I was wondering if anyone had any experience with mechanical keyboards and whether they improved because of them? I know most good standard players use them but I've never heard of any mania players using them.
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Is it worth getting a mechanical keyboard?
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Topic Starter
It's worth it if you consider it worth it. I find browns to work really well in mania.
If you're going mechanical, anything but blues. Try to avoid blacks if you don't want something stiff enough to drain your stamina too quickly. For people who "bounce" their taps, meaning they completely remove their finger from the button before pressing again, reds are the way to go. For people who keep their fingers relaxed on the keys most the time, they might not like how reds have no tactile feel and also accidentally press the key, so they might rather browns.
But in all honesty, you'll grow used to what ever you use. I personally press my key all the way to the bottom every time, doing that with a mechanical keyboard will result in unnecessary travel distance. So how things are now, I would rather a low-profile gel dome keyboard or a chiclet keyboard. I really want to try 30g-40g topres though.
But see, this is mostly due to the fact that I've been playing with stuff most the time, I'd be thinking differently if it were not the case.
If we're talking upgrading hardware to affect your skill, upgrade your monitor to 120hz+. Now THAT's a noticeable difference :p
But in all honesty, you'll grow used to what ever you use. I personally press my key all the way to the bottom every time, doing that with a mechanical keyboard will result in unnecessary travel distance. So how things are now, I would rather a low-profile gel dome keyboard or a chiclet keyboard. I really want to try 30g-40g topres though.
But see, this is mostly due to the fact that I've been playing with stuff most the time, I'd be thinking differently if it were not the case.
If we're talking upgrading hardware to affect your skill, upgrade your monitor to 120hz+. Now THAT's a noticeable difference :p
Again uniformed people hating on blacks... zzzzzzzzzzz
Topic Starter
Thanks for the help, there's a £35 keyboard with red switches that I've seen on amazon, I might buy that, at least if it isn't any good I wont be losing much
If I could I would.Drace wrote:
If we're talking upgrading hardware to affect your skill, upgrade your monitor to 120hz+. Now THAT's a noticeable difference :p
lol there was a condition in my statement btw, wasn't bashing the blacks or anything. Personally I much rather 30g-40g over the massive 60g blacks need. But that force means it springs back much faster, so if you have the strength and stamina, blacks may be the best for jack hammers :p
anytime ^^milky228 wrote:
Thanks for the help, there's a £35 keyboard with red switches that I've seen on amazon, I might buy that, at least if it isn't any good I wont be losing much
I'm using low profile dome keys (scissor switches on a laptop). I hate it. You are forced to hit the key hard to make sure it actually activates because if you hit off to the side you can actually press the key without actuating the dome. If you ever see me typo in chat missing an L, that's what happened. The other thing is that because you have to hit so hard, it's harder on your fingers because you're bottoming out every time.Drace wrote:
So how things are now, I would rather a low-profile gel dome keyboard or a chiclet keyboard. I really want to try 30g-40g topres though.
I haven't had a chance to actually play with any mechanical keyboards, but I definitely want to find a way to test out some topres; those things sound really cool.
I have a low profile dome keyboard, a laptop with scissor switches as well as a mechanical keyboard. The difference between all 3 is huge. With the worst being the low profile dome keyboard... my old keyboard... the keys measure over 80g on some, and differ by up to 30g between different keys, they get stuck etc... overall really really crappy.Bobbias wrote:
I'm using low profile dome keys (scissor switches on a laptop). I hate it. You are forced to hit the key hard to make sure it actually activates because if you hit off to the side you can actually press the key without actuating the dome. If you ever see me typo in chat missing an L, that's what happened. The other thing is that because you have to hit so hard, it's harder on your fingers because you're bottoming out every time.
If you want to press keys faster, you should pick a key switch that bounce back quicker.
Get a cherry mx sample kit if you want to try on different mechanical switches before you spend on a pricy keyboard
Get a cherry mx sample kit if you want to try on different mechanical switches before you spend on a pricy keyboard
Well the quality of the keyboard does indeed matter. I've never had any problems with mine, activation forces are all equal and i can just press the corner of any key with my nail and it registers just fine. But mine was a bit on the pricey side. I got an old IBM mechanical keyboard somewhere but that thing had a rough life and is too beat-up to be of any use haha
It's very true that they all fell very different. But as long that your keyboard is of good quality, I don't believe "upgrading" to mechanical will have any effect on your skill.
It's very true that they all fell very different. But as long that your keyboard is of good quality, I don't believe "upgrading" to mechanical will have any effect on your skill.
Mechanical keyboards will have more of an effect on your consistency and stamina. If you're not very good at the game, a mechanical keyboard will not make you any better.
That being said: I have an IRL friend who is a top player in FFR, and he has all 4 of the main switch types. He personally told me that Brown switches are the best for this type of game, as the the lightness greatly helps with stamina while the subtle tactile bump makes accuracy feel more consistent than Reds.
That being said: I have an IRL friend who is a top player in FFR, and he has all 4 of the main switch types. He personally told me that Brown switches are the best for this type of game, as the the lightness greatly helps with stamina while the subtle tactile bump makes accuracy feel more consistent than Reds.
