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automatic mapping?

posted
Total Posts
34
lawiee
8 posts
Joined August 2015
Topic Starter
lawiee
so... i know this might sound crazy or beyond belief, but imagine if it were possible for some sort of code (don't ask me i don't know these things) that would allow osu songs to map themselves, perhaps useful for turning entire music livestreams into live-beatmaps you can play along with the livestream
just imagine being able to not only listen to a monstercat stream, but to be able to play along to it too.

by the way, i have no idea how this could become a reality, its merely an idea that i hope will intrigue people who can make this a reality.
itsMapleLeaf
33 posts
Joined July 2010
itsMapleLeaf
I can guarantee someone's thought of this before. Like, ages ago. It's not really a novel concept, especially with a game like Audiosurf floating around. The difference between osu! and AS is that the "notes" in AS rarely ever go to the beat. Sure, the track gets more intense as the song gets more intense, but to the extent of how much it manages to match the music... that's pretty much it.

Now imagine if we attempted to implement the same kind of autogen in osu!. Trying to accurately click such off-rhythm circles would be hell. And that's pretty much end of story. It's not something that can be done so easily. Rhythm and beat detection exists, but it's nowhere near accurate to the level of quality you'd receive from a hand-mapped chart.
Kathex
200 posts
Joined September 2014
Kathex
Basicly its possible, but every map would have same or totaly random characteristics generated by the algorithm like what happen to beatmap converter to other game modes: taiko ctb, mania. Anyway its a bad thing, because maps represents personal likes of who maps, then play maps generated by a alghorithm lose the sense of peoples playing things made by peoples.
But who knows in the future they add a thing like this just for fun?
Anyway to make a algorithm for STD generate maps is very waste of time...

Suggestions for improve the actual map editor are welcome, like make more easy timming of a song... etc. kek
Allas
49 posts
Joined March 2011
Allas
While it is possible to turn a livestream/youtube, mp3 or whatever into a somewhat decent beatmap without personally mapping it (via a program), there is no way to play it live in osu! while it's doing it's job.

The quality of beatmap varies greatly between genres of music and many other things that can lead to quite repetitive/strange map. It's also quite complicated (time consuming) to program such a thing, well at least for osu!std if you want patterns that make sense. It can also calculate the BPM and offset internally unless you want people to type it like in the editor as an input but that would make batch processing multiple songs harder.

I've personally programmed one of those program as a fun project a while ago (I'm sure a few others did too). I've focused on non-standard modes for simplicity sakes and while it get the job done, I'm not impressed by the varying quality of beatmap it produce. Sure, with some tweaks here and there I'm sure I could get something decent out of it but trying to teach different style of mapping / patterns to a program is time consuming. It's also near impossible to make a pattern while doing it live as you don't know when the next beat is going to be. However you can get around that with post-processing.

It's was quite a fun project and I recommend doing it yourself if you like programming.
mizuki-chan
333 posts
Joined April 2016
mizuki-chan
It would be too great to be reality that such a program can auto-map as good as a handmade map, i guess :D
lawiee
8 posts
Joined August 2015
Topic Starter
lawiee
so essentially it would be possible if rhythm and beat detection was accurate enough and would only really be useful for offline training, and would be a pain to code
Bauxe
1,624 posts
Joined August 2012
Bauxe
It wouldn't be useful for anything. autogen maps would be terrible.
BirdyThePhoenix
43 posts
Joined March 2016
BirdyThePhoenix
Would be amazing if something like this could be coded well, but the thing is that a machine just can't replace the human element. There are so many different things that make up a beatmap, and a machine wouldn't be able to produce the high quality beatmaps that people can make.
mizuki-chan
333 posts
Joined April 2016
mizuki-chan

BirdyThePhoenix wrote:

Would be amazing if something like this could be coded well, but the thing is that a machine just can't replace the human element. There are so many different things that make up a beatmap, and a machine wouldn't be able to produce the high quality beatmaps that people can make.
Exactly. Take for example what do you consider rythm? Some want to go more for vocals, others will go for drums.
A machine cant really "feel" rythm.
Flanster
5,938 posts
Joined August 2010
Flanster
This idea has been floating around for years, its not something new. To be compeltely honest, the amount of work you'd have to do on perfecting such a program would probably be tons more than just mapping something.
Yuudachi-kun
5,432 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

Flanster wrote:

This idea has been floating around for years, its not something new. To be compeltely honest, the amount of work you'd have to do on perfecting such a program would probably be tons more than just mapping something.

That's a dumb excuse - you don't make the program to make one map. You use it to make hundreds
Bara-
11,961 posts
Joined April 2013
Bara-
Would be fine for Taiko/Mania, though the quality will likely be bad, but due to the 'limited amount of options' it will likely be okay-ish
CtB, and especially standard will get terrible maps

Maybe a good idea would be that the player times it first, so atleast everything will be properly snapped (maybe even force the player to set correct BSD (1/3, 1/4, 1/8 etc.))
Houtarou Oreki
303 posts
Joined March 2014
Houtarou Oreki
Aren't there programs for detecting timing? I heard they work well most of the time. But yeah - standard would probably be really bad. Timing circles/sliders isn't that undoable but making distances so that maps would flow good and feel nice seems rather impossible
Shohei Ohtani
Shohei Ohtani
Auto-mapping programs exist

https://osu.ppy.sh/s/90854

I actually remember going in and trying to use the auto-map thing (I forgot how I got my hands on the program) and what ended up happening was that it just placed a fuckton of notes and I had to spend a LOT of time re-arranging the notes into a way that didn't look like garbage. Especially in 2016 where people literally shit themselves over imperfect blankets, there'd have to be a LOT of finesse to make the program work and you're pretty much just stuck being a re-arranger rather than a mapper, which takes roughly the same amount of time if you're trying to create a coherent product

although everyone's fucking easies nowaday are bland as shit so maybe that's okay
Flanster
5,938 posts
Joined August 2010
Flanster

Khelly wrote:

Flanster wrote:

This idea has been floating around for years, its not something new. To be compeltely honest, the amount of work you'd have to do on perfecting such a program would probably be tons more than just mapping something.

That's a dumb excuse - you don't make the program to make one map. You use it to make hundreds
Mapping something actually good.
Seijiro
osu! Alumni
3,438 posts
Joined April 2013
Seijiro
that will give us just a shitton of identical maps (we already have a lot of maps looking alike now, imagine if this program gets release).
I find mapping as a sort of art. Unless our pc can think on its own, I wouldn't want it.
Alpgh367
55 posts
Joined March 2016
Alpgh367
Although I don't think this is feasible or viable, it would be really cool if someone actually went ahead and did this.
lawiee
8 posts
Joined August 2015
Topic Starter
lawiee
theres one idea that i havent seen anyone really address though, what if thsi automapping thing were to be used for a music livestream? is it possible for it to detect rhythm consistently and on the go?
Yuudachi-kun
5,432 posts
Joined August 2014
Yuudachi-kun

Flanster wrote:

Mapping something actually good.
Oh well then you should've just said that in the first place.
Flami
26 posts
Joined December 2013
Flami
Honestly, hand-made maps are the best and most likely will continue to be the best maps in osu! I just don't see how an "automatic mapping" system could beat something made with human thoughts and actions.
Stefan
Global Moderator
10,404 posts
Joined January 2011
Stefan
The question is: why?
Asaiga
848 posts
Joined July 2013
Asaiga
It's cool to see how machines can auto generate maps. And that's it, for entertaining purpose only.
Might see some random cool things that can inspire you in your maps but definitely can never replace even a **** tier mapper.
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