dj TAKA - quaver · forum

SnowNiNo_

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

Joined April 2013

SnowNiNo_ 2016-08-11T06:36:53+00:00

appleeaterx wrote:
[NiNo's]
01:20:046 (1,1,2) - Having the repeats ending on 1/8 really effects the hit-window, which can cause unneccesary and sudden sliderbreaks. I highly recommend ending them on 1/4 instead. the hitwindow between 01:20:046 (1,1) - and 01:20:699 (1,2) - is both the same tho, and if i change to 1/4 it wont fit the music anymore cuz the music here is 1/8 =w=
01:50:495 (1,2,1,2) - Too bad you completely ignored the interesting 1/4s here to keep 1212 jumps - especially since you mapped most doublets before. mainly because of the structure xd, focusing on jumps instead of double, if i map double here it would be rly hard to play since is a double and it got a large spacing
Even though structure and patterning seems random at times (like 02:39:916 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - ) still enjoyable.:>
Up to you, but I found that putting a spinner at the end fits quite well like the other difficulties. However, since this is a GD, I can allow it if you do not choose to put one.i feels like ending like this would be better, cuz imo spinner destroyed the emphasized on the last jumpy part

thx for mod

Edit : oh monstrata can you help me change the od to 8.5? thx :>

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-12T07:06:04+00:00

Placeholder for Reply

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-13T04:42:21+00:00

appleeaterx wrote:
♪

[General]
All HP settings are really weird to me to be frankly honest... I can see that a song like this, paired with the mapping style and rhythm choices can be very exhausting. But having <4 HP for everything makes me wonder whether this is still a challenge or just something every can pass after a play or two. Made them higher.
gay hitsounds (@milan - 02:46:764 (3) - was this left out on purpose?) Fixed them~
~~The artist should be "Risk Junk". It's only an alias (same person as dj TAKA, but he released this song under that alias, therefore you should use that artist name instead).~~
~~The title should be "quaver♪", without a space in between. (it seems other people like Spy and Mahua told you to change it too, let me see...)~~
~~Source(s): [1] [2]~~
nvm http://www.konamistyle.jp/sp/true_blue/index.html#music
[Astormant]
01:38:138 (1,1,1) - I remember quite a while ago, just prior to ranking my own set, I was told that stuff like this is discouraged in easier difficulties, and it's still kinda contreversial with the gap thing. The actual spinning time from all these added up to each other is also on the long side, which can be really exhausting especially for the lowest diff of the set.. I think it should be fine, since it's only like 6.5 seconds which isn't actually that much imo.
no spinner at the end intentional for might being too short? just confirm lol.. It's kinda short yea. But well, the important part is that uh the player isn't prepared for the spinner, unlike 01:43:380 (1) - where the player will already have a lot of momentum going in from the previous spins. I think the inconsistency might pop up so if you think a spinner here is better i'll add it, its no harm, let me know <3
Awesome work, Astormant. senpai noticed me >////<
[Joey's]
01:27:009 (2,3) - I personally think that CTRL+G'ing this rhythm-wise works much better. Sure, it's practically the same as every other rhythm but I fail to see / hear what this 1/1 slider actually follows, except for the fact it skips a significant drum sound. Up to you. Fixed for Joey.
[Crescendo]
HP1.5 is reaaaaly lame - raise to atleast 4 I'd say. This diff is 7.52& for a reason and 1.5 seems really unfitting for that <_< (unless its that testplay urself thing than feel free toc hange to the original HP) Changed to 3.5
~~pff narcissu wannabe with SV1.0x jkjkjk~~ dude, its actually so helpful for tracking DS increases
01:07:655 (1,2,1) - Kinda sad these weren't mapped out tbh... it's not like I couldn't find 121212 elsewhere in this diff D: I really want to keep, I generally dislike double rhythms like this when theres more jumps coming after. doubles feel good when theres a good combination of 1/4 rhythm like in stream maps, but here idk, i think it'll just throw players off from their 1/2 single tap spamming.
01:18:742 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - 02:57:525 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1) - weelll this is a different case since this section has 1/4 all the way.. but still - if you could take advantage of the song with the 1/4s, not sure why to only place 1212 jumps while that can be found literally nonstop in this diff. does kinda take away from the uniqueness and variety, which is kinda needed for an almost 4-minute repetitive song... tried... but I much prefer the single tap. I think if i put streams here, i'll have to put a death stream here and that would realy mess up this map's novelty of being almost entirely jumps. Kicksliders don't really fit that well imo. Well, the thing is, if i use kicksliders here i'd also have to spam a lot of kicksliders and I really want the only kickslider spammy section to be at 02:03:022 - for the guitar.
03:14:993 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - 03:22:735 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - could use a nerf really, i just cant imagine this playing comfortable. it matches the intensity, but i just feel having fullscream jumps in every corner of the playfield is just not practical Spoke with a couple of top rated players and got a few opinions from pro modders. Nerfed both. Scaled down the first one by like 0.85x and heavily nerfed the second, so rip screen jump i guess xD.
This is probably the most exhausting map I've ever passed and my arms hurt a lot now, thanks! On a serious note though, I have my doubts whether something like this can pass (even though I took part in the nomination of A-L-I-E-N ha), but seeing how Fycho's set was received, not sure about this one, even though the scenario was completely different.
Still have my doubts, though let me know!

Thanks again apple <3

fieryrage wrote:
ok im bored lets go

crescendo

hp 1.5 nice increased to 3.5
ar could be increased to like 9.7 maybe? it's pretty jumpy and going from ar 9.4 to ar 9.5 with basically a 1.5 star gap is pretty weird got a few more opinions, I increased to 9.6. 9.7 felt a bit too forced for some people, and slightly lower ranked (1-5k players) who aren't dt farmers felt 9.6 was just at the borderline of comfortable.

00:11:307 (3,4,5) - while the pattern it makes is super neato i don't really feel like the spacing here fits with the rhythm of the song, feels like it should be spaced out more than just...well, this I don't think 5 needs a jump since its a red tick and doesn't land on anything that significant
00:13:038 (1) - is this supposed to be a dog barking wtf is this hitsound lo True... this one's better for acoustic/rock music i guess. Replaced with a nore electric hitsound.
00:39:411 (1) - this red point on the slider triggers mE SO HARD WHY IS IT SO CLOSE TO THE START PLEAs I actually kinda like it lol.
00:44:686 (1,2,3,4) - use some 1/4 sliders here? as of right now the pattern is missing a lot of potential notes I wanna keep, but i explained it a bit more in apple's mod. Basically streams would mean using death streams, and kicksliders would make another section in the map feel less unique.
01:17:438 (1,3,5,7) - nc's on these to be consistent with the other squares after would be ok hand tbh hmm, idk. i think this pattern of 8 and the previous pattern of 8 form a pair. and the next two squares are more NC spammy because they feel more intense due to the added 1/4's (that i don't map ;c).
01:50:495 (1,2,3,4) - having this as doubles would be better imo, its pretty confusing the way it's laid out right now (at least to me) [color=#0000FF[ hmm, good point. fixed.[/color]
01:51:978 (6,8) - straight down sliders don't fit aesthetically here, kind of contradicts with the rest of the map prior in regards to the 1/4 sliders yea, very true. tilted them slightly.
02:14:231 (4,6) - not really needed but nc? I prefer not to.
02:15:385 (3) - kind of iffy about a repeat slider repeating on a strong beat, might be better having a circle on the red tick where the slider starts and the slider starting on the white tick hmm... I think its fine, i want some sort of 1/1 rhythm here, but i'm reconsidering this
02:17:858 (2,3,4) - triggered by aesthetics plsE this is fine ;c wel, for me anyways lol.
02:58:829 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - while the way you have it right now is fine, the 1/8 sounds here feel empty, maybe replace the last one with a buzz slider? I'd prefer just 1/2 here lol.
03:02:090 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - ok holy fuck this escalated quickly yea true. I made the previous section more difficult to compensate for the increase.

transition to that is kind of pretty awkward but the rhythm calls for it so g

03:03:380 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - im breaking here 24/7 calling it right now i hate patterns like thiszzz awh xP I really like this jump pattern tho! ;c.
03:11:122 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - this is one of the more awkward jumps in this series to hit due to the amount of angle changes and flow changes here, stuff like what you did previously in terms of the jump patterns would be ok here; while it's fine it's just pretty awkward and i can see a lot of breaks happening here very true. I changed up the angles and spacing here. it should be less awkward now since the angles aren't as tight.
03:17:089 (2,2) - i'm not gonna lie i honestly thought these were across-the-screen jumps, having these stacked is kind of misleading since the jumps usually intensify in both directions (from the previous jumps, at least)--this only intensifies in one direction very true... i dont use stacks at all during the final section so yea. redid this pattern to make it easier to read (also nerfed it slightly too)
03:22:735 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - ok well i know why this is 7 stars at least, personally i'd tone these down but most intense part of the song so what e vr well, i ended up nerfing it anyways, partly from your mod, and other players/bns/qats opinions too xD
03:23:944 (1) - should end on downbeat??? idk for sure It's fine as is, that's when the shhhhhhh sound cuts off xD.
too lazy to mod other diffs since i'm sure others modded those enough

Thanks for the mod fieryrage! Great points on aesthetics and playability

Dizick

221 posts

Joined October 2014

Dizick 2016-08-13T11:34:58+00:00

Best map. Rank itttt

Shiguri

439 posts

Joined May 2013

Shiguri 2016-08-13T14:34:15+00:00

Xexxar wrote:
i recommend deleting the map xd

still bummed

19 posts

Joined July 2015

still bummed 2016-08-13T14:35:17+00:00

Shiguri wrote:
Xexxar wrote:
i recommend deleting the map xd

OMG !!! :-(
RUDE !!

Bursthammy

1,254 posts

Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-14T06:02:06+00:00

fujiXn wrote:
OMG !!! :-(
RUDE !!

smol mod

NiNo's Extra

00:11:060 (1,2,3,4) - I'm confused as to why these are the only examples of doubles being used for the entire map despite the song repeating itself so much, either remove it or add some more doubles, add some consistency

01:20:699 (1) - This slider should be extended by an extra repeat, the small space in between (1) and (2) is pretty jarring during gameplay, and I think this works way better as a smooth natural transition between super fast repeats into a stream.

02:04:672 (2,3,4,5,6,7) - These should reverse rotate in the opposite direction to parallel 02:03:352 (2,3,4,5,6,7) - to make it a little more consistent and meaningfully challenging.

03:12:412 (1,1) - Is there a reason we don't hear any of this... weird... hitsound... between 03:12:412 (1,1) - and 03:16:283 (1)? Seems a little weird (not the hitsound lol).

Not going to bother talking about Crescendo since it won't change anything.

Monstrata for president

Lami

1,756 posts

Joined June 2011

Lami 2016-08-14T18:24:40+00:00

03:23:541 (1) - tbh, x512 y384 is better

/me run aways.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-14T20:12:37+00:00

appleeaterx wrote:
♪

[Haru's]
Different KIAI setting was intentional? Just verifying lol. Yea, Intentional!
00:41:224 (4,5) - I feel that these offbeat sliders do more bad than good. They completely ignore the double-clap pattern, which is located on (4)'s end and (5), and the loudest beep remains unclickable. Fixed it by resetting the off-beat rhythm. I made 5 two circles instead so Haru still gets his off-beat slider but without jeopardizing the double-clap pattern as much.
00:45:593 (3,4,5) - While I really enjoy how this forms one whole chunk with the previous pattern, I feel the doublets can play much smoother if you put (3,4) at (5)'s location instead, to really indicate that extra gap time. This way you can also keep your pattern intact, while having the distance between the doublets similar to identical parts. I think here, the symmetry is really necessary for the pattern. Also mmm I think with doubles, its better not to space them too far apart. Personally I prefer them closer together as the rhythm isn't really player-friendly (so many people hate doubles lol). I'd rather have the pattern how it is.
00:46:994 (3,4,1) - 00:49:631 (3,4,1) - This plays really uncomfortable.. having the downbeat offbeat for <to me> no apparent reason while immediately switching to 1/4 after that... it just seems too strange to me for an easier Insane. Agreed. I reduced the slider to 1/2, and added a circle ti create a triplet instead.
01:41:203 (1) - Eh, well the sound on the end kinda resembles a cymbal crash - sounds better to me if it was clickable tbh. Fixed this by just Ctrl+G'ing and moving one circle.
01:48:517 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,1) - 02:58:503 (5,6,7) - I'd really increase the distance between the streams here, because they are spaced exactly the same as stuff like 02:28:407 (5,1) - which doesn't have a rhythm gap at all D: I think this is okay because this section isn't really close to that other section where Haru uses 1/4 gaps instead of 1/2's. Also, this section is a bit quieter in terms of its use of instruments, so I think its okay to have a spacing like this.
01:50:742 (3,4,5) - Same comment as earlier. (if you agreed with this one too, stack 02:24:781 (3,4) - with 02:23:792 (4) - ?) I think its better to leave the doubles xp. Same reason as above.
01:52:308 (7,1) - 02:47:579 (6,1) - 02:55:405 (8,1) - Stack really takes away the emphasis of the finish thou ._. u always do that orz Fixed all.
Wasn't a big fan of some offbeat sliders, but I guess that was your way to add variety to a song like this lol. Generally fine!

