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Yuzo Koshiro - Attack the Barbarian

posted
Total Posts
89
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Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora
Updated ! Ready for BN check now? :o
Jonarwhal
1,216 posts
Joined November 2013
Jonarwhal
nm from queue
[general]
  1. disable widescreen
  2. make use of kick - Marker #2.wav,and fix the delay
[1]
  1. 01:03:584 (1,2,3,4) - the player just moves straight back/forth for 5 seconds, try putting slight bends in 01:03:584 (1) - this and 01:05:451 (3) - this
    ~
[2]
  1. 00:36:518 (7) - Ctrl+j and readjust this for slightly better flow
  2. 00:56:118 (1,2) - improve the blanket
  3. 01:07:318 (1,2) - ^
[3]
  1. 00:06:653 (4,5,1) - stack 00:06:886 (5) - this 00:05:019 (4) - there, 00:06:653 (4,5) - blanket these, and move 00:07:586 (1) - this right. It makes the flow better 00:06:419 (3,4,5) - there, and prevents having too much on the left side 00:07:586 (1) - here.
    ~
  2. 00:13:186 (1,2,3,4) - blanket 00:13:186 (1,2) - these, and then make an even triangle 00:13:652 (2,3,4) - there, and then fix the triangle 00:14:586 (5) - here too.
  3. 00:15:519 (2,3,4,5) - make the diamond more even.
  4. 00:19:719 (3,4,5) - ^...triangle
  5. 00:26:719 (2,3,4) - ^... use approach circles for help
  6. 00:32:319 (2,3,4,5) - ^...
  7. 00:34:185 (2,3,4) - this one is good :3
  8. 00:41:652 (2,3,4) - fix it again
[4]
  1. 01:11:051 - what are you emphasizing with this SV change?
  2. 01:18:517 - ^
  3. 01:20:384 (1) - NC
[5]
  1. 01:11:051 - SV change in 4, but nothing in 5? imo it makes sense to have more SV changes on higher difficulties
  2. 01:12:917 (2) - NC
  3. 01:18:517 - same as 01:11:051 -
  4. 01:20:384 (1) - NC
Good Luck~!! :D
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora

Jonawaga wrote:

nm from queue
[general]
  1. disable widescreen fixed for all
  2. make use of kick - Marker #2.wav,and fix the delay Nah...deleted. Was going to be a bass kick but I used the other instead
[1]
  1. 01:03:584 (1,2,3,4) - the player just moves straight back/forth for 5 seconds, try putting slight bends in 01:03:584 (1) - this and 01:05:451 (3) - this
    ~
    I had no intention of changing that but I like the suggestion you gave. changed
[2]
  1. 00:36:518 (7) - Ctrl+j and readjust this for slightly better flow agreed
  2. 00:56:118 (1,2) - improve the blanket I guess. not a big deal
  3. 01:07:318 (1,2) - ^ I see it
[3]
  1. 00:06:653 (4,5,1) - stack 00:06:886 (5) - this 00:05:019 (4) - there, 00:06:653 (4,5) - blanket these, and move 00:07:586 (1) - this right. It makes the flow better 00:06:419 (3,4,5) - there, and prevents having too much on the left side 00:07:586 (1) - here. Sadly I am not going to change this. I don't see any problems with how it is now and that's the way I want it to be. It flows into the right side of the grid just fine
    ~
  2. 00:13:186 (1,2,3,4) - blanket 00:13:186 (1,2) - these, and then make an even triangle 00:13:652 (2,3,4) - there, and then fix the triangle 00:14:586 (5) - here too.fixed but I dont want a blanket at 00:14:586 (5) -
  3. 00:15:519 (2,3,4,5) - make the diamond more even. hi
  4. 00:19:719 (3,4,5) - ^...triangle sure but most of these aren't even noticeable.
  5. 00:26:719 (2,3,4) - ^... use approach circles for helpk
  6. 00:32:319 (2,3,4,5) - ^...dfsasfs
  7. 00:34:185 (2,3,4) - this one is good :3 8-)
  8. 00:41:652 (2,3,4) - fix it again actually keeping this one. Not everything needs to be symmetrical. I like the flow here
[4]
  1. 01:11:051 - what are you emphasizing with this SV change? the tone of the music. The first 3 ( 01:07:318 (1,2,3) - ) go down in tone gradually and then 01:11:051 (1) - ends the section with a higher tone. Yes it's true I didn't do this in the other diffs, but I think the section can be mapped with or without a SV change. The SV change also adds difficulty to the map. I wanted more diversity in the mapset and this is the way I chose to do it.
  2. 01:18:517 - ^
  3. 01:20:384 (1) - NC Using 1/8 combos (or is it 4/1?) anyways, I use NC on every 8th white tick
[5]
  1. 01:11:051 - SV change in 4, but nothing in 5? imo it makes sense to have more SV changes on higher difficulties read above
  2. 01:12:917 (2) - NC read above
  3. 01:18:517 - same as 01:11:051 -
  4. 01:20:384 (1) - NC
Good Luck~!! :D Thanks for taking the time to mod this ! You found some small stuff that even I wouldn't be able to find :D Hopefully you understand my reasoning for the slider SV changes at the end
Jonarwhal
1,216 posts
Joined November 2013
Jonarwhal
no kd

Ora wrote:

  1. 01:20:384 (1) - NC Using 1/8 combos (or is it 4/1?) anyways, I use NC on every 8th white tick This isn't an option. It's required for SV change.

