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osu!(lazer) 2023.1218.0 release feedback

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Eltrigs
3 posts
Joined March 2021
Eltrigs
I really like the fact that you can actually get an S rank without an FC - e.g. 99.42% 1x miss isn't an A rank anymore.

Gameplay wise everything else seems to work fine as a 100k standard player.

Maybe something should be done about the intial rendering of a map (load for longer?). What I mean is that on the initial load the first circles tend to lag and therefore it is necessary to restart the map because landing the first circles is sometimes impossible. Stable does not have this problem.
Last edited by Eltrigs , edited 1 time in total.
iBah4mu7
1 post
Joined June 2020
iBah4mu7
I haven't played much, but I here's my opinions so far:
-I don't really like that when disabling in game interface both score meter and key overlay also disappear, I usually like to have them on without showing accuracy, combo and hp...
-Post map UI is kind of weird and underwhelming, I feel like the old one is much more intuitive and feels better to look at;
-Sliders feel better overall, specially with them fading as the hit circle goes. However, the new slider scoring is not something I really appreciate;
-Also, I think there should be an option to use the tablet area settings from its own driver.

Apart from this, I think Lazer is actually pretty solid, I would consider playing on it if these things were changed. Note that some things might already have an option to be like that and I might just have not noticed them in the configs.
Last edited by iBah4mu7 , edited 1 time in total.
Happy Satoko
280 posts
Joined November 2019
Happy Satoko
please no S rank change, keep it like in stable please. I shouldn't get an S rank on a 95% with misses or on any score with misses. They're supposed to be special. I already had to make collections for 'non-FC S' to find the scores I need to fix, but at least I didn't have to do that for A ranks, since I could sort by rank achieved. If you switch to this system I would have to add all of these currently 95+ A rank maps (1,753 according to o!alt, they are not hard to get) to a collection manually also. Adding an "FC" indicator to an S score is also just redundant, because if you want a clear indicator, you could just change it so that sliderbreak scores give you an A.

Also I still don't agree with slider acc being added after a decade, I think we should keep the basics the same and not have this new/classic split at all, but I guess it's too late on that one.

No real personal opinion on HP, if you tweak it to the point where both pass players still find passes meaningful and new players find it fair, I think you're good.

edit after reading -Enigma-'s comment: While I'm old fashioned and will probably always prefer old way, if you did it like their suggestion and added a new ranking, I could probably adjust to that as long as there is a ranking below a perfect score that requires no misses. So if for some reason you need to do this change, please do it that way? The current way pretty much ruins the way I play the game. I don't care much about if leaderboard says I have an FC, I just like my profile stats and knowing when a map is "done". As long as I can know on my profile and through rank achieved which maps are "done", I'm okay with gaining/losing grades even if the changes in numbers are significant.

Assuming you add an entirely new ranking for an imperfect FC, somewhere around 98% is what I would consider "good score", so a 98 for S I think would reward those scores. 97% is too lenient for me personally but I think that would also be fair. I don't think lower than 97 keeps S ranks special.

(and sorry for so many edits, i have a bit of adhd)
Last edited by Happy Satoko , edited 15 times in total.
ogey rrat
11 posts
Joined February 2016
ogey rrat
osu!standard
Before this update, it felt like some maps with buzz sliders and short sliders were impossible to keep combo, but this update makes it function like stable.

Honestly, I think a lot of people might dislike the way sliders are scored in lazer, but it's a needed change.
As for the capped spinner bonus it seems fine with the way scoring works in lazer.

The HP drain actually is too forgiving compared to stable. I was playing a couple hours ago so I think HP isn't actually as lenient as before this update. I'll need to play more to test that.

Lazer scoring makes it easier to tell how much more of the map I need to fc. Some of the scores from some months up to a year are still under a different lazer scoring so its harder to get the same scores. I like seeing more S rank scores but as others have said it's harder to tell if you've FC'd a map or not.

Now for UI(?) requests for multiplayer.
Its hard to know if people are choosing a map simply because there's nothing that says "choosing a map" or a lobby chat. You'll have to exit out of map select to read lobby chat again.
Also wondering if the lobby size will be unlimited seeing as how we can't limit the lobby size right now.

There's also a bug(?) where you can't skip the beatmap intro so I always have it to skip.
BoscoCHungYT
1 post
Joined November 2019
BoscoCHungYT
Please allow multiple devices to login the same osu account, when I want to play lazer on my iPad it logs out my PC and it is so annoying
AerialSnack
6 posts
Joined January 2017
AerialSnack
I really like Lazer. When I started a month or two ago, I first started with Lazer, and was sad when I switched to Stable to be able to get PP gains. Now I've switched back to Lazer, and while I have been enjoying the improved song selection and UI, as well as better feel while playing, there have been some issues that feel pretty glaring to me.

The tablet settings are confusing, and I'm not sure why they exist. All they do is override what you have already set up in your tablet driver software that you use. It makes it so much more difficult to use a tablet. For some reason in order to use my tablet how I've already set it up using OpenTabletDriver, I have to disable both the Tablet input and the High Precision Mouse input. This took way too long to figure out.

Secondly, there isn't a way to find your universal offset. Being off by 40+ms on every single beatmap is... well, unplayable. Even for new players. The fact that there is no good way to find out what your universal offset is, is honestly unacceptable. The biggest priority in my opinion right now should be getting the Offset Wizard functional in Lazer. Currently, the best way I have found to get what my local offset is, is to play the Offset Wizard beatmap, then afterwards adjust the local offset for that beatmap, then apply that number to my universal offset.

