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Accuracy Meter Showing Min-Current-Max %

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This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +72
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
Oinari-sama
Keywords: Accuracy, Meter, Min, Max, %

[Updated 2014-03-29]

To make it easier to read (since not everyone will read through the whole thread), I have updated the OP with an alternative proposal based on the discussions in this thread. Thanks to everyone who participated in the discussions so far!

To summarise, the revised request focus on having the Max Accuracy info displayed in addition to Current Accuracy during the break like this:



The Max Accuracy may be displayed at all times for spectators.

The original request can be found below.

========================================================================
There has been a few Request recently regarding displaying in game accuracy, either going up from 0% or deducing from 100% downwards. This idea I'm proposing started as a reply in another thread. The aim is to better help those who wants to know "how well I'm doing," "what is the best % I can get even if I 300 everything from this point on" etc. I've taken the advice to make a new thread and gather the community's opinion on this.

Quotes from the other thread, where this idea started

Kyou-kun wrote:

Uhh, yeah, you will know if you're on an A run. If your accuracy goes to roughly 93%, it's probably an A, unless you got a bunch of 50s or misses. I want it for when I'm, for example, trying to beat a 97.13% accuracy play, so when my accuracy goes down to, for example, 96.58%, I know to retry.

How far into the song you are won't matter at all with my suggestion. Obviously it would matter for score, but the solution to that would be to ask for a pace predictor that assumes all of your future hits will be 300s. While that type of pace predictor would be optimal in theory, it would be a hassle to keep track of 7-9 digits while playing, which is why I suggested an accuracy pace predictor following the same principles instead.

Oinari-sama wrote:

You know, after seeing all those accuracy related request in the past few weeks, I kinda wish that osu can display accuracy in a meter like this:





The values above were made up, I wanted to spend time on photoshop rather than going through the maths.

So instead of a single accuracy, osu now has to calculate 3 values simultaneously at any given time. Max is obviously the best accuracy a player can get if he gets only 300 from this point on, while Min is the worst accuracy he can get if he misses everything (assuming fail does not kick in) till the end of the map. Current Accuracy (the one we have now) is displayed in the middle. This should (more or less) cater for those who wanted accuracy calculations going up from 0 or down from 100.

This is just a fancy wish from me rather than a real request though, because I can foresee the effort required to make this happen while there are more urgent things for peppy to do. But who knows, I'll just leave the idea here and see if miracle happens. ;)

Winshley wrote:

Oinari-sama wrote:

So instead of a single accuracy, osu now has to calculate 3 values simultaneously at any given time. Max is obviously the best accuracy a player can get if he gets only 300 from this point on, while Min is the worst accuracy he can get if he misses everything (assuming fail does not kick in) till the end of the map. Current Accuracy (the one we have now) is displayed in the middle. This should (more or less) cater for those who wanted accuracy calculations going up from 0 or down from 100.
Current Accuracy: ((300*a)+(100*b)+(50*c)) / (300*(a+b+c+d)) = (6a+2b+c) / (6*(a+b+c+d))
Maximum Accuracy: ((300*x)-(200*b)-(250*c)-(300*d)) / (300*x) = (6x-4b-5c-6d) / (6x)
Minimum Accuracy: ((300*a)+(100*b)+(50*c)) / (300*x) = (6a+2b+c) / (6x)

a = Number of 300s
b = Number of 100s
c = Number of 50s
d = Number of Misses
x = Number of Objects (Circles + Slider + Spinner)

I think this is quite easy to implement and shouldn't impact the performance. :P

The case above is for osu!Standard mode. The only problem is how the calculation can be done for the rest of the game modes though...

Kyou-kun wrote:

I'd like Oinari-sama's idea if it wasn't suggesting to add an annoying and distracting bar into the game. The reason why I didn't ask for something like that is because I don't think the extra information is necessary, and having extra stuff on the screen will only make the game more distracting for me.

Oinari-sama wrote:

theowest wrote:



What is that gradient for? answer:

Just to show that red is bad, green is good?
Ya it was just a decoration. I felt that some sort of graphics is required to tie the 3 numbers (Min, Current, Max) together or it'll look at bit weird with numbers only. I also considered placing a grid below the numbers instead of a meter. Just something to tie the visual up. For that reason, the meter I photoshopped could be made thinner to give more screen real-estate to the numbers.

EDIT: Hmm... theo you think it's worth it to create a new Request? I'll photo shop a few more and make a new thread.

theowest wrote:

why not~

PROPOSAL


A new in game "Accuracy Meter" showing not just Current Accuracy, but also the Maximum and Minimum possible accuracy from this point onwards. So instead of a single accuracy, osu now has to calculate 3 values simultaneously at any given time. Max is obviously the best accuracy a player can get if he gets only 300 from this point on, while Min is the worst accuracy he can get if he misses everything (assuming fail does not kick in) till the end of the map. Current Accuracy (the one we have now) is displayed in the middle. This should (more or less) cater for those who wanted accuracy calculations going up from 0 or down from 100.



