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Are sliders with variable SV rankable?

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DeletedUser_13957006
Topic Starter
DeletedUser_13957006
So, there's this map that has a lot of sliders that change velocity in itself. I know I haven't seen a lot of them, even in loved or graveyard categories so I really don't know much about it. Is it rankable or not? Those might be confused with burai sliders and I want to clear this up since I'm making a map and it has a part which would fit those types of sliders.
Chiru-kun
800 posts
Joined January 2018
Chiru-kun
those kind of maps with those sliders are in loved or graveyard because they can't be ranked.

RC states that a slider's own velocity must be clear. its purpose is to clarify a slider's SV, and to make it readable no matter what speed it may reach. this is not to confuse the use of very variable SV on single sliders in tech maps like Camellia. those are fine since each slider does not change velocity in its own timeframe, and is therefore technically readable.

sliders used in this map are unreadable in their own timeframe. therefore they cannot be ranked. ever. those sliders aren't "bad," but RC demands clarity and consistency.
DeletedUser_13957006
Topic Starter
DeletedUser_13957006

renzthegreat wrote:

those kind of maps with those sliders are in loved or graveyard because they can't be ranked.

RC states that a slider's own velocity must be clear. its purpose is to clarify a slider's SV, and to make it readable no matter what speed it may reach. this is not to confuse the use of very variable SV on single sliders in tech maps like Camellia. those are fine since each slider does not change velocity in its own timeframe, and is therefore technically readable.

sliders used in this map are unreadable in their own timeframe. therefore they cannot be ranked. ever. those sliders aren't "bad," but RC demands clarity and consistency.
uh.... what? first of all, i get you're trying to use tech maps as an example, but it simply doesn't work here. both are pretty different in concept.

and while it may be completely unrankable by RC standards, all i could personally find 'related' to this a rule stating that slider shapes should be clear, but nothing about SV. i also think i should've specified that the SV changes are rather minimal, unlike Acid Rain, so i really wonder if it's still rankable.
Zelzatter Zero
3,984 posts
Joined October 2016
Zelzatter Zero
I think you're missing the main point he's talking about here.

There are two kinds of SV:

1. Consistent SV throughout the slider no matter how fast they go. These can be defined through green lines and you can see them in tech maps.

2. "Inconsistent SV" as you stated, can only be seen in Aspire maps. The reason why it relates to clear sliderpath in RC, is because you have to manually change by yourself, by spamming red and white anchors, the ammount of them can be up to hundreds. Since SV is always consistent (even if you change SV midway through green lines it doesn't affect anything), sliders like that can be counted as burai, completely unrankable.

Also, you can decrease slider velocity midway if you want, but try to make it clear through slidershape, not through music for the sake of rankability.
Last edited by Zelzatter Zero , edited 3 times in total.
DeletedUser_13957006
Topic Starter
DeletedUser_13957006

Zelzatter Zero wrote:

I think you're missing the main point he's talking about here.

There are two kinds of SV:

1. Consistent SV throughout the slider no matter how fast they go. These can be defined through green lines and you can see them in tech maps.

2. "Inconsistent SV" as you stated, can only be seen in Aspire maps. The reason why it relates to clear sliderpath in RC, is because you have to manually change by yourself, by spamming red and white anchors, the ammount of them can be up to hundreds. Since SV is always consistent (even if you change SV midway through green lines it doesn't affect anything), sliders like that can be counted as burai, completely unrankable.

Also, you can decrease slider velocity midway if you want, but try to make it clear through slidershape, not through music for the sake of rankability.
yes but

1. i don't need to spam red and grey anchors myself, a program can do that which almost eliminates slider distortion
2. the SV increase wouldn't be 'sudden' so even though the player would not expect the change he can adapt to it as he plays - basically like deltaMAX's bpm
Zelzatter Zero
3,984 posts
Joined October 2016
Zelzatter Zero
1. Yes I know what Sliderator is. The point I was making here is to inform that changing slider midway without spamming anchors is impossible.

2. I think you should read this for references.
DeletedUser_13957006
Topic Starter
DeletedUser_13957006
maybe it is possible (assuming someone on that thread you linked said so) but it breaking in lazer is pretty lame tho so unless peppy either fixes this or destroys it altogether it sounds about right to reserve those things for aspire maps
DeletedUser_13957006
Topic Starter
DeletedUser_13957006
remembered this thread exists. i'm just bumping so i can prove y'all wrong [1] [2] gg good day sir

jokes aside, it's pretty cool that 2 years ago it was undoubtedly and undebatably banned (seen by this thread), yet we have seen 2(3?) maps like that being ranked lately and even a ranking criteria proposal in the making

so, i want to spark some discussion again. what do you guys think? should sliders like that be allowed, or just banned altogether? if yes, should the use of it be more lenient or only used in exceptional circumstances? if no, why? and how would that rule be enforced? what are your personal opinions on this?
Sophie Twilight
518 posts
Joined October 2019
Sophie Twilight
I'm fully agree with the enforcement on Sliderator usage.
What's important is it fits the song (as long it isn't Aspire), not sightreadable or anything.

Like, why "sightreadable" is even a factor in ranking when there're maps that aren't even passable?
Chiru-kun
800 posts
Joined January 2018
Chiru-kun
wtf I posted here almost 2 years ago
sorry for such terrible communication on my end :'*

ok then, I'll give another take on it since we're talking about opinions on the whole situation in the mapping scene atm

sorry, can't view sample maps atm, maybe if I update this I will have

I only have one sample pending map in mind for this, that's this map beatmapsets/1725665#osu/3526701
if most of the maps getting ranked with sliderators are taking this direction, then its ok imo. as players evolve in skill, so does the acceptable mapping elements. so it was with aspire, and this is just another case. most players are probably aware of sliderator sliders already due to promotional projects in osu! like aspire and some loved maps, so it should be fine now.

as for a line to draw the boundary... I'd turn to player skill on this as well, so I can't give a definitive bet. idk about the current player skill level. I'd be willing to blindly guess though that the line would be drawn on consistent acceleration/deceleration in slider sv
Last edited by Chiru-kun , edited 2 times in total.
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