Applying for Haruto too since he's been really busy/not feeling well lately. Get better soon Haru~!!

SnowNiNo_

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

2,108 posts

Joined April 2013

SnowNiNo_ 2016-08-15T04:10:52+00:00

Tatsuyu wrote:
fujiXn wrote:
OMG !!! :-(
RUDE !!
smol mod

NiNo's Extra

00:11:060 (1,2,3,4) - I'm confused as to why these are the only examples of doubles being used for the entire map despite the song repeating itself so much, either remove it or add some more doubles, add some consistency cuz the structure after mainly focusing on jumps, and this song is getting more and more intense so the spacing at the similar part like 01:50:495 - would got a large spacing, so if im putting a double here would be rly hard to play, so ill just rather focusing on jumps instead of double

01:20:699 (1) - This slider should be extended by an extra repeat, the small space in between (1) and (2) is pretty jarring during gameplay, and I think this works way better as a smooth natural transition between super fast repeats into a stream. nah i want to consist the hitwindow between 01:20:046 (1,1) - and 01:20:699 (1,2) - , and if i extend a repeat it would be way harder to play cause youll get sliderbreak easily

02:04:672 (2,3,4,5,6,7) - These should reverse rotate in the opposite direction to parallel 02:03:352 (2,3,4,5,6,7) - to make it a little more consistent and meaningfully challenging. mainly stay consistent, and i tried to rotate opposite direction, and the flow plays worse then original one, so ill keep here

03:12:412 (1,1) - Is there a reason we don't hear any of this... weird... hitsound... between 03:12:412 (1,1) - and 03:16:283 (1)? Seems a little weird (not the hitsound lol). i dont get your point here lol, so is the hs issue or the patterns =w=? cuz it seems like a hs issue to me but you said not the hs so im confused xd

Not going to bother talking about Crescendo since it won't change anything.

Monstrata for president

thx for mod

Bursthammy

1,254 posts

Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-15T10:22:52+00:00

just noticed this was on crescendo as well, I meant, shouldn't there be the custom hitsound on 03:14:993 (1) - ?

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-15T17:10:11+00:00

Tatsuyu wrote:
just noticed this was on crescendo as well, I meant, shouldn't there be the custom hitsound on 03:14:993 (1) - ?

No... that's supposed to be a soft-whistle. And there isn't actually a separate custom hitsound. The old custom hitsound was that "oniichan" hitsound which I had to replace with a normal hitsound. It was a pain removing all the green lines from all diffs so I just kept soft-hitwhistle2 and replaced it with normal-hitwhistle

Milan-

1,473 posts

Joined August 2011

Milan- 2016-08-17T07:09:00+00:00

you could've used a bell hitsound tho, that was the main idea at first xd

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-17T07:38:35+00:00

Do you have a custom for that? I'm not great with customs tbh xp.

Milan-

1,473 posts

Joined August 2011

Milan- 2016-08-17T21:06:18+00:00

uhm it's the one i use in every map with bells http://puu.sh/qEX8C/4c4a7f15f4.wav
sounds alright here as well i believe, up to u xd

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-19T10:10:46+00:00

Hey. Thanks Monstra for Fixing the Stuff!!

Altho you've fixed stuff for me, there's still some emphasize stuff i wanna change and some missing bell sound here 03:14:993 - .
and, Decided to add my own BG. Not because i dislike the new BG tho xP. It just looks more brighter lol so i put a darker one for my Diff xD.

Anyways, here's my diff and its BG

http://haruto.s-ul.eu/7n0o0mmU

Go rank /o/.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-19T14:56:03+00:00

Updated!

@Haruto. I'd prefer using the current background across all difficulties because the bg actually relates to the song pretty well (look at what she's holding xD). Also this is a pretty upbeat song with lots of jumps, so I think a flashy/bright bg fits the mood better haha. Your BG is really nice tho!! (You should save it for another map!!).

If you really wanna use the bg let me know though, I can update again with BN #2.

Mint

1,611 posts

Joined February 2013

Mint 2016-08-19T15:22:29+00:00

next bn:

If Haruto really wants separate BG for his difficulty, please let him do so first.

Lasse

osu! Alumni

3,644 posts

Joined June 2011

Lasse 2016-08-19T15:35:39+00:00

nearly as triggering as reimu lol
gets upscaled and cut off for everyone playing on common aspect ratios
=> http://i.imgur.com/daplNax.jpg

could use this 1366x768 version instead http://puu.sh/qGYHC/09c08a3a2c.jpg which is cut a bit + has the part of the text that got cut off removed

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-20T03:37:05+00:00

Lasse wrote:

nearly as triggering as reimu lol
gets upscaled and cut off for everyone playing on common aspect ratios
=> http://i.imgur.com/daplNax.jpg

could use this 1366x768 version instead http://puu.sh/qGYHC/09c08a3a2c.jpg which is cut a bit + has the part of the text that got cut off removed

i can help you remove the text there so, it will look plain without text.

@Monstrata : well, my diff uses big circle size. the bg caused the approach rate hard to read. but, if you really don't want to add the bg im fine too with the current bg. tho, my bg mainly uses for playability. so for ppl who dont play without 100% dim will have a nice dark view with bg

.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-20T03:45:55+00:00

Okay i'll replace it with Lasse's since either way its going to cut. I'd rather the bottom get cut than the top.

@Haruto, I think most people will play with bg dim anyways. And using a bright bg shouldn't be considered a palyability issue since many maps have bright bg's. I think its too minor to really consider switching bgs for that reason

. Not worth breaking consistency.

Can you remove the text though? o.o

Shiirn

2,896 posts

Joined August 2010

Shiirn 2016-08-20T04:34:18+00:00

oh look it's appleeater again

-Visceral-

644 posts

Joined August 2012

-Visceral- 2016-08-20T06:47:56+00:00

Dude is this a jump practice map? Come on... you're better than this. You know how to use emphasis and I know you know momentum and this map doesn't have any of that. It's so uncreative and mapped for difficulty and it's really fucking painful you've let yourself come to this. If you really want I can do a full mod but it won't be of use since you'll just deny all suggestions like always.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-20T07:20:24+00:00

Assuming that's not a meme, I'm not sure what to say lol. This map is built with a very clear goal of creating progressively more difficult jumps, and creating a crescendo effect that is both supported in the song's tone and atmosphere, pitch and octave increases, and even slight bpm increase.

The fact that it uses mainly jumps shouldn't discredit its quality. The song's main melody is pure 1/2 all the way through with some sections that are more normal. However, the jumps and rhythms are the novelty of this map. There is a lot of emphasis usage involved, as well as precise angles and flow structures that make these jumps fun to play.

You can see this as a jump training map if you want. It certainly fits the criteria as it contains a lot of jumps, but that was never my intention. Also, why are jump training maps seen as "unrankable" or even "low quality" to begin with? "Because theyre jump training maps" is obviously not a valid reason for anyone reasonable. Therefore, there are two main criteria:

1. "Jumps are too big". I think this is subjective to begin with, and I've explained it in detail on Inferno. However here, the spacing increases are all supported in the song, and the jumps at the end fit because of this meticulously structured crescendo.

2. "Song doesn't call for 1/2 rhythm here". This is probably what sets this map apart from what you call "jump" maps. Most other "jump training" maps simply map 1/2 notes on top of everything, even though perhaps 1/2 spam isn't the optimal or best rhythm to pick here. Because of a lack of rhythm diversity in an otherwise diverse song, the "jump training" map is seen as low quality. However, 1/2 rhythm is completely supported in this song.

You're welcome to do a mod on Crescendo if you want. You know how I operate though. Every placement has a purpose for being there because 99% of my map is created using some sort of copy/paste/ and rhjgfd<> function. I don't ever click or place individual circles or sliders on the screen.

Bursthammy

1,254 posts

Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-20T07:27:50+00:00

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-20T10:18:30+00:00

Monstrata wrote:
Okay i'll replace it with Lasse's since either way its going to cut. I'd rather the bottom get cut than the top.

@Haruto, I think most people will play with bg dim anyways. And using a bright bg shouldn't be considered a palyability issue since many maps have bright bg's. I think its too minor to really consider switching bgs for that reason . Not worth breaking consistency.

Can you remove the text though? o.o

Well... other than that, i just prefer a darker BG tho lol xD.
And, Yup. I can do a little finetunning with it, probably doing it this night. (Around 19:00-22:30 Central Indonesian Time).

Shiirn wrote:
oh look it's appleeater again

BN Association Team™. *Circlerjerk Association Team xDxXddxdXdXD.

Monstrata wrote:
2. "Song doesn't call for 1/2 rhythm here". This is probably what sets this map apart from what you call "jump" maps. Most other "jump training" maps simply map 1/2 notes on top of everything, even though perhaps 1/2 spam isn't the optimal or best rhythm to pick here. Because of a lack of rhythm diversity in an otherwise diverse song, the "jump training" map is seen as low quality. However, 1/2 rhythm is completely supported in this song.

Isn't that how Quaver Song Works?

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-20T13:38:27+00:00

Intended Doublepost.

Okay here you go!

SPOILER

http://haruto.s-ul.eu/zfGmkP1c

Also, did some Fine tunning, again on my Diff lol

Code update

osu file format v14

[General]
AudioFilename: dj_TAKA_quaver-Vubey.mp3
AudioLeadIn: 0
PreviewTime: 57791
Countdown: 0
SampleSet: Soft
StackLeniency: 0.4
Mode: 0
LetterboxInBreaks: 0
WidescreenStoryboard: 0

[Editor]
Bookmarks: 9082,35455,53917,112473,123022,209186
DistanceSpacing: 1
BeatDivisor: 4
GridSize: 32
TimelineZoom: 2.4

[Metadata]
Title:quaver
TitleUnicode:quaver ♪
Artist:dj TAKA
ArtistUnicode:dj TAKA
Creator:Monstrata
Version:Haru's Insane
Source:REFLEC BEAT limelight
Tags:true blue risk junk snownino_ haruto haruto_aizawa [ Joey ] Aia beatmania IIDX 19 Lincle jubeat saucer jukebeat KONAMI music pack 25 pop'n music Sunny Park plus MUSIC PACK 29 + ポップンリズミン パック1 MUSIC PACK 19
BeatmapID:918723
BeatmapSetID:423527

[Difficulty]
HPDrainRate:5.5
CircleSize:3.6
OverallDifficulty:8
ApproachRate:9
SliderMultiplier:1.55
SliderTickRate:2

[Events]
//Background and Video events
0,0,"D7l8mHT.jpg",0,0
//Break Periods
//Storyboard Layer 0 (Background)
//Storyboard Layer 1 (Fail)
//Storyboard Layer 2 (Pass)
//Storyboard Layer 3 (Foreground)
//Storyboard Sound Samples

[TimingPoints]
1170,329.67032967033,4,2,1,40,1,0
5785,-100,4,1,1,55,0,0
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300,160,156814,1,2,0:3:0:0:
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Lasse

osu! Alumni

3,644 posts

Joined June 2011

Lasse 2016-08-20T14:28:15+00:00

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-20T15:06:15+00:00

Lasse wrote:

sorry for that

maybe im blind. but got fixed tho xd

http://haruto.s-ul.eu/dAOWV3kA

Gus

318 posts

Joined June 2014

Gus 2016-08-21T01:42:03+00:00

Monstrata wrote:
Assuming that's not a meme, I'm not sure what to say lol. This map is built with a very clear goal of creating progressively more difficult jumps, and creating a crescendo effect that is both supported in the song's tone and atmosphere, pitch and octave increases, and even slight bpm increase.

The fact that it uses mainly jumps shouldn't discredit its quality. The song's main melody is pure 1/2 all the way through with some sections that are more normal. However, the jumps and rhythms are the novelty of this map. There is a lot of emphasis usage involved, as well as precise angles and flow structures that make these jumps fun to play.

You can see this as a jump training map if you want. It certainly fits the criteria as it contains a lot of jumps, but that was never my intention. Also, why are jump training maps seen as "unrankable" or even "low quality" to begin with? "Because theyre jump training maps" is obviously not a valid reason for anyone reasonable. Therefore, there are two main criteria:

1. "Jumps are too big". I think this is subjective to begin with, and I've explained it in detail on Inferno. However here, the spacing increases are all supported in the song, and the jumps at the end fit because of this meticulously structured crescendo.

