What? I asked them a question and they completely ignored it but because they asked "who's she" that means they actually read it. I was rightfully irritatedAce Timing wrote:
It reads sour to me as disingenuous because it looks like he's trying to twist things into being scummy and then asking them if they're doing it. Feels like ez faux-scumhuntingFoxtrot wrote:
are you deliberately avoiding my question?
forum
Newbie Game 16: Day 2
posted
Total Posts
559
By recursive I just meant that we're playing the mafia game over and over. We keep scumhunting, we keep dying, etcetera.abraker wrote:
RVS vote. Recursive likely hints nothing, though it would be nice of rEdo did say something regarding itrEdo wrote:
Why are you so mean already
I haven't seen Zekks in ourrecursivetown yet, so he must be the bad guy!
Vote: [ - Zekks - ]
Because I saw that as a RVS quarrel and did not take it seriously, so I'd rather wait and see what people have to say.abraker wrote:
Detail picking, but what is interesting is that rEdo completely miss Lincolm's color fiasco as well as him asking too many questions for comfort. Instead rEdo went straight to Zekks. Now this might be due to laziness on mobile judging by how it's hard to fuck up a simple quote box on pc, but then attempting to correct it instead of saying "fuck it" tells me otherwise. So the questions remains open: why didn't rEdo pick up on Lincolm before or after reponding to zekks in that session?
I have already addressed that.abraker wrote:
I am most active yet I provide so little information. Well I can say same about Foxtrot, so eh. It does look like the pressuring John thing is sincere.
You literally ignored the fact that I scumread you, or perhaps you must have missed that. So?
john, what do you think of abraker?
john, what do you think of abraker?
I'm not sure. He has provided ISO analyses for two people so far, and I want to say that he's just trying to move the game forward, as we only have 30 hours left.rEdo wrote:
john, what do you think of abraker?
He said this:
and proceeded to analyse an ISO; I want to say that he's just trying to move the game forward (because there was a 9 hour delay between his post and the last) but another possibility would be that he has the largest number of votes and is trying to get them off desperately because he doesn't want to flip scum. Personally, though, I would just say it's the former.abraker wrote:
Wow nobody? Did we run out of ideas on how to find scum or something?
Topic Starter
Day 1, VC 3
With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to lynch!
abraker (3) - rEdo, Lincolm, abraker
Hika (1) - Zexion, Ace Timing
rEdo (1) - [ - Zekks - ]
[ - Zekks - ] (1) - Foxtrot
Lincolm (1) - johnmedina999
Not Voting (2) - Hika
Mod Notes - [ - Zekks - ] is being replaced
Deadline: https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/g ... nt=cursive
With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to lynch!
abraker (3) - rEdo, Lincolm, abraker
Hika (1) - Zexion, Ace Timing
rEdo (1) - [ - Zekks - ]
[ - Zekks - ] (1) - Foxtrot
Lincolm (1) - johnmedina999
Not Voting (2) - Hika
Mod Notes - [ - Zekks - ] is being replaced
Deadline: https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/g ... nt=cursive
I'm back. I'm really on happiest state in this year that somehow I forgot about this game exist. Also, whatever the majority result is, even if it is myself, town needs to lynch someone to make the game easier for town rather than stalling this game and town get NKed 1 by 1 and let scum win, as we close to deadline.
I'm kinda confused with the context of every interaction right now, but I'm too lazy to reread.
And reminder, everyone need to know if you understand the setup or not, especially the people that I consider newbie. I said I know the setup completely.
Also, IMO this game really lack of serious votes...
Nothing more to say. I will try to post large post tonight.
@MOD : Still the same deadline?
I'm kinda confused with the context of every interaction right now, but I'm too lazy to reread.
And reminder, everyone need to know if you understand the setup or not, especially the people that I consider newbie. I said I know the setup completely.
Also, IMO this game really lack of serious votes...
I think it is very natural responseAce Timing wrote:
It's not the scummiest ISO on earth but it's hard to get a baseline like this lol
Ahoy, mine too.Foxtrot wrote:
sorry guys I had my first day of work today
Nothing more to say. I will try to post large post tonight.
@MOD : Still the same deadline?
Why not both? Why not because it was worrying not seeing a response for that long with the day nearing end and why not because suicide D1 is an darn awful way to go regardless what alignment I am? I would be lying if I said that I am not looking for reasons to justify changing my vote to someone else. What might happen is that I change my vote a few hours before the day is up, and that will surely make me look like scum even more. I am digging myself further into this hole as I post, but what to do?johnmedina999 wrote:
I want to say that he's just trying to move the game forward (because there was a 9 hour delay between his post and the last) but another possibility would be that he has the largest number of votes and is trying to get them off desperately because he doesn't want to flip scum. Personally, though, I would just say it's the former.rEdo wrote:
john, what do you think of abraker?
I realized you read me as scum. That is the expected consequence of the self vote and me accidentally ignoring your question.rEdo wrote:
You literally ignored the fact that I scumread you, or perhaps you must have missed that. So?
Dawnsday/Ace Timing
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[b][color=#FF40BF]Any response, even my self vote can't be taken at face value. However, we piece together responses and interactions to draw conclusions.
I get a feeling Dawnsday is trying to downplay Lincolm's move on John here to draw attention away from john.[/color][/b]
"You might be right, but since this is just a response to ensure I am not suspicious, here it is and I still stand by my opinion". It would make for a more interesting reply if Dawnsday asked what color Foxtrot would have said, just to work off that and prove the point. Instead we get this empty, knockoff response. When scum is planning something, or do an action to get results, they would be asked why, and this sort of response is what I expect scum to say because there is no alternative reasoning to their decision other than to do something in their favor.
