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How to make low diff map much interesting?

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RioAl
834 posts
Joined January 2018
Topic Starter
RioAl
I'm talking stuff like *3 and very low *4 star maps

Honestly my exceptation right now is being able to making a low diff map that have quality at least par* with many generic Shurelia's low diff marathon lmao. I really loved his/her low diff map marathon set btw. Also the song choices

So maybe you had some idea on this particular problem? Please share it here.

Edit. Added few sentence there and there.
*'Par' here is meant to average/reaching the minimum

Thank you for the answer~
Last edited by RioAl , edited 1 time in total.
Asphiee
1,449 posts
Joined January 2020
Asphiee
hmmm... maybe imitate Shurelia? or use some unique pattern that's exclusively for that song i guess. the definition of interesting is different to a mapper's perspective and a player's perspective imo. but if you're definiton of interesting leans more toward players then i guess go with some flows and pattern that most players would love
DeletedUser_5153421
DeletedUser_5153421
How to make the map interesting is something that depends more on your goals. Where do you want the map in the future? Ranked? If so you're going to have to make it interesting in the scope of the rules/criteria. It's funny that you say 3/4 stars is low... well, it's more than enough to make a map interesting. Interest comes from expectations, so if you somehow change from the player's expectations while following the song you're golden. But knowing what players usually expect comes from experience. There's many nuances to mapping, slider shapes, spacing, circle patterns, hitsounding, rhythm/follow choice [aka to what do you want to map to]. With 3/4* you have more than enough to change every bit of this to make your map more enjoyable. You must decide what to emphasize on and create different from what your player might expect, and there's where your creativity has to shine. Just keep the player in mind, and that you have to make it aesthetically pleasing and suits your goals as well or else it's going to take a lot of work to fix.
lewski
1,309 posts
Joined September 2014
lewski
song choice is half the map
- the song obviously needs to be calm, otherwise you won't be able to make a calm map and still get the most out of the song
- it should also be interesting; if it isn't, you'll have to put a bunch of extra work into forcing an interesting map on a boring song. you don't need anything super special, just a song with moderate variation and preferably rhythm that doesn't bore you to death

once you have a song you can just represent it as closely as possible and you should have an interesting map. quality depends on execution.
TheKingHenry
1,665 posts
Joined October 2014
TheKingHenry
brb linking this thread to Shurelia

Anyways, the songs I assume you are referring to already quite nicely support this level of mapping. So from there, point number 1: song choice. Picking an interesting song that literally caters very nicely for this level of difficulty will naturally make for an interesting map, if you just map it properly in general way.

Secondly, it comes down to constructing a map of that level from any kind of song. Usually it means stripping down stuff to fit the lower end. This is more complicated thing to do than the previous option, but just like looking at Shurelia's maps (as was suggested above) is good to see what he's doing right in his maps regarding the first point here, you can look at maps that do this kind of structure design choices exceptionally well, to see how they make nice diffs of this level for more general variety of songs. You could find this kind of stuff for example in spreads or so, just remember that many spreads might, depending on what you are looking for, more so have "generic alright diffs" on this level, rather than "very interesting" ones, but you can always just look around and play em to see if there's something you really like, and why it is so
RioAl
834 posts
Joined January 2018
Topic Starter
RioAl

Asphyre wrote:

hmmm... maybe imitate Shurelia? or use some unique pattern that's exclusively for that song i guess. the definition of interesting is different to a mapper's perspective and a player's perspective imo. but if you're definiton of interesting leans more toward players then i guess go with some flows and pattern that most players would love
I already played many of his/her map. Its really amazing for both of pattern, flow and playibility. Especially on this map : beatmapsets/537383

Besides of playing the map, i'm also already doing some research on some of his/her map.
Short story. Aside of song choice that tend to be slower, he/she is also dont uses many common flow pattern as much we can see on regular hard/hyper diff. And yeah one of mappers that influenced on my mapping style right now is Shurelia.


icytors wrote:

How to make the map interesting is something that depends more on your goals. Where do you want the map in the future? Ranked? If so you're going to have to make it interesting in the scope of the rules/criteria. It's funny that you say 3/4 stars is low... well, it's more than enough to make a map interesting. Interest comes from expectations, so if you somehow change from the player's expectations while following the song you're golden. But knowing what players usually expect comes from experience. There's many nuances to mapping, slider shapes, spacing, circle patterns, hitsounding, rhythm/follow choice [aka to what do you want to map to]. With 3/4* you have more than enough to change every bit of this to make your map more enjoyable. You must decide what to emphasize on and create different from what your player might expect, and there's where your creativity has to shine. Just keep the player in mind, and that you have to make it aesthetically pleasing and suits your goals as well or else it's going to take a lot of work to fix.

