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Somewhere to throw your votes [Storyboard Toggle] [added]

posted
Total Posts
176
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +1,468
peppy
19,300 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy
I recently received this PM:


I have also recently seen conversation perceiving that there will never be a storyboard toggle "because peppy says so". If you are going to say that, then let's take a trip back in time to get a perspective on things first. I highly suggest reading all these threads -- specifically my posts -- if you are one of the "peppy says so" peoples. You may learn some things you didn't know:

viewtopic.php?f=30&t=43488&hilit=storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=40938&hilit=storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=39463&p=573914&hilit=storyboard+disable#p573914
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=29083&hilit=storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=24008&hilit=storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=18119&hilit=+storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17612&hilit=+storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=17244&hilit=+storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=10387&hilit=+storyboard+disable <- probably the most clear
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=9506&hilit=+storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=7540&hilit=+storyboard+disable
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=2022&hilit=+storyboard+disable

If it still isn't apparent, I disagree with storyboards being toggled because they are part of the map, and as important from the mapper's perspective as the hitobjects they place (sometimes even more so). The only time I agree a toggle should be available is if they storyboard causes lag (those who have been around for a long time will recall this is why there is a no-video mod). Things have changed since then, and storyboards have become more and more complex, more flashy... and more laggy. I totally agree something needs to be done to allow the competitive players the ability to play without frustration of occasional fill-rate (aka. storyboard) related lag.

So, a couple of months ago I thought of an excellent solution to this problem. It will probably come be implemented around the same time that osz2 is introduced (the near future?) so all those of your complaining about "osz2 being the death of osu!" etc. should proabably stop and take a breath before continuing (n.b. this is a totally different issue and I don't even want to start a conversation about osz2 before it is implemented and you all fall in love with it).

Here's how it works: Storyboards are always played the first time you play a map. This cannot be bypassed. They will always play once. After you pass the map once on any difficulty, a new toggle option will appear, allowing storyboards to be disabled on a per-play basis. What does this mean?
  1. The main reason for me (and anyone else that agrees with me, if anyone is out there) being strongly against a disable is now gone: the storyboard is still appreciated by the player as they will see it once.
  2. The main reason for everyone else wanting the toggle is still satisfied: you can avoid any lag or distraction you may be experiencing by toggling off the storyboard after you have played through the map once.
  3. Those that may say "but the map lags so badly I can't even pass it with a storyboard" can have the option of watching auto play it. I will probably allow autoplay to be acknowledged as a "pass", so the next time you choose to play the map you can disable the storyboard.
In order to keep it in terms I can agree with, I will probably add the following restrictions, but these may change:
  1. Autoplay will tentatively be accepted.
  2. Switching maps on song select will toggle the storyboard disable off. This means you will need to manually disable it after choosing a map every time. I want to implement it this way so people don't disable storyboards for every map, but rather only when it is utmost necessary. I understand there are some very poorly optimised storyboards out there that do cause lag, even though I did initially try hard to ensure this wouldn't be the case.
I was planning on keeping quiet with this idea until osz2 was released, but felt it is probably best to share it, and give those of you with nowhere else to use your votes a place to drop them, but also providing an answer to the confusion and frustration that may be felt by "storyboard disable" threads getting quickly denied and thrown away (something I haven't been doing personally, I might add).
Guy-kun
770 posts
Joined December 2009
Guy-kun
Absolutely perfect solution in my opinion, everyone has to appreciate the storyboar at least once, and it's not a simple case of turning it off forever.
Pretty much a solution where I thought one wasnt possible (I always stood up for storyboards and not as a 'peppy says so' person)

As something to throw in as an idea, how about auto-disabling storyboards in-game if the framerate consistantly drops below a certain amount (say 40/50fps), or maybe even allowing a global disable in the 'low end pc' option when a consistantly low framerate is recorded throughout plays.
peppy
19,300 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy

Guy-kun wrote:

As something to throw in as an idea, how about auto-disabling storyboards in-game if the framerate consistantly drops below a certain amount (say 40/50fps), or maybe even allowing a global disable in the 'low end pc' option when a consistantly low framerate is recorded throughout plays.
I almost added this to my feature proposal as it has been in the back of my mind, but thought I'd implement it seprately. Good call, though.
Jarby
2,963 posts
Joined August 2008
Jarby
The only other thing of note I would like to bring up regarding this is the freedom to automatically disable all storyboards marked with an epilepsy warning. Of course, that could simply end in regular users enabling it, but I still think it's something to consider.
peppy
19,300 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy
This is fine by me, but is a separate feature request in my opinion. Also, it would mean epilepsy marked maps would have to be standardised to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photosensitive_epilepsy
The World Wide Web Consortium - Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) Version 2.0, produced in 2008, specifies that content should not flash more than 3 times in any 1 second period. However it does allow flashing above this rate if the flashing is below the "general and red flashing thresholds". (Basically, it is OK to flash more than 3 times in a 1 second period if the flashing is small enough or low contrast enough.) [6]
ShaggoN
689 posts
Joined September 2008
ShaggoN
Support AS HELL.

Well would be cool to see the Kiai toggle in the same way :3 ...ok now you can slap me :o
peppy
19,300 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy

ShaggoN wrote:

Kiai toggle
Don't get me started.
ShaggoN
689 posts
Joined September 2008
ShaggoN
Ok, ok, i was just talking xD i know what you think about it.
Anyways, great idea with this one.
*sticks to changelog* cool things there last times. :)
eddieee
253 posts
Joined February 2010
eddieee
great solution ppy:3 thank you.

my only question how about custom skins mappers put in their maps.. can i still delete those?

(mayB a dumb question but what the hell :D/)
Shiro
Global Moderator
4,984 posts
Joined May 2009
Shiro
This is simply amazing. Excellent idea, perfect solution, really.

Just one thing: there are some storyboards that are meant never to be deleted (Don't Stop Me Now, I Can Be Your Friend or in another registry Disturbia). Is there a way to mark these storyboards "non-deletable" ?

Well anyway, full support. I'm looking forward to seeing this implemented.
h3k1ru
osu! Alumni
1,910 posts
Joined March 2010
h3k1ru

peppy wrote:

ShaggoN wrote:

Kiai toggle
Don't get me started.
for some ppls osu is more than just a game, its like a sport, get it please
peppy
19,300 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy
That's like saying "remove the sun from the universe; it makes me hot while running".

Let's keep this on-topic, though.
eddieee
253 posts
Joined February 2010
eddieee

peppy wrote:

That's like saying "remove the sun from the universe; it makes me hot while running".

Let's keep this on-topic, though.
Plz answer my question then :D?
Kitsunemimi
2,188 posts
Joined April 2009
Kitsunemimi

eddieee wrote:

Plz answer my question then :D?
While the skin my sometimes be a bit awkward or difficult to play with, I honestly doubt it would be something that's more distracting than a really intense storyboard. And it certainly doesn't lag as much. People have requested to be able to disable skins in the past already, but I doubt peppy will include this feature.
[/offtopic]

I really like this idea of disabling storyboards after a first run, since a lot of hard work is put into those storyboards (including my own), and they're pretty interesting to watch. Actually, I'm convinced that this is probably the only possible solution without adding the option to disable all storyboards in general. So although we won't be able to disable them in multi (on the first try anyways), I think this would make osz2 more appreciable when time comes.
eddieee
253 posts
Joined February 2010
eddieee
i don't remember asking a question to you, i want to know if can still delete skins... since i am a competitive player, skin is for me just as important as SB/BGmovie so plz give me a answer... and not this story
peppy
19,300 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
peppy
If there is a storyboard toggle, there will also be a skin toggle. It will work in a similar way. Kiai is completely out of the question.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
Just add a mod named "No Sh!t Sherlock" which disables every custom thing in the map (leaving only the map itself, a black background and kiai stuff). It sounds like I'm making a joke but no, I'm sure almost everyone deletes everything in a map folder except for the MP3 and the map itselfs when playing serious stuff, which means using your own skin + black background (sometime grey or other color because of dark colored hits). Don't think wrong of me, I almost always play with SBs and such since I, for some reason, find the map more enjoyable, but when trying to do hard stuff it is just a problem (yeah, when I play just for enjoyment I love having a nice SB, but when playing in a competitive manner I just feel like deleting every image file in osu's songs folder).

I don't mean to be rude or sound imperative, sorry if it looks like it.
adam2046
1,653 posts
Joined April 2008
adam2046

Wishy22 wrote:

I'm sure almost everyone deletes everything in a map folder except for the MP3 and the map itselfs when playing serious stuff
Yeah, it does sound like you're making a joke.