As it turns out, as shown later in the game, that there is something to read from zekks's weird comment. But we were still wrapping our heads about this and zekks has yet to show the his inactivity. Also what do you mean by "fluff memory?"
expected
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So Dawnsday is drawing connections between Lincolm, John and Zekks. Don't see much wrong with this. Currently I am convinced Lincolm was a radioactive knucklehead and zekks is just dumb town. Scum being as radioactive as Lincolm would be quite an adventure for them, and judging by Lincoln's behavior, I don't think he would want to risk that. I don't think he has the deeper knowledge needed to know how to get out the situation if votes did settled on him for those actions. To give an example, Foxtrot seems to be the type of person that would be confident doing this if scum, but I don't believe Lincolm would.
First part seems reasonable. Second part, Dawnsday seems to have people vote for zekks. It's not a matter of questioning the scummy behaviors at this point. Either zeeks is dumb town or is scum. Most decided zekks is dumb town, and I agree. However, Dawnsday is still fixed on it as if there is more to discuss about why that is scum. Almost everything on why that might be scum has been already said at that point. This is Dawnsday trying to change mind and get people to vote on zekks.
I saw stuff as stupid as zekks in a previous game. I'd say anti-town, but doesn't imply scum. But you can start to see the change of mind in Dawnsday already as zekks bandwagon dies down
Had to just drop and agree. So malleable.
This is a response to Lincolm saying that while we can attempt to lynch zekks, if he flips town, then that would be super bad. Yet Dawnsday still want to convince that doing that to zekks is a good consideration... right after choosing to unvote. He is still pushing to make zekks lynched and it's becomming how subtly, yet forcefully he is doing that. Given my previous comment regarding Dawnsday needing to lynch zekks instead of NK because of PR, this makes perfect sense. And he had to unvote as insurance that vote won't draw uneeded attention.
[b][color=#FF40BF]He unvoted zekks twice in a row. Didn't vote in between. Not sure if mistake or just in case to make sure people notice that he unvoted zekks. Also I did it because for reasons I explained my reasoning for it in the rEdo iso. But if dawnsday experienced a selfvote turning scum previous game,
then why doesn't he just claim I am scum and vote for me then? I think my actions are just as scummy. This kinda kills the "Dawnsday as scum votes upon chance" theory. As the thinking goes, if someone appears scummy, the vote would be automatically justified for scum, but that it is not seen with Dawnsday.[/color][/b]
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I don't fully agree with Foxtrot read until I get self analysis from her. Lincolm can agree. I still can't tell much about John and won't be able to until D2. His read on me strikes me weird. As mentioned before, the selfvote turned up scum in previous game and he had to mention it, but thinks I am town instead. I understand it was to claim he was mafia, but still, I wouldn't be so sure of town with that in mind. Not much on others, and Hika did turn leaning toward the scum side for me as well.
Null
I did mention how I fail to see the point of not mentioning voting strategy on here if both sides have same info. I am not sure if Dawnsday is agreeing with this, nodding his head in emptiness, or just picked out the comment and has not opinion on the matter.
RVS
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Oddly, I think that too. Foxtrot is on the "too good to be true" end spectrum. However I thought of same about Sakura last game, so fuck knows.
Reason #2453 How Lincolm's shallow behavior looking risky from his POV if he is scum hints that he is not scum
He had the choice not to bring this up, and it is one of the posts that made me thing Dawnsday might be scum. I am not sure if Ace Timing picked up upon how much Dawnsday was trying to push zekks lynch.
Too much confidence, but then again he is still looking through the posts and rolling on the floor
I realize how of an unusual request this is, and it is meant to trip up the player.
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[b][color=#FF40BF]Now that I think about it, after you are finished laughing at the request, can you read Dawnsday too? It might help understand what your previous life was up to. Anyway,
Foxtrot: very town -> scum
Lincolm: town -> null
John: town -> scum
abraker: null/town -> town
zexion: null -> town
rEdo: null -> null
null -> scum
Well It is assuring that he is still onto zekks even after the player change, which means there is somthing going on in that regard. I am surprised my read hasn't changed. Now if Foxtrot is his scumpartner, then that contrasting change looks the logical choice because Foxtrot's ISO would def balance this out for other players and I think Foxtrot can fend off hellfire if needed judging by her posts. I will need to do a zexion ISO later and see what that read might imply.[/color][/b]
So what made you change your mind?
Null
We just need to threaten to lynch hika and see how Ace Timing attempts to defend in that case. He can let the vote on Hika stay since it means nothing yet.
Doesn't really say much. Null
As I posted later on, I couldn't see how that would indicate scum.
I provide senarios for hypothetical cases to make sense of the read, but this fails to make much connections. False scum hunting and pretend behavior rarely says anything, if at all. As I said in a post before, I assume any scum tactic appears as townie action. Instead I search for persistent action, base motives, connections between interactions and draw hypothetical scenarios for them to draw conclusions from. I am basically laying out the deck of cards faced down and evaluating what the state of the game might be if I flip one over. This fails to tell anything and is just mere finger pointing.
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faux is a french word for false[/quote]
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Dawnsday wrote:
Hello! Sorry for the delay. Catching up on everything now and will do the do
[b][color=#FF40BF]Any response, even my self vote can't be taken at face value. However, we piece together responses and interactions to draw conclusions.
I get a feeling Dawnsday is trying to downplay Lincolm's move on John here to draw attention away from john.[/color][/b]
Dawnsday wrote:
Judging that I didn't skip a post/some super relevant info I'm in the neutral party currently: Lincolm attempted a..? Thing? and John responded with the choice to abstain from any info rather than straight up claiming his PM text was green.
John also seems to be willing to progress other lines of reading (see; his most recent post) whereas Lincolm has stuck to explaining his play. Nothing solid for me atm
My entire opinion on the entire "PM color" thing is that no matter what John responded (even red?), it couldn't be taken at face value ever. He responds green? Duh he's scum, or town. Leaving you with nothing. He responds with nor green nor red? Great, he's given you nothing. He responds red? He can simply claim he was trying to see how far you'd push him as a newb and how devoted you'd be to taking such info at face value. (Though I'm not sure I'd even consider this a possbility in hindsight, just pointing out that even in the most extreme of responses it could be played off.) therefore I think the entire concept of asking for his PM color was flawed in response.