The gradient meter is just a decoration. I felt that some sort of graphics is required to tie the 3 numbers (Min, Current, Max) together visually or it'll look at bit lacking with numbers only. For that reason, the meter could be made thinner to give more screen real-estate to the numbers. Here's a thinner meter for comparison:

Thinner Meter



I also considered placing a grid below the numbers instead of a meter. This may sit better with people who wants less distractions:

Grid Meter

Swiss watches anyone? :)


This is just a fancy wish from me rather than a real request though, because I can foresee the effort required to make this happen while there are more urgent things for peppy to do. But who knows, I'll just leave the idea here and see if miracle happens. ;)
Last edited by Oinari-sama , edited 2 times in total.
yoyomster
58 posts
Joined July 2011
yoyomster
It's a nice idea but the min % value seems a bit redundant to me. To me it seems that value wouldn't have any meaning at all other than esthetics.
Maybe it would be nice to show the meter only during breaktime as players would be probably focusing on the circles while they're playing and wouldn't like even more information to take into account.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
Min would be ridiculous since the minimum would mean you have to miss everything which would require you to be playing on no fail.

Then again the max could be nice.
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1
too many numbers to deal with. gah. i'd rather not have it, but THAT'S WHERE TOGGLES COME IN AHAHAHAHAUEHUAH.

okay
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
Oinari-sama
Well it's not easy to see the usefulness of the min% at first. But it's not just there for aesthetics.

The min% is useful for judging whether you've already beaten your target % or not. This is obscure to high ranked players, since very often their target is FC or nothing. But for players who are training to beat certain obstacles with NF (especially maps with high hp drain), it's not unusual to set a target such as "beat gold dust NF with 80% acc." The min % value could be useful when the player looks at it during the break to see if he's already beaten it, or need to work harder (or just retry since the max % is already below target).
Luna
2,355 posts
Joined November 2010
Luna
The min% would still be pretty useless even in the case you proposed.
Let's just take your example of 80% acc NF. There's no way the min% will help you until the very, very end - at which point there probably will no longer be a break to look at it. Why? Well, the earliest point in the map where you could theoretically get 80% min acc is after you've SS's the first 80% of hitelements. And if you're doing that well, you won't need a min% display to tell you that your goal will *probably* be reached. Assuming your 80% goal is something reasonable but not easy for you, the min% will only "help" you on the very last few notes.
TakuMii
1,874 posts
Joined October 2009
TakuMii
IMO this would make the accuracy meter very cluttered and harder to read while playing. The max% idea could be helpful in some cases, but even then I'd rather have it appear as less significant compared to current accuracy (be it a small fontsize, or having it appear only during breaks, etc.).
Minimum wouldn't be very helpful, nor would it be very accurate. Missing all of the notes remaining would cause a fail so it wouldn't be useful unless you were on NF on a song that is way beyond your skill level, or nearing the end of a song. And if it were something like displaying the bare minimum % needed to pass, that would be impossible due to the nature of osu!'s lifebar.
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
Oinari-sama
Before I answer some posts above, it'll be nice if people can propose a modification to the request to make it better, rather than just say "I don't like something."

For example if someone doesn't think that the min % is useful, please feel free to draw up an alternative to the OP. This will help facilitate discussions from everyone, rather than just the OP burning his head to come up with new ideas to "satisfy" an "angry mob."

Luna wrote:

The min% would still be pretty useless even in the case you proposed.
Let's just take your example of 80% acc NF. There's no way the min% will help you until the very, very end - at which point there probably will no longer be a break to look at it. Why? Well, the earliest point in the map where you could theoretically get 80% min acc is after you've SS's the first 80% of hitelements. And if you're doing that well, you won't need a min% display to tell you that your goal will *probably* be reached. Assuming your 80% goal is something reasonable but not easy for you, the min% will only "help" you on the very last few notes.
That is taking the min % at face value. Sure, if the player in my example gives up trying after seeing a min% of 80%, he'll end up getting 80% at the end of the song (NF). I want to point out 2 things for consideration.

#1: Having extra information doesn't hurt (assuming there's no issue with screen real estate). In my example, when the player sees during the break a min acc of, say, 70% and a current acc of 90%, he can have a feel that his final acc should be around 80% if he gets at least half the notes on perfect timing (300s). If he's been playing well enough up to this point, he can probably be confident in beating his 80% NF target. Without the min acc info, one has to take into consideration of how many hit elements are left (ie how much of the map is left) to "guestimate" this final figure from just current acc alone. Unless you know the map inside out (or be extremely good with maths), this is a cumbersome task to do within the short break.