Topic Starter
My keyboard has started to become quite faulty (space bar requires far to much force and z,v and b have to be hit right in the centre to register) So I've just purchased a CM Storm Quickfire TK Red. I get the feeling that I would've been better off with brown switches but they were £10 more and I was already over budget.
Thanks for all your help, now I just can't wait for it to arrive.
Thanks for all your help, now I just can't wait for it to arrive.
I think reds are preferred over brown, but there shouldn't be much of a difference between them, so don't worry, they'll be great.
I want to try brown aswell because of the accuracy feeling yaymii mentioned but i got red switches at the moment and its still a great feeling to play on it because everything feels like so soft and playing quick note series just looks tiring anymore but playing itself feels very relaxed 
Here are some force charts. You can clearly see the difference in brows vs blacks and reds. Blacks and Browns both start off at just under 40 cN, Blacks quickly reach 60 cN of force required by the operating point, and bottom out just over 80. Browns have a tactile bump which requires what looks like about 55 cN to pass over with the actuation point at 45 and a bottom out at 60. The bump on browns means that even though the "actuation point" is 45 cN, it actually requires more force than that to reach the actuation point, Reds are clearly the easiest keys to press, beginning around 35 cN with an actuation pressure of 45 cN, and a bottom out at 60. Even though the actuation point for Browns and Reds are both listed as 45 cN, Reds will take less overall pressure to reach the actuation point, which is good for hovering right over the activation point for ultra+fast presses and will likely require less stamina when playing difficult stuff.
for mania, i'd say so. a lot of rubberdome keyboards can't even do 7 keys at a time. look out for No-key rollover (NKR) when buying a mechanical keyboard.
also, what switches you will like depend very much on how you type and how much you are willing to put up with noise, if you can, try them out in person.
i reccomend a Filco majestouch 2. blues or browns. they're generally what most people would consider to be the best build quality for the price, and it really shows. don't try buying really cheap mechanical keyboards because they'll be crap. unless you nag a model M at a dump or something.
also, what switches you will like depend very much on how you type and how much you are willing to put up with noise, if you can, try them out in person.
i reccomend a Filco majestouch 2. blues or browns. they're generally what most people would consider to be the best build quality for the price, and it really shows. don't try buying really cheap mechanical keyboards because they'll be crap. unless you nag a model M at a dump or something.
KRO has nothing to do with the type of keys it uses, it's a hardware limitation on the USB side. Lately I've been seeing keyboards that support NKRO through USB but the roundabout processing they use to achieve this results in a pretty meaningful input lag. 6KRO usually got like 2-4ms lag while NKRO goes up to 8ms-10ms. PS/2 keyboards are mostly NKRO and got virtually no input lag since the data doesn't have to be processed by the USB drivers.Flubbernugget- wrote:
for mania, i'd say so. a lot of rubberdome keyboards can't even do 7 keys at a time. look out for No-key rollover (NKR) when buying a mechanical keyboard.
also, what switches you will like depend very much on how you type and how much you are willing to put up with noise, if you can, try them out in person.
i reccomend a Filco majestouch 2. blues or browns. they're generally what most people would consider to be the best build quality for the price, and it really shows. don't try buying really cheap mechanical keyboards because they'll be crap. unless you nag a model M at a dump or something.
Interesting, I'd wondered if there were any downsides to the weird crap they do for NKRO over USB.Drace wrote:
KRO has nothing to do with the type of keys it uses, it's a hardware limitation on the USB side. Lately I've been seeing keyboards that support NKRO through USB but the roundabout processing they use to achieve this results in a pretty meaningful input lag. 6KRO usually got like 2-4ms lag while NKRO goes up to 8ms-10ms. PS/2 keyboards are mostly NKRO and got virtually no input lag since the data doesn't have to be processed by the USB drivers.
As far as I know, many >6KRO USB keyboards are simply detected as multiple keyboards in Windows to achieve their KRO, which shouldn't be causing any extra input lag (and the only downside for a USB NKRO is the fact it uses a polling rate rather than an interrupt system like PS/2 uses, resulting from 8ms to 1ms delay depending on the keyboard).
I have Blue switches atm (CM QuickFire Rapid); not sure how they compare to other switches, but I find them alright. I'm not great at mania at all though, and not the best at Standard or Taiko either, so idk how meaningful my feedback is even lol
I came from an IBM Model M keyboard... the force needed on those keys was pretty extreme, but fun to get used to. Came from a Saitek Eclipse rubber dome keyboard prior to that which worked very nicely for years (not sure on rollover).
I came from an IBM Model M keyboard... the force needed on those keys was pretty extreme, but fun to get used to. Came from a Saitek Eclipse rubber dome keyboard prior to that which worked very nicely for years (not sure on rollover).
I wouldn't be surprised if they have a USB controller acting like a hub in order to have multiple USB devices appearing over the same cord, which very well could increase the delay, depending on the exact implementation.YayMii wrote:
As far as I know, many >6KRO USB keyboards are simply detected as multiple keyboards in Windows to achieve their KRO, which shouldn't be causing any extra input lag (and the only downside for a USB NKRO is the fact it uses a polling rate rather than an interrupt system like PS/2 uses, resulting from 8ms to 1ms delay depending on the keyboard).