Again, siding with neither of you on this one.
Foxtrot did the same amount of nosing around on the subject as I did so, neutral on her.
"You might be right, but since this is just a response to ensure I am not suspicious, here it is and I still stand by my opinion". It would make for a more interesting reply if Dawnsday asked what color Foxtrot would have said, just to work off that and prove the point. Instead we get this empty, knockoff response. When scum is planning something, or do an action to get results, they would be asked why, and this sort of response is what I expect scum to say because there is no alternative reasoning to their decision other than to do something in their favor.
Dawnsday wrote:
Zexion wrote:
Dawnsday wrote:
My entire opinion on the entire "PM color" thing is that no matter what John responded (even red?), it couldn't be taken at face value ever. He responds green? Duh he's scum, or town. Leaving you with nothing. He responds with nor green nor red? Great, he's given you nothing. He responds red? He can simply claim he was trying to see how far you'd push him as a newb and how devoted you'd be to taking such info at face value. (Though I'm not sure I'd even consider this a possbility in hindsight, just pointing out that even in the most extreme of responses it could be played off.) therefore I think the entire concept of asking for his PM color was flawed in response.
I think you're just overanalyzing a bad newb-test Lincolm did.
I'm looking at it critically but maybe you're right. I stand by that the concept was flawed, I have no idea as to Lincolm's experience but I'm just giving my opinion on the matter. I stand by that it COULD potentially have been a scum play but I agree that it's just a shortsighted newb test.
As it turns out, as shown later in the game, that there is something to read from zekks's weird comment. But we were still wrapping our heads about this and zekks has yet to show the his inactivity. Also what do you mean by "fluff memory?"
Dawnsday wrote:
Foxtrot wrote:
interesting that you mention a connection between Lincolm and Zekks, Dawnsday
Zekks recently wrote this
Zekks wrote:
idc, as long as I'm walking, there's no stopping for me 'w'
and I asked her to clarify on this, but she hasn't told me anything yet. I know, I might be looking too hard for clues, but that is such an odd thing to say
It is odd agreed. It's possible this is just fluff memery (however inappropriate one may deem it in a thread). I'm also quite eager to hear the reasoning for it but on the whole I don't think there's too too much that can be read into.
expected
Dawnsday wrote:
Vote: Zekks
Maybe this gives you the incentive to "look things over". You're setting off my scumdar now.
null
Dawnsday wrote:
last mod post, he was 1 vote, me and fox voted so that's 3?
L-2 I think but not sure of it's accuracy.
/shrug
Kinda hope Zekks posts soon, been scummy the entire time and this latest post doesn't help :S
So Dawnsday is drawing connections between Lincolm, John and Zekks. Don't see much wrong with this. Currently I am convinced Lincolm was a radioactive knucklehead and zekks is just dumb town. Scum being as radioactive as Lincolm would be quite an adventure for them, and judging by Lincoln's behavior, I don't think he would want to risk that. I don't think he has the deeper knowledge needed to know how to get out the situation if votes did settled on him for those actions. To give an example, Foxtrot seems to be the type of person that would be confident doing this if scum, but I don't believe Lincolm would.
Dawnsday wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
Somehow this question doesn't posted in my previous post.
Dawnsday wrote:
furthering the narrative that Zekks & Lincolm seems to have some connection
What do you mean by "connection" between me and Zekks? Do you mean scum-scum interaction or something? What if one or both of us town?
You and Zekks seemed to speak to eachother a lot, you were asking Zekks for his thoughts about John (you've explained this to be solely down to online users but I'm still iffy.)
Not saying it's scum scum but I'm not sure about buddying in any scenario as townies.
First part seems reasonable. Second part, Dawnsday seems to have people vote for zekks. It's not a matter of questioning the scummy behaviors at this point. Either zeeks is dumb town or is scum. Most decided zekks is dumb town, and I agree. However, Dawnsday is still fixed on it as if there is more to discuss about why that is scum. Almost everything on why that might be scum has been already said at that point. This is Dawnsday trying to change mind and get people to vote on zekks.
Dawnsday wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
Dawnsday wrote:
You and Zekks seemed to speak to eachother a lot, you were asking Zekks for his thoughts about John (you've explained this to be solely down to online users but I'm still iffy.)
I think there are more interaction between me and Foxtrot now. What do you think about that?
Incomparable. This is currently an open discussion, not a simple "hey X what do you think about Y" out of the blue (where X is currently most people's top scumread). You x Foxtrot interaction is limited to discussion, not the half-buddying I witnessed, again. I'm not claiming it to be scum-scum buddying. Was just an observation I made when rereading the thread.
Lincolm wrote:
Foxtrot wrote:
it's not like we can't unvote, so why would you say that? is zekks getting too many votes for your liking?
As abraker and Hika scum-read Zekks also, I would like you guys to see other players as I don't think Zekks is scum for now. Also, you can go unvote and vote him back. It's not about the votes, but everyone seems too focused on Zekks.
Somehow, I'm pretty sure there is no point in pressuring or waiting Zekks. But if you want to stick your vote, I don't mind also.
Explain? When asked to open up on certain things he simply says "I'm too lazy" and literally applies a logical fallacy (Appeals to emotion in his statement that if we lynch him we'll give mafia a higher probability.)
I'm not saying he's guaranteed scum but he should 100% be setting off some alarms in your head right about now.
I saw stuff as stupid as zekks in a previous game. I'd say anti-town, but doesn't imply scum. But you can start to see the change of mind in Dawnsday already as zekks bandwagon dies down
Dawnsday wrote:
looking forward to posts from rEdo and Zexion honestly, haven't seen enough to get reads.