The last thing, which is annoying but not really a huge issue, is that you should be able to type in numbers for the difficulty sliders in the song selection. Having to slide it makes it really hard to get to the specific number you want, so what I've been doing is just making the slider range all inclusive, and typing "star>=x star<y" which defeats the purpose of the sliders and is unintuitive.

I think that if these first two aspects were improved (and the third to a lesser extent), then Lazer would be quite the upgrade to Stable.
Last edited by AerialSnack , edited 1 time in total.
Scientia Fe
4 posts
Joined February 2016
Scientia Fe
More casual player here:

HP drain feels better for maps that had previously stupid punishing HP drain values. Failing seems still possible but HP was always a frustrating mechanic in my opinion, so making it less punishing is good. I think for casual players it's more fun to be able to pass a map with a garbage score than fail over and over because of some HP cutoff or some specifically hard section because of HP drain. It feels more akin to other rhythm games now in terms of how HP tends to work.

Slider accuracy feels weird especially for certain types of fast sliders, but being able to hit it feels the same as stable, which is good enough for me. I do notice my accuracy being generally lower but acceptable.

Scoring without mods (and classic converted scores) are a little confusing to understand especially in the PP they might award. I think higher scores should directly correlate with higher hypothetical pp awarded which doesn't seem to be true yet? Scores are definitely higher than expected but I think it's just a matter of getting used to combo being less valuable, though I do think if FCs are still going to award the most PP then scoring should reflect that too.

Spinners feel fine with the maximum award. I think it adds clarity to the game to be honest.

Thanks for the update!
Last edited by Scientia Fe , edited 2 times in total.
Cicchio51
2 posts
Joined July 2017
Cicchio51
Sliders still feels a little choppy, i think is a visual problem with staple skins and the fade in of the sliderball follow circle should be double in speed or just appear instantly. The argon skin pro should have the slider track override in black and the white circle around the hitcircle makes it look like bigger than they should, a fix can be the only one border in white like the standard osu skin. I really have doubts about accuracy on slider heads because after all this years is part of the game identity but maybe im only bad, i feel top players should talk about this change.


About the input delay is great, feels a lot better thand standard

About the map editor olibomby is literally saving mapping: i love the fact now you can draw sliders
fleuphy
4 posts
Joined October 2017
fleuphy
I have long felt that lazer hp drain is too lenient while stable is too harsh. When in combination with the lack of notelock (or is notelock just done differently? not entirely sure to be honest), it is far too easy to pass stream maps as long as you can aim them semi-accurately and mash, and it doesn't feel rewarding to get passes on maps like these as it would in stable. On stable, it seems like very often (and especially with HR on since it increases HP) the HP drain brings your hp down a lot during less difficult sections of a map (due to less note density) which makes it very stressful when entering the harder parts of maps. Somewhere in the middle where stream maps don't feel like free passes and less note-dense maps don't give me a heart attack because it feels like im about to fail even without any misses would be great. Maybe something like a lowered rate of HP drain if you have at least a certain amount of combo and then it kicks back up when you miss? IDK I don't know what I'm talking about when it comes to the "balance" of HP drain, especially since it doesn't matter in terms of farming balance or tournament play.
_Xavi_
2 posts
Joined January 2021
_Xavi_
Can you add the option to move the cursor sensitivity of mouse via the keyboard, I am capable of changing the other similar options using the keyboard but it seems to not be possible on that single slider (Idk if I'm the only one having trouble with this).
ierapir
3 posts
Joined October 2019
ierapir
Speaking about osu!std only

I believe changes that increase slider leniency are good in general since this allows to implement slider accuracy without serious consequences in terms of playability of certain maps. This one isn't an exception, although losing that distinctive feeling of short sliders compared to usual circles due to hit window cutoff is a bit sad.

Slider scoring feels okay I guess. I mean it seems right when judgement is given based only on sliderhead hit window since osu is a rhythm game above everything else. Score and accuracy penalty is pretty fair as well.
But for all the saints sake, please implement some sort of missed sliderend indication ;_;
Playing a beatmap for SS and then noticing your acc isn't perfect during a break is pretty damn frustrating. There's no possibility to know where exactly you screwed up without watching replay or somehow noticing corresponding followcircle animation. It'd make things so much easier!

Also don't see any problems with the current spinner bonus cap. High enough to make a difference in leaderboards. Low enough to not cause mod mess in lbs of 30 sec 1 star maps. Low enough for score still feeling corresponding to player's performance in case said player spins very fast. Not high enough to make spin battles at the end of a tourney map exciting enough, but that's the price I guess.

Can't say anything about HP drain since I don't play for passes. But in general I think that a harsher hp drain system is better than a more lenient one. Especially when we have notelock being drastically reduced.

Scoring also feels better and more fair than v2. Getting 300k when you're obviously comfortable with the beatmap has never felt right for me. Glad it's changed!

And finally I'm okay with getting S w/o full combo. FC isn't always an indicator of a good score and just displaying a separate mark for it seems a better option.
However there is a quite unpopular opinion on grades topic: if we stick to the concept of osu!std being a combination of rhythm game and combo game, judging by accuracy only feels unsuitable for this particular ruleset. Awarding grades based on score would be better in my opinion.

