Well, Rotten was always a placeholder name while I thought of something better so... huh.MaridiuS wrote:
m4m hello
Personal thoughts: I really like this song, like its one of my favorites, the nhato remix also to me sounds at least as good as the original, so I have my patterning opinions about the song, and would like to share them. You can disagree/agree or apply/not apply, but applying them might be a bit troublesome since it mostly parries your concepts, in fact i might end up mapping this song lol.
So bad apple is primarily a vocal driven song. Vocals land right on white/red and end mostly in a 1/2 interval. Which means that a lot of notes are included, and nomico did very variable intensity through out the vocals that follow some kind of a melody. And my concern is that it isn't really shown in the map. While playing, I didn't feel anything except consistent rhythm and nice aesthetics by playing. Will now explain my thoughts:
00:58:215 (1,3) - these two are like the peak of the vocals. And i'd scale everything else related to that. If you follow vocals it gets really spicy, and less repetitive . Intensity goes up and down. This is basically the mod i received not long ago from Naxess, and when I tried it, the sections had so much more life. I mean you probably know that you were following the pitches and such.
02:21:693 - if you listen to this section, i think that you should understand how emphasized the double drum hits really sound. Since everything is really kinda quiet and trippy, the drums are strong and really stand out, they happen on regular intervals. Which is why I think they should have bigger spacing and much more emphasis than you already did. And what's more, you even sliders on such notes, which i don't find apporpriate for this song. http://i.imgur.com/EawTEP7.jpg this is the kind of patterning that I would use.
Okay, so it's clear we have completely opposite points of view regarding this song. I'm not going to change emphasis from the instrument melody to the vocal melody made by nomico. You explained your reasons, so I feel like it's only appropiate that I explain my reasoning for mapping this song the way I've mapped it.
I agree that the original song is mostly a vocal oriented song, but not so much this nhato remix. For me the high point here is not on the vocals of nomico,
but on the rhythm and melody line created by nhato to support it. I feel like the melody is easily as important here as nomico's vocals, and the highest point of the song for me it's at 04:54:737 (1) - where nhato finally unleashes himself and let's the melody run wild. That, and of course, the main melody remix in nhato style that comes at 05:36:476 (1) - after being teased by both nomico and the rest of the instrumental lines throughout 5 whole minutes. It's the main instrumental melody of the original, yet nhato only brings it up here because he builds to it and plays with the listener's expectations during all of the mix.
This is what made me focus on the musical melody instead of vocals, plus the fact that if I would only map and give intensity to the vocals I'd rather map the original song where those are clearer and there's less things in the way of them that a mix that literally changes everything except vocals, lol. I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree on this.
The rhythm you propose at 02:21:693 - is great... if you're following the vocals, but I'm placing the emphasis on practically everything but them, and there's no real instrumental sound that deserves changing my 3/4 sliders into 1/2's since the drums don't hit there or do it so faintly that it doesn't really deserve a hit for me there.
Feel free to map a version of the song with the vocals as a main point if you'd like, and call me when you do for a mod 'cause I'll be glad to give a hand where I can. This song is amazing and I think both of our interpretations can be as equally valid and powerful for a map, right?
I shall now proceed to mod less subjective things.
00:04:519 (2,3) - would be cool if you used this slider shape only when there will be 1/4 after slider, 00:06:041 (1,2) - and this when there's 1/2 after slider. I use one or the other for aesthetics, mostly. It should be allright anyway since time-equality spacing is consistent here.
00:08:650 (5) - would prefer if you place it here, having the most comfy flow really makes jumps on this bpm actually feel nice imo xd http://i.imgur.com/6kFdWMZ.jpg nah, my reasoning for all of these parts is "from white to red, big space. From red to white, smaller space"
since IMO that fits the intensity on the drums better. Moving 5 there would completely destroy that and also leave me no room for the kind of pattern I'm creating with these.
00:17:345 - following 1/8 feels really nice on such sounds. http://i.imgur.com/uvliHUt.jpg. Now that I think about it, maybe making (3) not stacked to the two sliders actually fits? Think it could be justified that way, since it sounds like it would need more emphasis. That goes for all similar patterns in the section.Where do you hear a 1/8 sound there ? I could maybe change for a 1/4 repeating slider since there's drum hits at 00:17:345 - 00:17:454 - 00:17:563 and 00:17:671, but 1/8? I can't really hear that lol. Anyway, I'll think on it but I'm keeping this as it is for now. I'm not going to unstack 3, though,
this is a really calm part of the song and I don't want to introduce 1/4 jumps to the player until 00:28:867 (2,3) - where the rhythm becomes more complex and it's more justifiable for me to.
00:22:997 (7,8) - feels really overspaced, please nerf, i hit always 100's on testplay ;d nerfed
00:41:910 (6,8) - 1/12? Both will end on same beat, so i think its fine. sure
00:45:389 (6,7) - mm i'm a bit skeptical about this. It doesn't fit your usual structuring of no overlaps, so I suggest not an overlap this dense. http://i.imgur.com/nbaM585.jpg something like this should fit your structuring more. sure
00:47:128 (6) - I see no particular reason to make this slidershape different from others. aesthetics, would be kinda boring to have 3 curved sliders so I changed one while not really impacting gameplay. I do this all the time, kinda my thing I guess?