Also even if Zekks isn't a redname his posts don't exactly scream "pro-town" to me so I'm still entirely set on getting some info from him, obviously I'm open to let him go and follow other reads if we get any but this is defo the flavor of the day controversy for me.
Had to just drop and agree. So malleable.
Dawnsday wrote:
Zekks play is anti town but I think he's just a bit clueless. I'm gonna drop it for now but if we turn up nothing I'm going to go for a policy lynch.
unvote
If zekks is a town, then we can expect zekks to be the victim at night. Depending on the PR dawnsday think zekks might have and if Dawnsday is scum, it would be in his best interest to lynch zekks. However, we seem him let zekks go. Doesn't make sense if dawnsday is scumDawnsday wrote:
I actually catch a hint of Zekks possibly being PR because of his "lynch me and mafia have a higher chance" post. It just seems that something a noob with a power role would say, could be entirely wrong but it's 100% a possibility in my mind and one that wouldn't shock me if it were to be true.
Also +1 to Foxtrot's point about John and Zexion needing to post more content. It's hard to get reads on people who don't converse
Will post later
This is a response to Lincolm saying that while we can attempt to lynch zekks, if he flips town, then that would be super bad. Yet Dawnsday still want to convince that doing that to zekks is a good consideration... right after choosing to unvote. He is still pushing to make zekks lynched and it's becomming how subtly, yet forcefully he is doing that. Given my previous comment regarding Dawnsday needing to lynch zekks instead of NK because of PR, this makes perfect sense. And he had to unvote as insurance that vote won't draw uneeded attention.
Dawnsday wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
, but I hate policy lynch also.
Why? If he's not commited to reading he's going to hurt town in the long run. It's not FUN to policy lynch rest assured I'd rather the idea was never even conceived but honestly.
I agree we shouldnt straight call it a day here and lynch but it should 100% be an option for us moving forward.
[b][color=#FF40BF]He unvoted zekks twice in a row. Didn't vote in between. Not sure if mistake or just in case to make sure people notice that he unvoted zekks. Also I did it because for reasons I explained my reasoning for it in the rEdo iso. But if dawnsday experienced a selfvote turning scum previous game,
then why doesn't he just claim I am scum and vote for me then? I think my actions are just as scummy. This kinda kills the "Dawnsday as scum votes upon chance" theory. As the thinking goes, if someone appears scummy, the vote would be automatically justified for scum, but that it is not seen with Dawnsday.[/color][/b]
Dawnsday wrote:
I have little to no faith in the power of PoE currently, seriously it's day 1.
Also, how and why does selfvoting exist in mafia; I seriously fail to see it's applications in any useful scenario. The last time I saw it used was BBoy last game and he did it to CLAIM he was scum.
Any other time it's used it's just straight up weird. Anyone explain it's use here? (Sorry I'm still learning mafia apparently).
unvote
removing my vote on Zekks because this is a weird gamestate
null
Dawnsday wrote:
Hika wrote:
Also, self voting strategy shouldn't be mentioned here. Maybe google it cause we're currently in game and dont want mafia doing anything with that information.
Aight, ty anyway.
I don't fully agree with Foxtrot read until I get self analysis from her. Lincolm can agree. I still can't tell much about John and won't be able to until D2. His read on me strikes me weird. As mentioned before, the selfvote turned up scum in previous game and he had to mention it, but thinks I am town instead. I understand it was to claim he was mafia, but still, I wouldn't be so sure of town with that in mind. Not much on others, and Hika did turn leaning toward the scum side for me as well.
Dawnsday wrote:
Going to give my reads and throw a few observations of mine into the mix
Foxtrot: As everyone has said, she looks largely townie. I have no reason not to have the same assumption, I'm weary but given what small meta I know this is likely to be a townie.
Lincolm: His 1v1 with Foxtrot earlygame gives me 2 townies trying to pry vibes. Everything he posts to me looks very very pro town agenda and for now he's a slight townread but this is subject to change moving forward
John: Posts strike me as just a new townie (Same as lincolm), I'm also swayed by his reaction to policy lynching (He's a newb but he understands the townie benefits of PL)
Abraker: Largely null but he's trying to help town, Selfvote earlygame gives me a strong townie vibe from him
Null Zone is Zexion, rEdo, Zekks, Hika
Zexion - Inactive.
rEdo - Not enough content to sway me over but he's more realistically nulltown.
Zekks - I felt like making a "Zekks" zone and putting him in it for the rest of the game, we played irc mafia earlier and he seemed competent as a mafia (he actually won rofl.), his mafia strategy largely entailed parroting the most active townies just enough to stay out of suspicion. But IRC is a different beast to forum so I have no idea how reliable any of it is. He stays in null permanently probably.
Hika - Actually one of my strongest "gut" feelings I've had in a mafia game thus far. Everything Hika posts rubs me the wrong way, I'm going to link specific posts eventually (pressed for time here atm) but a lot of what she posts just FEELS SO "LAMIST" to me, I'm willing to accept I'm probably wrong on this one and I'm just being paranoid but it's a read and I have it so that's that. Keeping in null because there's nothing I have beyond my gut.
Null
Dawnsday wrote:
there was an attempt
I did mention how I fail to see the point of not mentioning voting strategy on here if both sides have same info. I am not sure if Dawnsday is agreeing with this, nodding his head in emptiness, or just picked out the comment and has not opinion on the matter.
Dawnsday wrote:
Hika wrote:
Also, self voting strategy shouldn't be mentioned here. Maybe google it cause we're currently in game and dont want mafia doing anything with that information.
Strikes me as a LAMIST post mainly due to the "dont want mafia doing anything with that information". Just feels like such a weird addition to the sentence in general, ending at "we're currently in game" would've been acceptable but the last bit seems to be tacked on solely to remind us you're not mafia.