That's my feedback. Should also say that I'm grateful for everything you and your team has done about Lazer so far! :-)
Last edited by ierapir , edited 1 time in total.
BreadisFox
1 post
Joined May 2023
BreadisFox
The acc feels too punishing as I only get one miss and I already have a 70% acc. But that is just for me rn.
Deag
234 posts
Joined May 2022
Deag
Just wanted to leave some quick feedback. Sorry it's not really about gameplay.

As I came from Osu!Mania I LOVE S ranks for 95% accuracy. In my time playing osu there's been a few times I've had an acc of 95% (or higher) and not gotten an S rank... it's just slightly annoying. And then sometimes I FC with 93% acc S rank and it doesn't feel deserved. Great change.

I feel like retrying should be faster. Or at least be an option. Holding the reset bind brings up a screen which could be useful the first time you play a map, but as 1. I don't really care for changing any of these and 2. it's not needed the second or third time retrying a map. In classic you could move your cursor down to the bottom and pull up this screen. I don't see why it can't be the same here. Sure it's like .2 seconds longer but imo the time to retry in classic was already just long enough. The only reason I gripe about this is because I farm; but stands for a lot of osu players and would love to see a setting to not have this screen pop up the 2nd and following times you retry.

2 things about importing. For one I had ALL of my maps organized by date added and that's how I would find what I would want to play. Example 1000 stream maps were all towards the top of my songs I would just go there to play streams; however, now it seems like it sorta imported them all kind of randomly. I wish it would've imported them all in order. But it's no big deal.
Second thing, an unuploaded map I made didn't import over. I was hoping to be able to map more of it in lazer and can't upload it as I have too many maps uploaded right now. Also not a big issue, just wish it would've imported. There's probably a way to import it anyways but I'll just wait.

As for playing everything feels great. No issues yet.
Phosphores
21 posts
Joined July 2013
Phosphores
Not sure if this stuff got addressed but On osu!catch editor on lazer when testing some basic patterns the catcher in the editor will miss, this seems to happen after you edit a pattern they still follow the old pattern. Also when using test mode the combo doesnt seem to register for a bit then out of nowhere it will register a bunch of fruit at once producing a very loud sound, this constantly happens.
peppy
19,315 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy

Bosques wrote:

I feel like the scoring in general is rather disconnected since scoring 400k points can still be shown as an "s rank" in spite of the fact that it is under half of the total possible achievable score. It feels much less satisfying getting an S rank when you didn't really try too hard for it or beat the map with a "good" score. It also feels disconnected since in the final scoring screen with the wheel that has all the ranks, the rank D takes up well over half of the wheel yet I usually don't even get c ranks anymore.
Can you please attach a screenshot or replay of this score? It sounds pretty damn weird, so I'd want to investigate further.
Lasseh
45 posts
Joined September 2014
Lasseh
The scoring feels good but i feel like its way too lenient at the same time, i dont think i should be getting a 547k score on a map where i missed 16 times across the whole map and only getting 250/1437 combo with 95.34% acc
Hiagg
3 posts
Joined May 2014
Hiagg
i feel hp drain is far too forgiving compared to stable. it felt like i was passing difficult maps without putting in any of the work to actually hit the notes. as an example, on sythos mapset of judas [prophet] (hp5) on stable you can nearly pass the first 2 jump patterns, maybe 3s into the map, by clicking only half of the notes. but then on lazer you can get about 50% further. this turns into being able to pass while missing nearly the entire difficulty spike section in the end.

this only gets worse on stream maps where there is no notelock. while the judgement is more fair, i am able to pass maps with ease that i wouldnt be able to come anywhere near a pass on in stable. it feels like it invalidates passes entirely almost comparatively

for score with a 1 million cap it seems to be oddly lenient especially on short maps. im getting 330k score on a tv size stream map with 82.6% and 21 misses. along with 557k on a 2:14 map with 17 misses and 94% acc. it just feels strange to get so close to cap with a play that is nowhere near fc. not entirely opposed though

s without full combo is probably my least favorite change so far. as a 4 digit at least, its extremely easy to get 95% on any standard style map and it just feels like it invalidates what an s rank traditionally meant entirely. i can consistently s rank 8 or 9 star jump maps with a dozen or 3 dozen misses. it does not feel good to me to see an s on that.
Launchie
7 posts
Joined February 2013
Launchie
I am against the change of S-ranks no longer requiring a Full-Combo. I intuitively felt the change in lettering to an S-rank (rather than reverse alphabetical) to signify something special. S-rank is the end goal of a map to a majority of osu!standard players. S-rank in osu!standard has historically been when you can say the map is completed. Having played mania as well, S-rank not requiring a Full-Combo makes perfect sense there as mania scoring/pp does not consider combo much at all. Osu!standard is a different beast entirely with how combo-oriented it is (and has to be when half of it is aiming). The goal is and has always been to get a Full-Combo, and that should align with the highest grading in my opinion.

Speaking from example, a play of 98% accuracy that is not a Full-Combo is a disappointment. A high accuracy means I could absolutely Full-Combo this map but I didn't on this play. It was a choke. I could do better and should retry to get the Full-Combo. I have not completed the map yet. The play should be awarded A-rank. The high accuracy is consistently re-creatable on any later attempt in my experience, whereas the Full-combo is more special.

Edit: I do believe the cutoff accuracy of 90% for A-rank and 95% for S-rank are correct, but S should also require a full combo.
Last edited by Launchie , edited 1 time in total.
LilRora
1 post
Joined September 2023
LilRora
I started playing about 3 months ago and switched to lazer about a month in, but still kept playing classic. I can't speak on some things because of that reason, mainly HP drain since I never paid much attention to it.