Ora wrote:

Thanks for taking the time to mod this ! You found some small stuff that even I wouldn't be able to find :D Hopefully you understand my reasoning for the slider SV changes at the end thanks <3
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora

Jonawaga wrote:

no kd

Ora wrote:

  1. 01:20:384 (1) - NC Using 1/8 combos (or is it 4/1?) anyways, I use NC on every 8th white tick This isn't an option. It's required for SV change.

oops thanks, I learn something new every day. :o
Spork Lover
722 posts
Joined October 2013
Spork Lover

Ora wrote:

  1. 01:20:384 (1) - NC Using 1/8 combos (or is it 4/1?) anyways, I use NC on every 8th white tick This isn't an option. It's required for SV change.

It's not required, I see a lot of maps where they don't - If the map wants easier reading though (which is definitely the case for this map), it's definitely a nice thing to do xd It's always case-by-case xd
Seijiro
osu! Alumni
3,438 posts
Joined April 2013
Seijiro
looks like I am late as usual, sorry

General


  • Isn't there a "BOSS" stage? "Final stage" feels a bit plain lol

    Unused hitsounds:
    kick - Marker #2.wav     nvm, I had to re-dl

    remove "yuzo koshiro" from tags since it is the artist. Also, since we're at it, can you provide an official site or source for your meta?

________________



Caffe


  • 00:44:452 (4) - just personal stuff, but I'd turn this into circles since I feel like those beats need to be clicked. Similar to 00:58:918 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - , basically

    01:00:707 (1,2,1,2) - again personal. I'd avoid the double NC here since they're following both the same rhythm, aren't they?
    Same goes for all of them in case you accept

    01:22:367 - spinner? Till 01:25:984 - maybe

________________



5


  • 00:06:886 (1) - I noticed this is the only "fssss" sound that has a normal 1/4 slider instead of a 1/8 repeat slider. I know it kinda breaks the pattern but imo it really stands out like that. (I'm referring to just the intro, since later on patterns change so there's no problem)

    01:07:318 - 01:22:251 - this section is too unbalanced difficulty-wise. Those long sliders do make sense if considered alone, but comparing them to the parts where you follow the more intense rhythm it feels like black and white. Try to make it more gray x)

    Side note: 00:45:385 (3,4,5,6) - while this pattern comes out of the blue I still agree it is redundant and when you play it a second time you get used to it already so I guess we can let it slip this time

________________



4


  • 01:03:351 (9) - I'd turn this into a circle to emphasize better the different sound occurring here (make sure to give it also an appropriate spacing)
    01:07:084 (9) - same

    01:07:318 - same as for the STAGE 5, it feels too contradicting seeing long sliders and doubles one near to each other

________________



3


  • 00:04:319 (2,3) - personal, but I'd improve this rhythm by making them a repeat slider instead (spacing needs tweaking if you agree)

    01:07:318 - same as for the above diffs
overall this diff seems less structured than the above ones. Did you map this during a different period?

________________



2


  • l00:00:120 (1) - I'd add more recovery after this spinner, let's say around 1 more beat so we're sure there are no problems.

________________



1


  • 00:00:120 (1) - well, following the guidelines, you'd need more break after this, so what about making it end at 00:01:986 - ? Or even 00:02:453 - , even tho it has just 1.400 ms of break but I could still accept it

________________



Ora wrote:

Updated ! Ready for BN check now? :o
If you can improve a bit more structure on stage 3 (and maybe also 2) I can icon it :p
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora

MrSergio wrote:

looks like I am late as usual, sorry

General


  • Isn't there a "BOSS" stage? "Final stage" feels a bit plain lol I guess I can change this. I'll wait for Caffe to eply to his mod first though

    Unused hitsounds:
    kick - Marker #2.wav     nvm, I had to re-dl

    remove "yuzo koshiro" from tags since it is the artist. Also, since we're at it, can you provide an official site or source for your meta? oops had this from before I had to change the song title/artist. I got my metadata from HallidayASR. I'll contact him to see where he got it. looks like I am going to be using this as my source since it is the official CD/Soundtrack.

________________



5


  • 00:06:886 (1) - I noticed this is the only "fssss" sound that has a normal 1/4 slider instead of a 1/8 repeat slider. I know it kinda breaks the pattern but imo it really stands out like that. (I'm referring to just the intro, since later on patterns change so there's no problem) If you really think I should change this, I'll be sad because those 1/4 sliders really stick out with that part of the music. But I do see your reasoning....is this a must change? On the other hand, I haven't had any problems with testplays for this part.

