehow, comboing in my view is something really subjective and considering the different kiai entry there, it feels absolutely fine.
----------------------------------//----------------------------------------
And allow me to speak some portuguese here real quick so I can explain myself better:

Amore, Net0 e Seto, mesmo se ele quisesse deixar do jeito q tá agora, acho q n teria tanto problema considerando que a batida que está aqui 04:32:181 (1) - já faz parte do kiai imo, e faz parte dessa ordem de combo como um tudo. Não acho que a simetria foi mal usada nessa parte, o movimento feito pelo cursor do (1) pro (2) deixa a enfase no (2) onde a batida eh mais forte bem óbvio, e o combo está desse jeito pelo motivo q expliquei acima, a batida está entre o chorus already e faz parte da pattern simetrica como um todo~ Subjetividade
----------------------------------//----------------------------------------

Seto Kousuke wrote:

I don't know if you actually play this game besides mapping, but the reading is part of the rythm of the player, the NCs tells a LOT about the rythm and the intensities, if you place a NC the way you did, you're implying there is intensity on that note, but there is not, it's clearly not the strong sound of the kiai. That can actually make the rythm confusing for some people and even remove a lot of the ''feel'' of the map.
the player DOES pay attention to NC
And in addition to that you said, the way he kept this NC is not confusing at all. The song intensity is different than 04:31:726 (4) - so there's no reason to keep on the same combo pattern of it. And as I told before, is also different than all the other kiai entrances. I don't approve the idea that strong beats needs ALWAYS to be represented with an NC, he wanted to represent the song section as a whole there, this is not confusing and it is absolutely fine in my view.
Net0
All right, if you guys want to give it a try with this combo idea, I won't force a modification on it. If there's no other points or concerns @pimpG feel free to poke me :>
Topic Starter
pimp
@MkGuh i honestly like your suggestion, but it's too different from my original idea so i would rather keep D:

as for the other mod, what mkguh said is very accurate so i make his words mine.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

bossandy told me to fix some weird breaks, he also replaced a hitsound with a small delay, and we discussed the same new combo as before, but no change on the combo we are fine with it.
readded two taikosu tick sounds, but using half volume of normal notes
i also silenced some slider ticks that don't have custom hitsounds (the ones Bonsai mentioned last time)
Darcsol improved the quality of my background image
source changed to "東方風神録 ~ Mountain of Faith." as suggested by Regraz
Net0
Okay, let's give it a go!
Andrea
Did some IRC Modding with pimp.

We removed 3 storyboarded hitsounds that might confuse players at 01:15:590 - 02:49:681 - and 02:59:113 - (replaced them with actual clickable objects), plus fixed a perfect stack at 02:45:817 (3,4) -.

Rest seems clean to me, good job!

Re-Bubbled~
UndeadCapulet
hang on a sec

tick rate 4 is very unfitting for reasons 224318 bn's/qat's have already mentioned, and as you've said you're only using it for slidertick hitsounds, you should switch to using sliderslide samples for the few times you need it since that's a rankable option now
Topic Starter
pimp
i had them before as sliderslide and they don't behave the same way as slider ticks, sometimes the sliderslide don't have enough time to play the hitsound completely because it has to change sample or volume shortly after it starts.
UndeadCapulet
we spoke a bit in pm, tbh i kinda just thought the option was forgotten about after the 7month hiatus ^^' pimpg's reasoning for not switching is reasonable for me

personally still think the tick rate 4 isn't a good design choice, but i'm prob the last person that should be judging someone for poor design choices, so gimme a sec to run through the map and i'll rebubble
UndeadCapulet
ok sec's up sorry for the interruption
Net0
Imagine a forum that you can send a custom msg to rank maps :O
tatatat
hi
Mordred
#bringbackiconposts
Trynna
hey, i can say gratz in v1!!!
gratz~
UndeadCapulet

Mordred wrote:

#bringbackiconposts
Kuron-kun
blob
Andrea
Congrats pimp! I'm glad everything got solved :)
Azu
nice
Ideal
ae pimpo boa
bossandy
Best qualification in 2K18
It is a really tough time but finally we made it
Biggest congrats to pimpG guys!
I am crying now
Ascendance

UndeadCapulet wrote:

Mordred wrote:

#bringbackiconposts
hypercyte

Ascendance wrote:

UndeadCapulet wrote:

Mordred wrote:

#bringbackiconposts
Topic Starter
pimp
yeah i'll miss the icons too ^^

this is my last map that survived v2 migration so i'm happy i managed to make it ranked :)

thank you everyone for your motivation, stars, mods and feedback 8-)
Aurele
congratsss!!
Uta
yeayyy! congrats~
Topic Starter
pimp
thank you 8-)
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