HAHAHA karsh ftw
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The official osu! mascot
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Progress has been made. Keep idle discussion in this thread, but if you're an artist interested in helping out, please post over here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3897
Topic Starter
awp wrote:
As per LH's request, played around with the three prominent designs and rolled them all into one awp-idea
Also, what's that? Another link plzKarsh wrote:
*attachment of evils*
Any chance of those pics coming back? I wanted to save the "solution" pic :D
all your chan are belong to us.
I've thought about two things we might want to start thinking about for the mascot: A name and a voice. My first ideas are that we could name her after one of the Ouendan cheerleaders or Elite Beat Divas as homage, and I know several message boards where people do amateur voice acting for free. We'd need the usual countdown, a miss clip, and maybe some shouts at certain points as an extra whistle/finish.
Prototype name was "Pippi" because lol peppyBehonkiss wrote:
I've thought about two things we might want to start thinking about for the mascot: A name and a voice.
I might have a cute voice for "pippi" (or whatever her name is) in mind... I just gotta run the idea by her. If not, I have other people in mind. Just give me a list of things to record and stuff.Behonkiss wrote:
I've thought about two things we might want to start thinking about for the mascot: A name and a voice.
Topic Starter
There are 2 more details I'll have to add when I'm home again: The skirt, and the hair. I tried to create a skirt, but I can't simulate that newly-ironed look(I know what to do, it simply won't work), so is a more round-looking skirt OK?
Heres a pic of the mascot That i colored pixel by pixel in Paint.NET.
It was hard to do.
Also Some1 should make a guy mascot so we have a male gender version for our male players? Have twin mascots or something.
I think the male one should have like a blue Osu! themed outfit and also the girl's fingers should have been more sharp to be more anime girl like.
It was hard to do.
Also Some1 should make a guy mascot so we have a male gender version for our male players? Have twin mascots or something.
I think the male one should have like a blue Osu! themed outfit and also the girl's fingers should have been more sharp to be more anime girl like.
Topic Starter
Metroid wrote:
Heres a pic of the mascot That i colored pixel by pixel in Paint.NET.
It was hard to do.
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dddddddddddddddddmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmhs+////////////////////////////+++++++++oo++++++osyhhhhhhhhhhhhhddddddddddmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmddddd
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mmmmmmmmmmNNNNNNNNNNNmmmmmmmmmmmdho++++/////////////////++++++////////+++++oooshdmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmdmmmmdmdddddddddddddddddddddddhhhhhhh
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Thank you, Captain Picard.
Topic Starter
I just realized one facepalm is not enough to describe how epic the failure was.
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So you hate my job of coloring.
at least I tried and I wasn't trying to be super detailed just a rough coloring sheesh.
at least I tried and I wasn't trying to be super detailed just a rough coloring sheesh.
what the fuck Sarumaru you said you were going to post the ink layer where is it D=
Topic Starter
That, and the way you colored it.Metroid wrote:
So you hate my job of coloring.
at least I tried and I wasn't trying to be super detailed just a rough coloring sheesh.
Well at least I tried Oh well I'll get back my beatmaps that need work. 
This map has been deleted on the request of its creator. It is no longer available.
So yea. What do you need from my end? Its almost a given YES that my friend will help out. She has the perfect voice for Pippi, based on what I'm seeing.
EDIT: Looks good, awp!
EDIT: Looks good, awp!
For voice, start with:RemmyX25 wrote:
So yea. What do you need from my end? Its almost a given YES that my friend will help out. She has the perfect voice for Pippi, based on what I'm seeing.
EDIT: Looks good, awp!
Are you ready?
3
2
1
Go!
And some kind of "oomph!" or "oh no!" for combo break. And perhaps "We did it!" for when a song is cleared.
I like the girl awp but maybe it has to much pink.
I know that osu! also has a lot of pink but maybe a little of contrast would be good.
For the voice i look forward to hear something cool.
I know that osu! also has a lot of pink but maybe a little of contrast would be good.
For the voice i look forward to hear something cool.
On the contrary, I think the pink adds the necessary touch to what is already present in the Osu! app.
Overall, I'd like to share my opinion: looking good so far!
Overall, I'd like to share my opinion: looking good so far!
...
Reminds me of peppy's old status as factory slave. =P
This map has been deleted on the request of its creator. It is no longer available.
