Made in Abyss

unsure if this is worth compromising the sliders / how i could change them.

(slowing them down while keeping the visual length wouldn't work, cause it would mess with the speed proportions by slowing down shorter sliders more, but lengthening them all instead would also lengthen the shorter ones more, so i'd have to try to slightly redesign everything, and idk if i'm capable of that even tho it would theoretically be better).. so i guess i won't change this

that's correct, it follows my feeling of the audio's intensity + of what a fitting (additive) rhythm would be like.

object and audio influence each others feeling, too - there's some element of this happening here.

what physical movements it takes to play an instrument in in real life isn't a relevant consideration when mapping, for my mapping philosophy. i go by my perception of the audio alone.

these are not following the piano sounds. they're following some less sudden sounds you might have called 'wubs'. these sliders are timed to the start of those sounds.

"why isn't 00:06:834 represented" - that timestamp is a piano, which isn't being prioritized currently. though, i could add a note here and it wouldn't make the pattern worse imo. if you reopen this and yoanie wants to, they can, the map just doesn't feel any better to me with this change and there's some small subjective reasons for keeping it as is.

the map doesn't strongly follow pianos till 00:12:007 (13)

(like i wrote in a reply to a mod pointing out this pattern in the ending part of the map, i'm open to remapping this part to follow pianos instead, tho i prefer it how it is)

yes they are. these, and other violins that i tried to time precisely to the violin start (even if it was just a bit after a piano before it), will be changed to start on the white tick where the piano is.

if you have any advice for their ending timings, that would be helpful. i tried to make them end when it felt like the violin was quiet and quickly fading to nothing, but if the endings also felt jarring then there must be something wrong

snapped all starts and ends to white ticks

done

do you want me to remove 00:08:558 (8) too? (ghost note to keep rhythm)
edit: changed this to not be ghost note

open to changing to 1/8 or 1/6
ill see if i can find some lower ranked players to test this part

rank 27k player struggled with these on sightread (full replay https://files.catbox.moe/afmv1s.mp4), will change to 1/6

edit: they said it was 'more of an AR issue for them', maybe AR should be increased. (edit: nvm, they say it's cause they're used to hdhr's high ar)

will be 1/6 anyways in next update, i liked that better

fixed

nope

fixed now

i thought the piano was offset at first but listening closer, theres a subtle piano on the white tick and then the louder one on the 1/12th. fixing

moving these to white ticks as discussed in #4225301

01:20:972 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - ill just make this the snapping thread

01:14:765 - agree it's off, but i think the precise timing would be uneven (maybe https://i.imgur.com/dorcm1Y.png?), maybe it's okay to 'simplify' and leave it like this, or go a bit further and make it more even (https://i.imgur.com/mDwTVeD.png / https://i.imgur.com/tIktBIE.png)

current upload does the last screenshot

on the long violin timings: it's odd that these feel evenly spaced when listening at full speed, but at a higher resolution (listening on 25%) they apparently diverge. maybe simplifying is possible

other sets snap to 1/1, though they're 2-3* diffs
mania set (https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1579415#mania/3224949) does them all on white ticks except 01:10:053 (2) on 1/8

it probably helps that the pianos are on the white ticks, while violin fade-ins/outs are less distinct

01:15:886 (1,1,1) - 01:15:886, 01:16:058, 01:16:231 works a lot better

moved all these to white ticks

for anyone who might be looking here during qualif:
the sliders were moved to white ticks
01:14:765 (1,1,2,3,1,2,1,1,1,1,1,1) was simplified from a more complex and precise timing to how it is now. i did deliberate having it start 1/12th earlier but that seemed more mis-timed when listening in editor, and felt a little abrupt/too early when i played it that way. (note the base bpm is low so 1/12th here is ~1/6th on 180bpm)
just writing so noone think its unintented given my above reply

this is one of my favorite patterns in the map so i don't plan to change it
added the custom 'finish' hitsound to 01:16:892 (1) though

im going to respond to every claim in case i'm supposed to do that:

"it does feel a bit excessive in terms of difficulty" - it feels perfectly fitting to me

"these 2 seconds here bump up the star rating like .4" - yes because they're the most spaced objects, while the rest of the map's difficulty comes from things that sr doesn't capture as well

"maybe some more hands on hitsounds" - that could be done, but custom hitsounding is not within my capability, and it could break the immersion to have custom hitsounds on only these objects. i did add a hitsound on the downbeat right after the pattern to give it some hitsound resolution though

some 'positive' (rather than 'negation of negative') points for keeping:

• i feel like it benefits the 'overall experience' frame to have some 'symmetry breaking' patterns like this
• the quila who mapped this feels like a different person and i want to minimize the amount i have to overwrite their output to rank this. this pattern was the result of intuitions in an emotional state and i think intuition is fundamentally valid in mapping, even if it's hard to articulate

based and true <3

unfortunately the tick rate is as low as possible without red line changes, which i don't think would be rankable for slider tick rate change (though i might be wrong).

they are silenced already

resolved since the proposed change is desirable but not possible i guess

this is following a recurring pattern in the map, which also happened at the start, so my preference is to not change this.
the change would be okay though. if this recurring pattern needs to be removed from the map to satisfy how it's perceived by others' minds, i'd be okay with that.

01:48:313 (1) ends where it does because at that end timing, there's a prominent piano note, which is represented by starting the jump from the ending of this slider to the next one (which placed such that there is a sort of jump)

wheras, for your proposed ending timing to 01:45:857 (4) (at 01:46:554), there's a much softer/more subtle piano

this change would also be okay though, if it seems more major to your / others perception? (the problem stamp could indicate this)

resolving

also you might as well extend the slider end until 02:05:659. The chord doesn't get released until there

you're correct that it starts on nothing (or, at least, almost nothing, i do feel the reverb of the audio peaks a little at this location). this is okay to me, in this case. if i try to decompose my intuition into reasons, and not just say 'i really like how this feels', here are those reasons

• i do want to follow the violin here
• there's a 1/2 gap between the last object and this one, which makes the timing predictable.
• this might sound silly at first, but i think its length gives time to (non-logically, intuitively) reflect on any emotional significance that was felt during play
• alas i can't fully decompose the intuitive view of it, so 'it just feels really nice to me' to encompass the other stuff i can't word

• (there is an hitsound as well)

overall this is one of the more important objects in the map to me, and i would be very against changing it (unlike most other things that i wouldn't mind changing to fit mapping norms)

about ending it at 02:05:659 - i would probably do this if i knew that everyone would be playing with loud enough audio that they could hear the audio until it's fully silent. but this isn't the case. for example, on my headphones + default volume, i stop hearing anything about 3 seconds before that timestamp.

also, in my philosophy it's okay if the slider doesn't go until a sound finishes. i see a slider as a restriction on movement and a requirement for the kb/mb to be held, rather than a 1:1 timing correspondence. (i think this might be the standard view, just usually not articulated, e.g see in other maps sliders ending a little bit early to leave time for the next object).