I can't really think of any way that the proposed system could be improved.
...Yet somehow I get the feeling there'll still be some "disable storyboard without playing" threads.
Bittersweet
2,031 posts
Joined February 2010
Bittersweet
Awesome, especially cause i usually (try to) play map few times with sb/skin before delete it. Just a question: This first play will count for the whole mapset or it'll be per diff?
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy

adam2046 wrote:

Wishy22 wrote:

I'm sure almost everyone deletes everything in a map folder except for the MP3 and the map itselfs when playing serious stuff
Yeah, it does sound like you're making a joke.

I can't really think of any way that the proposed system could be improved.
...Yet somehow I get the feeling there'll still be some "disable storyboard without playing" threads.
When you reach some high level playing this you'll notice deleting the background when playing with AR 10 or doing high BPM DTs is really a big help. With serious stuff I mean that, not trying to do some insane map with an A/S. Feel free to ask most top players if they actually play very hard maps with all the stuff a mappers adds to it (uncomfortable skins, flashy SBs/BGs, etc).

PD: Didn't see last peppy's post, so w/e.
Card N'FoRcE
osu! Alumni
4,058 posts
Here since the beginning
Card N'FoRcE
Yeah, finally a good compromise.
And i totally agree with the toggle to be disabled on a "per-play" basic.

And now i want osz2 even more.

@Bittersweet:

peppy wrote:

Here's how it works: Storyboards are always played the first time you play a map. This cannot be bypassed. They will always play once. After you pass the map once on any difficulty, a new toggle option will appear, allowing storyboards to be disabled on a per-play basis.
Zetta
334 posts
Joined December 2009
Zetta
Sounds great. It's fair and it's a huge step up from the flat out "No" we've been receiving for god knows how long.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy

peppy wrote:

Here's how it works: Storyboards are always played the first time you play a map. This cannot be bypassed. They will always play once. After you pass the map once on any difficulty, a new toggle option will appear, allowing storyboards to be disabled on a per-play basis.
So just do DT + AutoPlay and wait for the map to end to play it... is there any real need to waste time doing that? I mean seriously, if a player wants to see the SB, he will, but some mappers love doing storyboards so much that they forget the map is meant to be played and not to be watched. Having to "play" it or "watch" it to be able to disable it is, in my opinion, a waste of time.
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira
@above

peppy wrote:

After you pass the map once
Autoplay doesn't count as passing it since Autoplay is a 'replay'.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
1- In order to keep it in terms I can agree with, I will probably add the following restrictions, but these may change:

* Autoplay will tentatively be accepted.

2- If my PC is bad enough for me not to be able to play it with it's SB because my FPS count goes to 20, then what?

3- No Fail + DT + Spun Out + Clicking some of the last circles to clear it. Still wasting time.
ShaggoN
689 posts
Joined September 2008
ShaggoN
Storyboard, storyboard...but it'd be great if it worked with skin too. Hmmm
Mashley
2,042 posts
Joined September 2008
Mashley
osu! already detects lag and disables score submitting, would it not help to give the player an option to disable the SB if they are detected to be severely lagging?
Gabi
2,554 posts
Joined December 2008
Gabi

peppy wrote:

If there is a storyboard toggle, there will also be a skin toggle.
I'm really glad that there is going to be a skin toggle (if i've understood your post correctly). I can usually not play a beatmap if it has a different skin than the one i'm using or standard, no matter how little difference it has.
Dragvon
osu! Alumni
2,269 posts
Joined June 2009
Dragvon
Even tho i'm a SB & Skins lover i must say this is a nice solution.
As for people who usually say skins ruins gameplay, i think that's an issue with the modding team... It's kinda dumb that if a skin is so bad to play that no one point's that out :3
Zetta
334 posts
Joined December 2009
Zetta

Dragvon wrote:

Even tho i'm a SB & Skins lover i must say this is a nice solution.
As for people who usually say skins ruins gameplay, i think that's an issue with the modding team... It's kinda dumb that if a skin is so bad to play that no one point's that out :3
This is very true. Usually bad skins are the skins which have fake edges where the hit circle isn't really there, so you end up clicking on the end of the skin, thinking you're hitting the circle but you're not. Then they have stupid spinners where you can't see the point in the middle and an intrusive background where you can't see the notes that follow up a spinner. This isn't in the least bit fun it's ANNOYING.

I think the BATS need to be a lot more strict when ranking maps with skins. The same could be said for Storyboards too.
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