    01:07:318 - 01:22:251 - this section is too unbalanced difficulty-wise. Those long sliders do make sense if considered alone, but comparing them to the parts where you follow the more intense rhythm it feels like black and white. Try to make it more gray x) I'll ask you in-game but what exactly should I do? Should I not map to the slider part of the music? Should I map the slider velocity like I did in STAGE 4? :o

    Side note: 00:45:385 (3,4,5,6) - while this pattern comes out of the blue I still agree it is redundant and when you play it a second time you get used to it already so I guess we can let it slip this time I also explained myself for this part in this mod: p/5476853/ (you can see in the reply below it)

________________



4


  • 01:03:351 (9) - I'd turn this into a circle to emphasize better the different sound occurring here (make sure to give it also an appropriate spacing) I agree, fixed
    01:07:084 (9) - same ^

    01:07:318 - same as for the STAGE 5, it feels too contradicting seeing long sliders and doubles one near to each other

________________



3


  • 00:04:319 (2,3) - personal, but I'd improve this rhythm by making them a repeat slider instead (spacing needs tweaking if you agree) I feel like either pattern works here and the one I chose will keep a steady density. I'm not sure I agree with this suggestion, but I see where you are coming from.

    01:07:318 - same as for the above diffs
overall this diff seems less structured than the above ones. Did you map this during a different period? It might have been a couple days later. What do you mean it's less structured? Do the patterns not make sense? Im confused D:

________________



2


  • l00:00:120 (1) - I'd add more recovery after this spinner, let's say around 1 more beat so we're sure there are no problems. agree and moved back 1 white tick

________________



1


  • 00:00:120 (1) - well, following the guidelines, you'd need more break after this, so what about making it end at 00:01:986 - ? Or even 00:02:453 - , even tho it has just 1.400 ms of break but I could still accept it I agree with your first suggestion. the spinner will then be the same length in beats as the space between making it easier to read.

________________



Ora wrote:

Updated ! Ready for BN check now? :o
If you can improve a bit more structure on stage 3 (and maybe also 2) I can icon it :p I'm not entirely sure how structure needs to be improved. Maybe we can talk in-game and you can give me some examples ? Or just a reply here would be great.
Anyways, No worries about being late. I've been busy myself and haven't gotten a lot done. I still appreciate you taking your time for my map :) hopefully I can sort out "structure" of stage 3 (and stage 2?).
Seijiro
osu! Alumni
3,438 posts
Joined April 2013
Seijiro
Alright, I'm not home so I can't make specific examples but I can explain most of the stuff.
First: What I meant with "unbalanced" was that after a really intense part which uses 1/6 doubles you place really long sliders that totally kill the movement and the rhythm of your map. Whether keep long sliders for all the map or keep the rhythm with doubles, otherwise it is too inconsistent (and also not appropriate for a diff, since you should keep difficulty somehow constant through the map and those sliders are obviously too easy)

Second: Regarding structure on stage 3 (and in part also on 2, but I'm being too strict here probably).
As it is now stage 3 doesn't have any objective problems. What I meant there is that I can clearly see that patterns are more... idk... sloppy? I actually don't know how to describe it oerfectly but I can see it is more "just because".
You said you mapped all of the difs pretty close in time, which means that all diffs have such a problem partially (in my eyes at least).
As I said, this is not a problem but it is something you should work on for your next maps: try to give more meaning for each object to be where it is, not placing them because you want to move the cursor from x1 y1 to x2 y2 (some patterns on stage 3 are just simple curves from a corner of the screen to the other iirc).
This sort of stuf is usually kinda planned before starting the map or after 5-10secs of mapping, because it is like a frame for your painting (your map).

Anyway, source for meta looks fine and later on I'll give you some examples of what I mean exactly in game, since structure is something mappers build over a long period of time and can't be easily learned after one post of mine.

PS: The 1/4 slider on stage 5 can be kept, it's not a big deal but again, stuff like that should have been planned before hand. If you could have noticed that repetitive "fssss" sound every measure you could have managed the pattern differebtly, am I right? :)
CaffeAmericano
615 posts
Joined January 2015
CaffeAmericano
@MrSergio

Changed everything except the spinner. I personally like the abrupt ending for this map. I don't have strong opinion about this, so if Ora wants to make it consistent with other diffs, I don't really mind. You can go ahead and add the spinner if you want, Ora :3

Thanks for the mod!

mysterious box
osu file format v14

[General]
AudioFilename: audio.mp3
AudioLeadIn: 0
PreviewTime: 59851
Countdown: 0
SampleSet: Normal
StackLeniency: 0.7
Mode: 0
LetterboxInBreaks: 0
WidescreenStoryboard: 0