2. "Song doesn't call for 1/2 rhythm here". This is probably what sets this map apart from what you call "jump" maps. Most other "jump training" maps simply map 1/2 notes on top of everything, even though perhaps 1/2 spam isn't the optimal or best rhythm to pick here. Because of a lack of rhythm diversity in an otherwise diverse song, the "jump training" map is seen as low quality. However, 1/2 rhythm is completely supported in this song.

You're welcome to do a mod on Crescendo if you want. You know how I operate though. Every placement has a purpose for being there because 99% of my map is created using some sort of copy/paste/ and rhjgfd<> function. I don't ever click or place individual circles or sliders on the screen.

This isn't justification at all, your Crescendo effect doesn't mean it needs to be that spaced that totally doesnt fit the song, its a 4bpm increase it doesnt need a 2-3x spacing increase nor to be that difficult at all, the song rly doesnt fit this difficulty.

the jumps at the end don't fit please no matter how structured it is you need to take in playability and creativity too there's like not a magic formula for the perfect map

I’m Rick Harrison, and this is my pawn shop. I work here with my old man and my son, monstrata. Everything in here has precise angles and flow structures. One thing I’ve learned after 21 years – you never know WHAT is gonna come through that door.

ok actually tho idk what to say Crescendo so obviously plays like jump training; you say there's a bias but if someone were to map a square of just constant streams (ur basic stream training map), that would obviously lack structure. I think something like that would struggle to be bubbled, so the fact that something like this is bubbled is kinda wHAT. You can take a song like Shinsekai or Ascension to Heaven and totally do that, but should it be ranked? prob not.

Monstrata I gotta b real I thought RoR and Alien were pretty cool maps but HWAT IS THIS DUDE HWAT

[Crescendo]
ok ill admit this map is structured really well and is visually appealing BUT WHERES THE PLAYABILITY OR CREATIVITY

00:13:038 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3,4) - no sliders in this entire section, there are clear pitch changes so why is this shown with spacing emphasis every time, vary it up, add some sliders and potentially some SV changes instead to show it bc the way this plays is just stale

00:44:686 (1,2,3) - missed beats that'd be cool to map

00:49:961 (1) - these sliders could be better emphasized with a stream imo

00:55:235 (1,2,1) - better emphasized this way bc the note isnt a full stop, the music continues to play and the sound rings out kind of, a slider would totally sound better

00:56:224 (1,2,1,2) - same

01:43:300 (1,2,3,4,5) - not kiai yet and this spacing dude

02:43:992 (2,1) - should be a triple here

03:02:090 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - This spacing is so over the top, some things should be kept under the title jump training or beatmap graveyard, there's no playability here pls pls pls also I counted there are a total of 8 sliders in ur entire kiai time

monstrata you're prob like literally 1 of the best mappers you're an editor savant you can make so much more than this, there is very obviously structure, rhythm, etc here. this set has it all, but there's no creativity and this kind of thing is very cool in the editor but outside of it unpractical..

I suggest you just revamp your Crescendo diff, just bc there's so much potential for a cool, creative diff despite it being such a linear song. you can do so much more than what you have, and the spacing really doesn't support the song, it isnt that intense IMO

I see the reason and playability in your angles (well, ok minus the playability in ur kiai DUDE WHAT IS THAT) but im saying the spacing and the fact that such a boring, linear song is 7* kinda surprises me. it's so unfitting, I mean if you look at other 7* maps this is just.. I mean the aim is hard but there's absolutely no rhythmic challenge or tapping ability really needed... it doesnt fit the difficulty at all this is why I suggest a revamp to make it fit the difficulty if you must have a 7* in this set

best of luck, mostly my opinions, but that kiai spacing needs to be tuned down thats too much for the song, you could do the song so much more justice than what you made here

regardless, im noob mapper, but I wish u best of luck with this set and I hope this can help you with this set so people can appreciate it more

good luck!

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

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Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-21T02:15:53+00:00

Gus wrote:
[Crescendo]
ok ill admit this map is structured really well and is visually appealing BUT WHERES THE PLAYABILITY OR CREATIVITY

00:13:038 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3,4) - no sliders in this entire section, there are clear pitch changes so why is this shown with spacing emphasis every time, vary it up, add some sliders and potentially some SV changes instead to show it bc the way this plays is just stale This is intentional to map the main melody and only the main melody. There are pitch changes that are mapped both to larger jumps, sharper angle changes, and/or pattern changes.

00:44:686 (1,2,3) - missed beats that'd be cool to map I want to keep my 1/2 rhythm spam. It's fully supported in the song. There are places where arguably I could make streams (apple pointed out a good section) but here this isn't even significant imo. If I weren't making a gimmicky map i still would have used this rhythm.

00:49:961 (1) - these sliders could be better emphasized with a stream imo No. I want to emphasize the white and red ticks. Putting streams here take emphasis away from these ticks and makes the entire section feel the same in terms of clicking rhythm. You don't get a staccato feel.

00:55:235 (1,2,1) - better emphasized this way bc the note isnt a full stop, the music continues to play and the sound rings out kind of, a slider would totally sound better Sliders can fit. It's not better though, its just a different interpretation, and one that I don't want to use here. I like the 1/1 rhythm pause better.

00:56:224 (1,2,1,2) - same Same.

01:43:300 (1,2,3,4,5) - not kiai yet and this spacing dude This is echoing the second half of the song.

02:43:992 (2,1) - should be a triple here There is a triplet there, but its not very noticeable, so I want to continue with the jump pattern I have here.

03:02:090 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - This spacing is so over the top, some things should be kept under the title jump training or beatmap graveyard, there's no playability here pls pls pls also I counted there are a total of 8 sliders in ur entire kiai time There's nothing wrong with "over the top". I created this map to challenge players, not to make things that are easy to pass. This is over the top precisely to challenge people into doing the largest possible jumps in the game. The entire premise is set up to prepare players for the jumps at the end.

monstrata you're prob like literally 1 of the best mappers you're an editor savant you can make so much more than this, there is very obviously structure, rhythm, etc here. this set has it all, but there's no creativity and this kind of thing is very cool in the editor but outside of it unpractical..

I suggest you just revamp your Crescendo diff, just bc there's so much potential for a cool, creative diff despite it being such a linear song. you can do so much more than what you have, and the spacing really doesn't support the song, it isnt that intense IMO

I see the reason and playability in your angles (well, ok minus the playability in ur kiai DUDE WHAT IS THAT) but im saying the spacing and the fact that such a boring, linear song is 7* kinda surprises me. it's so unfitting, I mean if you look at other 7* maps this is just.. I mean the aim is hard but there's absolutely no rhythmic challenge or tapping ability really needed... it doesnt fit the difficulty at all this is why I suggest a revamp to make it fit the difficulty if you must have a 7* in this set

best of luck, mostly my opinions, but that kiai spacing needs to be tuned down thats too much for the song, you could do the song so much more justice than what you made here

regardless, im noob mapper, but I wish u best of luck with this set and I hope this can help you with this set so people can appreciate it more

good luck!

Thanks for your concerns. The jumps are indeed really big. You can call them over the top, but they've been precisely set up throughout the entire map. I'm mapping this to challenge people. Some people enjoy playing maps that are really difficult, and not just maps that give easy pp/are easily fc'able. The jumps are all structured in a way to build intensity.

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

osu!completionist

118 posts

Joined July 2013

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEE 2016-08-21T03:21:39+00:00

"I'm mapping this to challenge people. Some people enjoy playing maps that are really difficult, and not just maps that give easy pp/are easily fc'able."

that is what mapping for the graveyard is for :^)

Monstrata

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Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-21T03:41:11+00:00

Mapping for graveyard is for unrankable stuff

.

7ambda

2,590 posts

Joined January 2015

7ambda 2016-08-21T04:27:03+00:00

Monstrata wrote:
Mapping for graveyard is for unrankable stuff .

I map for graveyard, yet my maps are perfectly rankable.

?

Monstrata

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Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-21T05:12:58+00:00

I map for ranked, yet my maps are perfectly rankable.

?

Bursthammy

1,254 posts

Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-21T05:38:23+00:00

Monstrata wrote:
I created this map to challenge players, not to make things that are easy to pass.

Monstrata wrote:
not to make things that are easy to pass.

Curious that you say that, and yet Crescendo's HP is 3.5, compared to NiNo's HP5 or even Haru's 5.5. Surely you wouldn't object to bumping up the HP some more to prevent players from "easily passing" just by hitting around 60% of the notes during the ending?

Monstrata

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Monstrata 2016-08-21T05:54:26+00:00

I figured the HP was around 5 or 5.5... Theres an enormous amount of NC spam towards the end which increases the actual HP quite a lot.

Bursthammy

1,254 posts

Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-21T06:01:06+00:00

That doesn't change the fact that it's pretty easy to pass due to NC HP boosts even if you miss a shitload of notes.

Monstrata

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Monstrata 2016-08-21T06:05:26+00:00

Well, except HP drain is higher than it normally should be, and NC spam means you won't receive as much health back from each katu/geki too.

But I'm fine with raising it a bit more. I just tested a bit and HP 4 seems to be good.

Monstrata

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Monstrata 2016-08-23T07:11:36+00:00

After some more playtesting and watching replays, I ended up nerfing some more jumps, and changing some angles and flow structures. Also, I redid some of the NC patterning to avoid so much NC spam during the kiai. Lastly, HP has been bumped up to 5!!

Also updated Haru's diff.

I'm finally fully satisfied with every jump placement in Crescendo. It's time.

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-23T12:08:22+00:00

You haven't changed the BG xd.

Monstrata

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Monstrata 2016-08-23T14:44:05+00:00

Right. Updated!

Mint

1,611 posts

Joined February 2013

Mint 2016-08-24T15:43:01+00:00

Rebubble instead, good luck!

<also asked about spinner in normal diff, is perfectly fine>

Bursthammy

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Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-24T15:55:39+00:00

pp hype

Ascendance

Elite Mapper

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Ascendance 2016-08-25T00:03:30+00:00

Placeholder, let's go

I Must Decrease

913 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-08-25T01:08:32+00:00

I have a concern regarding the top diff of this mapset.

There is seemingly very little justification in the design of the section around

02:57:525 (1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) -

Could you please explain the purpose in ignoring a majority of 1/4th beat during the build up to the kiai? This seems to be an attempt to follow the lead synth, which is by itself fine, however it becomes confusing during the kiai when you then decide to no longer follow the lead synth and instead spam circles on red ticks of 03:02:251 (2,4,2,4,2,2,2,2) - Would this section not be better as sliders to more properly reflect the synth that you have been some religiously following from before?

As this such a high star map, shouldn't your goal be to follow the song with no restrictions, rather than paste jump after jump even on sections where 1/4th rhythm exists?

Is it possible that the origin of this maps constructions were not for the purpose of creating a beatmap to capture the song but instead some ulterior motives?

Rethink this map please Monstrata, I'm sure even you know that this is not what the song desires nor warrants.

Ascendance

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Ascendance 2016-08-25T01:14:00+00:00

lol cmon xexxar, it's kind of obvious in this section 02:57:525 (1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - that he's following the main rhythm which gradually builds in intensity. Anyone with decent ears can hear that and see the increase in distance as the song gains volume and intensity.

03:02:251 (2,4,2,4,2,2,2,2) - It's the kiai time, why should you have to emphasize things the same way as you did in the non-kiai? The kiai is meant to be harder and the pinnacle of difficulty in a map.

There was no hidden alterior motive. Monstrata has said it himself that he intends for it to be a jumpier-styled map, and it's evident in the map itself. You blatantly ignored the mapper's intentions while "analyzing" the difficulty.

You and I both know this pop was unnecessary. How hard is it to simply leave your opinion before popping an icon? Or does having that power now automatically mean you can use it without first reasoning it out with the mapper? Let's calm down next time, shall we?

Last edited by Ascendance 2016-08-25T01:21:50+00:00, edited 1 time in total.

Monstrata

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Monstrata 2016-08-25T01:21:41+00:00

On mobile so detailed reply later. Basically though, I am following the main melody. 1/4 notes exist but as a good modder you should know that emphasizing 1/2 notes is not practical when mapping streams.

I Must Decrease

913 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-08-25T01:42:06+00:00

If you're goal was to capture the melody then why is 03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - not sliders.

If you're trying to capture the 1/2 feeling during the 1/4th streams, why are you not utlizing 1/4th sliders to highlight the difference that the song is providing you (aka the stream).

Ascendance wrote:
There was no hidden alterior motive. Monstrata has said it himself that he intends for it to be a jumpier-styled map, and it's evident in the map itself. You blatantly ignored the mapper's intentions while "analyzing" the difficulty.

Your intentions can be what you want them be as long as your goal isn't to rank your map. If you think that your individual choice of expression is deserving of being ranked when it quite clearly ignores what the song ihas to offer than feel free to continue acting entitled. Some people intend to create jumpy maps like these that ignore the song's rhythms. Sure jump training maps can be fun, but everyone knows that they're not suitable for ranking.