All slider changes except for slider head acc (in the last paragraph) feel great to me, their scoring though doesn't matter much to me. Probably another thing I just didn't pay attention to. Past that, all of it is good, especially in regards to very short sliders, because they used to be really hard to hit. Even now they're worse than spaced streams (or however it's called at my "fcing ~4* maps with some effort" level), but there's a huge improvement.

The capped spinners are great. I remember when I got my first SS and thought I would be among the first place ranks, only to learn they did spinners stupid fast and got more score for them. That's definitely a great change for newer players, I think it even motivates them to do spinners better because they have a real cap they can reach, instead of some mythical 477 rpm.

The scoring is definitely way better than it was, though to me it's now way too forgiving on some maps; on some maps I had ~800-900k highscores, and the changes didn't really do anything there, but on others I had 50-100k, then easily got ~300k after the changes for what should have been a really bad play, with like 10 misses and 85% acc. Feels a little too much. I think now that it's smoother it's way better overall, but it's not steep enough. It should punish going way above the player's league instead of giving a fifth of the max score for something they can barely pass.

The S also doesn't feel really special. I can sometimes get a score with 4 misses and a third of the combo, and still get an S for it because of fairly high acc, which feels weird. So yes, definitely something to distinguish full combo.

Also, one thing that bugs me is slider head acc - and yes, I know it's not exactly the topic, but it's important to me. PLaying stable and later classic, I got used to thinking circles are about accuracy and sliders are about tracking, and now when I play with slider head accuracy, it completely throws me off, to the point I often get ~90% scores where I did easy 97-98% on classic despite the fact maybe half of the objects are sliders. Skill issue, arguably, I know. Still, it bugs me, and I think it could be easily solved by making slider head accuracy an additional mod in the same vein as strict tracking.
Last edited by LilRora , edited 2 times in total.
Lemuze
19 posts
Joined October 2020
Lemuze
visually the follow circle of the slider expands weirdly when not aiming the slider end correctly. Also my game runs gets like mini lagspikes, when on vsync its like every 3 seconds i drop a couple of frames and when using unlimited, its just lots of singular frame drops which makes the game looky laggy even though it says it runs between 200-600 fps (which is a big range te vary within imo)
peppy
19,315 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy

Deag wrote:

For one I had ALL of my maps organized by date added and that's how I would find what I would want to play.
Import date is respected on importing, based on the file write time of .osu files in folders. Are you editing beatmaps or something? To adjust for practice difficulties?


Deag wrote:

Second thing, an unuploaded map I made didn't import over. I was hoping to be able to map more of it in lazer and can't upload it as I have too many maps uploaded right now. Also not a big issue, just wish it would've imported. There's probably a way to import it anyways but I'll just wait.
This doesn't sound right. Can you share the beatmap?
FlameOfWar
1 post
Joined August 2021
FlameOfWar
So, I'm ALL FOR more lenient hp drain but uh, as a 6 digit, on main, my best pass is chikatto reform's its like a 7.2 star. I have a couple other low 7 stars, and thats about it.

I now have

system sun dt, ange du blanc, raise my sword, 1.18x sidetracked day (222 bpm) freedom dive original, blue zenith original, glory days, legend of millenium, honesty, calttanoia, 240 bpm road of resistance (205 normally), 240 bpm azul remix, 240 bpm pretender, and 217 bpm DAWN OF THE DRAGON STAR (1.24x, I dont think I could do .5x speed on main)

after 2 hours.
dawn of the dragon star is a RANKED 9 star...

its worth mentioning before anyone asks, the ONLY MOD ANY OF THESE USED is dt and the variable speeds it can have. NO DIFFICULTY ADJUST
Last edited by FlameOfWar , edited 4 times in total.
-zilva-
108 posts
Joined April 2015
-zilva-
Hello! been playing on lazer for over a year already.

· sliders have been feeling pretty well overall and I definetly like the approach. But there have been massive lag on tick-heavy sliders:
beatmapsets/1125563#osu/2359830 this map for example, 01:04:667 (1) - lags a lot on a play but keeps running, but when I open on editor it just crashes when I go to that slider. It doesnt happen on my stable build, so Im sure it has to do with how sliders works now with this update.

· Capped spinners is very good, even tho I spin over 400 consistently I welcome not having to break my wrist every time theres a spinner.

· Scoring felt way better before this update. Score v2 is already a satisfying scoring system imo. maybe keep the idea of less penalty on misses, but dont be too forgiving as keeping high combo is not only mechanically hard, but mentally too so it should feel more rewarding getting 700k+ on maps.

· I kind of like the idea of getting S rank and having a proper "FC" mark. I dont get why people are so against it when stable gives S rank even tho you sliderbroke 100 times on a map (therefore getting S rank doesnt means FC in the first place). You will farm FC ranks instead of S ranks. But I will admit that 95% for S is also kinda bad, you won't change the fact that S ranks means a lot to the community, so maybe adjusting accuracy requirements would make them more relevant and rewarding. (97% for S? idk)
Isatuyu
32 posts
Joined July 2020
Isatuyu
Hi, I wanna know is there a reason why the cursortail of my skin don't appear? I felt like my cursor become more heavy (maybe it's placebo referring to this video) and it felt like playing without cursortail and I couldn't bother myself to change skin because it's the skin I've been used to.