[Editor]
Bookmarks: 40135,67318
DistanceSpacing: 0.6
BeatDivisor: 4
GridSize: 4
TimelineZoom: 1.8

[Metadata]
Title:Attack the Barbarian
TitleUnicode:Attack the Barbarian
Artist:Yuzo Koshiro
ArtistUnicode:Yuzo Koshiro
Creator:Ora
Version:Caffe's FINAL STAGE
Source:Streets of Rage
Tags:CaffeAmericano video game sega yuzo koshiro
BeatmapID:1072404
BeatmapSetID:502187

[Difficulty]
HPDrainRate:5
CircleSize:3.2
OverallDifficulty:8
ApproachRate:9.5
SliderMultiplier:2.4
SliderTickRate:1

[Events]
//Background and Video events
0,0,"maxresdefault (1).jpg",0,0
//Break Periods
//Storyboard Layer 0 (Background)
//Storyboard Layer 1 (Fail)
//Storyboard Layer 2 (Pass)
//Storyboard Layer 3 (Foreground)
//Storyboard Sound Samples

[TimingPoints]
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15052,-83.3333333333333,4,1,1,70,0,1
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81317,-100,4,1,1,50,0,0
81784,-66.6666666666667,4,1,1,50,0,0


[Colours]
Combo1 : 255,0,0
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Combo3 : 241,214,54
Combo4 : 192,192,192

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92,352,66384,6,0,B|72:308|72:308|68:256,1,95.9999970703126,2|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
128,188,66618,2,0,B|128:124|68:84|68:84|60:128,1,143.999995605469,2|8,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
228,188,67007,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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444,128,67318,6,0,P|404:156|352:160,1,95.9999970703126,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
280,112,67551,2,0,P|228:100|152:120,1,95.9999970703126
132,184,67784,2,0,P|88:176|104:124,1,95.9999970703126,8|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
108,112,68018,1,0,0:0:0:0:
248,276,68173,5,0,0:0:0:0:
240,307,68250,1,2,0:0:0:0:
366,191,68406,1,0,0:0:0:0:
358,160,68483,1,2,0:0:0:0:
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372,336,69340,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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232,80,69806,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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84,196,70351,2,0,B|60:144|68:76|68:76|28:112,1,143.999995605469,2|8,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
232,80,70740,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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256,352,71751,1,0,0:0:0:0:
168,196,71906,5,0,0:0:0:0:
176,165,71983,1,2,0:0:0:0:
36,240,72139,1,0,0:0:0:0:
44,271,72216,1,2,0:0:0:0:
264,272,72451,6,0,B|300:220|256:164|256:164|304:168,2,143.999995605469,8|0|0,0:0|0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
180,344,73073,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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444,280,73540,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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460,96,73851,6,0,L|356:86,1,95.9999970703126,2|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
284,136,74084,2,0,B|160:128|160:128|200:100,1,143.999995605469,2|8,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
208,236,74473,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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280,184,75484,1,0,0:0:0:0:
88,56,75640,5,0,0:0:0:0:
119,48,75717,1,2,0:0:0:0:
192,200,75873,1,0,0:0:0:0:
161,192,75950,1,2,0:0:0:0:
368,132,76184,6,0,B|412:186|392:248|392:248|412:244|416:232,2,143.999995605469,8|0|0,0:0|0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
264,92,76806,1,0,0:0:0:0:
264,92,76884,2,0,P|340:84|408:40,1,143.999995605469,0|8,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
204,8,77273,1,0,0:0:0:0:
204,8,77351,2,0,P|176:52|156:112,1,95.9999970703126,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
212,172,77584,6,0,P|188:220|132:248,1,95.9999970703126,2|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
80,300,77817,2,0,B|136:344|192:320|192:320|160:364,1,143.999995605469,2|8,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
296,232,78206,1,0,0:0:0:0:
296,232,78284,2,0,P|312:284|320:328,1,95.9999970703126,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
392,264,78517,6,0,P|401:216|415:171,1,95.9999970703126,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
444,80,78751,2,0,P|398:95|351:105,1,95.9999970703126,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
259,127,78984,2,0,P|295:158|327:193,1,95.9999970703126,8|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
320,220,79217,1,0,0:0:0:0:
128,236,79373,5,0,0:0:0:0:
160,228,79450,1,2,0:0:0:0:
276,320,79606,1,0,0:0:0:0:
245,312,79683,1,2,0:0:0:0:
280,168,79917,5,8,0:0:0:0:
116,368,80151,1,0,0:0:0:0:
24,152,80384,6,0,B|44:120|72:132|72:132|136:148|132:92,1,135.000005149841
200,36,80851,2,0,P|284:24|380:48,1,161.999995056153,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
408,128,81317,2,0,P|473:157|453:88,1,180,0|0,0:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
308,128,81784,1,0,0:0:0:0:
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299,253,82134,6,0,L|230:234,1,45.0000017166138
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Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora
Well...my internet is out until Monday :o I'll see what I can do when I get back on
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora

MrSergio wrote:

Alright, I'm not home so I can't make specific examples but I can explain most of the stuff.
First: What I meant with "unbalanced" was that after a really intense part which uses 1/6 doubles you place really long sliders that totally kill the movement and the rhythm of your map. Whether keep long sliders for all the map or keep the rhythm with doubles, otherwise it is too inconsistent (and also not appropriate for a diff, since you should keep difficulty somehow constant through the map and those sliders are obviously too easy)
Ok so to reply to this issue and explain myself. IMO I think the sliders being there should be fine but I see your point. The sliders tell the player that the song/map is coming to an end and it's consistent throughout the whole set (except of course Caffe's diff, which I think is fine because it's an extra diff and the final boss stage).

If you really think it kills the movement of my map then I guess I will remap all of the diffs, but I'm still going to stand up for the sliders because they still go with the music/rhythm and it's easily distinguishable from the 1/6 part of the music that plays with it (there is no sound for the long sliders in the first 1/6 part which is the reason why I don't have the sliders through the entire map which you say is inconsistent).


Second: Regarding structure on stage 3 (and in part also on 2, but I'm being too strict here probably).
As it is now stage 3 doesn't have any objective problems. What I meant there is that I can clearly see that patterns are more... idk... sloppy? I actually don't know how to describe it oerfectly but I can see it is more "just because".
You said you mapped all of the difs pretty close in time, which means that all diffs have such a problem partially (in my eyes at least).
As I said, this is not a problem but it is something you should work on for your next maps: try to give more meaning for each object to be where it is, not placing them because you want to move the cursor from x1 y1 to x2 y2 (some patterns on stage 3 are just simple curves from a corner of the screen to the other iirc).
This sort of stuf is usually kinda planned before starting the map or after 5-10secs of mapping, because it is like a frame for your painting (your map).
I see what you mean (sort of) about the differences in my difficulties. But yeah, as a new mapper I kind of run out of ideas so I start mapping in a different/new way (style?) but not really. It's hard to explain. And my mapping style based on difficulty is usually really different because I'm so new. This is actually the first time I've mapped E, N, H, I usually map 4* and above and most of my practice maps are marathons that are obviously more consistent as 1 difficulty. but yeah, I still would like to go over Stage 3 (and stage 2?) to see what you have in mind for examples/stuff I can improve. Remember that Stage 2 is a collab with Pereira006, and he mapped the Kiai time


Here is the source Album, if you see anything I should add to tags please let me know :o

http://vgmdb.net/album/211

https://www.discogs.com/Yuzo-Koshiro-Ba ... ase/665962
Last edited by Ora , edited 1 time in total.
- Frontier -
1,854 posts
Joined April 2014
- Frontier -
hi i'm late
[General]
  1. Put "Pereira006" in tags too since he collab with you
  2. Maybe put "Bare Knuckle" in tags. It's an album's name

MrSergio wrote:

If you can improve a bit more structure on stage 3 (and maybe also 2) I can icon it :p
I'm just lazy so I'll mod Stage 2 and 3

[Stage 2 Collab]
  1. 00:56:118 (1,4) - These aren't parallel.
  2. 01:05:451 (3) - Maybe make like this for more aesthetic?
Actually, this diff is okay.

[STAGE 3]
  1. 01:12:917 (1,2,3) - These shouldn't overlap each other! Separate these.
GL no kd please
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora

- Frontier - wrote:

hi i'm late
[General]
  1. Put "Pereira006" in tags too since he collab with you
  2. Maybe put "Bare Knuckle" in tags. It's an album's name

MrSergio wrote:

If you can improve a bit more structure on stage 3 (and maybe also 2) I can icon it :p
I'm just lazy so I'll mod Stage 2 and 3

[Stage 2 Collab]
  1. 00:56:118 (1,4) - These aren't parallel.
  2. 01:05:451 (3) - Maybe make like this for more aesthetic?
Actually, this diff is okay.

[STAGE 3]
  1. 01:12:917 (1,2,3) - These shouldn't overlap each other! Separate these.
GL no kd please
Thanks ^^ I will check your mod with the next BN post :o
Thanks for reminding me about the Pereira006 tag
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora
Ok, so I changed some stuff on STAGE 5, just to give the slider part some more life and make it not so dull. I adjusted the SV to make it gradually slower from .75 to .60 and then back up to .75. Having it strictly at .60 was dull, and sucked the life out of the ending, so I think it should play better now like STAGE 4

I also decided to stack the 1/6 patterns of "circle-slider" directly just because it plays more comfortably. I also remapped the pattern of 01:12:917 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) - so it flows better than before.
neonat
Beatmap Nominator
3,528 posts
Joined April 2012
neonat
stage 1