Also upon actually rereading you don't have as many posts I find questionable as I seem to have remembered. You're probably still pretty null for me honestly. Sorry for forcing you to do stuff on your drinking night, I'm just giving my honest views!
also @mod can we have a votecount
RVS
Ace Timing wrote:
I HAVEN'T READ ANYTHING BUT I'M JESUS SO
Hika
null
Ace Timing wrote:
fuck
Vote: Hika
null
Ace Timing wrote:
ok i just started reading and stuff
Foxtrot wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
That's logical answer. And no, I just ask if you get red or green colour, hoping you to answer red somehow.
Well-written flavour, though.
why would he answer red? are you trying to distract us from actual scum and shift the attention to the new players?
Hey Zekks, what do you think about John?
this further proves my suspicion; stop trying to initiate a bandwagon, it's not working
Vote: Lincolm
this is horrible lmao
Oddly, I think that too. Foxtrot is on the "too good to be true" end spectrum. However I thought of same about Sakura last game, so fuck knows.
Ace Timing wrote:
Foxtrot wrote:
you're acting very scummy, zekks. if you're town, i advise you to stop it. you're most likely not.
I'm starting to think this is playstyle cause you sound so forced and unnatural
Reason #2453 How Lincolm's shallow behavior looking risky from his POV if he is scum hints that he is not scum
Ace Timing wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
Vote : abraker because PoE (L-3)
LOL
is this PoE on day one? How the fuck dude?
He had the choice not to bring this up, and it is one of the posts that made me thing Dawnsday might be scum. I am not sure if Ace Timing picked up upon how much Dawnsday was trying to push zekks lynch.
Ace Timing wrote:
Dawnsday wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
, but I hate policy lynch also.
Why? If he's not commited to reading he's going to hurt town in the long run. It's not FUN to policy lynch rest assured I'd rather the idea was never even conceived but honestly.
I read this as dawn actually saying he'd like it better if zekks was never conceived and I was laughing so hard
Too much confidence, but then again he is still looking through the posts and rolling on the floor
Ace Timing wrote:
Hika wrote:
I have more people in the red rather than green, sad to say
me_irl
y'all are so scummy for no reason
I realize how of an unusual request this is, and it is meant to trip up the player.
Ace Timing wrote:
abraker wrote:
To level this uncertainty off, I ask you to analyze your own posts and come up with a detailed read on yourself.
LOL
null
Ace Timing wrote:
holy shit you guys have me rolling
[b][color=#FF40BF]Now that I think about it, after you are finished laughing at the request, can you read Dawnsday too? It might help understand what your previous life was up to. Anyway,
Foxtrot: very town -> scum
Lincolm: town -> null
John: town -> scum
abraker: null/town -> town
zexion: null -> town
rEdo: null -> null
null -> scum
Well It is assuring that he is still onto zekks even after the player change, which means there is somthing going on in that regard. I am surprised my read hasn't changed. Now if Foxtrot is his scumpartner, then that contrasting change looks the logical choice because Foxtrot's ISO would def balance this out for other players and I think Foxtrot can fend off hellfire if needed judging by her posts. I will need to do a zexion ISO later and see what that read might imply.[/color][/b]
Ace Timing wrote:
ok it took me about 20 minutes to read everything, which was, disappointing, to say the least.
I want to say my reads are something like
Town:
Zexion
Hika
abraker
Null:
rEdo
Lincolm
Scum:
Foxtrot
johnmedina999
[ - Zekks - ]
Which is too many scum for the purposes of this game.
So what made you change your mind?
Ace Timing wrote:
abraker was initially scum, which had me at more scum than town lol
Null
Ace Timing wrote:
yes they are newbie and scum
ty for adjectives
We just need to threaten to lynch hika and see how Ace Timing attempts to defend in that case. He can let the vote on Hika stay since it means nothing yet.
Ace Timing wrote:
Lincolm wrote:
So you like your vote in Hika, your townread, instead your scumread? Interesting choice
I'm exceedingly lazy
Doesn't really say much. Null
Ace Timing wrote:
rEdo wrote:
@Ace Timing: what makes you think Foxtrot is scum?
He's got a tone of awkwardness and stiffness that I don't particularly like. I also find a few of his posts quite egregrious.
As I posted later on, I couldn't see how that would indicate scum.
Ace Timing wrote:
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/6176282/
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/6177786/
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/6178103/
https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/6181003/
These posts are some examples of such
It's not the scummiest ISO on earth but it's hard to get a baseline like this lol
I provide senarios for hypothetical cases to make sense of the read, but this fails to make much connections. False scum hunting and pretend behavior rarely says anything, if at all. As I said in a post before, I assume any scum tactic appears as townie action. Instead I search for persistent action, base motives, connections between interactions and draw hypothetical scenarios for them to draw conclusions from. I am basically laying out the deck of cards faced down and evaluating what the state of the game might be if I flip one over. This fails to tell anything and is just mere finger pointing.
Ace Timing wrote:
Foxtrot wrote:
abraker wrote:
Well since we can forgive zekks's concerning stupidity, PoE looks sexy as fuck, and I would like to bring my end of the deal, I guess I have no choice either
vote: abraker
No, you do have a choice. And that choice is not to off yourself. Are you trying to do this to make yourself more believable?Foxtrot wrote:
[ - Zekks - ] wrote:
Who's her?
are you deliberately avoiding my question?
It reads sour to me as disingenuous because it looks like he's trying to twist things into being scummy and then asking them if they're doing it. Feels like ez faux-scumhunting
null
abraker wrote:
Still noob enough not to know what this meansAce Timing wrote:
faux-scumhunting
faux is a french word for false[/quote]
So Danwsday/Ace is leaning toward scum due to pushing zekks lynch too hard, and might have connections with Foxtrot or Hika.
Just because you're projecting yourself onto me? There's not enough time for me to analyze my posts and I don't think it's necessary. Also I don't particularly feel like it because I don't think it would help the game in any way.abraker wrote:
To level this uncertainty off, I ask you to analyze your own posts and come up with a detailed read on yourself.