#2: Your assumption of having to FC everything before the break is probably quite true if the break is positioned right in the first 2/3 of the map (hit element-wise, not time-wise). There're maps with multiple breaks, some towards the end of the map (eg Kyun Kyun Tamaran Inaba-tan [Inaba]); also the 80% NF is just an assumption. Since most people posted in this thread has achieved certain skill level, you probably don't remember the days where you struggled to get even a 60% acc (NF) in insane maps. The FC requirement isn't necessary if the target is only, say 60% NF, combined with map architecture regarding the break.

That's my take on why the min acc info isn't useless. It maybe useless to high ranked players, so a toggle to turn off this meter would be nice.


YayMii wrote:

The max% idea could be helpful in some cases, but even then I'd rather have it appear as less significant compared to current accuracy (be it a small fontsize, or having it appear only during breaks, etc.)
The example in the OP clearly shows a contrast between Current and Min/Max %. Please feel free to post your example of how this could be done better. ;)
TakuMii
1,874 posts
Joined October 2009
TakuMii
My idea was to only have the max% from your request. It would just be the current% and the smaller max% adjacent with each other (and, as I mentioned before, appearing only during breaks), omitting everything else you have illustrated. The colored bar and the "Current/Min/Max" text would only serve as clutter.

Also, @ your "Having extra information doesn't hurt" comment: There is a point where having lots of information will be more cumbersome than helpful. For some people, the accuracy meter is something to take a quick glance at every once in a while when playing. In this case, adding extraneous numbers surrounding the accuracy would be detrimental to its quick readability.
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
boat
I learned to assume the "max" value of your proposed feature and I'm generally close to spot on. I don't see a lot of use for this, particularly for higher tier players. Sounds great in theory but would be tricky and a bit of a hassle to use in practice.
pixeldesu
243 posts
Joined December 2010
pixeldesu
I think this would be a bit useless in gameplay. It's way too much for me on the right top...numbers only are okay, but a entire meter is a bit too much. It would be okay for me if these "statistics" were in the result screen.
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
Oinari-sama
Since there's not much love for the min acc according to the feedback, I'm leaning towards a minimalist approach like YayMii suggested. What about this as an alternative:

Leave current accuracy display untouched. Add a new display for Max Accuracy info below Current Accuracy during breaks like this:



This should save on coding effort compared to the original proposal.

If possible though, I'd like to have the Max Accuracy info displayed at all times for spectators. The Max Acc is smaller in contrast to the Current Acc for easier reading. It's hard to the player to read the Max Acc during the combo, so it'll suffice to display Max% during breaks only. However this limitation doesn't apply to spectators, so I think that it'll be nice to have this Max% on at all time for spectators.

Of course that's up to the devs.
Mira-san
1,038 posts
Joined May 2012
Mira-san
A Max acc could be pretty useless since if a person gets 1x100 at the VERY end of the song (e.g. last note), the max acc would be 100%
Also, the max acc is already 100%, though that only depends if the person gets a 100/50/miss at the very start.
The min acc is more useful for me, obv. reasons.

I've made images to show you what's cool for me and etc.

huehue


Min acc. would be more useful really.

Correct me if I'm wrong though. :o
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
boat

Mira-san wrote:

A Max acc could be pretty useless since if a person gets 1x100 at the VERY end of the song (e.g. last note), the max acc would be 100%
Also, the max acc is already 100%, though that only depends if the person gets a 100/50/miss at the very start.
That's pretty much the point, showing the highest accuracy you can get. Of course it'll drop down to 99,9X or whatever once you get a 100 since that's the highest value possible. The idea seems to be knowing what is possible in order to not waste time when you wont beat the goal anyways.
Mira-san
1,038 posts
Joined May 2012
Mira-san

boat wrote:

Mira-san wrote:

A Max acc could be pretty useless since if a person gets 1x100 at the VERY end of the song (e.g. last note), the max acc would be 100%
Also, the max acc is already 100%, though that only depends if the person gets a 100/50/miss at the very start.
That's pretty much the point, showing the highest accuracy you can get. Of course it'll drop down to 99,9X or whatever once you get a 100 since that's the highest value possible. The idea seems to be knowing what is possible in order to not waste time when you wont beat the goal anyways.
Hmm.

Guess I've been skipping through reading everything. I see your point.