00:50:389 (5) - ^, if you're emphasizing the third beat, you should also do for previous pattern 00:47:345 (7) - , not second beat. sure,
I'll change third beat in the previous pattern to match here, I guess. Wasn't really my intention tho, I wanted to avoid visual boredom.
01:07:128 (2,3) - obligatory blanket fix yep
01:06:802 (9,1) - this spacing is a bit random. If you want to make bigger spacing on (1) to stand out, i suggest something like this http://i.imgur.com/ganOheq.jpg nah, I eyeballed this and I fucked up, they were supposed to have the same spacing.
01:01:258 (6,7) - as these two have same shape so should these 01:08:215 (6,7) - sure
01:12:889 (5) - placing it here should look better http://i.imgur.com/aZpzrwQ.jpg yep
01:16:910 (7,8) - Wish that your patterning system was a bit more planned tbh, it all looks nice but I think it should have the same shape as other finishing 2 kicksliders. yep
01:18:541 (6,7) - One play i think its 1/24 the other I think its 1/2. So i suggest you do something about it, like stacking xd moved 6 a bit,
should clear things a bit I hope
01:22:128 (7,8) - wish you'd do some huge spacing for these two, just listen to the vocals, they're screaming for justice ;d. Also slidershape is not identical, so i suggest copy paste inverse you know. But my focus is not on the vocals D: yes to fixing the shape tho
01:24:737 (3) - Ugh, think this deserves the biggest spacing, imo it is the most intense.
01:25:606 (7,8) - same for here, needs more emphasis. nope, emphasis for me is on the red ticks since that's where the big drum hits, same concepts as 00:08:650 (5) -
01:57:237 (6,1) - another example where you could add to the intensity of the song. Since both the blue ticked circle and the downbeat are of similar intensity, so should they be followed by something s p a c e d nah, it's not really an intense section, this spacing is just fine
01:55:280 (5) - also its probably okay to have this also have bigger spacing to make contrast with the section. You're keeping slow sliders, which the section deserves, but it is also a nice option to make contrast, making it more fun, I believe it would be a nice idea to make this also a bit spaced. the way I see it, 01:55:280 (5) - has almost no intensity where as 01:55:497 (6,1) - receive all the intensity, and that's why 5's are placed real close and then we make a high jump (not that high since, you know, this part is not that intense, but you get what I mean I hope) towards 6.
02:37:345 - so here i basically don't understand at all when it should be stacked and when spaced, i get no intuition. I thought 02:35:606 (1,2,3,4,5) - deserved a lot of energy since we came from a build up and it was the start of this section, so I used spaced 1/4's. Then that energy dies down, and so do these 1/4's. 02:39:845 (4,5,6,7,8) - somehow slipped by me though, fixed
02:38:215 (5,6) - http://i.imgur.com/MJUUMP1.jpg doing some inversion and rotation, it seems you could make a better lookin pattern. I guess
Also, I think you should make some kind of a rule in this map for kickslider shape choices. I agree it all looks nice, but I don't recognize patterns. that's cause I wasn't going for patterns with them but visuals, lol
03:15:171 (7,8) - it is kinda spottable that they're not the same shape. Use rotation inversion etc to make such shapes look identical, I don't think that its much of a chore. ye
03:16:041 (3) - Like i mentioned on a similar sounding pattern, this also needs more spacing imo, it sounds like the strongest note, at least stronger than 03:16:258 (4) - . same reasoning as above
03:33:215 - hm since you mostly focus on techno part, following this wub would be a nice addition 03:33:650 - if you can think of somethink. nah, for rhythm purposes I'll keep it as a slidertail. It's not totally ignored and it's hitsounded, should be ok
03:38:976 (5,6) - blanket a bit messed up pesky blankets I swear
03:57:563 (2,4) - also following this in form of 3stacks should suit your rhythm choices in the song. I don't understand what you mean here,
sorry
04:09:084 (4,5) - please the vocals, i'm crying, more emphasis, if it were me, i'd do this xd http://i.imgur.com/z29ibXa.jpg okay, I'll give you this one since here the vocals have priority I guess. Not with that suggestion though, but my solution should follow both the drumline and give a little more emphasis here.
05:01:476 (3) - think that this broke my headphones, reduce volume? hai
05:17:128 (7,1) - blanket fixy blankets and me I swear
05:22:563 (1,2) - ^ this one is just sad
05:12:997 (7,8,9) - this seems curved, think it needs to be straight. uh, I touched it a bit but that's straight I think?
05:22:128 (7,1) - hm the overlap, think i mentioned it on start. I don't see no overlap I'm sorry
05:36:476 - i'm a bit sad that you didn't make the rhythm denser, making use of 05:36:910 - , instead you always skip it. Suggest in making denser rhythm ;v I'll think on it, but I skipped it because I wanted to stick to the recognizable bad apple instrumental melody
Well this ended up a bit longer than i wanted it to be, love the hitsounding, and aesthetics. Other things are probably just subjective, so good luck, seeing another bad apple ranked is good. Oh yeah, one more thing, "Rotten" is a rather crude name for a difficulty i suggest putting something from bad apple lyrics idk.
Guess I'll go with Limbo for now, since the song talks about being and disappearing and it's also a nifty reference to another nhato song? I'm open for any suggestions though lmao.
Thanks for your mod, was helpful even if we disagree on some things