I didn't ask why you're not voting for abraker, I asked why you need votecount for read. I realize this is old, but that's not exactly what I asked.Hika wrote:
I dont want scum to come along and 'accidentally' hammer abraker also. Would be dumb for anyone else to vote him without a complete town decision. hope you see where im coming from
Anyhow, Hika is right. Zekks might have been roleclaiming in a dumb way and we just took it too seriously. Especially me. It just rubbed me off really wrong so yeah, I think voting for them was a mistake. Honestly, I just did it to get them to talk but considering they completely disappeared it was a mistake of mine to forget to unvote them.
Considering abraker is L-2 and the final day is almost over, that worries me though.
What do you mean "why not both"? That implies that you don't want to flip scum but at the same time you want to move the game forward. Is that what you're trying to say here?abraker wrote:
Why not both? Why not because it was worrying not seeing a response for that long with the day nearing end and why not because suicide D1 is an darn awful way to go regardless what alignment I am? I would be lying if I said that I am not looking for reasons to justify changing my vote to someone else. What might happen is that I change my vote a few hours before the day is up, and that will surely make me look like scum even more. I am digging myself further into this hole as I post, but what to do?
I don't know what the hell were you expecting, man. Don't make dumb promises like self-voting.
I don't want to be voted off D1 and I don't want things to let be since there is still a lot left to analyze.Foxtrot wrote:
What do you mean "why not both"? That implies that you don't want to flip scum but at the same time you want to move the game forward. Is that what you're trying to say here?
Oh shit dawnsday isn't on this read! What gives?johnmedina999 wrote:
abraker wrote:
@John
Your reads?ng else.[/list]
- I don't know much about Zexion, or Hika, so I cannot say anything for them.
- I can't say much about redo either, but due to his last post, I would say he's town, but I'm not too sure.
- Foxtrot is also town to me, her posts analyze all players very well and she pushes people to give info, I don't think that's associated as scum.
- As abraker pointed out, they both post similarly, very neutral, very analytic. Personally, I don't like this "poker face" style of play because there is really nothing to analyze; abraker played like this last game as well, and he got lynched, and he flipped town, so I don't know about these two.
abraker, however, with his self-vote, is starting to flip towards the mafia side, because of the reasons previously posted. I will have my eye on you.- Zekks is lazy and may be either town or mafia.
- Lincolm is leaning towards scum, he is very defensive explaining his actions and doesn't really offer
Must've got messed up with the list. He's with you: "they both post similarly".
I mean if you do threaten to lynch Hika I'm gonna unvote, because she's my townread... That's not a very good associative read there bud.
oh my god, i'm here i'm so srry
I had emergency things come up! I'll read thread sometime soon
Well why is Hika your town read? It still puts me off that hika needed vote count for reads. Hammer or no hammer, vote count should be an honest opinion. If the person needs one vote to lynch and you think that person is scum, you need to say it so that person and other can respond to it.Ace Timing wrote:
I mean if you do threaten to lynch Hika I'm gonna unvote, because she's my townread... That's not a very good associative read there bud.
>He had the choice not to bring this up, and it is one of the posts that made me thing Dawnsday might be scum. I am not sure if Ace Timing picked up upon how much Dawnsday was trying to push zekks lynch.
I was ignoring Dawnsday for the most part.
>I provide senarios for hypothetical cases to make sense of the read, but this fails to make much connections. False scum hunting and pretend behavior rarely says anything, if at all. As I said in a post before, I assume any scum tactic appears as townie action. Instead I search for persistent action, base motives, connections between interactions and draw hypothetical scenarios for them to draw conclusions from. I am basically laying out the deck of cards faced down and evaluating what the state of the game might be if I flip one over. This fails to tell anything and is just mere finger pointing.
With the logic of "scum won't do scummy things," your scumhunting is extremely limited. Scumhunting is a townie action, and thus it's scum's prerogative to fake doing so; fake scumhunting is inherently scummy and it stops there. You're bending over backwards to tell me some irrelevant method of scumhunting from you that isn't applicable here.
>Well It is assuring that he is still onto zekks even after the player change, which means there is somthing going on in that regard. I am surprised my read hasn't changed. Now if Foxtrot is his scumpartner, then that contrasting change looks the logical choice because Foxtrot's ISO would def balance this out for other players and I think Foxtrot can fend off hellfire if needed judging by her posts. I will need to do a zexion ISO later and see what that read might imply.
You're comparing my reads to my slot's earlier reads, which is NAI at best. You're forcing a connection where there isn't one.
>Now that I think about it, after you are finished laughing at the request, can you read Dawnsday too? It might help understand what your previous life was up to
I'm not going to do that. That wouldn't help you at all.
>Well why is Hika your town read? It still puts me off that hika needed vote count for reads. Hammer or no hammer, vote count should be an honest opinion. If the person needs one vote to lynch and you think that person is scum, you need to say it so that person and other can respond to it.
the hammer isn't the only aspect of the vote count relevant to reads. Sometimes a VC doesn't make sense with your reads, and a readover is necessary.
I was ignoring Dawnsday for the most part.
>I provide senarios for hypothetical cases to make sense of the read, but this fails to make much connections. False scum hunting and pretend behavior rarely says anything, if at all. As I said in a post before, I assume any scum tactic appears as townie action. Instead I search for persistent action, base motives, connections between interactions and draw hypothetical scenarios for them to draw conclusions from. I am basically laying out the deck of cards faced down and evaluating what the state of the game might be if I flip one over. This fails to tell anything and is just mere finger pointing.
With the logic of "scum won't do scummy things," your scumhunting is extremely limited. Scumhunting is a townie action, and thus it's scum's prerogative to fake doing so; fake scumhunting is inherently scummy and it stops there. You're bending over backwards to tell me some irrelevant method of scumhunting from you that isn't applicable here.
