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Taiko BAT ? [invalid]

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Topic Starter
Roga-don
Hi !
Sometimes, when I see some taiko difficulties that has been ranked, I think that some of them need to be improved for ranking.
Sometimes, I see the pending beatmaps forum, and I see that there are more and more beatmaps, including taiko beatmaps.
Sometimes, I think that we should do a Taiko BAT, then we will have better taiko difficulties, for taiko player's pleasure !

what's your position about that ?
Zekira
I've asked peppy about this quite a long time ago, and I think he said something like "The BATs should be able enough to check Taiko diffs." and thus he said there's no need for Taiko BATs.

...forgive me people, but I honestly asked that because I was interested in such a position.
lepidopodus
Well I hope they understood about Taiko maps much more than now...
Shohei Ohtani
I don't think they should be BATs, but a special group of people called TATs, Taiko Assistance Team.
Topic Starter
Roga-don
Yeah, TAT is a good name.

I think that taiko mode is important now, there is a lot of players and mappers, so the BAT team is not enough now.
Sushi
Yeah, I agree. besides there are some taiko rules that some BATs doesn't know.

"BATs are supposed to know modding Taiko" Yes, but atm, it's generally basic Taiko modding modding ( no details on patterns, they generally just verify the timing and some small stuff).

Most of the time, we say that the map is Rokodo/lepidon/arken/<insert good known taiko player here> certified. so, this group of person would be like them.

another solution : learn to BATs deep taiko mod (painful)
Zekira

CDFA wrote:

I don't think they should be BATs, but a special group of people called TATs, Taiko Assistance Team.
Jinxyjem suggested something like this name too lol, in the Family Dondon thread.

no details on patterns, they generally just verify the timing and some small stuff).
But just to remind that, unfortunately, creativity is not part of the ranking criteria.
Jinxy

Zekira wrote:

CDFA wrote:

I don't think they should be BATs, but a special group of people called TATs, Taiko Assistance Team.
Jinxyjem suggested something like this name too lol, in the Family Dondon thread.
Congratulations on remembering posts even I forget.
mekadon_old
...+support?
Yes, I might agree on BATs as well ranking taiko diffs. Taiko mods should be from a certified taiko modder (lol?) who actually know the rules in taiko mapping. Oh my my we should make a better taiko modding criteria these days since the old one is too formal :3

Zekira wrote:

But just to remind that, unfortunately, creativity is not part of the ranking criteria.
Objection. Some patterns are creative as well :3 Remember hataraku?
lepidopodus
Well, actually I don't think we need official team like Taiko BAT or TAT for now.

But at least we need active taiko modders or taiko modding queue or something like 'Integrated Taiko Modding Queue'....
Topic Starter
Roga-don
.... or BATs that mods only taiko maps.
I think that we need something official
Gabi
So anyone of you pro taiko players out there, could you explain exactly what to mod in a taiko diff?

The only thing that comes to my mind is patterns (hitsounds).

Anyways i don't see this being needed at all because taiko isn't really that official and you rarely find taiko diffs.


lepidopodus wrote:

Well, actually I don't think we need official team like Taiko BAT or TAT for now.

But at least we need active taiko modders or taiko modding queue or something like 'Integrated Taiko Modding Queue'....
This sounds much better
Zekira
Objection. Some patterns are creative as well :3 Remember hataraku?
Hahahahaha, but Hataraku is inevitably supposed to be like that lol. Actually I don't find that chart creative; I think 765 just went on crack and went "OH GOD PUT DONS HERE AND MAKE SURE THEY'RE CLUSTERED AAAAAAAAAAA. IT'S 320 BPM ANYWAY SO THAT'S STILL A 1/4 BEAT, NOT 1/8 LOLOLOL"
Topic Starter
Roga-don

Gabi wrote:

Anyways i don't see this being needed at all because taiko isn't really that official and you rarely find taiko diffs.
hum.
Just an example : Today I played 10 ranked beatmaps, and 4 of them had taiko diff :lol:
lepidopodus
Oh, importance of hitsound between Osu Standard diff and Taiko diff is really different, so don't ignore that.