Time to sleep. /o/
Luna
2,355 posts
Joined November 2010
Luna
I think some people still have a wrong idea of how useful the min% feature would be. Just to illustrate how little it actually does I'm going to take Mira-san's image from above:

SPOILER

Just looking at the picture, it actually seems pretty nice. But the stats are really misleading, here's what would actually happen:
The progress bar shows a bit more than 1/3 completion and the accuracy is 99.25%. Assuming that hit objects are distributed somewhat evenly, the min% in this case would be somewhere around 34%-35% and NOT 70%+ as the image suggests. Knowing that you will get at least 34% accuracy really doesn't help at all, especially when you are almost SSing the map up to that point.
If the note density of the map increases towards the end (which it does for the higher diffs of StrangeProgram), the min% would probably even be below 30%.

You will NOT get 70%+ estimates until the very end of the map unless you are doing exceptionally well (like SSing the first 70% of hit elements) and at that point you can already tell how good you are doing.
Jethh
157 posts
Joined May 2013
Jethh
Hmm i don't like min % value, could be interesting only in the end of the song.

But I really would like a max % value option.
Let's do a quick comparison.

Atm, accuracy gives :
- accuracy of what you did. It's something that experienced players already know, I mean you know what you did lol, so the value in mind is always really close to the real one. Quite poor information then.
- You can or can't SS. ^^ i think you know this too.

max % value would give :
- all the values you can't reach anymore. -> I really like this information. Cause you can't compute it ingame unless you are really good at maths \o/
I know lot of players that play with accuracy objectives. And i saw requests in the same way (eg /t/141061)
So i guess i m not the only one looking for those informations.

I do support the potential accuracy option.
Mira-san
1,038 posts
Joined May 2012
Mira-san

Luna wrote:

I think some people still have a wrong idea of how useful the min% feature would be. Just to illustrate how little it actually does I'm going to take Mira-san's image from above:

SPOILER

Just looking at the picture, it actually seems pretty nice. But the stats are really misleading, here's what would actually happen:
The progress bar shows a bit more than 1/3 completion and the accuracy is 99.25%. Assuming that hit objects are distributed somewhat evenly, the min% in this case would be somewhere around 34%-35% and NOT 70%+ as the image suggests. Knowing that you will get at least 34% accuracy really doesn't help at all, especially when you are almost SSing the map up to that point.
If the note density of the map increases towards the end (which it does for the higher diffs of StrangeProgram), the min% would probably even be below 30%.

You will NOT get 70%+ estimates until the very end of the map unless you are doing exceptionally well (like SSing the first 70% of hit elements) and at that point you can already tell how good you are doing.
I think what I did here was to show the lowest ACHIEVED accuracy. Eh. Silly me.
Oinari-sama
osu! Alumni
3,403 posts
Joined July 2010
Topic Starter
Oinari-sama
I've updated the OP with revised proposal from 10 months ago (since not everyone reads the whole thread). Hopefully it's easier to read now :)

The Min Accuracy will be even less useful if t/141061 can be implemented, while the Max can still give you a feeling of "cushioning" so to speak (lol)
Franc[e]sco
189 posts
Joined August 2009
Franc[e]sco
+1. I'd love this, as I often find myself too scared to try and improve the accuracy of a hiscore because if I accidentally get a better score with less accuracy, I'll lose pp.
FlowHomie
97 posts
Joined June 2013
FlowHomie
I really like this idea! The thing with the minimum accuracy could be cut out, but the max accuracy would be so nice!
TheTrueNorth
19 posts
Joined November 2012
TheTrueNorth
'Potential' accuracy, yes. Min accuracy, no.

(Potential accuracy showing what accuacy you'd get if you got 300's for the rest of the song)
DT-sama
191 posts
Joined October 2013
DT-sama
Bump because I'm still waiting for the day osu! gets subtractive accuracy.

Instead of showing all three kinds of accuracy I'd make this an option like the score meter bar:
"Accuracy Meter Type: Additive/Progressive/Subtractive"
where Additive is what you call min% (because you start at 0% and each hit adds %), Progressive is what we currently have, and max% is what you call max% (because you start at 100% and each hit removes %).

While the additive accuracy meter might not be as useful as the other two, I don't really see a reason to not add it in, either.
GhostFrog
416 posts
Joined March 2013
GhostFrog

DT-sama wrote:

While the additive accuracy meter might not be as useful as the other two, I don't really see a reason to not add it in, either.
"Additive accuracy" is useless. That's a pretty good reason not to add it in. Use that extra little bit of development time to add something better to the game.

Max accuracy would be cool though for trying to get at least a certain %. It would be more reliable than trying to count 100s or estimating based on current accuracy and how far you are into the map.
teasp00n
40 posts
Joined October 2013
teasp00n
I want this!
Bara-
11,978 posts
Joined April 2013
Bara-
I really really like this
This'll make rank-farming much easier (you know when to retry earlier)
Have 1 star
Granger
835 posts
Joined April 2014
Granger

baraatje123 wrote:

I really really like this
This'll make rank-farming much easier (you know when to retry earlier)
Have 1 star
>Not retrying as soon you get 1x100
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