Am I the only one who thinks that the cleavage is a bit much? It could easily be fixed by making the star one solid color.
A - it was originally designed for someone around the age of 17, where this sort of thing would be expected
B - in the chibi model, the inner star is pink because red is glaring
C - Pippi is known to be a bit of a tramp anyway~
B - in the chibi model, the inner star is pink because red is glaring
C - Pippi is known to be a bit of a tramp anyway~
She does fill that top quite a bit for a 15-year-old, what with the overlap and all. Pretty gifted mascot.
You'll thank us when she becomes legal~Saturos wrote:
She does fill that top quite a bit for a 15-year-old, what with the overlap and all. Pretty gifted mascot.
(and maybe non-fictional)
oh wait I got it once DessaChan's done with her Mikuru cosplay she should totally cosplay as osu! mascot at the next anime convention that'd be rad <3
DUDE That would be pretty amazing, and some of us can go there as the Ouendan! It's great advertising!awp wrote:
oh wait I got it once DessaChan's done with her Mikuru cosplay she should totally cosplay as osu! mascot at the next anime convention that'd be rad <3
Download: PippiVoice.zip
Here's the voice samples and a readme about them inside.
Please let me know what you think! Tina and I can always re-record if we have to.
The only issues I had were that they sound to "airy." How do i iron those little air sound particle things out?
Here's the voice samples and a readme about them inside.
Please let me know what you think! Tina and I can always re-record if we have to.
The only issues I had were that they sound to "airy." How do i iron those little air sound particle things out?
The recording is actually fairly clean, I thought. Also, I think the voice is possible, but needs re-recording.
My stance on it is, the voice could be a tad higher-sounding. Tighten the vocal chords a bit more. And the actual reading of the lines lacks the right emotion, it sounds a bit rushed, and the emphasis falls on the wrong places.
Applause is just a straight-up "we-did-it" and doesn't really feel excited or energetic. I picture Pippi jumping when she says this. Either stretch the We out (Weeeee~ DID IT!) or hook the "did" more (We DID it!)
combobreak's not too bad, I think maybe hook the No a bit more. Sound a bit more desperate, maybe.
Ready, counts, go - it almost sounds like it's in the reverse order. There's a real drop in the "One" - it sounds like the end of the sentence, when there's still "Go!" to go. Ready sounds more like a statement to me than a question, and I can't really pick up any distinct emphasis. Try saying "Are you ready?" and bob your head down at the "rea" (of ready) and back up at "dy" to see if you can feel the movement of it. Also, it might help to record the entire "Are you ready? Three, two, one, go!" all at once - it really sounds like each sound file was its own take, and feels a bit broken/jumbled.
readyLOL.wav - too much breath on the "ck" but other than that, <3
readyLOL2.wav - "Oss", not "oh sue"...also, is that your mouse clicking that I hear, Remdawg?
There is my "I have no regard for how this makes you feel" critique of take One. There's no reason we can't continue to work at it, right?
Try making exaggerated body movements when you say the lines. If you feel that you're there, that you're actually this character, it might come more naturally.
Also harass peppy to see what he thinks. And maybe LH, too.
My stance on it is, the voice could be a tad higher-sounding. Tighten the vocal chords a bit more. And the actual reading of the lines lacks the right emotion, it sounds a bit rushed, and the emphasis falls on the wrong places.
Applause is just a straight-up "we-did-it" and doesn't really feel excited or energetic. I picture Pippi jumping when she says this. Either stretch the We out (Weeeee~ DID IT!) or hook the "did" more (We DID it!)
combobreak's not too bad, I think maybe hook the No a bit more. Sound a bit more desperate, maybe.
Ready, counts, go - it almost sounds like it's in the reverse order. There's a real drop in the "One" - it sounds like the end of the sentence, when there's still "Go!" to go. Ready sounds more like a statement to me than a question, and I can't really pick up any distinct emphasis. Try saying "Are you ready?" and bob your head down at the "rea" (of ready) and back up at "dy" to see if you can feel the movement of it. Also, it might help to record the entire "Are you ready? Three, two, one, go!" all at once - it really sounds like each sound file was its own take, and feels a bit broken/jumbled.
readyLOL.wav - too much breath on the "ck" but other than that, <3
readyLOL2.wav - "Oss", not "oh sue"...also, is that your mouse clicking that I hear, Remdawg?