>Well It is assuring that he is still onto zekks even after the player change, which means there is somthing going on in that regard. I am surprised my read hasn't changed. Now if Foxtrot is his scumpartner, then that contrasting change looks the logical choice because Foxtrot's ISO would def balance this out for other players and I think Foxtrot can fend off hellfire if needed judging by her posts. I will need to do a zexion ISO later and see what that read might imply.
You're comparing my reads to my slot's earlier reads, which is NAI at best. You're forcing a connection where there isn't one.
>Now that I think about it, after you are finished laughing at the request, can you read Dawnsday too? It might help understand what your previous life was up to
I'm not going to do that. That wouldn't help you at all.
>Well why is Hika your town read? It still puts me off that hika needed vote count for reads. Hammer or no hammer, vote count should be an honest opinion. If the person needs one vote to lynch and you think that person is scum, you need to say it so that person and other can respond to it.
the hammer isn't the only aspect of the vote count relevant to reads. Sometimes a VC doesn't make sense with your reads, and a readover is necessary.
I don't understand what's so hard to get with me wanting vote counts
It's suspicious.
It's really not though
How does that even make sense as a scum motivated action
idk why I play with newbies bc you guys miss the point of playing mafia
The whole point is to AS A TEAM, come up with a lynch before deadline, otherwise we might get rekt AS A TEAM
The whole point is to AS A TEAM, come up with a lynch before deadline, otherwise we might get rekt AS A TEAM
And it's more suspicious that three people are still on my case about it
More than likely one of you have to be scum
Ace Timing wrote:
It's really not though
Except it is. Needing a vote count before giving reads implies that the reads are based on who has votes or not. Following me so far?Ace Timing wrote:
It's really not though
That means that if someone (Hika's partner) has too many votes for her taste, she would read that person as town: if not, and the person was safe for the time being, it would be OK to read that person as scum.
That's exactly what we're doing, if you haven't noticed.Hika wrote:
idk why I play with newbies bc you guys miss the point of playing mafia
The whole point is to AS A TEAM, come up with a lynch before deadline, otherwise we might get rekt AS A TEAM
Just because people have their guns pointed at you doesn't mean that no one is playing as a team; three people have you under their radar, while a couple more have their eye on you. Why are you getting paranoid now that the day is almost over?Hika wrote:
And it's more suspicious that three people are still on my case about it
Unvote
Vote: Hika
Ace Timing wrote:
the hammer isn't the only aspect of the vote count relevant to reads. Sometimes a VC doesn't make sense with your reads, and a readover is necessary.
As you are going through reading the posts, you can keep track of the vote count on your own. It's a bold action separate from much else. If you are lazy to do that much, then my understanding is that you just skimmed through posts and picked whatever best fit your needs. It would have been faster to go through the posts and do a vote count yourself than wait a few days for bboy. I went through all 18 (now 19) pages at least 6 times in the past few hours while compiling player data. It's not that hard.Hika wrote:
I don't understand what's so hard to get with me wanting vote counts
I am still going through Foxtrot posts, trying to find her reads. Zex doesn't seem to have made any reads, but I am yet to go through and search for his posts specifically.
You're comparing my reads to my slot's earlier reads, which is NAI at best. You're forcing a connection where there isn't one.Ok, fair
Any thoughts about any player help, especially if that player is self. Was worth the try anyway, didn't expect much after Foxtrot declined.Ace Timing wrote:
I'm not going to do that. That wouldn't help you at all.
My logic isn't "scum won't do scummy things". Anything scummy is instantly on radar, and it's the easiest to pick up upon. It's townie actions which are hard to decipher because both town and scum would do it. Because those actions can be either scum or town, and I evaluate both possibilities and draw conclusions. I am yet to post a grand total analysis of all major player actions with both sides to each action, but it is in the works. Players that played with me before can vouch that I am not bullshitting about making it.Ace Timing wrote:
With the logic of "scum won't do scummy things," your scumhunting is extremely limited. Scumhunting is a townie action, and thus it's scum's prerogative to fake doing so; fake scumhunting is inherently scummy and it stops there. You're bending over backwards to tell me some irrelevant method of scumhunting from you that isn't applicable here.
Also this is missing an answer to why you think Hika is town. It just has a counter toward my argument that Hika might be scum for the weird VC request.Ace Timing wrote:
>Well why is Hika your town read? It still puts me off that hika needed vote count for reads. Hammer or no hammer, vote count should be an honest opinion. If the person needs one vote to lynch and you think that person is scum, you need to say it so that person and other can respond to it.
the hammer isn't the only aspect of the vote count relevant to reads. Sometimes a VC doesn't make sense with your reads, and a readover is necessary.
I'm not paranoid, I'm just trying to figure out how today is going to end with 20 hrs left
playing osu! mafia is bad because we always tend to panic our votes which is why I kept stressing the deadline so much before.
Hika wrote:
playing osu! mafia is bad because we always tend to panic our votes which is why I kept stressing the deadline so much before.
Oh it will def end with panic. Given the activity, there won't be enough time to decide on anything. At least a few Zex posts will be a miracle, I have yet to take a good look at Foxtrot, and it will be a few hours before time is up when I post my compiled analysis, giving others little time to respond.Hika wrote:
I'm not paranoid, I'm just trying to figure out how today is going to end with 20 hrs left
>implying that post hoc ergo propter hocjohnmedina999 wrote:
Except it is. Needing a vote count before giving reads implies that the reads are based on who has votes or not. Following me so far?
That means that if someone (Hika's partner) has too many votes for her taste, she would read that person as town: if not, and the person was safe for the time being, it would be OK to read that person as scum.
lmao
I lie eagerly in wait.abraker wrote:
My logic isn't "scum won't do scummy things". Anything scummy is instantly on radar, and it's the easiest to pick up upon. It's townie actions which are hard to decipher because both town and scum would do it. Because those actions can be either scum or town, and I evaluate both possibilities and draw conclusions. I am yet to post a grand total analysis of all major player actions with both sides to each action, but it is in the works. Players that played with me before can vouch that I am not bullshitting about making it.