Anyway, we need taiko modders before something like TAT, that's my opninion.
Topic Starter
Roga-don
hmmm ... Yeah but in a few months we will need a real team I think :?
Krisom
Well, I don't play Taiko, but I'd like to support Taiko players by hosting Taiko Guest Diffs in my maps. With that being said, I'd love to see a TAT group, or at least a modding queue from Taiko Players who check Taiko Diffs. That way, we would be sure that the Taiko diffs that get ranked are good :3.
Topic Starter
Roga-don
If you want, I can make to you all the taiko beatmaps you want
But It's out of propose, just PM me if you want ;)
Neo Adonis

Zekira wrote:

I've asked peppy about this quite a long time ago, and I think he said something like "The BATs should be able enough to check Taiko diffs." and thus he said there's no need for Taiko BATs.
I thought the same, but well... :roll:


Yeah, we need a Taiko Assistance Team, though!!! Support!!
Rokodo
Shohei Ohtani
A topic is cool and all but we need people who know what they're doing to check those maps made by using that topic, and to also help them make their map better. A person can tell you more than a topic.
Shiro
I agree with Roganis regarding some taiko specific maps and I think such a team is a good idea.

I'm not saying mapping taiko specific should be a privilege for taiko pros. Just like mapping osu! maps isn't a privilege for osu! pros, but they do provide help, there should be people that are somehow specialized in taiko mapping and that chan provide help for mappers who want a taiko diff.

If this cannot be made officially, mappers can just ask known taiko players/mappers.
Takuma
please don't make it TAT
i don't want people to be confused when i make the emoticon TAT

TAT
arien666
Well...

I agree this request 10000%...
But, I'll wait for next things atm...



ps. So, that's why HS system should be added<(?)
crystalsuicune
Hey,actually that's quite a good idea..especially when taiko criterias/standards
are quite different from those for normal osu! gameplay.

Besides,with the popularity of taiko-playage in osu!,I bet a team like
this will come in handy.
Sleep Powder
=o I'd rather join a TAT than a BAT

+ Support
vytalibus
While the idea of having some people focus on Taiko-specific maps is a good step towards quality, I must say that this must be something that BATs are already supposed to be able to do. Adding another line of "rankers" is a rather redundant move imho, as this is rather more easily resolved by having the current BATs be prepared to mod Taiko maps.

Though honestly, there is a rather huge difference between "getting a map ranked" and "having an awesome map". BATs around here are accustomed to check for more technical stuff like timing and file size; they're not going to tell you that your maps suck because that would be more subjective than what they're required to do. Several BATs would love to do that for you, but they also want to remind you about being able to improve your own maps.

<tl;dr>, decisions on patterns and quality should be up to the mapper and those who really want to see that map be improved pattern-wise.
Sir Minelli
In my opinion, there is no current need for an specific taiko approval team, nor CTB approval team.
Game focuses on osu! main, the rest is an extra feature.

If the osu! map was correctly modded and it got ranked, that means that it should work as well for Taiko.
Asking for a team who will be in charge to mod and rank "taiko maps" (which are basically osu! maps because is not as if you had a taiko editor), is like asking someone to "Aesthetic Mod" your taiko map.

If a Taiko specific editor were to be implemented, then you might consider this feature a bit more.
arien666

animask wrote:

=o I'd rather join a TAT than a BAT

+ Support
^



Umm...
Then, how about Taiko-authentic maps which are same patterns as TnT?
That needs 'Authentic' test...

Should TAT look at that thing...?
Topic Starter
Roga-don
Hmmm ...
Taiko players that play also originals taiko games should test authentic maps, personally I don't :D
Zekira
Taiko players that play also originals taiko games should test authentic maps,
Quiet, you! D:
lepidopodus

Sir Minelli wrote:

In my opinion, there is no current need for an specific taiko approval team, nor CTB approval team.
Game focuses on osu! main, the rest is an extra feature.

If the osu! map was correctly modded and it got ranked, that means that it should work as well for Taiko.
Asking for a team who will be in charge to mod and rank "taiko maps" (which are basically osu! maps because is not as if you had a taiko editor), is like asking someone to "Aesthetic Mod" your taiko map.