There is my "I have no regard for how this makes you feel" critique of take One. There's no reason we can't continue to work at it, right?
Try making exaggerated body movements when you say the lines. If you feel that you're there, that you're actually this character, it might come more naturally.
Also harass peppy to see what he thinks. And maybe LH, too.
She says "Are you ready?" way too quick, and the applause doesn't sound enthusiastic enough. The whole thing sounds really casual and not very appropriately bubbly, so you might want to re-record. As for the air sound issues, take each sound into Audacity and do the following:
-Highlight a 'silent' part of the line
-Choose Noise Removal from the Effect Tab
-Click Get Noise Profile.
-Highlight the whole sound.
-Choose Noise Removal again.
-Click Remove Noise. Voila!
I say take all this advice and have Tina do another round of recordings, but since the window is open for others, here's a list of demos for amateur voice actresses that do stuff like this, Flash animations, and fandubs for free. I think that Rina-chan and Mippa have good voices for the character.
http://voiceacting.proboards62.com/inde ... hread=8414
-Highlight a 'silent' part of the line
-Choose Noise Removal from the Effect Tab
-Click Get Noise Profile.
-Highlight the whole sound.
-Choose Noise Removal again.
-Click Remove Noise. Voila!
I say take all this advice and have Tina do another round of recordings, but since the window is open for others, here's a list of demos for amateur voice actresses that do stuff like this, Flash animations, and fandubs for free. I think that Rina-chan and Mippa have good voices for the character.
http://voiceacting.proboards62.com/inde ... hread=8414
That's what I thought, but she had to be somewhere very soon. I'll make note of that.awp wrote:
The recording is actually fairly clean, I thought. Also, I think the voice is possible, but needs re-recording.
My stance on it is, the voice could be a tad higher-sounding. Tighten the vocal chords a bit more. And the actual reading of the lines lacks the right emotion, it sounds a bit rushed, and the emphasis falls on the wrong places.
Applause is just a straight-up "we-did-it" and doesn't really feel excited or energetic. I picture Pippi jumping when she says this. Either stretch the We out (Weeeee~ DID IT!) or hook the "did" more (We DID it!)
You want them all in one file? Ok then, i'm assuming you'll break them later.awp wrote:
Ready, counts, go - it almost sounds like it's in the reverse order. There's a real drop in the "One" - it sounds like the end of the sentence, when there's still "Go!" to go. Ready sounds more like a statement to me than a question, and I can't really pick up any distinct emphasis. Try saying "Are you ready?" and bob your head down at the "rea" (of ready) and back up at "dy" to see if you can feel the movement of it. Also, it might help to record the entire "Are you ready? Three, two, one, go!" all at once - it really sounds like each sound file was its own take, and feels a bit broken/jumbled.
ahaha they weren't meant to be taken seriously, but i'll pass the note alongawp wrote:
readyLOL.wav - too much breath on the "ck" but other than that, <3
readyLOL2.wav - "Oss", not "oh sue"
...No... >.>awp wrote:
...also, is that your mouse clicking that I hear, Remdawg?
...
Ok yes.
Of course not!awp wrote:
There is my "I have no regard for how this makes you feel" critique of take One. There's no reason we can't continue to work at it, right?
Noted.awp wrote:
Try making exaggerated body movements when you say the lines. If you feel that you're there, that you're actually this character, it might come more naturally.
When I'm confident in it, sure.awp wrote:
Also harass peppy to see what he thinks. And maybe LH, too.
Again, i realize she was rushing too much. There's a small personal issue going on that let to rushed voice acting. We're settling this soon.Behonkiss wrote:
She says "Are you ready?" way too quick, and the applause doesn't sound enthusiastic enough. The whole thing sounds really casual and not very appropriately bubbly, so you might want to re-record.
Behonkiss wrote:
I think that Rina-chan and Mippa have good voices for the character.
http://voiceacting.proboards62.com/inde ... hread=8414
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Topic Starter
The voice could work, but the pronunciation needs some work. Tina also seems to have a problem with high tones, although I mainly base this on the LOLs. Warming up for a minute or two by doing weird sounds with varied pitches, and using exaggerated mouth movements when recording the lines should help. The "Are you ready?" is way to quick and the 1, 2 and 3 in the countdown should all have the same pitch. Also, personally, I think the ending thing is a bad idea. And air problems aside, the quality is fine.
