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some advices for SB and Taiko mode

posted
Total Posts
50
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +57
xierbaliti
osu! Alumni
1,009 posts
Joined August 2008
Topic Starter
xierbaliti
To give more control on SB by relating the amount of SB elements with HP drain, for example, when hp reaches 25%, some elemnts will pop out
SPOILER
once it drop to 24%, the elements will disappear.
SPOILER
And when it reaches 50%, the whole interface will change and gets brighter...
SPOILER
Something like this that I want to put into my map http://osu.ppy.sh/s/25503 ;)

*not only will taiko mode benefits from it, but osu as well. For example, in a map with no break, we can actualize the section-pass and section-fall effect. Also it will enrich SB content. ;)

and some suggestions for Taiko mode:
1. Increasing the amount of notes appeared on the screen. Right now osu can only show about 9 notes at the same time (compare to taiko no tatsujin, which can show 15.5 notes) which is very limited especially with high sv since its too fast to react and if we can increase it to 15 notes, it would be easier to see the coming notes. ~_~




2. add another mod to taiko: that is, change blue to red and red to blue, a very entertaining mod. :D

it could be predicted that many new ideas would come out based on this new feature i guess.

NatsumeRin
osu! Alumni
4,032 posts
Joined August 2009
NatsumeRin
would be interesting.
Shiro
Global Moderator
4,984 posts
Joined May 2009
Shiro
I'd support that (especially the new mod - probably unranked ?) but I don't have any vote left. I kind of disagree with the SB thing though, it'd be kind of disturbing.
Verdisphena
4,240 posts
Joined June 2010
Verdisphena
Sounds nice :D
OzzyOzrock
5,185 posts
Joined August 2010
OzzyOzrock
The SB might be cool to further enhance authenticity, but no to the new mod.
Krisom
osu! Alumni
2,867 posts
Joined April 2009
Krisom
Support. I actually wanted to do this a while ago.
arien666
6,290 posts
Joined May 2009
arien666

Odaril wrote:

I'd support that (especially the new mod - probably unranked ?) but I don't have any vote left. I kind of disagree with the SB thing though, it'd be kind of disturbing.
Then, make like some option :3?
EBAWER123
151 posts
Joined August 2010
EBAWER123
Support both, awesome idea. あべこべ would be nice, instead of tediosly swapping dons and kats manually like POONwing does it will be much easier to just toggle it.
Azure_Kite
osu! Alumni
3,217 posts
Joined February 2009
Azure_Kite
I support the HP Storyboarding, actually.
Sander-Don
1,282 posts
Joined March 2010
Sander-Don
abekobe should be a taiko mod tbh, would be fun.
OzzyOzrock
5,185 posts
Joined August 2010
OzzyOzrock
no, this would make a lot of songs easier/not change anything in matters of difficulty.

I guess unranked mod for fun would be fine >_>
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira
YES TO ALL OF THESE!

1. Increasing the amount of notes appeared on the screen. Right now osu can only show about 9 notes at the same time (compare to taiko no tatsujin, which can show 15.5 notes) which is very limited especially with high sv since its too fast to react and if we can increase it to 15 notes, it would be easier to see the coming notes. ~_~
Especially this one about the scroll length! The fact that the screen can only fit 9 notes has... 'annoyed' me for god knows how long, as it makes HS2.0 almost unreadable when in the original game it was completely possible to read up to a speed of HS3.0 ._.

Can't I use money to get additional support stars please lol

HP Storyboarding would be HUGELY interesting. I have plans for an osu! SB that would look much, much better on HP trigger rather than pass-fail...