If a Taiko specific editor were to be implemented, then you might consider this feature a bit more.
We are talking about Taiko only diffs.
There's much more custom taiko diff than authentic taiko diff, and some of them are in low quality or even break basic rules. That's why we are talking about TAT or something (though I oppose for now...)
Osu standard and taiko mode share some aspects, but most important element is different: spacing is one of the most important factor in standard map, but in taiko there's no concept like spacing. Instead, hitsound is most important factor. This is why standard maps are not that good with taiko, so quite lots of taiko mappers make their own taiko map, and this is why good osu maps isn't always good taiko map.
(Well, did you ever open taiko only maps with editor? It completely ignores spacing and it cannot be played with osu standard. it shares same editor and same file formation, but it's different.)

But as I said, I oppose this TAT or TBAT idea before we made some criteria for taiko map, and appearance of many active taiko modders. So I agree with you with 'there is no current need for an specific taiko approval team, nor CTB approval team'.
luoyianwu
In my opinion, there should be a Taiko Bat.
There should be more difficulties in taiko mode, and they should be TAIKO ONLY.
ex.
M2U-Nightmare
Osu! only
*easy
*normal
*hard
*insane
Taiko only
*taiko-easy
*taiko-normal
*taiko-hard
*taiko-oni

and fruit cathing mode can just follow the Osu! beatmap.
btw, a good Osu map == a good taiko map. If you compare an Osu-taiko map with a Namco original map, you'll get it.
MMzz
I support this 100%, but i DON't Support it AT THE CURRENT TIME.

Reason:

We have no "set guidelines" on how to map Taiko. Most taiko maps are created in the relivent beat of the song, or the creativity of an induvidual. (witch would be very hard to judge IMO)


Also, it's not just the Taiko PROS that know how to map taiko. Every player can map taiko, it's not a factor of skill in actual play. (Well there does have to be a base amount of skill, so you have the sence to know that "YOU SHOULDNT PUT THIS IN A MAP BECAUSE IT PLAYS WRONG")

But if this does get put into place soon it would be nice, i've noticed a few maps that go against the current guidelines that are being ranked, before any type of mod for the song was made, by a BAT or a general player.

Sign me up P:
Saten
Bump~

I see nothing wrong with this atm since Taiko-only maps are now rankable.
Tanomoshii Nekojou

CDFA wrote:

I don't think they should be BATs, but a special group of people called TATs, Taiko Assistance Team.
Support. This will make sense.... :D :D :D
Stefan
Bumping it again.

It has good reasons why we don't have Taiko BATs. To CTB: We had actually nothing before Deif/eldnl joined as CTB BATs (except some "own" suggestions/opinions by Shiro or kanpaykin as example) and Deif/eldnl are obviously good for this Job. To o!m it's pretty much the same: The only one who could o!m Diffs properly were woc and DJPop.


For Taiko almost half of the BATs can mod them and judging them. I do not even think it's unfair or neccessary (due the Taiko Mapsets) because we simply have enough skilled BATs for Taiko Diffs.
TheVileOne
We already have taiko BATs. they just count as regular BATs. wmfchris is an example if he hasn't quit yet.
Kuro
Taiko BATs? I support this.

Actually, all of the BATs should be subdivided into different modes. Anyone with modding skills in more than one mode will be in both divisions of said modes:
  1. TAT (Taiko Appreciation Team)
  2. CtBAT (Catch the Beat Appreciation Team)
  3. MAT (Mania Appreciation Team)

Maybe with this we'll have more BATs that can actually offer good criticism instead of just "Hmm.. It looks fine, I guess" or "sorry, I can't mod taiko"
A few even skip taiko diffs, and rank the map based on the playability of the standard maps in the set. All I can ever say was "it could have been better" and move on.

If I had stars I'd throw them all at this request

TheVileOne wrote:

We already have taiko BATs. they just count as regular BATs. wmfchris is an example if he hasn't quit yet. Nice :I
Like the 4 or 5 that actually mod taiko on a regular basis?
Ephemeral
The teams will not be divided any further and we already have several members of staff whom are capable, established Taiko modders.
Shiro
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