A video about the difference: https://youtu.be/9yhMSwtVGmw?si=-AmwyYFi7arNyJ1F

Is it my settings or something else? I just wanna know. Thanks in advance
Sefeo
1 post
Joined June 2018
Sefeo
Very general points, not related to recent updates:

- It is certainly a preference, but UI feels cluttered. Many will like it for more so-to-say futuristic looks, but it cuts off simplicity of standard, often feels disorientating. Perhaps after some time of usage it will be perceived more natural, but would be cool to have option to choose betwen two types of UI: normal (current lazer) and simplified (more similar to standard). Also, since song select screen blurs backgrounds and doesn't show full background image on the right ribbons (with maps' names and difficulties), it often becomes more time-consuming to identify map based on its image, forcing you to read the text rather than create instant visual association.

- Lack of grouping. I always use grouping by difficulty and couldn't find it in lazer. Difficulty range seems similar, but it applies only to original star rating and is not affected by mods.

- More of my subjective problems: cursor feels absolutely non-responsive, playing on 1ms input lag almost feels like 10ms, even when fullscreen, multithread etc are enabled - one of the things that kept me away from lazer before and still remains here. Also, I can't understand what is up with playing HDDT, but it is weird. Perhaps Hidden animation of objects disappearance is different? Can't pinpoint what is off, perhaps will resolve after getting used to it
Djemovampire
71 posts
Joined January 2022
Djemovampire
quick retry isnt quick
also 1 million dollars for anyone who finds a single non mapper player in the history of the game who asked for that slider change
Yuyuko
2 posts
Joined July 2015
Yuyuko
How does slider head leniency feel with the new changes?
  1. See Extra bullet
How does slider scoring feel? Unlike in classic ScoreV2, slider tails don't give a final judgement based on the number of ticks hit. Instead, the slider's head gives the main judgement based on its own hit window.
  1. On one hand, git gud. On the other hand, it simply just feels bad from a psychological perspective. It's very very discouraging to play tech maps and just get nothing but a visual clutter of 100s on screen and thinking half the time that I dropped combo when I didn't. Honestly having slider head acc makes sense, but if I could turn off seeing slider head acc on screen I would. (Could do this by making slider head acc numbers a separate skinnable element maybe). I shouldn't feel required to turn on Classic mod just to have tech maps not feel bad to play.
How does the current implementation of capped spinner bonus feel?
  1. Good
How does HP drain feel? We reverted to more lenient "lazer" style drain this release, because "stable" style drain felt too harsh.
  1. Too lenient
How does scoring feel? It's now using a modified ScoreV2 which places less penalty on misses.
  1. Good
In lazer you can get an S without full comboing. We are intending to better display "FC" on the results / leaderboards, but how does this feel? (note: also applies to taiko)
  1. Good change
Extra
  1. The uncanny feeling that something is just wrong with gameplay was what kept me from playing around with Lazer for the past several years. Now we're a week away from pp and that feeling... is still there. Not as bad as before and I'm aware of most the changes made to address that feeling. I wish I could say exactly why it still feels bad to play but all I can tell is it's something to do with clicking (and no, I don't mean the fact that sliders now have head acc) Maybe performance based (my PC is higher end, so I don't mean my specs are bad). Edit: Honestly this feeling may be the slider head changes in part, still figuring it out.
Last edited by Yuyuko , edited 11 times in total.
hetamaaj
8 posts
Joined March 2019
hetamaaj
Over all I think Lazer is a massive improvement over stable, but my only two problems with the gameplay right now is the hp drain being way to lenient. I say this because I watched one of my 6 digit friends who played the sun the moon the star no mod, and he was able to get half way through the map missing every 3rd or 4th note in the streams on top of having 40 accuracy. I like the idea of making hp more lenient but as of right now hp-5 looks like stables hp-1. My only other complaint is when you let go of a slider early there isnt a hit sound like there was in stable, because in stable you would still get a missed combo but the slider would count as a 100. I get that in lazer it counts as a missed combo and not a combo break. However having that feedback of a hitsound on slider ends even if I let go early makes it easier for me to stay on rhythm on more complex tech maps.
Niccy
26 posts
Joined March 2017
Niccy
I've been playing osu! for about 6 years now, and I've been very excited whilst following the osu!lazer project.
Here's my feedback!