...where are my support stars when I need them?1 >_>

no, this would make a lot of songs easier/not change anything in matters of difficulty.
Who said mods needed to make the play easier or harder lol? I'd support it as an unranked mod, however.
Cristian
1,945 posts
Joined November 2009
Cristian
Good luck!
aquabluu
5,024 posts
Joined February 2008
aquabluu
1. Increasing the amount of notes appeared on the screen. Right now osu can only show about 9 notes at the same time (compare to taiko no tatsujin, which can show 15.5 notes) which is very limited especially with high sv since its too fast to react and if we can increase it to 15 notes, it would be easier to see the coming notes. ~_~
This, a thousand times over.
anongos
2,672 posts
Joined March 2008
anongos
Notes shown would be the best change ever. Make it happen!
OzzyOzrock
5,185 posts
Joined August 2010
OzzyOzrock
Forgot to mention that I fully +2000 support the notes shown thing :3

annoying being able to read stuff in the games but not osu!...
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira
Seriously, if there was an ability to shell out 5USD just to add +20 support to this, I would :<
Noobita
597 posts
Joined June 2009
Noobita
you forgot to mention an SB toggle, or you just didn't think about it and should D:
anyway great suggestions
AoiX
674 posts
Joined April 2010
AoiX
for a more powerful SB～
sherrie__fay
437 posts
Joined October 2010
sherrie__fay
:DDDsounds good..
NeoRainier
508 posts
Joined April 2010
NeoRainier

xierbaliti wrote:

and some suggestions for Taiko mode:
1. Increasing the amount of notes appeared on the screen. Right now osu can only show about 9 notes at the same time (compare to taiko no tatsujin, which can show 15.5 notes) which is very limited especially with high sv since its too fast to react and if we can increase it to 15 notes, it would be easier to see the coming notes. ~_~
That's something where i'd like to throw my votes :D

xierbaliti wrote:

2. add another mod to taiko: that is, change blue to red and red to blue, a very entertaining mod. :D

it could be predicted that many new ideas would come out based on this new feature i guess.
About this...maybe it should be a global mode, with reversed commands for osu and ctb, while in taiko we'll have that "joke".
OnosakiHito
osu!taiko Paragon
6,842 posts
Joined March 2010
OnosakiHito
Well, I had the same idea - and I guess some more people -, but I didn't mention this because there could be some problems, I guess?
If the scroll gonna be longer, there could be some problems:

- Every ranked Taiko diff.'s SB would not fit anymore
- All Taiko_BG's will be screwed lol
- It would make new possibilities to get better rankes > that means a big inflation of scores
- The MOD Hidden would be much harder (well, for me it's a good point, I like it. lol)
- makes some maps easier
- generel script problems (?)

I'm not agains this idea, I like it realy much. But if you think of it, it is much more complicated as it seams.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

Well I support it if it is easy to make/script.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201
Taiko score reset, ho!
anongos
2,672 posts
Joined March 2008
anongos

MetalMario201 wrote:

Taiko score reset, ho!
This, lol. OMG! What happened to my ranked score?!
Oh wait.....

Seriously though, OnosakiHito brings up a good point. So toggle option for the SB then? Instead of applying it universally to all beatmaps.
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira

MetalMario201 wrote:

Taiko score reset, ho!
If that's what it takes to change the scroll length, then gladly :D (lolololol)
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201

Zekira wrote:

MetalMario201 wrote:

Taiko score reset, ho!
If that's what it takes to change the scroll length, then gladly :D (lolololol)
We should take a vote. I'm no taiko expert, which has made it even harder for me to cope with the high HS.

I guess no score reset would be needed for something that can only reduce difficulty. More opinions needed.
lepidopodus
3,548 posts
Joined November 2009
lepidopodus
Those are features in Taiko no Tatsujin game. In TnT we can see one stanza in one screen(with HS 1.0), so that's why there's usually maximum 16 notes(1/4) in one screen in TnT. Don <--> Kat changing mode is called 'abekobe', and it's from Taiko no Tatsujin too. Those SB suggestions are also considered as features from TnT, hmm...

As I know Taiko players outside osu aren't that willing to play osu even there are really great features like multiplayer, ranking, etc., cause there's some differences between osu Taiko mode and TnT. We, Taiko players in osu are also influenced a lot from Taiko no Tatsujin. But I guess peppy don't want to make it more similar to TnT than now with various reasons... It's kinda dilemma to me, I guess.

And... Maybe we can consider adjusting accuracy window? (Not just narrowing it, I mean.)