Whether or not you agree that ranked maps should match the song and not be a place for jump training maps is entirely up to you.

Shiirn

2,896 posts

Joined August 2010

Shiirn 2016-08-25T02:30:21+00:00

Maps should be judged against themselves. If they're intentionally fucking over their own message inherent to the music, that's a problem. quaver's problem seems to be that it was mapped with patterns the mapper just wanted to use, rather than patterns the music encourages, at least from the perspective of.... whoever's basically said that, in so many words.

quaver's fairly weakly mapped up until the second half, with the kiai completely blowing everything else out of the water - if you remove the kiai of quaver, the rating drops over a full star. You can justify this with reasons such as "well it's the kiai", but it's literally the same musical chunk - it's a repeat of an earlier chorus section. It's not even any louder or higher pitched or any more dense. It's almost a direct copy+paste, but it's spaced up to twice as large.

I think it sets a rather disappointing precedent when the mapper becomes more important to the map than the music contained with in. And that's what has largely been the crux of my, and I can only presume other's, issue with monstrata's recent dealings, more so than the actual mapping contained within.

Monstrata

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Monstrata 2016-08-25T04:01:44+00:00

Thanks for the concerns. Actually, Xexxar, the point you brought up was discussed earlier between me and apple, but since you brought it up, I think shedding more light on my intentions and reasoning would benefit everyone.

You pointed out that despite the 1/4 track on 02:57:525 (1,2,3,4,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - I still continued with my 1/2 rhythm choice. My reasoning is that I really wanted to capture the main melody there. It's an especially crucial part in the song because it transitions into the kiai, and because of the pitch increase. It continues to go up and up, so I felt this was the best place to put jumps in increasing order. Why didn't I map the 1/4's? Well, because as you know, putting streams ends up completely eliminating any emphasis onto individual 1/2 notes, unless you want to do a stream jump every two notes, which would be horrible. Aside from that though, due to the way this song has been structured, streams wouldn't fit that well rhythm-wise either. There'd be too much of a disparity between 1/2 jumps and 1/4 death streams when the map really is a map set up to highlight these 1/2 notes.

Of course, you might want to talk about kickslider-usage there too then. I didn't want to use kicksliders because I felt using kickslider-spam here would draw emphasis away from the guitar section at 02:03:022 - which I felt was really unique, instrument-wise. Also, kicksliders play very similarly to jumps anyways in terms of rhythm, except for the fact that on large jumps, it becomes a lot easier to break on kicksliders just due to the amount of velocity change involved in them compared to smaller jumps, where you don't have to cover as much ground to reach the next object. This is why I decided to go with circles rather than kicksliders. Just bringing it up since I felt a discussion on that might prop up.

Your point on 03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - though, I have to disagree with. If you listen carefully, there are main melody notes on all the red ticks too. They are perhaps not as noticeable because the pitch and echo of the notes here make the 2nd note sound feint. 03:12:412 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - See if you can hear them in this section. It's a bit clearer maybe.

Regarding Shiirn's concerns about the first half of the map being easier than the second half. That is the point of a crescendo effect though. You have to look at the map holistically. It continues to get bigger and bigger even though the song practically repeats itself. If I made both sections the same intensity, the ending wouldn't feel as spectacular, and the player experience wouldn't be as enjoyable because you'd have to go through the whole crescendo process twice. I want players to feel the map getting progressively harder and harder, constantly demanding more from the mapper, until they either break, or finally break past the final jumps.

Thanks for the comments anyways. I know there was probably some crap earlier, I didn't get to read any cuz I was busy, but I hope this covers most things. Let me know if you need more clarification!

anna apple

1,256 posts

Joined March 2014

anna apple 2016-08-25T04:28:25+00:00

this map rn

criticizing bullies isn't bullying.

shiirn bullies lots of maps:/

please stop bullying

Ascendance

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Ascendance 2016-08-25T04:51:08+00:00

Call me when you need me, Monstrata

I Must Decrease

913 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-08-25T15:28:58+00:00

Kocari wrote:
Strike 1

It is my belief that this map does indeed lack severe quality. I have no interest to sit idly and watch as bad maps get ranked for the sole reason of causing drama and community unrest.

Monstrata wrote:
Your point on 03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - though, I have to disagree with. If you listen carefully, there are main melody notes on all the red ticks too. They are perhaps not as noticeable because the pitch and echo of the notes here make the 2nd note sound feint. 03:12:412 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - See if you can hear them in this section. It's a bit clearer maybe.

There is no melody on those notes.

I do not know what you are hearing, there is simply the existence of drum beats that follow after the main melody. There is literally zero reason for those notes to be given the same level of intensity as the main white tick beats. As such, this does a bad job of capturing the song and what your intentions are. This type of mapping makes sections that actually do have 1/2 melody to feel indistinguishable from the rest.

If you spam 1/2 circle jumps for literally 40 seconds in a row with no variance do you honestly think the player can enjoy any of whats going on? It's entirely monotonous and not capable of providing feeling for the song. I am saying this as both a player and a mapper that this map is not fun nor suitable for ranking.

Monstrata

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Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-25T15:35:40+00:00

Xexxar wrote:
Kocari wrote:
Strike 1
It is my belief that this map does indeed lack severe quality. I have no interest to sit idly and watch as bad maps get ranked for the sole reason of causing drama and community unrest.

Monstrata wrote:
Your point on 03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - though, I have to disagree with. If you listen carefully, there are main melody notes on all the red ticks too. They are perhaps not as noticeable because the pitch and echo of the notes here make the 2nd note sound feint. 03:12:412 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - See if you can hear them in this section. It's a bit clearer maybe.
There is no melody on those notes.

I do not know what you are hearing, there is simply the existence of drum beats that follow after the main melody. There is literally zero reason for those notes to be given the same level of intensity as the main white tick beats. As such, this does a bad job of capturing the song and what your intentions are. This type of mapping makes sections that actually do have 1/2 melody to feel indistinguishable from the rest.

If you spam 1/2 circle jumps for literally 40 seconds in a row with no variance do you honestly think the player can enjoy any of whats going on? It's entirely monotonous and not capable of providing feeling for the song. I am saying this as both a player and a mapper that this map is not fun nor suitable for ranking.

Huh.... there are definitely notes on the red ticks though.

Also, this map uses variance, however it's very subtle compared to your typical view of "variance" being rhythm changes. This map is a workout for your right hand (or left, if thats your tablet/mouse hand). The variance comes in the different ways I use angles, spacings, and beatpairings to capture different melodies in the song.

In any case though, you seem to think those red ticks are just "overmaps" and I would have to completely disagree. Do you want me to find more opinions?

Monstrata

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Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-25T16:40:47+00:00

Okay, I got several opinions from other members of the community.

03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - I agree the red ticks aren't as prominent so I'm going to nerf the jumps to a level that is more reflective of their level of emphasis, relative to the rest of the section. They are still mapped to jumps, but it is now very clear that the jumps on white ticks are being emphasized. Sliders will not fit here because they just don't fit the consistent structure and rhythm of the map.

Some quick opinions. I'll of course discuss further with the BN's involved in the qualification process. Anyways, lets discuss later tonight, Xexxar.

1

2

08:53 Monstrata: hey hey! quick opinion if you have 1 minute?
08:53 Chaoslitz:

sure
08:53 *Monstrata is editing [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/915210 dj TAKA - quaver [Crescendo]]
08:53 Monstrata: 03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) -
08:54 Monstrata: what do you think of the jumps on the red ticks?
08:54 Monstrata: xexxar doesn't hear any notes on them but idk so getting some more opinions xD
08:55 Chaoslitz: wait there's definitely have sound...
08:56 Monstrata: yea thats what i thought xd but i guess they aren't as strong
08:56 Monstrata: im thinking of nerfing the jumps on the red ticks as a solution
08:56 Monstrata: but he basically wants sliders haha
08:56 Chaoslitz: you can use smaller ds xd
08:57 Chaoslitz: but considering the first half of your kiai is using notes :v
08:58 Monstrata: its all 1/2 rhythm haha yea. so i prefer to be consistent. the angle changes/beatpairing and right-hand rhythm is the star of this diff xD
08:58 Chaoslitz: then i will prefer nerfing the jumps
08:59 Monstrata: kayy~ thx heh.
08:59 Chaoslitz: xd no problem

3

09:09 *Monstrata is editing [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/915210 dj TAKA - quaver [Crescendo]]
09:09 Monstrata: do those notes on red ticks exist? basically xD
09:09 Yukiyo: yes
09:09 Yukiyo: They do
09:10 Monstrata: how about the jump spacing
09:10 Yukiyo: I hear them they are only high hats afaik but they are existent
09:10 Yukiyo: hmm
09:10 Yukiyo: Well you want it to be that hard
09:11 Monstrata: yea xD
09:11 Yukiyo: and the only one goin out of order is 03:02:896 (2) -
09:11 Monstrata: o true
09:11 Monstrata: hm
09:11 Yukiyo: But it is only a sound on that red tick
09:12 Yukiyo: so It really isn't THAT prominent imo
09:16 Yukiyo: Hope I helped or smt

4

08:55 Monstrata: collecting opinions now

08:55 Monstrata: 03:02:090 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) -
08:55 *Monstrata is editing [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/915210 dj TAKA - quaver [Crescendo]]
08:55 Monstrata: do notes exist? or are they nonexistent like xexxar says?

08:56 Raiden: getting a taiko bn eh???
08:56 Raiden: let's see
08:56 Raiden: you mean as in
08:56 Raiden: there is indeed a note from X instrument?
08:56 Monstrata: yes
08:56 Monstrata: for the red ticks
08:56 Monstrata: in that section
08:57 Raiden: of ourse
08:57 Raiden: the synth does constant 1/2
08:57 Raiden: hmmm
08:58 Raiden: the synth does a 1 beat break though at 03:02:735 (1) -
08:58 Raiden: but there are drums supporting the 1/2 so
08:59 Monstrata: wait so theres no synth at 03:02:735 - ?
08:59 Raiden: ok listening to it at 25% the synth keeps doing 1/2 but it's super weak
08:59 Raiden: there is
08:59 Raiden: but super weak
08:59 Raiden: maybe reduce spacing in there?
08:59 Raiden: LOL
08:59 Monstrata: yea i'll probably do that xD
08:59 Raiden: listen at 50%
08:59 Raiden: would give a nice epic feeling
09:00 Raiden: an up down up
09:00 Raiden: on spacing
09:00 Raiden: hey mom i know standard!
09:00 Monstrata: ye maybe that could work
09:00 Monstrata: considering im doing 03:03:380 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - horizontal + upward movement the next measure over
09:02 Raiden: oh ya
09:03 Raiden: inb4 i post for kd
09:04 Monstrata: feel free to xD
09:04 Raiden: nah im not a kd whore
09:04 Monstrata: xD
09:04 Raiden: but you can show the log to prove that you got more opinions i guess

5

6

08:46 Monstrata: o
08:47 sahuang: o3o
08:47 Monstrata: do notes exist there? xD
08:47 sahuang: where?

08:47 sahuang: oh
08:47 sahuang: you mean quaver?
08:47 Monstrata: 03:02:251 (2,4) - 03:02:896 (2,4) -
08:48 Monstrata: yes xD
08:48 sahuang: yeah there are
08:48 sahuang: hmm lemme listen carefully again
08:49 Monstrata: i might just nerf the spacing for 03:02:251 (2,4) - since it seems xexxar cant hear them xP
08:50 sahuang: i think every 1/2 should have a note here
08:51 Monstrata: okay, so im not going crazy xD
08:51 sahuang: but it's true that
08:51 Monstrata: im gonna get some more opinions since he says he can't hear anything
08:51 Monstrata: its true that theyre feint though
08:51 sahuang: 03:02:251 (2,4,2,4) - imo has a bit quiet sounds
08:51 Monstrata: so i think reducing spacing is still better
08:51 sahuang: yeah
08:52 sahuang: they are fainter but i dont think there's nothing
08:52 Monstrata: okay, thx

D
08:52 sahuang:

09:04 sahuang: just went through posts in quaver
09:05 Monstrata: >//<
09:07 sahuang: i think the only thing i agree with him is the jumps at the beginning of kiai where red tick notes are not really significant
09:09 Monstrata: yea xd
09:09 Monstrata: well, im willing to change them anyways
09:10 Monstrata: just, i dont think using sliders is good so i want to continue using 1/2 circles
09:10 sahuang: yeah,sliders may not fit the main diff here

I Must Decrease

913 posts

Joined June 2013

I Must Decrease 2016-08-25T17:38:07+00:00

Feel free to continue with the ranking of this map.

I made my attempt to stop a bad map like this from being ranked. If other BNs/QAT disagree with my opinion feel free to rank this and let the community be the judge. There's no sense in wasting my time in trying to improve the quality of a map that doesn't want to be a good map.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-25T17:44:29+00:00

I'm sorry you didn't like the map.