How does slider head leniency feel with the new changes?
  1. In short, it feels bad. Coming from the stable client, I have to agree with many of the users in this thread in saying that the changes to slider head leniency feel jarring and uncomfortable. This change seems to be one of the most controversial, understandably so. I can understand the reasoning behind why this change was implemented, but for many veteran players who have dedicated much time to playing on the stable client, it doesn't seem very feasible. Personally, migrating from the stable client to the lazer client I've noticed a significant decrease in accuracy on beatmaps which I'm usually very comfortable with playing, seemingly so as a result of the slider changes. I could see this change being the one that turns away many players who may be coming from the stable client.
How does slider scoring feel? Unlike in classic ScoreV2, slider tails don't give a final judgement based on the number of ticks hit. Instead, the slider's head gives the main judgement based on its own hit window.
  1. Unfortunately, in my opinion, this also feels bad to me. It's difficult to articulate why this is, but once again it just feels significantly different from slider scoring on the stable client, which feels jarring for returning players. A miss indicator appearing on the screen each time players miss a slider tick feels very out of place. It adds unnecessary screen clutter to the playfield that's distracting. Each time I see the miss indicator for missed slider ticks, it makes me think I've choked and broken combo. Perhaps this could be a toggle in the settings or a separate skinnable element. However, the current placeholder is a poor choice because there isn't enough distinction between a missed slider tick and an actual miss. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
How does the current implementation of capped spinner bonus feel?
  1. Capped spinner bonus feels good! I'm alright with this change!
How does HP drain feel? We reverted to more lenient "lazer" style drain this release, because "stable" style drain felt too harsh.
  1. I feel as though the new HP drain changes added to lazer are one of the best changes made to gameplay. I feel that this will incentivize players to step further out of their comfort zones to play more challenging maps and improve their skills! I like this change.
How does scoring feel? It's now using a modified ScoreV2 which places less penalty on misses.
  1. Scoring feels good! I've always been fond of ScoreV2, so this change seems good!
In lazer you can get an S without full comboing. We are intending to better display "FC" on the results / leaderboards, but how does this feel?
  1. This change feels good, so long as in the future there's a distinction made between when a player FC's a map and when a player earns an S rank based on accuracy alone. Hoping that will be added at some point in the future!
TLDR; Sliders feel bad, but I absolutely love everything else about lazer.
Looking forward to following more of the osu!lazer project in the future!
Last edited by Niccy , edited 1 time in total.
Entia
1 post
Joined September 2015
Entia
Please add a way to turn off seeing missed sliderends
-Enigma-
7 posts
Joined July 2013
-Enigma-
Have the new slider changes been checked to function well with strict tracking?

I think I noticed a bug with strict tracking enabled where I am failing a whole slider because I am passing over a slider tick from an upcoming slider while a button press from a previous hitcircle is still clicked down (it's just my habitual tapping style to hold down the previous key up until the next click, particularly when alt-ing).

So, I hadn't even tried to intentionally click on the slider yet, but a great big X pops up regardless.

In general slider changes feel great, though, and I'm now able to single tap sliders more comfortably like in stable.

Also, I find the visible slider end miss to be quite distracting (particularly aiming tech maps) and would like to be able to toggle it off, but I suppose I just need to git gud...

P.S. After reading through many other comments about the S-rank cut off:

Could you consider adding SSS rank for 100% and SS could be adjusted to 98% cut off? Many other rhythm games have this SSS rank, and I think it could help to have 98% SS to get back some of that old feeling of pride with an S rank FC on stable being harder to achieve than the new 95% which is generally very easy.
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PuddingMaster
4 posts
Joined November 2021
PuddingMaster
I might very well be mistaken, but scoring seems to be broken for me. After updating to latest version, all the scores seems to be recalculated, and that results in a very bizarre situation.

https://pasteboard.co/KwU6uwqqMoRK.png

If you would have a look at the image above and focus on the second and third top score, you should realise problem - The second score has way less combo and accuracy, yet over taking the third.

Please tell me if I am just an idiot and missed something, otherwise I suggest looking into this issue.
Mc_Cat
1 post
Joined February 2021
Mc_Cat
I was wondering if you could make a mod that allows you to start at a specific point in the song?

In Stable, when there was that one pattern you wanted to practice you could make a custom diff yourself. This was a huge help for song that have one very hard diffspike somewhere in the middle or at the end but a very long intro(examples would be sidetrack days or red like roses)
When I ported my songs(including custom diffs that are simply the ending of a song or different approach rate) Lazer presented the "Update Beatmap" option that, when klicked, basically deleted all my custom diffs.

I'd love it if Lazer would provide its own solution to this problem, and maybe even make it easyer for players who do not know how to create their own training difficulty.

Nonetheless I wish everybody a happy christmasmas

Edit: I would also love an option where you can move hiteffects or hitcircles from one skin to another; while I think that most of the skins you can download are really great, sometimes you just want to mix them up a bit to create your personal favorite.

If there is still a way to do that with lazers way of saving skins, somebody please tell me how it is done
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myl7
1 post
Joined June 2020
myl7

peppy wrote:

Deag wrote:

For one I had ALL of my maps organized by date added and that's how I would find what I would want to play.
Import date is respected on importing, based on the file write time of .osu files in folders. Are you editing beatmaps or something? To adjust for practice difficulties?
I have the same problem. In lazer the order by date added is not imported but random.

Below is the orders in the stable song folder and lazer song selection panel.
Though one should be imported from the other, they are different unexpectedly.



The lazer version is 2023.1224.0

Edit: Sorry I compared it with the order in the panel of stable again. Most added dates are imported as expected only several (4) fail.
For these failed songs I checked their properties, but still see the modified time unchanged (which means they should not be put in the front):
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willyi
3 posts
Joined November 2019
willyi
Could the old stable feature to sort beatmaps by score achieved be implemented?
Last edited by willyi , edited 1 time in total.
AIOM
28 posts
Joined April 2022
AIOM
Feedback on Osu!Catch ruleset

When playing catch there is no kiai flashes also if it is possible can you an option to disable kiai flashes for all rulesets
Scaffo
1 post
Joined September 2013
Scaffo
Here's my 2 cents regarding the standard ruleset as a mid-six digit returning player.