I know that.abraker wrote:
Also this is missing an answer to why you think Hika is town. It just has a counter toward my argument that Hika might be scum for the weird VC request.Ace Timing wrote:
>Well why is Hika your town read? It still puts me off that hika needed vote count for reads. Hammer or no hammer, vote count should be an honest opinion. If the person needs one vote to lynch and you think that person is scum, you need to say it so that person and other can respond to it.
the hammer isn't the only aspect of the vote count relevant to reads. Sometimes a VC doesn't make sense with your reads, and a readover is necessary.
I'm waiting for the VC to give my read on Hika
same
I am slightly disappointed nobody is trying to pick apart my player ISO posts other than the players they were made for. Not even trying to understand my reasoning concerning why I think about someone. Ace even skipped my questioning of town read and proved it was on purpose. I am getting the impression you guys take town reads to player's character and draw conclusions from them without question. Lincolm is the only one that provided reasons for his reads here, and I don't see anyone trying to pick those apart. I might be hypocritical of me since I didn't either, but I am steadily working towards picking apart players' ISO. I already did Hika, rEdo, and Dawn/Ace. Next is Zex, and I'm afraid that's all I would have time for.
Any way, It pisses me off and I don't like that I doing all the effort trying to understand player actions while others are trying to connect the dots at face value. Ace's rejection to give reasoning to why he thinks Hika is town just tips that scale all too much for me. I am trying to understand and be open and all I am given is the tip of the iceberg as if that's perfectly normal.
Ace's request of VC is further proof of that and looks like a "fuck you" to me.
unvote
vote: Ace Timing
Let me just post what I have of my compilation now because it will be too late later or I might be lynched for changing my vote before I get to. I'll repost an updated version once I get around it.
Any way, It pisses me off and I don't like that I doing all the effort trying to understand player actions while others are trying to connect the dots at face value. Ace's rejection to give reasoning to why he thinks Hika is town just tips that scale all too much for me. I am trying to understand and be open and all I am given is the tip of the iceberg as if that's perfectly normal.
Ace's request of VC is further proof of that and looks like a "fuck you" to me.
unvote
vote: Ace Timing
Let me just post what I have of my compilation now because it will be too late later or I might be lynched for changing my vote before I get to. I'll repost an updated version once I get around it.
wtf
you're saying dawnsday suspected zekks was a medic and thought he would doc himself?
1. doctors can't do that on this site
2. there's daychat, ergo his whole team would be on that wagon.
you're saying dawnsday suspected zekks was a medic and thought he would doc himself?
1. doctors can't do that on this site
2. there's daychat, ergo his whole team would be on that wagon.
lol you've got me rolling on this whole thing
dont do that to someone my sides are gone
im in actual pain pls
dont do that to someone my sides are gone
im in actual pain pls
I already explained why I think your behavior is suspicious too many times and you just instantly assume I meant your VOTE. Why do your READS need the VC? It is suspicious that your reads are gonna be based on the VC because then you can easily target people who are about to get lynched off/threaten your role. And you're getting too heated up about people being weary of your actions, even though you were L-4 at the time (now L-3 I believe, and Ace voted for you with no reason but that's fine for you? Even after RSV was long over? Even though he voted for you, he seems rather eager to go out of his way to stand up with you, which makes NO SENSE.)Hika wrote:
Just because people have their guns pointed at you doesn't mean that no one is playing as a team; three people have you under their radar, while a couple more have their eye on you. Why are you getting paranoid now that the day is almost over?
Yeah, votes are based on a TEAM CHOICE, whereas reads are individual analysis of other players. Now, do you see why it'd be weird to ask for VC just for reads, when they're supposed to be based on what people say during daychat? You and Ace are the most suspicious people to me right now because you both are unwilling to cooperate with rest of town.
No, I'm not gonna let go of this because your behavior is too suspicious to look over.
Unvote
vote: Hika
On john:
RE: event #1:
lol wtf? There's no AI answer to this question, and there isn't supposed to be one. There's like 20 different reasons why any person as any alignment would choose any colour. You even admitted it saying "scum would give an indefinite answer, but so would town, so this is town." You can't even say someone would noob slip like that. Only time you would tell the truth as scum in that scenario would be if you legit had the IQ of a wet towel.
On zekks:
RE: event #2:
let me preface this by saying WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING FISHING FOR PRS. Beyond that, he's obviously fucking joking, and scum are equally liable to fuck around as town. This is another NAI point.
On lincolm:
??? What radioactive questioning? Are you just saying that he tried to scumhunt but acted hella scummy? How's that town?
On Zexion:
Are you just saying he wouldn't lurk as scum? I've played with scum!zex and town!zex, and they both occasionally lurk. I don't see why you're townreading this for literally no reason.
All of these have shitty base assumptions and confusing reasoning. How well did this work in your last game?
pedit: jeez you guys are actually doing it unvote: hika
RE: event #1:
lol wtf? There's no AI answer to this question, and there isn't supposed to be one. There's like 20 different reasons why any person as any alignment would choose any colour. You even admitted it saying "scum would give an indefinite answer, but so would town, so this is town." You can't even say someone would noob slip like that. Only time you would tell the truth as scum in that scenario would be if you legit had the IQ of a wet towel.
On zekks:
RE: event #2:
let me preface this by saying WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING FISHING FOR PRS. Beyond that, he's obviously fucking joking, and scum are equally liable to fuck around as town. This is another NAI point.
On lincolm:
??? What radioactive questioning? Are you just saying that he tried to scumhunt but acted hella scummy? How's that town?
On Zexion:
Are you just saying he wouldn't lurk as scum? I've played with scum!zex and town!zex, and they both occasionally lurk. I don't see why you're townreading this for literally no reason.
All of these have shitty base assumptions and confusing reasoning. How well did this work in your last game?
pedit: jeez you guys are actually doing it unvote: hika