I think its really fun seeing how far I can get through the map. I've only managed to pass it twice so far.

Anyways, thanks for bringing up the discussion before the map was qualified. I was expecting something like this to happen sooner or later so it's always nice to be able to discuss both sides of an issue prior to qualification.

-NeBu-

435 posts

Joined March 2014

-NeBu- 2016-08-25T19:24:58+00:00

Well, actually I enjoy that map so I wanna say few words.

What's the problem of this map being more of jump training? There are maps that are full of jumps or full of streams. It's not one difficulty that's gonna be ranked, but few of them that showing what you can actually do with one song, the rhythm and placement on the map.

Mapping is going forward, even it's currently more based on pp, it's still map that a lot of people will enjoy - mainly because of the song and map that after all following the rhythm perfectly and I don't see anything wrong with it.

People started to think now that pp-maps are bad, it should change and BN's shouldnt allow that to be ranked, but why? Because only 1/2 diffs out of 6/7 on mapset are slighty overmapped/overmapped? What's wrong with that? Isn't mapping something that should be fun for mapper, something that he wanna show to people and let them enjoy after the time he wasted on it? Look at Fort's Call me it mapset for example - few diffs with good spread which giving pp, they're good for any player starting from beginner up to top players, but what people crying most about? About the hardest diff that's overmapped - okay, it is, but whats wrong with that when you have easier diffs to play and you can just ignore the one you don't like, like the whole song/map or anything.

Great example of ranked map close to quaver in my opinion is Night of Knights by alacat - mostly jumps/triples without sliders - and even I don't need to like that diff, there are few more that can be fun to play for me and its still can be ranked - when you look at old DJPop's version of this song, it have actually very close rhythm but without jumps, thats the thing only changed in those few years - and so what? Nobody talked shit in alacat's mapset on forum because X its overmapped or even AR is low or whatever you wanna say about the map - he took mods, repaired what he should, changed the stuff he wanted, got it qualified, ranked - gg, so why people need to cry here? Because monstrata is now famous mapper that people farming pp on his maps, triangles or idk what?

He is still a mapper, very good mapper that wanna show more to us, letting us have fun on his maps. If something is rankable, just let it be rankable if it can be. And even I don't know what I wrote here, just tl;dr - great map, good rhythm, let people rank what they want even its overmap, some people will enjoy, some people will not - just ignore it then.

thank you, some unknown shitty low-tier mapper & player.

ps. monstrata, stay awesome bro

Sing

354 posts

Joined December 2013

Sing 2016-08-26T02:41:24+00:00

i suggest flipping the bg since the main point of the bg, girl, is blocked by song bars in song select screen

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-08-26T03:20:18+00:00

Actually nevermind, then the quaver is backwards and that looks really weird sry ;___;

Sing

354 posts

Joined December 2013

Sing 2016-08-26T18:02:07+00:00

http://puu.sh/qPk3P/fcd67d6d4e.jpg

bg flipped except quaver, shud b gud

Shiguma

476 posts

Joined May 2014

Shiguma 2016-08-26T20:05:40+00:00

Sing wrote:
http://puu.sh/qPk3P/fcd67d6d4e.jpg

bg flipped except quaver, shud b gud

Looks good, this new flipped bg would be nice to use.

Bursthammy

1,254 posts

Joined May 2015

Bursthammy 2016-08-26T21:12:58+00:00

btw you should update description monstrata

Aerous

1,492 posts

Joined September 2013

Aerous 2016-08-27T18:38:54+00:00

Hey nice map

Natsu

8,076 posts

Joined September 2012

Natsu 2016-08-30T04:35:49+00:00

Crescendo

HP is super low, I think allowing random people who spam keys to pass your map isn't fine, use atleast 6. Even the insane diff is using a higher setting
00:46:664 (3,4,5,6) - if you are following the melody of the song then some 1/2 sliders would fit it better.
02:13:572 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - this feels anticlimactic, either reduce the spacing or use some 1/2 sliders instead.
02:18:847 (1,2,1,2) - 1/2 sliders would fit better the music rhythm, since this is really different from 02:19:506 (1,2,1,2) -
03:19:993 (4,1) - 03:20:638 (2,1) - jumps are a bit exaggerated there
03:22:412 (1,2,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - while I agree on the increase of the difficulty, i feel 03:22:412 (1,2,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - being super exaggerated, reduce the spacing a bit it doesn't hurt your map, but make a more friendly end, putting them insider the grid its a fair compromise IMO.
Do you mind explaining again the ignored 1/4s, I guess 1/4 sliders would work better, since you can keep the stressed beats and also fill the 1/4s with slider tails.

NiNo's Extra

Again the HP setting is super low here
00:01:170 (1,2) - 00:04:301 (2,1) - fix blankets
01:48:847 (2) - this rhythm sounds really wrong, why is the strong beat mapped as slider tail? can you change the rhythm at 01:48:517 (1,2) - to:
02:21:649 (2,3,4) - super hard to read, check this in game or in the editor with stacking on, 3 is hidden, because of the wrong stacking, i guess you will need to do a manual stack there
03:23:944 - spinner pls.

Haru's Insane

00:03:807 (1,2,3,4) - improve blankets, looks super bad atm
00:17:159 (2) - 00:17:488 (3,4) - rhythm is wrong, why are the sliders ending in a super important beats? at this part all of they should start at the white ticks, which are the ones that follow the main melody, personally I can't agree with the current rhythm.
00:21:609 (4,5,6) - same, if you notice the music clearly indicate you, 1-2 00:21:609 - 00:21:774 - 1-2 00:21:939 - 00:22:104 - , basically starting the slider 00:21:774 (5) - on the red tick doesn't makes sense with the music
00:42:378 (2) - this is touching the HP bar, yeah is rankable, but it doesn't looks professional, and experienced mapper will avoid doing such things, since the grid is big enough to avoid this mistakes.
00:43:038 (5) - again you are giving a click action to the wrong beat, the music clearly indicate you that the current slider tail should be clickable
00:56:389 (1) - again why is the slider tail mapped to such important beat in the song?
00:59:992 (5) - same as above
01:30:396 (1,2,3,4) - slider tails can be stacked better
02:08:956 (3) - again you don't need to have this kind of dirty stuff (calling it dirty, because it touch the game elements), the grid is big enough and you can easily avoid touching the hp bar
02:13:572 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - why the jumps are bigger than in the previous part? this one is less intense..
02:18:270 (3) - something went wrong here
02:35:825 (1) - again why is this slider tail mapped to such important beat?
03:20:799 (3,4) - this is inconsistent with your other same rhythms, also starting that slider in red tick doesn't make much sense with the song
Not a fan of this diff, but I can make a compromise if you fix the wrong rhythms

Joey's Hyper

OD is super low, use 6
02:02:693 (4,1) - really hard to read for this diff lvl, try to don't overlap the slider that much, I guess keeping the clean mapping its better.
02:16:209 (4) - missing NC, I suppose

Aia's Advanced

OD4 AR5 fit this diff better, mainly because of the 1/2 patterns and bpm

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-08-30T22:00:17+00:00

didnt know my diff got many problem than i expect lol
will get into this after school! (UTC 6:30AM)

SnowNiNo_

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

2,108 posts

Joined April 2013

SnowNiNo_ 2016-08-31T04:56:29+00:00

Natsu wrote:
NiNo's Extra
Again the HP setting is super low here
00:01:170 (1,2) - 00:04:301 (2,1) - fix blankets
01:48:847 (2) - this rhythm sounds really wrong, why is the strong beat mapped as slider tail? can you change the rhythm at 01:48:517 (1,2) - to:
02:21:649 (2,3,4) - super hard to read, check this in game or in the editor with stacking on, 3 is hidden, because of the wrong stacking, i guess you will need to do a manual stack there
03:23:944 - spinner pls. nah i dont wat the spinner here cuz i want to make the last note got more impact :>, spinner will destroyed imo xd

no mention = fixed

osu file format v14

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Title:quaver
TitleUnicode:quaver ♪
Artist:dj TAKA
ArtistUnicode:dj TAKA
Creator:Monstrata
Version:NiNo's Extra
Source:REFLEC BEAT limelight
Tags:true blue risk junk snownino_ haruto haruto_aizawa [ Joey ] Aia beatmania IIDX 19 Lincle jubeat saucer jukebeat KONAMI music pack 25 pop'n music Sunny Park plus MUSIC PACK 29 + ポップンリズミン パック1 MUSIC PACK 19
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144,152,188541,5,2,1:2:0:0:
389,152,188702,1,2,0:0:0:0:
155,235,188864,1,2,1:2:0:0:
309,44,189025,1,2,0:0:0:0:
72,112,189186,1,2,1:2:0:0:
284,166,189348,1,8,0:3:0:0:
104,238,189509,1,0,1:2:0:0:
200,132,189670,1,4,0:3:0:0:
224,300,189831,5,6,1:0:0:0:
104,148,189993,1,0,0:0:0:0:
328,232,190154,1,2,1:0:0:0:
115,317,190315,1,0,0:0:0:0:
252,123,190477,1,2,1:0:0:0:
51,231,190638,1,0,0:0:0:0:
270,285,190799,1,2,1:0:0:0:
126,109,190960,1,0,0:0:0:0:
389,105,191122,5,8,1:3:0:0:
176,260,191283,1,4,1:3:0:0:
313,33,191444,1,8,1:3:0:0:
280,312,191606,1,4,1:3:0:0:
471,152,191767,1,8,1:3:0:0:
202,148,191928,1,4,1:3:0:0:
430,296,192090,1,8,1:3:0:0:
313,33,192251,1,4,1:3:0:0:
336,260,192412,6,0,P|288:292|232:300,1,97.4999955368044,6|0,1:2|0:0,0:0:0:0:
56,260,192735,2,0,B|84:220|84:220|140:204,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
184,20,193057,2,0,B|204:64|204:64|190:120,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
328,252,193380,2,0,B|279:247|279:247|237:207,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
25,158,193702,6,0,P|72:130|119:133,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:2|0:0,0:0:0:0:
316,43,194025,2,0,B|332:91|332:91|312:143,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
164,259,194348,2,0,B|197:221|197:221|252:212,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
428,279,194670,2,0,B|378:268|378:268|343:225,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:0|0:0,0:0:0:0:
358,54,194993,5,2,1:2:0:0:
318,323,195154,1,2,0:0:0:0:
246,80,195315,5,2,1:2:0:0:
267,313,195476,1,2,0:0:0:0:
149,132,195638,5,2,1:2:0:0:
218,313,195799,1,2,0:0:0:0:
83,200,195960,5,2,1:2:0:0:
171,327,196121,1,2,0:0:0:0:
149,132,196283,5,2,1:2:0:0:
58,332,196444,1,0,0:0:0:0:
54,101,196606,5,2,1:2:0:0:
171,327,196767,1,0,0:0:0:0:
157,113,196928,5,2,1:2:0:0:
48,353,197089,1,4,1:3:0:0:
43,76,197251,5,8,1:3:0:0:
183,347,197412,1,4,1:3:0:0:
82,151,197573,5,6,1:2:0:0:
110,305,197735,1,0,0:0:0:0:
177,143,197896,1,0,0:0:0:0:
30,271,198057,1,0,0:0:0:0:
122,76,198219,1,2,1:2:0:0:
195,297,198380,1,0,0:0:0:0:
197,43,198541,1,0,0:0:0:0:
110,305,198702,1,0,0:0:0:0:
316,100,198864,5,2,1:2:0:0:
30,138,199025,1,0,0:0:0:0:
301,156,199186,5,0,0:0:0:0:
53,211,199347,1,0,0:0:0:0:
288,213,199509,5,2,1:2:0:0:
83,277,199670,1,4,1:3:0:0:
277,270,199831,5,8,1:3:0:0:
114,346,199992,1,4,1:3:0:0:
339,334,200154,6,0,P|271:334|235:326,1,97.4999955368044,6|0,1:2|0:0,0:0:0:0:
67,238,200477,1,0,0:0:0:0:
234,136,200638,1,8,0:3:0:0:
243,330,200799,6,0,P|187:362|147:362,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:2|0:0,0:0:0:0:
95,126,201122,1,0,0:0:0:0:
331,190,201283,1,8,0:3:0:0:
155,363,201444,6,0,P|123:319|123:271,1,97.4999955368044,6|0,1:2|0:0,0:0:0:0:
295,38,201767,1,0,0:0:0:0:
411,306,201928,1,0,0:0:0:0:
119,278,202089,6,0,P|115:218|139:182,1,97.4999955368044,2|0,1:2|0:0,0:0:0:0:
443,42,202412,1,0,0:0:0:0:
411,382,202573,1,0,0:0:0:0:
111,170,202735,5,2,1:2:0:0:
490,148,202896,1,4,0:3:0:0:
60,229,203057,5,10,0:1:0:0:
412,159,203218,1,4,0:3:0:0:
81,94,203380,5,10,0:1:0:0:
457,217,203541,1,4,0:3:0:0:
30,154,203702,5,8,0:3:0:0:
445,90,203863,1,4,0:0:0:0:

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-09-02T08:13:22+00:00

Natsu wrote:
Crescendo

HP is super low, I think allowing random people who spam keys to pass your map isn't fine, use atleast 6. Even the insane diff is using a higher setting I still want to make the HP low enough that people can generally get through 75-90% of the map. The low HP was originally to motivate people to try and "beat" the map because it keeps getting harder and harder. I think with the HP where it currently is, most people will be able to get close to passing the map and it'll make the overall experience more fun. With a map like this, I don't want to punish people too hard for failing jumps, I just want to punish them for failing too many jumps in a row, which is what happens when the jump distance becomes too big for them to handle, The key is that they'll no where, and try and get further and further along the map, and maybe eventually beat it xD.
00:46:664 (3,4,5,6) - if you are following the melody of the song then some 1/2 sliders would fit it better. Fixed.
02:13:572 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - this feels anticlimactic, either reduce the spacing or use some 1/2 sliders instead. Hmm. Idk I don't think this section needs to be climactic, since the music isn't that intense. I want to capture that guitar riff as it's going up in pitch, thats why i've arranged the sliders going upward and in a rotated zig-zag movement.
02:18:847 (1,2,1,2) - 1/2 sliders would fit better the music rhythm, since this is really different from 02:19:506 (1,2,1,2) - Agree. Fixed.
03:19:993 (4,1) - 03:20:638 (2,1) - jumps are a bit exaggerated there Agreed. Reduced the spacing.
03:22:412 (1,2,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - while I agree on the increase of the difficulty, i feel 03:22:412 (1,2,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - being super exaggerated, reduce the spacing a bit it doesn't hurt your map, but make a more friendly end, putting them insider the grid its a fair compromise IMO. I still want to keep the jumps for their size, but I made the jumps right at the end, 03:23:380 (5,1,2,3) - smaller using a different formation. Everything is in the grid now though, well, I think I edited the .osu to make them outside grid (but in the screen) but I resnapped everything using grid snap now xD.
Do you mind explaining again the ignored 1/4s, I guess 1/4 sliders would work better, since you can keep the stressed beats and also fill the 1/4s with slider tails.

Yea sure. The 1/4's are ignored because in order to capture the pitch increase on every 1/2, I need to use 1/2 jumps. If you map 1/4 rhythms, it suddenly becomes almost impossible to emphasize every 1/2 note without doing some crazy Hanzer level streams, and I don't want this map to be a stream map or anything. The other thing about using kicksliders was that using kicksliders would make the guitar-section at 02:03:022 - not feel unique, and I really wanted that visual distinction between circles and kicksliders. I think that while there are indeed 1/4 drum notes in the background, the main melody is still clearly 1/2, it's just the drums that double. It's not like the main melody becomes 1/4. The map is centered around the use of 1/2 rhythms and jumps so iI think while streams work, they would end up making the map less unique and wouldn't support the rhythmic theme that this map is trying to set.

Haru's Insane

Fixing for Haru since he's really busy with school ;c.

00:03:807 (1,2,3,4) - improve blankets, looks super bad atm Fixed.
00:17:159 (2) - 00:17:488 (3,4) - rhythm is wrong, why are the sliders ending in a super important beats? at this part all of they should start at the white ticks, which are the ones that follow the main melody, personally I can't agree with the current rhythm. Fixed.
00:21:609 (4,5,6) - same, if you notice the music clearly indicate you, 1-2 00:21:609 - 00:21:774 - 1-2 00:21:939 - 00:22:104 - , basically starting the slider 00:21:774 (5) - on the red tick doesn't makes sense with the music Fixed.
00:42:378 (2) - this is touching the HP bar, yeah is rankable, but it doesn't looks professional, and experienced mapper will avoid doing such things, since the grid is big enough to avoid this mistakes. Moved it a few pixels down. Personally, I've always been fine with touching the HP Bar since my grid-style mapping ends up sometimes overlapping with the HP bar due to certain structures I crease. I try to work around the area, but at the same time I also feel it restricts the mapping area a bit so I don't personally mind it as much xD.
00:43:038 (5) - again you are giving a click action to the wrong beat, the music clearly indicate you that the current slider tail should be clickable Fixed.
00:56:389 (1) - again why is the slider tail mapped to such important beat in the song? I think this one is fine. The slider-end isn't clickable but I think it's still acknowledging the rhythm in the song. It's just simplifying the rhythm a bit and giving a more interesting approach to the rhythm than what you'd normally expect. I think having a momentary break there is a nice alternative. Haruto doesn't put as much emphasis onto the main melody as I do, since he maps the drums like in 00:55:730 (1,2,3,4,5) - (the doublets) so I think his rhythm choice makes putting a slider-end on 00:56:719 - less offensive to the rhythm. Like, if I did this on my difficulty where I always follow the main melody, then it's definitely a must-fix.
00:59:992 (5) - same as above Fixed.
01:30:396 (1,2,3,4) - slider tails can be stacked better Fixed.
02:08:956 (3) - again you don't need to have this kind of dirty stuff (calling it dirty, because it touch the game elements), the grid is big enough and you can easily avoid touching the hp bar I think here, the hexagon-grid structure here makes it really hard to change anything. If it were my difficulty, I would just leave it since I prioritize structure above HP-bar aesthetics.
02:13:572 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - why the jumps are bigger than in the previous part? this one is less intense.. Fixed.
02:18:270 (3) - something went wrong here Indeed. Fixed.
02:35:825 (1) - again why is this slider tail mapped to such important beat? Same reasoning as above. We can discuss it further if you wish though. It's not a hard fix, but here I think the rhythm is fine.
03:20:799 (3,4) - this is inconsistent with your other same rhythms, also starting that slider in red tick doesn't make much sense with the song Agreed. Fixed.
Not a fan of this diff, but I can make a compromise if you fix the wrong rhythms
Joey's Hyper

Fixing for Joey after getting his permission.

OD is super low, use 6 Fixed.
02:02:693 (4,1) - really hard to read for this diff lvl, try to don't overlap the slider that much, I guess keeping the clean mapping its better. Hmm... I think this plays really well though. It might be a bit harder to read due to the head of 1 being covered, but this difficulty uses a lot of overlaps and stacks too. I think it should be fine, considering that aside from 1's head, everything else is even. I adjusted the slider just a biiit to make the overlap cleaner with slider 2 : the slider-border is no longer overlapped when viewing with Stacking enabled.
02:16:209 (4) - missing NC, I suppose Fixed.
Aia's Advanced

OD4 AR5 fit this diff better, mainly because of the 1/2 patterns and bpm Fixed. I actually bumped the AR to 5.5, and OD to 4.5. This is still technically mapped like a "Normal" and not an "Advanced" we mainly named it "Advanced" because I decided to include an easier Normal. I also adjusted the diff settings of the Normal slightly (just increased AR to 4, instead of 3, since I used some 1/2 rhythms near the end).

Natsu

8,076 posts

Joined September 2012

Natsu 2016-09-02T08:49:36+00:00

Interpretation of the music can differ from person to person, and there are not correct interpretation, but different ways of interpret the music, that's why we have different maps of the same song.

Btw, jumps not only have to be placed at strong beats, we can place them according to multiple things and there is not correct spacing for them, anyways, I'm fine with Monstrata's reasoning about his map, and escalation difficulties are totally acceptables.

This map is totally fine in my opinion.

Mint

1,611 posts

Joined February 2013

Mint 2016-09-02T18:20:33+00:00

oh look it's appleeater again

(agree w/ natsu's words)

SeGin

32 posts

Joined March 2013

SeGin 2016-09-02T18:36:34+00:00

The description isn't right.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-09-02T18:39:11+00:00

Fixed, thanks! I knew i forgot something lol.

WORSTPOLACKEU

511 posts

Joined May 2013

WORSTPOLACKEU 2016-09-02T18:58:10+00:00

HP 5 on 7.4 star difficulty?
I read your explanation but even then, it's just too low.
The idea is to make HP drain equal to map's difficulty, not to make people that aren't good enough to pass the map, pass the map.
This feels too low as Natsu mentioned.

Pho

1,785 posts

Joined November 2013

Pho 2016-09-02T19:01:39+00:00

A SB for the set would've been nice lol

Anyway, congratz!

brdzxh

181 posts

Joined June 2013

brdzxh 2016-09-02T19:05:42+00:00

50 seconds without sliders kills my stamina lo good1

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-09-02T19:07:55+00:00

It's not too low. Usually maps have many sliders and "easy" patterns that help you recover HP in between difficult sections. 1/2 slider spam, 1/4 repeat sliders, anything slider-related usually gives players some breathing room to recover. This map has none of those. HP doesn't correlate with SR, it shouldn't really... HP should correlate with how forgiving the patterns and rhythms are in the map. The rhythms found here are not forgiving, and there are no sections that allow you to reliably recover, it's why HP is not as high as you would normally expect. (It's already pretty high. NC spam also increases total HP drain).

Irreversible

osu! Alumni

4,315 posts

Joined December 2011

Irreversible 2016-09-02T19:57:15+00:00

is that a dog barking as a hitsound? loool

AJT

551 posts

Joined August 2013

AJT 2016-09-02T21:09:58+00:00

I personally think the HP is fine, however as a map this is overmapped to shit IMO.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-09-02T21:16:39+00:00

Irreversible wrote:
is that a dog barking as a hitsound? loool

Please xD.

(It was replaced with something more normal, in case you still have an old version xD)

7ambda

2,590 posts

Joined January 2015

7ambda 2016-09-02T21:16:54+00:00

Nega wrote:
I personally think the HP is fine, however as a map this is overmapped to shit IMO.

It's not overmapped, it's just lazy and uncreative.

Buttercup

1,065 posts

Joined May 2012

Buttercup 2016-09-02T21:32:54+00:00

F1r3tar wrote:
It's not overmapped, it's just lazy and uncreative.

it isn't lazy and uncreative, he mapped 3 minutes of different types of jumps, and increase more difficulty on the jumps was a perfect idea on this song since it is repetitive and becomes more ''provocative'' increasingly
believe, it gave him more work than you imagine, a lazy person wouldn't do 50% what he did

Winnie

1,343 posts

Joined November 2013

Winnie 2016-09-02T21:42:44+00:00

Lets hear all these nonchalant arrogant mappers come in to talk shit. I'll get my popcorn ready. Going to expecting lots of "overmapped" "remap" and " I can't play because my rank doesn't portray how skilled I am". PREPARE FOR IT BOYS DOOMSDAY IS COMING EARLY
P.S. 1v1 me irl

XII

259 posts

Joined November 2013

XII 2016-09-02T21:49:53+00:00

Kocari wrote:
Lets hear all these nonchalant arrogant mappers come in to talk shit. I'll get my popcorn ready. Going to expecting lots of "overmapped" "remap" and " I can't play because my rank doesn't portray how skilled I am". PREPARE FOR IT BOYS DOOMSDAY IS COMING EARLY
P.S. 1v1 me irl

ok the map is still over spaced no matter what you, monstrata or anyone else's fluff words say.

Fezu

41 posts

Joined November 2012

Fezu 2016-09-02T22:27:09+00:00

I wish the moderation team would just ban all discussion on maps, its' obvious where the whiners come from at this point. If you're not providing mods, fuck off.

In the end we already have disqus for all your whining needs, why destroy the actual threads where your supposed to critique with your knowledge on mapping and not with your anger.

Your all weak.

Manysi

336 posts

Joined July 2014

Manysi 2016-09-02T22:55:11+00:00

Holy, this map is a masterpiece. I have never seen anything with such an intuitive rhythm. I absolutely love the way you handle those circle-slider combos in the Kiais. My only problem is with the Crescent difficulty. Its too easy for a peak diff imo. I mean, i managed to fc it with my xboy controller. This is clearly not enough to satisfy top rated players like cookingZ (cookieKingZ). I think the spacing is not enough at some parts, especially getting near the end. You really should try to go above 1.0 ds next time to surpass the 2 squares difficulty rating. Good luck with further modding!

Ideal

Nomination Assessment Team

629 posts

Joined January 2014

Ideal 2016-09-02T23:08:39+00:00

the last jumps seem somewhat overdone imo, but the rest of the map plays very well and I find it fun.