EDIT:
Oh, and current mechanism of showing the note has some 'bug': when the map starts with low BPM and if there's changing to high BPM(needs big difference, though.), you can't see any notes in high BPM part with hidden mode. I guess this should be fixed?
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira
I guess no score reset would be needed for something that can only reduce difficulty. More opinions needed.
This was what I was thinking actually; there's no change in the scoring mechanics as the change is only aesthetic and doesn't affect numerical scoring.

(...if this sounds like I'm contradicting myself, then you probably didn't get that my last post was a joke :<)
anongos
2,672 posts
Joined March 2008
anongos

lepidopodus wrote:

And... Maybe we can consider adjusting accuracy window? (Not just narrowing it, I mean.)
This very much. While you can simply set overall difficulty to 7 to fix that, most mappers don't. The hit window for osu!taiko is pretty large compared to authentic TnT.

Maybe this could be an offset to a larger scroll window. Even if you could see more notes, the accuracy would be much stricter.
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira
This very much. While you can simply set overall difficulty to 7 to fix that, most mappers don't. The hit window for osu!taiko is pretty large compared to authentic TnT.
I'm happy that someone at least agrees with me on this. Heh... Well, Kantan is the only difficulty in the authentic games that have a more lax hit window

Also, I think it's actually OD7.5 and not OD7 or OD8

Applying a change like this however will necessitate a score reset, so I don't think this will happen.
Rikers
288 posts
Joined January 2011
Rikers

xierbaliti wrote:

SPOILER
Something like this that I want to put into my map http://osu.ppy.sh/s/25503 ;)
How did I know this was gonna be used as an example?


lepidopodus wrote:

And... Maybe we can consider adjusting accuracy window? (Not just narrowing it, I mean.)
This.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201
OD7/8 are fairly popular for higher difficulties. I don't see why this needs to be changed.

What's the trigger for crowd growth in TnT? Specific combo numbers? Health bar percent? Anyone have the specific numbers handy?

Also adding don/katsu scrolling text is somewhere on my todo list.
Azure_Kite
osu! Alumni
3,217 posts
Joined February 2009
Azure_Kite
Onomatopoeia would be absolutely Awesome!
lepidopodus
3,548 posts
Joined November 2009
lepidopodus

lepidopodus wrote:

Not just narrowing it, I mean.
osu Taiko mode --> easy to get 良, hard to get 可 than authentic Taiko. Getting miss is somewhat similar, though I think osu Taiko is easier to get missed. That's what I mean, though I never experimented it before, so don't think this is confirmed or something.

To be honest, I'm a bit negative about fixing accuracy window for now. Lots of maps might be considered as 'unplayable' due to high OD.

Current OD using in Taiko-only maps: Lots of them are just using 5. I raised OD to 6 recently, and some mappers using 7. 8 isn't popular for now.

Trigger of crowd growth is health bar percent. In authentic TnT exact persentage of health bar is a bit different by versions, I think.

Here's random Taiko play video of TnT. TnT 14 is most recent AC Taiko. (Not among whole series, actually)
SPOILER
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira

MetalMario201 wrote:

OD7/8 are fairly popular for higher difficulties. I don't see why this needs to be changed.
Current OD using in Taiko-only maps: Lots of them are just using 5. I raised OD to 6 recently, and some mappers using 7. 8 isn't popular for now.
QFT; maybe make it so that everytime the mode is set to Taiko, the OD is automatically set to 7? And if possible make it uneditable (:D);

by defaulting the OD on the future maps, no score reset would be necessary (I guess)

Trigger for crowd growth is health percent. I don't think it needs to be said, but crowd depletion also happens when health goes down. Crowd growth differs per difficulty though, since the health needed to pass is different among the 4 difficulties. I think this will be too much of a hassle so we should probably just stick to one default health bar regardless of difficulty
lepidopodus
3,548 posts
Joined November 2009
lepidopodus
I don't think everyone in osu agrees higher OD for now, though.
OnosakiHito
osu!taiko Paragon
6,842 posts
Joined March 2010
OnosakiHito
Can some one tell me in an easy english what Zekira wrote? I think there makes something no sense, otherwise I dunno what this example with OD 7 should be. In my eyes just groundless.