00:39:318 (3) - why not have the slider end higher up, or rotate it more to be more even, it can help the movement from 00:38:852 (2,3) as well as well as the movement to 00:40:718 (4,1)
01:05:451 (1) - reason to NC this one?

stage 2

stood out from the rest from before as unlike the rhythms before this section they usually had the 2 1/2 circles that start 1 white line before the next phrase, like 00:10:853 (5,6) - maybe if you had 00:14:119 (6) - change into a circle at 00:14:119 and then did the same thing like before with the circles starting at 00:14:586 then I think it could match better
00:16:219 (3,3,3,3,3) - etc. I think while the actual beats are fine, but having the slider end at that position, 00:16:452 - 00:20:186 - 00:23:919 - so on so forth, now if you swap the circle with the slider's position, 00:23:686 (3,4) - 00:27:419 (3,4) - 00:31:152 (3,4) - etc. the clicking coincides with the song's descending pitch over 1 beat that leads to a held sound (namely what you hear at 00:31:385 - 00:31:619 and 00:31:852 - )

stage 3

00:21:119 (2) - could pattern it better with 00:20:186 (5,1)
01:07:318 (1,2,1,2) - why only stack these lol

In terms of placement, it just seems that sometimes, the patterns look out of place and not polished, like the pattern before and the pattern after it look jarring side by side/sloppy one moment, organised the next. I can't really say much about the rhythm, there's nothing really in the music

stage 4

other than the multiple repeat sliders in stage 3, there is no other 1/4 beats in there, but stage 4 uses a whole lot more, and last more than 2-3 beats in consecutive length. I think you need to consider that, even if the star rating does not indicate much because of the spacing and all

stage 5

00:17:619 (4,5,6,7,8) - the transition from slider to stream here is quite forced
01:07:318 (1) - eh, I think it really could use a better shape, a lot of the body just merges together, especially the slider end, it's just half sticking out of the body
01:14:784 (1,2) - the only one you don't stack out of all th difficulties, that kinda throws away consistency, but you didn't stack because of pattern so eh, try and fix on something to ensure it remains constant for everything, because if everything else shows one thing, if one doesn't do so, it gets really obvious



Just my suggestions

Good Luck
Pereira006
osu! Alumni
2,801 posts
Joined October 2010
Pereira006

neonat wrote:

[

stage 2


00:16:219 (3,3,3,3,3) - etc. I think while the actual beats are fine, but having the slider end at that position, 00:16:452 - 00:20:186 - 00:23:919 - so on so forth, now if you swap the circle with the slider's position, 00:23:686 (3,4) - 00:27:419 (3,4) - 00:31:152 (3,4) - etc. the clicking coincides with the song's descending pitch over 1 beat that leads to a held sound (namely what you hear at 00:31:385 - 00:31:619 and 00:31:852 - ) I wasn't follow beat,, just follow main instrument, the sound instrument sound strong than beat normal. I just put 1/2 slider because is fit better for this instrument small long. Prefer this way
ty check
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora

neonat wrote:

stage 1

00:39:318 (3) - why not have the slider end higher up, or rotate it more to be more even, it can help the movement from 00:38:852 (2,3) as well as well as the movement to 00:40:718 (4,1) I agree, fixed it as best as I can. Hope it looks fine now
01:05:451 (1) - reason to NC this one? woops, happened when I changed the slider shape in the last mod. Fixed!

stage 2

stood out from the rest from before as unlike the rhythms before this section they usually had the 2 1/2 circles that start 1 white line before the next phrase, like 00:10:853 (5,6) - maybe if you had 00:14:119 (6) - change into a circle at 00:14:119 and then did the same thing like before with the circles starting at 00:14:586 then I think it could match better So...for this part I agree with you, but the problem is if I do that I feel like the part will be too dense with circles for the difficulty. (what do you think?). I could also just add a circle at 00:14:819 - . I just think the rhythm will be too hard for normal if I do that

stage 3

00:21:119 (2) - could pattern it better with 00:20:186 (5,1) yeah sloppy...fixed ^_^
01:07:318 (1,2,1,2) - why only stack these lol are you talking about 01:07:318 (1,3) - ? I'm confused...if so, I fixed lol

In terms of placement, it just seems that sometimes, the patterns look out of place and not polished, like the pattern before and the pattern after it look jarring side by side/sloppy one moment, organised the next. I can't really say much about the rhythm, there's nothing really in the music i hear you and sergio saying "sloppy" but I don't see examples of where. I want to improve parts if you think it's sloppy but I'm a somewhat new mapper so I have trouble seeing those things without specific examples :o

stage 4

other than the multiple repeat sliders in stage 3, there is no other 1/4 beats in there, but stage 4 uses a whole lot more, and last more than 2-3 beats in consecutive length. I think you need to consider that, even if the star rating does not indicate much because of the spacing and all wow, you're right I just realized the huge jump in 1/4 rhythm...is this a huge issue? Do you think I can fix it or do you think I should just remap stage 3 (I am willing to remap). Stage 3 seems to be the major problem of the whole set...