How does slider head leniency feel with the new changes?
  1. I actually really like how this change feels for the most part. I was already interested in slider acc as a concept, but it felt way too finicky and unresponsive prior to this change. My only real complaint is that I think buzz sliders are a bit too forgiving due to the late hit change.
How does slider scoring feel?
  1. I'm a bit conflicted on this one. While I do like the slider head acc being important, it feels far less important to finish out a slider, which drastically changes how I think about sliders. Tech maps feel completely different due to the focus shift.
How does the current implementation of capped spinner bonus feel?
  1. I REALLY like this change. Leveling the playing field a little bit will make for more interesting/close competition I think.
How does HP drain feel?
  1. This is a fantastic change. I try and pass maps outside of my comfort zone frequently, and the current drain gives me a bit more wiggle room without feeling free/easy. IIRC, an older version of Lazer had extremely forgiving HP, which I didn't like.
How does scoring feel?
  1. This is my favorite change overall. I've been far more frequently playing out runs with early misses than I previously would. Less retry spam makes the game more fun :)
In lazer you can get an S without full comboing. We are intending to better display "FC" on the results / leaderboards, but how does this feel?
  1. Overall I really like the simplified grading. So long as an FC indicator is added, I'll have only good things to say about this change.
Closing thoughts:
  1. I really like this set of changes. Since the patch, I've only played Lazer as opposed to checking in every now and then previously. I'm excited for the PP released (even if there may be scoring changes down the line.) I expect some changes to the sliders despite my enjoyment of them, and that's okay. I think the other changes are well worth swapping over regardless. I've loved following the progress of Lazer over time and am very happy with what it's grown into!
FinesseAndStyle
11 posts
Joined May 2017
FinesseAndStyle
How does slider head leniency feel with the new changes?

It feels a bit easier but I still end up missing many fast sliders due to not adjusting to the new speed, so it's fine.

How does slider scoring feel?

I don't mind this change. I know tech maps will be affected by this but if we still have classic mod that disables slider acc it's fine.

How does the current implementation of capped spinner bonus feel?

It's good. Most players don't spin much more than 300rpm so awarding more than that, when the only reward is slightly more score doesn't matter. The only thing affected by this is #1 scores will get more ties, I guess.

How does HP drain feel?

Amazing. I played a hard HP7 map and I never dropped below 50% health. It's one of the only frustrating mechanics in stable. The only problem now is passes feel less meaningful. I could easily pass a 20s 8.5* map with 58% acc on HP5. It should be slightly less lenient IMO.

How does scoring feel?

Anything that makes missing a note feel less bad is good.

In lazer you can get an S without full comboing. We are intending to better display "FC" on the results / leaderboards, but how does this feel? (note: also applies to taiko)

Can't agree to this change. If scoring and pp reflect the scoring letter then good. The problem is if you have a 95% with 20x misses (idk if this is possible), this is a completely different score than a 99% FC. Whenever you see a reddit a post of an score with an S without SBs you KNOW it's gonna be good and will be high pp. Getting an S rank should be difficult.
Maybe add new ranks to indicate whether it's an FC or smth like an S+, I wouldn't mind this change then. Or maybe raise the requirement to 97% because 95% is pretty bad acc in rhythm game standards.

Other feedback:

- Besides UI, the game feels better than stable, tested on the same skin.
- Changing settings when importing sometimes lags horribly (up to 10s of freeze time on a good machine). Noticed especially when changing key configuration it would start typing on search instead of changing new input button.
- Lacking the ability to import settings from stable.
- Skin Editor is amazing, I've had a skin from stable that was broken and I very quickly fixed it.
- The Primary Left and Right button input from osu standard should be at the very top of Key Configuration window. This is how it was before so I'm not sure what made you change your mind.
- THE GAME IS VERY LOUD WHEN YOU FIRST START IT, IT SHOULD BE AT LIKE 50% MASTER VOLUME PLEASE CHANGE IT.
- UI Scaling is way too large on a 1080p screen, I've had to change it to 0.8x the minimum so it feels like stable
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fleuphy
4 posts
Joined October 2017
fleuphy

FinesseAndStyle wrote:

Can't agree to this change.

Maybe add new ranks to indicate whether it's an FC or smth like an S+, I wouldn't mind this change then.

peppy wrote:

In lazer you can get an S without full comboing. We are intending to better display "FC" on the results / leaderboards, but how does this feel? (note: also applies to taiko)
they are intending to do just that and have already talked about it in potentially every single forum that they can :)
Last edited by fleuphy , edited 1 time in total.
Happy Satoko
280 posts
Joined November 2019
Happy Satoko

fleuphy -SFA- wrote:

they are intending to do just that and have already talked about it in potentially every single forum that they can :)
not really, showing "FC" on a leaderboard doesn't necessarily mean they will add a new rank/grade, they are pretty separate. We already show the difference between no misses and a perfect FC by displaying the latter in green text on the website for example, but they aren't separate ranks. So they could easily add such an indicator without having a separate rank for it. Even with "S+", they could add it without it being a new rank you could sort by or see how many you have on your profile. If they intend to add a new rank, they haven't communicated it very well.
Last edited by Happy Satoko , edited 3 times in total.
FinesseAndStyle
11 posts
Joined May 2017
FinesseAndStyle

Happy Satoko wrote:

fleuphy -SFA- wrote:

they are intending to do just that and have already talked about it in potentially every single forum that they can :)
not really, showing "FC" on a leaderboard doesn't necessarily mean they will add a new rank/grade, they are pretty separate. We already show the difference between no misses and a perfect FC by displaying the latter in green text on the website for example, but they aren't separate ranks. So they could easily add such an indicator without having a separate rank for it. Even with "S+", they could add it without it being a new rank you could sort by or see how many you have on your profile. If they intend to add a new rank, they haven't communicated it very well.
I wrote this before seeing the peppy replied how he intends for ranks to have an + sign to indicate an FC in the youtube video. Whether it's a new rank or just cosmetic doesn't matter that much
Nekkra
1 post
Joined June 2018
Nekkra
Hello, long time osu! lurker/supporter. Awesome to see the improvements being made to Lazer. Overall I feel like the playing experience on Lazer feels smoother and have really enjoyed playing Lazer for some time now.