VINXIS

Featured Artist

3,161 posts

Joined April 2014

VINXIS 2016-09-02T23:38:59+00:00

helo i hav a vry important question about the map and its rly bothering me:::::::::::

~Y r u mapping so inconsistently????????????~

Herez a few obv placez/examplez tht im talking abou:

the kiai.. 03:02:090 - to 03:17:573 - is mapped COMPLETLEY to the lead synth, ignoring ltiaerly evryhting (even drums), and then u randomly decided 2 switch 2 the durms completely ignoring everyhting (even the lead synth) at 03:17:573 - and then decided 2 randomly switch bak and spam jumpz at the end wich i assumed was based off of the lead synth cuz of the even spacing
+ 03:20:154 (1,2,1,2) - i assume this is jsut 2 buildup to the drums/decrease note density but : /?/ ? / / ? ? / / / / d
00:13:038 - the wholepart right BEFOR e this took drums into consideration while also subtly mapping to the lead synth, then for a reason u may kno, u made the sudden change to mapping the lead synth comeptlely 100% while ignoring ltiaerly evrything else leaving out many possible different rhythms and spacing emphasis patterns out tht u have shown in th e previous part befor, (also for the record, this part is much easier than the aprt befor tho i am assuming tht this is supposd 2 be the harder part since its a crescendo + a more energetic part/ / ?)
00:41:637 (5) - d.. comparing 00:41:389 (3,4,5,6) - to 00:42:378 (2,3,4) - is like lol (also wot r u mapping 2 with tht note.,)
00:44:686 (1,2,3,4) - whers the stream/wot ru mapping to
00:45:345 (5,6,7,8,9) - rnt u mapping to liearly nothing/ not the lead synth/drums here
tbh the whole part (00:35:455 - to 00:57:873 - is also RLy messy and ther seems 2 not be a cleear reasone as 2 y u mapped parts of it lik tht, + inconsistencies as 2 wot ur mapping to, and how ur mapping 2 them throughout the whoLe section
01:45:880 - + if ur main point was 2 bring a crescendo throughout the map y is this part so low in spacing intensit y? / ? its not lik the rhythms r even challengign at this part jstu cuz u added a bit of 1/4s here and ther,, feelz rly out of plac
i completeLY misssded this cuz the parts above this potin got me distractd but wTF? ? ? ? ? ? 02:58:177 - compared to 03:17:573 - wew...... wtf even rofl.., u ltiaerly jstu made the part rite before the kiai eASIer than the kiai itself by putting vry densely spaced streamz in th kiai and 1/2 jumps rite befor th kiai instead of a naisu densly spaced stream,,

tbh i hav no idea wot u wer doign in this map and y aside for a... poor? attempt in making a crescendo-based map lo,lll

if this map waz a prtt(personal respons 2 text) essay id giv it a 72%

PLZNOFLAME

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-09-02T23:56:32+00:00

VINXIS wrote:
helo i hav a vry important question about the map and its rly bothering me:::::::::::

Y r u mapping so inconsistently????????????

Herez a few obv placez/examplez tht im talking abou:
the kiai.. 03:02:090 - to 03:17:573 - is mapped COMPLETLEY to the lead synth, ignoring ltiaerly evryhting (even drums), and then u randomly decided 2 switch 2 the durms completely ignoring everyhting (even the lead synth) at 03:17:573 - and then decided 2 randomly switch bak and spam jumpz at the end wich i assumed was based off of the lead synth cuz of the even spacing There's a really obviously shift in the song that occurs on 03:17:573 - ... It's not random at all.
+ 03:20:154 (1,2,1,2) - i assume this is jsut 2 buildup to the drums/decrease note density but : /?/ ? / / ? ? / / / / d But what? What's interesting about 1/8 hold sliders is that releasing on them feels more impactful than just 1/2 sliders. I'm emphasizing the main melody here but also using 1/8 holds to create some tension. It's a really stop-go movement here that helps to build momentum.
00:13:038 - the wholepart right BEFOR e this took drums into consideration while also subtly mapping to the lead synth, then for a reason u may kno, u made the sudden change to mapping the lead synth comeptlely 100% while ignoring ltiaerly evrything else leaving out many possible different rhythms and spacing emphasis patterns out tht u have shown in th e previous part befor, (also for the record, this part is much easier than the aprt befor tho i am assuming tht this is supposd 2 be the harder part since its a crescendo + a more energetic part/ / ?) There's a really clear shift in the song's melody too... It's not sudden at all... what?
00:41:637 (5) - d.. comparing 00:41:389 (3,4,5,6) - to 00:42:378 (2,3,4) - is like lol (also wot r u mapping 2 with tht note.,) Different rhythms. If you listen closely, the main melody uses a different rhythm every time too.
00:44:686 (1,2,3,4) - whers the stream/wot ru mapping to Here its more debatable, because you're right that streams can fit here, but I wanted to leave this section undermapped in order to emphasize 00:45:345 (5,6,7,8,9) - afterwards. If I made everything 1/4 here it would make 00:45:345 (5,6,7,8,9) - not seem as noticeable even though thteres a clear transition between synth to drum mapping.
00:45:345 (5,6,7,8,9) - rnt u mapping to liearly nothing/ not the lead synth/drums here ^
tbh the whole part (00:35:455 - to 00:57:873 - is also RLy messy and ther seems 2 not be a cleear reasone as 2 y u mapped parts of it lik tht, + inconsistencies as 2 wot ur mapping to, and how ur mapping 2 them throughout the whoLe section Part of this is because of the song being a bit inconsistent here anyways. But also, I tried to use slightly different variants of the same rhythm to give some variety. Originally everything was the same rhythm, but people suggested using more rhythmic variety here since the main sections of the song already use the same 1/2 rhythm so I elected to use these rhythms on these sections instead. They aren't the "chorus" of the song I guess, or the main focus where all the 1/2's occur.
01:45:880 - + if ur main point was 2 bring a crescendo throughout the map y is this part so low in spacing intensit y? / ? its not lik the rhythms r even challengign at this part jstu cuz u added a bit of 1/4s here and ther,, feelz rly out of plac There's again, a clear shift in the music... Holistically, the map is winding up harder and harder, but there are sections where I put breaks and interludes. This is one such section. Listen to the tone, it's much different from the chorus/kiai's.
i completeLY misssded this cuz the parts above this potin got me distractd but wTF? ? ? ? ? ? 02:58:177 - compared to 03:17:573 - wew...... wtf even rofl.., u ltiaerly jstu made the part rite before the kiai eASIer than the kiai itself by putting vry densely spaced streamz in th kiai and 1/2 jumps rite befor th kiai instead of a naisu densly spaced stream,, Again, theres a clear shift in the music...
tbh i hav no idea wot u wer doign in this map and y aside for a... poor? attempt in making a crescendo-based map lo,lll

if this map waz a prtt(personal respons 2 text) essay id giv it a 72%

PLZNOFLAME

I probably misinterpretted half of what you said...

mithew

396 posts

Joined April 2013

mithew 2016-09-03T00:38:25+00:00

i miss when dj taka maps were ar8 dt maps

Ankanogradiel

177 posts

Joined June 2014

Ankanogradiel 2016-09-03T01:24:43+00:00

Grats' :>

and

Strykerto wrote:
8* Monstrata map when....

Frim4503

2,067 posts

Joined July 2013

Frim4503 2016-09-03T04:10:32+00:00

i love to see dat users rating.
and i don't know why many people complaint about the highest diff.
if you can't play it, you still can play the lower diff.

hope this passing qualied section and go to ranked section

7ambda

2,590 posts

Joined January 2015

7ambda 2016-09-03T04:37:30+00:00

Frim4503 wrote:
i love to see dat users rating.
and i don't know why many people complaint about the highest diff.
if you can't play it, you still can play the lower diff.

hope this passing qualied section and go to ranked section

Short difficulty spikes involving 1/2 jumps are scorned by the community.

Underforest

5,895 posts

Joined July 2015

Underforest 2016-09-03T05:59:33+00:00

Fezu wrote:
I wish the moderation team would just ban all discussion on maps, its' obvious where the whiners come from at this point. If you're not providing mods, fuck off.

People are gettinge very off-topic and critiques the mapper style instead of helping the map with a better way, thing that is not very helpful.

Feb

1,027 posts

Joined June 2014

Feb 2016-09-03T07:12:46+00:00

sona ult
00:05:867 (4) - aaaaa is it just me or is there nothing

Haruto

1,815 posts

Joined December 2013

Haruto 2016-09-03T07:55:19+00:00

oh i didnt know its ranked already.

Congrats!! and Thanks Monstrata for fixing stuffs for me, im too busy with assignments ;c.
and uh, what just happen here o.o".

VINXIS

Featured Artist

3,161 posts

Joined April 2014

VINXIS 2016-09-03T10:04:11+00:00

since thers time for the next ohc match i hav time 2 respodn

first point was suposd 2 b followd up by the last point its quite random wehn u see both parts like that,, if "ther is a clear shift in the music" then y isnt 02:58:177 - mapped as if ther is a clear shift in music and jstu continuing the 1/2 jump patternz but the part in the kiai goes to a stream
if ur trying 2 follow the melody at 03:20:154 - then y did u evn bothr mapping to the snare for only 2 measures of the kiai lolz,, while completely ignoring tht and evrythign else for th erest of it
00:13:038 - tht wasnt my point here the oint here was tht u wer mapping to the drums and synth togethr with a more high note density at the suposdly "softr part" but decided 2 just put rly easy 1/2 jumpz all th way upto 00:34:796 - compeltely ignoring drums and evrythign els wich seems rlly weird 2 me cuz i wud assume ud want 2 keep the difficulty harder as the map goez sinc its a crescendo? /// but it jstu doesnt look lik tht considering its going up and down in difficulty thru the map
00:41:389 - has no synth sound at 00:41:637 - tho and u used circles here whil 00:42:378 (2,3,4) - acutaly has 5 notes from the synth but u used sliderz and a circl instea,d
00:44:686 - 00:45:345 - r u saying u undermapped the part befor so u cud overmap the stream aftr or wT R U SAyign4
00:35:455 - thn y dont u put variety in the 1/2 note spam partz 2 and map 2 the instrument ur mainly mapping to (lead synth) in th song lol z, :d
01:45:880 - i kno the diffrnc lolz i can hear ;///// it jstu seems rlly weird tht ud make the part wher a highly distorted filtered guitar is the main instrument 1 of the easiest partz especially considering it sounds mor intens wehn it plays the melody compared 2 the lead synth, ,, , /? im sur the amjority of th ppl wud agree 2. (tho i didnt read this before i wrote about the crescendo stuff in the point for 00:13:038 - lolz, point still standz tho as i stated tht for diffrnt reasonz,)
last point was supposd 2 follow up 2 first poitn so yea my bad btu it still standz,

https://www.twitch.tv/ohc_a * 23785

Last edited by VINXIS 2016-09-03T10:28:05+00:00, edited 1 time in total.

Okoayu

Nomination Assessment Team / Elite Nominator

4,959 posts

Joined May 2012

Okoayu 2016-09-03T10:44:41+00:00

don't deliberately shitpost in this thread, please.

Talk about the map here - if you don't have anything better to do then don't post here at all.