stage 5

00:17:619 (4,5,6,7,8) - the transition from slider to stream here is quite forced In terms of flow, I feel like it's fine because it plays just as you were to have a 1/4 slider at 00:17:853 (5,6) - except the player is expecting a stream because of the rhythm pattern I use through the whole map
01:07:318 (1) - eh, I think it really could use a better shape, a lot of the body just merges together, especially the slider end, it's just half sticking out of the body I agree, what do you think of the new one? :S
01:14:784 (1,2) - the only one you don't stack out of all th difficulties, that kinda throws away consistency, but you didn't stack because of pattern so eh, try and fix on something to ensure it remains constant for everything, because if everything else shows one thing, if one doesn't do so, it gets really obvious oops, I changed these sliders recently and forgot I had them stacked in the previous part

Just my GREAT sugestions

Good Luck

Thanks so much neonat, you didn't have to do this! I would love if you could reply to some of my questions and give some advice for the next step of the mapset
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora
Okay, so I remapped some of the issues with Stage 3 including sloppy flow and adding in some 1/4 rhythms to scale up with STAGE 4 better. 1/4 rhythms were added to the beginning 00:04:319 (2,3) - 00:08:053 (2,3) - 00:11:786 (2,3) - and 00:14:586 (5,6,1) - .

Some remapping:

neonat wrote:

In regards to Stage 3, here are some parts that seem to get somewhat off in pattern as you go along:
00:13:652 (2,3,4,5,1) - remapped
00:27:419 (4,5,1,2,3) - remapped
00:35:119 (5,1,2) - I don't agree that this should be remapped, the pattern sticks with the flow into the next part at 00:36:518 (3,4,5) -
00:38:852 (5,1,2,3) - remapped (yeah this was probably the worst. It was really awkward to play before)
00:43:518 (2,3,4,1) - I remapped 00:43:052 (1,2) - so that it flows better to that next part
01:01:718 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4) - This was also lazy of me :o REMAPPED
Hopefully someone rechecks :? I know I screwed up on Stage 3 but I'm trying really hard to improve

To everyone who is supporting me with this set, as well as my GDers Caffe and Pereira, I think I'm done looking for BNs for this. I've tried really hard but the song is just not appealing to most of them and they seem not interested. I won't be surprised if this ends up in the graveyard for now, but I guess that's just how it has to be

Thanks everyone!
Seijiro
osu! Alumni
3,438 posts
Joined April 2013
Seijiro

Ora wrote:

I think I'm done looking for BNs for this. I've tried really hard but the song is just not appealing to most of them and they seem not interested. I won't be surprised if this ends up in the graveyard for now, but I guess that's just how it has to be
Not trying to sound harsh here, but just one month passed since my last post and you're telling me 1 month is the limit of what you can do?
Probably you have not a single a clue how much I waited for my first map to get noted by someone spoiler: 6 months.

You also said you improved stage 3 but I can't notice a big difference from last time I checked. Structure is still the same overall.
Maybe we have wrong definitions about "trying hard" but I was expecting at least a remap on this diff, just as a test to see if you improved in the meantime and can do it better. Don't hope to patch up structure with hundreds of fixes either lol, since it's a basic concept of a map and it has to be built up before you even start mapping.

Let me bring some examples of what I mean with "lack of structure" on stage 3:
- 01:05:451 (1,2,3,4,5) - what do they mean? I'm referring to their positioning and slider directions, they look "just because". Just an example to show you what it means to structure better a pattern. This is the most basic structure you can use: mirroring. In that screen I simply used 2 sliders, repeated one after each other. Yes, this may be lame or boring (up to everyone to decide that), but it's way better that random curves and slider shapes.
- 00:47:718 (3,4) - why not both being straight sliders? Is the last one that special to deserve that curve? lol
- 01:03:584 (1,1) - I guess you added an extra NC here
- 01:10:118 (3,1) - this is probably something personal, but although they have a sort of "general concept" they still lack something... it's probably because I can't give a meaning to that complex shape. If you make something particular make sure that it represents something outstanding in the song which is easy to recognize (and pay attention to aesthetics, it's important)
- 01:18:517 (1) - how can I relate this slider shape with the previous ones? ^
- 00:05:719 (1,2,3,4,5) - let's take again structure here. I tried finding a meaning for it, but in the end I just think "it goes from xy1 to xy2 on the playfield". Another lame example
- 00:11:319 (1,2,3,4) - even curves like this one... they are fine overall, but structure wise they just tell nothing :/
- 00:14:586 (5,6,1) - minor, but visual DS may be made more equal I guess
- 00:18:786 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - instead let's take up a good example here (you forgot a NC somewhere here too btw). This one is really solid, from start of the pattern to end.