More screwing around from last night, tweaked slightly today
=\
which is better, mouth open or closed?
=\
which is better, mouth open or closed?
Closed.
Topic Starter
Open, but it's a pretty unimportant detail.
Download: DCX - Flying High (jericho2442) [Ultimate's CrazyRave (old)].osu
Download: DCX - Flying High (jericho2442) [Ultimate's CrazyRave (old)].osu
Open.
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Try a different pose, standing doesn't seem to fit this situation.
It's pretty much scrapped at this point.Reikin wrote:
Try a different pose, standing doesn't seem to fit this situation.
Topic Starter
3ds is giving me hell. I've been stuck on the fucking skirt for DAYS. Not even asking for help on the Autodesk board seems to be of much help. <_>
But I'm close, I know it. I WILL make that damn nudist wear a skirt. >:[
But I'm close, I know it. I WILL make that damn nudist wear a skirt. >:[
You can't just model a belt and use some sort of cloth material type to just fold itself around her figure? Last I heard/saw/thought, 3DSMax6 could automate a bunch of stuff.
Topic Starter
I've already modeled the belt, but the only way to make it look like the belt is holding the skirt in place is to put it IN the belt. That's where the Cloth modifier's lack of functions kills me. <.<
But I have an idea... o.o
But I have an idea... o.o
Topic Starter
FUCK YOU AUTODESK
The mascot file is corrupted. So is my backup. Same with the three auto-backups. POOF. GONE.
Download: Snowkel - Namikaze Satellite (TV Size) (Slanox) [Insane].osu
The mascot file is corrupted. So is my backup. Same with the three auto-backups. POOF. GONE.
Download: Snowkel - Namikaze Satellite (TV Size) (Slanox) [Insane].osu
D:Loginer wrote:
FUCK YOU AUTODESK
The mascot file is corrupted. So is my backup. Same with the three auto-backups. POOF. GONE.
Topic Starter
Oh well, enough with the wristslitting. I have a non-corrupted file of the non-clothed body, so I should be able to remake it within an hour.
>_<
>_<
Removable Media backups~
Topic Starter
Wait a minute...
What does the hair look like from behind? Sarumaru's hairstyle looks like it's split in two, but wouldn't that make her bald in a small stripe at the back of her head?
What does the hair look like from behind? Sarumaru's hairstyle looks like it's split in two, but wouldn't that make her bald in a small stripe at the back of her head?
You've never seen a girl who parts her hair?Loginer wrote:
Wait a minute...
What does the hair look like from behind? Sarumaru's hairstyle looks like it's split in two, but wouldn't that make her bald in a small stripe at the back of her head?
Topic Starter
Not with the hair divided into STRIPES, no. <.<
Anyway, I figured it out. Just have to add some more details, and it'll be ready for criticism. :/
Anyway, I figured it out. Just have to add some more details, and it'll be ready for criticism. :/
Topic Starter
So I have this picture here. I KNOW IT SUCKS, BTW. I just want to know how hard it sucks.
Failures I'm aware of:
Failures I'm aware of:
- Skirt is ugly and goes through body (That belt is causing all kinds of problems, can has remove plz?)
- Shading glitches (That belt is causing all kinds of problems, can has remove plz?)
- No nose
- Very ugly hair
- Unnecessarily high-poly (That belt is causing all kinds of problems, can has remove plz?)
- Large breasts, long arms and legs
- Ugly armpits
- Ugly belt (plzzzzzzz?)
- Some things are missing
Bullet form bitches
-Chin, or head in general, is too high up (isn't vertically long enough?).
-Face is way too flat. From this angle I can't see any cheekbones.
-Muscle tone on arms is basically absent (feels like tubes connected by blobs sort of).
-Fingers too fat and tubey
-Thumbs too thin
-Chest is too large (not just breast size, but overall has this broad-shouldered, muscular-ish build).
-Belt missing buckle (lol?).
-Hips/waist/ass lack definition
-Upper half of legs are thinner than lower half.
boot pix plz they look pretty awesome
-Chin, or head in general, is too high up (isn't vertically long enough?).