Monstrata

Elite Mapper: Aspirant

4,642 posts

Joined May 2013

Topic Starter

Monstrata 2016-09-03T15:52:06+00:00

VINXIS wrote:
since thers time for the next ohc match i hav time 2 respodn

first point was suposd 2 b followd up by the last point its quite random wehn u see both parts like that,, if "ther is a clear shift in the music" then y isnt 02:58:177 - mapped as if ther is a clear shift in music and jstu continuing the 1/2 jump patternz but the part in the kiai goes to a stream FĪŔSƬ ♡ИƐ, ƬĤƐŔƐ'S И♡ SĤĪFƬ, ĴƱSƬ ΛИ ΛDDĪƬĪ♡И ♡F 1/4'S ĪИ ƬĤƐ ßΛƇҠƓŔ♡ƱИD. Ī DĪSƇƱSSƐD ƬĤĪS ѠĪƬĤ ӾƐӾӾΛŔ ΛИD ИΛƬSƱ ΛĿŔƐΛDY S♡ Y♡Ʊ ƇΛИ ƇĤƐƇҠ ßΛƇҠ F♡Ŕ MY ŔƐΛS♡ИĪИƓ ♡И ѠĤY Ī DĪDИ'Ƭ MΛṖ ƬƐ 1/4'S. SƐƇ♡ИD ♡ИƐ ĪS ΛИ ♡ßѴĪ♡ƱS SĤĪFƬ F♡Ŕ Λ ѴΛŔĪƐƬY ♡F ŔƐΛS♡ИS ĿĪҠƐ ƬĤƐ MƱSĪƇ'S Ƭ♡ИƐ, ƬĤƐ MΛĪИ SYИƬĤ ßƐĪИƓ M♡ŔƐ MƱFFĿƐD, ƬĤƐ S♡ИƓ ßƐĪИƓ SĿĪƓĤƬĿY ҨƱĪƐƬƐŔ, ΛИD ṖŔƐṖΛŔĪИƓ F♡Ŕ ƬĤƐ FĪИΛĿ ĴƱMṖS ƐƬƇ...
if ur trying 2 follow the melody at 03:20:154 - then y did u evn bothr mapping to the snare for only 2 measures of the kiai lolz,, while completely ignoring tht and evrythign else for th erest of it į'ʍ ղօէ ʝմʂէ ʍąքքìղց էհҽ ʂղąɾҽ... į'ʍ ʍąքքìղց էհҽ ʍąìղ ʍҽӀօժվ էօօ. Lìҟҽ į ʂąìժ, ҍҽçąմʂҽ վօմ ցҽղҽɾąӀӀվ հօӀժ օղ էօ 𝟙/𝟠 ʂӀìժҽɾʂ մղէìӀ էհҽ ҽղժ, ąղժ ɾҽӀҽąʂҽ աìէհ ʍօɾҽ ƒօɾçҽ ժմҽ էօ էհҽ ʂէօք/ցօ ʍօէìօղ հҽɾҽ, վօմ աìӀӀ ƒҽҽӀ էհҽ ʂӀìժҽɾ-ҽղժ ʍօɾҽ էհąղ ą էվքìçąӀ 𝟙/ϩ ʂӀìժҽɾ.
00:13:038 - tht wasnt my point here the oint here was tht u wer mapping to the drums and synth togethr with a more high note density at the suposdly "softr part" but decided 2 just put rly easy 1/2 jumpz all th way upto 00:34:796 - compeltely ignoring drums and evrythign els wich seems rlly weird 2 me cuz i wud assume ud want 2 keep the difficulty harder as the map goez sinc its a crescendo? /// but it jstu doesnt look lik tht considering its going up and down in difficulty thru the map Ƭнєяє'ѕ α cƖєαя ѕнιfт ιη тнє мυѕιc... ωнιcн ιѕ ωну ι ѕнιfтєɗ тσ мαρριηg тнє мαιη мєƖσɗу. AƖѕσ уσυ тαкє тнє cяєѕcєηɗσ тєям тσσ ƖιтєяαƖƖу. Ƭнєяє αяє ρƖαcєѕ тнαт ηєєɗ вяєαкѕ. UηƖєѕѕ уσυ ωαηт мє тσ ɗяαѕтιcαƖƖу ιη cяєαѕє тнє נυмρѕ αт 03:00:786 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - тσσ ιη σяɗєя тσ мαкє тнє cяєѕcєηɗσ єffєcт мσяє ρяσησυηcєɗ. Ƭнєη ωє נυѕт нανє тσ ɗιѕαgяєє вєcαυѕє ǀ'м ησт ɗσιηg тнαт.
00:41:389 - has no synth sound at 00:41:637 - tho and u used circles here whil 00:42:378 (2,3,4) - acutaly has 5 notes from the synth but u used sliderz and a circl instea,d Ｔｈｅｒｅｉｓａｓｙｎｔｈｓｏｕｎｄｔｈｏｕｇｈ？ＡｎｄｌｉｋｅＩｓａｉｄ，Ｉｗａｎｔｓｏｍｅｒｈｙｔｈｍｉｃｖａｒｉｅｔｙ．Ｅｖｅｒｙｒｈｙｔｈｍｓｔｉｌｌｆｏｌｌｏｗｓｔｈｅｓａｍｅｔｈｒｅａｄ，ｂｕｔｉｔ＇ｓｔｗｅａｋｅｄｓｌｉｇｈｔｌｙｔｏｂｅｄｉｆｆｅｒｅｎｔｆｒｏｍｏｔｈｅｒｓ，ｂｕｔｇｅｎｅｒａｌｌｙｔｈｅｐｌａｃｅｓｗｈｅｒｅｙｏｕｃｌｉｃｋａｎｄｒｅｌｅａｓｅａｒｅｖｅｒｙｍｕｃｈｒｅｌａｔａｂｌｅｔｏｏｔｈｅｒｒｈｙｔｈｍｓ．
00:44:686 - 00:45:345 - r u saying u undermapped the part befor so u cud overmap the stream aftr or wT R U SAyign4 ᴵ'ᵐ ˢᵃʸᶤᶰᵍ ᴵ ᵘᶰᵈᵉʳᵐᵃᵖᵖᵉᵈ ᵗʰᵉ ᵖᵃʳᵗ ᵇᵉᶠᵒʳᵉ ˢᵒ ᴵ ᶜᵒᵘˡᵈ ʰᶤᵍʰˡᶤᵍʰᵗ ᵗʰᵉ ˢᵗʳᵉᵃᵐ ᵃᶠᵗᵉʳ˒ ᶤᶰˢᵗᵉᵃᵈ ᵒᶠ ᵖᵘᵗᵗᶤᶰᵍ ᵃ ᵇᵘᶰᶜʰ ᵒᶠ ¹/⁴'ˢ ʰᵉʳᵉ ᵗʰᵃᵗ ʷᵒᵘˡᵈᶰ'ᵗ ᵐᵃᵏᵉ ᵃᶰʸ ˢᵉᶜᵗᶤᵒᶰ ᵐᵒʳᵉ ᵖʳᵒᵐᶤᶰᵉᶰᵗ ᵗʰᵃᶰ ᵗʰᵉ ᵒᵗʰᵉʳ.
00:35:455 - thn y dont u put variety in the 1/2 note spam partz 2 and map 2 the instrument ur mainly mapping to (lead synth) in th song lol z, :d ᗷᕮᑕᗩᑌᔕᕮ TᕼᗩT'ᔕ ᕼOᗯ I ᗯᗩᑎTᕮᗪ TO ᗰᗩᑭ IT. I'ᒪᒪ ᑭᑌT ᗰOᖇᕮ ᐯᗩᖇIᕮTY Iᑎ ᔕᕮᑕTIOᑎᔕ TᕼᗩT ᕼᗩᐯᕮ ᐯᗩᖇIᗩᗷᒪᕮ ᖇᕼYTᕼᗰ ᑕᕼOIᑕᕮᔕ. ᗰᗩIᑎ ᔕᕮᑕTIOᑎᔕ Oᖴ Tᕼᕮ ᔕOᑎG ᕼᗩᐯᕮ ᗩ ᐯᕮᖇY ᑕᒪᕮᗩᖇ ᖴIᖇᔕT ᒪᗩYᕮᖇ ᗯᕼIᑕᕼ I ᗰᗩᑭ TO, ᗷᑌT OTᕼᕮᖇ ᔕᕮᑕTIOᑎᔕ Tᕼᕮ ᖴIᖇᔕT ᒪᗩYᕮᖇ Iᔕ ᔕᒪIGᕼTᒪY ᗰOᖇᕮ ᗪᑌᗷIOᑌᔕ ᗩᑎᗪ TᕼᗩT ᗩᒪᒪOᗯᔕ ᗰᕮ TO IᑎTᕮGᖇᗩTᕮ OTᕼᕮᖇ ᖇᕼYTᕼᗰᔕ Iᑎ.
01:45:880 - i kno the diffrnc lolz i can hear ;///// it jstu seems rlly weird tht ud make the part wher a highly distorted filtered guitar is the main instrument 1 of the easiest partz especially considering it sounds mor intens wehn it plays the melody compared 2 the lead synth, ,, , /? im sur the amjority of th ppl wud agree 2. (tho i didnt read this before i wrote about the crescendo stuff in the point for 00:13:038 - lolz, point still standz tho as i stated tht for diffrnt reasonz,) Rҽαʅʅყ? Tԋιʂ ʂσυɳԃʂ ʅιƙҽ α ɾҽαʅʅყ ιɳƚҽɳʂҽ ραɾƚ ƚσ ყσυ? I ƚԋιɳƙ ɯҽ ʝυʂƚ ԋαʋҽ ƚσ ԃιʂαɠɾҽҽ Ⴆҽƈαυʂҽ ƚԋҽ ʂҽƈƚισɳ ԋҽɾҽ ԃσҽʂɳ'ƚ ƈαʅʅ ϝσɾ αɳყ ԃιϝϝιƈυʅƚყ ιɱσ...
last point was supposd 2 follow up 2 first poitn so yea my bad btu it still standz,
https://www.twitch.tv/ohc_a * 23785

Click the link for more readable version

Shiirn

2,896 posts

Joined August 2010

Shiirn 2016-09-03T16:39:07+00:00

Underforest wrote:
Fezu wrote:
I wish the moderation team would just ban all discussion on maps, its' obvious where the whiners come from at this point. If you're not providing mods, fuck off.
People are gettinge very off-topic and critiques the mapper style instead of helping the map with a better way, thing that is not very helpful.

monstrata has actively refused all commentary and suggestions which do not already fit his half-baked "theme". Don't get testy over people giving up.

It's already been shown time and time and time again that the only way to actually DQ a monstrata map is to community dogpile it because the maps generally speaking have no objective flaws, only massive amounts of subjective fuckery and "mapper style" design decisions.

I still want to know what actual justification Monstrata has for blatantly and completely ignoring every part of the music except for the 1/2 overlay outside of the edge cases such as two transitions and the calm interludes

But if you want me to actually mod it and treat Monstrata like a newbie mapper rather than someone who is probably just fucking around,

[Crescendo]

00:08:752 (4,1) - For the entire few measures after this (and future, repeated copies of this musical pattern), you have a click at 00:08:917 - 's beat position. I see no reason to have this transition happen this awkwardly.
Contrast 00:11:060 (1,2,3,4) - with 00:55:895 (2,3,4,1) - . The first makes sense, you're following the bass. The second makes no sense whatsoever. The clicks in the second have been following the synth&bass (Which for those measures both occur on the same positions), but neither of them actually play on 00:56:060 - . Clearly, you're not adverse to having doubles, as the first combo linked has two pairs of doubles with the bass. If you want to follow just the synth, you'll have a weird empty 3/4 space, so why not just do another set of doubles? This hasn't been mentioned before, but seems like an big discrepancy. You use doubles 01:50:495 (1,2,3,4) - here as well, but you use another random triple at 02:35:165 (1,2,3,4) - . In terms of musical structure, at least you're consistently fucking around, but still. These are clearly patterns that need to be changed, modified, or you need to get your big boy bullshitting pants on and start justifying post-qualification. Also, to keep consistency with the earlier section, 02:36:978 (3) - should be a 1/2 slider. I like the 1/2 slider more than the circle anyway
00:22:928 - missing an opportunity here for a mid-jump-section transition but whatever
01:40:719 (1,2,1,2) - any reason these are circles rather than sliders like at the end? or vice versa. They're literally identical musically and structurally otherwise, after all.
03:22:735 (1,2,3,4,5) - I still don't get why these five notes are so much more massive in scope than 03:23:541 (1,2,3) - , when you first showed off the map to the public it was the other way around and while the spacing was still eye-rollingly, put-up-with-it-in-a-groaning-sort-of-way, stupid, it at least made more sense than this. This isn't the only example but it's the biggest one and for your sake and mine i'm not going to put you up to repeating your same reasoning for the 50th time.

This is completely ignoring the massive crapfest that is the "1/2 spam sections" because Monstrata is far better at Fort than bullshitting why he's ignoring most of the music to inject jump spam (rest in peace, call me it), so I stuck to the other sections.

This map is extremely rigidly following the "4/4/4/4/4" mapping formula and by god does it show. The music itself departs from 4/4/4/4/4 several times but monstrata sticks to the cascade of interlayed quadruple patterns because it's harder to subjectively take down.

I mean, personally speaking, if this was my map, I wouldn't find any of the above points to be "heavy enough" to justify a DQ over. But at this point, people are grasping at straws. They're desperately trying to figure out how to stop bad ideas and bad precedents from flowing into the game as the past-their-prime mappers start to get bored and see what they can get away with before calling it quits. And that causes drama and that causes poor arguments and illogical assumptions. Can't really blame human nature. But people can sure as fuck blame me and get mad at me when I point this kind of shit out :u

dj TAKA - quaver

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dj TAKA - quaver

appleeaterx wrote:

appleeaterx wrote:

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Xexxar wrote:

Shiguri wrote:

Xexxar wrote:

fujiXn wrote:

appleeaterx wrote:

Tatsuyu wrote:

fujiXn wrote:

Tatsuyu wrote:

Lasse wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Shiirn wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Lasse wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Gus wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Ascendance wrote:

Kocari wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Xexxar wrote:

Kocari wrote:

Monstrata wrote:

Sing wrote:

Natsu wrote:

Natsu wrote:

Irreversible wrote:

Nega wrote:

F1r3tar wrote:

Kocari wrote:

~~~~~Y r u mapping so inconsistently????????????~~~~~

PLZNOFLAME

VINXIS wrote:

PLZNOFLAME

Strykerto wrote:

Frim4503 wrote:

Fezu wrote:

VINXIS wrote:

Underforest wrote:

Fezu wrote:

New reply

~Y r u mapping so inconsistently????????????~