Anyway, I guess I went full spartan mode just now, sorry.
This is mainly what I was referring to with "structure": it's something that involves whole patterns at a time, and sometimes even the whole map altogether. That's why you can't really fix it up with modding and that's also why I hoped you were gonna do something about it on your own (I don't like telling people to remap stuff, but it usually brings many bonuses).
So yeah, that's that..

On above stages it is harder to notice such structure inconsistencies due to higher spacing while for lower diffs you're restrained by the low spacing again so umh... this is why I picked stage 3 here (but it can probably be applied on all diffs, even on the final boss stage if we want to be picky)
Ora
959 posts
Joined November 2014
Topic Starter
Ora
Not trying to sound harsh here, but just one month passed since my last post and you're telling me 1 month is the limit of what you can do?
Probably you have not a single a clue how much I waited for my first map to get noted by someone spoiler: 6 months.
You are taking this way out of context. This isn't me asking/begging for a bubble. It's me trying to find a BN (someone who is good at modding) to get some help with the mapset. I didn't hear back from you (I know you have other priorities and you don't owe me anything so it's fine) but I tried to reach out to others for help and was ignored every time I asked, even when I offered mods in return. I understand others have had to wait longer, but when I constantly get ignored for a month, I lose a lot of motivation to keep trying. I never said I wouldn't come back to the mapset either to try and finish it. That was just me telling everyone that I needed a break from it. I was exhausted and I wasn't getting anywhere.

You also said you improved stage 3 but I can't notice a big difference from last time I checked. Structure is still the same overall.
Maybe we have wrong definitions about "trying hard" but I was expecting at least a remap on this diff, just as a test to see if you improved in the meantime and can do it better. Don't hope to patch up structure with hundreds of fixes either lol, since it's a basic concept of a map and it has to be built up before you even start mapping.
When I said I was "trying hard to improve", i meant it as like trying to understand my own personal problems mapping overall but I guess I never really understood how bad it was until you posted here today. Stage 3 is deleted now and I will go for a remap. If there are any other diffs that should be remapped, please tell me now because I dont want to get to the end and realize that other stuff should have been remapped as well. But it's not your job to babysit me so I do appreciate the help and I won't call you back again. I really do want to thank you though Sergio because you have been the only one to actually respond to my messages and help me out.

I think if Stage 3 was really that bad you should have just told me to remap (not that it's your duty to do that or anything to do that for me), but I really wouldn't have had a problem with that. I was looking for a BN to tell me what I should do with my structure because I felt like I didn't get a full answer from you, which lead me to say I wasn't going to spend any more time looking for a BN (I was getting ignored by all of them, even when I offered mods in return). I just got confused because you said the structure was bad/sloppy without any specifics, and I never got a reply from about 1 month ago. Neonat helped me so I tried to fix those specifics that he gave me, but now you're saying the entire set has structural issues so now I'm starting to think the mapset is a lost cause.



Thanks

Let me bring some examples of what I mean with "lack of structure" on stage 3:
- 01:05:451 (1,2,3,4,5) - what do they mean? I'm referring to their positioning and slider directions, they look "just because". Just an example to show you what it means to structure better a pattern. This is the most basic structure you can use: mirroring. In that screen I simply used 2 sliders, repeated one after each other. Yes, this may be lame or boring (up to everyone to decide that), but it's way better that random curves and slider shapes. yeah I see
- 00:47:718 (3,4) - why not both being straight sliders? Is the last one that special to deserve that curve? lol I felt that 4 would flow better into the next curved slider 00:48:651 (1) - idk what I was doing
- 01:03:584 (1,1) - I guess you added an extra NC here
- 01:10:118 (3,1) - this is probably something personal, but although they have a sort of "general concept" they still lack something... it's probably because I can't give a meaning to that complex shape. If you make something particular make sure that it represents something outstanding in the song which is easy to recognize (and pay attention to aesthetics, it's important) yeah I was just making slider art, idk
- 01:18:517 (1) - how can I relate this slider shape with the previous ones? ^ i just like adding random curves to sliders in slow slider parts, I guess I didn't understand that they had to mean something. but I guess I just never understood why other mappers did similar things and I never thought about "why did they use this specific shape?".
- 00:05:719 (1,2,3,4,5) - let's take again structure here. I tried finding a meaning for it, but in the end I just think "it goes from xy1 to xy2 on the playfield". Another lame example yeah it's all random idk why I was so sloppy
- 00:11:319 (1,2,3,4) - even curves like this one... they are fine overall, but structure wise they just tell nothing :/
- 00:14:586 (5,6,1) - minor, but visual DS may be made more equal I guess
- 00:18:786 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - instead let's take up a good example here (you forgot a NC somewhere here too btw). This one is really solid, from start of the pattern to end. ok this is good to know, because if I can do something right then I can try to build off of it. I never really understood what was right/wrong with my "structure" so this is helpful.
I have Stage 3 remapped now and I feel a lot more confident. I'll go look for more mods now
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