Ah thank you for your input. I also wanted to state that star rating isnt good to justified the difficulty. Maybe the right word for title is making "how to make hard/hyper diff much interesting". Also of course ranked.

And i'm feel wrong to putting 'interesting' and 'quality' on the same boat lmao

TheKingHenry wrote:

brb linking this thread to Shurelia

Anyways, the songs I assume you are referring to already quite nicely support this level of mapping. So from there, point number 1: song choice. Picking an interesting song that literally caters very nicely for this level of difficulty will naturally make for an interesting map, if you just map it properly in general way.

Secondly, it comes down to constructing a map of that level from any kind of song. Usually it means stripping down stuff to fit the lower end. This is more complicated thing to do than the previous option, but just like looking at Shurelia's maps (as was suggested above) is good to see what he's doing right in his maps regarding the first point here, you can look at maps that do this kind of structure design choices exceptionally well, to see how they make nice diffs of this level for more general variety of songs. You could find this kind of stuff for example in spreads or so, just remember that many spreads might, depending on what you are looking for, more so have "generic alright diffs" on this level, rather than "very interesting" ones, but you can always just look around and play em to see if there's something you really like, and why it is so
Oh its 'he'.
Thank you for linking this thread to him.

Yeah the song choice is one of stronger point here. Im agreed.

About second paragraph, the problem is i cant really find map which have similar structure other from him (that also make map from him is unique in their own way) Especially in non-marathon map set. I can said that because until this day, i'm still playing *3 and lower *4 stars map regularly.
Last edited by RioAl , edited 5 times in total.
Shurelia
Global Moderator
2,781 posts
Joined December 2013
Shurelia
Hello!
sorry for the post but I've been pondering myself for the past few days on what to post on this thread cuz I tend to have no idea on how should I respond towards someone's praise this much. First of all, Thank you. This post means a lot to me. Let's go to the actual topic now.

Honestly, You can actually learn more from TKH's post than mine cause I tend to not think much about what am I making while working on a map. To put it simply, I just doing it by listening to the song and try to get the imagination on what kind of pattern or stuff that'd work with the song itself. Also for the note, I don't play standard at all so compared with the most of mappers, I don't really have "base standard" towards my own stuff, I just put whatever I feel like that I think it'll do nicely. Though, to accomplish this. I actually need to learn a lot from other mappers by looking at their stuff, modding and collabing would do, so I could learn something new that I can try to apply on my future projects.

And yes, since I mostly fell in love with slow songs, I tend to map it thus a lot of low diff stuff that I mapped.

oh also, I'm suuuuuuper picky with the song that I want to map to the point it's hard for me to join something like mapping competition because usually, I listened to one certain song that I'm interested in like many times, prolly more than 50 times so I could finally get an idea on how am I gonna map it.

Rest is just trials and errors for million times, I guess.

I hope this help and again, Thank you
Last edited by Shurelia , edited 1 time in total.
RioAl
834 posts
Joined January 2018
Topic Starter
RioAl
Thank you Shurelia <3

Yeah i've kinda doing that on mapping lately also with my song choice too. The good thing is that i can properly jugded how interesting a map on hard or insane diff (in term on playability and visual) because i spent almost my entire playtime around 500hr stuck on *3 and *4 map lmao. Afterall, its mostly all about feeling right?. Maybe i'm already had that 'feels' far a while when mapping insane or lower diff map.

Anyways. I'm very happy by getting Shurelia views for this particular problem. Thank you again
Last edited by RioAl , edited 2 times in total.
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