-Face is way too flat. From this angle I can't see any cheekbones.
-Muscle tone on arms is basically absent (feels like tubes connected by blobs sort of).
-Fingers too fat and tubey
-Thumbs too thin
-Chest is too large (not just breast size, but overall has this broad-shouldered, muscular-ish build).
-Belt missing buckle (lol?).
-Hips/waist/ass lack definition
-Upper half of legs are thinner than lower half.
boot pix plz they look pretty awesome
Topic Starter
I was trying to get it more anime-styled, which pretty much means flat face.awp wrote:
-Face is way too flat. From this angle I can't see any cheekbones.
<_<
>_>
awp wrote:
-Belt missing buckle (lol?).
I'll fix the other things on the list.I wrote:
[*]Some things are missing
Ask and you shall receive.awp wrote:
boot pix plz they look pretty awesome
Download: Kinya Kotani - BLAZE (TV Size) (tmokb93) [Hard +].osu
That's...not exactly true =x They still have depth and all that, it's just often implied via shading for 2D cartoons.Loginer wrote:
I was trying to get it more anime-styled, which pretty much means flat face.
Topic Starter
Yes, but that's what it looks like, and since the dancers won't have cartoon shading... <.<awp wrote:
That's...not exactly true =x They still have depth and all that, it's just often implied via shading for 2D cartoons.Loginer wrote:
I was trying to get it more anime-styled, which pretty much means flat face.
I could decrease the flatness a bit, though.
That head's so tiny compared to the rest of the body! It makes her look buff and muscular instead of visually appealing.
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Topic Starter
This map has been deleted on the request of its creator. It is no longer available.
unless she wears a very tight top, then it woud lack a bit of definition to the clothing (such as clothing folds/creases or the "Drapery effect" or whatever you call it)Loginer wrote:
Thanks for all the critique, but could ANYONE please answer my question? The top is currently a part of the body unlike in Sarumaru's drawing, is that fine?
Topic Starter
In that case, I'll redo the top and the skirt (No belt this time, although I could make it look a bit like one). It'll take a while, but it will look great if I don't phail. <.<
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The top is worn actually quite loosely - it's a size too large for her, so maybe you should keep that in mind when remodelling. Swoooooshy.
Topic Starter
Yup. Also, I recently looked at my old Ryuta model. I'm definitely remaking that one when I'm done with the mascot. <.<
Topic Starter
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More like what have you failed to do !!!
Topic Starter
I'll be a good factory slave from now on.
Also, I'll probably have to skip that star-shaped hole in the top. :/
Also, I'll probably have to skip that star-shaped hole in the top. :/
It's not actually a hole anymore - it's just a textured star. It was a hole for the 17 year old slut model, but she's been converted into a 15 year old sweetheart.
Topic Starter
Oh, good. Also, slight progress.
Edit: Make that a lot of progress.
Edit2: Almost done with the fixing. Just have to add the nose. Too bad that's so hard. D:
Edit: Make that a lot of progress.
Edit2: Almost done with the fixing. Just have to add the nose. Too bad that's so hard. D:
Are there no existing 3D anime girl models you can rip parts from use for reference?
Topic Starter
Tons, but I can't find any files. The problem is this: To add a nose, I'll have to add more edges to the face. However, this makes everything veeeery high-poly when I use Mesh Smooth. But if I remove all the unnecessary edges, the shading gets messed up, and the face will have lots of gray triangles on it. The only way to get around this is by making the nose a separate object, but this would make it look weird, as if it wasn't a part of the body.
Why are you using mesh smooth?
I thought this was going to be cell-shaded?
We're going for "better than DS," here, so I don't think you need to do too much AA...
Download: Marianas Trench - Cross My Heart (Natowa) [Irato's Normal].osu
I thought this was going to be cell-shaded?
We're going for "better than DS," here, so I don't think you need to do too much AA...
Download: Marianas Trench - Cross My Heart (Natowa) [Irato's Normal].osu
Topic Starter
...wut
.
LuigiHann wrote:
Why are you using mesh smooth?
.
If peppy could set that up, that would be great. :3LuigiHann wrote:
I thought this was going to be cell-shaded?
...You do know what AA is, right?LuigiHann wrote:
We're going for "better than DS," here, so I don't think you need to do too much AA...