New slider scoring feels great, a better reward for accuracy. Capped spinner bonus is also nice as a mouse and keyboard player lol.

As someone who has been working to improve towards being a better player I feel that there is almost too much leniency on Lazer. HP drain feels good, but maybe a touch too lenient. There were some maps in Stable I felt you got knocked too harshly for missing two jumps in a row but now in Lazer I'm passing maps that are probably too hard for me. If possible, maybe somewhere in a middle ground where something like streams still drain a bit more if you aren't on-time? I do like that it's easier to recover. There were some slow bpm maps in Stable that no matter how accurate you were you couldn't actually recover to stabilize.

In addition, the overall grade/score feels way too lenient. On the one hand, there were some plays I had in Classic where one miss on an otherwise full combo felt super bad getting an A for. But, getting an S now doesn't feel as rewarding as when I was spamming plays to get an S on a map in Stable. I think it might feel better if it was 90% for an A, 97% or 98% for an S.

Thanks for the continued communication about the changes to Lazer. I'm really looking forward to continuing to play on Lazer
isslayer1
1 post
Joined March 2022
isslayer1
i would love if there was a way for me to import skins and beatmaps from osu to lazer
not when i first download the game i did that and it worked but after i downloaded it i still mainly play on osu standard but i love to play lazer here and there but since i donloaded new maps i couldn't find how to import them from standard to lazer
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Shaff
13 posts
Joined April 2016
Shaff
Slider scoring : I think most players will hate not being able to cheese slider accuracy, it's always been a part of osu! and one of the biggest reasons why they would never play lazer, most slider heavy maps are made with this mechanic in mind and now they are way harder to get acc on than they already are.

HP drain : I can pass things I wouldn't normally pass in stable even with a bad run. The thing with stable HP is that there are maps that wouldn't refill you much and missing mid map was instakill. So, definitely easier, but I'm not sure how easier it was intended.

S with misses : Yes, if you're gonna have S being anything more than 95% accuracy please have a shiny indicator for FCing a map because the indicator before that was the S rank (minus the sliderbreaks). But still, an S in lazer doesn't feel like achieving anything because 95% is really not that high, even with the slider changes.
Last edited by Shaff , edited 5 times in total.
Spectrogan
13 posts
Joined August 2021
Spectrogan
ok, first time going on a forum, why isnt my progress from osu lazer not showing up in the website?
JustABeginner
1,216 posts
Joined December 2016
JustABeginner

Spectrogan wrote:

ok, first time going on a forum, why isnt my progress from osu lazer not showing up in the website?
Hi Spectrogan!
You can check your osu!lazer progress in this website: https://lazer.ppy.sh/users/25482083
Or you can also click your profile in-game at the top right on your menu screen.
Last edited by JustABeginner , edited 1 time in total.
czeczotka
117 posts
Joined March 2019
czeczotka
Hello I come with a proposition, a quality of life change of sorts. Would it be possible to make notelock a toggleable feature in options instead of being tied to classic mod?

My argument is that it would make lazer feel more like stable while still being flexible for players who don't like this mechanic while simultaneously not punishing people like myself with a 0.96x classic mod multiplayer for wanting the game to feel like stable.

In my opinion the notelock mechanic was with us for so long that some of us (me) depend on it without realizing it. My feedback is based on my Spotlight plays that were painfully hard for me given the lack of notelock.
I know it isn't a common stance to defend notelock but I would love to see such change implemented.
BlueChinchompa
722 posts
Joined May 2019
BlueChinchompa

filomaster22 wrote:

In my opinion the notelock mechanic was with us for so long that some of us (me) depend on it without realizing it.
Personally I find the removal of notelock to make things a lot easier. Mainly for spaced streams, but other than that I don't think I depend on notelock.
Joyster
1 post
Joined November 2019
Joyster
Hello fellas. Does anyone know why the hell framerate is limited to 1000? Doesn't matter whether it's OpenGL or DX11, x8 refresh rate or unlimited, windowed or fullscreen, highest possible is exactly 1000.
In stable release i've got somewhat above 3000 fps. And it's a noticeable difference between 1000 and 3000
ZebbyX
38 posts
Joined May 2017
ZebbyX

Joyster wrote:

Hello fellas. Does anyone know why the hell framerate is limited to 1000? Doesn't matter whether it's OpenGL or DX11, x8 refresh rate or unlimited, windowed or fullscreen, highest possible is exactly 1000.
In stable release i've got somewhat above 3000 fps. And it's a noticeable difference between 1000 and 3000
I personally can't notice a difference, here you have an explanation about why this happens: wiki/en/Help_centre/Upgrading_to_lazer#performance
Geenes
4 posts
Joined February 2015
Geenes
Hello!

I want to report a bug regarding the input settings that came up for me with this update.
Hope this is the right place to tell.

Lazer does loose the input of my pen in regular intervals when the tablet option is not active.
When I activate the Tablet mode, this issue disappears but brings up a new one.

Lazer somehow ignores my tablet drivers settings.
For playing osu I made my tablet area smaller, Lazer somehow grabs the raw tablet area I suppose.

When I deactivate the tablet option, lazer recognizes the area I set in my drivers but also looses track of the cursor.
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