Edit: Okay, I understand it now right after reading lepidopodus post. It makes no sence to take a higher OD. WHat should be the reason to take it?
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201

Zekira wrote:

QFT; maybe make it so that everytime the mode is set to Taiko, the OD is automatically set to 7? And if possible make it uneditable (:D);
The thing is, OD is set before you select Taiko-only, so if we change it for one mode we change it for all of them.
If I'm to force OD7 for Taiko then I'm also removing tick 0.5 :D~

But if it's that the mappers don't like it then this is a problem with them and should be addressed as such? If mappers want a low OD, that's their choice and not a bug.
Easy difficulties could still make use of OD5 in Taiko.

Zekira wrote:

by defaulting the OD on the future maps, no score reset would be necessary (I guess)
Not if it affects existing maps. Which is the whole point?

Zekira wrote:

Trigger for crowd growth is health percent. I don't think it needs to be said, but crowd depletion also happens when health goes down. Crowd growth differs per difficulty though, since the health needed to pass is different among the 4 difficulties. I think this will be too much of a hassle so we should probably just stick to one default health bar regardless of difficulty
I vaguely recall the crowd going away entirely when I combo broke, so I thought it was based on combo length, as a percentage of the map's combo length...
osu! already has the passable HP threshold built-in, so using something other than that when it's correct behaviour would be silly.
OzzyOzrock
5,185 posts
Joined August 2010
OzzyOzrock
OD7 thing no please ;_;

I don't think adding more notes seen will need a score reset at all, as it's not making notes easier to hit (well, in some cases yes I guess, but you're bound to read that speed anyways at some point), just more authentic...
peppy
19,315 posts
Here since the beginning
peppy
Accuracy window won't be changed. OD mappings will not be changed, nor will the default. Number of hitObjects visible on the screen at once is one thing that has bugged me and can be changed without affecting the existing ranking too much.

SB triggers could easily be added for HPIncrease and HPDecrease (past a certain point) events.
anongos
2,672 posts
Joined March 2008
anongos

MetalMario201 wrote:

Also adding don/katsu scrolling text is somewhere on my todo list.
Would it behave in the same way as the notes in hidden mode?
Zekira
9,233 posts
Joined September 2008
Zekira
Number of hitObjects visible on the screen at once is one thing that has bugged me and can be changed without affecting the existing ranking too much.
This made my day :D
Azure_Kite
osu! Alumni
3,217 posts
Joined February 2009
Azure_Kite

Zekira wrote:

Number of hitObjects visible on the screen at once is one thing that has bugged me and can be changed without affecting the existing ranking too much.
This made my day :D
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201

anongos wrote:

MetalMario201 wrote:

Also adding don/katsu scrolling text is somewhere on my todo list.
Would it behave in the same way as the notes in hidden mode?
Either this or they would disappear entirely. Wasn't there a TnT mode where they were hidden?
Azure_Kite
osu! Alumni
3,217 posts
Joined February 2009
Azure_Kite
in Auth. Taiko, hidden mode removed the don and kat symbols, but left the onomatopoeia.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201

Azure_Kyte wrote:

in Auth. Taiko, hidden mode removed the don and kat symbols, but left the onomatopoeia.
What you're saying sounds like "they removed X but they kept X."
I guess what you mean is, they removed the orange/blue notes completely but kept the don/katsu text?
Azure_Kite
osu! Alumni
3,217 posts
Joined February 2009
Azure_Kite
That's it.

By don and Ka symbols I meant the orange/blue symbols disappear, but the ドン　カッ onomatopoeia stayed visible.
DJKero
231 posts
Here since the beginning
DJKero
+1...

Really want a wider Taiko note view... such as original taiko no tatsujin game
HashishKabob
254 posts
Joined September 2011
HashishKabob
Yes, do it! +1
Rei Hakurei
1,983 posts
Joined February 2011
Rei Hakurei

peppy wrote:

SB triggers could easily be added for HPIncrease and HPDecrease (past a certain point) events.
how about HPReach{percentage rounded} ? it could be better

also about the abekobe mod, i want to see it, (as a hidden mod XP)

support anyway~
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