Hey that low-poly model makes the flaws more apparent - that should be handy.
Topic Starter
It does, but the model's appearance changes drastically when Mesh Smooth is applied, so I thought it was a better idea to post the smoothed one.awp wrote:
Hey that low-poly model makes the flaws more apparent - that should be handy.
Oh, and since I've posted a new picture, how's the length on the arms/legs?
Arms appear to be a bit too long, but legs seem a good size. They're still way too thin (particularly above the knees). Also on the topic of limbs, the hands are huuuuge but I'm sure you'll get to that.
Topic Starter
Like I said, Mesh Smooth changes the model drastically. :/
Topic Starter
Of course, and it will also be ported for the PS3 and 360. Oh, and if you have an Ouendan 2 ROM on your PC, it will unlock a bonus game, where YOU are the mascot (Webcam not included).qwertyuiop wrote:
Our mascot will be making use of PhysX, right?
Also, I looked at the first video, and I'm not quite sure you know what PhysX does, nor how much CPU/GPU power it would drain.
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Topic Starter
complain nao plz
http://www.twinkfish.com/al/Tips04.jpg
courtesy of Alvin Hew <3
Al says (6:19 PM):
I realized I made her arms too long...
just a quick note
Now with more http://www.twinkfish.com/al/Tips05.jpg
courtesy of Alvin Hew <3
Al says (6:19 PM):
I realized I made her arms too long...
just a quick note
Now with more http://www.twinkfish.com/al/Tips05.jpg
Topic Starter
That was really useful. While it's very hard to add detail to a Mesh Smoothed model, it helped me fix the horrible pelvis. And I tried to add some detail, but it's barely visible.
Anyway, here's the latest pic. I've finished and scaled the hair, added kneecaps/elbows (Not visible from this angle), and done some other, smaller tweaks. Oh, and the face is slightly rounder.
Rank please?
Anyway, here's the latest pic. I've finished and scaled the hair, added kneecaps/elbows (Not visible from this angle), and done some other, smaller tweaks. Oh, and the face is slightly rounder.
Rank please?
Nice Boots.
Hair is looking better already. Still a bit thin/spaghetti-like though, as if it were made with playdough. Nose is looking better, maybe give the bridge more definition (or at least some, it seems nonexistent) there's no difference between forehead and eyesockets (not sure if texturing will cover that) and the head is still too small. Other proportions still need to be tweaked as well.
Topic Starter
I'll work on the hair and eventually the bridge. Textures will cover the eye thing, and I'll need a list of things to tweak. ._.awp wrote:
Hair is looking better already. Still a bit thin/spaghetti-like though, as if it were made with playdough. Nose is looking better, maybe give the bridge more definition (or at least some, it seems nonexistent) there's no difference between forehead and eyesockets (not sure if texturing will cover that) and the head is still too small. Other proportions still need to be tweaked as well.
I think hands are still too big D:
^Echo49 wrote:
I think hands are still too big D:
Topic Starter
OK, I'll shrink the hands. Anything else?
Topic Starter
Here's the 531980th rendering so far. I've fixed the problems you've pointed out (I hope) and fixed/reduced some shading glitches, mainly the one under the nose. Anything else?
Edit: Oh, and I just fixed the missing insides on the boots, so that's another one off the list.
Edit: Oh, and I just fixed the missing insides on the boots, so that's another one off the list.
Head is still a tad small, hair not meaty enough, calves reach their maximum diameter much too close to the kneecaps, arms lack muscle definition, *generic face complaints you're still aware of*.
wow my list is getting shorter though.
wow my list is getting shorter though.
It's certainly much better than it was before
Topic Starter
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Topic Starter
So I made it a little bigger. Anyway, render of the day:
Download: ZUN - Maiden's Cappricio ~ Dream Battle (Fight69) [LRJ's Hard].osu
Download: ZUN - Maiden's Cappricio ~ Dream Battle (Fight69) [LRJ's Hard].osu
I don't see anything wrong with the head, although the breasts can go up 2 or 3 cup sizes.
Not if peppy has anything to say about itRolled wrote:
I don't see anything wrong with the head, although the breasts can go up 2 or 3 cup sizes.
I hope you dieRolled wrote:
I don't see anything wrong with the head, although the breasts can go up 2 or 3 cup sizes.